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Despair doesn't become you - and a no-lynch isn't the end of the world. Prob, your case on Matt was, literally, 16 minutes before deadline. Did you feel it was strong enough to lynch him? Really? It didn't feel thrown together at all?
And you were freaking out at me, why? Because I caused a no-lynch over a guy who the only case against him was literally made 16 minutes before the deadline?
Snap out of it guy, we're in the same position we were in yesterday, only now we have reactions to the wagons and soon we'll have NK information (or hopefully not! ^^). We're not in a bad position.
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yo, sorry I wasn't around to defend myself or consolidate for the lynch, I just woke up 5 minutes ago (it's 6am my time)
On June 27 2012 05:31 prplhz wrote:
I didn't ignore you, I read your post alright.
No I wouldn't (and I know because I just replaced into iGrok's mafia) but I don't think that means that everybody would react like that. He is using a dumb excuse for creating content and that's townie enough to me right now. von Klaust II wasn't even under any pressure, I think you voted him for lurking and that was it.
You'll also see that xsksc isn't actually defending von Klaust II's standpoints, he actually starts out by saying (correctly) that he can't take responsibility for them or explain them. He just answers the questions to create some sort of content and get a kick start into the game and I think that looks pretty townie.
This sums up what I was gonna say nicely, thanks.
I took a completely different stance on marv than von Klaust did, too, so I'm not sure why people think I'm trying to justify von Klaus's opinnions.
On June 27 2012 12:35 Mattchew wrote:
##unvote
##vote xsksc
He is bussing his teammate and is lurking and is afraid to post freely in the thread. He has no opinions on others.
And prob, I am first and foremost trying to avoid a mislynch, me being dead wont do the town any good
Lurking and afraid to post freely? No, it's called being asleep.
I have no idea you're so sure that I'm bussing Rasta O_O
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So you'll be happy to note that marv didn't die xs...what do you think about the no-lynch and the events leading up to it?
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On June 27 2012 14:17 VisceraEyes wrote:
So you'll be happy to note that marv didn't die xs...what do you think about the no-lynch and the events leading up to it?
Well, I started to get a bit worried that I might have been wrong about marv, when I was reading this bit -
On June 27 2012 10:33 marvellosity wrote:
i'm literally done.
##vote: marvellosity
On June 27 2012 10:34 marvellosity wrote:
it's pretty much playing against my wincon and i might get modkilled for it, ya.
i can't bear that after everything i've put into this game the last 48 hours, prplhz, the guy who fucking pointed out how retarded the argument on me was, goes "meh, he might be scum after all".
Like, wtf, seems completely OTT for a townie who knows he is innocent... but it did succeed in giving people second thoughts, so I guess that's why I got a bad feeling about it.
Mattchew seemed like a decent lynch, considering how little time you guys actually had to come up with one - I don't really get why you jumped off at the last minute though.
On June 27 2012 13:34 VisceraEyes wrote:
And to be honest, he pushed the right button on me losing town the game. I didn't want people to sheep me onto him when I wasn't sure of his guilt myself.
Why would it be your fault in particular, weren't you like the 4th or 5th vote onto him?
I don't think a no-lynch is as bad as some folk are making it out to be, though.
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Seeing as it looks like everyone else went to sleep... VE, what do you think of risk.nuke (and his thoughts on me) after last night?
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I want risk.nuke dead. I'll elaborate later. Bedtime...sorry guy.
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I second that motion.
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Does prplhz come off as pro-town to you?
Because he doesn't to me, and VE said that prplhz usually looks incredibly towny when he plays town. I'm starting to believe that he is scum... It's mostly just OMGUS and meta, but still.
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On June 27 2012 13:59 VisceraEyes wrote:Despair doesn't become you - and a no-lynch isn't the end of the world. Prob, your case on Matt was, literally, 16 minutes before deadline. Did you feel it was strong enough to lynch him? Really? It didn't feel thrown together at all? And you were freaking out at me, why? Because I caused a no-lynch over a guy who the only case against him was literally made 16 minutes before the deadline? Snap out of it guy, we're in the same position we were in yesterday, only now we have reactions to the wagons and soon we'll have NK information (or hopefully not! ^^). We're not in a bad position.
this is all such bullshit. he was one of the ones you were calling scum for much of the day, for god's sake.
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Probulous, you can't give up, I need to sheep your vote.
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On June 27 2012 18:54 Shraft wrote:
Does prplhz come off as pro-town to you?
