Death Note Mini Mafia

On August 31 2012 16:19 BlackMamba24 wrote:
I sat down and read the whole thread now. I don't know Hapahauli's meta but I agree with Shady Sands' FOS. Hapahauli immediately breadcrumbs the VT rolename "detective" then qualifies/explains the post following it immediately.

Town wouldn't breadcrumb if they know mafia has a safeclaim and they wouldn't breadcrumb without knowing that. He didn't ask. Mafia, however, immediately like to abuse any defense they have. There is inherent guilt. If supplied with a safeclaim it's a very reasonable thing to do. I missed the Zephirrds post about the safeclaims because I'm very unattentive. When I first entered the thread, I only scanned and read the longer posts and made my comments about policy lynches. I forgot the game was starting tonight and saw my role PM right before I was about to watch a movie.

Why would a townie, after making a specific reference to his role name then immediately post that he will no longer be using real role names? Why would he even need to tell us that? Is he afraid someone is going to point it out as an inconsistency? the first two posts in the thread are him and they're both passively defensive. Scum like to announce things that are meaningless for some reason.

In his post history, he only goes on and on about lurkers and other bullshit like that. It's so tired and worthless. "Lurking is anti-town." What a revelation. Mafia are no more likely to lurk than town are and if town goes on a "let's kill the lurkers" bend how easy is it for the scum team to tell everyone on the team to just post a lot? It's stupid.

##vote Hapahauli

Also, just an aside regarding "reads". I consider them totally worthless. I will post and try to get someone lynched if I think they are mafia. I will not post a list of "suspects" or "reads" or make bullet points or anything like that. It has no value. Waste of a post. I almost made VE quit a game because I talked down on him so much for posting reads lists and other things like that so don't expect that out of me regardless of my alignment.

On August 06 2012 08:06 Hapahauli wrote:
‘Sup town!

Much to my delight, I’ve rolled Vanilla Townie this game – I hope strength in numbers shall prevail this game!

I ended up rolling mafia-goon in the last newbie game I played (Newbie Mafia XXI), and two members of my scumteam got away with blatant-lurking for days because of poor D1 discussion and a disorganized town. Our scumteam ended up winning that game in large part to this lack of productive discussion.

So to get things moving in a good direction, howabout some policy talk? I propose the following:

• We will not lynch highly-active members D1! Often, the most active members in games are townies. I suggest we be very mindful of bandwagonning on active/controversial players D1 – they often get lynched in newbie games and almost always flip town.
  
• We will focus our lynching efforts on less-active lurkers! Lack of discussion is bad for the town, and most mafia lurk/semi-lurk through the first few days of the game while they figure out how to play. I propose we keep the pressure up on non-posters day 1. Hell I don’t even mind a lynch-all-lurkers policy: in Newbie Mafia XXI, town would have had a 50% chance of lynching scum D1 if they went after lurking posters.

On July 16 2012 09:35 Hapahauli wrote:
Hey folks! I rolled Vanilla Townie (again) - let's lynch us some scum!



One of the lessons I learned from the last game (Newbie Mini Mafia XX) was how fickle meta-analysis can be. My case against Hopeless was mostly based around him mis-representing evidence and fingerpointing. The Meta was the icing on the cake. Also note that my cases/meta arguments against two players (Release and JingleHell) were ulitmately wrong. While meta has a place as supplemental evidence against players who are not self-aware of their own history, Otherwise, it lead you on a goose chase after a player who's in a bad mood in a particular game.

To re-iterate, meta is icing on the cake. We should always look for suspicious behavior and mafia-motive before even considering something like meta.

Suspicious behavior like the bolded part below:



That's a really subtle way to point out your newbieness. That's some mafia behavior right there.

FOS calgar

On July 05 2012 11:37 Hapahauli wrote:
Hai folks! Just opened my inbox to much relief: I'm a Vanilla Townie!

I would like to cast an FOS on JingleHell, who's actions in day 1 have been nothing but contradictions so far.





JingleHell opens the game by decrying D1 voting as "nonsense in newbie games," then immediately fires one out himself. When Harry replies with the innocent, "why is lightning fast vote scummy," JingleHell posts:



Not only does this not address Harry's question, but it has an incredibly defensive tone when he was not yet attacked. Sounds to me like someone who is very paranoid in the early game...





JingleHell posts another crusade against bandwagoning and day 1 voting, despite his earlier vote against YourHarry. In addition, he's very adamant (almost panicked) about this "avoiding bandwagoning" business. From a townie perspective, what incentive does he have to discourage bandwagnoning only a few hours into the game? I would understand if this was a day or a half-a day before the lynch, but seeing who does and does not bandwagon provides us townies with time to provide good reads. It makes no sense to take such a staunch anti-bandwagoning platform so quickly into the game.

Finally, Jingle Hell has been content to laugh off a legitimate post against his early-game behavior by lazermonkey.

Lazer's post ---> http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=349066&currentpage=7#132



No defense, and completely ignores a topic worthy of response.

In conclusion, FOS on JingleHell. His actions regarding D1 voting are contradictory, and he's taken a very suspicious stance on anti-bandwagnoning so early into day 1.

On September 01 2012 02:16 Hapahauli wrote:


What does this even have to do with my first point? I'm suggesting that players who lurk in this format deserve suspicion. This has nothing to do with "bad townies" or whatever. Also, this ain't a newbie game, and I think everyone here knows that lurking is bad for town.

Also, I have no idea what your last sentence there means...



So I'll take it you're no longer suspicious of me then?



