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On June 07 2011 06:43 Treadmill wrote:
with how spread out our votes are the mafia will be able to easily swing a lynch.
QFT, and this is something that we should keep in mind.
I swiched my vote to Rookie44 since I believe that a lynch of FL625 would be a complete lottery, while the accusations of rookie at least has something (if not very much).
Is anyone by accident sitting on an updated list of lurkers/"less than 2 posts with substance" players?
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Alright, I'm back, and I've read the last ~10 pages to try to get myself up to date. I've probably missed something, but I think I have a good idea on what's going on so far.
On June 07 2011 04:16 Jackal58 wrote:
Impervious???? Bah. Obviouscum.
I'll be keeping an eye on you.
Scum.
Btw - GREEN AND YELLOW!!!!!
Ok, now, from what I've seen, I think Jackal's plan is best. I've seen a bunch of "newbie" posts, but that one seriously hinted at finding blues, as well as finding flaws in previously used investigative strategies.
While it may be a "newbie" type post, it also answers a question I ask myself whenever I'm looking at someone - Are they acting in the best interest of the town?
My gut feeling is "no", even though he has so few posts. And, rather than pick on lurkers for the sake of picking on lurkers (since they'll likely be modkilled at some point), I think our best move at the moment is to lynch rookie44.
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Germany3729 Posts
yes I can explain myself. I judged over monsterDrakar too quick. I am used to the sc2 mafia, where everything has to be very quick and most votes happen to be intentional...
Despite of that, I will stick to my vote, since monsterDrakar obviously won't be lynched and I really don't know who to vote for, as I described in my last post.
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On June 07 2011 08:23 Impervious wrote:Alright, I'm back, and I've read the last ~10 pages to try to get myself up to date. I've probably missed something, but I think I have a good idea on what's going on so far. I'll be keeping an eye on you. Scum. Btw - GREEN AND YELLOW!!!!! Ok, now, from what I've seen, I think Jackal's plan is best. I've seen a bunch of "newbie" posts, but that one seriously hinted at finding blues, as well as finding flaws in previously used investigative strategies. While it may be a "newbie" type post, it also answers a question I ask myself whenever I'm looking at someone - Are they acting in the best interest of the town? My gut feeling is "no", even though he has so few posts. And, rather than pick on lurkers for the sake of picking on lurkers (since they'll likely be modkilled at some point), I think our best move at the moment is to lynch rookie44.
Ok, i guess you're right. His posts didn't really contribute and now with the knowledge of that there is a thread for mafia alone freeloader isn't really a viable option too. So with that my vote will also be on Rookie for the sake of voting. 4 hours remaining but i'm going to bed so my vote is final. Goodnight
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I just realized that my post can accidentaly become flamebait. Would like to edit by doubleposting to just lurkers.
Any attempts to use "less than 2 posts with substance" in a way to start flamewars and huge derails of the thread should be considered heavily scummy behaviour. Please ignore that wording of the post above.
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EBWOP
of *my* post above is what I meant obvoiusly.
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On June 07 2011 08:26 supersoft wrote:
yes I can explain myself. I judged over monsterDrakar too quick. I am used to the sc2 mafia, where everything has to be very quick and most votes happen to be intentional...
Despite of that, I will stick to my vote, since monsterDrakar obviously won't be lynched and I really don't know who to vote for, as I described in my last post.
Sorry but that's a terrible reason to vote for someone. You believe, as of now, monsterDrakar is most likely not mafia. Yet you refuse to unvote him. Yes, no one is sure of anything at this point but its simply lazy to refuse to revote based on whats occuring now especially in regards to Rookie.
It would also be interesting to hear your read on the other person who voted for monsterDrakar.
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There is no more of a meaningful explaination i can give.
I will be voting for gtrsrs, not due to an indepth analysis of his posts. But because he talks about town in the 3rd person, which is a very unnatural thing to do. Obviously an indepth analysis would be the best, however there is not much we can go on at this stage, and given that i think any tells will be a metagame failure.
I quite like thinking about metagame, and (though obviously this will be biassed) looking at my posts i have been advacating thinking about the longer term when everyone else was discussing the right now. No blue or red would want to stick out like that.
I am going to bed now so this is the last of it.
(would a mafia give such a poor defence?!!?!?)
