EPTOn September 25 2012 08:27 grush57 wrote:
Yeah but I still play the game.
It's not like that is all I do.
Yeah but I still play the game.
It's not like that is all I do.
yeah.......
no.
Liquid City Mafia
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marvellosity
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yeah....... no. | ||
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On September 25 2012 09:20 grush57 wrote: Sigh was I really that bad in LVII? I know that I'm not even trying in Caller's that game just went to shit. point me to one case you made, ever | ||
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On September 26 2012 11:06 VisceraEyes wrote: /in smooches <3 | ||
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On September 30 2012 04:31 Mementoss wrote: mightaswell /in aww yea  | ||
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On September 30 2012 13:54 Shady Sands wrote: Yes! Thank goodness the gambit worked. The whole plan was either to troll hard and have some fun, or enjoy a serious, non-troll game of Mafia by inciting the mod to explicitly threaten a modkill for trolling and scare all the trolls into the straight and narrow. Shiao, you can thank me after the game is over. With that being said, I find the easy rando-vote at the beginning highly suspicious. ## Unvote ## Vote Z-Boson Explain your rando-vote without trolling as a factor. Hi all! Totes wasn't expecting to be going by now. Shady, why you lie to us? | ||
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On October 01 2012 01:36 kingjames01 wrote: I'm not backing off at all. I quoted it so that I wouldn't lose it later. He asked why and I explained. Just because a post gives off a scum-tell doesn't mean that the post was made by a mafia. Town players sound scummy all the time without realizing it because we don't care how we sound. You're currently way in the lead in the Wiffly Waffly Awards. It's contrived but it's not contrived but it seemed contrived but it doesn't have to be contrived. Thanks man. If you're curious, it didn't seem contrived to me. I still want Shady to come back and tell us why he basically lied to us about his trolling. Covering his tracks after the event is super scummy. | ||
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On October 01 2012 03:16 VisceraEyes wrote: The thing is marv the way he phrased it, he doesn't have to EXPLAIN why he lied because all he has to say is "nuh uh" to the accusation. The way you phrase the accusation even invites such a response (Y U LIE). What do you think of annul so far marv? annul seems kinda pointless so far. Have you played with him before? | ||
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I'd much rather lynch Shadypants. | ||
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On October 01 2012 10:25 Keirathi wrote: Kind of frustrating that we're halfway through D1 and half the people haven't even posted. Anyways, regarding Shady and KJ: He wants to troll to buy a free-ride through the game because he thinks that's automatically why those players make it to endgame. I don't buy that it was a gambit to get a mod to threaten trolling. That said, I'm hesitant to jump on the bandwagon because its so...easy. Which is ironic, because THATS the reason that people like BM and grush make it to endgame. Not because they troll, but because lynching them is the easy way out for scum when they are town. As far as KJ, I just want to say that I wasn't even getting defensive. I was legitimately trying to figure out his thinking, and explain myself. That he got defensive to my questions, and then decided on a wishy-washy stance rather than taking a firm opinion and trying to explain himself make me question his motives. Just throwing mud out for the sake of appearing like he was contributing? For now: ##Vote: kingjame01 Yes it is ironic, because it's preventing you voting for him. Mission successful on you at least then? It's the inherent 'too scummy to be scum' defence which is bleh. VE's post at the top of this page mostly covers my thoughts on both Shady and KJ. With kingjames, the general wishy washyness isn't *so* bad in general except for the fact that he just lumped those quotes in the thread in the first place. If you're not willing to uphold why you're doing so, it's just insidious suspicion placing. With Shady, what I really really dislike is the bullshit after-the-fact explanation for his actions. It just reads as a lie trying to justify the dumb play in the first place. I've seen several instances of scum trying to justify shit after the fact... Kei, i think you were in that game with talis and his 'reads' plan where he was scum? On top of this is his absence from the thread afterwards. If you're seriously making a point about how trolling is bad (...) then at best it's completely hypocritcal to disappear without actually then providing any content. Your response to it, Kei, is validation of Shady playing like that. Boo! ##Vote: Shady Sands | ||
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On October 01 2012 20:43 Mementoss wrote: ##Vote: Kushm4sta Pretty self explanatory. Except I don't think he's scum at the moment. He's managing to be surprisingly unargumentative and I don't think he has the self-control to pull that off as a lie. His town games are littered with big scumslips, and I've watched/coached/hosted every single one of his newbie games. Coag and VE are playing like coag and VE is the sum of what's been said about them. Z-Bo, as I tried to explain (perhaps poorly), it was the explanation for Shady's trolling and his subsequent lurking that I particularly disliked, but you seem to be representing it otherwise. On October 01 2012 11:39 kingjames01 wrote: So what we're shifting towards is whether Shady's 'plan' to preempt trolling was legitimate or a cover-up? That should not be the focus of our first day. Instead, I'd like Shady to come back to the thread and give us something more concrete. Shady: what do you think about the assertion that I was being wishy-washy? Also, tell us if you have a spy read on anyone yet, who and why. Bla bla bla bla. What do you think, about, you know, anything? | ||
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On October 01 2012 21:34 kushm4sta wrote: lynching someone you don't think is scum is common. it's called a policy lynch. also no one who I want to lynch is getting lynched, so I might as well join this bandwagon because I don't like shady 's play Who do you want to lynch most of all right now and why? | ||
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On October 01 2012 13:17 Shady Sands wrote: In response to trolling: I think people are drastically overblowing the following post: How is that a lie, Marv? I explicitly said I was trolling even though on the very first page DrH told GRush to eff off for presumed trolliness. I knew this was going to get me a high chance of being modkilled. But given that there are people who are possibly smurfing for others here, there's still a risk that trolls are here, so I wanted to play that way to make sure no one dared to troll... or at least I could abuse tolerance for trolls to the same extent as others. Now reading through filters So in the game with the most specific anti-troll host/rules, you felt the need to make a point? Is it not true then that you were basically having a hissy fit? This way my interpretation of your pre-game post, and it's the fact that you tried to make your trolling into a legitimate point that reads as fake to me. To the bold, you said this and then made two further inconsequential posts. Did you find nothing to comment upon? | ||
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On October 01 2012 22:27 Z-BosoN wrote: I don't know coag, and I don't know VE. On coag, its a pity that's how he plays then, I hate ppl like that. Hope seeing his brilliant play in day 2. I still don't like how VE attacked annul though, but given this was the beggining of day one I don't necessarily think that part is scum motivated. I'd like him to be clearer on KJ, though. Risk, yea you should read my post, I specifically addressed that. Marv, I just don't feel that way. Shady usually comes off scummy as shit no matter his alignment, so I don't think that is enough to push a lynch. In my experience Shady's scummyness usually comes from massive bouts of "lol didn't read thread!". His play here is distinct from this normal ailment of his. Well, aside from the fact he said he was reading filters and then didn't give us anything, but that's not the same either ^^ | ||
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On September 03 2012 18:47 kushm4sta wrote: So it seems like the consensus is to lynch either cubu or kville. Anyone not feel this way? Even if they aren't mafia they are solid policy lynches. Now the question is which one. Kville is the bigger lurker, but I think there is a higher possibility for cubu to actually be mafia. Honestly cubu probably isn't mafia either, just because I think mafia would put more effort into their posts. Lynching one of these guys is better than lynching someone who is active though. So my vote is still on cubu. Will vote for policy lynches just fine, check Calls Cubu probably not mafia but is happy to have his vote on him, check | ||
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Anyway, it's been gnawing at me for most of the day, and I want to lynch kj more and more. On October 01 2012 00:19 kingjames01 wrote: I was mafia in a DrH game where there were clues. As mafia, I spent the entire game speculating on what the clues meant and who they were pointing to rather than to actually hunt for spies. The Town got caught up in it and we ended up winning the game with some false claims. I want this game to focus on scum hunting and not rely on the crutch of sifting through possible clues. We should be aware of any players who encourage using time and effort on scum hunting via clues. That being said, I'm going to quote some posts so I don't lose them. They're not proof of alignment yet, but they give off a scummy stench. The whole contrived/seems contrived has been gone over well enough. But if you're not going to stick by what you posted, why make these quotes at all? It's suspicion on people that he won't even back up properly himself. If you "don't want to lose them", that's what fucking notepad/excel/word is for. What's pushing me towards kj instead of Shady though is the first 2 paragraphs. The first indicates that he's been around long enough to have mafia experience of previous DrH's games. In the 2nd he wants to focus on scumhunting, and yet has done none - it's just a totally empty promise. "Let's all do this! Except I won't myself! haha!" Much more than I feel with Shady, he should really know better. ##Unvote ##Vote: kingjames01 | ||
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On October 02 2012 00:09 Kreb wrote: This had me interested since I've only experienced town-kush. Posting since more people might want to check it out (Im assuming this is what marv means): http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=367548¤tpage=75 yeah, for a more accurate clicky http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=367548¤tpage=75#1489 | ||
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On October 01 2012 23:51 risk.nuke wrote: Marv, thoughts on Sharrant? I'm fine with Sharrant atm. Yes he took ages to come in to the thread (but hello austin, 1 post, talis, Admiral A, 0 posts...) but having done so he gave his full thoughts on the hot topics, which is what I'd want from a latecomer. | ||
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The rest of talis' case is just bad. How is VE stirring up things a little (not even a lot, and he doesn't keep harping on about it) in the slightest alignment indicative? VE happily does the same as either town or scum. The 'low-hanging fruit' business barely merits a response. Can otherwise be read as "comments on stuff relevant to the thread". And the hypocrisy behind the activity thing is just immense. I find the entire case quite scummy, but it's ameliorated by the fact that talis didn't know of VE's activity stuff, and could have had terrible confirmation bias for the rest of the case. I'll be looking for talis to conform to *his* town meta with more posts and contributions. BC: that's news to me about kj's meta, I've never seen him play before. Going to have to reconsider. I don't really share your feelings about risk though, the biggest surprise to me is how much and the length with which he's posted. It seems he's already posted more than in his entire scum game in Bureaucracy, I'm not feeling it. | ||
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On October 02 2012 06:59 BloodyC0bbler wrote: ebwop Do you at least see why I would be suspicious of him at least marvel? and you have your read disagreeing with mine based on his previous game meta? I mean, you've seen how risk plays, right? Generally? The most suspicious thing I've seen from risk is his discouragement of a new bandwagon with loads of time left until deadline, but even that's not that strong. | ||
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- he gives way too much thought and time to setup speculation and shenannies and can go off on tangents. So with that alone I wouldn't find him banging on about spy that relevant, except for two things (which you mention) - the fact that it specifies pretty damn clearly in the OP that all available role names are known to us - that's all he's talked about having been absent for a long time. If you're gonna derp around talking about setup and spy lololol you'd imagine you'd at least fucking read the setup first. Gonna give his filter another look. Anyway I'm gonna unvote kj for now ##unvote | ||
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I've never thought of slOosh as the most prolific poster, but he's usually impactful as town, and a bit less relevant/disconnected as scum (Bureaucracy, erm... Dwarf). I'd like to see more from him but I'm not touching a lynch on him today. | ||