Because he doesn't to me, and VE said that prplhz usually looks incredibly towny when he plays town. I'm starting to believe that he is scum... It's mostly just OMGUS and meta, but still.
He really does not. This is untrue.
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On June 27 2012 19:07 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 13:59 VisceraEyes wrote:Despair doesn't become you - and a no-lynch isn't the end of the world. Prob, your case on Matt was, literally, 16 minutes before deadline. Did you feel it was strong enough to lynch him? Really? It didn't feel thrown together at all? And you were freaking out at me, why? Because I caused a no-lynch over a guy who the only case against him was literally made 16 minutes before the deadline? Snap out of it guy, we're in the same position we were in yesterday, only now we have reactions to the wagons and soon we'll have NK information (or hopefully not! ^^). We're not in a bad position. this is all such bullshit. he was one of the ones you were calling scum for much of the day, for god's sake.
Went back, and you didn't talk about him as much as I thought. Nevertheless there was a list of scum:
marvellosity, Mattchew, risk.nuke
and yet VE saved Matt from the lynch?
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erm, sorry for spamming but: VE, this isn't an invitation for an argument, i just want to know how he went from a scumread to saving him from the lynch.
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That's actually quite strange. It doesn't really appear as though VE was convinced by Mattchew's posts either:
On June 27 2012 12:45 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2012 15:07 Mattchew wrote:On June 25 2012 12:00 wherebugsgo wrote:
What the fuck
Truth + Show Spoiler [Probulous post] +On June 25 2012 14:40 Probulous wrote:MattchewYou started the whole Marvel thing and given his incredibly vague response why is this all you have to say about him Show nested quote +On June 22 2012 13:42 Mattchew wrote:On June 22 2012 07:29 marvellosity wrote:On June 22 2012 07:22 Mattchew wrote:Hi All, I want MrZentor dead. On June 22 2012 07:16 marvellosity wrote:On June 22 2012 07:14 VisceraEyes wrote:
Let's try and figure out a way to figure out if we're town right here and right now...
:/
Because it's going to help me a lot if I can trust you. I now know you're a fucking beast as scum. What do you suggest? you may quiz me and i will answer your questions. Marv, if you were to pick out the differences in your scum play and your town play, what would you point to? I like this question a lot. I think there are a couple of possible tells. But tell me what you think first. I dislike this answer greatly. The entire reason I asked was because of how strong your scum play has been recently, and that seemingly no-one (especially in this game) could finger you as scum. I was looking for an answer that would leave me with things to hold you accountable for. Instead, you dodge the question completely. On June 22 2012 09:50 marvellosity wrote:On June 22 2012 09:47 VisceraEyes wrote:On June 22 2012 09:42 marvellosity wrote:On June 22 2012 09:20 VisceraEyes wrote::OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Anyways look what I found guys! On May 30 2012 06:16 marvellosity wrote:On May 30 2012 06:16 VisceraEyes wrote:
Marvel, the correct response is "my thoughts are X and Y and Z"...my question of you wasn't an accusation, so there's no need to get defensive. Saying things like "I already said" and "I made a comment" are very defensive when all I wanted was your input.
