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/in
tons of free time now that voulenteer work is done.
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On January 02 2013 15:09 yamato77 wrote:
fuck it
/in
CC I tunnel you all day.
Everytime you tunnel me i'm town hehe. And I'm busy solving the game.
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Hey Hapa, sup?
I think we should take our time with this game, but make our decision by the 72 hour-ish mark. As long as we aren't making emotional lynch swings we should be okay. Imo, treat it like any majority deadline game, but be very aware before you vote. I don't want the excuse "Oh, I didn't know it was the hammer." etc.
I'm curious as to how the omniscient Rise knows the setup already...?
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Oh you mean just the setup in general. I thought you were referring to one of the four possible setups that the game rolled. I thought you somehow knew it.
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On January 04 2013 10:25 RiseAgain wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 10:18 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Oh you mean just the setup in general. I thought you were referring to one of the four possible setups that the game rolled. I thought you somehow knew it. My lack of omniscience haunts me. I'll work harder on it for next game. So, based on the info in the OP, what do you think the optimal play is? Is there one?
Optimal play? There is no optimal play other than lynching the scummiest player and being clear-headed. Blue roles are only there to throw a wrench into the mafia agenda.
I'm not entirely sure what you're referring to with your "setup idea"
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On January 04 2013 10:45 jaybrundage wrote:Well we can rule out Palmar as the smurf. In regards to your idea about the set up. It seems that if we have a parity cop. And then lynch the person the parity cop targeted night one. We would have confirmed towns and confirmed scum easily. As we have no millers or GF's. The only trick would be for the parity cop to push his lynch well with out getting outed. Unless you have some idea for claiming.
That's if the parity cop exists.
I'd also rather not game the setup like we did in WCMM. Just detracts from the game imo.
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On January 04 2013 10:52 Hapahauli wrote:
Talking about blues = not good idea, unless you're mafia and looking for snipes.
Thank you. Let's just play the game and lynch some scummers. No doing fancy shenanigans with the setup.
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On January 04 2013 11:17 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 10:45 jaybrundage wrote:Well we can rule out Palmar as the smurf. In regards to your idea about the set up. It seems that if we have a parity cop. And then lynch the person the parity cop targeted night one. We would have confirmed towns and confirmed scum easily. As we have no millers or GF's. The only trick would be for the parity cop to push his lynch well with out getting outed. Unless you have some idea for claiming. Is Rise a smurf? He seems to me more like a guy who stumbled upon our parts from mafiascum.net or something. Perhaps I'm wrong.
Either way it doesn't matter, just another face I don't know. Easier to judge based on face value, without all the meta behind it.
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On January 04 2013 11:32 Hapahauli wrote:@ Mr.CCShow nested quote +On January 04 2013 11:21 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 04 2013 11:17 Hapahauli wrote:On January 04 2013 10:45 jaybrundage wrote:Well we can rule out Palmar as the smurf. In regards to your idea about the set up. It seems that if we have a parity cop. And then lynch the person the parity cop targeted night one. We would have confirmed towns and confirmed scum easily. As we have no millers or GF's. The only trick would be for the parity cop to push his lynch well with out getting outed. Unless you have some idea for claiming. Is Rise a smurf? He seems to me more like a guy who stumbled upon our parts from mafiascum.net or something. Perhaps I'm wrong. Either way it doesn't matter, just another face I don't know. Easier to judge based on face value, without all the meta behind it. Well I'd interpret him withholding his game history a lot differently if he was a smurf. And looking at his profile... yeah he's a smurf. 'doh. British flag and whatnot.
Haha that's hilarious. Still, we can't judge anything based on him being a smurf. Not really going to dwell or speculate on it further.
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On January 04 2013 11:40 MrZentor wrote:
I feel that creating an arbitrary limit will only limit town, regardless of whether that limit is one that shortens or lengthens the day.
We should instead have guidelines.
48-72 hours
^ Agree with this sentiment
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On January 04 2013 11:42 jaybrundage wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 11:01 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Jay
Any other thoughts on what Rise and I have discussed over the first pages of the thread? Day length, hammer votes, or anything really. We should lynch someone when we feel confident they are mafia. We should always be aware of the hammer vote. People should be responsible for there hammer vote. We shouldn't rush a lynch cause we lost discussions to read people with. Policy Lynches rarely work so we should refrain from doing them. Pretty straight forward imo.
So the hammer vote takes full responsibility for the lynch? Everyone who votes is responsible, not just the hammering guy.
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On January 04 2013 11:54 MrZentor wrote:
By the way, I will be reserving my vote, just so I can the first to lynch somebody.
atta boy Z
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Mr.Z we're masoned you dummy. ShiaoPi obv scum right?
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At work fellas, will be able to post at around 7:30 est. Initial. thoughts: while i dont like the setup gaming, i think it's a fairly null tell. Hopefully the discussion switches from hammer votes when peeps get here. peace y'all
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Hey yeah yeah yeah Hey yeah, I said HEY! What's going on?!
Home from my shift and such. Reading the shitfest that is DP-Hapa (kind of sounds like a porno) interaction atm and catching up.
Questions, people, questions. Anyone?
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On January 05 2013 10:21 Hapahauli wrote:
@ CC
Most interested in comments/reads/etc rather than specific questions. Hard to ask questions since you haven't really done anything.
Cool bro, just let me shower off the stank from work. I got something brewing in my head methinks. Also, you're sexy. Keep it up good-lookin'. BRB
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On January 05 2013 10:22 MrZentor wrote:
Why haven't you done anything?
I was on last night before anything juicy happened. Just Rise and policy stuff, none too interesting. Worked a 12 hour shift, gave a little update on my whereabouts during lunch, and here am I.
So Xatalos is scummy yo
+ Show Spoiler +On January 05 2013 07:23 Xatalos wrote:Sorry for the late entrance, but I warned about this pre-game :/ Anyways, there are a couple of players whose posting I haven't liked so far: MrZentorShow nested quote +On January 04 2013 09:37 MrZentor wrote:
Also, dragging days out will lead to decreased interest in the game by town, increasing inactivity, and generally making things easier for scum.
Days should be 48-72 hours. Additional discussion time benefits town and damages Mafia. Mafia's agenda is to stall discussion and create confusion - both of these goals are achieved by faster lynches where less players can offer their opinions. From my point of view, the above post is pushing Mafia agenda. Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 11:40 MrZentor wrote:
I feel that creating an arbitrary limit will only limit town, regardless of whether that limit is one that shortens or lengthens the day.
We should instead have guidelines.
48-72 hours This post basically repeats what was already said in the previous post... Plus some obvious setup talk that anyone could post, no matter their alignment. It's quite unnecessary to mention that his "faster lynches plan" is a guideline and not a strictly enforced rule. Who would have thought so in the first place, really? Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 11:54 MrZentor wrote:
By the way, I will be reserving my vote, just so I can the first to lynch somebody. Another post that doesn't fit into town agenda. Regardless of the trollish appearance, this post actually gives MrZentor more breathing room if he just joins a bandwagon without good reasoning later on. He told he would do so after all, didn't he? Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 11:59 MrZentor wrote:
ShiaoPi, if you say that you agree with me about not creating arbitrary limits about the length of the day, I will think of you as confirmed town. Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 12:12 MrZentor wrote:
Because we're masoned.
But don't tell anybody. Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 12:15 MrZentor wrote:
I'm masoned with more than one person.
ShiaoPi pulled a BH. More fluff... So far there's nothing townish in MrZentor's filter, and too much useless/anti-town stuff to be overlooked. If he's town, he needs to change his playstyle completely. If he's Mafia, he needs to continue on his current path and convince us he can't be town. Mr. CheesecakeWho was he again? I only remembered him after rereading the thread a couple of times. He hasn't actually taken stances on anything that matters (not counting obvious stuff like "we should lynch the scummiest player"). What I'm most worried about is his complete lack of presence - he's basically casually lurking without being too obvious. I'm unwilling to judge him yet, but he isn't looking good so far. I'm not looking good so far. Lol k. Why the hell isn't Xatalos attacking me for wanting a shorter lynch time? I basically said 48-72 hoursish just like MrZ. I agreed with MrZ on that point. Inconsistency much? Why is it not okay for MrZ to want a shorter lynch time, but seemingly alright with me to want it?
jaybrundageShow nested quote +On January 04 2013 10:45 jaybrundage wrote:Well we can rule out Palmar as the smurf. In regards to your idea about the set up. It seems that if we have a parity cop. And then lynch the person the parity cop targeted night one. We would have confirmed towns and confirmed scum easily. As we have no millers or GF's. The only trick would be for the parity cop to push his lynch well with out getting outed. Unless you have some idea for claiming. Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 11:42 jaybrundage wrote:On January 04 2013 11:01 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Jay
Any other thoughts on what Rise and I have discussed over the first pages of the thread? Day length, hammer votes, or anything really. We should lynch someone when we feel confident they are mafia. We should always be aware of the hammer vote. People should be responsible for there hammer vote. We shouldn't rush a lynch cause we lost discussions to read people with. Policy Lynches rarely work so we should refrain from doing them. Pretty straight forward imo. Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 12:00 jaybrundage wrote:On January 04 2013 11:59 MrZentor wrote:
ShiaoPi, if you say that you agree with me about not creating arbitrary limits about the length of the day, I will think of you as confirmed town. Should be obvious why limit our selves? Only lynch when we are confident in the lynch. And have had good discussion over it. This is his whole filter. It's certainly... lacking, for a lack of better word. First he speculates a bit about blue roles, then gives a list of vague of his policy opinions, then leaves. It's just all too vague and pointless for my liking. What's up with this lack of effort, interest, anything really? Some players have been very active so far and it's definitely a good theme in this game. But some players (like these 3 above) have done practically nothing, even if they have posted. That should be some reason for concern to anyone.
Just look at these reasons for attacking MrZ. "Omg you want less time in the game? Obvious mafia-agenda pushing. It's such a cheap shot it's disgusting, and what an easy thing to point out. Some goes for the point about hammer votes. He attacks MrZ for a fairly null comment, it means nothing.
Why the hell isn't Xatalos attacking me for wanting a shorter lynch time? I basically said 48-72 hoursish just like MrZ. I agreed with MrZ on that point. Inconsistency much? Why is it not okay for MrZ to want a shorter lynch time, but seemingly alright with me to want it?
So his first post of the game pretty much calls out a third of the thread. Stuff on Jaybrundage is bland and basically summarizes instead of analyzes.
Then comes the mother of all contradictory posts:
On January 05 2013 07:49 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 07:33 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Xalatos
Welcome! Thoughts on DP appreciated!
Regarding your own points:
MrZ - He tends to do very "trolly" stuff as town and scum. His early-game in Witchcraft Mini is a good example, where he self-votes himself and just posts a couple of meaningless one-liners for most of Day 1 (as town). I'm not too worried about MrZ, as I think reading him is fairly easy. He's very clammy and afraid to post as scum. He's much more open and jokey as town.
JayBrundage - He's lynch-bait (see Hero Mini Mafia). We should definitely encourage him to post more, but he's a pretty easy mislynch (if he's town) because he tends to make sparse and wishy-washy posts.
Mr.CC - I think he's fairly similar to MrZ. I'm not very worried about reading him, because I feel he has a hard time replicating his "jokey" town-meta. His inactivity so far is a concern, but I'm not sure how much of that is due to RL business. Well, for starters, I think you're most likely town. I can't believe a Mafia would outpost everyone in the thread and engage in every possible topic. Does that make DarthPunk Mafia in my eyes? Not really. I agree with many things he says, and his filter just reads fairly townish to me - this post for example: Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 06:16 DarthPunk wrote:
I don;t like either of the 'cases' to be perfectly honest.
Rise is completely null to me. And to be honest you are the one picking a fight with rise. There should be one read due to Rises' aggression and that is null. I thought that you were simply following up on him in order to push the town to be active. However you trying to drum up support for a bandwagon based of something that any player of your calibre should KNOW is a null tell is not 'potentially scummy' it IS scummy. and it has me worried.
Since when do you call things 'potentially scummy' anyway??? sounds really fucking off to be honest.
Yeah it was a WTF post from yamato initially. But his explanation, willingness to be open and transparent, and the fact that his original WTF post turned out to be an exercise in an open thought process give me a town read on yamato at this juncture.
And once again I am wondering how the fuck a town hapa is not reaching the same conclusions as myself and is pushing the wagons of two people who are null at worst.
I consider DarthPunk to be trying to figure out the game, not trying to drive his own agenda. That's always town points +++ in my books. I don't like him labeling you as his main suspect, considering your heavy activity and overall townish agenda, but it would be stupid for Mafia to target someone like you as well. I think it's just a case of town vs town flamewar. That's happened so many times before, and not even once has a war between active players A and B resulted in one of them flipping Mafia (in my games). Ugh, I don't like giving some players the benefit of the doubt if they're "lynch baits". That just encourages them to play anti-town as Mafia and then get away with it. Especially MrZentor's playstyle is so irritatingly useless and hard to read... What's the point of signing up if he justs posts some one liners anyway?
So he thinks DarthPunk is town, and provides a reason to back it up. Cool beans.
Not even a half-hour later:
On January 05 2013 08:19 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 07:54 Hapahauli wrote:Well see DarthPunk is very capable of playing an engaged and active mafia game. It's his individual behavior that makes him scummy. For example, his complete lack of pursuing lurkers despite him being super-concerned about them. In addition, his "all bark, no bite" stance on me... where he's been directly calling me scum, yet hasn't placed his vote and hasn't been able to produce a case on me when asked: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=391112¤tpage=8#142Ugh, I don't like giving some players the benefit of the doubt if they're "lynch baits". That just encourages them to play anti-town as Mafia and then get away with it. Especially MrZentor's playstyle is so irritatingly useless and hard to read... What's the point of signing up if he justs posts some one liners anyway? It's not like I'm unwilling to lynch Jay if I think he's mafia. Far from it. However, his behavior does need to be analyzed in the context of his own gameplay. As for MrZ, I'm not worried about him at all. He's actually pretty easy to read, because his mafia and town personas are completely different from one another. He's far more active, engaged, and jokey in his town games. In his mafia games, it's pretty clear that he has a hard time making posts. His activity and engagement will reveal his alignment soon enough. Hmmm... I can kind of see what you're getting at. For example, this post:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 07:04 DarthPunk wrote:On January 05 2013 06:57 Hapahauli wrote:
Naw it's quite good actually.
You've been screaming "lurkers are ruining the game" in our conversation. Your solution? You've never offered a single lurker to the chopping block. Instead, you think the most active player in the game is scummy.
That's a complete load of logical shit, and I don't expect that from a town DP. We don't have to lynch forever in this game. we can wait a bit before we seriously consider lynching for lurking which is a larger sacrifice in a game this small. What was on top of my agenda was figuring out hapa as you are the scariest player in this game, and if I could get a solid town read on you we could roll these scum. Unfortunately you went retard and or are scum so now I have to deal with a hapa tunnelling me based on On January 05 2013 06:54 Hapahauli wrote:
Straight-up OMGUS and a sprinkle of gut-feeling. You scum brah. All the while I am somehow illogical despite having really solid reasoning and you just ignoring that to serve your OMGUS agenda. Well, that is cool with me HAPA. I don't have to convince you you are scum. I just have to convince the town. And that should be straightforward after this little party we have been having together. Look at these three bolded statements. First you're the scariest player in the game. Then you're retard town (or scum). Then you're certainly scum. These statements just contradict each other. This kind of flip-flopping about your A) skill level B) alignment doesn't make me feel good about DP. Even so, I don't like lynching one of the most active players when most players have done (practically) nothing. Especially this early. Well, I'm not really sure how MrZentor is so easy to read... I'm having extreme difficulties reading him. And I've played with him in two games before too. It shouldn't be too hard to fake some joke posts, right? Especially with his general low activity and lack of any content.
So now DarthPunk is possibly scum and he provides a quote with a bunch of dem bolded statements to back it up. But didn't Xatalos just say that DP was looking town? That he agreed with a lot of what he had to say? This is a huuuuuge 180 right here. He just felt very comfortable with DP being town. Now he feels uneasy.
Dat 180 on DP. Explain.
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On January 05 2013 09:46 jaybrundage wrote:@Xalatos I dont plan to post just to post. When I'm ready to give my thoughts ill do so. Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 11:51 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 04 2013 11:42 jaybrundage wrote:On January 04 2013 11:01 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Jay
Any other thoughts on what Rise and I have discussed over the first pages of the thread? Day length, hammer votes, or anything really. We should lynch someone when we feel confident they are mafia. We should always be aware of the hammer vote. People should be responsible for there hammer vote. We shouldn't rush a lynch cause we lost discussions to read people with. Policy Lynches rarely work so we should refrain from doing them. Pretty straight forward imo. So the hammer vote takes full responsibility for the lynch? Everyone who votes is responsible, not just the hammering guy. Dont like this post from CC its twisting my words for no reason. It feels like a post just to post and look like hes contributing with out saying anything. Ofc the Hammer vote isn't going to take responsibility for the whole lynch but he does seal the deal. Also Hapa on your case on DP I think you bring up some good points. Specifically him calling you out with any case. And saying lurking is terrible but not pressuring any lurkers.
I'm not twisting your words. You made it seem like whoever done did dat hammer vote was super responsible and everyone else was mostly abstained from judgment. If that's not what you meant, sorry brother.
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On January 05 2013 12:14 ShiaoPi wrote:Hmm looks like RiseAgain has still not responded.... Anyway moving onto the matters more at hand for now. I don't think that DP or Hapa are scum, it feels much more like townies at each others throats for minor things. While I can see where both are coming from during the exchange I does kind of worry me that DP does not follow up with a vote as Hapa does. Does not seem to fit when he calls him scum more than once earlier. @Mr.CC Xatalos is kind of a lynchbait in itself. He is not that easy to read (at least for me), but what I have seen so far from him does not really convince me on his scumminess. From time to time he does these 180-turns but usually it is because he lays his entire thoughtprocess out and therefore every nook and turn of his mind is in the thread. He is nullish right now. I want to see more from RiseAgain, so ##Vote: RiseAgainget in here and do something please! 
I'd like to hear more for you as well. If not Rise, who would be your biggest scummer read right meow? Rise I would consider the lynchbait right now imo.
##Vote: Xalatos btw
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On January 05 2013 12:37 yamato77 wrote:
Do people really think it was that difficult to understand what I said?
Anyway CC your case is bad and I think you're faking this read. I don't think Xatalos is that scummy, but he is an easy target.
CC is scummy.
##Vote: Mr Cheesecake
Lol k
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Do people really think it was that difficult to understand what I said?
Anyway Yamato your logic is bad and I think you're faking this read. I don't think I'm that scummy, but I'm an easy target.
Yamato is scummy.
*Vote Yamato*
No but seriously, if you're going to vote me, TUNNEL ME BRO. Get at me.
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Oh hey Hapa whats up. I need someone to talk to. Wanna cuddle? What you think of Yamato going full retard right now?
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On January 05 2013 13:03 Hapahauli wrote:
I'm catching up a bit right now. Regarding your Xatalos case, I did find his initial post slightly scummy (spreading suspicion amongst 3 players and not making any conclusions). I'm less convinced than you about his stance on DP, because I was really attacking his town-read on DP and pushing the idea that DP is scum at the time he made the switch.
However, Yamato's vote/post is just all sorts of absurd. You don't call someone's case "fake" without any rationale to back it up. This is not how this game works, and it's absolutely retarded play. I'm not sure if it's scummy or not yet, but like damn.
Truth, I wasn't in here at the time so I can't get the best feel for the atmosphere / mood people were in. But the timestamp suggests he switches the read soup quickly. You made one post in between his two contradictory ones. Meh, seems like le scum to me.
Totes not down for a Rise lynch right now if you're wondering Shiao.
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He's always been scummy as shit as town, though, for whatever it's worth.
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On January 05 2013 13:26 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 13:23 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
He's always been scummy as shit as town, though, for whatever it's worth. In what sense? Is his logic normally this bad? Even if so, it's the activity levels and lack of engagement that are most concerning to me.
Think Eywa of Witchcraft. I think I compared Eywa to Yamato... said that he produced "The Yamato effect" or something like that.
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@Jay
Who, right now, do you wanna lynch? Why does not making sense as town play = bad play and not mafia play?
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On January 05 2013 13:40 jaybrundage wrote:
Doing things that draw a shit load of attention to you for no fucking reason isn't a scum tell.
He came out of no where said something about cc's case being bad soft defended Xaltos and then decided to vote cc . It could be a ploy for discussion it could be a pressure vote.
But there is one thing that it did do and that is draw alot of attention to himself. I dont see mafia making a play like and draw scrutiny on themselves. For no foreseeable reason.
I hate these kinds of defenses. Because obvious scum can get away with shit. Trouble is, he's (probably) right.
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Eh, I just hate this dick measuring contest between hapa and DP. Not really sold on either being scum in the slightest.
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Yo guys, cease the shitflinging kk? You both think each other are scum, that's cool and all. You guys can make condense cases later so we don't have to sift through this mess.
This argument could pretty much go on forever between you two. What say you guys to SP being super ultra mega neutral so far this game? Concerning or no?
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On January 05 2013 14:40 ShiaoPi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 14:38 DarthPunk wrote:
ugh I am not scum. So there is that.
Case on hapa very simply
Pushes weak as shit wagons for weak as shit reasons when he should know better. Look at original post.
When Questioned he states that it was for the purposes of promoting activity and discussion. Which is fine. But then I ask why not push lurkers as they are hurting the game more than yamato or Rise were at that point as both had posted pretty recently.
Tries to say that not pushing lurkers makes me scum which is fucking absurd.
Hapa proceeds to go apeshit and omgus me and tunnel me which is not the reaction I would expect from a town hapa who almost always gives me a town read in similar circumstances.
He then misinterprets and misrepresents things that I say in order to paint me as scummy and discredit my view of his scummines to the point in which it seems as if it is deliberate and pushing an agenda rather than scumhunting and searching genuinely for my alignment.
He flames and omgus' away regardless of what I say. Which is unlike any town hapa ever. He has never not called me town correctly aside from his scum game in mario.
A lot of it is gut feeling and a complete wtf?!?! reaction to hapa going apeshit at the lightest and IMO justified pressure originally.
Okay so basically it is more of a meta-read on Hapa you have? Why be so inconsistent then? Another question, Hapa is not in this game anymore, who do you want to lynch?
Weren't you reading the thread?
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Anyone read Mr.Z's comment about "I'm easy to read because I do stuff scum never would do!" To be scummy as fk?
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Holy crap thank you guys for compromising to stop this headbashing endeavor.
I permit you guys one post each to flesh out your ideas on each other. And don't respond to each other. Just one long post containing errything y'all done got.
Meanwhile, I sleep.
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On January 05 2013 14:58 jaybrundage wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 14:53 DarthPunk wrote:
Oh and for the record. I think cheesecake is probably Town for not jumping on either hapa or myself. I am sure scum would love to get me or hapa if he is town for free. now your assuming hapa is town again....
Jesus Jay, he said "if he is town".
Trying to get a cheat shot in much?
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On January 05 2013 15:03 jaybrundage wrote:
Whats it to you?
What's it to me? That's a scummy as shit move you pulled right thar sonny boy.
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On January 05 2013 15:10 jaybrundage wrote:
You dont know DP alignment if your town. So I find it ironic that your thinking hes town. I made a comment on his post concerning his wishy washiness.
So much wrong with this post.
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On January 06 2013 02:48 Xatalos wrote:Now that you mention RiseAgain... I'm very uncomfortable with his inactivity so far. He never posted again after the beginning. There's something interesting in his filter: Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 09:45 RiseAgain wrote:
What your post is doing is detracting from something we should be doing, setup-analysis, this setup has a very clear town slant with the proper play. I already know what it is, three townie points to the first person to propose it, if no one has come up with it in the next... 12-24 hours I'll explain it, after all, we have time. What might this be about? I have a feeling he's going to make some giant post soon enough and focus on this idea. However, I don't feel good about focusing on "setup-analysis". I really doubt there's some trick that would make us win based on the setup. It always comes down to player analysis, in the end. I'm not really willing to lynch him right now though. His inactivity is bad, but not necessarily scummy. And when he did post (long ago), his posts were focused on the setup, yeah, but it at least looked like he was trying to achieve something and convince others of his ideas. At the very least I want to see him posting again before judging.
Xalatos,
You don't seem to be willing to lynch anybody. Make a hard read on someone and vote their ass. Stop floundering around with the DP read (all you've done is give longass post(s) with a super neutral opinion on people, and your filter doesn't reveal anything new). Vote your top scumread. Right now. Explain it at your leisure.
Interested in seeing what it is.
Love,
Mr. Cheesecake
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On January 06 2013 03:32 jaybrundage wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 15:37 Hapahauli wrote:
So regarding Jay's stuff on DP... it doesn't look very good. It looks a lot like he's trying to shovel shit on DP.
After Hero Mini, my view on Jay is that he's lynch-bait, so I'm rather hesitant about lynching him. Right now, I'm unsure how likely his behavior is coming from a "town-Jay." His play on it's face is scummy, but I really need to hear more from him.
@ Jay
What do you make of my newly disclosed town-read on DP? Agree or disagree?
Secondly, your quote accusing DP of assuming I was town was very clearly mis-interpreting his actions (in which he very clearly qualified as only IF I was town). It doesn't look very good. Explain yourself. First off you said you have done this before how many times have you done this tunneling on DP and out of the times you have done it how many times have you been wrong. If you play with DP alot and you can read him consistently then I will reconsider my position. The reason I find him scummy as been said before. Is his flip flopping on Hapa from hes obv completly with out a doubt scum to i have no fucking idea. It seemed to me like scum backing off of a mislynch they were pushing gone wrong. I personally put alot less faith in reading people's reactions to when they are about to be or going to be lynched. The quote was me being frustrated with DP's flip flopping he has gone from scum to town to scum now giving someone townie cred for the possibility of one of his scum reads being town. So yes he did change his opinion on hapa again. I didnt say anything wrong. Also I dont like CC hes doing absolutely nothing this game. He has made some worthless comments about concentrating on finding scum. He was mentioning the DP-Hapa conversations early one with out giving his opinion on him hasn't commentated much on it when DP was doing some scummy stuff. Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 11:22 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
So Xatalos is scummy yo
So now DarthPunk is possibly scum and he provides a quote with a bunch of dem bolded statements to back it up. But didn't Xatalos just say that DP was looking town? That he agreed with a lot of what he had to say? This is a huuuuuge 180 right here. He just felt very comfortable with DP being town. Now he feels uneasy.
Dat 180 on DP. Explain. He makes a case on Xalatos for making a 180 on DP and calls him scummy for it. However when DP does so many 180s on Hapa hes trying to pull off a 900. CC doesn't give it a second thought although DP is doing the samething as Xalatos CC ignores it. CC has played like he has more knowledge on other townies. He would of known if DP and Hapa were town or not so he played accordingly. Also his lack of anything in his filter is really disconcerting. He has said useless 1 liners. And made a case of 180s that were exactly what DP was doing. ##Unvote
##Vote Mr.CheeseCake
I've done absolutely nothing? Watch your tongue, scumster, you've done nothing as well.
