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Let's play a game... |
On June 06 2013 02:47 TheDavison wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 02:10 TomB4 wrote:On June 05 2013 13:43 TheDavison wrote:
Tom gives his reads, which he actually promised during night1. In it, he outlines specifically why eccleston is probably town. Tomb4 gives a breakdsown of eccleston actions and states specifically this can only be from a town mindset.
He then buddies to McCoy by pushing both of his suspects JP and TD.
Whereas day1, Dr.t he continually fought McCoy.
Compare this with his post above, where he finds cheap reasoning to +1 eccleston. A full 180 and in the process throwing away his probable town read with very little reasoning. Why is he not adamantly defending eccleston like he did Dr.t? He never said he thought Dr.t was probable town, merely the reasoning was weak. What has changed tom? 1. He got replaced. 2. JP died. 3. MSmith died. It's really quite simple, reevaluating in light of deaths is very important. Eccleston's replacement really hasn't done much in the time since and the deaths have made him look quite bad. Perhaps, or perhaps not. Show nested quote +On June 05 2013 12:59 TomB4 wrote:
..
Seeing as MSmith's secondary read was Eccleston and McCoy's secondary read was JP, Eccleston looks very bad in light of the kill.
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##vote Eccleston OK. JP died, by lynch. Eccleston didnt even vote. 7 voters out of 10, nominated JP. Why does the JP lynch paint Eccleston in a bad light again?
Process of elimination.
Like I said earlier in the game and even earlier today, Based on who I think is likely to be town, scum must be within a small group of 3-4 players. JP's flip makes that group smaller and by extension makes everyone in the group look worse.
On June 06 2013 02:47 TheDavison wrote:OK. MSmith died. If Eccleston was the secondary read; why is the primary read not being painted in bad light for you / discussed publically? Perhaps you will now throw in, his primary wass Dr.T. If that is the case, considering you threw out this before: Show nested quote +On June 01 2013 09:47 TomB4 wrote:
Like most players on TL you have no idea how to play scum. I am sure you will agree, it is very weak scum play to NK people "onto" you. Typically strong analysts are taken out first. MSmith1 satisfied that role: and hence became a suitable candidate regardless of who his target was. Now, if you want to consider we have "terribad" scum playing, then I'm surprised you didn't catch onto Dr.T earlier =P So I ask again, what does the death of MSmith have to do with Eccleston bleeding red?
Really, you're grasping at straws so hard here. Yes, obviously their primary reads on DAY 1 were DrT. Almost everyone had that read aside from, primarily, JP and myself.
Also, no, it is NOT a weak scum play to kill someone who is "onto" you, particularly if it avoids other issues. Townies don't always go back and reread. I was the only person who reported on what I found in MSmith's filter after he died. How many times in endgame have you seen good townies come back and say "you should have looked in my filter after I died"? It happens all the time.
So if they were shooting purely based on analysis why did McCoy not get shot?
There are three reasons that could possibly be, and I'm betting on a combination of them. We can agree that good analysts are scary to scum, but we need to differentiate the shot here.
McCoy maybe would have been perceived more likely as being a protect target than MSmith. There's one reason.
The second reason (and just as plausible) is that McCoy's secondary reads were not as scary as MSmith's. Scum often shoot those who are on the correct track if they are the only ones they think have the potential of catching them.
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Davis, I am low on patience, and I have to say I'm not in my most analytical mood, and I didn't look critically at every post in this game since End of D2.
What HW did is scummy, and even if he isn't scum, I want him out, OUT. I hate him and H3 both, cause they are abysmally bad if they're town, and will be the guys we will rage about when they will be the ones who have to decide the game at LYLO, and fail miserably.
We could have saved JP if it wasn't for these two guys who crawled in talking shit after JP's lynch.
The little HW did lately is scummy enough, and he has to be lynched, you won't find anything else you can build a case on cause this dude doesn't post, so take what you can find and realize this is one of the few pieces of proof this dude will ever deliver, since everyone ignores him.
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I don't understand what action I could have taken to save JP other than voting for someone who wasn't him. Explain that to me.
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I don't Understand how smcc is comparing me to hw. HW is try harding on a whole different level than me. He would be tryhard scum and I would be lurkstrat scum.
I guess he hasn't been reading hws recent posts.
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smccs bitching in his recent most actually is so scummy.
He wants to kill hw and me because we are bad lol.
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We were rallying people for a voteswitch.
You and H3 only posted shortly after his death, which suggests you were there pre-deadline.
That suggests you were scared to show your presence when it mattered, or that you don't give a shit about the game, either of which is bad and justifies your lynch.
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SMcCoy,
it is clear you are agitated today.
I still think you are the key to rallying this town together, but i suggest you take a breather and clear your mind.
I am about to unleash a case on TomB4 based on his latest response.
I truly feel this holds more certainty than your Day1 case on Dr.T.
I would appreciate if you (and all other town) can review this case and if it holds, join my vote.
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On June 06 2013 03:06 TomB4 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 06 2013 02:47 TheDavison wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 02:10 TomB4 wrote:On June 05 2013 13:43 TheDavison wrote:
Tom gives his reads, which he actually promised during night1. In it, he outlines specifically why eccleston is probably town. Tomb4 gives a breakdsown of eccleston actions and states specifically this can only be from a town mindset.
He then buddies to McCoy by pushing both of his suspects JP and TD.
Whereas day1, Dr.t he continually fought McCoy.
Compare this with his post above, where he finds cheap reasoning to +1 eccleston. A full 180 and in the process throwing away his probable town read with very little reasoning. Why is he not adamantly defending eccleston like he did Dr.t? He never said he thought Dr.t was probable town, merely the reasoning was weak. What has changed tom? 1. He got replaced. 2. JP died. 3. MSmith died. It's really quite simple, reevaluating in light of deaths is very important. Eccleston's replacement really hasn't done much in the time since and the deaths have made him look quite bad. Perhaps, or perhaps not. Show nested quote +On June 05 2013 12:59 TomB4 wrote:
..
Seeing as MSmith's secondary read was Eccleston and McCoy's secondary read was JP, Eccleston looks very bad in light of the kill.
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##vote Eccleston OK. JP died, by lynch. Eccleston didnt even vote. 7 voters out of 10, nominated JP. Why does the JP lynch paint Eccleston in a bad light again? Process of elimination. Like I said earlier in the game and even earlier today, Based on who I think is likely to be town, scum must be within a small group of 3-4 players. JP's flip makes that group smaller and by extension makes everyone in the group look worse. If only that was the answer to the question.
First the easy part: You have subtracted "assume town" players from the remaining pool of players.
Where you proceed to lose me is when you tie the following two statements.
(1) JPs flip makes that group smaller
&
(2) The JP lynch paints Eccleston in a bad light.
As I mentioned, Eccleston did not vote.
With your logic: whilst Eccleston may hang with the low fruit; he must certainly not be the lowest hanging fruit.
Unfortunately, your actions suggest otherwise.
On June 06 2013 03:06 TomB4 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 06 2013 02:47 TheDavison wrote:OK. MSmith died. If Eccleston was the secondary read; why is the primary read not being painted in bad light for you / discussed publically? Perhaps you will now throw in, his primary wass Dr.T. If that is the case, considering you threw out this before: Show nested quote +On June 01 2013 09:47 TomB4 wrote:
Like most players on TL you have no idea how to play scum. I am sure you will agree, it is very weak scum play to NK people "onto" you. Typically strong analysts are taken out first. MSmith1 satisfied that role: and hence became a suitable candidate regardless of who his target was. Now, if you want to consider we have "terribad" scum playing, then I'm surprised you didn't catch onto Dr.T earlier =P So I ask again, what does the death of MSmith have to do with Eccleston bleeding red? Really, you're grasping at straws so hard here. Yes, obviously their primary reads on DAY 1 were DrT. Almost everyone had that read aside from, primarily, JP and myself. Also, no, it is NOT a weak scum play to kill someone who is "onto" you, particularly if it avoids other issues. Townies don't always go back and reread. I was the only person who reported on what I found in MSmith's filter after he died. How many times in endgame have you seen good townies come back and say "you should have looked in my filter after I died"? It happens all the time. So if they were shooting purely based on analysis why did McCoy not get shot? There are three reasons that could possibly be, and I'm betting on a combination of them. We can agree that good analysts are scary to scum, but we need to differentiate the shot here. McCoy maybe would have been perceived more likely as being a protect target than MSmith. There's one reason. The second reason (and just as plausible) is that McCoy's secondary reads were not as scary as MSmith's. Scum often shoot those who are on the correct track if they are the only ones they think have the potential of catching them. I spoilered what you wrote because it is all pertains to discussion over theory. Hence, each of our opinions are valid in their own context.
As I am sure you are aware. I am a practical man. Theory only extends so far, and thus, your point holds very little credence. It certainly is not a precursor for a vote when isolated.
If i choose to indulge this "theory".
MSmith1 was chasing Eccleston & MSmith1 dies.
This outcome does not make Eccleston scum.
You know this TomB4. Cause and causality are very hard to "reverse engineer", yet you claim to have done so?
I smell fallacious posting.
Even if you want to treat this "theory" as 'icing on the cake", the rest of your reasoning does not even equate to the eggs in the cake mix. The point is moot.
Herein lies my quandry.
If we rewind to Day1/2: You identified Eccleston as a probable town in this post
On June 02 2013 16:10 TomB4 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +EcclestonBased on what I've read of Eccleston's posts I think he's probably the most likely to be town out of the entire lot. In fact, I think he's quite likely to be town. He's made very specific observations that are quite hard for scum to make. I do not, for example, think that the average TL scum player would say anything like these:On May 31 2013 19:25 Eccleston wrote:Show nested quote +On May 31 2013 11:20 Hurndall3 wrote:
##unvote
##vote DrT
k I think I can sheep this DrT shit now that I read the case thoroughly.
these are the points that convinced me to sheep.
1 DrT's overdefense
2 unnatural calmness
3 repeated appeal that scum is among the inactives
4 one dimensional scumreads Can you explain to me why you think that these points are exclusive to a scum mindset? For example, point three could be explained from a town perspective too; if DrT is a townie being tunneled, trying to shift the attention toward the lurkers is a perfectly valid thing to do if he thinks that the mafia are lurking. Before, you dismissed his "overdefense", as brought up by MSmith1 here (it's point two in his post), saying that "2 people are searching for something to talk about early game. This is true of both town and scum." What made you change your mind? How often do scum reference posts and actually question the logic of someone else on such a specific level? Generally scum find it hard to fake the "figuring out" process because they've already been given the alignments of everyone in the game. It's almost impossible to fake this kind of specific questioning process-if questioning is faked by scum, it's usually more general or nebulous. On May 31 2013 03:05 Eccleston wrote:I think lynching PT2 at this time would be unwise. He's made one post and thrown a vote on Hurndall3 for being "brief and blunt", and suddenly, ten hours later, he's a prime suspect? I think you're stretching it when you say that Show nested quote +Being present but not caring about scumhunting is actually much worse than simply not being present at all, because there is standing evidence that a player has at least taken the time to read and post, but still is not contributing. That's far from "null" in my opinion. At the time of his post the thread was about three and a half pages long. It doesn't really take much effort to read that and then write a five paragraph RP post and throw a vote on someone. He could just as well be disinterested townie. I could understand it if you were pushing him as a policy lynch because you're not certain about DrT, but how he is "far from null" is beyond me. He has made one (half serious) post in the entire game. Has he been useless? Yes. Does that make him scum? No. This post reflects Eccleston's initial thought process regarding my opinion of PT yesterday. What's interesting is not necessarily this post itself, because I think the average scum could probably reasonably fake something like this. What's most interesting are his followup posts that demonstrate that he was thinking about this. IMO most scum would not put in the effort to think about what another player has written and said about someone else because they don't have to-they don't know how to fake the process, and so they only show the results of that process. This is partly also, IMO, why scum are so reluctant to swap votes. It's hard for scum to realistically be able to fake a decision-making process when their ulterior goal is to blend in. Eccleston doesn't display any of those tendencies. He's almost certainly town IMO.If anyone can find instances where I am wrong about what I've said above, I'd love to hear it. The only thing that could possibly be held against Eccleston, IMO, is his relatively low recent activity, but given the context of the game I do not think it is a point worthy of consideration unless his inactivity persists.
Let me summarise the key quotes:
Eccleston
- Based on what I've read of Eccleston's posts I think he's probably the most likely to be town out of the entire lot. In fact, I think he's quite likely to be town. He's made very specific observations that are quite hard for scum to make. I do not, for example, think that the average TL scum player would say anything like these.
- It's hard for scum to realistically be able to fake a decision-making process when their ulterior goal is to blend in. Eccleston doesn't display any of those tendencies. He's almost certainly town IMO.
- The only thing that could possibly be held against Eccleston, IMO, is his relatively low recent activity, but given the context of the game I do not think it is a point worthy of consideration unless his inactivity persists.
A very strong analysis, backed with a VERY strong opinion. (Eccleston *is* certainly town)
You go on to add the caveat: this opinion even holds credence with low activity.
If we fast forward to now:
You have 180'd on Eccleson with weak logic (already broken down above), and to boot, you have cited his low activity as an issue!
Surely I dont have to remind you it is normally scum that are able to backpedal reads so flippantly.
If you dont want to respond to that one, its OK. Lets try the next point.
HartnellWilliam.
Below are opinions you have chosen to share publicly of HW throughout Day1 to now.
On June 02 2013 02:30 TomB4 wrote:
I'll let JP speak for himself, but I find it more likely that... HW or PT are scum than him. ... On June 03 2013 04:13 TomB4 wrote:
IF there is some scum on the DrT votelist it's probably HW.
He's pretty much just coasting along. On June 04 2013 07:07 TomB4 wrote:
JPertwee claiming medic.....
There's still so few posts...I'd be down to kill JP or HW but with no one posting there's almost no way to tell who's scum and who's just afking as town.
In short: Since Day1 HW has hovered as a low hanging fruit according to your filter.
So what happens Day3.
Your low hanging fruit writes a "big" case on Eccleston. The man you adamantly proclaimed as almost confirmed town.
What do you do?
You decide to side with your low hanging fruit (HW); throw around cheap reasoning (already dispelled), and discard that *certain* town read.
Not only calling Eccleston scum, but proceed to use a townies strong weapon against scum on him. Your vote.
That is a sequence of logic that is incomprehensible for a townie.
In this sequence of actions, you exhibit no desire to follow up with Eccleston to ascertain his alignment. This is the absolute least a man of your intellect can do for a former "confirmed' townie.
Your behaviour satisfies all the criteria for trademark scum motive.
You saw an opportunity to pounce on lynch bait (Eccleston), and took it.
In process you not only threw away a hard town read.
But you also decided to vote *with* a scum reads target. This all occur without you trying to prod for more information.
This is all scummy behaviour from simply Day2 and Day3.
SMcCoy has already summarised a bunch of points to why your Day1 antics were scummy.
Ironically as a corollary.
Your post identifying JP as medic: is so blase regarding JP being lynched, that surely even you qualify for your own criteria for low hanging fruit on the JP wagon.=P
Town: Join me in eradicating scum. Vote for TomB4
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On June 06 2013 03:48 SMcCoy wrote:
We were rallying people for a voteswitch.
You and H3 only posted shortly after his death, which suggests you were there pre-deadline.
That suggests you were scared to show your presence when it mattered, or that you don't give a shit about the game, either of which is bad and justifies your lynch.
I can only speak for myself when i say this is simply untrue. I was busy that day. I probably was posting on my phone. I had no idea that the lynch had already happened when I posted.
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##Unvote
##Vote TomB4
I'm glad you posted such nice analysis. I'm lazy and busy atm.
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On June 06 2013 03:48 SMcCoy wrote:
We were rallying people for a voteswitch.
You and H3 only posted shortly after his death, which suggests you were there pre-deadline.
That suggests you were scared to show your presence when it mattered, or that you don't give a shit about the game, either of which is bad and justifies your lynch.
I would like to say that swim practice has been ending especially late for me this week. I have come home the last two days at 01:45 GMT (+00:00) and have barely powered my computer and caught up on the thread when the deadline starts. Today I will be home about an hour earlier than that but unfortunately there is no deadline this early.
Tomorrow I'll be late again, but Friday I'll be home long beforehand, and I'm not going anywhere on the weekends. So hopefully I'll lurk at more convenient times for you all.
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Goddamn I would have no problem sheeping that TomB4 case. I still feel Eccleston is scum though. Maybe both are. Lynch one and shoot the other?
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On June 06 2013 04:38 HartnellWill wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 03:48 SMcCoy wrote:
We were rallying people for a voteswitch.
You and H3 only posted shortly after his death, which suggests you were there pre-deadline.
That suggests you were scared to show your presence when it mattered, or that you don't give a shit about the game, either of which is bad and justifies your lynch. I would like to say that swim practice has been ending especially late for me this week. I have come home the last two days at 01:45 GMT (+00:00) and have barely powered my computer and caught up on the thread when the deadline starts. Today I will be home about an hour earlier than that but unfortunately there is no deadline this early. Tomorrow I'll be late again, but Friday I'll be home long beforehand, and I'm not going anywhere on the weekends. So hopefully I'll lurk at more convenient times for you all.
Can you comment on players instead of excusing yourself out. So far you have only summarized stuff Eccleston did. I don't care who of you or Tom gets lynched first, and I'll keep pushing your lynch.
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On June 06 2013 04:44 SMcCoy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 04:38 HartnellWill wrote:On June 06 2013 03:48 SMcCoy wrote:
We were rallying people for a voteswitch.
You and H3 only posted shortly after his death, which suggests you were there pre-deadline.
That suggests you were scared to show your presence when it mattered, or that you don't give a shit about the game, either of which is bad and justifies your lynch. I would like to say that swim practice has been ending especially late for me this week. I have come home the last two days at 01:45 GMT (+00:00) and have barely powered my computer and caught up on the thread when the deadline starts. Today I will be home about an hour earlier than that but unfortunately there is no deadline this early. Tomorrow I'll be late again, but Friday I'll be home long beforehand, and I'm not going anywhere on the weekends. So hopefully I'll lurk at more convenient times for you all. Can you comment on players instead of excusing yourself out. So far you have only summarized stuff Eccleston did. I don't care who of you or Tom gets lynched first, and I'll keep pushing your lynch.
3 total scum, DrT is dead and Eccleston I have a scum read on. My last guess would either be
- Hurndall3 the SCV for suspecting JP, then saying he's town based on his single last post, then voting for him after the deadline. This last part confuses me.
or maybe
- TomB4 the Mighty Thor if I choose to sheep that last case. I'm reading through both pieces of evidence, the one that calls him scum based on D1 and the one based on D2-3 and seeing if it's worth considering him to be scum.
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On June 06 2013 02:31 TheDavison wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 02:06 TomB4 wrote:On June 05 2013 13:30 TheDavison wrote:
Yeah. Explain how you are certain of two shots. No one died n1, right? Our flipped medic claimed to have protected him-we obviously don't know if he got shot n1 but it's very likely given there were no kills. Our medic dies d2 and then MSmith dies n2. Almost certainly he got shot twice. I read it originally as double stacked. Yes it is likely MSMith1 was shot over two consecutive nights. However it is not almost certain. Considering there are other roles capable of preventing a NK than medic in this game.
Are you thick? You think there are multiple defensive roles?
If there was a veteran, he would have claimed a hit. So we can rule that out. If it was a jailkeeper, we would've known there was a roleblock. We can rule that out too.
A medic flipped, he claimed to protect the guy on n1 who died on the night following his flip,
In addition, if the delay was used then MSmith most probably got hit twice, because the medic was dead before the night started, and there almost certainly not two medics. It's just not balanced.
On June 06 2013 04:04 TheDavison wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 03:06 TomB4 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 06 2013 02:47 TheDavison wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 02:10 TomB4 wrote:On June 05 2013 13:43 TheDavison wrote:
Tom gives his reads, which he actually promised during night1. In it, he outlines specifically why eccleston is probably town. Tomb4 gives a breakdsown of eccleston actions and states specifically this can only be from a town mindset.
He then buddies to McCoy by pushing both of his suspects JP and TD.
Whereas day1, Dr.t he continually fought McCoy.
Compare this with his post above, where he finds cheap reasoning to +1 eccleston. A full 180 and in the process throwing away his probable town read with very little reasoning. Why is he not adamantly defending eccleston like he did Dr.t? He never said he thought Dr.t was probable town, merely the reasoning was weak. What has changed tom? 1. He got replaced. 2. JP died. 3. MSmith died. It's really quite simple, reevaluating in light of deaths is very important. Eccleston's replacement really hasn't done much in the time since and the deaths have made him look quite bad. Perhaps, or perhaps not. Show nested quote +On June 05 2013 12:59 TomB4 wrote:
..
Seeing as MSmith's secondary read was Eccleston and McCoy's secondary read was JP, Eccleston looks very bad in light of the kill.
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##vote Eccleston OK. JP died, by lynch. Eccleston didnt even vote. 7 voters out of 10, nominated JP. Why does the JP lynch paint Eccleston in a bad light again? Process of elimination. Like I said earlier in the game and even earlier today, Based on who I think is likely to be town, scum must be within a small group of 3-4 players. JP's flip makes that group smaller and by extension makes everyone in the group look worse. If only that was the answer to the question.First the easy part: You have subtracted "assume town" players from the remaining pool of players. Where you proceed to lose me is when you tie the following two statements. Show nested quote +(1) JPs flip makes that group smaller
&
(2) The JP lynch paints Eccleston in a bad light. As I mentioned, Eccleston did not vote. With your logic: whilst Eccleston may hang with the low fruit; he must certainly not be the lowest hanging fruit.
I don't understand what you're implying here.
I think Eccleston is scummy primarily because of two reasons:
1.) He's within the only group of players that could possibly be scum at the moment.
and more importantly,
2.) He was suspected quite consistently by MSmith, who most likely got shot twice. You think this is a coincidence? I don't.
Unfortunately, your actions suggest otherwise.
No, they don't. My actions are completely consistent with what I've been saying. I had a change of opinion about Eccleston based both on his replacement and based on the events that have happened.
If you think that players' opinions are not supposed to change in light of occurrences then you are playing the wrong fucking game. If you can't accept that, you can go ahead and lynch me and then call me bad when I flip town.
On June 06 2013 02:31 TheDavison wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 03:06 TomB4 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 06 2013 02:47 TheDavison wrote:OK. MSmith died. If Eccleston was the secondary read; why is the primary read not being painted in bad light for you / discussed publically? Perhaps you will now throw in, his primary wass Dr.T. If that is the case, considering you threw out this before: Show nested quote +On June 01 2013 09:47 TomB4 wrote:
Like most players on TL you have no idea how to play scum. I am sure you will agree, it is very weak scum play to NK people "onto" you. Typically strong analysts are taken out first. MSmith1 satisfied that role: and hence became a suitable candidate regardless of who his target was. Now, if you want to consider we have "terribad" scum playing, then I'm surprised you didn't catch onto Dr.T earlier =P So I ask again, what does the death of MSmith have to do with Eccleston bleeding red? Really, you're grasping at straws so hard here. Yes, obviously their primary reads on DAY 1 were DrT. Almost everyone had that read aside from, primarily, JP and myself. Also, no, it is NOT a weak scum play to kill someone who is "onto" you, particularly if it avoids other issues. Townies don't always go back and reread. I was the only person who reported on what I found in MSmith's filter after he died. How many times in endgame have you seen good townies come back and say "you should have looked in my filter after I died"? It happens all the time. So if they were shooting purely based on analysis why did McCoy not get shot? There are three reasons that could possibly be, and I'm betting on a combination of them. We can agree that good analysts are scary to scum, but we need to differentiate the shot here. McCoy maybe would have been perceived more likely as being a protect target than MSmith. There's one reason. The second reason (and just as plausible) is that McCoy's secondary reads were not as scary as MSmith's. Scum often shoot those who are on the correct track if they are the only ones they think have the potential of catching them. I spoilered what you wrote because it is all pertains to discussion over theory. Hence, each of our opinions are valid in their own context. As I am sure you are aware. I am a practical man. Theory only extends so far, and thus, your point holds very little credence. It certainly is not a precursor for a vote when isolated. If i choose to indulge this "theory". MSmith1 was chasing Eccleston & MSmith1 dies. This outcome does not make Eccleston scum. You know this TomB4. Cause and causality are very hard to "reverse engineer", yet you claim to have done so? I smell fallacious posting. Even if you want to treat this "theory" as 'icing on the cake", the rest of your reasoning does not even equate to the eggs in the cake mix. The point is moot.
It makes him far more likely than almost anyone else in the game.
You think that someone who in all probability got shot TWICE didn't have good reads, then by all means, don't kill Eccleston. Scum are not generally that afraid of a player unless it's by name basis, and we certainly don't know who anyone is in this game. The only other reasonable explanation is that MSmith was on the right track.
On June 06 2013 02:31 TheDavison wrote:Herein lies my quandry.If we rewind to Day1/2: You identified Eccleston as a probable town in this postShow nested quote +On June 02 2013 16:10 TomB4 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +
Eccleston
Based on what I've read of Eccleston's posts I think he's probably the most likely to be town out of the entire lot. In fact, I think he's quite likely to be town. He's made very specific observations that are quite hard for scum to make. I do not, for example, think that the average TL scum player would say anything like these:
So? I do think those are townish posts, but in light of the fact that he got replaced, his replacement so far has done nothing, AND to top it all off the MSmith connection stuff, most of that information is almost completely irrelevant. It's obsolete given the fact that we're not even dealing with the same player anymore.
If you cannot understand that simple fact, then you are simply hopeless.
On June 06 2013 02:31 TheDavison wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 02:31 TheDavison wrote:On May 31 2013 19:25 Eccleston wrote:On May 31 2013 11:20 Hurndall3 wrote:
##unvote
##vote DrT
k I think I can sheep this DrT shit now that I read the case thoroughly.
these are the points that convinced me to sheep.
1 DrT's overdefense
2 unnatural calmness
3 repeated appeal that scum is among the inactives
4 one dimensional scumreads Can you explain to me why you think that these points are exclusive to a scum mindset? For example, point three could be explained from a town perspective too; if DrT is a townie being tunneled, trying to shift the attention toward the lurkers is a perfectly valid thing to do if he thinks that the mafia are lurking. Before, you dismissed his "overdefense", as brought up by MSmith1 here (it's point two in his post), saying that "2 people are searching for something to talk about early game. This is true of both town and scum." What made you change your mind? How often do scum reference posts and actually question the logic of someone else on such a specific level? Generally scum find it hard to fake the "figuring out" process because they've already been given the alignments of everyone in the game. It's almost impossible to fake this kind of specific questioning process-if questioning is faked by scum, it's usually more general or nebulous. On May 31 2013 03:05 Eccleston wrote:I think lynching PT2 at this time would be unwise. He's made one post and thrown a vote on Hurndall3 for being "brief and blunt", and suddenly, ten hours later, he's a prime suspect? I think you're stretching it when you say that Being present but not caring about scumhunting is actually much worse than simply not being present at all, because there is standing evidence that a player has at least taken the time to read and post, but still is not contributing. That's far from "null" in my opinion. At the time of his post the thread was about three and a half pages long. It doesn't really take much effort to read that and then write a five paragraph RP post and throw a vote on someone. He could just as well be disinterested townie. I could understand it if you were pushing him as a policy lynch because you're not certain about DrT, but how he is "far from null" is beyond me. He has made one (half serious) post in the entire game. Has he been useless? Yes. Does that make him scum? No. This post reflects Eccleston's initial thought process regarding my opinion of PT yesterday. What's interesting is not necessarily this post itself, because I think the average scum could probably reasonably fake something like this. What's most interesting are his followup posts that demonstrate that he was thinking about this. IMO most scum would not put in the effort to think about what another player has written and said about someone else because they don't have to-they don't know how to fake the process, and so they only show the results of that process. This is partly also, IMO, why scum are so reluctant to swap votes. It's hard for scum to realistically be able to fake a decision-making process when their ulterior goal is to blend in. Eccleston doesn't display any of those tendencies. He's almost certainly town IMO.If anyone can find instances where I am wrong about what I've said above, I'd love to hear it. The only thing that could possibly be held against Eccleston, IMO, is his relatively low recent activity, but given the context of the game I do not think it is a point worthy of consideration unless his inactivity persists. Let me summarise the key quotes: Eccleston- Based on what I've read of Eccleston's posts I think he's probably the most likely to be town out of the entire lot. In fact, I think he's quite likely to be town. He's made very specific observations that are quite hard for scum to make. I do not, for example, think that the average TL scum player would say anything like these.
- It's hard for scum to realistically be able to fake a decision-making process when their ulterior goal is to blend in. Eccleston doesn't display any of those tendencies. He's almost certainly town IMO.
- The only thing that could possibly be held against Eccleston, IMO, is his relatively low recent activity, but given the context of the game I do not think it is a point worthy of consideration unless his inactivity persists.
A very strong analysis, backed with a VERY strong opinion. (Eccleston *is* certainly town) You go on to add the caveat: this opinion even holds credence with low activity.
If we fast forward to now: You have 180'd on Eccleson with weak logic (already broken down above), and to boot, you have cited his low activity as an issue! Surely I dont have to remind you it is normally scum that are able to backpedal reads so flippantly. If you dont want to respond to that one, its OK. Lets try the next point.
HartnellWilliam.Below are opinions you have chosen to share publicly of HW throughout Day1 to now. Show nested quote +On June 02 2013 02:30 TomB4 wrote:
I'll let JP speak for himself, but I find it more likely that... HW or PT are scum than him. ... Show nested quote +On June 03 2013 04:13 TomB4 wrote:
IF there is some scum on the DrT votelist it's probably HW.
He's pretty much just coasting along. Show nested quote +On June 04 2013 07:07 TomB4 wrote:
JPertwee claiming medic.....
There's still so few posts...I'd be down to kill JP or HW but with no one posting there's almost no way to tell who's scum and who's just afking as town. In short: Since Day1 HW has hovered as a low hanging fruit according to your filter.
So what happens Day3.Your low hanging fruit writes a "big" case on Eccleston. The man you adamantly proclaimed as almost confirmed town. What do you do?You decide to side with your low hanging fruit (HW); throw around cheap reasoning (already dispelled), and discard that *certain* town read. Not only calling Eccleston scum, but proceed to use a townies strong weapon against scum on him. Your vote.That is a sequence of logic that is incomprehensible for a townie. In this sequence of actions, you exhibit no desire to follow up with Eccleston to ascertain his alignment. This is the absolute least a man of your intellect can do for a former "confirmed' townie.
Your behaviour satisfies all the criteria for trademark scum motive.You saw an opportunity to pounce on lynch bait (Eccleston), and took it. In process you not only threw away a hard town read. But you also decided to vote *with* a scum reads target. This all occur without you trying to prod for more information. This is all scummy behaviour from simply Day2 and Day3. SMcCoy has already summarised a bunch of points to why your Day1 antics were scummy.
Ironically as a corollary. Your post identifying JP as medic: is so blase regarding JP being lynched, that surely even you qualify for your own criteria for low hanging fruit on the JP wagon.=P
Town: Join me in eradicating scum. Vote for TomB4
How on earth is Eccleston lynch bait?
Clearly I was going to get resistance. I'm not a moron, I know that I called him town earlier. How the fuck would he be an easy lynch if I contradict myself so heavily?
If I wanted an easy lynch I would have jumped on HW because it would not have called attention to myself. I still want to get HW lynched, but I do think Eccleston is the better choice today. If people don't agree with me, then we kill HW instead.
Eccleston 2.0 so far has done nothing; he promised a case and a rebuttal but so far has fallen short of providing both. Surely if you've been reading the thread you can at least see that much.
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Less than enthused that there was nothing from Eccleston after his latest promise almost a day ago. The developments over the early part of this cycle lead me to believe that he is using the opportunity to not take part in discourse and remain in the shadows as Davison, who is arguably being the loudest, leads discussion away from him. Of course I appear to be in that same category but right now I'm trying to wrap my head around Davison's case. Tom's rebuttal reads incredibly townie and he has explained, at least to my own satisfaction, his thoughts on each of the points brought against him. Moreover, I am concerned that this case seeks to discredit Tom who was one of two people eyeing Davison for a potential lynch on D1. It seems the other was also one of his current scum reads: McGann. It may be just a coincidence, after all, and the game is dynamic after all, so I'll take a look at Davison's responses to those suspicions.