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Like, see how he's been posting in that other game he's in and not this one? Not caring about this one? Yeah, scummy as shit, except he did the same thing in rock band as town. | ||
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On October 01 2012 23:03 annul wrote: holy shit, seriously? what an easy decision. ##vote kushm4sta before abandoning the thread. It's a weak as shit vote and pays no heed to anything said about kush before or after that point. Otherwise known as a scummy copout. | ||
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Why do you think austin has a higher chance of flipping scum than annul, BC? | ||
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On October 02 2012 09:12 Risen wrote: Really? What's my town meta vs scum meta? Seems to me like I've been able to use "meta" in the past to hide and make people think I'm town. Seems to me like ANYONE with half a brain can just "act like their meta" and "poof!" towny. I'm not going to get into a big meta conversation with you, but go take a look at XXX analysis thread and see how much Ver refers to players' previous games. Or how Foolishness (#1 townie TL?) almost always includes meta in his cases | ||
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On October 02 2012 10:05 VisceraEyes wrote: It looked serious enough by players whom I consider to be serious players. Anyway, I do want to know your answer to that or I wouldn't have asked. I mean, yeah I'll post just to read my own typing on occasion, but generally speaking if I specifically ask someone a question, I enjoy an answer.  Also your read on Kush hasn't changed I assume? Have you considered just like...noob town? Because that's what kush looks like to me. What do you think of austin? I'm seriously struggling with where I want to place my vote at the moment. I don't want to lynch either kush nor kj, which leaves austin/Shady. Between them I find Shady scummier, but we're kinda just waltzing towards his lynch in an eerie fashion. I also went back and had a look at Mementoss, and he just seems kinda nullish. Deadline kinda sucks because he said he was going to look for scum an hour or two ago, and he could still be doing that, but I can't stay up forever :/ The most damning thing on austin imo is the very fact we're going towards a Shady lynch, austin knows he's under pressure and he's kinda contributed a little bit on Shady and then jumped ship again. | ||
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On October 02 2012 10:54 VisceraEyes wrote: Well, I went over austin's filter and was coming back to tell you guys that I didn't want to lynch him based upon it, and then I saw two walls of his. We're not lynching austin today. I'm liking a Node lynch. I do NOT think we have the votes to make it happen. I still like a Shady lynch, but more and more it's feeling like an angry townie ragequitting the game more than a scummy manipulation tactic. However his explanation for his trolling was totally bullshit and I can get behind his lynch more than kj/austin. I have very similar thoughts to this indeed. There are still some of us around and votes are split. Let's see if we can push Node? As with you I prefer him to Shady and Shady to then anyone else. | ||
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##vote: node | ||
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On October 02 2012 11:19 VisceraEyes wrote: "Hey scumbuddies Marv and austinmcc, how can we save our scumbuddy ShadySands from imminent lynch?" -scumVE "I've been hoarding this Node case since he made his second post. I was afraid to post it but..." -scumAustin "DO IT!!!" -scumVE and scumMarv in unison "But what if they..." "DO IT!!!!" this is actively playing against wincon :<<<< | ||
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On October 02 2012 18:54 Kreb wrote: Hmm, this kinda rivals marv's earlier claim about Kush. And considering: -I think marv acted scummy in the Node case -marv kinda defended Kush when early votes started to land on him -Kush was also an early joiner of the Node wagon -You think Kush is playing a toned down scum game Kush could definitely earn a spot in my scummy-looking group of austin/VE/Marv. Here. Let me tell you why you're fucking awful. You're fucking awful because you've already managed to make a 4-man connection before anyone involved (node, austin, kush). Who do you think is better at understanding meta, newbie thrawn (no offence intended at all, just fact) or me? Who *have* we had flipped? We've had Shady flipped. Confirmed town. What drugs are you on when you're looking at those on the Node wagon as the most culpable, instead of the people who derailed it back to Shady? Damn right I defended kush, I think he's playing to his town meta far more than his scum meta, and he's such a god damn easy lynch for scum just to park on going "lol scumslip must be scum." Looking at the voting list, the interesting points are players like BC, Matt, Keir, talis. It became clear kj wasn't a realistic lynch target with plenty of time to spare. BC came in, contributed some, then totally disappeared. Not sure on Keir. talis may be the worst of the bunch with his awful case on VE and subsequent total disappearance. | ||
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On October 02 2012 08:33 Mementoss wrote: -snip- Now to search for scum since shady sands most likely will be modkilled. To which I said a couple of hours later: On October 02 2012 10:34 marvellosity wrote: I also went back and had a look at Mementoss, and he just seems kinda nullish. Deadline kinda sucks because he said he was going to look for scum an hour or two ago, and he could still be doing that, but I can't stay up forever :/ Except Mementoss never came back or contributed to the scumhunt/discussion. | ||
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At the time I started the voting off, the austin wagon was already not getting off the ground. Before I laid my vote, the count was at Shady: 9, austin: 3. And in fact people were consolidating on to Shady; when I placed my vote, the previous 5 votes had gone on to Shady. For Node to be a 'distractionary' wagon, it would certainly be a distractionary wagon off of Shady. Now tell me how this makes sense? | ||
