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On May 06 2014 07:47 Cavalinho wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2014 07:41 Holyflare wrote:On May 06 2014 07:32 Cavalinho wrote:On May 06 2014 06:17 Vivax wrote:
I just wanted to know more about that post. What was serious and whatnot, hence I find it quite a bit of overreaction from Cava to give me "super suspicion" and say I'm twisting things cause I stated my thoughts about his post (upon request!) without even being judgmental about him.
It's not like I'm sure about his alignment yet, neither about Holyflare's, but the latter seems to follow a very aggressive approach to the game and that gives me neg vibes. Anyway gonna give some of my thoughts about the two now.
If you're town and look at the posts I made about Cava, think for a moment how you would see them and suggest how you would react if you were in the place of Cava (who never showed a sign of wanting to vote for me). Would you instacall me scum and say i'm twisting or try to make clear it was a full joke post and that you think it's actually townie?
Cause I don't call him scum, I don't say he's twisting things, I simply say that I found his post defensive, giving a reason for something that in his eyes should be trivial since it stems from a joke, a reason that at the same time allows him to not give a read on me (hence evasive).
He doesn't have to agree with the same logic, but does the logic I use at the same time make me scum for using it? That pattern of thinking is missing in Cava's response as I see other people being able to at least understand my point of view, of which I don't claim that it constitutes ultimately damning evidence.
Regarding HF a lot is cause of the reasons he's pushing Oats with. Oats sometimes gets misunderstood or misreads or doesn't make something incredibly clear, so pointing out inconsistencies and calling his mistakes or wrong representations lies, as in scummy lies shouldn't be applied while it could be applied to a player who doesn't make such mistakes as town often.
With Oats you have to is look at his attitude. He's really passive as mafia and in your face as town as I think that is the case in this game. I know it's very subjective (I think LXI and Doctor Who 1 he was scum and I played with him) but maybe somebody else can confirm (Koshi and thrawn maybe can) but I feel confident to say he shouldn't be lynched today. I think a combination of tone and a logical leap (asking more about a post that others have found relatively towny because I didn't include you in it) made me think less of you at the time. The only thing I really don't like about this post is that I feel like you're martyring yourself by saying "wtf Cav thinks I'm scummy how dare he." I still don't understand why you would expect me to give a read of you based off of nothing. I don't feel like any of my reads are relatively strong with the exception of HF, and even then I wouldn't put money on what I currently think of him. If I even had to give anyone a read on you right now...I'd say it's rather null for the moment. I don't think "suspicious" warrants the same response as "I'm going to vote you and push you until you die." There's a clear difference between the two, and I feel like this post was made, in part, to make me look bad. Maybe I'm overreacting, maybe I'm not. I don't really know what to think of you yet. I think you're null...For the moment. Presumably you've read the thread. What do you think of that post now that I've already disproved it all as nonsense and misrepresenting things happening in the thread? I think it's a very manipulative post. The whole thing plays out like a way of making me look bad without actually outright saying anything against me. It smells like the equivalent of putting your hand up away from someone and then pointing a finger at them behind it. I'm beginning to think Vivax is scummy. I want to see him post more though, I don't want to get sucked into a one-way train of thought.
Ok well, how about this:
What reason does a towny have to post a manipulative post such as that?
What reason does scum have to post a manipulative post such as that?
I think if you talk it through it will be quite evident what you are already thinking in the back of your mind.
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On May 06 2014 08:03 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2014 07:40 Koshi wrote:
Time to sleep.
Poofter fill in 8 names:
towniest town that towned:
Leaning town:
Leaning scum:
Scummiest scummer that scummed: why just poofter?
Just make it happen.
In bed. Sleeping.
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This game feels like trying to get blood out of a stone...
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On May 06 2014 06:43 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +Regarding HF a lot is cause of the reasons he's pushing Oats with. Oats sometimes gets misunderstood or misreads or doesn't make something incredibly clear, so pointing out inconsistencies and calling his mistakes or wrong representations lies, as in scummy lies shouldn't be applied while it could be applied to a player who doesn't make such mistakes as town often.
