Student Mafia (New/Newish players welcome)
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Adam4167
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Adam4167
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I hope everyone who's signed up intends to fully commit to this. There are still a half-dozen people who posted in the Newbie Mini Mafia thread expressing interest and are yet to show up here, it looks like they're going to end up reserves/watching. | ||
Adam4167
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On December 03 2011 09:28 Incognito wrote: This setup is town favored. A usual setup would be 7 townies/2 mafia or 8 townies/3 mafia. In a 1 KP game, the ratio of townies to mafia does not matter as much as the number of allowable mislynches before the town loses. In the above two setups, town loses with 3 mislynches, in the current 10/3 setup, town gets 4. In addition, town has 2 guaranteed blue roles and 2 of the 3 setups has a medic. I would also replace the watcher with a tracker, as watchers take less skill to use than trackers. If the last Newbie Mafia is any indication, a little town favoring could balance things out. That game ended in flawless victory to the scum team. | ||
Adam4167
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What is the coaching situation? Are we being assigned to coaches privately through PM? | ||
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On December 04 2011 13:24 Velinath wrote: EBWOP because you guys post too fast: Blazinghand, I completely agree with your idea here. If we lack a case on a poster in the thread, lurkers are, regardless of alignment, anti-town, and they should be lynched in preference to a no-lynch. Given that, ##Vote: Bbite Let's hear from another nonposter. We cannot have no-lynches in this game due to the voting rules. I am all for lynching anyone who scum slips or is caught in an outright lie, as they're almost sure to be mafia. Lynching lurkers on the other hand, while I think they offer nothing to the town, also provides the town with very little new information and costs us an additional townie through a night-kill. As previously stated in the thread, bored townies are more likely to go inactive/lurk due to not having a very interesting role, whereas a mafia member has two teammates who are relying on him/her to stay active and try to achieve a win. | ||
Adam4167
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On December 04 2011 21:39 Tunkeg wrote: So are you trying to establish yourself as a boring townie by not posting anything or what? Adam, a couple of questions for you: What is your thoughts on Blazinghand's aggressiveness? How do you perceive him thus far? Is his play pro-town or anti-town? Any thoughts on xsksc's play? Is he a key player in this game? If he is scum, what effect will that have on the game? If my lack of posting thus far has crowned me as a boring townie, I guess it’s a mantle I’ll wear; I had a Sunday off and decided to go out drinking. My thoughts on Blazinghands aggression so far is that I feel he is trying to generate discussion. However, I question whether he is trying too hard to establish himself as a townie by his badgering. This, coupled with his apparent buddy-buddy relationship with Velinath has me keeping a close eye on both of them as I find it strange that they are apparently “BFF’s” after only 12 hours of play. So to directly answer your question, Tunkeg, I find his behaviour suspicious and erring on the side of Anti-town. 5 separate votes in 12 hours is akin to spam and is just leading the town around in circles, rather than focusing on any one target. Xsksc is someone I’m more familiar with after close examination of the Newbie Mini Mafia thread. So far he has begun discussion, scolded Blazinghands reckless aggression and defended himself well when called out. Is he a key player in the game? Not yet, but neither is anyone else. Is he pro-town? All signs are pointing towards yes. If he turns out to be mafia, id hope to think we can still catch him out and hang him even with his greater mafia experience over us. On December 04 2011 16:03 Blazinghand wrote: Adam has correctly noted that there are no no-lynches in his sole post. Helpful, but not enormously so. Also, he's certainly awake since he's Australian. I'm gonna slap my vote on him and wait for him to contribute some more. Maybe he's eating or out or something, but hopefully this will get more than 1 post Adam, I'd like to see you contributing to the discussion more. I'm heading to bed relatively soon, but when I wake up I hope to see a new post from you. ##Vote Adam4167 I don't necessarily think you're scum or that other people should vote for you, but you've only made one post, and that's simply not good enough. Hurry up. As previously stated, I went out drinking. And after I finish this post, I'm going to need at least 6 hours to sleep it off. I feel that by flinging your vote in every direction, you have cheapened the weight of your vote when you eventually do decide to settle on a target. I also feel the need to point out again that you have had 5 separate votes in 12 hours, which is almost half of the players participating. You’ve caught my attention Blazinghand, don’t slip =). | ||
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Firstly, before I thoroughly comb the thread, I feel like I need to respond to Blazinghand: My reaction to your aggression, Blazinghand, was shitty and misguided. I am not going to blame alcohol as I would have reacted in a similar fashion had I been sober. I am defensive by nature. I questioned your motives, but with a clearer head I can only come to the conclusion that your motives are to generate posts from everybody and get people talking to draw out mistakes from scum. Expect a thorough analysis in the coming hours. I have a lot of reading to catch up on. | ||
Adam4167
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Adam4167