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On October 02 2012 23:55 annul wrote: it looked an awful lot like shady was getting modkilled. easy way to take out two towns in one day.... This is just insidious claptrap. As an experienced player you should know better than this. Playing for modkills is really stupid, pretty much as evidenced by what happened in this game. On October 03 2012 01:58 annul wrote: and another thing (prior to the last 5 minutes of the day), assume my arguments about "i didn't actually defend shady" are terrible (they're not) and you, as a town reading this, honestly believe i did defend shady... SHADY WAS A GREEN! holy fuck, imagine that: i did my job as a town player in trying to stop a mislynch! this is a bad thing apparently to austinmcc I can't even tell if this post is actually serious. You did your job stopping the Shady mislynch (in your eyes) by actively derailing the wagon that had come up to... stop the Shady lynch? Really?! In the whole lead-up to the deadline you objected to things on 'procedural' grounds without actually giving good reasons based on actual play. Nor did you present a realistic candidate (no, Z-Bo half an hour or whatever before deadline does not count). What you did succeed in doing is deflecting the wagon back on to Shady, but to what end? Shady was too easy, Node was too easy, what would have been 'acceptable' to you at that late hour? | ||
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My perspective on the Node wagon and how it went down: there were clearly a good number of people who weren't satisfied with the main options - kj, austin, Shady. Whereas Node was both lurking/not giving a crap about town, *and* looked scummy while doing so with his odd defence of Shady. | ||
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On October 03 2012 04:41 Kreb wrote: Well, theres is still the possibility of it being an austin-distraction. Or just as a general distraction from, well, any mafia. Theres also the purpose of just pushing for different townies left and right because it both creates confusion and probably makes it easier to blend in (if theres votes all over the place, everything is "ok", so mafia can pick any stance they want and seem genuine with it). I still dont see Node as scummy at all from his posting, and the way that wagon happened makes him look on the townish side. You're not making sense. The Node push makes no sense from a mafia distraction point of view because Shady was a townie heading inexorably for the lynch. It's in these situations mafia are usually happy to sit back as town happily hops on to the townie wagon. On Node: tell me, does his posting look like he cares for town? iamperfection pointed it out perfectly earlier: When Node was at great risk of being lynched, did he come in to drop reads and shit? No, he came in to call town stupid, and then promptly left again without making any reads or anything. How are you reading this as townie? You also, presumably from your attitude, find his defence of Shady townie. How? Want to talk about your connection stuff a little. You don't even realise how strongly you're doing it, or how it's affecting how you think. We have: On October 02 2012 08:23 Kreb wrote: Anyway, time to put down my vote. Disregarding the first trio (kush/kj/shady) which Ive said Im not feeling too good about. -snip- Austin on the other hand indeed had a pretty bad reason to vote for KJ. And his obsession with the spy comment seem a bit..... out of place. Cant say Im feeling super convinced about this either considering how early it is into the game and the length of peoples filters, but meh, gotta place my vote somewhere. As such: ##Vote austinmcc You place your vote on him and you're not sure at all. Your very next post goes into theories about the Node wagon and how it looked and how it makes austin look much worse (which I think I've helped establish that it doesn't really). So you, yourself, never actually had strong feelings on austin if the quote above is true, until you started ladeling Node/austin/me/VE/wagon stuff on top of it. | ||
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On October 03 2012 05:27 austinmcc wrote: Marv, I don't know kreb's play well/at all, but right now I'm not as scummy on him as I am on other players, and at the very least it seems that pushing him is just going to get things more and more twisted up. aye, it's why I've read his response and I'm not replying for now, as it's fruitless. I'm seeing him as misguided townie atm. | ||
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iamp: you may only use the term if you bring with it the sense of arrogance I use it with. Anyway, Mattchew, come talk to me about your play, it's looking pretty damn scummy to me right now, especially after the first half of Day 1. You voted kj yesterday lunchtime or so, and we have this post: On October 02 2012 08:21 Mattchew wrote: BC mind telling me why you think i am scum? also, I could get down with an austin lynch. he doesn't feel like he is hunting scum as much as he is hunting for an easy out to vote. I am willing to ##unvote for the meantime. I am caught up on the thread but don't actually understand some of the arguments. You 'unvote' here in the thread but you do no such thing in the Voting Thread. You also say you're down for an austin lynch here, but you never elaborate on this again, instead going on with: On October 02 2012 08:47 Mattchew wrote: lets lynch sloosh On October 02 2012 08:49 Mattchew wrote: sloosh hasnt done anything after coming in complaining about the thread being bad. You don't talk about austin anymore at all, and instead casually suggest lynching slOosh. Except you never seem serious about it, you're just dropping his name there and off you go, not to be heard of again during the Day. You're gonna have to explain pretty well what you were thinking here as it looks scummy as shit to me. Posting for the sake of posting and not taking actually taking any real stances. Absolutely nothing to say on how the lynch went down or anything pertinent at all. Scum bro? | ||
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On October 03 2012 07:15 BloodyC0bbler wrote: This stands out to me for one major reason. It makes perfect sense for mafia to push node as a distraction case regardless of the fact shady flipped green. Ask VE or Node if they remember a game in the high 30's or low 40s run by FW with the weird mason mechanic (each player could mason any two players they chose but only two players) where on day 3 or 4 as mafia my entire team sat firmly on two sides of a townie vs townie lynch pushing each. Also pushing node as a "distraction" case would be perfect if austin is red. Why? Because it got heat off himself. However, this is me merely clearing up something I find instantly wrong and misleading. Yes, that's one way to look at it; on the flip side, the right thing for austin to do as townie is to make reads and push things like he did, and like Node very much did not. How are you reading the both of them? I find austin quite townie now. talismania - What is your current read on VE? Do you still think he is scum? | ||
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On October 03 2012 07:46 BloodyC0bbler wrote: For those still looking or interested Game I am referencing Had a quick peek at the playerlist out of curiosity. Seeing syllogism lynched day 2 was a bit of a shock to my system, heh | ||
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On October 03 2012 08:13 BloodyC0bbler wrote: He had to to avoid being lynched. As townie or mafia he had to do what he did. I find him less scummy then he was before, however it doesn't mean he doesn't still get my gaze for only pushing someone when his ass was on the line. I more stated what I did because of how you stated your post I responded to which basically stated mafia wouldn't do what he did, or have a reason to push a second townie candidate. Making a case on a terrible poster as mafia or pushing a lynch on a bad scum player on ones team is standard play. Ok, I get where you're coming from. I experienced similar with austin in the very last game I played with him. I voted for him on Day 1 for only talking about himself for a while then completely afking for ages when there was tonnes going on in the thread, but it turned out he was being lazy/dumb whatever, which is why I was so antsy about it this game. His contributions look more thought out, researched and I guess not-skewed than what I'd expect from scum, and I see them as good contributions. | ||
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With BC, I don't like how he came in, contributed, and left, but that doesn't seem that unusual. When he was here he seemed concerned with actually finding scum, whereas my memory of seeing him play scum last is that he didn't focus on that at all. Comparing him to a different player in Bureaucracy doesn't seem relevant. And yeah, annul is definitely scummy. I detest him objecting to pretty much every candidate just on the way the wagon went and not pushing people properly himself. | ||
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On October 03 2012 08:30 Mattchew wrote: nice paragraphs about yesterday? i merely answered your questions o.o I guess it's wrong to condemn you for writing so wordily when I was asking you about it, I think it's the reaction of seeing that compared to the.... nothingness during Day 1. Or perhaps worse than nothingness, actually being around and posting pointlessly. Tell me what you make of Mementoss and talismania? | ||
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On October 03 2012 09:17 annul wrote: "pretty much every candidate" = shady and node? hyperbole much? both main candidates + you not pushing anyone. Not too much hyperbole really :/ | ||
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what kind of fucking useless game is that? | ||
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gg glhf | ||
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On October 03 2012 20:45 mkfuba07 wrote: I think he felt like a lot of scum had outed themselves interacting with him. I agree with Kreb here, both about the most likely scenario, as well as the fact that speculating too much about it is effort better spent elsewhere. Now to find out where it can be better spent... [b]I feel we can safely assume marv will flip scum, so I'll be looking at interactions between him and other players. good luck with that, babyface. Bet you enjoyed the role that seemed specifically designed to be used on me, eh Risen? <3 | ||
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On October 03 2012 21:14 Z-BosoN wrote: Couple of thoughts from reading marvs filter, now that he is pretty much confirmed scum. First off, his reaction to kreb makes me raise an eyebrow. He was extremely aggressive for something that could simply have been a townie thought. Kreb also hadn't made an association case, he simply said that some people looked scummy. Also, kreb said that marvs node push made him look scummy and generally made a weak semicase vs marv. It didn't feel legit and marvs reaction felt forced. I myself don't know what I'm implying but I think this interaction will become useful later. There's also some interesting info regarding the node push. Marv stated that it didn't make sense at all from a mafia perspective, yet made the push. Pretty much an attempt at clearing suspicion. Now, I'm not gonna go and start accusing everyone on the node lynch because I myself sheeped it, as town. But Afaik, VE and marv basically started the Node push, and pretty much at the same time. Initially I thought this would clear node, but it's pretty easy to not actually make it go through as mafia. So, my conclusion from this is: VE looks pretty damn scummy right now. 1) He basically claimed he got RB(and its almost factual that at least one kill didn't go through). 2) marv showed weird hostility on the association kreb didn't make. 3) he co-led the Node push with another scum at the same time -> came from qt, quite possibly. They were pretty much caught with their pants down if it was indeed scum-influenced. This is all excellent. Or poor. Definitely one of the two. | ||
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anyway, I'm not dead yet. I might be town! !!! ! :< | ||
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On October 03 2012 21:39 Z-BosoN wrote: In my eyes you are but a shadowless wisp of life, condemned to whither away into a lonely void, unwanted - and unloved. Jesus man. You're a harsh dude. I'm still cute n shit. | ||
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On October 03 2012 21:38 kushm4sta wrote: ##fos ve all of the meta reads from thrawn are useless now. hey scummy. or... hmm. hey townie. third party? wow you're scary | ||
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On October 03 2012 21:46 kushm4sta wrote: there should be that paramedic role in every mafia game. then i'd never win as mafia again t.t | ||
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On October 03 2012 21:49 Kreb wrote: I'm pretty sure no one called out all three of Shady, Kingjames and Annul while simultaneously calling for a medic on a scum. Lots called one, someone might have called two, I'm pretty sure no one called three and Im 100% sure no one called all three + medic on scum. Kreb is a baws. He knows what's up. Maybe. | ||
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On October 03 2012 22:23 iamperfection wrote: Wait i don't get why is marv confirmed scum. Hes acting like it now but why was he forced to give up basically? Risen protected me and his role is that if he protects mafia he dies | ||
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I wasn't angry at being caught, by the way. Angry at the presence of an anti-marv role that I didn't know about, and so could do nothing to prevent. Not sure I could have done anything even if I knew. Basically that role fucks me up the ass. | ||
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On October 03 2012 22:39 mkfuba07 wrote: Well I would still have likely voted for you, but knowing myself I would have questioned it until you flipped. Thanks for making it easier for me ^^ you know i love you babyface | ||
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oh fuck. lol. That's kinda hilarious actually. | ||
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On October 03 2012 22:46 ShiaoPi wrote: lol ##vote: marvellosity Sooo give me some time to do some funky connection stuff with marv's filter now. Make it good! Or bad. Preferably good. | ||