With Oats you have to is look at his attitude. He's really passive as mafia and in your face as town as I think that is the case in this game. I know it's very subjective (I think LXI and Doctor Who 1 he was scum and I played with him) but maybe somebody else can confirm (Koshi and thrawn maybe can) but I feel confident to say he shouldn't be lynched today. You mafia vivax? Biggest load of bs contained in 2 paragraphs I've ever read. You're throwing around words like "misunderstood" or "misreads" instead of lying to get a towny lynched by any means possible. Show nested quote +wrong representations lies, as in scummy lies shouldn't be applied while it could be applied to a player who doesn't make such mistakes as town often. Show nested quote +On May 06 2014 00:19 Oatsmaster wrote:On May 05 2014 23:45 Holyflare wrote:
Not paying attention to what? I'm asking why you even mentioned my meta in the first place if you had literally no idea about my meta at all. You've answered now "because it sounded nice"........................... wtf does that even mean, that's the scummiest shit i've ever heard, why would you need to make your argument sound nice if you're just trying to point out information you think is right (all my meta is in my profile too) I literally said that meta shit because it sounded nice and convincing and had a decent chance of being correct. Show nested quote +On May 06 2014 00:34 Oatsmaster wrote:On May 06 2014 00:22 Holyflare wrote:On May 06 2014 00:19 Oatsmaster wrote:
Do you know how to play this game Holyflare? Half of the battle comes when town decides that their ego is too large to sheep people without so called "good cases" So what, you make up points to try and get someone lynched when you don't know whether the points are actually accurate or not? Is that what you are seriously sticking to? I dont see what accuracy has to do with anything. Fact is, what convinces me is not what convinces other people and if I have to lie my ass off to get other people to listen, I dont see anything wrong with that. How can you possible defend oats saying he misread or misinterpreted when he said that he lied himself when he got caught out and then instead of you know, playing the game he just said how i am so mafia and wasn't doing anything instead of you know.... playing the rest of the game? His "in your face" town style is also wrong meta because in catastrophe he was exactly the same and was mafia.
Are you really this dense hf? Really? I find that hard to believe.
which is why you are scum.
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I´m also here for some minutes
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Yeh oats just stop typing and roll over. You're attacking me as a player right now instead of what I am typing, I am the only thing you have talked about pretty much ever which is rich when you accused me of focusing on nothing but cav (which never happened). Vivax hardddd defended you by saying what you said was misread or misinformed when you yourself explicitly said it was a lie. Yet, you make no mention of vivax on your return, no mention of anything about anyone.
Have fun.
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On May 06 2014 08:42 Steveling wrote:
Anyone here?
Have your thoughts updated since last time you were around? You've only really talked about cav for posts in a time of joking and koshi.
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HF I don't agree with you on the cav-vivax situation.
You said the following is bs
On May 05 2014 21:06 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2014 12:08 Cavalinho wrote:On May 05 2014 12:00 Tehpoofter wrote:
@Cav whyd you choose Steve over Vivax or anyone else?
@Steve what character is Cav? At first glace, I figured this was setup like Mafiascum, where when someone hits majority they get lynched. I didn't want to put Vivax at L-2 because we were goofing off. I'm still not entirely sure if that's how it works, but that's my best guess. He said he didn't want to vote me to not put me at L-2. 1. It's serious, 2. It provides a serious justification for a non-serious phase, 3. The reason is totally evasive and doesn't say anything about his opinion on me. It reads like an excuse. That's why I wanna know more about this post.
How so? This is perfectly logical.
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On May 06 2014 08:54 Steveling wrote:HF I don't agree with you on the cav-vivax situation. You said the following is bs Show nested quote +On May 05 2014 21:06 Vivax wrote:On May 05 2014 12:08 Cavalinho wrote:On May 05 2014 12:00 Tehpoofter wrote:
@Cav whyd you choose Steve over Vivax or anyone else?
@Steve what character is Cav? At first glace, I figured this was setup like Mafiascum, where when someone hits majority they get lynched. I didn't want to put Vivax at L-2 because we were goofing off. I'm still not entirely sure if that's how it works, but that's my best guess. He said he didn't want to vote me to not put me at L-2. 1. It's serious, 2. It provides a serious justification for a non-serious phase, 3. The reason is totally evasive and doesn't say anything about his opinion on me. It reads like an excuse. That's why I wanna know more about this post. How so? This is perfectly logical.
We are having a fun time making up bs. Cavalinho is concerned fun could end up bad if he puts vivax close to lynch. It's not serious, it's not evasive in any way shape or form. Why should cava have a read on vivax when vivax posted nothing? There was no scum reads no anything, just jokes. So why did vivax take it as a serious post, why is it evasive and why should cava have a read on 0 posts?
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booom boom boom.
Mderg is scum too ok for sure.