Okay so that was in the period Davison was inactive and heading for replacement. Fair enough. I don't think I can attribute his read on Tom now to the things that Tom wrote about his slot earlier in the game, especially when those concerns over Davison were assuaged by McCoy:
On June 03 2013 06:05 SMcCoy wrote:If we don't lynch JP the only guy I'll vote today will be HartnellWill, I've grown doubts about Davis cause of this post: Show nested quote +On May 30 2013 23:54 TheDavison wrote:
Doc, don't you feel bad for accussing someone of "maybe not reading the thread" when you yourself are clearly not reading the thread. You 'could kill him' someone else 'has a point' you couldn't be less committal if you tried.
Baker, you are right. DocT is one scummy mother fucker. This was right after DrT jumped onto the Trout wagon. If Davison is his scumbuddy, why would he try to disrupt the only way for DrT to save himself? Also, I think this post is really townie, although I don't agree with his conclusion since HW also made clear he would switch onto Trout: Show nested quote +On June 02 2013 04:51 TheDavison wrote:
Actually this is interesting, there was a time on page 7-8 where Trout was leading in votes four to three by my count. It was at that time when HWill came in and voted DrT bringing him to four as well. While I was feeling bad on the Hwill voting I really like his timing. I think a scum coming into the thread at that time would try to push the trout lynch and, with a few reasoned arguments could probably actually sway people.
Feeling better about Hwill after that read. I'd suggest everyone go look at page 7 and 8 actually. No Davis lynch please. I think we have a false positive here.
The new Davison is loud and in your face and even though I feel he is incorrect about Tom here, I am having trouble placing a scum motive on this case when it can just be explained as a genuine misunderstanding or misinterpretation as shown by Tom's response.
Davison, would you please flesh out what exactly it is about McGann you find scummy other than assocation with Tom, or have you reconsidered your renewed read on Eccleston in the face of his timely disappearance?
##Vote: Eccleston
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Okay, I've honestly been feeling unmotivated and only just now finished my first readthrough. Ive decided that the way Tom is playing just doesn't hang right with me at all. He's really trying too hard to hunt scum! A lot of his posts are very "off" to me
On May 31 2013 08:52 TomB4 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 31 2013 06:29 Baker1986 wrote:On May 31 2013 06:04 TomB4 wrote:
Would you be willing to bet your life in this game on DrT being scum, McCoy? Given your current language, I'd be willing to simply kill you if he flips town.
Explain this. I don't see the connection. McCoy's reads are based on solid logic that's easy to follow and hard to fake. Even if he is wrong, which I don't think he is, I still would consider him town. It's not solid logic, and it's actually super easy to fake. Based on McCoy's first post I didn't consider him strong town. What's troubling is his attitude regarding the lynch. We have so much time, there is no reason to pigeonhole our options so quickly. I could easily be wrong-my first impression is that they are both town. I mostly just asked that question to gauge his sincerity regarding the strength of his read. Show nested quote +On May 31 2013 06:09 SMcCoy wrote:On May 31 2013 06:04 TomB4 wrote:
why are you saying that DrT is the only viable lynch for today? There are a full 29 hours left in the day. This foregone conclusion seems to have come almost immediately. In fact, your confidence doesn't even seem sincere to me.
Would you be willing to bet your life in this game on DrT being scum, McCoy? Given your current language, I'd be willing to simply kill you if he flips town.
Maybe you should find something better than your policy lynch, that might actually convince someone. What policy am I lynching him on? Lynch all trolls? Lol. I don't even know why you are trying to lynch DrT-at least my reasons are clear. Your reasons and confidence don't make any sense.
hes definitely faking his confusion here, why would town do this? theres no explanation
On May 31 2013 03:51 TomB4 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 31 2013 03:26 Baker1986 wrote:On May 31 2013 02:32 TomB4 wrote:
At best, you can argue that what Troughton has said is null, but even that is stretching. In a game like this, all of the town should be acutely aware of the fact that each player's presence is vital in attaining opinions and organising a good scumhunting effort. Being present but not caring about scumhunting is actually much worse than simply not being present at all, because there is standing evidence that a player has at least taken the time to read and post, but still is not contributing. That's far from "null" in my opinion.
There is a big distinction between what players should do and what they do. I don't expect this game to be different at all. Yes, ideally everyone was contributing valuable input to the discussion, but you know what? That's not what actually happens most of the time. So? Are you saying that we should simply ignore people who are willingly not contributing? What a wonderful world we'd live in if we could just win games by letting the scum stand around and troll us all day and not actually lynch them for it.
On May 31 2013 06:04 TomB4 wrote:
why are you saying that DrT is the only viable lynch for today? There are a full 29 hours left in the day. This foregone conclusion seems to have come almost immediately. In fact, your confidence doesn't even seem sincere to me.
Would you be willing to bet your life in this game on DrT being scum, McCoy? Given your current language, I'd be willing to simply kill you if he flips town.
On June 06 2013 07:32 TomB4 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 02:31 TheDavison wrote:On June 06 2013 02:06 TomB4 wrote:On June 05 2013 13:30 TheDavison wrote:
Yeah. Explain how you are certain of two shots. No one died n1, right? Our flipped medic claimed to have protected him-we obviously don't know if he got shot n1 but it's very likely given there were no kills. Our medic dies d2 and then MSmith dies n2. Almost certainly he got shot twice. I read it originally as double stacked. Yes it is likely MSMith1 was shot over two consecutive nights. However it is not almost certain. Considering there are other roles capable of preventing a NK than medic in this game. Are you thick? You think there are multiple defensive roles? If there was a veteran, he would have claimed a hit. So we can rule that out. If it was a jailkeeper, we would've known there was a roleblock. We can rule that out too. A medic flipped, he claimed to protect the guy on n1 who died on the night following his flip, In addition, if the delay was used then MSmith most probably got hit twice, because the medic was dead before the night started, and there almost certainly not two medics. It's just not balanced. Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 04:04 TheDavison wrote:On June 06 2013 03:06 TomB4 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 06 2013 02:47 TheDavison wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 02:10 TomB4 wrote:On June 05 2013 13:43 TheDavison wrote:
Tom gives his reads, which he actually promised during night1. In it, he outlines specifically why eccleston is probably town. Tomb4 gives a breakdsown of eccleston actions and states specifically this can only be from a town mindset.
He then buddies to McCoy by pushing both of his suspects JP and TD.
Whereas day1, Dr.t he continually fought McCoy.