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On October 03 2012 22:48 austinmcc wrote: I'm pretty sure that I was shot. It's a little difficult to tell. There's a chance someone used a detective role on me too? I thought this stopped being a clue game, lol. Also, ##Vote: marvellosity marv, if everyone in this game were a sherpa that you could hire to climb mount everest, which sherpa would you hire? Which sherpa has summited the most times? Which sherpa is actually one kid standing on another kid's shoulders inside a big coat, trying to make some sweet, sweet sherpa $ in order to buy food for their families? You are the answer to all questions dear. I've always wanted one of your funky questions, but not like this... T.T | ||
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On October 04 2012 00:43 VisceraEyes wrote: You enjoying this marv?  I'm not scum guys. But yeah, don't take my word for it. I'm rereading now. Be back in a bit. I may or may not be enjoying it. I might try to incriminate you... on the other hand I might not. Reread away, dear! | ||
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On October 04 2012 00:46 VisceraEyes wrote: You could at least pretend to not be scum dear. :/ I did. I called myself town earlier today. | ||
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Get your votes off me, bitchasspunks. | ||
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On October 04 2012 00:48 Keirathi wrote: I'm not exactly sure why, but this made me laugh extremely hard. Is that because you're scum bro? Or perhaps you're merely town. | ||
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or is it?! | ||
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On October 04 2012 00:56 Coagulation wrote: ...yeah my votes on marv WHY COAG WHY | ||
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I thought we had something after all the sex that night on omgus | ||
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shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh | ||
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On October 04 2012 01:15 Z-BosoN wrote: A bit defensive are we? Visceraeyes once told me that scum got all defensive when called out. That must mean you are scum. Plus, marv told me to shhhhhh that must mean that he didn't want everyone to know you are scum. Sup scum or does it? it probably doesn't. why would i draw attention to it? or maybe i did it as reverse psychology. Not sure myself at this point. | ||
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On October 04 2012 01:15 austinmcc wrote: HEY! That's not garbage. It's a legitimate question, which he dodged. Therefore, he's scum and we all voted him. yes that's why we voted marv | ||
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On October 04 2012 01:17 VisceraEyes wrote: Hey now you're lying...you are voting for annul, someone who's dead. :/ o shit you're right | ||
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marv said: aww thanks hunny coag said: wanna go to the cinema later and make out in the back rows? marv said: sure, if you buy me icecream coag said: deal! marv said: <3 coag said: <3 scumQT right there | ||
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On October 04 2012 01:27 kushm4sta wrote: stfu marv... i hate to be the killer of fun but marv is making this thread much harder to go back and read constructively. Please stop interacting with known scum. you stfu, pooface | ||
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On October 04 2012 01:32 Coagulation wrote: marv who are your scumbuddys? who do you think they are? | ||
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On October 04 2012 01:34 Coagulation wrote: cmon.. im sure theres at least one of them that is an arrogant twat that you would enjoy tossing under the buss for ol coag.. right? i got arrogant twat totes covered | ||
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On October 04 2012 04:42 BloodyC0bbler wrote: That is the single most amusing outing of a scum I have seen since A RNG shot toad a few games ago. Shitty that you were punished for bad play Marv, but well, if it makes you feel any worse.... I survived your shot. Thank you magical man who saved my life, as I didn't want to die again before day 2. No, I was punished for *good* play. Useless, bad mechanic. | ||
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let me think | ||
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On October 04 2012 05:15 Mementoss wrote: seems like your taking a page out of hiropros playbook from rockband lol *giggles* | ||
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it's like marv from Liquid City | ||
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*shown i'm really actually just a confused townie to | ||
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hey, I said that first! | ||
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On October 04 2012 06:24 VisceraEyes wrote: Hey I claimed RB - EXCUUUUSE ME that scum feel I'm horrifyingly manipulable. you claimed Rambunctious Boobies? | ||
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now unvote me. | ||
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no u | ||
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marvellosity said, a long long time ago in a galaxy far far away I'm gonna shoot that horrid annul | ||
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Now unvote me at once, you pesky bumballoons. | ||
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But I'll tell you tomorrow. And I'll be right about it too. | ||
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On October 04 2012 09:35 slOosh wrote: ? Oh. Yea that was what I was referring to, I guess I wasn't clear. Treatment of someone you think is 60~75% scum. you're 60-75% scum. Or do I mean 40-25%. Scum! Townie. Holy shit reversing 60-75 was hard. Anyway guys, if you leave me alive today I promise I'll shoot scum during the night and be all awesomesauce. | ||
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please don't lynched the claimed vigilante guise. i'm really townie, just look at my play today and how hard i've been hunting for scum. my cases are irrefutable. | ||
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Now that's just uncalled for :< | ||
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On October 04 2012 21:03 Keirathi wrote: @DP: the simplest answer is most often the right one. that you're scum? ha! No seriously, this guy is town. Maybe. | ||
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*waves* like, knowing who 3rd party is will HELP YOU later in the game. | ||
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On October 05 2012 02:26 austinmcc wrote: Does 3rd party have the no-flip kills or is that you guys? I have no idea what 3rd party has. Wanna guess who it is yet? | ||