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mafia will do whatever it takes to seem like a townie
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On June 07 2011 08:39 rookie44 wrote:
There is no more of a meaningful explaination i can give.
I will be voting for gtrsrs, not due to an indepth analysis of his posts. But because he talks about town in the 3rd person, which is a very unnatural thing to do. Obviously an indepth analysis would be the best, however there is not much we can go on at this stage, and given that i think any tells will be a metagame failure.
I quite like thinking about metagame, and (though obviously this will be biassed) looking at my posts i have been advacating thinking about the longer term when everyone else was discussing the right now. No blue or red would want to stick out like that.
I am going to bed now so this is the last of it.
(would a mafia give such a poor defence?!!?!?)
I used 3rd person in my 2nd post in the thread. And my first post was a "hi" post.....
What does that tell you about my alignment? That I'm scum?
As for the metagame.....
.....
.....
.....
.....
.....
We need to get the best possible lynch RIGHT NOW. Not 5 days from now. The sooner we hit a couple of reds, the better. So we have to do what we can to hit a red RIGHT NOW.
Don't worry about the "metagame"..... It is a metaphysical construct which will not directly help in any individual game, as players can actually play against said "metagame".
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I absolutely don't buy the "hunting for blues" nonsense on rookie44. I don't see at all how what he's been saying could lead to blues revealing themselves - one of the people voting for him should lay out the case a bit better.
On June 07 2011 06:01 Jackal58 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2011 05:47 TranceStorm wrote:On June 07 2011 05:38 Jackal58 wrote:You guys want to vote for scum? Vote this guy - rookie44: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=9611408Has played before so he has an idea how it works. Very subtle in his fishing for blues. Only scum fish for blues. Wants to know what methods and tactics are used to catch scum. Wants us to share them with everybody. Claims it will help derail scum tactics. When it will obviously do the opposite. Has all but disappeared since this post. I'm sure he'll show up momentarily to tell me how full of shit I am. That's where my vote is going. I would recommend you all do the same. Would you mind doing a post-by-post analysis of rookie44's posts? (There are only 3) Right now I can't really see how subtly he is fishing for blues. After all, we don't know how experienced he really is, so I would like a little more clarification as to your accusation. We'll start with the post I linked: Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 04:22 rookie44 wrote:
Hey guys,
This is all getting a bit out of hand, we seem to already be getting in each others faces over perceived (and real) sleights. I have only played mafia on battle.net, and this is going to be quite a different game to that.
Only real difference is timing. Tactics are the same
What i believe is the crucial difference is that we have large amounts of time for discussion. This also gives us the time to create a solid plan for using whatever roles we have effectively (it would seem that way).
This is role fishing. He's wanting people to post their roles and tell him how they intend to use them. At the very least he's hoping a noob would post something along the lines of I'm a DT. Who should I check
Maybe some of the more experienced players could expand on what investigative stratagies they have used; their pitfalls, and how we may evade those pitfalls.
This is saying "I am scum. How are you guys going to catch me? It's called a scum slip
Perhaps an added benifit will be that it will be very tricky for a mafia to come up with a generalized stratagy that is grounded in reason, so maybe there will be some suspiciously quiet people. (I assume it will be difficult for a generalized stratagy becasue i can only see the mafia being able to take advantage of a specific stratagy by getting their peolpe in the right places).
This is just bullshit trying to provide a townie reason for asking.
My analysis in red. This guy is scum.
Point by point:
1. Irrelevant. And battle.net mafia is EXTREMELY different from this.
2. No, he isn't asking people to post their roles. He's asking what people think good strategy for blues would be - which is a reasonable question from town and even more sensible for a blue poster.
3. Alternately, he's honestly a newbie asking experienced players what they think we should be doing.
4. Or, he's giving his reason, as a townie, for asking.
The "analysis" is bullshit. This is bandwagonning at its WORST.