Your vote is pretty lulzy considering I called you out on your attempted cheap shot at DP. Also, anything DP-Hapa related is completely independent of Xalatos. DP's 180s aren't the same as his by any means.
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On January 06 2013 03:46 jaybrundage wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 03:41 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 03:32 jaybrundage wrote:On January 05 2013 15:37 Hapahauli wrote:
So regarding Jay's stuff on DP... it doesn't look very good. It looks a lot like he's trying to shovel shit on DP.
After Hero Mini, my view on Jay is that he's lynch-bait, so I'm rather hesitant about lynching him. Right now, I'm unsure how likely his behavior is coming from a "town-Jay." His play on it's face is scummy, but I really need to hear more from him.
@ Jay
What do you make of my newly disclosed town-read on DP? Agree or disagree?
Secondly, your quote accusing DP of assuming I was town was very clearly mis-interpreting his actions (in which he very clearly qualified as only IF I was town). It doesn't look very good. Explain yourself. First off you said you have done this before how many times have you done this tunneling on DP and out of the times you have done it how many times have you been wrong. If you play with DP alot and you can read him consistently then I will reconsider my position. The reason I find him scummy as been said before. Is his flip flopping on Hapa from hes obv completly with out a doubt scum to i have no fucking idea. It seemed to me like scum backing off of a mislynch they were pushing gone wrong. I personally put alot less faith in reading people's reactions to when they are about to be or going to be lynched. The quote was me being frustrated with DP's flip flopping he has gone from scum to town to scum now giving someone townie cred for the possibility of one of his scum reads being town. So yes he did change his opinion on hapa again. I didnt say anything wrong. Also I dont like CC hes doing absolutely nothing this game. He has made some worthless comments about concentrating on finding scum. He was mentioning the DP-Hapa conversations early one with out giving his opinion on him hasn't commentated much on it when DP was doing some scummy stuff. On January 05 2013 11:22 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
So Xatalos is scummy yo
So now DarthPunk is possibly scum and he provides a quote with a bunch of dem bolded statements to back it up. But didn't Xatalos just say that DP was looking town? That he agreed with a lot of what he had to say? This is a huuuuuge 180 right here. He just felt very comfortable with DP being town. Now he feels uneasy.
Dat 180 on DP. Explain. He makes a case on Xalatos for making a 180 on DP and calls him scummy for it. However when DP does so many 180s on Hapa hes trying to pull off a 900. CC doesn't give it a second thought although DP is doing the samething as Xalatos CC ignores it. CC has played like he has more knowledge on other townies. He would of known if DP and Hapa were town or not so he played accordingly. Also his lack of anything in his filter is really disconcerting. He has said useless 1 liners. And made a case of 180s that were exactly what DP was doing. ##Unvote
##Vote Mr.CheeseCake I've done absolutely nothing? Watch your tongue, scumster, you've done nothing as well. Your vote is pretty lulzy considering I called you out on your attempted cheap shot at DP. Also, anything DP-Hapa related is completely independent of Xalatos. DP's 180s aren't the same as his by any means. Thats not the reason I wrote a case on you. I didnt even commentate it in my case as its irrelevant as why you are scummy. You have wrote a crap load of one liners and things that should be obvious. You seem to me lacking presence in this thread. You are calling me scummy. But you fail to follow thru with your read. Just as you have done with ShaioPi and Mr.Zentor. You make glib comments with no substance so you seem to be contributing.
Because I was trying to stop the shitflinging between DP and Hapa, I was trying to get their opinions on MrZ and SP just to stop them from fighting for once. Seems the only reason you think I'm scummy is because I'm "not contributing"
Sonny boy, you're going to have to do better than a little fluff and one-liner argument.
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On January 06 2013 04:19 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 03:37 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 02:48 Xatalos wrote:Now that you mention RiseAgain... I'm very uncomfortable with his inactivity so far. He never posted again after the beginning. There's something interesting in his filter: On January 04 2013 09:45 RiseAgain wrote:
What your post is doing is detracting from something we should be doing, setup-analysis, this setup has a very clear town slant with the proper play. I already know what it is, three townie points to the first person to propose it, if no one has come up with it in the next... 12-24 hours I'll explain it, after all, we have time. What might this be about? I have a feeling he's going to make some giant post soon enough and focus on this idea. However, I don't feel good about focusing on "setup-analysis". I really doubt there's some trick that would make us win based on the setup. It always comes down to player analysis, in the end. I'm not really willing to lynch him right now though. His inactivity is bad, but not necessarily scummy. And when he did post (long ago), his posts were focused on the setup, yeah, but it at least looked like he was trying to achieve something and convince others of his ideas. At the very least I want to see him posting again before judging. Xalatos, You don't seem to be willing to lynch anybody. Make a hard read on someone and vote their ass. Stop floundering around with the DP read (all you've done is give longass post(s) with a super neutral opinion on people, and your filter doesn't reveal anything new). Vote your top scumread. Right now. Explain it at your leisure. Interested in seeing what it is. Love, Mr. Cheesecake 1) I don't yet have a scumread I'm confident in. 2) I don't want to vote someone prematurely - in this setup, it could lead to someone I only have a weak scumread on to get lynched while I'm offline. 3) If I had to vote someone right now, it would be you, but there's no rush (several players have said almost nothing yet).
then explain, why me?
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Anyone here at all? Xatalos just disappeared when I asked him to explain himself. I need someone to hold me.
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On January 06 2013 05:49 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 04:23 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 04:19 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 03:37 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 02:48 Xatalos wrote:Now that you mention RiseAgain... I'm very uncomfortable with his inactivity so far. He never posted again after the beginning. There's something interesting in his filter: On January 04 2013 09:45 RiseAgain wrote:
What your post is doing is detracting from something we should be doing, setup-analysis, this setup has a very clear town slant with the proper play. I already know what it is, three townie points to the first person to propose it, if no one has come up with it in the next... 12-24 hours I'll explain it, after all, we have time. What might this be about? I have a feeling he's going to make some giant post soon enough and focus on this idea. However, I don't feel good about focusing on "setup-analysis". I really doubt there's some trick that would make us win based on the setup. It always comes down to player analysis, in the end. I'm not really willing to lynch him right now though. His inactivity is bad, but not necessarily scummy. And when he did post (long ago), his posts were focused on the setup, yeah, but it at least looked like he was trying to achieve something and convince others of his ideas. At the very least I want to see him posting again before judging. Xalatos, You don't seem to be willing to lynch anybody. Make a hard read on someone and vote their ass. Stop floundering around with the DP read (all you've done is give longass post(s) with a super neutral opinion on people, and your filter doesn't reveal anything new). Vote your top scumread. Right now. Explain it at your leisure. Interested in seeing what it is. Love, Mr. Cheesecake 1) I don't yet have a scumread I'm confident in. 2) I don't want to vote someone prematurely - in this setup, it could lead to someone I only have a weak scumread on to get lynched while I'm offline. 3) If I had to vote someone right now, it would be you, but there's no rush (several players have said almost nothing yet). then explain, why me? I've already detailed my reasons for suspecting you in several earlier posts. Mainly about posting lots of fluff and not contributing much. My suspicion started when I originally read through the thread and had a hard time noticing your existence at all. It's not a strong suspicion, but after all, I don't have any stronger reads either. I'm unwilling to vote now though - you already have 2 votes, and if I voted now, only 2 more votes would be needed for an instalynch, without giving all players a chance to offer their opinions. I'm also not confident in you flipping Mafia, even though I don't have a better option currently.
So you don't have a better option right now? Then find one.
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On January 06 2013 07:53 Hapahauli wrote:
@ CC
Can you give me an update on your current suspicions? Xatalos does have a point when he says that you haven't been all that committal this game
You kidding? He has been a floundering neutral playing PoS this game so far and literally hasn't done anything but teeter on the fence of null on DP. Xatalos scum. Jay scummy as fk. Yamato is pretty meh considering he's Yamato. That vote was just out there but, you know, it's him and i can't exactly blow up on him over his work schedule because mines pretty fucked up too. CC also pretty scummy.
Not even going to bother with you and DP, I'm just glad you two stopped facerolling into each other.
Rise I want to think as town because of his "grand master plan" to rid the world of scum and do justice. Idk, nothing inherently scummy so far other than lurking.
MrZ soup null sides that he's "too obv scum to be scum brah" argument which rubs me the wrong way but hey, it's pretty much a null tell either way.
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On January 06 2013 08:36 jaybrundage wrote:
I thought the case on him you made was* decent.
EBWODP
You have no idea how fast I was about to red text that lololol
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On January 06 2013 08:42 jaybrundage wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 08:37 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 08:36 jaybrundage wrote:
I thought the case on him you made was* decent.
EBWODP You have no idea how fast I was about to red text that lololol Jesus CC That's a cheat shot bra
Wrong. Don't try to compare that to what you tried on DP.
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@MrZ
Who should we lynch, then?
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On January 06 2013 08:57 jaybrundage wrote:
I plan to lynch my biggest scum read. And at the moment its CC.
I think that ShaoiPi could still be scum. But atm I believe i have a better read on CC. His lack of substance in his posts. And his continual lack of conviction, makes it seem to me that he is a scum trying to look like he is contributing with out really doing so.
Dude, your reasoning is terrible. It's just a general blanket statement saying that I lack substance. Or I "haven't been contributing"
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On January 06 2013 09:00 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 08:36 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 07:53 Hapahauli wrote:
@ CC
Can you give me an update on your current suspicions? Xatalos does have a point when he says that you haven't been all that committal this game You kidding? He has been a floundering neutral playing PoS this game so far and literally hasn't done anything but teeter on the fence of null on DP. Xatalos scum. Jay scummy as fk. Yamato is pretty meh considering he's Yamato. That vote was just out there but, you know, it's him and i can't exactly blow up on him over his work schedule because mines pretty fucked up too. CC also pretty scummy. Not even going to bother with you and DP, I'm just glad you two stopped facerolling into each other. Rise I want to think as town because of his "grand master plan" to rid the world of scum and do justice. Idk, nothing inherently scummy so far other than lurking. MrZ soup null sides that he's "too obv scum to be scum brah" argument which rubs me the wrong way but hey, it's pretty much a null tell either way. Regarding Xatalos, I'm not as sold on him as you are. Indecision is not an exclusively scummy trait, and a degree of hesitancy is necessary with this mechanic. If he never comes up with something, I'll be concerned. For now, he's pretty null for me. I'm really not sure why you think Yamato is "Yamato." In fact, he's being anything but right now given his abysmal activity
I mean that Yamato in himself is an enigma all his own regardless of activity this game. I don't know what to do with him.
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@MrZ
Get off your loaf and do something this game besides reserve your hammer like some God on Mt. Olympus. I haven't seen one bit anything controversial from you besides a few trolly comments.
All I've seen is some defending of yourself via "Oh, scum don't want to hammer vote, therefore I'm auto-town yo. I can't be scum because scum don't want to do things like this."
Last game you voted for yourself which scum would "never want to do". But you didn't flaunt it around to assure everyone that you were town.
##Unvote
##Vote: Mr. Zentor
You were much more interesting last game. Start being interesting plx.
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On January 06 2013 09:09 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 09:01 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 09:00 Hapahauli wrote:On January 06 2013 08:36 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 07:53 Hapahauli wrote:
@ CC
Can you give me an update on your current suspicions? Xatalos does have a point when he says that you haven't been all that committal this game You kidding? He has been a floundering neutral playing PoS this game so far and literally hasn't done anything but teeter on the fence of null on DP. Xatalos scum. Jay scummy as fk. Yamato is pretty meh considering he's Yamato. That vote was just out there but, you know, it's him and i can't exactly blow up on him over his work schedule because mines pretty fucked up too. CC also pretty scummy. Not even going to bother with you and DP, I'm just glad you two stopped facerolling into each other. Rise I want to think as town because of his "grand master plan" to rid the world of scum and do justice. Idk, nothing inherently scummy so far other than lurking. MrZ soup null sides that he's "too obv scum to be scum brah" argument which rubs me the wrong way but hey, it's pretty much a null tell either way. Regarding Xatalos, I'm not as sold on him as you are. Indecision is not an exclusively scummy trait, and a degree of hesitancy is necessary with this mechanic. If he never comes up with something, I'll be concerned. For now, he's pretty null for me. I'm really not sure why you think Yamato is "Yamato." In fact, he's being anything but right now given his abysmal activity I mean that Yamato in himself is an enigma all his own regardless of activity this game. I don't know what to do with him. Wut? Yamato is generally pretty obv-town when he's town. He's active, aggressive, and foams at the mouth about scum-reads.
Obv-town as town? You must have not seen my newbie games with him haha. One of the scummiest towns in those games by far.
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On January 06 2013 09:10 Hapahauli wrote:Mr.CC, why the crap are you voting MrZ, when you posted this barely an hour ago: Show nested quote +You kidding? He has been a floundering neutral playing PoS this game so far and literally hasn't done anything but teeter on the fence of null on DP. Xatalos scum. Jay scummy as fk. Yamato is pretty meh considering he's Yamato. That vote was just out there but, you know, it's him and i can't exactly blow up on him over his work schedule because mines pretty fucked up too. CC also pretty scummy.
Pressure voting is fun. Nobody is getting lynched right now anyway. Just a pressure vote so he does stuff.
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=381931
^XXXI was my first game with him. We nearly lynched him D1 for being scummy town. The rest of the game he tunneled me with confirmation bias and he was one of my top scumreads until I figured out the scumteam during lylo (which could have included him). Glancing over the post-game you can see him being like LOL I'm so bad sorry town, etc. But yeah he was scummy all around.
In XXXII he was fairly scummy too but I got NK'd n1 so I didn't read into it much after that.
Those were his nooby games though, maybe I'll look at some more of his recent games? I just assumed he kept his scummy-town persona thing going on. I don't doubt he's improved.
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It's really hard to describe his play in those games, even when you just read them over. He was a lesser-version of Eywa, that's all I can say.
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On January 06 2013 09:20 Hapahauli wrote:
Oh yeah those games. Those weren't very good lynches d00d =P
But look at his filter in those games. Look how engaged, spammy, and aggressive he is. This game... he's a shell of himself.
Can it all be due to a work schedule? I mean I can sympathize with that. But he's been really lurky so far and I was looking forward to him tunneling the fuck out of me.
Him backing down made me a sad panda...
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On January 06 2013 00:19 yamato77 wrote:
I'm trying to quit the tunneling deal. I'm almost always wrong and I waste a lot of time in games by doing so.
Does it sound legit? Trying to become a different / better / more sophisticated monocle-wearing player?
Why am I trying to defend Yamato? Lolololol
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On January 06 2013 09:34 Hapahauli wrote:
Btw CC, you mind building a case on Xatalos? He may be indecisive, but I don't see how it's scummy.
Tbh I think everyone was overstating my read on Xatalos. My original "case" was just a read post with vote pressure and it kind of got blown out of proportion both by myself and others.
Allow me to rationalize why his indecision struck me so: Oats as scum in XXXII. I caught him flip flopping his read on Yamato so hard and lynch him for it. Xatalos did the same thing by contradicting himself within the frame of ~20mins with only 1 post from you inbetween.
I'm starting to realize the two situations are different (as scum are more refined in these non-newbie games). But my concern stands that he's only really done that the entire game so far; saying he could be scum because this, but it could also be town. My experience with such play has been that it is scum.
Tell me: Is it different?
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On January 06 2013 10:03 MrZentor wrote:
So when do you plan on lynching somebody?
We can start with you right now if you'd like. But I'd rather not, sir.
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On January 06 2013 10:07 Hapahauli wrote:
I'd rather not lynch MrZ either. He's a pretty classic example of a bored townie.
Hapa, you know how much I want to call that a scumslip right? Hehehe. Oh lordy you get me riled up.
But seriously Mr.Z -- your opinions please.
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If anyone actually wants me to address a specific part of that case I will.
And Hapa I'm not moving my vote on MrZ until he does something decent. Last game he was much more productive, and I don't see why he shouldn't this game.
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On January 06 2013 10:27 jaybrundage wrote:Hey look a post with out substance lollll How about you write a case on someone you wanna lynch plz I find it ironic that you think im tunneling you, as I have called DP scummy and said I would vote him at the time. And I have made a case on ShaioPi.
You really don't know the meaning of ironic, do you?
And no, you've pretty much had it out for me since the start of the game. Just think you need to calm yourself.
@Hapa
What do you make of Yamatos vote on ya?
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@Yamato
Care to clarify why you're voting for Hapa? It seems rather OMGUSy to me.
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On January 06 2013 10:39 jaybrundage wrote:
ugh im frustrated non else things that CC is scummy. DP thoughts on my two cc cases?
And hapa why are you convinced CC is townie he hasn't wrote a single case on his reads.
It would also suck if Rise got replaced. I just want him to come back tho. ShaioPi lets see ya
Cases don't equal town, and it seems to be your only real ammunition for my scumminess =\
Cases are only there for the sake of convenience, brevity, and to a certain extent extrapolation. It's a small game... stuff ain't that hard to find.
At this point it's more constructive to simply talk and discuss with each other than make huge cases, etc.
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On January 06 2013 10:50 DarthPunk wrote:
on Yamato. like. I could lynch him but it would be a gamble. I can't find anything to distinguish him between useless townie and useless scum. He is just useless.
Kind of feel the same way right now. I want to hear more from our SP fellow however...
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On January 06 2013 11:17 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 11:17 MrZentor wrote:
I like to wait until the second day. c: it's been 48 hours consider this the second day :O
Actually it's night 1.
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Well it doesn't look like anything else interesting is going to happen today. We should consolidate soon. I'll lynch Yamato straight up or Xatalos.
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On January 06 2013 11:31 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 11:29 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Well it doesn't look like anything else interesting is going to happen today. We should consolidate soon. I'll lynch Yamato straight up or Xatalos. Shaio lives on the other side of the globe from where we're from, so I expect some activity from him tonight. Ideally I want to give things 24 more hours at minimum. I really don't want to play russian roulette with a bunch of lurkers. I'd like to ideally get things right on the first go.
Of course, but I don't want to be at this for a week. We should lynch by tomorrow night, imo.
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Hey guys, how are things going in the land of the British Empire? Catching up just like Hapa is apparently.
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On January 06 2013 15:42 Z-BosoN wrote:@Mr.CCShow nested quote +On January 06 2013 09:39 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 09:34 Hapahauli wrote:
Btw CC, you mind building a case on Xatalos? He may be indecisive, but I don't see how it's scummy. Tbh I think everyone was overstating my read on Xatalos. My original "case" was just a read post with vote pressure and it kind of got blown out of proportion both by myself and others. Allow me to rationalize why his indecision struck me so: Oats as scum in XXXII. I caught him flip flopping his read on Yamato so hard and lynch him for it. Xatalos did the same thing by contradicting himself within the frame of ~20mins with only 1 post from you inbetween. I'm starting to realize the two situations are different (as scum are more refined in these non-newbie games). But my concern stands that he's only really done that the entire game so far; saying he could be scum because this, but it could also be town. My experience with such play has been that it is scum.Tell me: Is it different? Can you please elaborate on the bolded? Yamato is a newbie, whether he's in a newbie game or not. Why would "flip-flopping" be a characteristic of a more refined scum play?
Uhhh Z-bo I'm not even talking about Yamato in this passsage. I'm talking about Oats as scum in a previous game, and how his actions match that of Xatalos. The bolded statement is essentially stating that the two situations are somewhat different (Xatalos being more refined because Oats was very blatant about it), but my experience has led me to believe that what Xatalos is doing is scum play.
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On January 07 2013 04:03 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 03:58 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 15:42 Z-BosoN wrote:@Mr.CCOn January 06 2013 09:39 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 09:34 Hapahauli wrote:
Btw CC, you mind building a case on Xatalos? He may be indecisive, but I don't see how it's scummy. Tbh I think everyone was overstating my read on Xatalos. My original "case" was just a read post with vote pressure and it kind of got blown out of proportion both by myself and others. Allow me to rationalize why his indecision struck me so: Oats as scum in XXXII. I caught him flip flopping his read on Yamato so hard and lynch him for it. Xatalos did the same thing by contradicting himself within the frame of ~20mins with only 1 post from you inbetween. I'm starting to realize the two situations are different (as scum are more refined in these non-newbie games). But my concern stands that he's only really done that the entire game so far; saying he could be scum because this, but it could also be town. My experience with such play has been that it is scum.Tell me: Is it different? Can you please elaborate on the bolded? Yamato is a newbie, whether he's in a newbie game or not. Why would "flip-flopping" be a characteristic of a more refined scum play? Uhhh Z-bo I'm not even talking about Yamato in this passsage. I'm talking about Oats as scum in a previous game, and how his actions match that of Xatalos. The bolded statement is essentially stating that the two situations are somewhat different (Xatalos being more refined because Oats was very blatant about it), but my experience has led me to believe that what Xatalos is doing is scum play. I have no idea why I wrote Yamato >.< Anyways, so you are saying that he is doing the same thing as Oats, but he's just more avid about justifying them?
More discreet and well-thought out imo. Oats was just like "I'm not sure ababout Yamato, but I'm leaning scum on him" 20 mins later "I'm not sure about Yamato, but I'm leaning town on him". Xatalos has just floundered around the majority of the game and been super non-committal with reads up until recently. The stuff I quoted in my original post was alarming to me because of how quickly he changed his mind, and how there was only a single post from Hapa (a small one) that triggered his switch.
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Just going to do a stream of consciousness kind of thing as I read the thread. Spoilered stuff so it doesn't take up ridiculous amounts of space.
+ Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
I am interested currently in these people:
yamato
Xatalos
MrZ
yamato:
There are many things which would probably be me reiterating stuff that was mentioned (discrepancy in behaviour as hapa said). Not being really present, throwing votes around with little reasoning. But that can be explained by his lack of time due to RL business. could really use more analysis and reasoning from him.
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait. That is because he is hesitating a lot, laying out a lot of his thoughts in the thread and therefore opening himself up for harsh critique if he changes his mind and posts it. His lack of any stance is alarming though. While it is somewhat just his playstyle (IIRC) I still dislike it a lot, I mean day 1 has been going for quite a long time now already, while we did not get more information through lynching there is still a lot of content to search through and find something.
MrZ:
He is useless, which is stupidly just his meta with the lightheartedness he has shown. I don't like useless people but cannot condemn him based on this.
Actually I started this post with wanting to lynch into Xata/yamato preferrably yamato but now that I am writing those reads feel just unsatisfying...There is nothing really much that distinguishes one option from the other. I am reluctant to lynch yamato since he seems legitimately busy, also relcutant to lynch Xata for just playing as he does (same goes for MrZ).
Somehow this day 1 has not been really productive >_>
So what you're saying is, you don't want to lynch anyone?
+ Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I do scumhunt, just because I am not writing a case on anything that moves does not mean I am not doing it...
Boson is pretty much town in my eyes, no reason to share his spreadsheet with his thoughts lined out with us if he were scum. Also he has directly started to scumhunt as soon as he replaced in, gets lots of towniepoints from me.
CC is someone I don't want to lynch today, you may think him scummy for not making a shitton of cases but that is just a difference in playstyle imo. Looking through his filter he is actively trying to get more information out of people by asking questions promoting discussing. What I dislike is parking his vote on MrZ but that is nothing to be honest.
Who the fuck do you want to lynch??
+ Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:58 yamato77 wrote:
Mr Zentor
He's only given a lot of town reads and acted impatient about lynching people. His filter is full of one liners that provide little reasoning for what he wants to do this game aside from Lynch people. He seems more preoccupied with there being a lynch than who is going to be lynched. He hasn't helped town find who they should lynch, either. Hapa says he's a bored townie but he looks like a scum just waiting for an excuse to hammer a townie lynch.
Ahh something me and Yamato agree on... I hate that Mr. Z ain't doin shit this game.
+ Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 18:06 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 18:04 ShiaoPi wrote:
What makes MrZ scummier than Xatalos in your opinion? Apathy about who is lynched, less scum hunting than Xatalos, less reasoning posted than Xatalos, more trollish nature to his posting. Plus he's advocated the idea that we should limit our discussions in favor of making a decision on a lynch which is a scum favored idea. No, Yamato wtf. Advocating a shorter time limit is not scum favored -- it promotes activity because we have an artificial deadline to adhere by. 72 hours is plenty. Not a reason to lynch MrZ. On January 06 2013 18:49 yamato77 wrote:Is the only reason you want to lynch him is that he's useless? That's the only thing his meta might excuse but I think there are other parts of his play that are scummy. As I've mentioned before he's advocated the idea that we should be deciding on a lynch by now, which is in opposition to the town-favored idea Hapa put forth that we should allow more time for ourselves so that we don't end up mislynching. Indeed so far that has been good, because we haven't done anything rash or stupid just because we felt we had to decide on someone to kill. Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 09:37 MrZentor wrote:
Also, dragging days out will lead to decreased interest in the game by town, increasing inactivity, and generally making things easier for scum.
Days should be 48-72 hours. He's expressed this sentiment multiple times since this initial post in the form of troll votes and acts of impatience. He's pushing town toward making a bad decision which is something I do not think we should be doing. Only scum would want to advocate this idea. Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 07:21 MrZentor wrote:
I will use my hammer vote as soon as I possibly can.
It's unlikely that scum will want to have the final vote on somebody, because it will put them under a lot of scrutiny. This post here he looks like he's setting himself up for making the hammer vote on a player, and then calling himself town for doing it. And again he's advocating the idea that quick hammer lynches are a good thing when they only benefit scum. Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 11:23 MrZentor wrote:
There's too little information to make an accurate lynch first day; we're just wasting time by delaying it. Here he bemoans day 1 as useless and says we should lynch someone. He doesn't have any good ideas of who to lynch, nor has he helped make day 1 more useful, he just wants to kill someone. Apathy about who is lynched is a scummy trait. So basically instead of being pro-town and scum hunting, or even offering up a scum read, he's given town reads on people and told us all to lynch someone quickly. He's playing anti town.
Okay this is rediculous. Yamato I feel like you're pressuring the weakest player right now (in terms of actualy content). These are super easy points to make as scum. These aren't good reasons to lynch Mr Z at all.
+ Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 18:52 Xatalos wrote:Welcome, Z-Boson! I'm glad you're being very townish and contributive so far, which means we have one less player out of the lynching table (I didn't like lynching RiseAgain either, but this is a much easier judgement than that). Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 15:35 Z-BosoN wrote:Allright, caught up. What concerns me about Xatalos, as you can see in the spreadsheet is this post: On January 05 2013 22:20 Xatalos wrote:On January 05 2013 15:00 DarthPunk wrote:On January 05 2013 14:52 Hapahauli wrote:On January 05 2013 14:48 DarthPunk wrote:On January 05 2013 14:46 Hapahauli wrote:On January 05 2013 14:45 DarthPunk wrote:
oh and If I had to lynch now and hapa was dead. hmmm. dunno I would need to read more filters. Actually I would wait to vote until something solid comes up. Remember when you called Xatalos scummy as shit? Yeah I guess you forgot about that huh? Yeah. He is. But I am not certain. Holy fuck dude I change my mind and am unsure as a townie with no info on day one. That doesn't sound plausible at all now does it? Yeah, but how the hell did you change your mind so quickly? You just called Xatalos "scummy as shit" barely an hour ago. Then all of a sudden you're unsure again? Holy fuck. What do you not understand about this. I am town. I have no additional info. I have to figure shit out. The way I figure shit out is to have ideas and then alter these ideas with changing info or more thought applied to the problem. Whilst I was flaming with you I was thinking about Xatalos. Now the thing about Xatalos is that he is a pretty bad townie. He likes to sheep and he changes his mind. Changing your mind is a pretty bad thing to do as scum because people such as yourself for some reason view it as scummy, and as scum you don't need to change your mind. You can defend someone you know will flip town and be fully justified in doing that later when he flips. You can also tunnel people as long as they aren't your buddies, and even then you can do so. So changing his mind/sheeping was originally scummy but not with some further thought applied. His list post irks me as all lists post do in general HOWEVER re reading it actually contained decent content and seemed to fit someone trying to figure shit out. Not scummy. So. He is back to null after reevaluation and I need to figure some other shit out. Savvy? Hmm.. Posts like this are the reason why I originally viewed DP as townish. From time to time there are scummy traits in his filter (angriness, contradictions...) but then again, there are many posts where he appears to genuinely try solving the game. For example this earlier post of his: On January 05 2013 06:16 DarthPunk wrote:
I don;t like either of the 'cases' to be perfectly honest.
Rise is completely null to me. And to be honest you are the one picking a fight with rise. There should be one read due to Rises' aggression and that is null. I thought that you were simply following up on him in order to push the town to be active. However you trying to drum up support for a bandwagon based of something that any player of your calibre should KNOW is a null tell is not 'potentially scummy' it IS scummy. and it has me worried.
Since when do you call things 'potentially scummy' anyway??? sounds really fucking off to be honest.
Yeah it was a WTF post from yamato initially. But his explanation, willingness to be open and transparent, and the fact that his original WTF post turned out to be an exercise in an open thought process give me a town read on yamato at this juncture.
And once again I am wondering how the fuck a town hapa is not reaching the same conclusions as myself and is pushing the wagons of two people who are null at worst.
These well thought-out and contentful posts about several players seem like something Mafia would have a hard time doing. Not impossible, of course, but they just fit town agenda a lot better. Combined with DP's relatively high activity and the speed at which the ghost bandwagon for him gained support, I don't really feel comfortable lynching him today. There's also the point that in my experience, a town vs town flamewar is the most obvious explanation for a fight between active players. With that said, there are some things in his filter that I don't like. DP, if you're there, I want your take on the following matters. On January 05 2013 07:04 DarthPunk wrote:What was on top of my agenda was figuring out hapa as you are the scariest player in this game, and if I could get a solid town read on you we could roll these scum. Unfortunately you went retard and or are scum so now I have to deal with a hapa tunnelling me based on On January 05 2013 06:54 Hapahauli wrote:
Straight-up OMGUS and a sprinkle of gut-feeling. You scum brah. All the while I am somehow illogical despite having really solid reasoning and you just ignoring that to serve your OMGUS agenda. Well, that is cool with me HAPA. I don't have to convince you you are scum. I just have to convince the town. And that should be straightforward after this little party we have been having together. I just can't wrap my head around this post. Here's what it basically says: 1) Hapa is the best player in this game 2) He's a retard and/or scum 3) He's definitely scum Where's the coherency and logic in all this? You called me out for switching my opinions in the time of 1-2 hours, but you're switching your opinions even inside the same post... It makes me think this could all be fake reasoning, only aimed at pushing an agenda, not finding the truth. And why is it so bad for Hapa to push weak cases? What it does is create discussion and draw opinions, likely even hints to several players' alignments, and simply there almost CAN'T be any strong cases this early. So it's infinitely better to push a weak case than merely talk policy or semantics. I have a hard time seeing why this makes Hapa scum exactly? - - - Alright. I don't have any strong scumreads at the moment, but... There are two players I'm considering for today. Mr. Cheesecake- Lots of one-liners that add nothing to the thread - So far his only suspect is me, based on my uncertainty about DP... and nothing else to add to the discussion? - A reasonable amount of posts, but basically nothing of value except the (weak) case on me - Generally being quite forgettable and blending in without drawing attention at all yamato77- Voting for Mr. Cheesecake since... why? - Weird logic and reasoning... scrambling for something to back up his opinions? - Practically nothing useful in his (short) filter - Talking almost exclusively about meta/policy/semantics, nothing really meaningful related to this game His bit on DP reads to me as a biiiig over-justification. What is he trying to accomplish on DP? What is the purpose of beggining by stating why DP looks town, and then refuting it? Xatalos, I'd like you to better explain this post, so I can better understand where you are coming from. The reason I have conflicting arguments about DP's alignment is because I have conflicting feelings about him. Some posts he seems townish, some posts scummy. By the way, he still hasn't responded to any of my questions earlier... Even though he has posted a reasonable amount since then. That doesn't make me feel too good about him, but it's not like we're lynching him anyways (there are so many people who are hiding in plain sight compared to him), so I'd rather not focus on him for now. It's true that MrZentor has been quite passive and non-contributing, but he was somewhat like this in Paranoia Mafia as well (and he was town). And I got a townish feel from the discussion we had earlier in the thread. I don't feel like he's a good lynch. I said I was ready to vote for Mr. Cheesecake, but somehow I don't feel like it's a sufficiently justifiable lynch. He's had some townish posting lately and my read on him wasn't strong to begin with. But there's someone else I want to discuss... ShiaoPiThe first thing that doesn't seem right is this post: Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:14 ShiaoPi wrote:Hmm looks like RiseAgain has still not responded.... Anyway moving onto the matters more at hand for now. I don't think that DP or Hapa are scum, it feels much more like townies at each others throats for minor things. While I can see where both are coming from during the exchange I does kind of worry me that DP does not follow up with a vote as Hapa does. Does not seem to fit when he calls him scum more than once earlier. @Mr.CC Xatalos is kind of a lynchbait in itself. He is not that easy to read (at least for me), but what I have seen so far from him does not really convince me on his scumminess. From time to time he does these 180-turns but usually it is because he lays his entire thoughtprocess out and therefore every nook and turn of his mind is in the thread. He is nullish right now. I want to see more from RiseAgain, so ##Vote: RiseAgainget in here and do something please! I agree with his points about Hapa/DP and myself, but then comes the weird "pressure" vote. It reminds me so much of an earlier game where one Mafia player made a similar pressure vote without ANY conviction. There's even a double (over?)justification for this vote (I want to see more from him - VOTE - do something please). It feels like just a ploy to appear scumhunting with pressure, but that pressure is so weak and apologetic that it doesn't look like he even tried to accomplish anything. It's just all too indifferent about gaining any new information and basically voting for the sake of having voted. Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:26 ShiaoPi wrote:
Right now I am torn between the two of jaybrundage and yamato77.
More tending towards yamato77 for his meltdown in logic as jaybrundage has done nothing, which is bad but not necessarily scum Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:26 ShiaoPi wrote:
EBWOP: oh and someone I would be more reluctant to lynch but could agree to is DP Just listing possible lynch candidates without much (or any in DP's case) reasoning, and putting his foot pre-emptively in a lot of bandwagons. Not advancing the thread, not scumhunting, merely agreeing to lynch several players. Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
I am interested currently in these people:
yamato
Xatalos
MrZ
yamato:
There are many things which would probably be me reiterating stuff that was mentioned (discrepancy in behaviour as hapa said). Not being really present, throwing votes around with little reasoning. But that can be explained by his lack of time due to RL business. could really use more analysis and reasoning from him.
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait. That is because he is hesitating a lot, laying out a lot of his thoughts in the thread and therefore opening himself up for harsh critique if he changes his mind and posts it. His lack of any stance is alarming though. While it is somewhat just his playstyle (IIRC) I still dislike it a lot, I mean day 1 has been going for quite a long time now already, while we did not get more information through lynching there is still a lot of content to search through and find something.
MrZ:
He is useless, which is stupidly just his meta with the lightheartedness he has shown. I don't like useless people but cannot condemn him based on this.
Actually I started this post with wanting to lynch into Xata/yamato preferrably yamato but now that I am writing those reads feel just unsatisfying...There is nothing really much that distinguishes one option from the other. I am reluctant to lynch yamato since he seems legitimately busy, also relcutant to lynch Xata for just playing as he does (same goes for MrZ).
Somehow this day 1 has not been really productive >_> All of his stances are neutral and weak. Although it's a bit hypocritical since I've been hesitant as well, but when he was town in our earlier game together, he had VERY strong opinions and even hard defended a scum until he actually flipped red. When he was Mafia, he was very quiet and vague. This just feels like much more fitting his scum meta, although it's not a huge pool of evidence.With this, I'm actually much more confident in ShiaoPi being scum than Mr. Cheesecake. It's also late in the day, so I guess it's about time to finally cast a vote. ##Vote ShiaoPi
OMG TAKE A STANCE ON SOMETHING INSTEAD OF DISCREDITING YOUR OWN READ
+ Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 19:36 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 19:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am voting you now because:
-flip flopping on DP in some logical inconsistencies earlier
-not committing at all earlier
-writing a terribly bad case for the sake of writing one to get some pressure off yourself.
call it OMGUS if you want, I don't think so.
Also you have been on my hitlist now, Zentor is not around so I cannot ask him stuff right now, I just asked yamato a bunch of stuff earlier. Leaving you and with that crap contribution you look like the best option for today's lynch When was I under pressure...? I've just been trying find someone scummier than Mr. Cheesecake, but it's not an easy job, considering the relatively low activity and the high amount of townish/nullish players. There are many things in your filter that strike me as suspicious (mentioned earlier), and even though they're partly intuition and not solid proof, it's better than Mr. Cheesecake in my eyes (he started off under the radar but has had some engagement since then).
Why are you actively seeking to stop pressuring me?? Apparently anybody will do for this lynch despite your null reads on everybody.
+ Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 21:27 ShiaoPi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 20:05 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:41 ShiaoPi wrote:On January 06 2013 19:36 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am voting you now because:
-flip flopping on DP in some logical inconsistencies earlier
-not committing at all earlier
-writing a terribly bad case for the sake of writing one to get some pressure off yourself.
call it OMGUS if you want, I don't think so.
Also you have been on my hitlist now, Zentor is not around so I cannot ask him stuff right now, I just asked yamato a bunch of stuff earlier. Leaving you and with that crap contribution you look like the best option for today's lynch When was I under pressure...? I've just been trying find someone scummier than Mr. Cheesecake, but it's not an easy job, considering the relatively low activity and the high amount of townish/nullish players. There are many things in your filter that strike me as suspicious (mentioned earlier), and even though they're partly intuition and not solid proof, it's better than Mr. Cheesecake in my eyes (he started off under the radar but has had some engagement since then). Several people have mentioned you as a possible lynch candidate that qualifies as under pressure. I would really be interested in those "many things" in my filter that are suspicious, I already answered the ones you quoted earlier. Please show them to me, I don't even know where you find them. Anyway I am out for dinner now. See you later. Okay... I guess that counts as pressure, although I haven't been even remotely in a dangerous spot until now. But this always happens to me when I'm town at some point, so I'm not too worried yet. Are you saying you were really pressuring RiseAgain? I just can't see anything but a weak fake pressure in that. Merely voting for someone without any actual pressure doesn't count as pressure. Some other players in this game have thrown away weak votes as well, but at least they tried to create some pressure. You didn't even try - the opposite, you openly said it was only an empty vote beforehand. Why were you suddenly okay with lynching DP when he started to gain a bandwagon for himself? All I can see is an opportunistic (yet extremely vague) move to potentially get rid of an active player. And when the bandwagon started to crumble, you suddenly dropped him from your suspects without saying a word about it. It feels like you're just trying to get someone lynched, and it doesn't really matter who. So I am back. Where did I say I was really pressuring Rise? I clearly said it was to get him to post, since I had questions for him, that I wanted to answer. It is blatantly clear in my filter.
I was not "suddenly" okay with lynching DP, stop misrepresenting facts. Mr.CC asked me who my other possible candidates were. That was after the first episode of DP/Hapa-shitfest but before the entire wagon on him started. I was active during the increasing pressure on DP, being part of it myself, before I had to leave cause of RL matters. How is it opportunistic for me to be one of the persons being there while the pressure added up, when I really thought that he might be red?? The bandwagon started to crumble because DP was doing some really townish posts, thing is I was not in the thread at that time. As soon as I was back und caught up I removed DP from my hitlist as he was much more townie now. I did not want to bloat my post with the DP matter again, when it was not part of the trending discussion in the thread, but I did "say a word" about it.... Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
-snip- I for sure care who gets lynched, seriously are you even reading this thread? I clearly stated which persons I want to lynch during varying times already.
I'm confused Batman. Pressure votes get ppl to post and stuff -- why are you saying you're not pressuring him? This post is basically just a summary of events also, useless kk.
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On January 07 2013 04:45 Hapahauli wrote:
I really despise posts like that Mr.CC. Every time I've seen those "stream of consciousness," posts, it's been from scum.
Well doesn't that suck for me huh.
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On January 07 2013 04:49 MrZentor wrote:
But we can kill somebody today, right?
Who do you wanna string up? No hammer for you, I want to do it.
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On January 07 2013 04:50 Hapahauli wrote:Like this. What in the fuck is this? How do you go from... Show nested quote +Ahh something me and Yamato agree on... I hate that Mr. Z ain't doin shit this game. To... Show nested quote +Okay this is rediculous. Yamato I feel like you're pressuring the weakest player right now (in terms of actualy content). These are super easy points to make as scum. These aren't good reasons to lynch Mr Z at all. Hell the rest of the post is ridiculous too. You're just flinging shit at 3-4 players (Yamato, Mr.Z, Shiao, Xatalos) instead of doing anything productive.
Calm down Hapa. I don't like that Mr. Z isn't doing anything this game. But Yamato's reasons for wanting him dead are lolcakes.
That's what I was thinking when I read it, so deal with it. I'm comfortable with a Yamato or Xatalos lynch right now. And no, I wasn't flinging shit at Mr. Z lol.
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On January 07 2013 04:56 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 04:54 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 07 2013 04:50 Hapahauli wrote:Like this. What in the fuck is this? How do you go from... Ahh something me and Yamato agree on... I hate that Mr. Z ain't doin shit this game. To... Okay this is rediculous. Yamato I feel like you're pressuring the weakest player right now (in terms of actualy content). These are super easy points to make as scum. These aren't good reasons to lynch Mr Z at all. Hell the rest of the post is ridiculous too. You're just flinging shit at 3-4 players (Yamato, Mr.Z, Shiao, Xatalos) instead of doing anything productive. Calm down Hapa. I don't like that Mr. Z isn't doing anything this game. But Yamato's reasons for wanting him dead are lolcakes. That's what I was thinking when I read it, so deal with it. I'm comfortable with a Yamato or Xatalos lynch right now. And no, I wasn't flinging shit at Mr. Z lol. Take out Mr. Z and that's three players you just throw poop at. If you're only comfortable with lynching Yamato/Xatalos, why did you devote half of your post to ShaioPi?
Because he was talking in the thread, and I felt it needed addressing. I still have no clue who the hell he wants to lynch right now. Yamato/Xatalos are scummier than that dude.
And I'm glad I threw some poop. Thread needed a kick in the pants.
On January 07 2013 04:56 MrZentor wrote:
Mr. CC
The person I want to lynch is probably the person I'm voting for.
And Hapa, you never answered me. Can we lynch somebody today, plleeeeeeasssssee?
Oh I missed you were voting for Yamato. Cool beans. I should probably unvote you.
##Unvote
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On January 06 2013 17:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I do scumhunt, just because I am not writing a case on anything that moves does not mean I am not doing it...
Boson is pretty much town in my eyes, no reason to share his spreadsheet with his thoughts lined out with us if he were scum. Also he has directly started to scumhunt as soon as he replaced in, gets lots of towniepoints from me.
CC is someone I don't want to lynch today, you may think him scummy for not making a shitton of cases but that is just a difference in playstyle imo. Looking through his filter he is actively trying to get more information out of people by asking questions promoting discussing. What I dislike is parking his vote on MrZ but that is nothing to be honest.
On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
I am interested currently in these people:
yamato
Xatalos
MrZ
yamato:
There are many things which would probably be me reiterating stuff that was mentioned (discrepancy in behaviour as hapa said). Not being really present, throwing votes around with little reasoning. But that can be explained by his lack of time due to RL business. could really use more analysis and reasoning from him.
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait. That is because he is hesitating a lot, laying out a lot of his thoughts in the thread and therefore opening himself up for harsh critique if he changes his mind and posts it. His lack of any stance is alarming though. While it is somewhat just his playstyle (IIRC) I still dislike it a lot, I mean day 1 has been going for quite a long time now already, while we did not get more information through lynching there is still a lot of content to search through and find something.
MrZ:
He is useless, which is stupidly just his meta with the lightheartedness he has shown. I don't like useless people but cannot condemn him based on this.
Actually I started this post with wanting to lynch into Xata/yamato preferrably yamato but now that I am writing those reads feel just unsatisfying...There is nothing really much that distinguishes one option from the other. I am reluctant to lynch yamato since he seems legitimately busy, also relcutant to lynch Xata for just playing as he does (same goes for MrZ).
Somehow this day 1 has not been really productive >_>
On January 06 2013 17:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I do scumhunt, just because I am not writing a case on anything that moves does not mean I am not doing it...
Boson is pretty much town in my eyes, no reason to share his spreadsheet with his thoughts lined out with us if he were scum. Also he has directly started to scumhunt as soon as he replaced in, gets lots of towniepoints from me.
CC is someone I don't want to lynch today, you may think him scummy for not making a shitton of cases but that is just a difference in playstyle imo. Looking through his filter he is actively trying to get more information out of people by asking questions promoting discussing. What I dislike is parking his vote on MrZ but that is nothing to be honest.
And apparently you missed this Hapa.
Just because he's voting for Xatalos and gave a little reason post for it doesn't mean he has super vindication behind it. He said he was reluctant to lynch Xatalos and then votes him cus OMGUS pretty much.
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lol accidently quoted one of the things twice.
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On January 07 2013 05:17 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 05:12 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 06 2013 17:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I do scumhunt, just because I am not writing a case on anything that moves does not mean I am not doing it...
Boson is pretty much town in my eyes, no reason to share his spreadsheet with his thoughts lined out with us if he were scum. Also he has directly started to scumhunt as soon as he replaced in, gets lots of towniepoints from me.
CC is someone I don't want to lynch today, you may think him scummy for not making a shitton of cases but that is just a difference in playstyle imo. Looking through his filter he is actively trying to get more information out of people by asking questions promoting discussing. What I dislike is parking his vote on MrZ but that is nothing to be honest.
On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
I am interested currently in these people:
yamato
Xatalos
MrZ
yamato:
There are many things which would probably be me reiterating stuff that was mentioned (discrepancy in behaviour as hapa said). Not being really present, throwing votes around with little reasoning. But that can be explained by his lack of time due to RL business. could really use more analysis and reasoning from him.
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait. That is because he is hesitating a lot, laying out a lot of his thoughts in the thread and therefore opening himself up for harsh critique if he changes his mind and posts it. His lack of any stance is alarming though. While it is somewhat just his playstyle (IIRC) I still dislike it a lot, I mean day 1 has been going for quite a long time now already, while we did not get more information through lynching there is still a lot of content to search through and find something.
MrZ:
He is useless, which is stupidly just his meta with the lightheartedness he has shown. I don't like useless people but cannot condemn him based on this.
Actually I started this post with wanting to lynch into Xata/yamato preferrably yamato but now that I am writing those reads feel just unsatisfying...There is nothing really much that distinguishes one option from the other. I am reluctant to lynch yamato since he seems legitimately busy, also relcutant to lynch Xata for just playing as he does (same goes for MrZ).
Somehow this day 1 has not been really productive >_> And apparently you missed this Hapa. Just because he's voting for Xatalos and gave a little reason post for it doesn't mean he has super vindication behind it. He said he was reluctant to lynch Xatalos and then votes him cus OMGUS pretty much. Okay cool. So that makes him suspicious then in your mind? Because you're apparently not considering lynching him.
Yes he's suspicious. But not moreso than Xatalos or Yamato.
You're taking my stream post really seriously. Stream of consciousness is what you think the instant you read it, not after you give it thought. But I stand by what I said about SP -- he was reluctant to lynch anybody, then he gets a vote by Xatalos and was like WELP, LYNCH THIS DUDE. It's scummy, yeah, but it doesn't change my reads on the other two.
Although I do appreciate your paranoia -- it's making me think you're so townie right now.
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@Xatalos
Obviously nobody likes your vote on Yamato. I'm pretty scummy right now - just look at the horrible stream of consciousness post. You've had it in for me all game. You totes want to lynch me right now. Jay does too, and Hapa thinks I'm totes a scumster. Maybe I could die today.
Why won't you vote me? 
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On January 07 2013 05:53 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 04:42 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Just going to do a stream of consciousness kind of thing as I read the thread. Spoilered stuff so it doesn't take up ridiculous amounts of space. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
I am interested currently in these people:
yamato
Xatalos
MrZ
yamato:
There are many things which would probably be me reiterating stuff that was mentioned (discrepancy in behaviour as hapa said). Not being really present, throwing votes around with little reasoning. But that can be explained by his lack of time due to RL business. could really use more analysis and reasoning from him.
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait. That is because he is hesitating a lot, laying out a lot of his thoughts in the thread and therefore opening himself up for harsh critique if he changes his mind and posts it. His lack of any stance is alarming though. While it is somewhat just his playstyle (IIRC) I still dislike it a lot, I mean day 1 has been going for quite a long time now already, while we did not get more information through lynching there is still a lot of content to search through and find something.
MrZ:
He is useless, which is stupidly just his meta with the lightheartedness he has shown. I don't like useless people but cannot condemn him based on this.
Actually I started this post with wanting to lynch into Xata/yamato preferrably yamato but now that I am writing those reads feel just unsatisfying...There is nothing really much that distinguishes one option from the other. I am reluctant to lynch yamato since he seems legitimately busy, also relcutant to lynch Xata for just playing as he does (same goes for MrZ).
Somehow this day 1 has not been really productive >_> So what you're saying is, you don't want to lynch anyone? + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I do scumhunt, just because I am not writing a case on anything that moves does not mean I am not doing it...
Boson is pretty much town in my eyes, no reason to share his spreadsheet with his thoughts lined out with us if he were scum. Also he has directly started to scumhunt as soon as he replaced in, gets lots of towniepoints from me.
CC is someone I don't want to lynch today, you may think him scummy for not making a shitton of cases but that is just a difference in playstyle imo. Looking through his filter he is actively trying to get more information out of people by asking questions promoting discussing. What I dislike is parking his vote on MrZ but that is nothing to be honest.
Who the fuck do you want to lynch?? + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:58 yamato77 wrote:
Mr Zentor
He's only given a lot of town reads and acted impatient about lynching people. His filter is full of one liners that provide little reasoning for what he wants to do this game aside from Lynch people. He seems more preoccupied with there being a lynch than who is going to be lynched. He hasn't helped town find who they should lynch, either. Hapa says he's a bored townie but he looks like a scum just waiting for an excuse to hammer a townie lynch. Ahh something me and Yamato agree on... I hate that Mr. Z ain't doin shit this game. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 18:06 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 18:04 ShiaoPi wrote:
What makes MrZ scummier than Xatalos in your opinion? Apathy about who is lynched, less scum hunting than Xatalos, less reasoning posted than Xatalos, more trollish nature to his posting. Plus he's advocated the idea that we should limit our discussions in favor of making a decision on a lynch which is a scum favored idea. No, Yamato wtf. Advocating a shorter time limit is not scum favored -- it promotes activity because we have an artificial deadline to adhere by. 72 hours is plenty. Not a reason to lynch MrZ. On January 06 2013 18:49 yamato77 wrote:Is the only reason you want to lynch him is that he's useless? That's the only thing his meta might excuse but I think there are other parts of his play that are scummy. As I've mentioned before he's advocated the idea that we should be deciding on a lynch by now, which is in opposition to the town-favored idea Hapa put forth that we should allow more time for ourselves so that we don't end up mislynching. Indeed so far that has been good, because we haven't done anything rash or stupid just because we felt we had to decide on someone to kill. Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 09:37 MrZentor wrote:
Also, dragging days out will lead to decreased interest in the game by town, increasing inactivity, and generally making things easier for scum.
Days should be 48-72 hours. He's expressed this sentiment multiple times since this initial post in the form of troll votes and acts of impatience. He's pushing town toward making a bad decision which is something I do not think we should be doing. Only scum would want to advocate this idea. Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 07:21 MrZentor wrote:
I will use my hammer vote as soon as I possibly can.
It's unlikely that scum will want to have the final vote on somebody, because it will put them under a lot of scrutiny. This post here he looks like he's setting himself up for making the hammer vote on a player, and then calling himself town for doing it. And again he's advocating the idea that quick hammer lynches are a good thing when they only benefit scum. Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 11:23 MrZentor wrote:
There's too little information to make an accurate lynch first day; we're just wasting time by delaying it. Here he bemoans day 1 as useless and says we should lynch someone. He doesn't have any good ideas of who to lynch, nor has he helped make day 1 more useful, he just wants to kill someone. Apathy about who is lynched is a scummy trait. So basically instead of being pro-town and scum hunting, or even offering up a scum read, he's given town reads on people and told us all to lynch someone quickly. He's playing anti town. Okay this is rediculous. Yamato I feel like you're pressuring the weakest player right now (in terms of actualy content). These are super easy points to make as scum. These aren't good reasons to lynch Mr Z at all. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 18:52 Xatalos wrote:Welcome, Z-Boson! I'm glad you're being very townish and contributive so far, which means we have one less player out of the lynching table (I didn't like lynching RiseAgain either, but this is a much easier judgement than that). Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 15:35 Z-BosoN wrote:Allright, caught up. What concerns me about Xatalos, as you can see in the spreadsheet is this post: On January 05 2013 22:20 Xatalos wrote:On January 05 2013 15:00 DarthPunk wrote:On January 05 2013 14:52 Hapahauli wrote:On January 05 2013 14:48 DarthPunk wrote:On January 05 2013 14:46 Hapahauli wrote:On January 05 2013 14:45 DarthPunk wrote:
oh and If I had to lynch now and hapa was dead. hmmm. dunno I would need to read more filters. Actually I would wait to vote until something solid comes up. Remember when you called Xatalos scummy as shit? Yeah I guess you forgot about that huh? Yeah. He is. But I am not certain. Holy fuck dude I change my mind and am unsure as a townie with no info on day one. That doesn't sound plausible at all now does it? Yeah, but how the hell did you change your mind so quickly? You just called Xatalos "scummy as shit" barely an hour ago. Then all of a sudden you're unsure again? Holy fuck. What do you not understand about this. I am town. I have no additional info. I have to figure shit out. The way I figure shit out is to have ideas and then alter these ideas with changing info or more thought applied to the problem. Whilst I was flaming with you I was thinking about Xatalos. Now the thing about Xatalos is that he is a pretty bad townie. He likes to sheep and he changes his mind. Changing your mind is a pretty bad thing to do as scum because people such as yourself for some reason view it as scummy, and as scum you don't need to change your mind. You can defend someone you know will flip town and be fully justified in doing that later when he flips. You can also tunnel people as long as they aren't your buddies, and even then you can do so. So changing his mind/sheeping was originally scummy but not with some further thought applied. His list post irks me as all lists post do in general HOWEVER re reading it actually contained decent content and seemed to fit someone trying to figure shit out. Not scummy. So. He is back to null after reevaluation and I need to figure some other shit out. Savvy? Hmm.. Posts like this are the reason why I originally viewed DP as townish. From time to time there are scummy traits in his filter (angriness, contradictions...) but then again, there are many posts where he appears to genuinely try solving the game. For example this earlier post of his: On January 05 2013 06:16 DarthPunk wrote:
I don;t like either of the 'cases' to be perfectly honest.
