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On March 26 2014 09:24 gumshoe wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 09:07 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I'll reword the question:
Do you think he is scummy because;
1) he is asking useless question, or
2) he took my answer at face value?
In my opinion these are different things and you have now said both of them. 1) Yes 2) Yes Because the two are intwined, the question implied he had a difficult time understanding your inquiry, something hard to bilieve in of itself, and the acceptance was almost immediate, thereby showing his confusion was weak at best.
I claim that the answer was really short and I'm a fast reader!
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On March 26 2014 09:26 gumshoe wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 09:22 marvellosity wrote:On March 26 2014 09:11 gumshoe wrote:On March 26 2014 09:05 raynpelikoneet wrote:
gumshoe i am interested. Do you think Palmar is mafia? I do not for a second think he could not come up with his own valid reasoning for your question twoards me and I dont see how he could imagine you in any world giving something up in response. As if when your scum you dont bother with reasons, whereas the opposite is true, your far more careful as red and he should know that. The outcome of the question is inevitable, you look capable, he gives ground, it was unlikely to go any other way(and I dont see what other path he could have honestly imagined) and therefore it was pointless. Hes either fienting in an effort to kick start or hes scum trying to fit in. One thing for sure though, hes not bieng genuine atm. If you believe this, should you not be voting for him? What is the alternate, townie explanation for not being genuine but trying to appear so? Trying to kick start the game, countless times, people have had meaningless conversation just to get things going. He may be doing that now, if you are Palmer wouldn't mind some confirmation / : Also I only ninja vote. Dems the breaks / :
What do you think, I'm curious.
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On March 26 2014 09:30 gumshoe wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 09:26 Palmar wrote:
Also regarding genuine, no matter my alignment I would always be genuine right now. There is a reason I asked rayn the question, and that reason exists whether or not I am mafia or town. So why do you say I am not genuine? I agree with you, a reason does exist, when the reason is some other than "Asking this question of rayn because I think hes scummy" I consider it not genuine and I'm forced to consider other reasonings other than the prefered default. As for why your not literally genuine, 2 reasons 1) I dont believe you couldnt come up with a reason for him asking me that question. 2) Going by the first bit. I dont understand why youd ask that question knowing how easy it is to answer. 3) Your quick acceptance indicated your confusion was meh, possibly non existant.
If the bolded is true I am mafia for asking that question, no matter what. The only answer you accept as genuine can not possibly be given at that point in the thread because it's completely unreasonable to think rayn is scummy at that point. Thus by your own definition I must be mafia for asking that question and there is no need for you to follow up on it, as any answer I give will always make me mafia in your eyes.
##Vote gumshoe
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On March 26 2014 09:39 gumshoe wrote:
He found you scummy because of your question, he wasnt just trying to find out your intent. Point is, I dont see how he could have anticipated the intent you chose to reveal bieng scummy. Therefore the only likely outcome of the question is that you both come to an understanding.
Where do I say this?
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On March 26 2014 09:40 gumshoe wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 09:36 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 09:30 gumshoe wrote:On March 26 2014 09:26 Palmar wrote:
Also regarding genuine, no matter my alignment I would always be genuine right now. There is a reason I asked rayn the question, and that reason exists whether or not I am mafia or town. So why do you say I am not genuine? I agree with you, a reason does exist, when the reason is some other than "Asking this question of rayn because I think hes scummy" I consider it not genuine and I'm forced to consider other reasonings other than the prefered default. As for why your not literally genuine, 2 reasons 1) I dont believe you couldnt come up with a reason for him asking me that question. 2) Going by the first bit. I dont understand why youd ask that question knowing how easy it is to answer. 3) Your quick acceptance indicated your confusion was meh, possibly non existant. If the bolded is true I am mafia for asking that question, no matter what. The only answer you accept as genuine can not possibly be given at that point in the thread because it's completely unreasonable to think rayn is scummy at that point. Thus by your own definition I must be mafia for asking that question and there is no need for you to follow up on it, as any answer I give will always make me mafia in your eyes. ##Vote gumshoe Not necessarily ( : if you ask the question to kick start town, which you stated you were trying to do, then your town, albiet deceitful, so answer me, is that what you were doing?
I already asked you, what do you think?
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On March 26 2014 09:43 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 09:36 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 09:30 gumshoe wrote:On March 26 2014 09:26 Palmar wrote:
Also regarding genuine, no matter my alignment I would always be genuine right now. There is a reason I asked rayn the question, and that reason exists whether or not I am mafia or town. So why do you say I am not genuine? I agree with you, a reason does exist, when the reason is some other than "Asking this question of rayn because I think hes scummy" I consider it not genuine and I'm forced to consider other reasonings other than the prefered default. As for why your not literally genuine, 2 reasons 1) I dont believe you couldnt come up with a reason for him asking me that question. 2) Going by the first bit. I dont understand why youd ask that question knowing how easy it is to answer. 3) Your quick acceptance indicated your confusion was meh, possibly non existant. If the bolded is true I am mafia for asking that question, no matter what. The only answer you accept as genuine can not possibly be given at that point in the thread because it's completely unreasonable to think rayn is scummy at that point. Thus by your own definition I must be mafia for asking that question and there is no need for you to follow up on it, as any answer I give will always make me mafia in your eyes. ##Vote gumshoe Looks like you made a case on yourself and then voted someone else, Palmar. Tsk.
It's how I roll.
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On March 26 2014 09:42 gumshoe wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 09:41 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 09:40 gumshoe wrote:On March 26 2014 09:36 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 09:30 gumshoe wrote:On March 26 2014 09:26 Palmar wrote:
Also regarding genuine, no matter my alignment I would always be genuine right now. There is a reason I asked rayn the question, and that reason exists whether or not I am mafia or town. So why do you say I am not genuine? I agree with you, a reason does exist, when the reason is some other than "Asking this question of rayn because I think hes scummy" I consider it not genuine and I'm forced to consider other reasonings other than the prefered default. As for why your not literally genuine, 2 reasons 1) I dont believe you couldnt come up with a reason for him asking me that question. 2) Going by the first bit. I dont understand why youd ask that question knowing how easy it is to answer. 3) Your quick acceptance indicated your confusion was meh, possibly non existant. If the bolded is true I am mafia for asking that question, no matter what. The only answer you accept as genuine can not possibly be given at that point in the thread because it's completely unreasonable to think rayn is scummy at that point. Thus by your own definition I must be mafia for asking that question and there is no need for you to follow up on it, as any answer I give will always make me mafia in your eyes. ##Vote gumshoe Not necessarily ( : if you ask the question to kick start town, which you stated you were trying to do, then your town, albiet deceitful, so answer me, is that what you were doing? I already asked you, what do you think? I asked first.
Did you not read the next post right after I asked rayn this particular question?
Also, why do I get an out if I say "I was trying to kickstart discussion"?
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On March 26 2014 09:48 gumshoe wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 09:43 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Like the same thing as my question to you:
"A variety of answers are null, but there is a possibility of scummy one."
Why did you figure that out from my question but not from Palmar's? Because my history indicates that such line of questioning is effective against me, whereas such a question directed against you would only make you look stronger regardless of alignment. If hes town, asking that question does him little good. I dont think town palmer would find you scummy for your question, and if he did he wouldnt ask a question that improves your position if your scum 99 out of 100 times. Therefore he is not genuine.
I think you think I think rayn is better at scum than I think he really is.
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Which questions did I not cover?
And you still need to explain why the magic phrase "I was trying to create discussion" is a get out of jail free card.
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On March 26 2014 09:59 gumshoe wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 09:56 Palmar wrote:
Which questions did I not cover?
And you still need to explain why the magic phrase "I was trying to create discussion" is a get out of jail free card. Not until you answer definitively yes or no. That is the question, the only question I have of you.
which one, whether or not I was trying to create discussion? Seeing as I posted as much in the next post after I asked rayn the question I thought the answer should be default, did you not notice that?
And no, it's an opportunity to do something that may or may not provide something useful, so yes I was creating discussion and no that wasn't the sole purpose of the question.
Do I get to go home now officer?
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On March 26 2014 10:08 gumshoe wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 10:03 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 09:59 gumshoe wrote:On March 26 2014 09:56 Palmar wrote:
Which questions did I not cover?
And you still need to explain why the magic phrase "I was trying to create discussion" is a get out of jail free card. Not until you answer definitively yes or no. That is the question, the only question I have of you. which one, whether or not I was trying to create discussion? Seeing as I posted as much in the next post after I asked rayn the question I thought the answer should be default, did you not notice that? And no, it's an opportunity to do something that may or may not provide something useful, so yes I was creating discussion and no that wasn't the sole purpose of the question. Do I get to go home now officer? Yeah sure, in case you were wondering about the trap card, I wanted to see how paranoid you were at the thought of a trap, which you weren't really, just sort of indolent towards the whole notion. I has no issues with you as of now.
I wasn't wondering about the trap card.
By your own definition I am still mafia because I was serious about my question without previously thinking rayn is scum, so how can you have no issues with me? I literally just said that there exists a reason for me asking rayn that question that isn't a) to start a discussion or b) because I think rayn is scummy.
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On March 26 2014 10:09 raynpelikoneet wrote:Palmar must be the most trapped person in mafia. 
Yeah if people would stop doing that shit, that'd be great, thanks.
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On March 26 2014 12:39 IAmRobik wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 09:26 Palmar wrote:
Also regarding genuine, no matter my alignment I would always be genuine right now. There is a reason I asked rayn the question, and that reason exists whether or not I am mafia or town. So why do you say I am not genuine? ##vote PalmarExplanation: Palmar is self-conscious mafia, so when he is writing this sentence, he feels the need to add the "or town" even though the sentence actually should end on "whether or not i am mafia" or it should read "whether i am mafia or town". It can't be both. Trust me on this one. I found our first mafia boys!
If anything you should conclude I'm town here for not proofreading my posts.
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objection:
On March 26 2014 13:06 Holyflare wrote:Ok, Palmar is 100% mafia for this small comment that nobody picked up on. Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 08:13 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 08:11 thrawn2112 wrote:
witchcraft 2 My idea kinda died anyway. I just remembered that rayn also did a townclaim at the beginning of titanic, and that he didn't really in foundation, but reading back I found that he opened with that unvoting plan in default suspicion, so whatever. In no way shape or form does rayn "town claim" like Palmar says flat out. It's a statement that is alignment null. He could be town, he could be mafia. Who knows? Palmar knows, that's who. ##Vote Palmar
What have the sentences got to do with each other?
rayn does claim town, he even clarifies later that he was claiming town.
rayn claiming town doesn't say anything about his alignment.
