On December 30 2010 12:57 Qatol wrote:
This is a good idea, but I don't think referring people to Mafia 2 is a good idea. That is the longest game on TL (349 pages) and was plagued with rampant inactivity. Also, Ver had a better variant of the same plan in AMW (which also happens to be a shorter thread thanks to Folca). I would recommend using either AMW, Mafia 4 (which had 2 plans - the veteran circle creation and the massclaiming + bombing "greens"), Mafia 5 (which had both the medic list and the idea of the "zodiac list" - a concept I'm pretty surprised we don't see used more often), or PYP1 (which also had 2 plans - assignment of the most powerful roles and the number claiming).

I'll switch it to PYP1 since the plan essentially gets started on the first post of the day.

On December 30 2010 12:58 Ace wrote:
Well honestly if Node is a DT, claimed he found 2 reds and came out thats cool.

Then he goes back on his claim.

I'd probably vote for him at this point because I can't believe a real DT would deny his claim at this point. Add in the fact that if I don't have Scum vibes from the other 2 and it's LYLO I could see the Scum doing it. Either way if Node did that as a legit DT that's just terrible playing.

I don't know if I'd fake DT claim even with an inactive town. You never know if the real DT ends up getting brave and arguing with you. Then again that begs the question of what the hell was the actual DT doing all that time if he's still alive at LYLO and doesn't have a clue to what's going on.

Yeah, and lose the game.
The point is that there was no counterclaim, so unless DocH decided that only 1 dt was a good idea in a game. Node has to be DT

I wouldn't say that it was terrible playing. It defiantly pressured DCXLIV and without it, he probably wouldn't be flagged at red. It's defiantly better than node posting that "hey guys, I didn't get anything useful, sorry"

Ace

United States16096 Posts

December 30 2010 04:09 GMT

#22

Fine, we'll lose the game. But it would still be the rational move even if there is no counter claim. Unless you are sure there has to be a DT in the game at that point and that no one else can possibly be a DT then you take his claim seriously.

Otherwise you've got a player that just claimed DT and found 2 reds and goes back on his claim.
At that point he is an outed DT and now the Mafia knows it because he pinned 2 reds. Why would he retract his claim if it's true? