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On April 03 2014 08:57 Djodref wrote:
I'm going to sleep soon guyz, but I'll be here for 10 minutes before heading to bed (actually I'm already on my bed).
Anything you wanna ask, please do it now.
Please pressure Toad if he pops up in the thread when you are around. Please nuke Slam.
Yeah, may I ask if you get what my beef is with hopeless' play or am I just seeing things?Did you form a read on him yet?
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Before you check out you might want to tell us why you're interested into hopeless' read on me.
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On April 03 2014 10:49 kushm4sta wrote:
vivax why are you interested in kitaman's interest in hopeless' read on you?
Cause the question like it is doesn't say anything about what kita thinks or what he wants to achieve with it?
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Sounds a lot like you're trying to figure out if I'm scum
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On April 02 2014 06:09 Toadesstern wrote:
well I was untargetable last night, that's why
On April 03 2014 17:55 Toadesstern wrote:
also if there's people defending me you should probably take a look at that. I haven't really done anything scummy or townish this game so there shouldn't be a reason to call me mafia OR town on anything I've done in this game.
A new guy might come to the conclusion that lack of activity might be a trait either way when it's obviously not because I'm posting a lot more when I'm mafia than when I'm town but not everyone has played a lot of games with me considering I haven't played a lot in in the last 12 months or so.
So if there's someone telling you I'm looking townish based on my posts that might be a bullshit mafia trying to look good afterwards. The only real reason to defend me would be the fact that I there's shots missing n1 and the fact that I got protected.
Can you expand on the protection please?
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On April 03 2014 17:51 Toadesstern wrote:
yeah sorry guys I don't really have the time to read this week...
Did someone claim being shot and protected besides me? Because with no kills on n1 I don't even know why someone would
consider lynching me right now despite not playing the game.
Reads haven't really changed for me, still the same, add in whoever gave that nuke to JarJar because he didn't give it to someone like Kita / hopeless / austin / myself, which makes it highly likely that the intention of the nuke was to just get someone nuked instead of an aimed hit.
Looked a lot like a gundealer giving a gun to some new guy / some guy with wrong reads so that they shoot a townie instead of someone from team mafia having to dirty their hands. If someone claimed giving that nuke away, that guy probably should be lynched.
I have to vote today as well so I'll put it on hopeless, still want him dead
##vote hopeless
Might wanna lynch Toad now cause he drops in saying he wants to lynch hope without giving a single reason as to why he's scum, and on top of that knowing his vote doesn't even count.
You can say you're busy all you want but if you spend your time talking about not-your-scumread then I see that as not caring much about the game which is a rather not-town trait.
I have extensively questioned hopeless, need your updated opinion on the exchange, JJD and me both raised up multiple points. How do you agree/disagree with them?
Need any reason for you to still think hopeless is scum. Something conclusive for you to leave with your not-vote.
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Start by writing about me kita cause I wanna gun the shit you will write down so fast you won't even hit F5
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Yeah I moved back to Austria last year after some time in Italy. Also got both citizenships etc.
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Kaslam justice is flying towards you. Any last words?
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+ Show Spoiler +
The biggest problem that I have with Vivax is his inconsistency between post 1 and 2. In the first post, he goes after Rayn for the easy slam lynch stating that slam should be dealt with at some point in the future, while trying to lynch mafia instead. I agree with that point and think it's generally good policy. Mid way through the day, he suggests that Slam could be a traitor and that he was willing to support a slam lynch, not necessarily because slam was mafia, but because it was a possibility that he was mafia. By the end of the day, Vivax wants to lynch slam to postpone a rayn lynch for another day.
Here is what I find scummy. I would expect a townie to follow this path of logic:
1) We should lynch mafia, rather than slam day one
2) Slam needs to be killed at some point to remove doubt, but lets see if I can find a likely mafia instead
3) rayn isn't the best lynch today, but player X is and this is why
This is Vivax's path:
1) We should lynch mafia, rather than slam day one
2) Slam needs to be killed at some point to remove doubt
3) rayn isn't the best lynch today, so I guess we have no choice but to lynch slam
I don't have a huge issue with Vivax wanting to not lynch rayn, but I do have an issue with the fact that he don't attempt to pursue a player that he thinks is scum. He says that he is working on things one by one, but in the end nothing comes of it. Sure, he questions thinks he finds suspicious and asks for opinions, but there is no follow up or statements attempting to convince others to lynch a certain player, rather than the settle vote at the end, which is what he was criticizing to begin with.
D1 I didn't have any strong scumreads to go after, all I knew is that I didn't want to lynch rayn D1 albeit finding some stuff about him scummy, and especially didn't want to after his role claim, and that slam could be anything and wasn't helping town, but spamming the thread. So, in summary he would have been a safe lynch as opposed to somebody like rayn.
Sure, I criticized rayn for telling us to lynch him and call it a day, but that was early in the day so it didn't make much sense to agree on a lynch and not do anything else D1, it's not that much about lynching scum it's about hunting it which town won't do properly if a 3p claim lynch is on the table and stays there throughout the day.
If Vivax argues that he was completely stumped on day one, had absolutely no mafia reads, and wanted more time to find a mafia player, I really don't like his nuke preference. He criticizes rayn for going for the easy target and calling it a day, while deciding not to suggest that the nuke be fired at a scum suspect on day two. He essentially settles two cycles in a row without indicating that he actually has a strong mafia read on slam, aside from cult speculation, which is more of a guess at a possibility than anything.
Why don't you like my nuke preference? Assume Kaslam didn't claim, didn't do anything of the sort. Assume he simply stood there, posted bullshit and spammed the thread without a claim. That's Kaslam as we have him and independently of his claim he is somebody who should be vigged for his play alone. Lots of people justified voting rayn (maybe even you have to check) saying "lynch mafia not 3p". That's where I came in play saying Kaslam could be anything, from traitor to survivor to scum fakeclaiming, I couldn't get why people simply went with that claim and lynched rayn. And on top of that, the bullshit posters' claim looked legit to you but rayn's didn't?
Stuff like this doesn't really seem like a mindset that he is thinking about things from a town perspective. Like toad claims to have a vote, kush claims to have two votes, so for kush to steal toad's vote, that would mean both toad and kush are lying/buddies, which doesn't even make sense.
His argument with hope today does seem like it makes a hope/vivax pair unlikely, which makes me worried about who else I'm overlooking. I do want to evaluate hope a bit more in depth before deciding between the two/others, but right now I'm leaning mafia.
It was pure speculation, a vote stealer role was also in personality mafia 2 I think so I figured kush=extra vote, Toad=lack of vote -> kush maybe stole it and wrote it down without much thought behind it.
It's not like you can say I had any malicious intentions with that post do you? Or do you think I used that post to push a scummy idea on the two of them? Well no I didn't and that should be evident.
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Kita before you respond to this I would like to hear your points on hopeless first if you don't mind.
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On April 04 2014 01:36 kushm4sta wrote:Show nested quote +On April 04 2014 00:47 Vivax wrote:
It was pure speculation, a vote stealer role was also in personality mafia 2 I think so I figured kush=extra vote, Toad=lack of vote -> kush maybe stole it and wrote it down without much thought behind it.
It's not like you can say I had any malicious intentions with that post do you? Or do you think I used that post to push a scummy idea on the two of them? Well no I didn't and that should be evident.
Vivax you have been subtly pushing the idea that 1. I'm scum for a very long time. Also the idea that 2. I will probably become scum in the future. Here you are trying to discredit my claim in a way that makes absolutely no sense.
1. possible
2. possible
3. not discrediting anything, just speculating on...possibilities
You and kita on the other hand both pushed rayn and now both push me so I'll have to reevaluate some things cause I can't imagine kita being this bad as town, although for you it's perfectly possible.
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On April 04 2014 01:45 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 04 2014 01:42 Vivax wrote:On April 04 2014 01:36 kushm4sta wrote:On April 04 2014 00:47 Vivax wrote:
It was pure speculation, a vote stealer role was also in personality mafia 2 I think so I figured kush=extra vote, Toad=lack of vote -> kush maybe stole it and wrote it down without much thought behind it.
It's not like you can say I had any malicious intentions with that post do you? Or do you think I used that post to push a scummy idea on the two of them? Well no I didn't and that should be evident.
Vivax you have been subtly pushing the idea that 1. I'm scum for a very long time. Also the idea that 2. I will probably become scum in the future. Here you are trying to discredit my claim in a way that makes absolutely no sense. 1. possible 2. possible 3. not discrediting anything, just speculating on...possibilities You and kita on the other hand both pushed rayn and now both push me so I'll have to reevaluate some things cause I can't imagine kita being this bad as town, although for you it's perfectly possible. So to be clear, you thought my case on rayn was valid yesterday, but today you can't imagine me being this bad as town, even though you agreed with me?
Yea precisely, especially cause of the push on me, I saw you hunting me when I was scum and it wasn't like this, gut wise. I know you are a good scumhunter and I feel like I'm not up against a scumhunter here, I'm simply up against a guy who decided for some reason he wants to lynch me but doesn't otherwise seem interested in what I have to say (like kush and tehpoofter though).