No. It prevents players from taking stances on specific players. Sure we could end up lynching a lurking townie D1 - it happens. But the votes give us so much information for future days, and an "RNG" vote deprives us of this.



I didn't see anything in Marv's filter about MrZentor... you're talking about momentoss, right?

On August 31 2012 22:35 ghost_403 wrote:
Risen's play this game is a little off from the Risen we all know and love. Not sure exactly why as of yet. Could be it's just been a while since he's played.

On August 31 2012 23:27 ghost_403 wrote:
Risen is very aggressive in Mafia when he plays town. He's abrasive and abusive and plays hard. In this game, I haven't seen that quite yet. I'm still trying to decide why that is. It could just be that we're 12 hours into the game, and he hasn't had an opportunity to call anyone stupid yet.

On September 01 2012 03:49 ghost_403 wrote:
Can't change my mind on Risen until he comes back and starts acting more or less Risen.

On September 01 2012 09:04 ghost_403 wrote:
Next, Risen is a bit off. Everyone said that. Next!

On September 02 2012 00:23 ghost_403 wrote:
Hey guys!

---

Scum: MMToss, Risen, and S+B. I'm not convinced that's the scum team by any stretch, but those are the people in the thread I think are acting scummy. (Side note: I have no idea how many scum there are in this game at all. I'm assuming there is a team?) MMToss is a carry over from yesterday. No part of how the day played out makes me change my opinion on him. S+B, I'll comment on that at the end (new stuff in thread between when I started writing and finished writing).

As far as Risen, Node is right. We have to hold him accountable for his part in the Palmar lynch. As town, Risen is aggressive and abrasive. As scum, Risen worships chaos (See TLM LIII). This is looking a lot more like scum Risen. Pressure him today and watch what happens.

On September 03 2012 04:47 ghost_403 wrote:
Also, he completely missed the reason that I though Risen was scum. Risen is not playing to his meta. Based on my own time constraints, I didn't have time to write out to the thread exactly why I believed that. I was putting it out there and hoping someone else would take the time to decide if I was right or wrong.

On September 03 2012 04:57 ghost_403 wrote:
Risen still seems off to me, and I need to put some time into reading his filter in order to figure out what's going on with him.

On September 03 2012 04:42 marvellosity wrote:
Why ghost is scum:

1) How he pressured Hapa for his vote on BM24. Any of you reading the thread know that I had a back and forth with him about it, and it's basically because it didn't seem his view was from a particularly townie mindset - remember ghost had BMB24 marked down as scum in his s/s, but was pressuring Hapa for voting for him? It doesn't add up.

2) He had a really weak vote on Mementoss. And he doesn't give an actual proper reason for his post until he's made several more posts in between.



At this stage, we don't even really know why ghost's vote is on Mementoss in the first place. There's a misplaced conviction. He finally gives reasons for the Mem lynch (which amounted to him rehashing a Mementoss post), probably when it dawns on him he can't just vote for no reason.

3) Mementoss picked up on ghost's long post and I followed up on it. There are things that don't make sense from a townie mindset, like where he voted s&b, but if s&b was town, I somehow got scummier (even though he was voting him too)

4) In that same post, he says this:

"Looks like S+B probably fakeclaimed miller. Ballsy play on his part. This pushes Hiro to town read, and confirms what I suspected on S+B."

Confirms what he suspected? How can it confirm something that was never really brought to the thread? :/ Earlier he said his play had been 'a bit off', and also:



All these points aren't massively strong by themselves, but added altogether I think it shows that ghost is scum.

On September 02 2012 01:24 Mementoss wrote:


This is the kind of post you make before you die. As of now it does nothing to help the game. It makes you look like your doing something, but really it's more confusing than anything to give your read on everyone in the whole game. None of his reads are really explained at all. This whole post screams scum to me, and I'm pretty surprised im the first person to mention it. As scum, you can pretty much put anyone in whatever category you want, to try and manipulate the views of others. You know the alignments of players, so he can distance himself from his scum team while looking like he's contributing. He also has all his basis covered for future mislynches.

Mementoss was the 2nd highest lynch yesterday so he's going to keep mentioning it so while everyone is still curious about it he can push for a second mislynch. He finds SnB scum, so lets kill him, if he flips town, Marv will most certainly be scum and we can mislynch him. Also Risen started the Palmar lynch, so lets lynch him! I'm not saying Marv and Risen are definitely town. What I am saying is ghost is clearly keeping his options open without really giving any helpful information or committing to any options, so if he switches wagons, he can refer to this post and say , well yeah I mentioned it here.

I will bold the parts where ghost puts blame onto other people for the lynch yesterday or downplays the intelligence of others, to try and re-enforce what a good and noble townie he is. When yesterday he did nothing to help the lynch or help find scum, yet alone even make a case.

Additionally, another thing he does to make himself look like good old useful townie ghost is take credit for things that never happened. Such as the last line of the post, "confirms what I suspected on S+B." when in reality, ghost never mentioned SnB in his whole filter as a scum possibility. He is now doing the same thing yesterday, jumping on the lynch wagon after it starts to gain a bit of steam.

I will also re-quote Shady's case on ghost from day 1 as it is still relevant and is a lot of what I felt made ghost seem off in day 1.
Shady's Case Starts here


SnB's alignment has nothing to do with whether ghost is scummy or not. Im not sure which is more scummy ghost or SnB.

But I think I will be voting for ghost because his entire game speaks scum to me for SnB it's just a questionable claim that we can't know for sure is fake, its based mostly on speculation.

##Unvote:StrongandBig
##Vote: Ghost_403