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On December 05 2011 14:33 Grackaroni wrote: I was really hoping to read Adam's opinions before I went to sleep, but it is taking too long. Would like to see more Adam/EB(less pissed off and emotional) and Tunkeg posts. Good Night! This took longer to format then I thought it would. Apologies. My analysis: Bbyte + Show Spoiler + Bbyte takes issue with some of the criticisms I also held of Velinath, but his vote seems reactionary to Velinath voting for him initially. Does not have much in the way of post volume so there really isn’t much to go on here. He seems reluctant to jump on the bandwagon that’s formed on me, which in itself is not scummy because I’ve made myself an easy target. Blazinghand + Show Spoiler + Well I think I’ve already said my piece here. His aggression is ruffling feathers, that much I am sure. He has been consistent throughout the game in his attacks on people with low post counts and he opened the game with this mindset. BroodKingEXE + Show Spoiler + BroodKingEXE is suspicious to say the least. He posts up a one-line analysis on half of the players present, not very much effort put in at all. Then 2 hours later, he fires a vote in my direction with no explanation given. At all (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12592641). After being pressed a little he gives his thoughts on my larger post aimed at BH’s aggressive style. He takes issue with the fact that I apparently miscounted the number of votes BH has put out. BH did in fact only vote 4 times but the 2nd vote was a correction on a misspelling of the 1st vote. Honestly put, this is a piss-weak reason for me to earn his vote. He also takes issue with my lack of identifying a key player. I stated in the very post he quoted that BH was just flinging his vote in any direction and I felt they had no weight, why would I then go ahead and identify him, as a key player if I thought his vote was weightless? (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12593121) ElectricBlack + Show Spoiler + ElectricBlack has posted next to nothing so far but when he did post, boy has it created a storm. He says he would be more comfortable lynching Hassybaby, although gives no reasons at all. I’d like to hear the explanation for this (as would the rest of the town by the look of it). His snap at Blazinghand may be due to being fed up with the hounding he’s received thus far. While I don’t think he has conducted himself very well here, lets give him a chance to post his thoughts on Hassybaby in the morning and evaluate the merit of them. Ey215 + Show Spoiler + Ey215 has been pressed much like myself from the get-go and also reacted defensively. I cannot fault him for this as Blazinghand was being obnoxious towards him. The vote he places on me is understandable, but also unsupported. He claims to have no read on anyone at the moment and that I am probably the best candidate as a result (this is how bandwagons pickup speed..) (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12591630). After the ElectricBlack incident he applies ‘pressure’ (his vote) to EB. His votes seem to come without a great deal of support behind them, other then the fact that “everyone else was doing it”, this really presents me with a null read as he’s either a mafia getting momentum on a wagon or a townie sheeping. He was willing to give me the benefit of the doubt for a while; I will afford him the same courtesy. Grackaroni + Show Spoiler + Gackaroni opens by stating that he is against lynching lurkers (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12582520) and (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12583297) and here in capitals! (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12590849). He then turns his attention to me for lurking, asking me to step up, I was unavailable and thus earned his vote. Here (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12593813) he states that I am more likely to flip scum and I have given him no reason to think otherwise. I don’t see any issues here. Hassybaby + Show Spoiler + Hassybaby has very little to go on. He seems like a busy person and I can only take him at his word (much like everyone can only take me at mine) that he was busy with work and real life stuff. He then focuses in on BroodKingEXE for band wagoning me and for WIFOMing. I share his suspicions of BroodKingEXE, but I hope to see more. At the moment this is a null read. Jaybrundage + Show Spoiler + Jay’s reads on me seem weak and effortless. He labels me as scum for ‘lurking’ and says I come off as happy to fly under the radar and just posting to keep up (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12590767). While, I’ll give him the lurking thing (lurking and inactivity look awfully similar), I don’t think id describe my play as flying under the radar. I misguidedly attacked everyone’s most confirmed townie and have launched myself right into the spotlight by doing so. This is not apathetic behaviour. These reads feel fabricated because I made myself an easy target due to my inactivity and less than stellar response to BH’s aggression. Jay even states here (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12583286) that lynching lurkers is not a good policy, yet has focused a majority of his attention on me… for lurking (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12592678) and I have even earned his vote for doing so. This is very inconsistent logic. Jay also posts for the sake of posting, even weaving idle bullshit in like mentioning xsksc’s spacing? What is the relevance of that to the game? The rest of his posts seem equally as half-hearted and filler. Tunkeg + Show Spoiler + Tunkeg posted up some one-line analysis on the game earlier in the piece. His words were quite pointed and draw attention from almost everyone he ‘insulted’, behavior I wouldn't identify as scummy. After posting some more, he posts up another set of one-line analysis on each player in the game. His singling out of Hassybaby and xsksc strike me as quite odd, Hassybaby had not posted a thing and xsksc was being helpful. I do not see what he sees here and could use some further clarification from Tunkeg on how he has got to his 'scum reads' from whats been posted so far. His attack on Jay, to me, is justified, as I’ve covered in my “Jay” section. Velinath + Show Spoiler + Another person who is reluctant to jump on my bandwagon and railroad me. He took the right meaning out of my post aimed at BH even after I insinuated that both of them might be mafia (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12592166). He votes for me, but avoids an OMGUS vote, which would probably not look out of place here. Originally, I had planned to criticize Velinath for his large posting content with marginal substance. He has since rectified this with solid, well thought out posts. Xsksc + Show Spoiler + Xsksc has posted up some solid analysis after being prodded. He seems to be copping an awful lot of flack for being asleep (lol?). I like what I have seen out of Xsksc and appears to be a voice of reason for the town, discouraging blind aggression (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12584653) while also maintaining a firm hand over people who are being obstructive (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12594032). Xtfftc + Show Spoiler + His odd explanation of lynching all liars comes off as circular and.. well, odd. He’s posted very little else besides tacking a vote (unfairly in my opinion) on xsksc. He takes issue with a statement I wrote “I am all for lynching anyone who scum slips or is caught in an outright lie” (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12591319). I still stand by this statement. He qualifies with: On December 05 2011 07:28 xtfftc wrote: There's two problems with this quote. The first one is that this is exactly what mafia want. They want to focus on someone saying one stupid thing and lynch that person. Ask your coaches if you don't agree with me: lynching someone over a single "scumslip" tends to be main reason why towns lynch an innocent on Day 1. The second is that he mixes a "scum slip" and "an outright lie". We had a lot of talk about LaL and a lot of you disagree with me. You want a strict policy on it and although I think it favours mafia, it can also help town, so it's okay. What is not okay is trying to tie "scumslipping" to the same policy without holding a proper discussion on what we consider to be a scumslip and what we consider to be someone overreacting over bad wording. This is very pro-mafia as it gives them an easy way to push for lynches. You’d prefer we just let scum slip go until someone makes a whole bunch of them and then hang them? I’m sorry but that’s just plain unrealistic. Scum slips are rare and the odds of the same person making additional ones after a first one is next to nil. I think you’re making a mountain out of a molehill, Xtfftc. The TLDR version amounts to: I have scum reads on both Jaybrundage and BloodKingEXE I am willing to give ElectricBlack the benefit of the doubt until his next post. Everyone else Ill consider "town"/null as I am not trusting enough to ever consider anyone 100% town. As such, ##Vote: Jaybrundage | ||
Adam4167
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Adam4167
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On December 05 2011 18:41 ElectricBlack wrote: Then answer me, am I mafia cause I did something out of spite to him? If so, why? Spite isn't going to help us in this game. I can understand where you're coming from, voting without a reason does look shitty, however being obstructive or evasive does not aid the town effort in any way. Can you post your reasons for targeting Hassybaby that you hinted at last night? | ||
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I think xsksc was trying to prove a point that he was not happy with your play, because he felt it was anti-town. Punishing someone (lynching them) to prove a point is also anti-town, as EB has pointed out. Teaching someone a lesson for shitty behavior might feel 'right', but it does nothing to further the current game as it will invariably end in us hanging a townie. I think both of you are possible townies taking aim at each other. This pissing match has run its course. Xsksc, please take a look at my analysis, give your thoughts on it. Lets let ElectricBlack get back to posting his case on Hassybaby and see what that leads to. | ||
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On December 05 2011 17:59 xtfftc wrote: I'm on my phone at lunch, so I'll be brief for now. I think that Bke is the easy lynch at the momenand Ipm glad we have bettee targets now. Byte is my top lurker and he'd make an okay lynch if we end up looking at the lurkers. Xskc looks a bit beteer but he still hasn't lived up to his early play. I'll make sure not to throw away my votw for an unlikely candidate by voting for someone who wont get lynched like I did in xlvii and I encourage everyone to do the sa,e. Also, remember that last minute changes tend to help mafia. Out of the two best candidates I find Adam's dwfence much better (he is at least giving usomethimg to analyse), so I'll probably go for BE. I missed this post earlier through all the xsksc/EB drama. Xtfftc, are you encouraging bandwagons with the section I have bolded? I cast my vote in Jaybrundage's direction, even though I am the only one that's taken even the slightest bit of interest in him besides Tunkeg, because to do otherwise would be at odds with my analysis and reads. Good townie's should not be casting their vote based on the probability that the person will get lynched, they should be voting on whomever they have scum reads on regardless of the current vote situation. I am off to bed now guys. I have set my alarm to wake me up 2 hours before the deadline to contribute as much as possible before the day ends. | ||
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On December 06 2011 05:41 jaybrundage wrote: Ok so i am going to vote for adam. Adam does have a point tho i had posted no real case on him just my general reads. While i did call him scummy because he was not only lurking but also in a suspicious way. If no one calls out the lurkers then they can just stay hidden. Thats why BH put his vote on you and many other people. You finally put out some reads. But it was a OMGUS even then and a easy lynch target to boot. You even mention me talking about xsksc spacing. What the fuck how is that even relevant to me being a mafia or not. And then adam defends xsksc who seems like he might all so be potential mafia. I still will stand by my read of tunkeg i think he is only trying to get some solid posts out of people and i think he might have a lead on something but as it stands so far Im still going to be voting for adam My vote on you was not OMGUS. I clearly outlined that your reads felt half-hearted, your logic was inconsistent, and you were adding filler to your posts. I mention your post regarding xsksc’s spacing because it is a prime example of the padding I see from you, try posting some actual content. Why do you consider yourself an easy lynch target? I also singled out BKEXE and he had a vote on him and is drawing more interest from everyone, due to his lurking. I could have gone with him, but I felt you were the strongest scum read I had. On December 06 2011 06:21 Velinath wrote: I think Adam made a mistake saying what he said regarding bandwagons. I'm not sure how I missed this post earlier, but not having strong majorities = chances for the Mafia to swing votes later game. Remember 47? The Mafia vote-switched at 11:59 and managed to kill Palmar and almost got BloodyC0bbler as well. This is absolutely a matter for concern, and I think we should think about this - having a clear single candidate minimizes this possiblity. Granted, this is a possibility, but the amount of attention an 11:59 switch (or even a sub 1-hour switch) would draw on day one would surely mean we are going to hang a mafia on day 2. This kind of tactic really only shines on the last day of play. In regards to the Bbyte lynch that’s about to happen. Well… in my analysis I posted that he has a low post count, but also that he avoided taking the easy option and jumping on my case. I feel he’s going to flip town and we’ll have zero new information to show for it. He has almost no interactions with anyone so we have no idea how he was polarised to all of the people here. I’d really rather see Jay neck swing for the reasons I previously outlined. To avoid a similar situation on day 2, "lurkers" (primarily Hassybaby) can you please find some time to get into this thread? | ||
Adam4167
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On December 07 2011 04:59 Tunkeg wrote: What I find more interisting is the lynch on BByte. As I said before putting my vote on him, I feel he got bandwagoned, but out of the three candidates he was the "best". How do you guys see this lynch in hindsight? Was it the best we could do, with the information we had? I assume this question was open for anyone to answer, so: This lynch was shit. I said as much in my post right before the cutoff. He flipped town, as I predicted and what do we gain from losing this townie? We get another dead townie tonight on a Night-kill. We get ZERO information off of this lynch. Bbyte was not scummy, inactive sure, but there was not any noteworthy behavior that warranted a lynch. Who were his "enemies" that we should take a harder look at now that hes flipped town? Well, he didn't like Velinath for his earlier actions in the day. Granted, I noticed the same things, but since Velinath has been an asset to the town, running some good analysis and maintaining fairly active. So that puts us right back at square one... less two townies, unless there is some kind of miraculous medic save (if we even have one). This lynch was brought about by exactly what I said would happen if people didn't follow their reads and vote on the most scummy person on option regardless of the current vote standing. A bandwagon formed, spearheaded by Blazinghand, everyone merrily jumped on board because it was the easy route. I'm glad that people have recently started coming to their senses and not just blindly following the person who yells the loudest. Today, I vehemently suggest we lynch someone who is actually active and acting scummy rather than trading another two townies for no information by killing another lurker. | ||
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On December 07 2011 09:33 Blazinghand wrote: FYI it's also everyone's fault the lynch went the wrong way, since we all failed to capture a majority. I'm just saying that if you have a solid read, you have a BIG responsibility to convince the rest of us. ESPECIALLY if you're right. Also, most towns mislynch on the first day. Why are you being so defensive over this? I didn’t single you out and railroad you for this lynch because I felt your play was CONSISTENT with your stance towards lurkers. I specifically targeted everyone who jumped on the bandwagon and made it pick up steam so easily because they weren’t willing to stick to their own reads. Its OK to be wrong, I'm not out to get you. But everyone else really needs to be held accountable for why they are blindly following. | ||
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On December 07 2011 10:02 Blazinghand wrote: Yeah it's definitely JB. ##Vote: jaybrundage LOL I had a feeling you were trying to save yourself from being the NK, that's exactly why I never brought up your analysis. But on what I've said on JB so far in my analysis and also your pretty compelling analysis, lets do the right thing here: ##Vote: jaybrundage | ||
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On December 07 2011 10:02 Blazinghand wrote: I'd like to see a comprehensive JB case from you. I really would. I'm not ACTUALLY 100% on him, and I don't like voting on hunches, but we have lots and lots of time. Put together your case, and I'll put together mine, and lets post and see how it matches up. Ill get to work on this when I get home in a few hours. We have plenty of time, as you stated. Id like to let Jay speak more as well, to give me some additional content to work with. | ||
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On December 06 2011 09:45 jaybrundage wrote: BH i cant even understand your post what the fuck is hedging lol. Half of your statements are me hedging someone. So plz tell me what it means This is completely unnecessary posting, you could have easily looked this up for yourself but you are trying to play ignorant. I’ll save you that trip to google though and say it directly: you are being very non-committal in all of your posts. You are doing this so that when the people you implicate as mafia eventually flip town, you can say “oh, I wasn’t really sure and you can see that in my posts!!” Sorry, not buying it. Own your reads. Support them with facts. On December 06 2011 10:40 jaybrundage wrote: Fuck More vintage jay, posting shit for the sake of it. What purpose does this serve? On December 07 2011 09:49 jaybrundage wrote: Im going to write my post up on what i think went on this night. Sorry for being a bit inactive. I saw BH post about no posting and then was really busy so i didnt get around till now. But BH honestly i find this statement really suspicious. But BH you Succeded to capture the majority. You made the case against Bbyte and your case garnered the majority. It almost seems like your trying to take the chunk of responsibility off your back. I put down what i thought about adam. And said why i didnt like BBytes case. Im going back to make my posts about what else happened tonight. As well as response to your nice post about me. Thank you for that btw :D I don’t find this statement suspicious from BH at all. It IS everyone’s fault that Bbyte ended up dead. We had 6 people follow BH’s invoking of a lurker lynch almost blindly, that is their failings and as BH has pointed out since, its also the failing of everyone else that none of us had put forward a compelling enough case to keep Bbyte off the hangman’s noose. Trying to shift attention onto BH here is not going to save you. On December 07 2011 10:43 jaybrundage wrote: Im going to state this right now. My logic is completely sound and there is nothing wrong with it. What you are using is WIFOM for people not familiar with it hear is where it comes from. Link To be clear you could be right if me, Adam and BKEXE are scum then i could be trying to buss my teammate to gain town cred (although your forgetting one thing we don't know anyone's alignment till they flip so i would have to lynch adam to bus him which i would love to do btw). But if your using WIFOM logic i would know that bussing my teammate would be actually make me look mafia because they would think that bussing him would be a mafia thing to do. OR you could use WIFOM again and say i know that they know that they think i would be mafia to bus my teammate so i wont bus my teammate. WIFOM is good to think about occasionaly but to state that my logic is shit is just not true. You would just state that i could be using WIFOM. I hope that makes sense WIFOM is sometimes not easily understood for people not familiar with it. But at its simplest its just doing the not obvious thing to trick someone. Would i put a cup of poison in front of you to drink or closer to me so that you would take my cup. On another note EB you wrote you think im scum. Plz provide a case. Or what you say is useless Firstly you’ve quoted something there saying “what adam said”, I never said anything close to any of that so you might want to figure out where the hell that all came from and try again. You state that your logic is completely sound. Your logic on your case against me was shit and I called you out on it in my last analysis as a result. You pin terms on me like “flying under the radar” when I was the centre of attention for half the game or “apathetic”. Apathy is a lack of caring, google it when you’re done looking up hedging because my heated post aimed at BH was anything but apathetic, it showed I give a damn and I have a vested interest in seeing this town do well and was unimpressed with the state of the game. Explaining what WIFOM is at this point seems wholly unnecessary and comes across as more filler from you, padding your posts out. That acronym has been thrown around so damn much this game that anyone who’s been even half reading this thread would have had to of googled it to find out what point anyone was trying to make if they didn’t know its meaning. Asking EB to post a response after he died. I think BH said it all here, terrible ploy, really not well thought out at all. On December 07 2011 10:56 jaybrundage wrote: Briefly looking over you new case its pretty shitty with no content. Nice use of caps to make it seem like you have a point. Your "core of your argument. Is also dumb is stated multiple times i did not like the Bbyte case. I'm not gonna let you steamroll the townies into another mislynch. Ill give people some time to read my case before i comment again. I was not expecting EB to get killed i was thinking either BH Veli maybe Grack even. I really wish he had posted his case on me instead of his empty comment that he thinks I'm mafia. Are you kidding? He’s spent hours looking at your filter and you “briefly look” at it. You might want to go back and examine the SHIT out of his case on you and start defending yourself properly. Calling his case “shit” is tantamount to saying “no u r”, it might have worked when you were 7, but its not flying here. Is this a slip? “I'm not gonna let you steamroll the townies into another mislynch.”. You are part of the town… shouldn’t this read “im not going to let you steamroll us into another myslynch”, unless of course you don’t consider yourself part of the town. On December 07 2011 11:58 jaybrundage wrote: Why would you claim right now your giving mafia information that we dont want them to have. And secondly if you dont post a case on me WITH YOUR OWN THOUGHTS we gonna have another mislynch with BH leading it. You gotta stop sheeping Veli if you wanna give me your case give me YOUR case Trying to deflect onto BH/Veli again? As has been pointed out, you didn’t read the OP before you wrote this, or you did and you just decided to play dumb. So you were either ignorant of the game rules or trying desperately to deflect attention onto anyone but yourself. WIFOM to analyze that but worth noting. On December 07 2011 13:10 jaybrundage wrote: Regardless i want to get more input from people before i start typing a case. Adam is still might have my vote but lets see what new information the new day brings More stalling, coupled with more non-committal behaviour. You say not 2 hours earlier in the post where you were talking to dead EB: “so I would have to lynch adam to bus him which I would love to do btw”. If you would “love” to lynch me then why wait for more information on myself or anyone else. Formulate your case against me. You had better make it convincing, because all eyes are on you right now. I am highly interested to see the work of fiction that is your case, because as Day 1 proved, your first attempt was not convincing, even when I had 5 votes on me and I was the prime candidate for hanging. | ||
Adam4167
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Finally someone around my timezone :> | ||
Adam4167
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On December 08 2011 04:22 xtfftc wrote: Parroting what Veli said. Yes, it is everyone's fault that we couldn't consolidate on a proper case but no, we didn't have 6 people follow BH's invoking of a lurker lynch almost blindly. Sounds like mafia trying to make us think that this wasn't as bad of a loss as it was to me. I was not ‘parroting’ Veli here, I was echoing my own thoughts, which I posted here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12620144 and http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12620376 . I've already made my thoughts crystal clear on how much i think we gained by the Bbyte lynch (first link), but I am also accepting of my responsibility of not preventing it. On December 08 2011 04:22 xtfftc wrote: This is a great point (Jay either scumslipped really badly or he spends more time writing his own posts than analysing others, which is pretty bad), but Adam sure likes adding fluff to his arguments. All he needed was the bolded bit, everything else is completely pointless. My “fluff” that you’ve pointed out here is me asking jay to start defending himself properly, because id really like to be wrong here, I don’t want to lynch another townie, but I’m not seeing anything from him that’s pushing me towards that conclusion. On December 08 2011 04:22 xtfftc wrote: This is pretty bad. What is the right way to say it then? "I'm not going to let you steamroll me into mislynching myself"? I will revisit my suspicion from yesteyday when I thought that Adam might be bussing Jay. Did you even read the post you quoted after the first line? I showed him the right way it should have been said. This slip from jay is an insight into his subconscious mind. Go ahead and revisit your theory. It is your duty to this town to examine every read you get and push it if you think it holds weight. | ||
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On December 08 2011 12:01 Velinath wrote: And of course RIGHT after I post that, BKEXE comes back with some decent reasoning and also steps up and votes. Guhhhhhhhhhhh I don't see what you see at all. I see BKEXE quote BH's book that he wrote on jay, ramble on about policy (a bit late in the piece for this really..), then dump his vote on jay after calling him an idiot. Oh and don't forget declaring how new he is... again. Your case on BKEXE was exactly where I was heading with the next day (assuming I survive the night.). It was well done and did a good job of highlighting exactly how BKEXE has been playing thus far, however I am going to highlight something you missed: BKEXE and jay have been defending each other this entire game: Here Here Here Here Here BKEXE's more recent posts aimed at jay are nothing more than distancing because we have shifted focus onto them. It is just a smokescreen, do not buy into this nonsense. | ||
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On December 09 2011 08:32 ey215 wrote: The math: We're currently at 8 - 3 They get me today and someone tonight we're at 6 - 3 Two more townies Day/night 3 and it's 4-3. Jay is scum, they get one tonight 7 - 3 Two more townies 5 - 3 I actually think today/tonight is pretty damn important. Why is your math so doom and gloom? Its also incorrect. In your second scenario: Jay is scum, they get one tonight 7 - 3 Two more townies 5 - 3 I assume "Jay is scum" means "we hang Jay and he flips red". That means we go down to 7 - 2. Then you discount us from finding scum on day 3 with BKEXE a prime target after jay flipping scum. If there aren't any surprises with our lynchings we're 6 - 1 heading into Day 4. Hardly as bad a scenario as you're making it out to be here. | ||
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On December 09 2011 09:45 BroodKingEXE wrote: For anyone who thinks I am mafia, because jay is. Think about it, if I kill off jay I would only have one other teamate left, if you think I am mafia for this reason I would be killed as well. This leaves one mafia member to convince everyone else that they are not mafia. The mafia that you are suspecting me to be in would have to have a player so experienced he could take out 6 other players over the course of three days. How does this make sense? I think you guys backed yourself into this shitty position by being too comfortable on day 1. Your team mate, who has done a much better job of staying hidden thus far, is probably reaming you in the QT for dumping the monumental task of killing 6 townies on his own, with 2 blues (if they live that long) still in the mix. Lets not get ahead of ourselves though. Jay hangs in 20 minutes (tick tock..). | ||
Adam4167
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On December 09 2011 10:01 Blazinghand wrote: That being said, maybe they think they can out-argue me or present a better case. Or whatever. Or they'll roleblock the watcher? They have to find him first. Heres hoping JB flips scum RB for an added cherry on top. | ||
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Im not that man. GG jay | ||
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On December 09 2011 10:31 Adam4167 wrote: If i were a lesser man, Id make some horrible quip asking JB to post an analysis on me before "realizing" he was dead. Im not that man. GG jay Nevermind. Looks like BH is that man. (lol) | ||
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On December 09 2011 12:31 Blazinghand wrote: OK, I'm home. I'm gonna start analyzing but before I do I just wanted to stop by and I want people to make cases for lynching people who aren't BKEXE. I'm like 99% convinced BKEXE is mafia. I'm gonna go after him pretty hard. If anyone can think of a better lynch than BKEXE I want you to make a super super good case for it, please. Also, keep on talking and arguing. The more stuff we argue about the more obvious the mafia will be. man i'm feeling good. Let's see if we can end this in the next two Days, gentlemen. Agreed. I've had a couple of suspicions since day 1, and for the most part our reads seem to be similar. I am pretty sure I understand the meaning of your posts. I am going to read everyone's filter, then construct a single case against the person i find the scummiest, rather than posting a couple paragraphs on everyone as I have previously. | ||
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xtfftc, you seem so sure that ey215 is red, are you willing to stake your own lynching on it, if he flips town? I am not entirely sold on your case on him, maybe that might change after its finished. ey215, the main criticism of your play in TL47 was that you did nothing but tunnel WBG all game (he was town). Can you say the same thing is not happening here with Grackaroni/xtfftc? You've declared your intention to slap an OMGUS vote on xtfftc tomorrow, will it be supported by an in-depth analysis of every one of his posts? | ||
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On December 10 2011 06:41 Blazinghand wrote: I think we need to get out of a mindset that "if A accuses B and B flips town, A is mafia". It's certainly possible that A is mafia, but it's also possible that A was just wrong. IF xtfftc things ey215 is scum, and if ey215 gets lynched and flips town, then maybe xtfftc is the scummiest remaining player so he should be lynched. Or, maybe, he's not. Then you should lynch whoever is the scummiest, even though xtfftc was wrong. Base lynches off of evidence whenever possible. *back to work* Oh, I fully agree, and It was something I never planned on following through with. When I was reading xtfftc's analysis, I couldn't help but find myself unconvinced. I was wondering if it was because he himself was unconvinced, which by the sound of it, he is. I thought it was slightly rash that you put your head on the block for jay's lynching. I will admit, I had some doubts early on, especially after reading the Mini Mafia X thread, where he was erratic and not very useful... and flipped town. | ||
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On December 10 2011 08:03 BroodKingEXE wrote: I am now starting to suspect ey215 as scum First he accuses Adam, but he has no evidence: Ok, I have only read the first 2 quotes, but take a look at the time stamps. ey215 actually said the 2nd quote first, wanting to give me a bit more time to explain my shitty behavior, then 3 hours later he drops his vote on me. BKE, you are trying to make it look like ey215 is backpedaling on his vote. Stop misrepresenting the truth. I'm now going back to entirely read this - very skeptically. | ||
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http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/GJxP4R5Vekf I think it clicked that you were doctor for me on about night 3, possibly day 4. Had the mafia just been brazen enough to gun you down on any night, that's a massive blow to towns chances. We would have lost our loudest mouth and one of our blues ^^ A big thankyou to all of the coaches who took their time out to help us out. I know I talked my coach's ear off. Another thankyou to the hosts, was a really fun game. | ||
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Yeah, the more I thought about it, the more it just made sense. Well played though. | ||
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On December 15 2011 19:20 Palmar wrote: Can you guys please answer these questions: Did you like having a veteran in the newbie game? Would you prefer the veteran did not smurf? Would you prefer giving both factions a veteran? Yes, I enjoyed having the veteran in the game. Although I wonder how this game may have panned out if the medic had saved you on N1. You would have had to push your 3 scum that you singled out on the second day or risk us just hanging you for semi-wild claims. The veteran really has to smurf, otherwise the medic will be glued on them all game, plus everyone will just keep asking the vet how to proceed. I think giving the scum team a veteran could tip the scale a bit far into their favor. A scum veteran will obviously be alive for the whole game bar intentional scum-slips. I can only imagine the havoc that might ensue if you dumped say, WBG in as the scum vet. A scum vet also has more influence over what his teammates are doing compared to what a town vet would. As an aside, I actually burst out laughing when i read this http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=12605867 | ||