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On June 07 2011 08:51 Treadmill wrote:I absolutely don't buy the "hunting for blues" nonsense on rookie44. I don't see at all how what he's been saying could lead to blues revealing themselves - one of the people voting for him should lay out the case a bit better. Show nested quote +On June 07 2011 06:01 Jackal58 wrote:On June 07 2011 05:47 TranceStorm wrote:On June 07 2011 05:38 Jackal58 wrote:You guys want to vote for scum? Vote this guy - rookie44: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=9611408Has played before so he has an idea how it works. Very subtle in his fishing for blues. Only scum fish for blues. Wants to know what methods and tactics are used to catch scum. Wants us to share them with everybody. Claims it will help derail scum tactics. When it will obviously do the opposite. Has all but disappeared since this post. I'm sure he'll show up momentarily to tell me how full of shit I am. That's where my vote is going. I would recommend you all do the same. Would you mind doing a post-by-post analysis of rookie44's posts? (There are only 3) Right now I can't really see how subtly he is fishing for blues. After all, we don't know how experienced he really is, so I would like a little more clarification as to your accusation. We'll start with the post I linked: On June 06 2011 04:22 rookie44 wrote:
Hey guys,
This is all getting a bit out of hand, we seem to already be getting in each others faces over perceived (and real) sleights. I have only played mafia on battle.net, and this is going to be quite a different game to that.
Only real difference is timing. Tactics are the same
What i believe is the crucial difference is that we have large amounts of time for discussion. This also gives us the time to create a solid plan for using whatever roles we have effectively (it would seem that way).
This is role fishing. He's wanting people to post their roles and tell him how they intend to use them. At the very least he's hoping a noob would post something along the lines of I'm a DT. Who should I check
Maybe some of the more experienced players could expand on what investigative stratagies they have used; their pitfalls, and how we may evade those pitfalls.
This is saying "I am scum. How are you guys going to catch me? It's called a scum slip
Perhaps an added benifit will be that it will be very tricky for a mafia to come up with a generalized stratagy that is grounded in reason, so maybe there will be some suspiciously quiet people. (I assume it will be difficult for a generalized stratagy becasue i can only see the mafia being able to take advantage of a specific stratagy by getting their peolpe in the right places).
This is just bullshit trying to provide a townie reason for asking.
My analysis in red. This guy is scum. Point by point: 1. Irrelevant. And battle.net mafia is EXTREMELY different from this. 2. No, he isn't asking people to post their roles. He's asking what people think good strategy for blues would be - which is a reasonable question from town and even more sensible for a blue poster. 3. Alternately, he's honestly a newbie asking experienced players what they think we should be doing. 4. Or, he's giving his reason, as a townie, for asking. The "analysis" is bullshit. This is bandwagonning at its WORST.
If this was a day 2 or later lynch, I'd expect something more convincing. But it's not. If you have a better idea, I'd like to hear it.
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GRAND OLD AMERICA16375 Posts
On June 07 2011 08:51 Treadmill wrote:I absolutely don't buy the "hunting for blues" nonsense on rookie44. I don't see at all how what he's been saying could lead to blues revealing themselves - one of the people voting for him should lay out the case a bit better. Show nested quote +On June 07 2011 06:01 Jackal58 wrote:On June 07 2011 05:47 TranceStorm wrote:On June 07 2011 05:38 Jackal58 wrote:You guys want to vote for scum? Vote this guy - rookie44: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=9611408Has played before so he has an idea how it works. Very subtle in his fishing for blues. Only scum fish for blues. Wants to know what methods and tactics are used to catch scum. Wants us to share them with everybody. Claims it will help derail scum tactics. When it will obviously do the opposite. Has all but disappeared since this post. I'm sure he'll show up momentarily to tell me how full of shit I am. That's where my vote is going. I would recommend you all do the same. Would you mind doing a post-by-post analysis of rookie44's posts? (There are only 3) Right now I can't really see how subtly he is fishing for blues. After all, we don't know how experienced he really is, so I would like a little more clarification as to your accusation. We'll start with the post I linked: On June 06 2011 04:22 rookie44 wrote:
Hey guys,
This is all getting a bit out of hand, we seem to already be getting in each others faces over perceived (and real) sleights. I have only played mafia on battle.net, and this is going to be quite a different game to that.
Only real difference is timing. Tactics are the same
What i believe is the crucial difference is that we have large amounts of time for discussion. This also gives us the time to create a solid plan for using whatever roles we have effectively (it would seem that way).
This is role fishing. He's wanting people to post their roles and tell him how they intend to use them. At the very least he's hoping a noob would post something along the lines of I'm a DT. Who should I check
Maybe some of the more experienced players could expand on what investigative stratagies they have used; their pitfalls, and how we may evade those pitfalls.
This is saying "I am scum. How are you guys going to catch me? It's called a scum slip
Perhaps an added benifit will be that it will be very tricky for a mafia to come up with a generalized stratagy that is grounded in reason, so maybe there will be some suspiciously quiet people. (I assume it will be difficult for a generalized stratagy becasue i can only see the mafia being able to take advantage of a specific stratagy by getting their peolpe in the right places).
This is just bullshit trying to provide a townie reason for asking.
My analysis in red. This guy is scum. Point by point: 1. Irrelevant. And battle.net mafia is EXTREMELY different from this. 2. No, he isn't asking people to post their roles. He's asking what people think good strategy for blues would be - which is a reasonable question from town and even more sensible for a blue poster. 3. Alternately, he's honestly a newbie asking experienced players what they think we should be doing. 4. Or, he's giving his reason, as a townie, for asking. The "analysis" is bullshit. This is bandwagonning at its WORST.
I gave him guides ti read after his 1st post concerning strategies. He ignored it and continued to ask about that topic then makes a sorry post about not reading too much in depth. Also, he wants to play for the lategame as if it is sc2 when we have to get the scums lynched now. This is not his first game, so he has experience already.
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Remember to send all night actions to both myself and Meapak_Ziphh. Any actions not sent will not be completed.
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
On June 07 2011 08:15 heist wrote:
An updated list after the massive amount of rookie votes:
Rookie: 5
Freeloader: 4
Treadmill: 2
Drazerk: 2
jimbooo:2
igrok: 2
monsterdrakar: 2
gtrsrs: 2
amazingxkcd: 1
Kurumi: 1
TheAwesomeAll: 1
Can the people who voted monsterDrakar and Drazerk explain themselves?
Hell i can explain for them, Ive been lurking for the better part of this first day and i voted without saying anything
When i got up this morning I did make a small post but nothing major bar changing my vote from freeloader to treadmill after reading all the posts and believing he was not scum
With my erratic voting / posting pattern i would not be surprised if more people voted for me though and ill try to make amends tomorrow
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Hey guys, first chance for me to catch up on the thread for today. I'm back on page 21 still, but rushing to catch up. I'm putting my vote onto jimboo for now, for what it's worth. If I still want to vote for him by the time I'm done reading the thread, I'll elaborate.
Thoughts on what I've read so far: iGrok's post on setup was not blue-fishing at all (if he was doing that for the benefit of his mafia friends, he would post it in mafia quicktopic, not in thread), but it also was kind of useless (sorry bro, I know you like this kind of stuff, but there was no need to post it). You went through a lot of trouble and wild conjecture just to arrive at the conclusion that we probably have a pretty normal setup (2dts, 2-3medics, 2-4vigs, 2-4 vets). You could have just stated that that's a normal setup for the roles that were listed. I want to mention, though, that I've played in games on this forum where the only blue roles were vigilantes, and where the only blue roles were veterans. Be ready for anything and DONT count on blue roles to win the game for you. Greens win games far more often than blues do.
About Kurumi, yeah a lot of his posts were bad, but he's been a pretty week player in the only two games I've seen him in. His habit of 'restating' other players posts to make it seem like they said things they didn't is very suspicious, though. I agree with him as a potential dt target.
On a side-note, though, Post by Post analysis is rarely needed. It just makes your analysis longer than it needs to be. Cut out the posts that don't contribute to your analysis, or just spoiler them. I don't love how iGrok responded to the vote on him, but I don't necessarily recommend a dt check on him, since if he's mafia he's likely to be the godfather.
Freeloader's one and only new post was really really bad. If you are town, buddy, don't do this sort of thing again. I think I know what you big 'plan' is; in fact I think it's the same awful 'plan' that Kurumi had in XXXIX. The "act suspicious so people bandwagon on you then accuse them of being scum for bandwagoning" plan is awful awful awful, and I dearly hope that that's not what you are going for.
Think that's all for now, more later.
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On June 07 2011 08:56 Impervious wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2011 08:51 Treadmill wrote:I absolutely don't buy the "hunting for blues" nonsense on rookie44. I don't see at all how what he's been saying could lead to blues revealing themselves - one of the people voting for him should lay out the case a bit better. On June 07 2011 06:01 Jackal58 wrote:On June 07 2011 05:47 TranceStorm wrote:On June 07 2011 05:38 Jackal58 wrote:You guys want to vote for scum? Vote this guy - rookie44: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=9611408Has played before so he has an idea how it works. Very subtle in his fishing for blues. Only scum fish for blues. Wants to know what methods and tactics are used to catch scum. Wants us to share them with everybody. Claims it will help derail scum tactics. When it will obviously do the opposite. Has all but disappeared since this post. I'm sure he'll show up momentarily to tell me how full of shit I am. That's where my vote is going. I would recommend you all do the same. Would you mind doing a post-by-post analysis of rookie44's posts? (There are only 3) Right now I can't really see how subtly he is fishing for blues. After all, we don't know how experienced he really is, so I would like a little more clarification as to your accusation. We'll start with the post I linked: On June 06 2011 04:22 rookie44 wrote:
Hey guys,
This is all getting a bit out of hand, we seem to already be getting in each others faces over perceived (and real) sleights. I have only played mafia on battle.net, and this is going to be quite a different game to that.
Only real difference is timing. Tactics are the same
What i believe is the crucial difference is that we have large amounts of time for discussion. This also gives us the time to create a solid plan for using whatever roles we have effectively (it would seem that way).
This is role fishing. He's wanting people to post their roles and tell him how they intend to use them. At the very least he's hoping a noob would post something along the lines of I'm a DT. Who should I check
Maybe some of the more experienced players could expand on what investigative stratagies they have used; their pitfalls, and how we may evade those pitfalls.
This is saying "I am scum. How are you guys going to catch me? It's called a scum slip
Perhaps an added benifit will be that it will be very tricky for a mafia to come up with a generalized stratagy that is grounded in reason, so maybe there will be some suspiciously quiet people. (I assume it will be difficult for a generalized stratagy becasue i can only see the mafia being able to take advantage of a specific stratagy by getting their peolpe in the right places).
This is just bullshit trying to provide a townie reason for asking.
My analysis in red. This guy is scum. Point by point: 1. Irrelevant. And battle.net mafia is EXTREMELY different from this. 2. No, he isn't asking people to post their roles. He's asking what people think good strategy for blues would be - which is a reasonable question from town and even more sensible for a blue poster. 3. Alternately, he's honestly a newbie asking experienced players what they think we should be doing. 4. Or, he's giving his reason, as a townie, for asking. The "analysis" is bullshit. This is bandwagonning at its WORST. If this was a day 2 or later lynch, I'd expect something more convincing. But it's not. If you have a better idea, I'd like to hear it.
Almost anyone else would be a better idea. I'm just bothered that wll of a sudden a bunch of people (xkcd, Kurumi, Senj) are jumping on voting for a guy, a handful of hours before the lynch. Especially considering:
Senj is a lurker who's posted the bare minimum to be considered active
amazingxkcd who's posted a whole lot of nothing - his only contributions have been posting one-liners about why other people's ideas are bad
Kurumi - who's been posting a lot, and insanely aggressively, and accusing everyone flat-out of being scum, but when he decides who to vote for he posts a chort and uncertain post wihtout really explaining.
It just seems like the analysis is a lot worse on this case than it has been on a bunch of others - but a couple people started voting for him and set a bandwagon rolling.
As for scummiest posts, I still haven't seen anything to top this:
On June 06 2011 14:21 freeloader625 wrote:It's true. I spent most of the weekend watching MLG, both streams. I was keeping an eye on this for all mirror matches though, I just chose not to comment. Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 12:54 CjrNinja wrote:I can't confirm what the actual role PM said for mafia members. But looking back through this thread I did find: On May 30 2011 01:33 Varpulis wrote:On May 30 2011 00:34 blackone wrote:On May 29 2011 06:47 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
PMs
PMs are not allowed in this game.