Rise is completely null to me. And to be honest you are the one picking a fight with rise. There should be one read due to Rises' aggression and that is null. I thought that you were simply following up on him in order to push the town to be active. However you trying to drum up support for a bandwagon based of something that any player of your calibre should KNOW is a null tell is not 'potentially scummy' it IS scummy. and it has me worried.
Since when do you call things 'potentially scummy' anyway??? sounds really fucking off to be honest.
Yeah it was a WTF post from yamato initially. But his explanation, willingness to be open and transparent, and the fact that his original WTF post turned out to be an exercise in an open thought process give me a town read on yamato at this juncture.
And once again I am wondering how the fuck a town hapa is not reaching the same conclusions as myself and is pushing the wagons of two people who are null at worst.
These well thought-out and contentful posts about several players seem like something Mafia would have a hard time doing. Not impossible, of course, but they just fit town agenda a lot better. Combined with DP's relatively high activity and the speed at which the ghost bandwagon for him gained support, I don't really feel comfortable lynching him today. There's also the point that in my experience, a town vs town flamewar is the most obvious explanation for a fight between active players. With that said, there are some things in his filter that I don't like. DP, if you're there, I want your take on the following matters. On January 05 2013 07:04 DarthPunk wrote:What was on top of my agenda was figuring out hapa as you are the scariest player in this game, and if I could get a solid town read on you we could roll these scum. Unfortunately you went retard and or are scum so now I have to deal with a hapa tunnelling me based on On January 05 2013 06:54 Hapahauli wrote:
Straight-up OMGUS and a sprinkle of gut-feeling. You scum brah. All the while I am somehow illogical despite having really solid reasoning and you just ignoring that to serve your OMGUS agenda. Well, that is cool with me HAPA. I don't have to convince you you are scum. I just have to convince the town. And that should be straightforward after this little party we have been having together. I just can't wrap my head around this post. Here's what it basically says: 1) Hapa is the best player in this game 2) He's a retard and/or scum 3) He's definitely scum Where's the coherency and logic in all this? You called me out for switching my opinions in the time of 1-2 hours, but you're switching your opinions even inside the same post... It makes me think this could all be fake reasoning, only aimed at pushing an agenda, not finding the truth. And why is it so bad for Hapa to push weak cases? What it does is create discussion and draw opinions, likely even hints to several players' alignments, and simply there almost CAN'T be any strong cases this early. So it's infinitely better to push a weak case than merely talk policy or semantics. I have a hard time seeing why this makes Hapa scum exactly? - - - Alright. I don't have any strong scumreads at the moment, but... There are two players I'm considering for today. Mr. Cheesecake- Lots of one-liners that add nothing to the thread - So far his only suspect is me, based on my uncertainty about DP... and nothing else to add to the discussion? - A reasonable amount of posts, but basically nothing of value except the (weak) case on me - Generally being quite forgettable and blending in without drawing attention at all yamato77- Voting for Mr. Cheesecake since... why? - Weird logic and reasoning... scrambling for something to back up his opinions? - Practically nothing useful in his (short) filter - Talking almost exclusively about meta/policy/semantics, nothing really meaningful related to this game His bit on DP reads to me as a biiiig over-justification. What is he trying to accomplish on DP? What is the purpose of beggining by stating why DP looks town, and then refuting it? Xatalos, I'd like you to better explain this post, so I can better understand where you are coming from. The reason I have conflicting arguments about DP's alignment is because I have conflicting feelings about him. Some posts he seems townish, some posts scummy. By the way, he still hasn't responded to any of my questions earlier... Even though he has posted a reasonable amount since then. That doesn't make me feel too good about him, but it's not like we're lynching him anyways (there are so many people who are hiding in plain sight compared to him), so I'd rather not focus on him for now. It's true that MrZentor has been quite passive and non-contributing, but he was somewhat like this in Paranoia Mafia as well (and he was town). And I got a townish feel from the discussion we had earlier in the thread. I don't feel like he's a good lynch. I said I was ready to vote for Mr. Cheesecake, but somehow I don't feel like it's a sufficiently justifiable lynch. He's had some townish posting lately and my read on him wasn't strong to begin with. But there's someone else I want to discuss... ShiaoPiThe first thing that doesn't seem right is this post: Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:14 ShiaoPi wrote:Hmm looks like RiseAgain has still not responded.... Anyway moving onto the matters more at hand for now. I don't think that DP or Hapa are scum, it feels much more like townies at each others throats for minor things. While I can see where both are coming from during the exchange I does kind of worry me that DP does not follow up with a vote as Hapa does. Does not seem to fit when he calls him scum more than once earlier. @Mr.CC Xatalos is kind of a lynchbait in itself. He is not that easy to read (at least for me), but what I have seen so far from him does not really convince me on his scumminess. From time to time he does these 180-turns but usually it is because he lays his entire thoughtprocess out and therefore every nook and turn of his mind is in the thread. He is nullish right now. I want to see more from RiseAgain, so ##Vote: RiseAgainget in here and do something please! I agree with his points about Hapa/DP and myself, but then comes the weird "pressure" vote. It reminds me so much of an earlier game where one Mafia player made a similar pressure vote without ANY conviction. There's even a double (over?)justification for this vote (I want to see more from him - VOTE - do something please). It feels like just a ploy to appear scumhunting with pressure, but that pressure is so weak and apologetic that it doesn't look like he even tried to accomplish anything. It's just all too indifferent about gaining any new information and basically voting for the sake of having voted. Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:26 ShiaoPi wrote:
Right now I am torn between the two of jaybrundage and yamato77.
More tending towards yamato77 for his meltdown in logic as jaybrundage has done nothing, which is bad but not necessarily scum Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:26 ShiaoPi wrote:
EBWOP: oh and someone I would be more reluctant to lynch but could agree to is DP Just listing possible lynch candidates without much (or any in DP's case) reasoning, and putting his foot pre-emptively in a lot of bandwagons. Not advancing the thread, not scumhunting, merely agreeing to lynch several players. Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
I am interested currently in these people:
yamato
Xatalos
MrZ
yamato:
There are many things which would probably be me reiterating stuff that was mentioned (discrepancy in behaviour as hapa said). Not being really present, throwing votes around with little reasoning. But that can be explained by his lack of time due to RL business. could really use more analysis and reasoning from him.
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait. That is because he is hesitating a lot, laying out a lot of his thoughts in the thread and therefore opening himself up for harsh critique if he changes his mind and posts it. His lack of any stance is alarming though. While it is somewhat just his playstyle (IIRC) I still dislike it a lot, I mean day 1 has been going for quite a long time now already, while we did not get more information through lynching there is still a lot of content to search through and find something.
MrZ:
He is useless, which is stupidly just his meta with the lightheartedness he has shown. I don't like useless people but cannot condemn him based on this.
Actually I started this post with wanting to lynch into Xata/yamato preferrably yamato but now that I am writing those reads feel just unsatisfying...There is nothing really much that distinguishes one option from the other. I am reluctant to lynch yamato since he seems legitimately busy, also relcutant to lynch Xata for just playing as he does (same goes for MrZ).
Somehow this day 1 has not been really productive >_> All of his stances are neutral and weak. Although it's a bit hypocritical since I've been hesitant as well, but when he was town in our earlier game together, he had VERY strong opinions and even hard defended a scum until he actually flipped red. When he was Mafia, he was very quiet and vague. This just feels like much more fitting his scum meta, although it's not a huge pool of evidence.With this, I'm actually much more confident in ShiaoPi being scum than Mr. Cheesecake. It's also late in the day, so I guess it's about time to finally cast a vote. ##Vote ShiaoPi OMG TAKE A STANCE ON SOMETHING INSTEAD OF DISCREDITING YOUR OWN READ + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 19:36 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 19:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am voting you now because:
-flip flopping on DP in some logical inconsistencies earlier
-not committing at all earlier
-writing a terribly bad case for the sake of writing one to get some pressure off yourself.
call it OMGUS if you want, I don't think so.
Also you have been on my hitlist now, Zentor is not around so I cannot ask him stuff right now, I just asked yamato a bunch of stuff earlier. Leaving you and with that crap contribution you look like the best option for today's lynch When was I under pressure...? I've just been trying find someone scummier than Mr. Cheesecake, but it's not an easy job, considering the relatively low activity and the high amount of townish/nullish players. There are many things in your filter that strike me as suspicious (mentioned earlier), and even though they're partly intuition and not solid proof, it's better than Mr. Cheesecake in my eyes (he started off under the radar but has had some engagement since then). Why are you actively seeking to stop pressuring me?? Apparently anybody will do for this lynch despite your null reads on everybody. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 21:27 ShiaoPi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 20:05 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:41 ShiaoPi wrote:On January 06 2013 19:36 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am voting you now because:
-flip flopping on DP in some logical inconsistencies earlier
-not committing at all earlier
-writing a terribly bad case for the sake of writing one to get some pressure off yourself.
call it OMGUS if you want, I don't think so.
Also you have been on my hitlist now, Zentor is not around so I cannot ask him stuff right now, I just asked yamato a bunch of stuff earlier. Leaving you and with that crap contribution you look like the best option for today's lynch When was I under pressure...? I've just been trying find someone scummier than Mr. Cheesecake, but it's not an easy job, considering the relatively low activity and the high amount of townish/nullish players. There are many things in your filter that strike me as suspicious (mentioned earlier), and even though they're partly intuition and not solid proof, it's better than Mr. Cheesecake in my eyes (he started off under the radar but has had some engagement since then). Several people have mentioned you as a possible lynch candidate that qualifies as under pressure. I would really be interested in those "many things" in my filter that are suspicious, I already answered the ones you quoted earlier. Please show them to me, I don't even know where you find them. Anyway I am out for dinner now. See you later. Okay... I guess that counts as pressure, although I haven't been even remotely in a dangerous spot until now. But this always happens to me when I'm town at some point, so I'm not too worried yet. Are you saying you were really pressuring RiseAgain? I just can't see anything but a weak fake pressure in that. Merely voting for someone without any actual pressure doesn't count as pressure. Some other players in this game have thrown away weak votes as well, but at least they tried to create some pressure. You didn't even try - the opposite, you openly said it was only an empty vote beforehand. Why were you suddenly okay with lynching DP when he started to gain a bandwagon for himself? All I can see is an opportunistic (yet extremely vague) move to potentially get rid of an active player. And when the bandwagon started to crumble, you suddenly dropped him from your suspects without saying a word about it. It feels like you're just trying to get someone lynched, and it doesn't really matter who. So I am back. Where did I say I was really pressuring Rise? I clearly said it was to get him to post, since I had questions for him, that I wanted to answer. It is blatantly clear in my filter.
I was not "suddenly" okay with lynching DP, stop misrepresenting facts. Mr.CC asked me who my other possible candidates were. That was after the first episode of DP/Hapa-shitfest but before the entire wagon on him started. I was active during the increasing pressure on DP, being part of it myself, before I had to leave cause of RL matters. How is it opportunistic for me to be one of the persons being there while the pressure added up, when I really thought that he might be red?? The bandwagon started to crumble because DP was doing some really townish posts, thing is I was not in the thread at that time. As soon as I was back und caught up I removed DP from my hitlist as he was much more townie now. I did not want to bloat my post with the DP matter again, when it was not part of the trending discussion in the thread, but I did "say a word" about it.... Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
-snip- I for sure care who gets lynched, seriously are you even reading this thread? I clearly stated which persons I want to lynch during varying times already. I'm confused Batman. Pressure votes get ppl to post and stuff -- why are you saying you're not pressuring him? This post is basically just a summary of events also, useless kk. What are your conclusions? You just read in a biased way, but you don't draw any conclusions whatsoever. There's nothing anyone can defend or support to. This is an useless effort.
Well you asked me to give my thoughts on the last few pages. And there you go. I don't draw any conclusions because it's just what I was thinking. So yes, it is pretty useless, but it pushes whatever I was thinking at the time out there.
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On January 07 2013 06:00 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 05:59 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 07 2013 05:53 Z-BosoN wrote:On January 07 2013 04:42 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Just going to do a stream of consciousness kind of thing as I read the thread. Spoilered stuff so it doesn't take up ridiculous amounts of space. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
I am interested currently in these people:
yamato
Xatalos
MrZ
yamato:
There are many things which would probably be me reiterating stuff that was mentioned (discrepancy in behaviour as hapa said). Not being really present, throwing votes around with little reasoning. But that can be explained by his lack of time due to RL business. could really use more analysis and reasoning from him.
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait. That is because he is hesitating a lot, laying out a lot of his thoughts in the thread and therefore opening himself up for harsh critique if he changes his mind and posts it. His lack of any stance is alarming though. While it is somewhat just his playstyle (IIRC) I still dislike it a lot, I mean day 1 has been going for quite a long time now already, while we did not get more information through lynching there is still a lot of content to search through and find something.
MrZ:
He is useless, which is stupidly just his meta with the lightheartedness he has shown. I don't like useless people but cannot condemn him based on this.
Actually I started this post with wanting to lynch into Xata/yamato preferrably yamato but now that I am writing those reads feel just unsatisfying...There is nothing really much that distinguishes one option from the other. I am reluctant to lynch yamato since he seems legitimately busy, also relcutant to lynch Xata for just playing as he does (same goes for MrZ).
Somehow this day 1 has not been really productive >_> So what you're saying is, you don't want to lynch anyone? + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I do scumhunt, just because I am not writing a case on anything that moves does not mean I am not doing it...
Boson is pretty much town in my eyes, no reason to share his spreadsheet with his thoughts lined out with us if he were scum. Also he has directly started to scumhunt as soon as he replaced in, gets lots of towniepoints from me.
CC is someone I don't want to lynch today, you may think him scummy for not making a shitton of cases but that is just a difference in playstyle imo. Looking through his filter he is actively trying to get more information out of people by asking questions promoting discussing. What I dislike is parking his vote on MrZ but that is nothing to be honest.
Who the fuck do you want to lynch?? + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:58 yamato77 wrote:
Mr Zentor
He's only given a lot of town reads and acted impatient about lynching people. His filter is full of one liners that provide little reasoning for what he wants to do this game aside from Lynch people. He seems more preoccupied with there being a lynch than who is going to be lynched. He hasn't helped town find who they should lynch, either. Hapa says he's a bored townie but he looks like a scum just waiting for an excuse to hammer a townie lynch. Ahh something me and Yamato agree on... I hate that Mr. Z ain't doin shit this game. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 18:06 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 18:04 ShiaoPi wrote:
What makes MrZ scummier than Xatalos in your opinion? Apathy about who is lynched, less scum hunting than Xatalos, less reasoning posted than Xatalos, more trollish nature to his posting. Plus he's advocated the idea that we should limit our discussions in favor of making a decision on a lynch which is a scum favored idea. No, Yamato wtf. Advocating a shorter time limit is not scum favored -- it promotes activity because we have an artificial deadline to adhere by. 72 hours is plenty. Not a reason to lynch MrZ. On January 06 2013 18:49 yamato77 wrote:Is the only reason you want to lynch him is that he's useless? That's the only thing his meta might excuse but I think there are other parts of his play that are scummy. As I've mentioned before he's advocated the idea that we should be deciding on a lynch by now, which is in opposition to the town-favored idea Hapa put forth that we should allow more time for ourselves so that we don't end up mislynching. Indeed so far that has been good, because we haven't done anything rash or stupid just because we felt we had to decide on someone to kill. Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 09:37 MrZentor wrote:
Also, dragging days out will lead to decreased interest in the game by town, increasing inactivity, and generally making things easier for scum.
Days should be 48-72 hours. He's expressed this sentiment multiple times since this initial post in the form of troll votes and acts of impatience. He's pushing town toward making a bad decision which is something I do not think we should be doing. Only scum would want to advocate this idea. Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 07:21 MrZentor wrote:
I will use my hammer vote as soon as I possibly can.
It's unlikely that scum will want to have the final vote on somebody, because it will put them under a lot of scrutiny. This post here he looks like he's setting himself up for making the hammer vote on a player, and then calling himself town for doing it. And again he's advocating the idea that quick hammer lynches are a good thing when they only benefit scum. Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 11:23 MrZentor wrote:
There's too little information to make an accurate lynch first day; we're just wasting time by delaying it. Here he bemoans day 1 as useless and says we should lynch someone. He doesn't have any good ideas of who to lynch, nor has he helped make day 1 more useful, he just wants to kill someone. Apathy about who is lynched is a scummy trait. So basically instead of being pro-town and scum hunting, or even offering up a scum read, he's given town reads on people and told us all to lynch someone quickly. He's playing anti town. Okay this is rediculous. Yamato I feel like you're pressuring the weakest player right now (in terms of actualy content). These are super easy points to make as scum. These aren't good reasons to lynch Mr Z at all. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 18:52 Xatalos wrote:Welcome, Z-Boson! I'm glad you're being very townish and contributive so far, which means we have one less player out of the lynching table (I didn't like lynching RiseAgain either, but this is a much easier judgement than that). Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 15:35 Z-BosoN wrote:Allright, caught up. What concerns me about Xatalos, as you can see in the spreadsheet is this post: On January 05 2013 22:20 Xatalos wrote:On January 05 2013 15:00 DarthPunk wrote:On January 05 2013 14:52 Hapahauli wrote:On January 05 2013 14:48 DarthPunk wrote:On January 05 2013 14:46 Hapahauli wrote:On January 05 2013 14:45 DarthPunk wrote:
oh and If I had to lynch now and hapa was dead. hmmm. dunno I would need to read more filters. Actually I would wait to vote until something solid comes up. Remember when you called Xatalos scummy as shit? Yeah I guess you forgot about that huh? Yeah. He is. But I am not certain. Holy fuck dude I change my mind and am unsure as a townie with no info on day one. That doesn't sound plausible at all now does it? Yeah, but how the hell did you change your mind so quickly? You just called Xatalos "scummy as shit" barely an hour ago. Then all of a sudden you're unsure again? Holy fuck. What do you not understand about this. I am town. I have no additional info. I have to figure shit out. The way I figure shit out is to have ideas and then alter these ideas with changing info or more thought applied to the problem. Whilst I was flaming with you I was thinking about Xatalos. Now the thing about Xatalos is that he is a pretty bad townie. He likes to sheep and he changes his mind. Changing your mind is a pretty bad thing to do as scum because people such as yourself for some reason view it as scummy, and as scum you don't need to change your mind. You can defend someone you know will flip town and be fully justified in doing that later when he flips. You can also tunnel people as long as they aren't your buddies, and even then you can do so. So changing his mind/sheeping was originally scummy but not with some further thought applied. His list post irks me as all lists post do in general HOWEVER re reading it actually contained decent content and seemed to fit someone trying to figure shit out. Not scummy. So. He is back to null after reevaluation and I need to figure some other shit out. Savvy? Hmm.. Posts like this are the reason why I originally viewed DP as townish. From time to time there are scummy traits in his filter (angriness, contradictions...) but then again, there are many posts where he appears to genuinely try solving the game. For example this earlier post of his: On January 05 2013 06:16 DarthPunk wrote:
I don;t like either of the 'cases' to be perfectly honest.
Rise is completely null to me. And to be honest you are the one picking a fight with rise. There should be one read due to Rises' aggression and that is null. I thought that you were simply following up on him in order to push the town to be active. However you trying to drum up support for a bandwagon based of something that any player of your calibre should KNOW is a null tell is not 'potentially scummy' it IS scummy. and it has me worried.
Since when do you call things 'potentially scummy' anyway??? sounds really fucking off to be honest.
Yeah it was a WTF post from yamato initially. But his explanation, willingness to be open and transparent, and the fact that his original WTF post turned out to be an exercise in an open thought process give me a town read on yamato at this juncture.
And once again I am wondering how the fuck a town hapa is not reaching the same conclusions as myself and is pushing the wagons of two people who are null at worst.
These well thought-out and contentful posts about several players seem like something Mafia would have a hard time doing. Not impossible, of course, but they just fit town agenda a lot better. Combined with DP's relatively high activity and the speed at which the ghost bandwagon for him gained support, I don't really feel comfortable lynching him today. There's also the point that in my experience, a town vs town flamewar is the most obvious explanation for a fight between active players. With that said, there are some things in his filter that I don't like. DP, if you're there, I want your take on the following matters. On January 05 2013 07:04 DarthPunk wrote:What was on top of my agenda was figuring out hapa as you are the scariest player in this game, and if I could get a solid town read on you we could roll these scum. Unfortunately you went retard and or are scum so now I have to deal with a hapa tunnelling me based on On January 05 2013 06:54 Hapahauli wrote:
Straight-up OMGUS and a sprinkle of gut-feeling. You scum brah. All the while I am somehow illogical despite having really solid reasoning and you just ignoring that to serve your OMGUS agenda. Well, that is cool with me HAPA. I don't have to convince you you are scum. I just have to convince the town. And that should be straightforward after this little party we have been having together. I just can't wrap my head around this post. Here's what it basically says: 1) Hapa is the best player in this game 2) He's a retard and/or scum 3) He's definitely scum Where's the coherency and logic in all this? You called me out for switching my opinions in the time of 1-2 hours, but you're switching your opinions even inside the same post... It makes me think this could all be fake reasoning, only aimed at pushing an agenda, not finding the truth. And why is it so bad for Hapa to push weak cases? What it does is create discussion and draw opinions, likely even hints to several players' alignments, and simply there almost CAN'T be any strong cases this early. So it's infinitely better to push a weak case than merely talk policy or semantics. I have a hard time seeing why this makes Hapa scum exactly? - - - Alright. I don't have any strong scumreads at the moment, but... There are two players I'm considering for today. Mr. Cheesecake- Lots of one-liners that add nothing to the thread - So far his only suspect is me, based on my uncertainty about DP... and nothing else to add to the discussion? - A reasonable amount of posts, but basically nothing of value except the (weak) case on me - Generally being quite forgettable and blending in without drawing attention at all yamato77- Voting for Mr. Cheesecake since... why? - Weird logic and reasoning... scrambling for something to back up his opinions? - Practically nothing useful in his (short) filter - Talking almost exclusively about meta/policy/semantics, nothing really meaningful related to this game His bit on DP reads to me as a biiiig over-justification. What is he trying to accomplish on DP? What is the purpose of beggining by stating why DP looks town, and then refuting it? Xatalos, I'd like you to better explain this post, so I can better understand where you are coming from. The reason I have conflicting arguments about DP's alignment is because I have conflicting feelings about him. Some posts he seems townish, some posts scummy. By the way, he still hasn't responded to any of my questions earlier... Even though he has posted a reasonable amount since then. That doesn't make me feel too good about him, but it's not like we're lynching him anyways (there are so many people who are hiding in plain sight compared to him), so I'd rather not focus on him for now. It's true that MrZentor has been quite passive and non-contributing, but he was somewhat like this in Paranoia Mafia as well (and he was town). And I got a townish feel from the discussion we had earlier in the thread. I don't feel like he's a good lynch. I said I was ready to vote for Mr. Cheesecake, but somehow I don't feel like it's a sufficiently justifiable lynch. He's had some townish posting lately and my read on him wasn't strong to begin with. But there's someone else I want to discuss... ShiaoPiThe first thing that doesn't seem right is this post: Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:14 ShiaoPi wrote:Hmm looks like RiseAgain has still not responded.... Anyway moving onto the matters more at hand for now. I don't think that DP or Hapa are scum, it feels much more like townies at each others throats for minor things. While I can see where both are coming from during the exchange I does kind of worry me that DP does not follow up with a vote as Hapa does. Does not seem to fit when he calls him scum more than once earlier. @Mr.CC Xatalos is kind of a lynchbait in itself. He is not that easy to read (at least for me), but what I have seen so far from him does not really convince me on his scumminess. From time to time he does these 180-turns but usually it is because he lays his entire thoughtprocess out and therefore every nook and turn of his mind is in the thread. He is nullish right now. I want to see more from RiseAgain, so ##Vote: RiseAgainget in here and do something please! I agree with his points about Hapa/DP and myself, but then comes the weird "pressure" vote. It reminds me so much of an earlier game where one Mafia player made a similar pressure vote without ANY conviction. There's even a double (over?)justification for this vote (I want to see more from him - VOTE - do something please). It feels like just a ploy to appear scumhunting with pressure, but that pressure is so weak and apologetic that it doesn't look like he even tried to accomplish anything. It's just all too indifferent about gaining any new information and basically voting for the sake of having voted. Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:26 ShiaoPi wrote:
Right now I am torn between the two of jaybrundage and yamato77.
More tending towards yamato77 for his meltdown in logic as jaybrundage has done nothing, which is bad but not necessarily scum Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:26 ShiaoPi wrote:
EBWOP: oh and someone I would be more reluctant to lynch but could agree to is DP Just listing possible lynch candidates without much (or any in DP's case) reasoning, and putting his foot pre-emptively in a lot of bandwagons. Not advancing the thread, not scumhunting, merely agreeing to lynch several players. Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
I am interested currently in these people:
yamato
Xatalos
MrZ
yamato:
There are many things which would probably be me reiterating stuff that was mentioned (discrepancy in behaviour as hapa said). Not being really present, throwing votes around with little reasoning. But that can be explained by his lack of time due to RL business. could really use more analysis and reasoning from him.
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait. That is because he is hesitating a lot, laying out a lot of his thoughts in the thread and therefore opening himself up for harsh critique if he changes his mind and posts it. His lack of any stance is alarming though. While it is somewhat just his playstyle (IIRC) I still dislike it a lot, I mean day 1 has been going for quite a long time now already, while we did not get more information through lynching there is still a lot of content to search through and find something.
MrZ:
He is useless, which is stupidly just his meta with the lightheartedness he has shown. I don't like useless people but cannot condemn him based on this.