:/ Much like Magic you are reading my responses as defensive when they were not. I'm just baffled you are asking questions I have already stated clear opinions on or at least alluded to. This was his defense in LV, the Zim themed large we were just in. Marv DOMINATED that game as scum, and look at what his first act of the game was (upon replacing in)! It was using his "meta" as a personalized defense against my accusations. Look at his defense this game! Oddly enough, it's a personalized "meta" defense again! Marv, your response? This is the second misrepresentation. Trying to compare a 'defence' in a game where I wasn't accused to my defence this game where I am in fact accused First misrepresentation: On June 22 2012 07:34 marvellosity wrote:
here's a clue
count how many times anyone said i said or even hinted at anything scummy in LV
see the pressure i was under at the start in magic at the start for wanting to shoot NT off the bat
compare to current situation
profit On June 22 2012 08:57 VisceraEyes wrote:
Probulous, what did you see when you went back and read Magic? When I went back, all I saw was a completely different opening strategy. I mean, he could just be doing a fast-expand or something, but it's looking kinda cheesy to me. :/ I clearly said what I was referring to in Magic and yet you try to pretend that you went and looked and didn't find anything. Despite the fact I said exactly what I was referring to. I "pretend" that I went and didn't find anything? I went and looked and I said EXACTLY what I found. I don't care about you wanting to shoot NT, nothing similar has happened this game to compare it to. When I went back, I found what I was looking for - you acting like a townie. You haven't done that this game. When I went and looked at your scum game, I found something there too - you defending yourself needlessly with meta . You HAVE done that this game. These aren't misrepresentations, they're observations I'm making. If you don't like it, STOP TELLING PEOPLE TO GO READ YOUR PREVIOUS GAMES. I've quite clearly stated I am not, stop it. The similar thing, VE, is that I wasn't afraid of saying something that was scummy in that game. In this game, unless you underestimate me which I think you do not, you should be aware that I know making a sidestep to Mattchew's question could be viewed scummily, and I'd avoid it like the fucking plague if I were scum. I don't like your grasping at straws to use "im smarter than doing something so scummy" as a defense. If you knew it would look scummy, why would you do it? It serves no town purpose to act willfully scummy. Show nested quote +On June 23 2012 04:10 Mattchew wrote:On June 23 2012 02:36 Snarfs wrote:Also, I'm still waiting for Mattchew to come back and explain this: On June 22 2012 15:23 Snarfs wrote:
Mattchew, you claim that you had hoped that marv would write down some things that he does as mafia so that you can hold him accountable, yet it just appears as though the most likely thing that will happen is, if marv is scum, he will become more cognisant of his flaws as mafia and be more likely to attempt to avoid them. It seems like you didn't fully think that question through. I figured that of all people he would have more insight as to his differences and tells in his scum/town play, he would have the most information. It was extremely early in the game and was what I thought a good time to go into a self meta analysis that if he were town, he would gladly bestow upon us the things that he would use to set himself apart from scum. Instead, he sidesteps the question completely, not leaving us with anything to hold him accountable or help us get a read on him. Then he says that he knew this answer would be viewed as scummy, which if something is scummy, it is anti-town. I don't see why he would post like that knowing it would not help town. From my reading it sounds like you think he is scum. You are certainly not happy with his reply. Which begs the question, if you are unhappy with his response but don't bother writing up a case, why ask the question? In fact you have nothing else to say about marvel at all. Then when you do push a case it is this terrible excuse for a vote on rastaban Show nested quote +On June 23 2012 04:10 Mattchew wrote:On June 22 2012 16:46 rastaban wrote:
Second, the focus of Marv makes me think of karma after seeing him do it to Gonzaw in our last game together. We need to be careful with tunneling though, when you push someone so hard day1, they will often come across as scum no matter what since the only content you have is them trying to defend themselves against accusations. He could be scum but I just want to say that we need to be cautious, as I feel the case against him is a bit biased. Now his day 1 "meta" is to spam 1 liners so I personally wouldn't mind him getting lynched if there isn't a better candidate but I feel like there is too much discussion on him this early in our day. Remember we have 48 hours, half that time hasn't even passed yet so I don't like the band wagoning on Marv so quickly.
That said I have a hard time getting anything from his filter right now. Some people analyze best when their quarry is under pressure but for me that introduces too many variables so I like to read posts where they aren't defending themselves. So marv would you mind answering the original question ( as leading as it may be) about what you feel are your tells, and second who do you feel is most likely scum? (big post by post case on Risk.Nuke that I am not quoting) On June 23 2012 03:47 rastaban wrote:
When I review MrZentor I see someone who hasn't contributed much, which, while scummy, isn't enough to lynch yet in my opinion.,Especially when he commits to delivering something tomorrow. I have seen players like Foolishness say the same thing so I am inclined to give him till tomorrow before I make my Judgment on him.
This all feels extremely middle of the road, I am ready to jump on a bandwagon but don't want to commit to anything scum play. He also contradicts himself about the talks about Marv, then contradicts his we have 48 hours post, by posting a case that he is pretty deadset on, about risk.nuke. Overall I just feel like Rastaban's posting has been flaky and his case on Risk is bad. To answer his question to the thread, I read his vote switch that he was not confident in a Marv lynch, and that he wanted to pressure a lurker with no content. Also, his first 30ish hour case doesn't take into account that Risk.nuke has played many many games before. ##Vote: rastaban Wishy washy and bad cases do not a scum make. Rastaban may be scum but if all he has done is be wishy-washy and push a bad case, he may be bad town as well. Of course you then jumped back onto your policy lynch of Zentor. What really confuses me is this Show nested quote +On June 24 2012 06:04 Mattchew wrote:On June 24 2012 04:54 prplhz wrote:Okay I wanted to write a case on Zephirdd last night but then I really had to sleep and I've been busy today but here we go. On June 22 2012 08:41 Zephirdd wrote:
This is a semi-closed setup. If there are 13 players, it's possible that 12 are medics and 1 is a scum. Of course that's retarded as fuck, but nothing is concrete and we shouldn't think "but it's not common to 2 of X" exist ever. at all.