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Haha that's great. I actually sat there for almost a half an hour, watching you and xsksc go back and forward, weighing up.. "Well, these two sure are going at it.... its definitely drawing attention away from the town wanting to lynch me... but I had a town read on both of them... save myself... help the town.... ah fuck it, I'm probably tomorrows lynch anyway" *post* | ||
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On December 15 2011 22:14 Palmar wrote: Posting is always the correct decision, you see, I got a town read on you BECAUSE you decided to step in, post, help out, etc. Yes. I'm aware now that i accidentally lucked into the best course of action. But at the time, being the first day of my first game, I had horrible visions of stepping between two fighting dogs and being eaten alive. Everyone else keen for the next game? I think Ver was hosting one right after the shitstorm that is TL48 is over (jeez, go read that if you have half a day). Hopefully Ver's game is new player friendly, otherwise I'm sure there's another game right around the corner. | ||
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On December 16 2011 05:16 wherebugsgo wrote: I agree with BC that scum should've had a vet if town got a vet. The drawback is that only two players learn to play scum, but that's not a huge problem IMO, particularly when you have one or maybe even two vets on the town side. In order for this to be feasible I think perhaps the next newbie or newbie-ish game should have 16 players. Activity is up recently and there were even a lot of new players in the normal game. Personally, I don't actually like newbie games, since I think normals are just better for new players, but they're certainly more popular recently, so they should definitely continue IMO. The only hurdle I can see with giving both sides a vet is that the town vet is very likely to be shot on night 1. Now, the game has only the scum vet in it until the town gets its shit together and eventually hangs him (which will probably be last of all the scums, as hes the least likely to be caught saying or doing something stupid). I don't think finding 16 new players would be very difficult, we had lots of people miss out on this game. I think the main draw of newbie games is that we are scared to completely fuck up a normal game regardless of which side we end up on. I know I'm both simultaneously dreading and eager for my first game as scum. If I'm caught with the day 1 lynch, ill feel really bad, since the day 1 lynch is usually always a mislynch, bar something spectacular. And ill also echo what others have said: Its a huge time investment, just to not be lynched for lurking. I lost actual sleep over this game, lying there, wondering if i could talk myself out of the hole id dug myself into, or if BKEXE was going to flip town and id feel like an ass for pushing his case (yep!). | ||
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On December 16 2011 09:25 Blazinghand wrote: Dude! I totally spend nights poring over people's filters looking for slipups. And I was definitely really worried about the BKEXE lynch during the last like 12 hours when he shaped up his posting. Unlike JB who withdrew entirely, BKEXE was legitimately trying to help in his final hours. He was WRONG, but he was trying to help. It was very unnerving. Sleep, Mafia, Social Life, Academics. Pick 2. I even sat there and thumbed through everyone's filter outside of mafia to get a feel for who they really were. That took about 9 hours. And its exactly what 'confirmed' you as townie for me on the 2nd day. Your posting was just consistent with how you were in other threads (srsly, 3000 posts worth.... I hate you). This is why I was happy to take more of a backseat to you towards the end, I knew you had towns interests at heart (even if you did hang poor Bbyte for nothing ). | ||
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On December 16 2011 09:32 xtfftc wrote: Town vet dies > instalynch of the other vet since he's obviously mafia. But we, as town, may not realize who the other vet even is, unless they aren't smurfing. I know I liked EB (mainly because he was making sense and shoving BH back a bit), but I had no clue he was a vet until I read the TL48 thread and Annul outed him as a smurf account. | ||
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On December 16 2011 09:35 Blazinghand wrote: Oh man... dude. I've made so many posts here on TL. I've been here for a year (as of today)... probably like 2k of them in Sc2 Strategy just answering questions. That's a lot of hard work to read through all that. I'm honestly impressed. Yeah, I feel like I know how to play Terran now. Not that id ever want to... dirty OP shit | ||
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Id really like to see a scum team actually engineer and manufacture a win, through a solid game-long strategy though. | ||
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Aaand yeah, I watched TL47 live and I have been keeping up with TL48. I think (from a semi-outsiders perspective) maybe people are getting too comfortable with the same players around here, so they try to get fancy, and it just leads to chaos. A good injection of fresh faces (like Student Mafia!) may solve that. | ||
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Myself, ey215 on day 1, Grack and BKEXE in the obs thread, tunkeg on day 4 and the mafia team probably wanted it all game. Popular man! On night 1, I recall saying to vaderseven that the most ideal situation was for me to be NK1, so I could get away from BH! The way you flip-flopped on Jay's case in the 8 hours before the night-kill really irked me, until i figured out why. I think the main hurdle I was facing with vader was being asleep during his prime time hours, and yeah, thats really unavoidable unless we had an oceanic coach sign up. I still learned a lot from him for the short time that we had! | ||
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