Compare this with his post above, where he finds cheap reasoning to +1 eccleston. A full 180 and in the process throwing away his probable town read with very little reasoning. Why is he not adamantly defending eccleston like he did Dr.t? He never said he thought Dr.t was probable town, merely the reasoning was weak. What has changed tom? 1. He got replaced. 2. JP died. 3. MSmith died. It's really quite simple, reevaluating in light of deaths is very important. Eccleston's replacement really hasn't done much in the time since and the deaths have made him look quite bad. Perhaps, or perhaps not. Show nested quote +On June 05 2013 12:59 TomB4 wrote:
..
Seeing as MSmith's secondary read was Eccleston and McCoy's secondary read was JP, Eccleston looks very bad in light of the kill.
..
##vote Eccleston OK. JP died, by lynch. Eccleston didnt even vote. 7 voters out of 10, nominated JP. Why does the JP lynch paint Eccleston in a bad light again? Process of elimination. Like I said earlier in the game and even earlier today, Based on who I think is likely to be town, scum must be within a small group of 3-4 players. JP's flip makes that group smaller and by extension makes everyone in the group look worse. If only that was the answer to the question.First the easy part: You have subtracted "assume town" players from the remaining pool of players. Where you proceed to lose me is when you tie the following two statements. (1) JPs flip makes that group smaller
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(2) The JP lynch paints Eccleston in a bad light. As I mentioned, Eccleston did not vote. With your logic: whilst Eccleston may hang with the low fruit; he must certainly not be the lowest hanging fruit. I don't understand what you're implying here. I think Eccleston is scummy primarily because of two reasons: 1.) He's within the only group of players that could possibly be scum at the moment. and more importantly, 2.) He was suspected quite consistently by MSmith, who most likely got shot twice. You think this is a coincidence? I don't. No, they don't. My actions are completely consistent with what I've been saying. I had a change of opinion about Eccleston based both on his replacement and based on the events that have happened. If you think that players' opinions are not supposed to change in light of occurrences then you are playing the wrong fucking game. If you can't accept that, you can go ahead and lynch me and then call me bad when I flip town. Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 02:31 TheDavison wrote:On June 06 2013 03:06 TomB4 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 06 2013 02:47 TheDavison wrote:OK. MSmith died. If Eccleston was the secondary read; why is the primary read not being painted in bad light for you / discussed publically? Perhaps you will now throw in, his primary wass Dr.T. If that is the case, considering you threw out this before: Show nested quote +On June 01 2013 09:47 TomB4 wrote:
Like most players on TL you have no idea how to play scum. I am sure you will agree, it is very weak scum play to NK people "onto" you. Typically strong analysts are taken out first. MSmith1 satisfied that role: and hence became a suitable candidate regardless of who his target was. Now, if you want to consider we have "terribad" scum playing, then I'm surprised you didn't catch onto Dr.T earlier =P So I ask again, what does the death of MSmith have to do with Eccleston bleeding red? Really, you're grasping at straws so hard here. Yes, obviously their primary reads on DAY 1 were DrT. Almost everyone had that read aside from, primarily, JP and myself. Also, no, it is NOT a weak scum play to kill someone who is "onto" you, particularly if it avoids other issues. Townies don't always go back and reread. I was the only person who reported on what I found in MSmith's filter after he died. How many times in endgame have you seen good townies come back and say "you should have looked in my filter after I died"? It happens all the time. So if they were shooting purely based on analysis why did McCoy not get shot? There are three reasons that could possibly be, and I'm betting on a combination of them. We can agree that good analysts are scary to scum, but we need to differentiate the shot here. McCoy maybe would have been perceived more likely as being a protect target than MSmith. There's one reason. The second reason (and just as plausible) is that McCoy's secondary reads were not as scary as MSmith's. Scum often shoot those who are on the correct track if they are the only ones they think have the potential of catching them. I spoilered what you wrote because it is all pertains to discussion over theory. Hence, each of our opinions are valid in their own context. As I am sure you are aware. I am a practical man. Theory only extends so far, and thus, your point holds very little credence. It certainly is not a precursor for a vote when isolated. If i choose to indulge this "theory". MSmith1 was chasing Eccleston & MSmith1 dies. This outcome does not make Eccleston scum. You know this TomB4. Cause and causality are very hard to "reverse engineer", yet you claim to have done so? I smell fallacious posting. Even if you want to treat this "theory" as 'icing on the cake", the rest of your reasoning does not even equate to the eggs in the cake mix. The point is moot.
It makes him far more likely than almost anyone else in the game. You think that someone who in all probability got shot TWICE didn't have good reads, then by all means, don't kill Eccleston. Scum are not generally that afraid of a player unless it's by name basis, and we certainly don't know who anyone is in this game. The only other reasonable explanation is that MSmith was on the right track. Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 02:31 TheDavison wrote:Herein lies my quandry.If we rewind to Day1/2: You identified Eccleston as a probable town in this postOn June 02 2013 16:10 TomB4 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +
Eccleston
Based on what I've read of Eccleston's posts I think he's probably the most likely to be town out of the entire lot. In fact, I think he's quite likely to be town. He's made very specific observations that are quite hard for scum to make. I do not, for example, think that the average TL scum player would say anything like these:
So? I do think those are townish posts, but in light of the fact that he got replaced, his replacement so far has done nothing, AND to top it all off the MSmith connection stuff, most of that information is almost completely irrelevant. It's obsolete given the fact that we're not even dealing with the same player anymore. If you cannot understand that simple fact, then you are simply hopeless. Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 02:31 TheDavison wrote:On June 06 2013 02:31 TheDavison wrote:On May 31 2013 19:25 Eccleston wrote:On May 31 2013 11:20 Hurndall3 wrote:
##unvote
##vote DrT
k I think I can sheep this DrT shit now that I read the case thoroughly.
these are the points that convinced me to sheep.