Actually I started this post with wanting to lynch into Xata/yamato preferrably yamato but now that I am writing those reads feel just unsatisfying...There is nothing really much that distinguishes one option from the other. I am reluctant to lynch yamato since he seems legitimately busy, also relcutant to lynch Xata for just playing as he does (same goes for MrZ).
Somehow this day 1 has not been really productive >_> All of his stances are neutral and weak. Although it's a bit hypocritical since I've been hesitant as well, but when he was town in our earlier game together, he had VERY strong opinions and even hard defended a scum until he actually flipped red. When he was Mafia, he was very quiet and vague. This just feels like much more fitting his scum meta, although it's not a huge pool of evidence.With this, I'm actually much more confident in ShiaoPi being scum than Mr. Cheesecake. It's also late in the day, so I guess it's about time to finally cast a vote. ##Vote ShiaoPi OMG TAKE A STANCE ON SOMETHING INSTEAD OF DISCREDITING YOUR OWN READ + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 19:36 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 19:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am voting you now because:
-flip flopping on DP in some logical inconsistencies earlier
-not committing at all earlier
-writing a terribly bad case for the sake of writing one to get some pressure off yourself.
call it OMGUS if you want, I don't think so.
Also you have been on my hitlist now, Zentor is not around so I cannot ask him stuff right now, I just asked yamato a bunch of stuff earlier. Leaving you and with that crap contribution you look like the best option for today's lynch When was I under pressure...? I've just been trying find someone scummier than Mr. Cheesecake, but it's not an easy job, considering the relatively low activity and the high amount of townish/nullish players. There are many things in your filter that strike me as suspicious (mentioned earlier), and even though they're partly intuition and not solid proof, it's better than Mr. Cheesecake in my eyes (he started off under the radar but has had some engagement since then). Why are you actively seeking to stop pressuring me?? Apparently anybody will do for this lynch despite your null reads on everybody. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 21:27 ShiaoPi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 20:05 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:41 ShiaoPi wrote:On January 06 2013 19:36 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am voting you now because:
-flip flopping on DP in some logical inconsistencies earlier
-not committing at all earlier
-writing a terribly bad case for the sake of writing one to get some pressure off yourself.
call it OMGUS if you want, I don't think so.
Also you have been on my hitlist now, Zentor is not around so I cannot ask him stuff right now, I just asked yamato a bunch of stuff earlier. Leaving you and with that crap contribution you look like the best option for today's lynch When was I under pressure...? I've just been trying find someone scummier than Mr. Cheesecake, but it's not an easy job, considering the relatively low activity and the high amount of townish/nullish players. There are many things in your filter that strike me as suspicious (mentioned earlier), and even though they're partly intuition and not solid proof, it's better than Mr. Cheesecake in my eyes (he started off under the radar but has had some engagement since then). Several people have mentioned you as a possible lynch candidate that qualifies as under pressure. I would really be interested in those "many things" in my filter that are suspicious, I already answered the ones you quoted earlier. Please show them to me, I don't even know where you find them. Anyway I am out for dinner now. See you later. Okay... I guess that counts as pressure, although I haven't been even remotely in a dangerous spot until now. But this always happens to me when I'm town at some point, so I'm not too worried yet. Are you saying you were really pressuring RiseAgain? I just can't see anything but a weak fake pressure in that. Merely voting for someone without any actual pressure doesn't count as pressure. Some other players in this game have thrown away weak votes as well, but at least they tried to create some pressure. You didn't even try - the opposite, you openly said it was only an empty vote beforehand. Why were you suddenly okay with lynching DP when he started to gain a bandwagon for himself? All I can see is an opportunistic (yet extremely vague) move to potentially get rid of an active player. And when the bandwagon started to crumble, you suddenly dropped him from your suspects without saying a word about it. It feels like you're just trying to get someone lynched, and it doesn't really matter who. So I am back. Where did I say I was really pressuring Rise? I clearly said it was to get him to post, since I had questions for him, that I wanted to answer. It is blatantly clear in my filter.
I was not "suddenly" okay with lynching DP, stop misrepresenting facts. Mr.CC asked me who my other possible candidates were. That was after the first episode of DP/Hapa-shitfest but before the entire wagon on him started. I was active during the increasing pressure on DP, being part of it myself, before I had to leave cause of RL matters. How is it opportunistic for me to be one of the persons being there while the pressure added up, when I really thought that he might be red?? The bandwagon started to crumble because DP was doing some really townish posts, thing is I was not in the thread at that time. As soon as I was back und caught up I removed DP from my hitlist as he was much more townie now. I did not want to bloat my post with the DP matter again, when it was not part of the trending discussion in the thread, but I did "say a word" about it.... Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
-snip- I for sure care who gets lynched, seriously are you even reading this thread? I clearly stated which persons I want to lynch during varying times already. I'm confused Batman. Pressure votes get ppl to post and stuff -- why are you saying you're not pressuring him? This post is basically just a summary of events also, useless kk. What are your conclusions? You just read in a biased way, but you don't draw any conclusions whatsoever. There's nothing anyone can defend or support to. This is an useless effort. Well you asked me to give my thoughts on the last few pages. And there you go. I don't draw any conclusions because it's just what I was thinking. So yes, it is pretty useless, but it pushes whatever I was thinking at the time out there. Yes, but what are your conclusions? I'm rather interested in hearing them.
Conclusions?
I hate Yamato's reasoning for voting Mr. Z. Could be scum trying to push the easiest player to lynch. (Mr. Z is an easy target, he even says it himself).
SP OMGUS votes Xatalos even though he "isn't sure" about lynching anybody. I'm actually not sure if it's a town reaction or scum reaction. Maybe you can provide some insight on this.
Xatalos still scummy as hell, not committing on reads, and discrediting his own when he has them.
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On January 07 2013 06:05 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 06:02 MrZentor wrote:
I didn't want to say this.
But CC and I are cousins.
I know how to read him, and trust me, he's town. Wait rofl, is this for real, or is this just a play on your names?
He's just fucking with you guys - ROFL.
Althought we could be cousins and not know it.
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On January 07 2013 06:17 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 06:14 Xatalos wrote:On January 07 2013 06:02 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Xatalos
You mentioned that your vote would end up on yamato, Shaio, or CC today. A process of elimination read on yamato makes absolutely no sense when you have other potential lynch candidates. What are your current thoughts on Shaio and CC? Mr. Cheesecake: he's had good engagement with the thread lately, but he hasn't actually done much. Much of his posting is just fluff or nearly fluff, like the stream of thought post for example. It doesn't feel like he wants to really affect the thread, more like comment on things of his choosing and follow along... It could very well be Mafia. I'm definitely pro-lynch on him. ShiaoPi: still concerned about his fake pressure, OMGUS vote on me, relative lack of contribution etc. I can easily see his filter from a Mafia perspective, unlike several other players (Hapahauli, MrZentor, jaybrundage). It all comes down to what's realistic. It's starting to look like ShiaoPi is not, Mr. Cheesecake and yamato77 may well be. So I'm not pushing for ShiaoPi to be lynched right now. I need less general statements and more specific analysis. Lynching based on realism = not good. Who is your top scumread based on behaviour alone and why? Let's pretend for a minute that everyone, is up on the block, and you control who the town is going to lynch. Who are you going to lynch?
Hapa, you said somewhere that you had a town read on Jay. Could you extrapolate on that a bit?
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On January 07 2013 06:31 jaybrundage wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 06:26 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 07 2013 06:17 Hapahauli wrote:On January 07 2013 06:14 Xatalos wrote:On January 07 2013 06:02 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Xatalos
You mentioned that your vote would end up on yamato, Shaio, or CC today. A process of elimination read on yamato makes absolutely no sense when you have other potential lynch candidates. What are your current thoughts on Shaio and CC? Mr. Cheesecake: he's had good engagement with the thread lately, but he hasn't actually done much. Much of his posting is just fluff or nearly fluff, like the stream of thought post for example. It doesn't feel like he wants to really affect the thread, more like comment on things of his choosing and follow along... It could very well be Mafia. I'm definitely pro-lynch on him. ShiaoPi: still concerned about his fake pressure, OMGUS vote on me, relative lack of contribution etc. I can easily see his filter from a Mafia perspective, unlike several other players (Hapahauli, MrZentor, jaybrundage). It all comes down to what's realistic. It's starting to look like ShiaoPi is not, Mr. Cheesecake and yamato77 may well be. So I'm not pushing for ShiaoPi to be lynched right now. I need less general statements and more specific analysis. Lynching based on realism = not good. Who is your top scumread based on behaviour alone and why? Let's pretend for a minute that everyone, is up on the block, and you control who the town is going to lynch. Who are you going to lynch? Hapa, you said somewhere that you had a town read on Jay. Could you extrapolate on that a bit? Hey CC you said you have a scum read on me. Would you lynch me today? Do you plan to do any follow up on the case?
All you've done today is tunnel me.
No I won't lynch you today. I'll follow up on your case (even though i never had one against you) during the night depending on the flip.
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On January 07 2013 06:35 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 06:07 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 07 2013 06:00 Hapahauli wrote:On January 07 2013 05:59 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 07 2013 05:53 Z-BosoN wrote:On January 07 2013 04:42 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Just going to do a stream of consciousness kind of thing as I read the thread. Spoilered stuff so it doesn't take up ridiculous amounts of space. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
I am interested currently in these people:
yamato
Xatalos
MrZ
yamato:
There are many things which would probably be me reiterating stuff that was mentioned (discrepancy in behaviour as hapa said). Not being really present, throwing votes around with little reasoning. But that can be explained by his lack of time due to RL business. could really use more analysis and reasoning from him.
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait. That is because he is hesitating a lot, laying out a lot of his thoughts in the thread and therefore opening himself up for harsh critique if he changes his mind and posts it. His lack of any stance is alarming though. While it is somewhat just his playstyle (IIRC) I still dislike it a lot, I mean day 1 has been going for quite a long time now already, while we did not get more information through lynching there is still a lot of content to search through and find something.
MrZ:
He is useless, which is stupidly just his meta with the lightheartedness he has shown. I don't like useless people but cannot condemn him based on this.
Actually I started this post with wanting to lynch into Xata/yamato preferrably yamato but now that I am writing those reads feel just unsatisfying...There is nothing really much that distinguishes one option from the other. I am reluctant to lynch yamato since he seems legitimately busy, also relcutant to lynch Xata for just playing as he does (same goes for MrZ).
Somehow this day 1 has not been really productive >_> So what you're saying is, you don't want to lynch anyone? + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I do scumhunt, just because I am not writing a case on anything that moves does not mean I am not doing it...
Boson is pretty much town in my eyes, no reason to share his spreadsheet with his thoughts lined out with us if he were scum. Also he has directly started to scumhunt as soon as he replaced in, gets lots of towniepoints from me.
CC is someone I don't want to lynch today, you may think him scummy for not making a shitton of cases but that is just a difference in playstyle imo. Looking through his filter he is actively trying to get more information out of people by asking questions promoting discussing. What I dislike is parking his vote on MrZ but that is nothing to be honest.
Who the fuck do you want to lynch?? + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 17:58 yamato77 wrote:
Mr Zentor
He's only given a lot of town reads and acted impatient about lynching people. His filter is full of one liners that provide little reasoning for what he wants to do this game aside from Lynch people. He seems more preoccupied with there being a lynch than who is going to be lynched. He hasn't helped town find who they should lynch, either. Hapa says he's a bored townie but he looks like a scum just waiting for an excuse to hammer a townie lynch. Ahh something me and Yamato agree on... I hate that Mr. Z ain't doin shit this game. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 18:06 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 18:04 ShiaoPi wrote:
What makes MrZ scummier than Xatalos in your opinion? Apathy about who is lynched, less scum hunting than Xatalos, less reasoning posted than Xatalos, more trollish nature to his posting. Plus he's advocated the idea that we should limit our discussions in favor of making a decision on a lynch which is a scum favored idea. No, Yamato wtf. Advocating a shorter time limit is not scum favored -- it promotes activity because we have an artificial deadline to adhere by. 72 hours is plenty. Not a reason to lynch MrZ. On January 06 2013 18:49 yamato77 wrote:Is the only reason you want to lynch him is that he's useless? That's the only thing his meta might excuse but I think there are other parts of his play that are scummy. As I've mentioned before he's advocated the idea that we should be deciding on a lynch by now, which is in opposition to the town-favored idea Hapa put forth that we should allow more time for ourselves so that we don't end up mislynching. Indeed so far that has been good, because we haven't done anything rash or stupid just because we felt we had to decide on someone to kill. Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 09:37 MrZentor wrote:
Also, dragging days out will lead to decreased interest in the game by town, increasing inactivity, and generally making things easier for scum.
Days should be 48-72 hours. He's expressed this sentiment multiple times since this initial post in the form of troll votes and acts of impatience. He's pushing town toward making a bad decision which is something I do not think we should be doing. Only scum would want to advocate this idea. Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 07:21 MrZentor wrote:
I will use my hammer vote as soon as I possibly can.
It's unlikely that scum will want to have the final vote on somebody, because it will put them under a lot of scrutiny. This post here he looks like he's setting himself up for making the hammer vote on a player, and then calling himself town for doing it. And again he's advocating the idea that quick hammer lynches are a good thing when they only benefit scum. Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 11:23 MrZentor wrote:
There's too little information to make an accurate lynch first day; we're just wasting time by delaying it. Here he bemoans day 1 as useless and says we should lynch someone. He doesn't have any good ideas of who to lynch, nor has he helped make day 1 more useful, he just wants to kill someone. Apathy about who is lynched is a scummy trait. So basically instead of being pro-town and scum hunting, or even offering up a scum read, he's given town reads on people and told us all to lynch someone quickly. He's playing anti town. Okay this is rediculous. Yamato I feel like you're pressuring the weakest player right now (in terms of actualy content). These are super easy points to make as scum. These aren't good reasons to lynch Mr Z at all. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 18:52 Xatalos wrote:Welcome, Z-Boson! I'm glad you're being very townish and contributive so far, which means we have one less player out of the lynching table (I didn't like lynching RiseAgain either, but this is a much easier judgement than that). Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 15:35 Z-BosoN wrote:Allright, caught up. What concerns me about Xatalos, as you can see in the spreadsheet is this post: On January 05 2013 22:20 Xatalos wrote:On January 05 2013 15:00 DarthPunk wrote:On January 05 2013 14:52 Hapahauli wrote:On January 05 2013 14:48 DarthPunk wrote:On January 05 2013 14:46 Hapahauli wrote:On January 05 2013 14:45 DarthPunk wrote:
oh and If I had to lynch now and hapa was dead. hmmm. dunno I would need to read more filters. Actually I would wait to vote until something solid comes up. Remember when you called Xatalos scummy as shit? Yeah I guess you forgot about that huh? Yeah. He is. But I am not certain. Holy fuck dude I change my mind and am unsure as a townie with no info on day one. That doesn't sound plausible at all now does it? Yeah, but how the hell did you change your mind so quickly? You just called Xatalos "scummy as shit" barely an hour ago. Then all of a sudden you're unsure again? Holy fuck. What do you not understand about this. I am town. I have no additional info. I have to figure shit out. The way I figure shit out is to have ideas and then alter these ideas with changing info or more thought applied to the problem. Whilst I was flaming with you I was thinking about Xatalos. Now the thing about Xatalos is that he is a pretty bad townie. He likes to sheep and he changes his mind. Changing your mind is a pretty bad thing to do as scum because people such as yourself for some reason view it as scummy, and as scum you don't need to change your mind. You can defend someone you know will flip town and be fully justified in doing that later when he flips. You can also tunnel people as long as they aren't your buddies, and even then you can do so. So changing his mind/sheeping was originally scummy but not with some further thought applied. His list post irks me as all lists post do in general HOWEVER re reading it actually contained decent content and seemed to fit someone trying to figure shit out. Not scummy. So. He is back to null after reevaluation and I need to figure some other shit out. Savvy? Hmm.. Posts like this are the reason why I originally viewed DP as townish. From time to time there are scummy traits in his filter (angriness, contradictions...) but then again, there are many posts where he appears to genuinely try solving the game. For example this earlier post of his: On January 05 2013 06:16 DarthPunk wrote:
I don;t like either of the 'cases' to be perfectly honest.
Rise is completely null to me. And to be honest you are the one picking a fight with rise. There should be one read due to Rises' aggression and that is null. I thought that you were simply following up on him in order to push the town to be active. However you trying to drum up support for a bandwagon based of something that any player of your calibre should KNOW is a null tell is not 'potentially scummy' it IS scummy. and it has me worried.
Since when do you call things 'potentially scummy' anyway??? sounds really fucking off to be honest.
Yeah it was a WTF post from yamato initially. But his explanation, willingness to be open and transparent, and the fact that his original WTF post turned out to be an exercise in an open thought process give me a town read on yamato at this juncture.
And once again I am wondering how the fuck a town hapa is not reaching the same conclusions as myself and is pushing the wagons of two people who are null at worst.
These well thought-out and contentful posts about several players seem like something Mafia would have a hard time doing. Not impossible, of course, but they just fit town agenda a lot better. Combined with DP's relatively high activity and the speed at which the ghost bandwagon for him gained support, I don't really feel comfortable lynching him today. There's also the point that in my experience, a town vs town flamewar is the most obvious explanation for a fight between active players. With that said, there are some things in his filter that I don't like. DP, if you're there, I want your take on the following matters. On January 05 2013 07:04 DarthPunk wrote:What was on top of my agenda was figuring out hapa as you are the scariest player in this game, and if I could get a solid town read on you we could roll these scum. Unfortunately you went retard and or are scum so now I have to deal with a hapa tunnelling me based on On January 05 2013 06:54 Hapahauli wrote:
Straight-up OMGUS and a sprinkle of gut-feeling. You scum brah. All the while I am somehow illogical despite having really solid reasoning and you just ignoring that to serve your OMGUS agenda. Well, that is cool with me HAPA. I don't have to convince you you are scum. I just have to convince the town. And that should be straightforward after this little party we have been having together. I just can't wrap my head around this post. Here's what it basically says: 1) Hapa is the best player in this game 2) He's a retard and/or scum 3) He's definitely scum Where's the coherency and logic in all this? You called me out for switching my opinions in the time of 1-2 hours, but you're switching your opinions even inside the same post... It makes me think this could all be fake reasoning, only aimed at pushing an agenda, not finding the truth. And why is it so bad for Hapa to push weak cases? What it does is create discussion and draw opinions, likely even hints to several players' alignments, and simply there almost CAN'T be any strong cases this early. So it's infinitely better to push a weak case than merely talk policy or semantics. I have a hard time seeing why this makes Hapa scum exactly? - - - Alright. I don't have any strong scumreads at the moment, but... There are two players I'm considering for today. Mr. Cheesecake- Lots of one-liners that add nothing to the thread - So far his only suspect is me, based on my uncertainty about DP... and nothing else to add to the discussion? - A reasonable amount of posts, but basically nothing of value except the (weak) case on me - Generally being quite forgettable and blending in without drawing attention at all yamato77- Voting for Mr. Cheesecake since... why? - Weird logic and reasoning... scrambling for something to back up his opinions? - Practically nothing useful in his (short) filter - Talking almost exclusively about meta/policy/semantics, nothing really meaningful related to this game His bit on DP reads to me as a biiiig over-justification. What is he trying to accomplish on DP? What is the purpose of beggining by stating why DP looks town, and then refuting it? Xatalos, I'd like you to better explain this post, so I can better understand where you are coming from. The reason I have conflicting arguments about DP's alignment is because I have conflicting feelings about him. Some posts he seems townish, some posts scummy. By the way, he still hasn't responded to any of my questions earlier... Even though he has posted a reasonable amount since then. That doesn't make me feel too good about him, but it's not like we're lynching him anyways (there are so many people who are hiding in plain sight compared to him), so I'd rather not focus on him for now. It's true that MrZentor has been quite passive and non-contributing, but he was somewhat like this in Paranoia Mafia as well (and he was town). And I got a townish feel from the discussion we had earlier in the thread. I don't feel like he's a good lynch. I said I was ready to vote for Mr. Cheesecake, but somehow I don't feel like it's a sufficiently justifiable lynch. He's had some townish posting lately and my read on him wasn't strong to begin with. But there's someone else I want to discuss... ShiaoPiThe first thing that doesn't seem right is this post: Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:14 ShiaoPi wrote:Hmm looks like RiseAgain has still not responded.... Anyway moving onto the matters more at hand for now. I don't think that DP or Hapa are scum, it feels much more like townies at each others throats for minor things. While I can see where both are coming from during the exchange I does kind of worry me that DP does not follow up with a vote as Hapa does. Does not seem to fit when he calls him scum more than once earlier. @Mr.CC Xatalos is kind of a lynchbait in itself. He is not that easy to read (at least for me), but what I have seen so far from him does not really convince me on his scumminess. From time to time he does these 180-turns but usually it is because he lays his entire thoughtprocess out and therefore every nook and turn of his mind is in the thread. He is nullish right now. I want to see more from RiseAgain, so ##Vote: RiseAgainget in here and do something please! I agree with his points about Hapa/DP and myself, but then comes the weird "pressure" vote. It reminds me so much of an earlier game where one Mafia player made a similar pressure vote without ANY conviction. There's even a double (over?)justification for this vote (I want to see more from him - VOTE - do something please). It feels like just a ploy to appear scumhunting with pressure, but that pressure is so weak and apologetic that it doesn't look like he even tried to accomplish anything. It's just all too indifferent about gaining any new information and basically voting for the sake of having voted. Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:26 ShiaoPi wrote:
Right now I am torn between the two of jaybrundage and yamato77.
More tending towards yamato77 for his meltdown in logic as jaybrundage has done nothing, which is bad but not necessarily scum Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:26 ShiaoPi wrote:
EBWOP: oh and someone I would be more reluctant to lynch but could agree to is DP Just listing possible lynch candidates without much (or any in DP's case) reasoning, and putting his foot pre-emptively in a lot of bandwagons. Not advancing the thread, not scumhunting, merely agreeing to lynch several players. Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
I am interested currently in these people:
yamato
Xatalos
MrZ
yamato:
There are many things which would probably be me reiterating stuff that was mentioned (discrepancy in behaviour as hapa said). Not being really present, throwing votes around with little reasoning. But that can be explained by his lack of time due to RL business. could really use more analysis and reasoning from him.
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait. That is because he is hesitating a lot, laying out a lot of his thoughts in the thread and therefore opening himself up for harsh critique if he changes his mind and posts it. His lack of any stance is alarming though. While it is somewhat just his playstyle (IIRC) I still dislike it a lot, I mean day 1 has been going for quite a long time now already, while we did not get more information through lynching there is still a lot of content to search through and find something.
MrZ:
He is useless, which is stupidly just his meta with the lightheartedness he has shown. I don't like useless people but cannot condemn him based on this.
Actually I started this post with wanting to lynch into Xata/yamato preferrably yamato but now that I am writing those reads feel just unsatisfying...There is nothing really much that distinguishes one option from the other. I am reluctant to lynch yamato since he seems legitimately busy, also relcutant to lynch Xata for just playing as he does (same goes for MrZ).
Somehow this day 1 has not been really productive >_> All of his stances are neutral and weak. Although it's a bit hypocritical since I've been hesitant as well, but when he was town in our earlier game together, he had VERY strong opinions and even hard defended a scum until he actually flipped red. When he was Mafia, he was very quiet and vague. This just feels like much more fitting his scum meta, although it's not a huge pool of evidence.With this, I'm actually much more confident in ShiaoPi being scum than Mr. Cheesecake. It's also late in the day, so I guess it's about time to finally cast a vote. ##Vote ShiaoPi OMG TAKE A STANCE ON SOMETHING INSTEAD OF DISCREDITING YOUR OWN READ + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 19:36 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 19:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am voting you now because:
-flip flopping on DP in some logical inconsistencies earlier
-not committing at all earlier
-writing a terribly bad case for the sake of writing one to get some pressure off yourself.
call it OMGUS if you want, I don't think so.
Also you have been on my hitlist now, Zentor is not around so I cannot ask him stuff right now, I just asked yamato a bunch of stuff earlier. Leaving you and with that crap contribution you look like the best option for today's lynch When was I under pressure...? I've just been trying find someone scummier than Mr. Cheesecake, but it's not an easy job, considering the relatively low activity and the high amount of townish/nullish players. There are many things in your filter that strike me as suspicious (mentioned earlier), and even though they're partly intuition and not solid proof, it's better than Mr. Cheesecake in my eyes (he started off under the radar but has had some engagement since then). Why are you actively seeking to stop pressuring me?? Apparently anybody will do for this lynch despite your null reads on everybody. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2013 21:27 ShiaoPi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 20:05 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:41 ShiaoPi wrote:On January 06 2013 19:36 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am voting you now because:
-flip flopping on DP in some logical inconsistencies earlier
-not committing at all earlier
-writing a terribly bad case for the sake of writing one to get some pressure off yourself.
call it OMGUS if you want, I don't think so.
Also you have been on my hitlist now, Zentor is not around so I cannot ask him stuff right now, I just asked yamato a bunch of stuff earlier. Leaving you and with that crap contribution you look like the best option for today's lynch When was I under pressure...? I've just been trying find someone scummier than Mr. Cheesecake, but it's not an easy job, considering the relatively low activity and the high amount of townish/nullish players. There are many things in your filter that strike me as suspicious (mentioned earlier), and even though they're partly intuition and not solid proof, it's better than Mr. Cheesecake in my eyes (he started off under the radar but has had some engagement since then). Several people have mentioned you as a possible lynch candidate that qualifies as under pressure. I would really be interested in those "many things" in my filter that are suspicious, I already answered the ones you quoted earlier. Please show them to me, I don't even know where you find them. Anyway I am out for dinner now. See you later. Okay... I guess that counts as pressure, although I haven't been even remotely in a dangerous spot until now. But this always happens to me when I'm town at some point, so I'm not too worried yet. Are you saying you were really pressuring RiseAgain? I just can't see anything but a weak fake pressure in that. Merely voting for someone without any actual pressure doesn't count as pressure. Some other players in this game have thrown away weak votes as well, but at least they tried to create some pressure. You didn't even try - the opposite, you openly said it was only an empty vote beforehand. Why were you suddenly okay with lynching DP when he started to gain a bandwagon for himself? All I can see is an opportunistic (yet extremely vague) move to potentially get rid of an active player. And when the bandwagon started to crumble, you suddenly dropped him from your suspects without saying a word about it. It feels like you're just trying to get someone lynched, and it doesn't really matter who. So I am back. Where did I say I was really pressuring Rise? I clearly said it was to get him to post, since I had questions for him, that I wanted to answer. It is blatantly clear in my filter.