This confuses me because from the other Mafia threads I read I feel that PMs are a pretty important part of the game. In particular, how is the scum supposed to operate without PMs? To clarify: The no PMs rule does not apply to scum. They are still allowed to communicate outside of the thread. Town aligned and third party roles must keep everything inside the thread, however, for the sake of balance and to keep the game fun for everybody. So it's already been addressed during the signup stage. Freeloader was probably just lazy and didn't read through the entire thread. Yes, I'm ashamed to admit I let pages 2-8 or 9 go without reading it, I assumed it was all just full of "/in's." I only read the first post and posts since the game has officially started. Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 13:17 DeMorcerf wrote:On June 06 2011 12:47 Treadmill wrote:+ Show Spoiler +One really big point - if you're going to quote a really long post it'd be great if you could put it in spoiler tags (just a formatting issue but helps to clean up the page a fair bit). Meaning you, iGrok.
@CjrNinja
Can you confirm that the role PM for mafia members spells out that mafia can communicate by PM? If this is true than obviously mafia wouldn't post that question and I'll change my vote from freeloader. Otherwise, though, he seems even more scummy to me now. I didn't vote for him cause he asked a silly question, it was how he replied to scrutiny. Since then, he hasn't posted in the thread at all. And I can confirm that he's been on TL - check his post history, he's posted a whole bunch in today's MLG live report. Either he's scum and waiting for suspicion to die down or he's town and has given up and resigned himself to getting lynched. Or he simply cannot extract himself from the excitement that is MLG, I know I couldn't for most of this weekend. I think that the reasoning that has come forth from some of the experienced players should convince us to leave freeloader for now and concentrate on others --- I agree with Alderan's suspicions of Amazingxkcd (posts that just repeat the description of the game) and Grush57 (confusing contradictions) and the strange hasty back and forth behavior of Jimboo pointed out by TranceStorm. On June 06 2011 11:43 redFF wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 06 2011 11:23 GMarshal wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 11:18 iGrok wrote:On June 06 2011 11:13 aprudds wrote:On June 06 2011 11:11 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:On June 06 2011 10:32 iGrok wrote:Mod Check Please I didn't catch it in time to see the original. I think flamewheel can see this sort of thing so I'll ask him. Because this is a noobies game I'll let you go with just a warning but the next time ANYONE does this they die, no exceptions. You've been warned I already reported it and the mod told me it was a typo fix. Lets get one thing clear here - do not Report anything to TL mods that isn't a direct violation of the TL Commandments (excluding spam - spam is legal here). We police ourselves, and only call in the authorities when we need them. Report to the Mod of your game, or Qatol if you have a problem with Mod. This. We self moderate. For the love of god, don't use the report button in this subforum. qft -___________- I quote this to point of that redFF's only post in the game is just this one-liner spam. Perhaps he is too busy in his other mafia game to contribute something more useful to his post, but then he should have waited until he had more time to post. Ohhh dirtay! I didn't not realize outside posts were fair game for this! I was under the impression (initially) that you can't click on ppls profiles/outside posts to avoid cheating or w/e. But I guess that's fair game. What do I honestly think and why haven't I really commented even though I threw myself under the bus? I'll give a longer explanation come closer to Day 1's end. Har har har, another "bad defensive" post by me :D Take it as you may.
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Sorry, EBWOP, that was @Impervious.
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I'll vote freeloader now, mostly because of this
On June 06 2011 14:21 freeloader625 wrote:
What do I honestly think and why haven't I really commented even though I threw myself under the bus? I'll give a longer explanation come closer to Day 1's end. Har har har, another "bad defensive" post by me :D Take it as you may.
His longer explanation still hasn't happened, of course, I have no idea why people were focusing on his initial question when they were abandoning this case instead of his horrible "defense".
And the vote on rookie is stupid, people are bandwagoning because of one short post of analysis. Bad analysis actually, because 1) comparing b.net mafia to this one is just wrong, 2) he wasn't role fishing (you could say he was fishing for a town plan, but there's no way a blue would have role claimed because of what rookie wrote, newbie or not) so all that's left is
On June 06 2011 04:22 rookie44 wrote:
Maybe some of the more experienced players could expand on what investigative stratagies they have used; their pitfalls, and how we may evade those pitfalls.
which is fishy, yes, but definitely not more than what we have on freeloader.
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I want to encourage all of you to think critically and independently.I have seen to many games where town herp derps themselves into oblivion by following one individual. If you have misgivings and doubts about my analysis on rookie by all means bring it up for discussion. If you believe you have found a better alternative by all means bring it forward.
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EPT