1 DrT's overdefense
2 unnatural calmness
3 repeated appeal that scum is among the inactives
4 one dimensional scumreads Can you explain to me why you think that these points are exclusive to a scum mindset? For example, point three could be explained from a town perspective too; if DrT is a townie being tunneled, trying to shift the attention toward the lurkers is a perfectly valid thing to do if he thinks that the mafia are lurking. Before, you dismissed his "overdefense", as brought up by MSmith1 here (it's point two in his post), saying that "2 people are searching for something to talk about early game. This is true of both town and scum." What made you change your mind? How often do scum reference posts and actually question the logic of someone else on such a specific level? Generally scum find it hard to fake the "figuring out" process because they've already been given the alignments of everyone in the game. It's almost impossible to fake this kind of specific questioning process-if questioning is faked by scum, it's usually more general or nebulous. On May 31 2013 03:05 Eccleston wrote:I think lynching PT2 at this time would be unwise. He's made one post and thrown a vote on Hurndall3 for being "brief and blunt", and suddenly, ten hours later, he's a prime suspect? I think you're stretching it when you say that Being present but not caring about scumhunting is actually much worse than simply not being present at all, because there is standing evidence that a player has at least taken the time to read and post, but still is not contributing. That's far from "null" in my opinion. At the time of his post the thread was about three and a half pages long. It doesn't really take much effort to read that and then write a five paragraph RP post and throw a vote on someone. He could just as well be disinterested townie. I could understand it if you were pushing him as a policy lynch because you're not certain about DrT, but how he is "far from null" is beyond me. He has made one (half serious) post in the entire game. Has he been useless? Yes. Does that make him scum? No. This post reflects Eccleston's initial thought process regarding my opinion of PT yesterday. What's interesting is not necessarily this post itself, because I think the average scum could probably reasonably fake something like this. What's most interesting are his followup posts that demonstrate that he was thinking about this. IMO most scum would not put in the effort to think about what another player has written and said about someone else because they don't have to-they don't know how to fake the process, and so they only show the results of that process. This is partly also, IMO, why scum are so reluctant to swap votes. It's hard for scum to realistically be able to fake a decision-making process when their ulterior goal is to blend in. Eccleston doesn't display any of those tendencies. He's almost certainly town IMO.If anyone can find instances where I am wrong about what I've said above, I'd love to hear it. The only thing that could possibly be held against Eccleston, IMO, is his relatively low recent activity, but given the context of the game I do not think it is a point worthy of consideration unless his inactivity persists. Let me summarise the key quotes: Eccleston- Based on what I've read of Eccleston's posts I think he's probably the most likely to be town out of the entire lot. In fact, I think he's quite likely to be town. He's made very specific observations that are quite hard for scum to make. I do not, for example, think that the average TL scum player would say anything like these.
- It's hard for scum to realistically be able to fake a decision-making process when their ulterior goal is to blend in. Eccleston doesn't display any of those tendencies. He's almost certainly town IMO.
- The only thing that could possibly be held against Eccleston, IMO, is his relatively low recent activity, but given the context of the game I do not think it is a point worthy of consideration unless his inactivity persists.
A very strong analysis, backed with a VERY strong opinion. (Eccleston *is* certainly town) You go on to add the caveat: this opinion even holds credence with low activity.
If we fast forward to now: You have 180'd on Eccleson with weak logic (already broken down above), and to boot, you have cited his low activity as an issue! Surely I dont have to remind you it is normally scum that are able to backpedal reads so flippantly. If you dont want to respond to that one, its OK. Lets try the next point.
HartnellWilliam.Below are opinions you have chosen to share publicly of HW throughout Day1 to now. On June 02 2013 02:30 TomB4 wrote:
I'll let JP speak for himself, but I find it more likely that... HW or PT are scum than him. ... On June 03 2013 04:13 TomB4 wrote:
IF there is some scum on the DrT votelist it's probably HW.
He's pretty much just coasting along. On June 04 2013 07:07 TomB4 wrote:
JPertwee claiming medic.....
There's still so few posts...I'd be down to kill JP or HW but with no one posting there's almost no way to tell who's scum and who's just afking as town. In short: Since Day1 HW has hovered as a low hanging fruit according to your filter.
So what happens Day3.Your low hanging fruit writes a "big" case on Eccleston. The man you adamantly proclaimed as almost confirmed town. What do you do?You decide to side with your low hanging fruit (HW); throw around cheap reasoning (already dispelled), and discard that *certain* town read. Not only calling Eccleston scum, but proceed to use a townies strong weapon against scum on him. Your vote.That is a sequence of logic that is incomprehensible for a townie. In this sequence of actions, you exhibit no desire to follow up with Eccleston to ascertain his alignment. This is the absolute least a man of your intellect can do for a former "confirmed' townie.
Your behaviour satisfies all the criteria for trademark scum motive.You saw an opportunity to pounce on lynch bait (Eccleston), and took it. In process you not only threw away a hard town read. But you also decided to vote *with* a scum reads target. This all occur without you trying to prod for more information. This is all scummy behaviour from simply Day2 and Day3. SMcCoy has already summarised a bunch of points to why your Day1 antics were scummy.
Ironically as a corollary. Your post identifying JP as medic: is so blase regarding JP being lynched, that surely even you qualify for your own criteria for low hanging fruit on the JP wagon.=P
Town: Join me in eradicating scum. Vote for TomB4 How on earth is Eccleston lynch bait? Clearly I was going to get resistance. I'm not a moron, I know that I called him town earlier. How the fuck would he be an easy lynch if I contradict myself so heavily? If I wanted an easy lynch I would have jumped on HW because it would not have called attention to myself. I still want to get HW lynched, but I do think Eccleston is the better choice today. If people don't agree with me, then we kill HW instead. Eccleston 2.0 so far has done nothing; he promised a case and a rebuttal but so far has fallen short of providing both. Surely if you've been reading the thread you can at least see that much.
the fact he talks so much in questions to make statements instead of answers: this sits poorly with me. something is clearly up imo! he's putting on a big "show" of scumhunting when really he's not. he's over playing his part
this is just my thought but Im willing to stand behind it for now. Im now rereading his filter for a more serious case.
##vote tom
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Well interesting response tomb4
FYI, Your style becomes very cramped when you are under perceived pressure.
It is the first I have noticed you throw ad hominem after ad hominem.
its nice to see scum sweat
I will reply to your questions when I have computer access.
In short. I'm finding your responses beginning to be selectively myopic. And you are stretching quotes between concepts in the same vein you did with McCoy and the trout policy issue. You are definitely one slippery scum player.
That being said.
I only have two things to continue discourse over.
Firstly. Eccleston may have been replaced but the alignment stays the same.
The point?
You have identified points you love about ecc 1.0
And points you despise about ecc 2.0.
I know it was clear before, however the point is important enough to warrant a repeat.
You have made no attempt to dialogue constructively with ecc 2.0
If you were truly looking for scum, as a townie does. Your sequence of actions would be very different.
Your addendum reasoning still does not cut the mustard or provide a satisfactory motive. This is exacerbated by your willingness to drop eccleston for he.
Point 2
You had a list of four people. Myself included.
Where are you trying to decipher which of the four are the apparently remaining two scum?
Where is your curiosity to decipher my alignment disappeared?
That you can jump from ecc to hw in a heartbeat without sound reasonings depicts the real truth on your care factor for this lynch.
I.e. you don't actually care.
For anyone who was still unsure about you; this should be the nail in the coffin.
In short. A Scummy response from a scum player.
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The Davison you have a very good phrasing of things... I will take this into consideration...
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Speak of the devil. There's Eccleston.
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EPT