I was not "suddenly" okay with lynching DP, stop misrepresenting facts. Mr.CC asked me who my other possible candidates were. That was after the first episode of DP/Hapa-shitfest but before the entire wagon on him started. I was active during the increasing pressure on DP, being part of it myself, before I had to leave cause of RL matters. How is it opportunistic for me to be one of the persons being there while the pressure added up, when I really thought that he might be red?? The bandwagon started to crumble because DP was doing some really townish posts, thing is I was not in the thread at that time. As soon as I was back und caught up I removed DP from my hitlist as he was much more townie now. I did not want to bloat my post with the DP matter again, when it was not part of the trending discussion in the thread, but I did "say a word" about it.... Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
-snip- I for sure care who gets lynched, seriously are you even reading this thread? I clearly stated which persons I want to lynch during varying times already. I'm confused Batman. Pressure votes get ppl to post and stuff -- why are you saying you're not pressuring him? This post is basically just a summary of events also, useless kk. What are your conclusions? You just read in a biased way, but you don't draw any conclusions whatsoever. There's nothing anyone can defend or support to. This is an useless effort. Well you asked me to give my thoughts on the last few pages. And there you go. I don't draw any conclusions because it's just what I was thinking. So yes, it is pretty useless, but it pushes whatever I was thinking at the time out there. Yes, but what are your conclusions? I'm rather interested in hearing them. Conclusions? I hate Yamato's reasoning for voting Mr. Z. Could be scum trying to push the easiest player to lynch. (Mr. Z is an easy target, he even says it himself). SP OMGUS votes Xatalos even though he "isn't sure" about lynching anybody. I'm actually not sure if it's a town reaction or scum reaction. Maybe you can provide some insight on this. Xatalos still scummy as hell, not committing on reads, and discrediting his own when he has them. That's a conclusion, but I don't see your reasoning, and I can't figure out from your other post how you've reached them. Be clear here. Why do you hate yamato's reasoning for voting Mr.Z?. Do you hate the reasoning itself - not showing interest in who gets lynched - or how he ignores comments and remarks on mr.Z's meta?
I'll respond to this in a few
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On January 06 2013 18:49 yamato77 wrote:Is the only reason you want to lynch him is that he's useless? That's the only thing his meta might excuse but I think there are other parts of his play that are scummy. As I've mentioned before he's advocated the idea that we should be deciding on a lynch by now, which is in opposition to the town-favored idea Hapa put forth that we should allow more time for ourselves so that we don't end up mislynching. Indeed so far that has been good, because we haven't done anything rash or stupid just because we felt we had to decide on someone to kill. Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 09:37 MrZentor wrote:
Also, dragging days out will lead to decreased interest in the game by town, increasing inactivity, and generally making things easier for scum.
Days should be 48-72 hours. He's expressed this sentiment multiple times since this initial post in the form of troll votes and acts of impatience. He's pushing town toward making a bad decision which is something I do not think we should be doing. 1.) Only scum would want to advocate this idea.Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 07:21 MrZentor wrote:
I will use my hammer vote as soon as I possibly can.
It's unlikely that scum will want to have the final vote on somebody, because it will put them under a lot of scrutiny. This post here he looks like he's setting himself up for making the hammer vote on a player, and then calling himself town for doing it. 2.)And again he's advocating the idea that quick hammer lynches are a good thing when they only benefit scum.Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 11:23 MrZentor wrote:
There's too little information to make an accurate lynch first day; we're just wasting time by delaying it. 3.)Here he bemoans day 1 as useless and says we should lynch someone. He doesn't have any good ideas of who to lynch, nor has he helped make day 1 more useful, he just wants to kill someone. Apathy about who is lynched is a scummy trait. So basically instead of being pro-town and scum hunting, or even offering up a scum read, he's given town reads on people and told us all to lynch someone quickly. 4.) He's playing anti town.
Okay so Z-BosoN wanted me to explain why I didn't like Yamato's reasoning for voting Mr. Z.
Yamato gives 3 reasons we should lynch Mr. Z, and I can't agree with any of them.
1.) Only scum would advocate the idea of an artificial deadline? I really cannot agree with that. Hell, I said we should wrap things up at the 72 hour mark. Attacking Mr. Z for it is a super easy thing to do because its *cough* "not in towns interest", but in reality it's not a scummy thing to suggest at all especially for day 1.
2.) Quick hammer lynches do benefit scum, yes, if the guy flips town. If Mr. Z wants to quick hammer vote that's his choice, and he should know he could be lynched for it. It's kind of just an opinion thing, not really something that's a scummy idea.
3.) Pretty much the same point as number 1: Mr.Z doesn't want to spend a week on day 1. I don't think Mr. Z is just saying "let's lynch anybody, who cares!" but rather "let's not dwell on it for too long, make your best educated guess". Too much time = second guessing ourselves = confusion = scum environment. At least that's what I get out of it.
4.) Mr. Z is playing anti-town by refusing to scumhunt and being generally inactive. And I would agree on this at the time of Yamato's post. Since this post, he's presented at least (at little) evidence of who he wants to lynch and why.
Didn't really care for Yamato's arguements because they could be from either alignment and focus on Mr. Z's lack of confidence in D1. It seems like a really easy case to make. Either way, I just didn't see it as a strong case.
Also, Xatalos took my bait. I told him to vote me cus I was totes scummy:
On January 07 2013 05:43 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
@Xatalos
Obviously nobody likes your vote on Yamato. I'm pretty scummy right now - just look at the horrible stream of consciousness post. You've had it in for me all game. You totes want to lynch me right now. Jay does too, and Hapa thinks I'm totes a scumster. Maybe I could die today.
So he does it: LOL
On January 07 2013 06:55 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 06:17 Hapahauli wrote:On January 07 2013 06:14 Xatalos wrote:On January 07 2013 06:02 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Xatalos
You mentioned that your vote would end up on yamato, Shaio, or CC today. A process of elimination read on yamato makes absolutely no sense when you have other potential lynch candidates. What are your current thoughts on Shaio and CC? Mr. Cheesecake: he's had good engagement with the thread lately, but he hasn't actually done much. Much of his posting is just fluff or nearly fluff, like the stream of thought post for example. It doesn't feel like he wants to really affect the thread, more like comment on things of his choosing and follow along... It could very well be Mafia. I'm definitely pro-lynch on him. ShiaoPi: still concerned about his fake pressure, OMGUS vote on me, relative lack of contribution etc. I can easily see his filter from a Mafia perspective, unlike several other players (Hapahauli, MrZentor, jaybrundage). It all comes down to what's realistic. It's starting to look like ShiaoPi is not, Mr. Cheesecake and yamato77 may well be. So I'm not pushing for ShiaoPi to be lynched right now. I need less general statements and more specific analysis. Lynching based on realism = not good. Who is your top scumread based on behaviour alone and why? Let's pretend for a minute that everyone, is up on the block, and you control who the town is going to lynch. Who are you going to lynch? If I had absolute power over the thread, I would lynch Mr. Cheesecake right now. Between his fluffy and passive opening game, constant lack of taking real stances and his recent weird and fluffy posts, he isn't much of a contributor or even a presence in the flow of the thread. Even considering his relatively good activity and engagement in several topics. I have to leave now for a quite lenghty period of time, so I'm torn about what to do. I guess I'll just have to leave it up to fate and hope I'm not lynched when I get back. ##Unvote yamato77
##Vote Mr. Cheesecake
Okay so let me be clear about this: Xatalos wants to lynch Yamato because he's scummy, scummier than I at least. He previously states that he doesn't want to lynch me and that I've been a decent contributor as of late and I've stepped up from my original lurky play. He says I've got some townish posts. (Just look through his filter for it, it's kind of spread out in there). Why the sudden disinterest in Yamato? Hmmmmmm?
Nobody wants to sheep the Yamato vote, but Hapa expresses his distaste in me, and suddenly VOTE CHEESECAKE.
He doesn't care who is lynched. Me or Yamato would do, he's just looking for whoever he can get peoples votes on.
##Vote: Xatalos
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On January 07 2013 08:19 jaybrundage wrote:
Ok can we lynch cc now
Yeah he seems scummy imo
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I'm just concerned why Yamato shows up randomly and hammers... and then Jay's like can we lynch cc now lol
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On January 07 2013 08:25 jaybrundage wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 08:21 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
I'm just concerned why Yamato shows up randomly and hammers... and then Jay's like can we lynch cc now lol Because im pretty confident your scum.
Tell me why - besides my "lack of cases"
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DP didn't you think I was town and stuff?
Also, how did you suddenly think Xatalos was town?
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On January 07 2013 09:06 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 08:55 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
DP didn't you think I was town and stuff?
Also, how did you suddenly think Xatalos was town? Yeah I did think you were town. But your posts ever since that stream of conciousness post changed my mind. I thought Xatalos was town because many, many times it was stated in the thread exactly why people thought he was scummy. And what did he do? he continued to do those exact things in the pursuit of other players. I.E. He didn't give a fuck about looking scummy, which is not something I would expect newbie scum to pull. He also changed his mind a lot even though he knew it would get him in trouble. after CASES were being made about that very thing he continued to do it. Didn't care about being scummy. = Town Didn't alter his play when it was obviously getting him into shit = Town Continued to pursue his reads with the whole thread calling him out for them = Town So yeah. By the end I think it was fairly obvious that Xatalos was town. I don't really blame people for voting for him. I just wish I had gotten up in time to change things.
What posts are it? How did they change your mind? You were pretty sure I was town. You were also pretty sure Xatalos was scummy, and did nothing to prevent his lynch. In fact, you just told them both to fight. Now you come in here right after he's lynched, conveniently, and 180 your read on both of us?
Seems a bit odd.
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Oh hey there Hapa. I've got a few mins to chat, what's up?
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On January 08 2013 04:31 Hapahauli wrote:
In school right now - interested to hear a reply to dp's case, as well as scumreads
In terms of DP's case.. It's alright. He's wrong, but I'm pretty scummy and much of the argument does hold water. However, I'm fairly disinterested with the pressure on me right now. I don't think I'll be lynched tomorrow, and I won't sit here and waste time deflecting every point brought against me. We can all settle on the fact that I'm super scummy right now, and that's fine with me.
Yamato concerns me right now.
There was his voting behavior early game and his Mr. Z case, but I won't restate all of it. I want to hear his reasoning behind his hammer vote.
Here is his second to last post:
On January 07 2013 06:16 yamato77 wrote:
I'll be back later.
Don't lynch someone until I get back.
"Alright guys, I care about who is lynch, so don't lynch nobody until I get back and we can make a rational decision"
And then he comes back to hours later right at the time Xatalos has 4 votes.
On January 07 2013 08:11 yamato77 wrote:
It seems like other people are seeing what I saw in Xatalos with his case in Shiao and vote on CC.
The dude doesn't really care where he votes, he gives weak justifications and has continually changed his reads over the course of the game on a moment's notice to fit his agenda.
It's enough for me to see him hang.
##Vote: Xatalos
What part of this mirrors his previous post? I don't understand his rational in hammering so quickly. Supposedly, he wants to take things slow, so people don't make the wrong decision. But he doesn't even consult the thread before he comes back in and hammers. Yes, he had a scumread on Xatalos. Cool. But -- what was the purpose in hammering so quickly?
Yamato, you've been a fairly inactive force in this thread. I want you to talk -- now.
Trying to wrap my head around Jay / SP right now. Will get back in a while.
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On January 08 2013 05:04 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 04:59 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 04:31 Hapahauli wrote:
In school right now - interested to hear a reply to dp's case, as well as scumreads In terms of DP's case.. It's alright. He's wrong, but I'm pretty scummy and much of the argument does hold water. However, I'm fairly disinterested with the pressure on me right now. I don't think I'll be lynched tomorrow, and I won't sit here and waste time deflecting every point brought against me. We can all settle on the fact that I'm super scummy right now, and that's fine with me. I would like you to be concerned, because I'm interested in hearing you defend what looks like a reasonable case against you.
His main point is that I just "heap shit on weak players". I don't know how you'd like me to defend that, because it's true. Some people need shit heaped on them to start doing stuff. Most of it is based on my shitty stream post, which, as all indicates, heaps shit on players. I heap some shit here and there, it's all fine. I want answers. And if you have to dig your way out that's perfectly fine with me.
The thread has been pathetically inactive for how long the game has been going. If I have to make myself seem scummy to generate some sort of response, well here we have it.
Problem is, I haven't heard from players that are really concerning like SP or Yamato.
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On January 08 2013 05:23 Hapahauli wrote:
Making yourself look scummy to elicit a response is not good town play. Are you suggesting you've been posting with this hidden intention?
Also, you can generate discussion without looking bad.
Lol it's not a hidden intention. But apparently it's a side effect that was somehow generated one way or the other.
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ShiaoPi is a chronic defender. He spends more time defending / justifying himself than he does actually being useful.
+ Show Spoiler +On January 04 2013 12:06 ShiaoPi wrote:
Well I am trying not to be lurky, but sometimes shit does come up, so I cannot gurantee being much more active than usually.
@MrZentor:
I agree on your point of just having general guidelines instead of a limit by which the vote must happen. While we should use the additional time we have, I don't like setting up something definite, it just gives scum an easier way to move in a set frame. On January 05 2013 14:07 ShiaoPi wrote:
@Jay:
I am doing a pressure vote on Rise since his last post seemed to me as if he would just be gone for a couple of hours before popping back into the thread, as he has not done so, I believe myself justified well enough, since I have questions for him that I want answered.
I think you got ninja'ed by me during writing your post. I did give out a stancee on his posting. I also fail to see how I have tried to lie low in this game....
Your case seems really weak to me.
/shrug On January 05 2013 14:28 ShiaoPi wrote:
@Jay:
I said that the exchange they had read kind of townish. But that I disliked DP's reluctance to vote. Xatalos is null just as easy as that.
Read that post again please.
I clearly said that DP is the weaker read of the two and that his behaviour does not add up. My thoughtprocess is right in that post.
With all that is happening in thread right now I am tending towards lynching DP, but I would really hear more from Rise and yamato On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait.
-snip-
On January 06 2013 17:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I do scumhunt, just because I am not writing a case on anything that moves does not mean I am not doing it...
Boson is pretty much town in my eyes, no reason to share his spreadsheet with his thoughts lined out with us if he were scum. Also he has directly started to scumhunt as soon as he replaced in, gets lots of towniepoints from me.
CC is someone I don't want to lynch today, you may think him scummy for not making a shitton of cases but that is just a difference in playstyle imo. Looking through his filter he is actively trying to get more information out of people by asking questions promoting discussing. What I dislike is parking his vote on MrZ but that is nothing to be honest.
On January 06 2013 19:11 ShiaoPi wrote:
@yamato:
While I like you doing more analysis, there is some stuff I do not agree with. Especially the first post you quoted with the guidelines on time. Hapa actually wanted a self-imposed deadline of 72h, which is something I did not agree to. So taking that quote from Zentor out of context makes it seem as it were all the time pushing for lynching somebody to end it the day. That is simply wrong. I can also sympathise with his sentiment that we really should start consolidating on someone by now. A much longer day 1 has negative effect on us imo.
You are right when you say that his play is not necessarily pro-town by now. But I can understand where he comes from to a certain degree, which explains why I said earlier that I am torn on all my candidates for today's lynch.
@Xatalos:
Nice that you have popped in, but not only are you dead wrong on me but your case is crap. I expected more than cherrypicking my filter for bits you can build something on.
I cannot even fathom how you critisize me for putting a vote on Rise as pressure when he had done jackshit at that moment.
The next two quotes are an answer to a question I was asked to. I was asked who the other options of mine were, I responded. Don't even see what is wrong with them as if you have studied my filter it is pretty clear why I listed each of them.
Now towards my stances being neutral and weak is stupid as shit. I posted my thoughts on the players I found suspicious at the moment and pressured them when they were around see the entire dialogue between me and yamato just above.
As icing on the cake you take a game from almost half a year back (which was also one of my newbie games) as a "meta-argument". That is a nice example of false usage of meta-arguments. If you want to study my meta at least take the most recent game in which I was town (which is LVII if I recall correctly) and compare it to this game...
This is just terribly bad and feels forced.
##vote: Xatalos On January 06 2013 21:27 ShiaoPi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 20:05 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:41 ShiaoPi wrote:On January 06 2013 19:36 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am voting you now because:
-flip flopping on DP in some logical inconsistencies earlier
-not committing at all earlier
-writing a terribly bad case for the sake of writing one to get some pressure off yourself.
call it OMGUS if you want, I don't think so.
Also you have been on my hitlist now, Zentor is not around so I cannot ask him stuff right now, I just asked yamato a bunch of stuff earlier. Leaving you and with that crap contribution you look like the best option for today's lynch When was I under pressure...? I've just been trying find someone scummier than Mr. Cheesecake, but it's not an easy job, considering the relatively low activity and the high amount of townish/nullish players. There are many things in your filter that strike me as suspicious (mentioned earlier), and even though they're partly intuition and not solid proof, it's better than Mr. Cheesecake in my eyes (he started off under the radar but has had some engagement since then). Several people have mentioned you as a possible lynch candidate that qualifies as under pressure. I would really be interested in those "many things" in my filter that are suspicious, I already answered the ones you quoted earlier. Please show them to me, I don't even know where you find them. Anyway I am out for dinner now. See you later. Okay... I guess that counts as pressure, although I haven't been even remotely in a dangerous spot until now. But this always happens to me when I'm town at some point, so I'm not too worried yet. Are you saying you were really pressuring RiseAgain? I just can't see anything but a weak fake pressure in that. Merely voting for someone without any actual pressure doesn't count as pressure. Some other players in this game have thrown away weak votes as well, but at least they tried to create some pressure. You didn't even try - the opposite, you openly said it was only an empty vote beforehand. Why were you suddenly okay with lynching DP when he started to gain a bandwagon for himself? All I can see is an opportunistic (yet extremely vague) move to potentially get rid of an active player. And when the bandwagon started to crumble, you suddenly dropped him from your suspects without saying a word about it. It feels like you're just trying to get someone lynched, and it doesn't really matter who. So I am back. Where did I say I was really pressuring Rise? I clearly said it was to get him to post, since I had questions for him, that I wanted to answer. It is blatantly clear in my filter.
I was not "suddenly" okay with lynching DP, stop misrepresenting facts. Mr.CC asked me who my other possible candidates were. That was after the first episode of DP/Hapa-shitfest but before the entire wagon on him started. I was active during the increasing pressure on DP, being part of it myself, before I had to leave cause of RL matters. How is it opportunistic for me to be one of the persons being there while the pressure added up, when I really thought that he might be red??
The bandwagon started to crumble because DP was doing some really townish posts, thing is I was not in the thread at that time. As soon as I was back und caught up I removed DP from my hitlist as he was much more townie now. I did not want to bloat my post with the DP matter again, when it was not part of the trending discussion in the thread, but I did "say a word" about it....Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
-snip- I for sure care who gets lynched, seriously are you even reading this thread? I clearly stated which persons I want to lynch during varying times already.
He seems pretty paranoid and feels the need to defend himself at every juncture. Frequently he references his past posts to justify his actions and explain them. Take a look at his vote for Xatalos, for example. He basically just calls him bad, defends himself hardcore, and then votes.
The symptoms of a guilty conscience, perhaps?
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@DP
I get that you think I'm scum and all, but curious, who is your second scum read besides me? Who is my potential scumbuddy?
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And what happens when i flip town, darth?
Expected response: you won't
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Let's just think about why you guys believe I'm scummy: Because I'm open about all of my reads and call people out on shit. I'm taking stances and trying to read people. Scummy? Perhaps in the way I was going about it. Does it mean I'm scum? No. And you really should consider that before you all suddenly vote me tomorrow. Scum will definitely want to push this lynch. At least give a suitable amount of discussion time; the day better not end super friggen quickly with my town flip.
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Scum could easily fake claim being roleblocked btw. So its not fool proof.
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I do think the named vt should claim. Roleblock claims are iffy. Hapa dies tomorrow night anyway so they arent in danger of NK really.
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Z-bo, what do you want to know about me and SP? I'm right here *waves*
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On January 08 2013 08:22 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 08:17 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
I do think the named vt should claim. Roleblock claims are iffy. Hapa dies tomorrow night anyway so they arent in danger of NK really. how the fuck are roleblock claims iffy? and how do you know hapa will die tomorrow night?
Because scum can fakeclaim being roleblocked? I've seen my scumbuddy do it in my only scumgame.
And because doctors can't heal the same target twice. This is assuming Hapa was shot, of course. I'm pretty sure he was and protected, it's the easiest explanation. What doctor wouldn't protect Hapa?
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On January 08 2013 08:23 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 08:17 Hapahauli wrote:On January 08 2013 08:15 Z-BosoN wrote:
So you are. Don't go ahead and disappear. I want to discuss ShiaoPi and CC with you. Why me? Discuss them with the rest of the thread. I'm the last person you should be asking the opinion of right now - I'm obv-town. We need to hear answers from others to determine their alignment. So what? Asking opinions is a good way to find scum, but it also adds information. I actually think the opposite, since you are 99% town right now, you should dish out as much info as you can, as it's almost guaranteed non-bullshit. I can understand your view this game due to inactiveness, but I don't want you to go full inactive (dunno if that's what you plan to do). @Mr.CCIt's cause I think Hapa is wrong on you and wrong on ShiaoPi. Since you are right here - let me ask you this, do you think DP is scum?
I don't like the fact that he just shows up randomly minutes after the lynch and 180's his reads on me and Xatalos. It doesn't make him scum, though. He's one of the more townier people so I definitely wouldn't lynch him today.
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On January 08 2013 08:26 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 08:24 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 08:22 DarthPunk wrote:On January 08 2013 08:17 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
I do think the named vt should claim. Roleblock claims are iffy. Hapa dies tomorrow night anyway so they arent in danger of NK really. how the fuck are roleblock claims iffy? and how do you know hapa will die tomorrow night? Because scum can fakeclaim being roleblocked? I've seen my scumbuddy do it in my only scumgame. And because doctors can't heal the same target twice. This is assuming Hapa was shot, of course. I'm pretty sure he was and protected, it's the easiest explanation. What doctor wouldn't protect Hapa? If scum fakes roleblock claim, the named VT will know it's bullshit.
Oh wow i didn't think of that. Cool. nvm dont claim named vt
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On January 08 2013 08:28 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 08:26 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: On January 08 2013 08:23 Z-BosoN wrote:On January 08 2013 08:17 Hapahauli wrote:On January 08 2013 08:15 Z-BosoN wrote:
So you are. Don't go ahead and disappear. I want to discuss ShiaoPi and CC with you. Why me? Discuss them with the rest of the thread. I'm the last person you should be asking the opinion of right now - I'm obv-town. We need to hear answers from others to determine their alignment. So what? Asking opinions is a good way to find scum, but it also adds information. I actually think the opposite, since you are 99% town right now, you should dish out as much info as you can, as it's almost guaranteed non-bullshit. I can understand your view this game due to inactiveness, but I don't want you to go full inactive (dunno if that's what you plan to do). @Mr.CCIt's cause I think Hapa is wrong on you and wrong on ShiaoPi. Since you are right here - let me ask you this, do you think DP is scum? I don't like the fact that he just shows up randomly minutes after the lynch and 180's his reads on me and Xatalos. It doesn't make him scum, though. He's one of the more townier people so I definitely wouldn't lynch him today. When did I reverse my read on Xatalos? I never thought you a strong town to begin with, and I like DP's case a lot. Please answer my questions I showed up because I got caught up in traffic. Why would I make a post saying I'd post my reads before deadline and not do so? Do you doubt this? If not, what's the point of asking?
Wtf are you talking about? DP 180'd his reads. Not you. I just answered your question.
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On January 08 2013 08:29 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 08:24 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 08:22 DarthPunk wrote:On January 08 2013 08:17 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
I do think the named vt should claim. Roleblock claims are iffy. Hapa dies tomorrow night anyway so they arent in danger of NK really. how the fuck are roleblock claims iffy? and how do you know hapa will die tomorrow night? Because scum can fakeclaim being roleblocked? I've seen my scumbuddy do it in my only scumgame. And because doctors can't heal the same target twice. This is assuming Hapa was shot, of course. I'm pretty sure he was and protected, it's the easiest explanation. What doctor wouldn't protect Hapa? What scum would shoot hapa in a setup in which it's quite likely he is protected? For that reason it is entirely plausible that both scum and the medic chose a secondary target.
Because the former is far more likely. Either way it's pointless to discuss, so let's end it.
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On January 08 2013 08:33 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 08:26 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: On January 08 2013 08:23 Z-BosoN wrote:On January 08 2013 08:17 Hapahauli wrote:On January 08 2013 08:15 Z-BosoN wrote:
So you are. Don't go ahead and disappear. I want to discuss ShiaoPi and CC with you. Why me? Discuss them with the rest of the thread. I'm the last person you should be asking the opinion of right now - I'm obv-town. We need to hear answers from others to determine their alignment. So what? Asking opinions is a good way to find scum, but it also adds information. I actually think the opposite, since you are 99% town right now, you should dish out as much info as you can, as it's almost guaranteed non-bullshit. I can understand your view this game due to inactiveness, but I don't want you to go full inactive (dunno if that's what you plan to do). @Mr.CCIt's cause I think Hapa is wrong on you and wrong on ShiaoPi. Since you are right here - let me ask you this, do you think DP is scum? I don't like the fact that he just shows up randomly minutes after the lynch and 180's his reads on me and Xatalos. It doesn't make him scum, though. He's one of the more townier people so I definitely wouldn't lynch him today. So wishy washy. Yeah I don;t agree with hapa's town read on you. like I would have earlier but you have actually contributed nothing whilst appearing active and townish. That is the hallmark of non useless scum play. Look town, contribute nothing substantial and find a mislynch in a group of several weaker players. Check, Check and Check.
Your confirmation bias is stunning. You haven't done anything this game but argue with Hapa, let the Xatalos lynch happen, and then proceed to tunnel me blindly.
Everyone keeps saying I'm not contributing when I've actually given reads and comments on a bunch of people. Seriously. If you are town, proceed to find scum instead of beating my mislynch into the ground.
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On January 08 2013 08:34 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 08:29 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 08:28 Z-BosoN wrote:On January 08 2013 08:26 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: On January 08 2013 08:23 Z-BosoN wrote:On January 08 2013 08:17 Hapahauli wrote:On January 08 2013 08:15 Z-BosoN wrote:
So you are. Don't go ahead and disappear. I want to discuss ShiaoPi and CC with you. Why me? Discuss them with the rest of the thread. I'm the last person you should be asking the opinion of right now - I'm obv-town. We need to hear answers from others to determine their alignment. So what? Asking opinions is a good way to find scum, but it also adds information. I actually think the opposite, since you are 99% town right now, you should dish out as much info as you can, as it's almost guaranteed non-bullshit. I can understand your view this game due to inactiveness, but I don't want you to go full inactive (dunno if that's what you plan to do). @Mr.CCIt's cause I think Hapa is wrong on you and wrong on ShiaoPi. Since you are right here - let me ask you this, do you think DP is scum? I don't like the fact that he just shows up randomly minutes after the lynch and 180's his reads on me and Xatalos. It doesn't make him scum, though. He's one of the more townier people so I definitely wouldn't lynch him today. When did I reverse my read on Xatalos? I never thought you a strong town to begin with, and I like DP's case a lot. Please answer my questions I showed up because I got caught up in traffic. Why would I make a post saying I'd post my reads before deadline and not do so? Do you doubt this? If not, what's the point of asking? Wtf are you talking about? DP 180'd his reads. Not you. I just answered your question. Derp. My mistake. I'd like you to be clearer on your read of him, though. Why is he one of the townier people?