In fact, we can't even confirm the existence of a SK until after the night phase.
I'm not sure about Millers instaclaiming. While it clears path for cops(as it's pretty obvious that they will show red), it also reduces the number of possible blues, making it easier for scum. At least what I understood from the setup is that Millers can't be blues.
If anything, Millers should be breadcrumbing and claiming in case a cop calls them guilty. For all other purposes, they should be *Vanilla*(unclaimed, aka. possible blue) to make it harder for mafia to shoot into blues. This is the post in question. People have already said that this is a bad plan and I agree with that. My problem isn't that he's suggesting a bad plan. it's that I think it comes from a scum perspective. Scum are much more likely to suggest plans that they think are bad for them. For scum, it doesn't really matter if millers claim or not but what Zephirdd focuses on is how it will make them confirmed green and not blue. Zephirdd thinks that that will narrow down the pool of potential blues that scum can shoot which will be a plus for scum. Townies would never focus on this because they don't really care about blues, they care about analysis and avoiding chaos and that's what miller claims will help them avoid. This is really the crux of my case but I'm going to write some more that might convince other people too. First Zephirdd is pretty suspicious about rastaban. Worst case ever into doesn't feel like your other games. He never does anything. Next he has an epiphany that VisceraEyes and marvellosity are scum and again he doesn't do anything about it. No vote, no push, no anything. He looks pretty convinced from what he is saying but he's not acting on it. In the end he jumps on the zentor wagon as the 9th voter, an ultra safe vote based off of two lines of analysis that has already been made several times by other people. What you guys think about this? what exactly are you trying to do with this? save your scum teammate zentor with a no-lynch? When prpl was the guy who started the whole thing. Your play is substandard mattchew. The only case you have pushed has been Rastaban which is not revealing at all. What happened the crazy bastard who fake claimed a hit in LV? Can I say "the weekend happened" (work into happy hour into NYC debauchery friday, graduation BBQ party saturday, NY Red Bulls game sunday)? Also, I fail to see how my thoughts on Rastaban are bad? Those reasons help push a scum agenda while showing a fear of posting in the thread. Prplhz's post on zeph came at a really suspicious time. He may as well have asked for a no-lynch because if his case had actually gained traction, thats what would of occurred considering the time and players available. I answered Snarfs question because it was asked of me. The discussion I believe had shifted away from Marv and he was no longer a lynch candidate. I don't believe that posting anything further about Marv would have helped town at that time. I will however be posting more on him in the next 24 hours while we discuss lynch candidates. I am attempting to post more concisely and be less annoying this game then usual due to complaints in past games. When I wake up tomorrow I want to do a big post explaining my scum reads. You may all hold me accountable for doing so and the reads that I present. For now I am going to sleep after a long weekend. Mattchew lynch is a go guys. On June 27 2012 12:53 VisceraEyes wrote:
If you're town, your death isn't necessarily the end of the game for town. Appeal to emotion AND fear simultaneously while you're at it.
I'm sorry if you're town, but I don't think you are. Get over it.
I wonder why he suddenly chose to unvote him.
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Well he says this here
On June 27 2012 13:34 VisceraEyes wrote:
And to be honest, he pushed the right button on me losing town the game. I didn't want people to sheep me onto him when I wasn't sure of his guilt myself.
I already mentioned that I find this weird...I don't see why he felt the entire responsibility was his, and why he was so worried about it.
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On June 27 2012 21:32 xsksc wrote:Well he says this here Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 13:34 VisceraEyes wrote:
And to be honest, he pushed the right button on me losing town the game. I didn't want people to sheep me onto him when I wasn't sure of his guilt myself. I already mentioned that I find this weird...I don't see why he felt the entire responsibility was his, and why he was so worried about it.
yeah, Snarfs laid the groundwork (first vote), Probulous really set the ball rolling, and rastaban then hopped on. No-one was sheeping VE :/
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VE you're so full of crap.
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marv, shoot xskcs please.
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marv, shoot risk.nuke please.
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EPT