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Even I am voting for me. That's how fucked up this town is. | ||
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Anyway, third party is very likely to be BloodyC0bbler. Thank me later. | ||
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it's still true | ||
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Go mafioso! <3 | ||
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Ou est les shitty pants? | ||
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Kreb, if you'd have lynched VE all over again, then you've learnt nothing from this game. Go back and look at what you did wrong. slOosh - not sure why you're even asking. Why would you need to fuck with your town meta to play scum? It makes no sense. You were just *so* goddamn far off your town meta, and actually you're a good enough / clever enough dude for this not to be the case. Post more, push more cases, etc. - it's very simple... VE, dunno why you didn't just accept framer, when I'd already flipped showing that I didn't just show up as town, but Lucky Citizen, as godfather - i.e. there was a precedent for role being changed as well as alignment | ||
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Without meaning to be rude, your own attitude isn't helping you. You just said, basically, "I committed this horrendous, game-losing mistake, but... yay! I'd do it again!" Which is silly. VE didn't play perfectly, but you went tunnel-tastic on him, and one of the roots of it was you WIFOMing on my actions. You were told by numerous players that using anything I did/said is an exercise in futility, as skilled scum players don't leave obvious tracks, and you can see this now. Again much as VE didn't play perfectly, there were far scummier players in the thread than VE. Both slOosh and ShiaoPi literally had no town features about their play. A couple of players made strong cases on DP (I believe relating to his kush flip flops etc?) as well as his large amount of implied knowledge about KP. You're not stupid by any means, and if you'd taken a step back from your VE case (when plenty of people told you to do so), you are quite capable of seeing these other things for yourself. | ||
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On October 18 2012 21:16 Kreb wrote: Well thats more helpful at least. The only thing I have to say about that is that last game I played I was totally onto the people playing without town features with the reasoning that "If they were town they would surely not play this bad/anti-town". You might remember it if you obsed it. What happened? Both my to pscum reads for that reason were both town. So I started to see lack of any features as exactly that, lack of anything. Which initially had me all null on sloosh, shiao and mattchew and I only started to suspect that trio when the field was thinning out and most other players remaining were more or less townish. I never really suspected any of them due to their actions...... because there were no actions. Would you suggest always lynching players lacking of town (or any) features? If so, I'll definitely take it into account. One of the hardest things in mafia is distinguishing between lazy/absent/bad town and scum, who have similar features. Honestly, Matt *could* have been scum. But there were things about his brazen attitude that could have tipped you off otherwise. ShiaoPi - iamperfection made a really *excellent* point, sadly ignored by most of the thread, that in an almost concurrent game as town, he repeatedly shouted at town for lack of activity. This should be lynchable by itself! The nature of his defences, when he appeared, how he appeared to jump all over DP. All scummy. slOosh - if we contrast with Matt, slOosh pretended to make contributions, without ever actually doing so. Matt was just like "yeah i'm doing jack shit." slOosh popped in sometimes, made some conversation, maybe once made a case on a townie, and then left again. This is scummy in itself, but when compared to his usual meta (leader, helpful, strong) it's absolutely damning. | ||
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edit: DP, you definitely played the best, and as town I'd have lynched you only after lynching the other two, but the cases + your implied knowledge (you went crazy in scumQT at your own slip remember) were lynchable as well. | ||
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On October 18 2012 21:37 Kreb wrote: I gues you have a point about Shiao, but I dont have that meta knowledge really. Last game he was quite inactive until only like 5-6ppl remained too so I didnt consider him to be too far off compared to what I saw him as town. Sloosh I wouldve found it very hard to lynch for that reason though. There were practically identical cases on Sloosh, VE, BC, Mattchew. And probably to a lesser extent on one or two more. "Too off their meta, much less helpful than usual". I dont think anyone couldve confidently single out Sloosh's scummyness compared to the others. Especially if you dont have any meta knowledge about them yourself. But maybe I should be harder on non-contributors. Its probably gonna lead to quite a few policy-mislycnhes, but in the end maybe its worth it. Well, that's why it helps to look into people's meta a bit. If you read the XXX analysis, Foolishness, probably the strongest town player TL Mafia has seen, uses it extensively in his cases. Look at Shiao and how he randomly came in the thread screaming at DP and then left again. What's similar about that to LVII? VE was very, very clearly more invested in the game than either slOosh or Shiao. Just look at the length of his filter for one. Or re-read his filter with townie eyes, and at many points he was clearly interested in finding scum. Can you say the same for slOosh and Shiao? BC made it abundantly clear why slOosh was scum, and Blazing caught on to Shiao very early too. BC played with classic 3rd party characteristics. He's a classic day 1 shot, so him being saved would not be surprising on Day 1. But when he was around he was making good contributions, while at the same time not really being invested in town. That was my genuine read when I was alive and was correct. It's also why BC outed my entire team before he left the game | ||
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you have to take stuff as a whole | ||