He's townier simply because their are scummier people. I'm starting to rethink my read on him simply because he's providing nothing to town other than tunneling me for "not contributing". I need to read SP and Yamato better due to this.
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I'm here too. I'll answer anything but I'm working atm.
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How natural do I find what? His town reads on me and DP?
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@Z-Bo
His town read on me is nothing special. It basically boils down to me being open and carefree. Problem is, I'm like that every game. If I was scum, I would emulate that to the max. It doesn't really say much to credit me town imo. The thing about Yamato and Xatalos wasn't convincing that I was townie. The only thing that should scream townie to him, imo, is my general reaction to the thread.
His town read on DP I think is genuine. In Witchcraft I believe that's exactly how he judged people, and I think it's how he's judging people this game including me and DP.
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On January 08 2013 09:53 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 09:43 DarthPunk wrote:
@ Yamato. You have a lot of experience playing with CC don't you? how would you say his play this game correlates to his previous games with you?
@ ZB have you dramatically altered your playstyle since the last time we played together? This is certainly not the town meta I remember from you. I've only played with town CC so I haven't seen his scum meta but this game doesn't look like the games I played with him. For one, he hasn't outright called me scum yet, he's actually defended me. Two, he doesn't seem active or invested like he usually does. Like I've said before, I have had a town read on him but it isn't strong, and it's quickly degrading. As for my top scum read, I still don't like Zentor for his play day 1 and he hasn't done anything to change that. I'm going to put some time into reading filters more carefully and see if I can see things more clearly.
I've been calling you out for shit, apparently you haven't noticed? I wanted to LYNCH you day 1. I defended you a tad d1 and that's it.
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On January 08 2013 09:57 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 09:55 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 09:53 yamato77 wrote:On January 08 2013 09:43 DarthPunk wrote:
@ Yamato. You have a lot of experience playing with CC don't you? how would you say his play this game correlates to his previous games with you?
@ ZB have you dramatically altered your playstyle since the last time we played together? This is certainly not the town meta I remember from you. I've only played with town CC so I haven't seen his scum meta but this game doesn't look like the games I played with him. For one, he hasn't outright called me scum yet, he's actually defended me. Two, he doesn't seem active or invested like he usually does. Like I've said before, I have had a town read on him but it isn't strong, and it's quickly degrading. As for my top scum read, I still don't like Zentor for his play day 1 and he hasn't done anything to change that. I'm going to put some time into reading filters more carefully and see if I can see things more clearly. I've been calling you out for shit, apparently you haven't noticed? I wanted to LYNCH you day 1. I defended you a tad d1 and that's it. You've been saying the same things Hapa was. I don't see any reason to attach those questions to your thought process.
Wait what? I still never defended you besides me saying "Yamato is being Yamato". Also, how can you say I don't seem as active? I'm as active if not more active than in my previous games with you with the exception of the first half of D1. You are straight up lying.
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On January 08 2013 10:08 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 10:03 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 09:57 yamato77 wrote:On January 08 2013 09:55 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 09:53 yamato77 wrote:On January 08 2013 09:43 DarthPunk wrote:
@ Yamato. You have a lot of experience playing with CC don't you? how would you say his play this game correlates to his previous games with you?
@ ZB have you dramatically altered your playstyle since the last time we played together? This is certainly not the town meta I remember from you. I've only played with town CC so I haven't seen his scum meta but this game doesn't look like the games I played with him. For one, he hasn't outright called me scum yet, he's actually defended me. Two, he doesn't seem active or invested like he usually does. Like I've said before, I have had a town read on him but it isn't strong, and it's quickly degrading. As for my top scum read, I still don't like Zentor for his play day 1 and he hasn't done anything to change that. I'm going to put some time into reading filters more carefully and see if I can see things more clearly. I've been calling you out for shit, apparently you haven't noticed? I wanted to LYNCH you day 1. I defended you a tad d1 and that's it. You've been saying the same things Hapa was. I don't see any reason to attach those questions to your thought process. Wait what? I still never defended you besides me saying "Yamato is being Yamato". Also, how can you say I don't seem as active? I'm as active if not more active than in my previous games with you with the exception of the first half of D1. You are straight up lying. A lot of your posting this game is what I would call "posting to post". You say nothing meaningful to the thread. You announce you're here, or that you're working, or make some snarky comment. This is different from your town games where you seem actively engaged in figuring out the game. And now this. You haven't seen any reason to respond to me before, but now that I give the slightest inkling I think you might be scum, you start attacking me. OMGUS much? CC, why so scummy?
LOL! I've been attacking you but you haven't responded in the slightest. Plus, that post of yours where you voted me I just went "lol", I'm not attacking you because you think I'm scum. Why don't you actually do something in this game Yamato. Everyone keeps saying that I'm "posting for posting" or blah blah blah. But you of all people should know I do that as town. A LOT. C'mon Yamato let's go. Tunnel me.
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On January 08 2013 10:15 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 10:11 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 10:08 yamato77 wrote:On January 08 2013 10:03 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 09:57 yamato77 wrote:On January 08 2013 09:55 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 09:53 yamato77 wrote:On January 08 2013 09:43 DarthPunk wrote:
@ Yamato. You have a lot of experience playing with CC don't you? how would you say his play this game correlates to his previous games with you?
@ ZB have you dramatically altered your playstyle since the last time we played together? This is certainly not the town meta I remember from you. I've only played with town CC so I haven't seen his scum meta but this game doesn't look like the games I played with him. For one, he hasn't outright called me scum yet, he's actually defended me. Two, he doesn't seem active or invested like he usually does. Like I've said before, I have had a town read on him but it isn't strong, and it's quickly degrading. As for my top scum read, I still don't like Zentor for his play day 1 and he hasn't done anything to change that. I'm going to put some time into reading filters more carefully and see if I can see things more clearly. I've been calling you out for shit, apparently you haven't noticed? I wanted to LYNCH you day 1. I defended you a tad d1 and that's it. You've been saying the same things Hapa was. I don't see any reason to attach those questions to your thought process. Wait what? I still never defended you besides me saying "Yamato is being Yamato". Also, how can you say I don't seem as active? I'm as active if not more active than in my previous games with you with the exception of the first half of D1. You are straight up lying. A lot of your posting this game is what I would call "posting to post". You say nothing meaningful to the thread. You announce you're here, or that you're working, or make some snarky comment. This is different from your town games where you seem actively engaged in figuring out the game. And now this. You haven't seen any reason to respond to me before, but now that I give the slightest inkling I think you might be scum, you start attacking me. OMGUS much? CC, why so scummy? LOL! I've been attacking you but you haven't responded in the slightest. Plus, that post of yours where you voted me I just went "lol", I'm not attacking you because you think I'm scum. Why don't you actually do something in this game Yamato. Everyone keeps saying that I'm "posting for posting" or blah blah blah. But you of all people should know I do that as town. A LOT. C'mon Yamato let's go. Tunnel me. This is the second time you've tried to bait me into tunneling you. What is with you? It's like you want town to think you're scummy or something. As town generally you want to PROVE you're town, you know. That way you're not just wasting time. Instead you seem to want town to waste time being suspicious of you. Why?
Because there's nothing you can actually throw at me. Your reasons for thinking I'm scum are hallow. You state that I don't contribute anything meaningful to the thread --- What have you done? Nothing. I haven't seen any specific reasoning from you thinking I'm scum. You even defended me day 1, and said that I was promoting discussion and generally being pro-town. C'mon. Why am I scum?
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On January 08 2013 10:22 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 10:18 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 10:15 yamato77 wrote:On January 08 2013 10:11 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 10:08 yamato77 wrote:On January 08 2013 10:03 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 09:57 yamato77 wrote:On January 08 2013 09:55 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 09:53 yamato77 wrote:On January 08 2013 09:43 DarthPunk wrote:
@ Yamato. You have a lot of experience playing with CC don't you? how would you say his play this game correlates to his previous games with you?
@ ZB have you dramatically altered your playstyle since the last time we played together? This is certainly not the town meta I remember from you. I've only played with town CC so I haven't seen his scum meta but this game doesn't look like the games I played with him. For one, he hasn't outright called me scum yet, he's actually defended me. Two, he doesn't seem active or invested like he usually does. Like I've said before, I have had a town read on him but it isn't strong, and it's quickly degrading. As for my top scum read, I still don't like Zentor for his play day 1 and he hasn't done anything to change that. I'm going to put some time into reading filters more carefully and see if I can see things more clearly. I've been calling you out for shit, apparently you haven't noticed? I wanted to LYNCH you day 1. I defended you a tad d1 and that's it. You've been saying the same things Hapa was. I don't see any reason to attach those questions to your thought process. Wait what? I still never defended you besides me saying "Yamato is being Yamato". Also, how can you say I don't seem as active? I'm as active if not more active than in my previous games with you with the exception of the first half of D1. You are straight up lying. A lot of your posting this game is what I would call "posting to post". You say nothing meaningful to the thread. You announce you're here, or that you're working, or make some snarky comment. This is different from your town games where you seem actively engaged in figuring out the game. And now this. You haven't seen any reason to respond to me before, but now that I give the slightest inkling I think you might be scum, you start attacking me. OMGUS much? CC, why so scummy? LOL! I've been attacking you but you haven't responded in the slightest. Plus, that post of yours where you voted me I just went "lol", I'm not attacking you because you think I'm scum. Why don't you actually do something in this game Yamato. Everyone keeps saying that I'm "posting for posting" or blah blah blah. But you of all people should know I do that as town. A LOT. C'mon Yamato let's go. Tunnel me. This is the second time you've tried to bait me into tunneling you. What is with you? It's like you want town to think you're scummy or something. As town generally you want to PROVE you're town, you know. That way you're not just wasting time. Instead you seem to want town to waste time being suspicious of you. Why? Because there's nothing you can actually throw at me. Your reasons for thinking I'm scum are hallow. You state that I don't contribute anything meaningful to the thread --- What have you done? Nothing. I haven't seen any specific reasoning from you thinking I'm scum. You even defended me day 1, and said that I was promoting discussion and generally being pro-town. C'mon. Why am I scum? I defended you day 1 precisely because I thought you would contribute more meaningfully as town like you have in games past and now you aren't. You're OMGUSing people who are suspicious of you. This is not town CC.
So you defended me because you THOUGHT I would do something? Lololol. I'm not OMGUSing people. Everyone in this thread but Hapa wants me dead --- so it's easy to yell OMGUS. You can shout that all you want, it doesn't make it true.
Why am I scum? Tell me, specifically. I've given my thoughts on everybody. You know my stances on each person in this thread relatively well. Give me something more convincing than "I'm not contributing".
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@Hapa
I know I'm in the middle of rolling my face over Yamato, but what do you think about Shaio always defending himself? I made a post about it during the night. Nobody has responded to it in the slightest. Is it a paranoid scumtell?
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Jay has a super boner scumread on me. Where is he? Wasn't he going to make a case until DP took charge?
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Never a big fan of meta cases guys. People can change their playstyle on a whim. I've seen meta cases go horribly wrong many times. A little meta here or there is fine, but entire defenses / attacks based on meta don't really hold strong. I don't think we should use them to exonerate (or damn, for that matter) Shaio.
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On January 08 2013 11:19 yamato77 wrote:CC's defense of his admittedly scummy okay this game is this: Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 05:17 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 05:04 Hapahauli wrote:On January 08 2013 04:59 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 04:31 Hapahauli wrote:
In school right now - interested to hear a reply to dp's case, as well as scumreads In terms of DP's case.. It's alright. He's wrong, but I'm pretty scummy and much of the argument does hold water. However, I'm fairly disinterested with the pressure on me right now. I don't think I'll be lynched tomorrow, and I won't sit here and waste time deflecting every point brought against me. We can all settle on the fact that I'm super scummy right now, and that's fine with me. I would like you to be concerned, because I'm interested in hearing you defend what looks like a reasonable case against you. His main point is that I just "heap shit on weak players". I don't know how you'd like me to defend that, because it's true. Some people need shit heaped on them to start doing stuff. Most of it is based on my shitty stream post, which, as all indicates, heaps shit on players. I heap some shit here and there, it's all fine. I want answers. And if you have to dig your way out that's perfectly fine with me. The thread has been pathetically inactive for how long the game has been going. If I have to make myself seem scummy to generate some sort of response, well here we have it. Problem is, I haven't heard from players that are really concerning like SP or Yamato. He says he has to be scummy because its the only way to move the thread forward. Again, how is this indicative of a town mindset? If he's town, why does he want to intentionally look scummy so that town wastes time and effort looking at him? No, he's much more likely to be scum baiting town into lynching him while thinking they won't because "scum wouldn't look so scummy". Furthermore, how is his play supposed to generate useful discussion? This whole post looks like post-hoc rationalization, a trademark of scum behavior. If he wanted to move the thread forward meaningfully, why didn't he do so by actually making substantiated cases on his reads with evidence to back up his cutesy one-liners? Because he's full of shit and he knows it.
It took you an hour to dig up that? I am disappoint. If you really thought I was scum you would have had that in 10 minutes tops.
Oh, and you seemed to have missed the part where I said I wasn't intentionally looking scummy, it was just a bi-product of my shenanigans to get answers. You know, the post after that in my filter.
Try harder please, Yamato. Why am I scummy? This is just an extension of the "You aren't promoting useful discussion" argument.
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Jay shows up right after we mention him... nice.
@Jay
Why are you down for dat SP lynch? Reasons updated from your original suspicion please
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I know I just said I hate meta cases, but I think I've got a decent piece of meta here.
In both of our games together, we were both town. Yamato would always post quickly and fiercely to any pressure he received. His posting this game feels more structured and put together. It's taking him a long time to put stuff together. He doesn't feel like that town Yamato I know and loathe.
On January 08 2013 11:41 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 11:27 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 11:19 yamato77 wrote:CC's defense of his admittedly scummy okay this game is this: On January 08 2013 05:17 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 05:04 Hapahauli wrote:On January 08 2013 04:59 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 04:31 Hapahauli wrote:
In school right now - interested to hear a reply to dp's case, as well as scumreads In terms of DP's case.. It's alright. He's wrong, but I'm pretty scummy and much of the argument does hold water. However, I'm fairly disinterested with the pressure on me right now. I don't think I'll be lynched tomorrow, and I won't sit here and waste time deflecting every point brought against me. We can all settle on the fact that I'm super scummy right now, and that's fine with me. I would like you to be concerned, because I'm interested in hearing you defend what looks like a reasonable case against you. His main point is that I just "heap shit on weak players". I don't know how you'd like me to defend that, because it's true. Some people need shit heaped on them to start doing stuff. Most of it is based on my shitty stream post, which, as all indicates, heaps shit on players. I heap some shit here and there, it's all fine. I want answers. And if you have to dig your way out that's perfectly fine with me. The thread has been pathetically inactive for how long the game has been going. If I have to make myself seem scummy to generate some sort of response, well here we have it. Problem is, I haven't heard from players that are really concerning like SP or Yamato. He says he has to be scummy because its the only way to move the thread forward. Again, how is this indicative of a town mindset? If he's town, why does he want to intentionally look scummy so that town wastes time and effort looking at him? No, he's much more likely to be scum baiting town into lynching him while thinking they won't because "scum wouldn't look so scummy". Furthermore, how is his play supposed to generate useful discussion? This whole post looks like post-hoc rationalization, a trademark of scum behavior. If he wanted to move the thread forward meaningfully, why didn't he do so by actually making substantiated cases on his reads with evidence to back up his cutesy one-liners? Because he's full of shit and he knows it. It took you an hour to dig up that? I am disappoint. If you really thought I was scum you would have had that in 10 minutes tops. Oh, and you seemed to have missed the part where I said I wasn't intentionally looking scummy, it was just a bi-product of my shenanigans to get answers. You know, the post after that in my filter. Try harder please, Yamato. Why am I scummy? This is just an extension of the "You aren't promoting useful discussion" argument. Excuse me for having other things to do in my life besides prove to town that you are scum. Are you going to do anything today besides defend yourself? Poorly,I might add. I bring up plenty of points besides just the useful discussion point. You cannot deny it looks like straight up post-hoc rationale. You didn't intend to look scummy with your shit but now that you do and you realize people see it that way you're making up bullshit excuses for your shit play. I'm dine with reading your useless posts. It is in town's best interest to see you hang. ##Vote: Mr Cheesecake
Now that's OMGUS.
As for the bolded; I'm not defending myself. I'm trying to feel your reasons for thinking I'm scum. DP has some decent ones. You do not. You can't even explain why my posts are "useless".
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On January 08 2013 11:48 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 11:45 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:I know I just said I hate meta cases, but I think I've got a decent piece of meta here. In both of our games together, we were both town. Yamato would always post quickly and fiercely to any pressure he received. His posting this game feels more structured and put together. It's taking him a long time to put stuff together. He doesn't feel like that town Yamato I know and loathe. On January 08 2013 11:41 yamato77 wrote:On January 08 2013 11:27 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 11:19 yamato77 wrote:CC's defense of his admittedly scummy okay this game is this: On January 08 2013 05:17 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 05:04 Hapahauli wrote:On January 08 2013 04:59 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 04:31 Hapahauli wrote:
In school right now - interested to hear a reply to dp's case, as well as scumreads In terms of DP's case.. It's alright. He's wrong, but I'm pretty scummy and much of the argument does hold water. However, I'm fairly disinterested with the pressure on me right now. I don't think I'll be lynched tomorrow, and I won't sit here and waste time deflecting every point brought against me. We can all settle on the fact that I'm super scummy right now, and that's fine with me. I would like you to be concerned, because I'm interested in hearing you defend what looks like a reasonable case against you. His main point is that I just "heap shit on weak players". I don't know how you'd like me to defend that, because it's true. Some people need shit heaped on them to start doing stuff. Most of it is based on my shitty stream post, which, as all indicates, heaps shit on players. I heap some shit here and there, it's all fine. I want answers. And if you have to dig your way out that's perfectly fine with me. The thread has been pathetically inactive for how long the game has been going. If I have to make myself seem scummy to generate some sort of response, well here we have it. Problem is, I haven't heard from players that are really concerning like SP or Yamato. He says he has to be scummy because its the only way to move the thread forward. Again, how is this indicative of a town mindset? If he's town, why does he want to intentionally look scummy so that town wastes time and effort looking at him? No, he's much more likely to be scum baiting town into lynching him while thinking they won't because "scum wouldn't look so scummy". Furthermore, how is his play supposed to generate useful discussion? This whole post looks like post-hoc rationalization, a trademark of scum behavior. If he wanted to move the thread forward meaningfully, why didn't he do so by actually making substantiated cases on his reads with evidence to back up his cutesy one-liners? Because he's full of shit and he knows it. It took you an hour to dig up that? I am disappoint. If you really thought I was scum you would have had that in 10 minutes tops. Oh, and you seemed to have missed the part where I said I wasn't intentionally looking scummy, it was just a bi-product of my shenanigans to get answers. You know, the post after that in my filter. Try harder please, Yamato. Why am I scummy? This is just an extension of the "You aren't promoting useful discussion" argument. Excuse me for having other things to do in my life besides prove to town that you are scum. Are you going to do anything today besides defend yourself? Poorly,I might add. I bring up plenty of points besides just the useful discussion point. You cannot deny it looks like straight up post-hoc rationale. You didn't intend to look scummy with your shit but now that you do and you realize people see it that way you're making up bullshit excuses for your shit play. I'm dine with reading your useless posts. It is in town's best interest to see you hang. ##Vote: Mr Cheesecake Now that's OMGUS. As for the bolded; I'm not defending myself. I'm trying to feel your reasons for thinking I'm scum. DP has some decent ones. You do not. You can't even explain why my posts are "useless". Lol you're fucking retarded for calling my vote on you OMGUS. I'm the one YOU responded to, remember? Who is the one making cases on the other? Your reasons for calling me scum are that my case on yoiu is "bad"? You've done nothing to prove that point aside from just saying it. You're so scummy it's ridiculous.
I'm not calling you scum. Paranoid much?
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OMGUS can come from either alignment. I'm trying to get a feel for you and why you think I'm scum. Trying to see if you're genuine or not.
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On January 08 2013 11:58 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 11:57 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
OMGUS can come from either alignment. I'm trying to get a feel for you and why you think I'm scum. Trying to see if you're genuine or not. If you're not calling me scum then how is there anything for me to OMGUS you for? You're full of shit. Die scum.
Town can OMGUS one another. It happens all the time lol. Calm yourself.
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@Hapa
There I got Yamato to post some more. What are your thoughts on him? Is he genuine with his reasoning? I'm having a difficult time considering I know him fairly well. Can you provide some insight? I know you were lurking you devil.
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Cousin, who doth thou wish to lynch?
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Yamato I think you misunderstand. I'm not wanting town to be suspicious of me. It just happened and I'm rolling with it, but I'm not going to dwell on people thinking I'm scum. People being suspect of me is just a bi-product of my shenanigans.
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I'll be straight up here.
I was never trying to come off scummy at all. I was trying to get answers from people by asking questions / expressing honest thoughts. Somewhere along the line, I got dubbed as scummy "omg not contributing wtf no content just posting for posting". I think to myself, really? Okay. I can't really refute that -- it would just end up in a he said she said situation. By fighting it, I'm getting in the way of finding actual scum. People would still be all over me for crap reasons if I were defending.
So I embrace it. Why fight the general flow of the thread? I'm here to read people and to find scum. What a better way than to talk to people and see if they are genuine in attacking me? It's not the best plan. Nor is it even a decent plan. But it's what I've got to roll with.
@Yamato
My shenanigans were only limited to quote "flinging shit" on some players. That was literally it, in one post I called some people out for BS. Somehow the entire thing has been bloated up into this mess where that one post makes me scum and it apparently is the only think I've done all game. But again, I have to roll with the punches.
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j Hapa, I think you're getting a bit emotional. I agree he should get back here so we can discuss to get a more accurate read on him, but I don't want you to go all out on him into a potential mislynch. You said yourself that emotional lynches are the worst. Think you guys should both cool down a little.
I really want to hear from everyone on the interactions. It seems 2-3 people interact and then the rest chime in later. Especially Jay and SP I need to hear from.
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Jay,
You seem not to care whether you lynch town or scum. What gives? You made that comment about lynching a detrimental townie to me, now you think shaiopi would be a good lynch whether hes scum or town.
Also, you've been very inactive / not involved in the thread as well. Why are you in favor of a SP lynch?
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On January 08 2013 14:00 jaybrundage wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 13:51 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Jay,
You seem not to care whether you lynch town or scum. What gives? You made that comment about lynching a detrimental townie to me, now you think shaiopi would be a good lynch whether hes scum or town.
Also, you've been very inactive / not involved in the thread as well. Why are you in favor of a SP lynch? I never said he would be a good lynch if hes town. I said his inactivity hurts us whether hes scum or town. In the end I can never know for sure if you, ShaioPi, ZBoson, Zentor or anyone else for that matter is town or scum. However if ShaioPi looks scummy then we should by all means lynch him. So far he hasn't given us much content to go off and determine his alignment. I dont want him at LYLO because if he stays at this post rate we still wont have much to go on. I have been a bit inactive I find it hard to continually post content. Also it find it difficult to continue to contributing when my best scum read is still alive. I had this same problem before with kata in one of my past games I got to tunneled on her and didn't branch out on other people. CC whos your biggest scum read atm?
You said you would be down for his lynch. How does he look scummy with the exception of lurking? What makes him have a good chance of flipping scum?
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Also Jay: What do you make of Yamato and his interaction with me / Hapa?
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Will post more tomorrow. It's like 1am. Have work etc so ill check game during my lunch break and continue posting afterwards. We have plenty of time, dont lynch anybody.
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STOP RIGHT THERE YOU CRIMINAL SCUM.
I was going to wait to claim, but i figure my role won't save anyone else this game. I'mthe Doctor. Partly why ive been so fearless this game is cus ive got this sexy claim. Hapa was shot last night and i saved his arse.
Yamato, you're case is wrong and pretty bad considering you know my spazzy meta.
youve also not said boo to jay this entire game. He's under suspicion but nowhere in your filter can i find his name. You two could totes be scum together. I think yamato or jay for todays lynch.
Figure id claim now that ive gotten input from jay and yamato and others.
Still want to lynch me? There will be no counterclaim. If you're wondering about breadcrumbs, i didnt feel the need other than to be 100% sure i wasnt getting lynched today and i knew hapa was shot at the beginning of D2.
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Also im at work so wont be able to post until later. I bet yamato is so mad right now :3
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Everyone was pushing me. I need to clear myself in order for people tovtake me seriously. I cant save you twice anyway, you die then me. I figure being confirmed town is better
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Also discrediting yamato's bad case this way is hilarious. Nope, doctor son. Anyway ill be back in 5 hours.
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Pretty much Yamato's scumreads this game are people that have "done nothing"
I still haven't seen him ever mention Jay at all...
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I''ll be honest it's hard to read Yamato becacuse of our history. The fact that he's only ever wanted to lynch Mr. Z is not good, as he is probably the easiest person to call scum. His pressure on me feels... I can't really describe it. But it' somehow different than our other games. I really can't put my finger on it
SP is just a lurker. In my experience, hardcore lurkers like him end up flipping town. I already gave my stance on his paranoid defending himself, but he's still not a good lynch for today.
Jay, why did you let DP make a case on me,, when you said you would? Why would you let someone who could have been scum make that case instead of yourself?
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Ugh looking at Yamato's filter he's really twisting my posts into something they aren't. I'd probably lynch him today.
Well a meta case is a meta case..Why aren't you looking at Yamato right now? Why is SP such a great lynch for today instead of him?
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Oh my bad you were earlier. cool. But still, lurking is lurking. and its a coinflip. I'd say lynch him after Yamato. one of them has to be scum. then the other scum is you or perhaps Z-bo or Mr. Z
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Z, please stfu seriously you're play actually pisses me off this game. Jay could easily be scum with Yamato. Z-bo much less so with anyone, but he's not confirmed yet. Still, at least one of yamato or SP is scum. Perhaps both. We'll see, I have zero reservations about lynching them.
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Bro we're going to lynch Yamato and SP in that order. And it will be epic.
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Reading through Yamato's filter right now.
On January 06 2013 18:06 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 18:04 ShiaoPi wrote:
What makes MrZ scummier than Xatalos in your opinion? Apathy about who is lynched, less scum hunting than Xatalos, less reasoning posted than Xatalos, more trollish nature to his posting. Plus he's advocated the idea that we should limit our discussions in favor of making a decision on a lynch which is a scum favored idea.
Proceeds to hammer a townie without consulting the thread first.