Vivax was metaing me and all that so Im meh. I dont think Im playing too different from my scum games though. Although he isnt saying that I wasnt lying, hes saying that I didnt explain myself in a 'townie' way.
Im just baffled at the amount of nonsense you say to the thread apparently believing in it.
lying to lynch someone is fine. I wouldnt lie as scum though, too easy to get caught out.
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On May 06 2014 08:57 Oatsmaster wrote:
booom boom boom.
Mderg is scum too ok for sure.
Vivax was metaing me and all that so Im meh. I dont think Im playing too different from my scum games though. Although he isnt saying that I wasnt lying, hes saying that I didnt explain myself in a 'townie' way.
Im just baffled at the amount of nonsense you say to the thread apparently believing in it.
lying to lynch someone is fine. I wouldnt lie as scum though, too easy to get caught out.
He quite categorically says you aren't a liar.
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About the Oatsmaster situation he did a silly thing, he lied and then admitted so himself before anyone called him out for it.
The whole HF meta situation.
You know who else does dumb things all the time and gets himself lynched as town?
Gumshoe.
Do you know who profits from silly town mistakes? Scum. I was scum twice vs gumshoe and jumped on him because of his inaccuracies and I won both games.
I believe oats did a silly thing now but he admitted himself that he actually don't know how HF's meta goes so that absolves this in my eyes as a silly town play.
On the other hand HF jumping on him for that reminds me of myself-gumshoe, so I get scum vibes from HF.
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And no, lying to lynch a towny is never fine oats. Especially when your lie was only concerned with one person in the early game where 5/9 people were present and doing the same.
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Oatsmaster revealed he lied after i called him out for it steveling
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On May 06 2014 09:00 Holyflare wrote:
Oatsmaster revealed he lied after i called him out for it steveling
Yeah obviously, I mean no one else.
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On May 06 2014 08:57 Oatsmaster wrote:
booom boom boom.
Mderg is scum too ok for sure.
Vivax was metaing me and all that so Im meh. I dont think Im playing too different from my scum games though. Although he isnt saying that I wasnt lying, hes saying that I didnt explain myself in a 'townie' way.
Im just baffled at the amount of nonsense you say to the thread apparently believing in it.
lying to lynch someone is fine. I wouldnt lie as scum though, too easy to get caught out.
I was about to post that I don´t agree with holy on you being scum, you made a bad case but in no way did you lie "to get a towny lynched by any means possible". I´d just call it a bad case based on wrong meta. Incidentally Holy made a case on me in cell mini mafia, also backed up with bad meta reasoning. He was town btw.
I don´t like this post, though. What´s with "Mderg is scum too ok for sure."? Some explanation would be good.
Lying to lynch someone is imo only fine in very few cases. Not with a weak case like yours, though.
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On May 06 2014 09:03 Steveling wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2014 09:00 Holyflare wrote:
Oatsmaster revealed he lied after i called him out for it steveling Yeah obviously, I mean no one else.
how can anyone else call him out if nobody else is around to do it? Don't you think the fact nobody else called him out for it makes it more likely a scummy play than a towny play because he could have gotten away with it unnoticed.
I'm also going to drop some knowledge bombs on you, mafia does whatever it takes to get someone lynched, they aren't interested in the truth they don't tend to ask questions they just push and push and push.
Where in oats filter does it highlight that he might be wrong about me? Absolutely nowhere. It's that conviction with no questioning and no care about anything else that makes him mafia.
If you're taking your past experiences as mafia into account then you should absolutely take my past experiences when I say that I have pushed lies and said the exact same logic as oats to appear more towny for doing it numerous times.
Here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/434275-tl-mafia-lxiii-time-to-die?user=Holyflare&view=all
On December 08 2013 13:38 Holyflare wrote:
I dunno, a lot of people in this game seemed to pick up on "scum tells" that aren't real scum tells. Like misrepresenting someone isn't a tell, it's just being forgetful or misunderstanding sometimes. It's one thing to lie but to lie about something so obviously fact checkable is a thing i don't think scums would ever do.
I was scum. Enjoy your free win and lynch oats now.
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On May 06 2014 09:12 Holyflare wrote:
how can anyone else call him out if nobody else is around to do it? Don't you think the fact nobody else called him out for it makes it more likely a scummy play than a towny play because he could have gotten away with it unnoticed.
That's 100% incorrect.
How would he go unnoticed since you are in the game?
A situation like you described for example, would be my post earlier about gumshoe, gumshoe is not here so I may be lying and get away with it.
But how on earth would Oats get away with it with you here?
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EPT