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On October 19 2012 02:44 slOosh wrote: No, I'm asking what does that look like? Am I striving to play like town that is having a really bad game (all wrong reads etc.)? Am I expecting to get caught in the early - midgame and center my play around that? Like for this quote by Incognito from general mafia guide That's basically all my town games (majority of games I'm shot D1) - if it is my meta to always become that person, and it's disadvantageous to become that person as mafia, what do I do? It's disadvantageous to become that person as mafia if you cannot keep your story straight. In LV I was considered townie town town, and I managed to maintain that facade for 8 (!) cycles for the win. Ugh, it's kinda hard to explain for you, because that was also before I acquired your knack of being NKed early, but this also means I should be able to help you here :x Like, I try to emulate my town play as much as I can, but I just make tiny little adjustments; like I might not pursue a scumread who is my team-mate quite as aggressively as I might otherwise, or perhaps I'll bring up a candidate at just a slightly different time from when I normally might to try to achieve something in-thread. Or perhaps there's a body of evidence on someone and you take one conclusion that looks logical, even though as town you may have reached another, also logical conclusion. Things like that that can't really be caught externally (i.e. by town) but are very subtly pushing your agenda. | ||
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On October 19 2012 05:14 slOosh wrote: Yea this is really helpful. I think it might just be a practice thing for me then. What's your view on bussing? Like for Node D1 I felt it was stupid to let him just die, which is in a sense sacrificing credibility for pushing your agenda with more force. As a "vet" or "usually dead by N3 or something is up" player, do you always play to survive to endgame, or do you actively make the most of these scum-agenda purchases to your eventual lynch? I never intended for Node to die day 1. The wagon achieved more votes than I expected. I took the calculated risk of creating the wagon quickly and hoping it would be objected to by townies so it wouldn't go through (which is indeed what happened) but I was scared because I didn't expect so many votes on Node like that, which is why I was pooping myself a little in scumQT. With your survive to endgame question: I just don't know at the moment. That's previously how I played, and successfully... but I feel it's getting harder to justify it when it occurs. When this game started I had planned to try a different style - ensure mislynches, and hope I'd done enough damage to town by day 4-5 that when I died the game was already won. Obviously I died much earlier, so meh. Generally speaking, though, towns in general are actually pretty resistant to lynching people because they're still alive - look at how little support a BC lynch garnered, even though he's a total vet and dies Night 1 with extreme regularity as well. So I believe playing the long-game is still quite possible. | ||
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On October 19 2012 06:16 talismania wrote: regarding sloosh's point: if mafia is always 1/4 the player pool and I have a pure town meta and I can make an obvious scum meta then aren't I not guaranteed town for all my town games, and therefore most likely to win most of the games I play? This is a thing I struggle with. I don't want to have to play worse as town in order to disguise my scum play. Because playing with as much effort as I give to town as scum simply isn't possible. none of this makes any logical sense. just because you're town more often doesn't mean you win more often. Basically you're just deficient as a player :/ But players like sandroba, palmar, foolishness have similar deficiencies, so *shrug* Just because you're clearly town as town, doesn't mean you win... | ||
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On October 19 2012 06:29 slOosh wrote: Do you guys have any tips in regard to staying consistent? I end up checking my filter to see what I said and make sure I align like that, but I don't like that. Is it just practicing in a way to "unsee" scum as scum and town as town? Not really. I just remember what I said. And it's ok to change your mind on someone if you explain it. | ||
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On October 19 2012 06:53 gonzaw wrote: It speaks for itself that you need to "find motivation" to play scum, while you don't to play town. tbf, it's true of a lot of people. I don't relish playing scum, I go "ugh" if I receive a scum PM. | ||
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On October 19 2012 07:09 risk.nuke wrote: It's not what I said. IF you feel the need to motivate yourself. Some people love the feeling of tricking and fooling the others, they're not good enough to catch you. Some enjoy hunting mafia. I do both but I agree with marv. It's more fun to be town because nailing a scumshit is <3. Couldn't have said it better myself ^^ | ||
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On October 19 2012 09:06 talismania wrote: True you don't win just because ppl know you are town. But I have only lost one town game and have lost all but one scum game. Also when town just being right and effective often guarantees a feeling of personal victory even if your team eventually loses. That's not true for scum. I'd also make the point that acting similar both as town and scum is dependent on your style of play. My town style is rooted in genuine enthusiasm and is therefore really hard to fake as scum. People that don't post that much have an easier time disguising themselves but I don't want to be an inactive player. Finally the more like your town self you are as scum the more you are less trusted as town. Marv you know this better than most given that people have an autolynch policy on you if you simply survive late. Just things to think about regarding some design issues inherent with mafia in general. Sure, but like... in mad men you were suspicious and shot by town vigilante. You've also had suspicions on you in other games. I believe you're creating incorrect causation with how you appear as town and your victory count. You also know I post a metric shit-tonne (more than you even) and I manage to get close to that as scum... I can handle people being suspicious of me more than they might otherwise. I haven't been mislynched in like my last 10-15 town games or whatever. Doesn't stop me catching ze scumbags. | ||
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On October 19 2012 13:36 talismania wrote: Also for sure I don't mean to say that me being town causes town to win. But you must agree that as town I'm way more helpful to my team than as scum. And that matters even if just a little bit when deciding the outcome of the game. Right. But my aim when playing is to be very helpful to my team whichever alignment I play, and I think I'm reasonably successful about it. You're creating this unnecessary dichotomy... largely, in my opinion, simply because you're lazy. | ||
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On October 20 2012 11:08 Shady Sands wrote: how can I improve? Read the thread more attentively. You get too caught up in the games sometimes and repeatedly bring up points that have already been explained. Look back at what gave you your scumreads and townreads and try to understand why you were wrong about them, and learn from that. | ||
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