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On January 09 2013 07:51 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2013 07:40 Hapahauli wrote:There are many ways I could describe your tunnel of CC. "Fair treatment" isn't one of them: On January 08 2013 11:58 yamato77 wrote:
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You're full of shit. Die scum. On January 08 2013 11:54 yamato77 wrote:
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Man you're full of shit. On January 08 2013 11:51 yamato77 wrote:
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Stop claiming scum. On January 08 2013 11:48 yamato77 wrote:
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You're so scummy it's ridiculous. Yeah, did you bother to look at the bullshit he was spewing at the same time? One minute I'm scum, the next minute I'm not, etc. He was full if it. As I said, I refuse to apologize for it.
Also, more lies. Never once called him scum during our interaction. Nor did I say he was not scum.
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On January 08 2013 22:41 yamato77 wrote:
......
In these two posts he establishes the idea that somehow he intended to look scummy to generate discussion. This is not only counter-intuitive because it is a TOWNIE thing to generate discussion, but also obviously an example of what I have realized is post-hoc rationalization. His intentions when he made the posts DP called him out for were almost certainly not to look scummy. Nobody in the game ever has any interest in looking scummy. Not town, not scum, anyone. However, scum do have an interest in making their former scummy actions seem better in hindsight with the types of justifications he gives here.
On January 08 2013 05:27 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2013 05:23 Hapahauli wrote:
Making yourself look scummy to elicit a response is not good town play. Are you suggesting you've been posting with this hidden intention?
Also, you can generate discussion without looking bad. Lol it's not a hidden intention. But apparently it's a side effect that was somehow generated one way or the other.
Apparently Yamato missed that post right beneath in my filter. More lies.
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Dat feel when replacing likely scum.
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Then don't read it and tell us who is scummiest.
Hint: It's Yamato.
Also me, Hapa and DP are confirmed town.
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On January 09 2013 10:40 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2013 10:35 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 22:41 yamato77 wrote:
......
In these two posts he establishes the idea that somehow he intended to look scummy to generate discussion. This is not only counter-intuitive because it is a TOWNIE thing to generate discussion, but also obviously an example of what I have realized is post-hoc rationalization. His intentions when he made the posts DP called him out for were almost certainly not to look scummy. Nobody in the game ever has any interest in looking scummy. Not town, not scum, anyone. However, scum do have an interest in making their former scummy actions seem better in hindsight with the types of justifications he gives here.
On January 08 2013 05:27 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 05:23 Hapahauli wrote:
Making yourself look scummy to elicit a response is not good town play. Are you suggesting you've been posting with this hidden intention?
Also, you can generate discussion without looking bad. Lol it's not a hidden intention. But apparently it's a side effect that was somehow generated one way or the other. Apparently Yamato missed that post right beneath in my filter. More lies. Lol did you read the posts you conveniently cut out? You said exactly what you bolded in my post you jackass.
No, I did not. It seems thats what I said. Apparently you didn't read carefully to realize I clarified. Stop being mad @ me bro.
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I played scum with Dandel. Def his scum meta right here. :p
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On January 09 2013 10:47 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2013 10:43 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 09 2013 10:40 yamato77 wrote:On January 09 2013 10:35 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 22:41 yamato77 wrote:
......
In these two posts he establishes the idea that somehow he intended to look scummy to generate discussion. This is not only counter-intuitive because it is a TOWNIE thing to generate discussion, but also obviously an example of what I have realized is post-hoc rationalization. His intentions when he made the posts DP called him out for were almost certainly not to look scummy. Nobody in the game ever has any interest in looking scummy. Not town, not scum, anyone. However, scum do have an interest in making their former scummy actions seem better in hindsight with the types of justifications he gives here.
On January 08 2013 05:27 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 08 2013 05:23 Hapahauli wrote:
Making yourself look scummy to elicit a response is not good town play. Are you suggesting you've been posting with this hidden intention?
Also, you can generate discussion without looking bad. Lol it's not a hidden intention. But apparently it's a side effect that was somehow generated one way or the other. Apparently Yamato missed that post right beneath in my filter. More lies. Lol did you read the posts you conveniently cut out? You said exactly what you bolded in my post you jackass. No, I did not. It seems thats what I said. Apparently you didn't read carefully to realize I clarified. Stop being mad @ me bro. By "clarified" you mean changed your whole fucking story. I am mad because you've made me waste a shitload of time looking at your scummy ass this game when you're a blue. Now people want me to have another scum read on a moment's notice. I would have lynched Shaio, too, but there's no development in me saying that because he wasn't posting. What am I supposed to do, fake a read on Hapa or some shit so you guys can call me confirmed scum? Stop being stupid with your bias against me.
Okay you can stop calling me bad, etc. You obviously can't read if you thought I changed my story. I'm town - why the fuck would I change my story. Now stop being angry and do shit if you're town.
Everyone in this game "wasted time" by calling me scummy etc, and you're the only one bitching about it. Man up. Stop complaining. You should be glad we aren't mislynching. Apparently, you're only pissed off that I claimed Doc and you're left to wallow in despair.
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I have to say it does sound like me trying association cases with double bussing scum lolol
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LOL Hapa I told you Ewya was Yamato. Ahahahaha.
Gawsh this is confuzzling. What besides the "running a marathon" post makes you think Jay is townie?
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Shaio seemed more scum than Dandel. Problem is they are the same person. What do.
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Oh I haven't been reading that much soz. But yeah Shaio was super scummy always defending himself without the need to. Sooo Dandel can you back up your claims of what Z-bo is accusing you of? (putting words in his mouth)
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Lol I don't think I've ever seen a town refer to someone pressuring him as bussing. Sorry that's really funny. Seems scummy.
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Z-Bo looking pretty town right now.
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Yeah, I'm pretty confident this Z is town. A lot of effort going over his past game. He seems to care a ton and isn't facerolling over this Dandel lynch -- wants to pursue other reads such as his evil twin brother Mr. Z.
But yeah. I'm not convinced of Jays towniness, and still Mr. Z irks me. Scumteam still most likely two of the three Yamato / Jay / Dandel. I'll provide the hammer on any if y'all want.
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+ Show Spoiler +On January 08 2013 05:35 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:ShiaoPi is a chronic defender. He spends more time defending / justifying himself than he does actually being useful. + Show Spoiler +On January 04 2013 12:06 ShiaoPi wrote:
Well I am trying not to be lurky, but sometimes shit does come up, so I cannot gurantee being much more active than usually.
@MrZentor:
I agree on your point of just having general guidelines instead of a limit by which the vote must happen. While we should use the additional time we have, I don't like setting up something definite, it just gives scum an easier way to move in a set frame. On January 05 2013 14:07 ShiaoPi wrote:
@Jay:
I am doing a pressure vote on Rise since his last post seemed to me as if he would just be gone for a couple of hours before popping back into the thread, as he has not done so, I believe myself justified well enough, since I have questions for him that I want answered.
I think you got ninja'ed by me during writing your post. I did give out a stancee on his posting. I also fail to see how I have tried to lie low in this game....
Your case seems really weak to me.
/shrug On January 05 2013 14:28 ShiaoPi wrote:
@Jay:
I said that the exchange they had read kind of townish. But that I disliked DP's reluctance to vote. Xatalos is null just as easy as that.
Read that post again please.
I clearly said that DP is the weaker read of the two and that his behaviour does not add up. My thoughtprocess is right in that post.
With all that is happening in thread right now I am tending towards lynching DP, but I would really hear more from Rise and yamato On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Xatalos:
I said earlier that Xatalos is a lynchbait.
-snip-
On January 06 2013 17:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I do scumhunt, just because I am not writing a case on anything that moves does not mean I am not doing it...
Boson is pretty much town in my eyes, no reason to share his spreadsheet with his thoughts lined out with us if he were scum. Also he has directly started to scumhunt as soon as he replaced in, gets lots of towniepoints from me.
CC is someone I don't want to lynch today, you may think him scummy for not making a shitton of cases but that is just a difference in playstyle imo. Looking through his filter he is actively trying to get more information out of people by asking questions promoting discussing. What I dislike is parking his vote on MrZ but that is nothing to be honest.
On January 06 2013 19:11 ShiaoPi wrote:
@yamato:
While I like you doing more analysis, there is some stuff I do not agree with. Especially the first post you quoted with the guidelines on time. Hapa actually wanted a self-imposed deadline of 72h, which is something I did not agree to. So taking that quote from Zentor out of context makes it seem as it were all the time pushing for lynching somebody to end it the day. That is simply wrong. I can also sympathise with his sentiment that we really should start consolidating on someone by now. A much longer day 1 has negative effect on us imo.
You are right when you say that his play is not necessarily pro-town by now. But I can understand where he comes from to a certain degree, which explains why I said earlier that I am torn on all my candidates for today's lynch.
@Xatalos:
Nice that you have popped in, but not only are you dead wrong on me but your case is crap. I expected more than cherrypicking my filter for bits you can build something on.
I cannot even fathom how you critisize me for putting a vote on Rise as pressure when he had done jackshit at that moment.
The next two quotes are an answer to a question I was asked to. I was asked who the other options of mine were, I responded. Don't even see what is wrong with them as if you have studied my filter it is pretty clear why I listed each of them.
Now towards my stances being neutral and weak is stupid as shit. I posted my thoughts on the players I found suspicious at the moment and pressured them when they were around see the entire dialogue between me and yamato just above.
As icing on the cake you take a game from almost half a year back (which was also one of my newbie games) as a "meta-argument". That is a nice example of false usage of meta-arguments. If you want to study my meta at least take the most recent game in which I was town (which is LVII if I recall correctly) and compare it to this game...
This is just terribly bad and feels forced.
##vote: Xatalos On January 06 2013 21:27 ShiaoPi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 20:05 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:41 ShiaoPi wrote:On January 06 2013 19:36 Xatalos wrote:On January 06 2013 19:25 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am voting you now because:
-flip flopping on DP in some logical inconsistencies earlier
-not committing at all earlier
-writing a terribly bad case for the sake of writing one to get some pressure off yourself.
call it OMGUS if you want, I don't think so.
Also you have been on my hitlist now, Zentor is not around so I cannot ask him stuff right now, I just asked yamato a bunch of stuff earlier. Leaving you and with that crap contribution you look like the best option for today's lynch When was I under pressure...? I've just been trying find someone scummier than Mr. Cheesecake, but it's not an easy job, considering the relatively low activity and the high amount of townish/nullish players. There are many things in your filter that strike me as suspicious (mentioned earlier), and even though they're partly intuition and not solid proof, it's better than Mr. Cheesecake in my eyes (he started off under the radar but has had some engagement since then). Several people have mentioned you as a possible lynch candidate that qualifies as under pressure. I would really be interested in those "many things" in my filter that are suspicious, I already answered the ones you quoted earlier. Please show them to me, I don't even know where you find them. Anyway I am out for dinner now. See you later. Okay... I guess that counts as pressure, although I haven't been even remotely in a dangerous spot until now. But this always happens to me when I'm town at some point, so I'm not too worried yet. Are you saying you were really pressuring RiseAgain? I just can't see anything but a weak fake pressure in that. Merely voting for someone without any actual pressure doesn't count as pressure. Some other players in this game have thrown away weak votes as well, but at least they tried to create some pressure. You didn't even try - the opposite, you openly said it was only an empty vote beforehand. Why were you suddenly okay with lynching DP when he started to gain a bandwagon for himself? All I can see is an opportunistic (yet extremely vague) move to potentially get rid of an active player. And when the bandwagon started to crumble, you suddenly dropped him from your suspects without saying a word about it. It feels like you're just trying to get someone lynched, and it doesn't really matter who. So I am back. Where did I say I was really pressuring Rise? I clearly said it was to get him to post, since I had questions for him, that I wanted to answer. It is blatantly clear in my filter.
I was not "suddenly" okay with lynching DP, stop misrepresenting facts. Mr.CC asked me who my other possible candidates were. That was after the first episode of DP/Hapa-shitfest but before the entire wagon on him started. I was active during the increasing pressure on DP, being part of it myself, before I had to leave cause of RL matters. How is it opportunistic for me to be one of the persons being there while the pressure added up, when I really thought that he might be red??
The bandwagon started to crumble because DP was doing some really townish posts, thing is I was not in the thread at that time. As soon as I was back und caught up I removed DP from my hitlist as he was much more townie now. I did not want to bloat my post with the DP matter again, when it was not part of the trending discussion in the thread, but I did "say a word" about it....Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 17:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
Okay finally got some time to give out some thoughts.
First off welcome Z-Boson, good to have a active replacement!
Moving on to some housekeeping:
DP's reactions since I was gone seem to me pretty townie, by extension Hapa seems town as well with the entire thoughtprocess behind tunneling being revealed. So I am retracting my scum-leaning read that I had on DP earlier.
-snip- I for sure care who gets lynched, seriously are you even reading this thread? I clearly stated which persons I want to lynch during varying times already. He seems pretty paranoid and feels the need to defend himself at every juncture. Frequently he references his past posts to justify his actions and explain them. Take a look at his vote for Xatalos, for example. He basically just calls him bad, defends himself hardcore, and then votes. The symptoms of a guilty conscience, perhaps?
Idk I'll pretty much lynch Dandel for what his counterpart was doing -- going turtle mode.
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Just one more vote on Dandel before I'll hammer it.
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Because this mislynch needs pushing. And fast.
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Wtf hapa is confirmed town. I friggen saved him from the NK
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Just a troll, Hapa. Either way let's just lynch dandel. then get jay / yamato after. I don't see z-bo being scum right now and Mr.Z is just a wild card. Everyone has some reason to be scum right now.
Although in truth i'd be more in favor of a yamato lynch simply because he lies / misrepresents so much.
Didn't he say he was going to make Dandel a "contributing town player" somewhere? Where has this occured? And why does he assume dandel is town o.o
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what about jay / yamato scumteam. maybe mrz jay lol
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to hammer or not to hammer. that is the question.
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Now he shows up. So yeah i could just lynch you right now... why shouldnt i?
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Yamato defended you hardcore D1 be tee dubs just sayin
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I know Dandels scum meta. He wants his scumbuddy to bus him. In our game he kept screaming at us to bus the fuck out of him. That's why there is no pressure to not lynch you.
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You have 30 minutes Dandel. 30 minutes.
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I'm giving him until 9:00 EST that's my deadline. 29 mins.
Prove you're town.
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Then give me some scumreads and reasons why.
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Just wanting to be sure here. Give it some suspense and whatnot. My hammer. 27 minutes.
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Dandel holy shit just give some reasons for your scumreads if you're actually town. SET US UP GOOD FOR TOMORROW CHRIST.
20 MINS I MIGHT NOT EVEN WAIT THATT LONG
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Last chance Dandel. We would take you fucking seriously once you were lynched.
Last chance.
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Going to hammer right on the hour. For funsies.
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Also where the fuck are Z-bo and Yamato
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HAMMER TIME
##Vote: Dandel Ion
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Anywho, I think scumteam is jay / yamato, jay / Mr. Z.
Offchance of Boson being in there somewhere, but I really think Jay needs to die tomorrow.
If my initial prediction of Jay / Yamato scumteam is right, I will still be very happy.
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Shut the fuck up Mr. Z. Then you can die tomorrow.
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So who the fuck is scumteam then Z? Yamato + Boson?
Prove it.
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Yamato has a damn good chance of flipping scum. He lied and twisted my words so much in his case on me.
I don't think scumteam is Mr. Z + Yamato because literally all Yamato has done this game is try to get him lynched. Unless it's a Witchcraft-style game I don't think they're the scumteam. It's either Jay / Yamato or Jay / Mr. Z. Only Z-Boson can throw a wrench into that.
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So why is Yamato town again? His frustration? Could easily be frustrated scum lashing out. He even said that I was "wasting time" by acting scummy towards him, when we have infinite time...
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I'm down for straight up policy lynching Mr. Z for being retarded this game. If Jay / Yamato scumteam wins whatever idc.
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Mr. Z -- You're full of shit. Only way Yamato is scum, according to you, is if he is in a scumteam with Z-BosoN.
Prove your shit or Idc if you're town or not, I will lynch you tomorrow.
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On January 10 2013 11:38 MrZentor wrote:
idk
If I'm scum, who's scum number 2?
Jay. Possibly Yamato if double bus.
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On January 10 2013 11:40 MrZentor wrote:
When did I say Yamato has to be in a scumteam with Z-Boson?
You all want me to prove that Yamato is scum, but you guys can't prove that I'm scum.
All you can say is. "Errr, I think I remember him doing something that might help scum, soooo HE MUST BE SCUM."
You say Jay is town. Rest of us are confirmed. Z-BosoN is the only one left.
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On January 10 2013 11:40 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2013 11:38 MrZentor wrote:
idk
If I'm scum, who's scum number 2? prob jay, someone you've been passing off as a top scumread for questionable reasons and didn't discuss, same person who pointed fingers at hapa, a confirmed town, for not having a vote in any lynch.
He had him as confirmed town?
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On January 10 2013 11:42 MrZentor wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2013 11:38 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 10 2013 11:38 MrZentor wrote:
idk
If I'm scum, who's scum number 2? Jay. Possibly Yamato if double bus. Blatantly saying I'm partners with Jay would be far too risky. And the second theory is just as stupid.
WIFOM. Die tomorrow please unless you can convince me of your Yamato - Z-BosoN theory.
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On January 10 2013 11:48 jaybrundage wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2013 11:40 Z-BosoN wrote:On January 10 2013 11:38 MrZentor wrote:
idk
If I'm scum, who's scum number 2? prob jay, someone you've been passing off as a top scumread for questionable reasons and didn't discuss, same person who pointed fingers at hapa, a confirmed town, for not having a vote in any lynch. Do you think scum would forget hapa got shot and was saved by doctor?
Or fabricate not remembering that hapa got shot. WIFOM
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Blatant scum claim right here. But i'd lynch Jay to be sure.
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So how did Z-bo suddenly drop from your town reads? How does a Yamato Z-bo team work? Explain yourself. Why the hell is jay and yamato hell of a lot more likely
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Santa put stupid in his stocking.
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No need Yamato we've got the scumteam wrapped up in fine linen for us.
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On January 10 2013 17:16 jaybrundage wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2013 16:46 yamato77 wrote:On January 10 2013 16:44 jaybrundage wrote:On January 10 2013 15:38 yamato77 wrote:
Moving forward, I think the best plan of action is to sit on the assumption that we can lynch Zentor at any point, and hunt for either his scum mate, or in the small likelihood that he's actually town, find the real scum. We can lynch anyone at anypoint. If it's very unlikely that hes town then why wouldn't you just lynch him? You should always lynch your best scum read. Never ever save a lynch for later on someone you think is scum. There's always the possibility that Zentor is town, isn't there? I mean we just saw a townie self-destruct yesterday. I agree he is probably scum, but even if he is I think the better move is to sit on the idea for at least a few hours. If you disagree, I want to know how you're so certain he'll flip. Im not really certain about anything at this point. We still have a similar pool to lynch in but I have added Zentor to that lynch. I'm not as sure as i was about him as before. His im not going to post crap was dumb to say the least.
So who is your scumteam at this point? You've got three candidates that aren't confirmed town other than yourself.
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Thing is, every one of the 4 remaining players has something scummy about them. Problem is, the really scummy ones can justify it via meta or being "too suicidal" as Hapa puts it. Really going to be a coinflip here imo.
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Where the fuck were you pre-flip with this information? You were spouting OMG Mr. Z is town! up until now.
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Bussing would be a great tactic right now on you, Z, just sayin'.
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My scumminess got people talking c:
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Hapa, I can heal you bro. It's all good you ain't dying tonight.
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I say we lynch Jay off the island because I don't much care for him.
Mr. Z pisses me off, but he's got style.
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On January 11 2013 08:47 MrZentor wrote:Hapa is dying tonight. He should tell us to kill Yamato before he dies.
The OP actually lies. In my PM it specifically says that I can protect the same person as many times as I want.
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@Jay
Who is Mr. Z's scumbuddy? Go.
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On January 11 2013 08:49 jaybrundage wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 08:47 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
I say we lynch Jay off the island because I don't much care for him.
Mr. Z pisses me off, but he's got style. CC you havent been giving much on the post side of things : ( can you read my case and give some thoughts about it plz
I don't have to give you my thoughts. When I'm good and ready to make my decision I'll justify it.
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On January 11 2013 08:51 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 08:49 jaybrundage wrote:On January 11 2013 08:49 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
@Jay
Who is Mr. Z's scumbuddy? Go. Z-Boson i said this in my case That makes a terrible amount of sense.
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Jay Yamato scumteam I want it to happen.
Thing is.. if Jay was bussing Mr. Z, I think Mr. Z would be screaming that he's scum right now. I still don't get how he thinks Jay is town.
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Or maybe they're just trying to distance themselves. wifom everywhere
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I want to lynch him based on feeling. Like I can't put my finger on it, nor can I explain it, but something is different apart from his inactivity.
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Keep going Mr. Z. You are beginning to interest me.
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Idk this could all just be tons and tons of WIFOM. Probably is.
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Everything is just a he said she said thing at this point. Eh.
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I just realized something, what if Rise is Z-BosoN's smurf :3. Irrelevant, but interesting to ponder.
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I'm going to sheep Hap and say lynch Yamato tomorrow.
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I mean, I want to lynch Yamato based on my gut. Good enough for me in this shitfest hehe
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I have no clue anymore, this game.
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On January 11 2013 10:57 yamato77 wrote:
What the fuck is going on.
How the fuck is what Zentor is doing right now even remotely proof that he's town?
God damn this game.
This sounds like fabricated frustration imo.
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On January 11 2013 10:59 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 10:58 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 11 2013 10:57 yamato77 wrote:
What the fuck is going on.
How the fuck is what Zentor is doing right now even remotely proof that he's town?
God damn this game. This sounds like fabricated frustration imo. Cheesecake you're retarded Gogo useless confirmed town
The fact that you rage at me for everything makes me think you're scum
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On January 11 2013 11:01 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 11:00 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 11 2013 10:59 yamato77 wrote:On January 11 2013 10:58 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On January 11 2013 10:57 yamato77 wrote:
What the fuck is going on.
How the fuck is what Zentor is doing right now even remotely proof that he's town?
God damn this game. This sounds like fabricated frustration imo. Cheesecake you're retarded Gogo useless confirmed town The fact that you rage at me for everything makes me think you're scum Yeah because those other games we played together I never raged at you when we were both town, right? I don't know how much more dumb you can be.
So mad right now, can't see sarcasm
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I told you Jay I haven't a clue. Could be any two of you fuckers. Problem is, even though Mr. Z pissed me off with his play this game, I kind of want him to win for lulz if he's scum
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On January 11 2013 11:09 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 11:06 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
I told you Jay I haven't a clue. Could be any two of you fuckers. Problem is, even though Mr. Z pissed me off with his play this game, I kind of want him to win for lulz if he's scum You're fucking useless as shit. God damn if you hadn't wasted so much of my fucking time this game I could have figured this shit out by now. Even as confirmed town you still say shit I could lynch you for.
Town would choose to ignore it. You're choosing to rage at me instead of actually do things. Also we have unlimited time ftw :D
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##Vote: Jay
I hit his name on my dart board.
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So darth what are you up to right now?
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Well Yamato did hammer the first lynch to be fair.
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Jay apparently isn't here soooo yeah.
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On January 11 2013 11:33 MrZentor wrote:
So, MrCC, what is your current scum team?
All four of you guys together on my dart board.
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Well of course the townies here know who aren't confirmed know who the scumteam is. Me and darth have no idea.
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Bro I'm just trolling around if you haven't noticed. But Jay isn't here so it doesnt matter anyway.
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I'll be voting at the top of the hour for funsies.
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On January 11 2013 11:47 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 11:25 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
So darth what are you up to right now? I am packing up my shit because I am about to move house. I am also eating lunch and checking the thread intermittently :D
Ohh where you moving?
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Eh, DP just do it get this over with. Re-reading will just make your head spin in every direction with possible scumteam motives or town tells.
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Just musing on some stuff: Why would Mr. Z scum try to kill Hapa night 1? Hapa was the only reason he was staying alive imo.
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Well I mean DP would have been an amazing secondary choice, and Hapa was most likely going to have the doctor on him. Scumteam had to take a chance in shooting him, right? I don't think scum Mr. Z would take that chance when he could have a guarenteed DP kill and still have Hapa hard defending him.
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Yamato so mad right now. But seriously killing DP would have made so much sense with scum Mr. Z.
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Firstly BH, there are 3 people not voting. Secondly, I voted for Jay first. Thirdly, Darth voted for Z-BosoN first.
DoYouHas confirmed best votecounter.
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Beat you to it, sonny boy.
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I friggen knew Yamato was scum when I told him to tunnel me. And that entire case on me. I just knew something was off.
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Although I will admit I thought Z-Bo was the towniest of the 4 remaining players :p
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On January 11 2013 15:38 jaybrundage wrote:
You gotta wonder who Yamato is gonnna kill tonite.
My bet is to end it all with a bullet to the brain :o
Well fun fact I healed zentor last night for no reason cus i couldnt heal Hapa. So either me or him will die.
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On January 11 2013 15:39 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 15:38 jaybrundage wrote:
You gotta wonder who Yamato is gonnna kill tonite.
My bet is to end it all with a bullet to the brain :o He will kill CC probably.
Lol just shoot me in the face and then concede hehe
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Live on
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Yamato were you legit mad when I claimed Doctor :3
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On January 12 2013 03:45 yamato77 wrote:
I knew you were doc.
It was a dumb decision to tunnel you with the blue claim to make it all worthless but you were really easy to make look bad and I knew I could shit up the thread a bit with you, you always played along.
Well I was trying to entice you to slip up, but you never really did. I had a gut feeling you were scum, but I couldn't prove it. The only thing I could do was try to have a little flame fest and see where you would falter. Something was different, and I can't exactly put my finger on it, but I thought you were scum so bad.
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And I guess that's why both scum had to be on the mislynch D1 -- because myself and some others wanted to lynch you instead.
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Oh and that Dandel lynch was terrible haha. I gave him time because I thought he was town, but he did absolutely nothing to prove it *sigh*
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Z-Bo you were pretty townie in my eyes. That's why I was thinking Yamato / Jay scumteam because at least that made sense. Jay and Mr. Z did an amazing job late game by interacting with one another and with the cases, etc. Really showed me that they weren't the scumteam.
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Dandel lynch was fine I guess -- but the problem was with how he handled it at the end. I would have tried to push Yamato if he wasn't claiming scum over and over
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Dandel you're still sexiest mafia player second to me.
Also thanks Hapa for you know what.
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On January 12 2013 04:43 Dandel Ion wrote:
Zbo, I see you're still a massively unattractive individual. Don't take it out on me, not my fault.
If you want pointers on sexiness, look at Cheese the Adonis.
Such a sexy bastard.
+1
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That's what usually happens in 9 player games: once one successful lynch occurs, the next mafia concedes or isn't far from death.
Unless, of course, you lynch scum day 1 and all but 3 townies are afk the rest of the game and don't lynch his obvious scumbuddy. *cough*
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I just want WCMM II
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Shoulda just lynched Yamato because he was scummy instead of going "Oh, well he's like that erry game no worries" lol :p
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EPT