I want to add a few more reasons. I ACTUALLY asked you for your points on hopeless cause I noticed that in your case you said that what I did was "pointless" or something like that, yet hopeless is among your scumreads. Hence I felt kinda offended at first, cause hopeless is a guy who doesn't post much on his own and I figured yo uwould have found me getting information out of him useful, yet you prefer to give a negative overall summary of my play.
So basically I wanted to see if your points on hopeless were related to the answers I pulled out of him, and confront you with the fact that you called my play useless.
Now I'm kinda sure you're scum cause you don't reply to my defense, but pop out once you spot something that could be construed as scummy. You don't question hopeless about anything but call him scum and the information I got from him useless.
Accusatory, not inquisitive. Judgmental but not considerate. Those are the words I would describe your play with right now. And they are scumtraits imo. So yeah, I think I'll actually go for a vote on you.
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On April 01 2014 06:07 Crossfire99 wrote:
Vote Count
raynpelikoneet (6) - kitaman27, thrawn2112, Alakaslam, Toadesstern, kushm4sta, Alakaslam, Tehpoofter, raynpelikoneet, Hopeless1der, kitaman27, Amiko, raynpelikoneet
Alakaslam (3) - Toadesstern, kushm4sta, Tehpoofter, thrawn2112, kitaman27, raynpelikoneet, Djodref, Amiko, Hopeless1der, JarJarDrinks, Djodref, Vivax, thrawn2112
Hopeless1der (0) - Toadesstern, raynpelikoneet, Toadesstern, thrawn2112
kitaman27 (0) - raynpelikoneet, raynpelikoneet, raynpelikoneet
gumshoe (3) - thrawn2112, Alakaslam, Tehpoofter, thrawn2112
Tehpoofter (1) - austinmcc
JarJarDrinks (0) - Djodref
thrawn2112 (0) - kitaman27
Toadesstern (0) - raynpelikoneet
Not Voting (1) - gumshoe
raynpelikoneet is lynched! Let me know if I made a mistake or anything.
Current vote count on me: Hopeless, kita, kush, TehPoofter
Oh look they were also on the rayn wagon yesterday.
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On April 04 2014 02:04 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 04 2014 01:58 Vivax wrote:
Now I'm kinda sure you're scum cause you don't reply to my defense, but pop out once you spot something that could be construed as scummy. You don't question hopeless about anything but call him scum and the information I got from him useless. lol, so you tell me not to reply to your defense until I'm done looking at hopeless and then when I'm in the process of doing so, you attack me for not responding, saying it makes me scum? You even assume that I've chosen you over hope when I haven't indicated one way or the other. What gives?
I was waiting for you to comment on hopeless, but seeing you got immediately hung up on soemthing that could be construed as scummy, I felt like I had to jump in and finally let out what I was thinking about you instead of keeping back until I saw what you would write about hope.
That really gave me super bad vibes cause yo uhave 1 post where I respond to your points, one post where I ask for your stuff on hope, and 1 where I replied to kush saying I have to reevaluate you both cause I can't imagine you being so bad.
Of all three, you chose the most offensive path to reply to me, picking the latest post trying to further incriminate me while completely skipping comments on my defense. That reads as scum trying to push a mislynch, not figuring out what i'm up to.
Even if I asked you to comment on hopeless first you didn't have to give me that courtesy if you felt that my defense against your case was bad. Which brings us to that. Try to reevaluate things in light of what I've said in my defense and post your points on hopeless and then we can see what's left to say to the points you skipped (either cause you accepted my request out of courtesy or willingly).
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I really hope that nuke isn't a dud -.-
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On April 04 2014 02:17 Hopeless1der wrote:
Hey Kita...have you made a case on me recently that I havent seen?
No, he never asks you a question but thinks you are worthy of today's lynch.
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Something like: "Hey hopeless care to justify that vote on Vivax from yours cause you previously said you were biased about him? Is there any particular reason you join his lynch without saying a word about the reasons just like you did D1 when you fucking genius killed rayn on a whim after encouraging him and kita to go 1 on 1 and then not applying it the next day, effectively shrubbing off as much responsibility for the lynch as possible and not having to deliver any arguments?"
On April 04 2014 02:19 Hopeless1der wrote:Show nested quote +On April 04 2014 02:17 Vivax wrote:On April 04 2014 02:17 Hopeless1der wrote:
Hey Kita...have you made a case on me recently that I havent seen? No, he never asks you a question but thinks you are worthy of today's lynch. Okay well... Show nested quote +On April 04 2014 02:09 Amiko wrote:
Right now my vote preference is hopeless1der. I will read vivax's defense more when I get back.
If I still think hopeless is the best lynch I will try to convince when I get back
@hopeless1der If you are in thread please comment on kita's case so I have more of you to read
##vote: hopeless1der something is amiss here
You asked kita, not amiko.
Something is amiss up there.
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EPT