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On March 26 2014 13:19 IAmRobik wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 10:34 raynpelikoneet wrote:gumshoe, here is how i see it: On March 26 2014 08:29 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 08:27 raynpelikoneet wrote:
gumshoe why Robik over anyone else? Do you think you will get an answer from gumshoe that has any chance of moving your read on him forward? If so, what kind of an answer would make you lean one way or the other? On March 26 2014 08:38 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 08:32 raynpelikoneet wrote:On March 26 2014 08:29 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 08:27 raynpelikoneet wrote:
gumshoe why Robik over anyone else? Do you think you will get an answer from gumshoe that has any chance of moving your read on him forward? If so, what kind of an answer would make you lean one way or the other? Over-explained answer could be indicative of scumshoe. He tried to over-explain shit last game (geript's PYP) as mafia and it backpedalled quite hard. He also knows i am a tunnely guy and he also knows my questions have motive behind them so therefore he knows he must answer to me. Joke is a joke, but gumshoe getting possibly scared as scum was worth a try. There is no reason for him not to answer you as any alignment, but I guess it is actually reasonable to think there is a small chance of panic and overexplanation. On March 26 2014 08:53 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 08:41 gumshoe wrote:On March 26 2014 08:38 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 08:32 raynpelikoneet wrote:On March 26 2014 08:29 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 08:27 raynpelikoneet wrote:
gumshoe why Robik over anyone else? Do you think you will get an answer from gumshoe that has any chance of moving your read on him forward? If so, what kind of an answer would make you lean one way or the other? Over-explained answer could be indicative of scumshoe. He tried to over-explain shit last game (geript's PYP) as mafia and it backpedalled quite hard. He also knows i am a tunnely guy and he also knows my questions have motive behind them so therefore he knows he must answer to me. Joke is a joke, but gumshoe getting possibly scared as scum was worth a try. There is no reason for him not to answer you as any alignment, but I guess it is actually reasonable to think there is a small chance of panic and overexplanation. Scum can be reasonable as well : P and this game is pretty stacked, mistakes this early on are not to be expected. I'm curious Palmer, what kind of reaction were you looking for out of Rayn, knowing farily well hed have an easy time answering your question as either alignment? If rayn does not have an explanation to his question it makes the question pointless and thus rayn more likely to be mafia. On March 26 2014 08:54 Palmar wrote:
The point being that I did not see how any answer I expected could possibly have revealed anything about your alignment. Let me make myself Palmar for a second: "I don't get why you are asking gumshoe that shit. I can't think of a reason but maybe there is one. Let's see if there is a reason or not. Otherwise rayn is probably mafia. Okay he told me the reason, hmm.. seems reasonable, no need to pursue this further." Everything after that is explaining the motivation behind the original question. Now why is this not an acceptable scenario given the posts i quoted? I mean of course it's possible Palmar was just lazy scum who was not thinking at all and asked useless shit but is it more likely? I can't tell based on these relevant posts so i consider this a null-tell. So if you have some awesome evidence i have missed which proves Palmar was just making shit up for no reason please elaborate. I think you're missing gumshoe's point about this, or maybe I'm misunderstanding...either way -- MY THOUGHTS -- are that Palmar clarified that he asked the question of you to promote conversation. He then reiterated that it was just for the purpose of starting conversation... THEN he said that he ALSO did it because he thought Rayn was scummy. He just seems to be continuously contradicting himself. idk. I don't like you Palmar. PALMAR. I THINK YOU'RE SCUM.
Show me where.
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On March 26 2014 17:56 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2014 17:52 Palmar wrote:objection:On March 26 2014 13:06 Holyflare wrote:Ok, Palmar is 100% mafia for this small comment that nobody picked up on. On March 26 2014 08:01 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Town wins this belt. On March 26 2014 08:13 Palmar wrote:On March 26 2014 08:11 thrawn2112 wrote:
witchcraft 2 My idea kinda died anyway. I just remembered that rayn also did a townclaim at the beginning of titanic, and that he didn't really in foundation, but reading back I found that he opened with that unvoting plan in default suspicion, so whatever. In no way shape or form does rayn "town claim" like Palmar says flat out. It's a statement that is alignment null. He could be town, he could be mafia. Who knows? Palmar knows, that's who. ##Vote Palmar What have the sentences got to do with each other? rayn does claim town, he even clarifies later that he was claiming town. rayn claiming town doesn't say anything about his alignment. you make the assumption that it's a town claim before he says it's a null claim and that assumption was scummy because it just said "town wins the belt" which is in fact null claiming in the first place
You can't null claim, that's literally impossible, as that means you're NOT claiming anything. It's by definition impossible to nullclaim.
Someone claiming shit doesn't make him shit, it just means he claims shit.
I claim I'm the goddamn president of america. <- Does this make me the president of america? What kind of retarded logic is this holyflare?
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On March 26 2014 17:57 Holyflare wrote:
before he says it's a town claim*
How on earth do you read his post if not that he is implying that he is part of town?
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wow, sentence
"How on earth do you read his post implying anything other than rayn saying he's part of town"?
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I'm still not following you.
You seem to be confusing claims with tells.
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EPT
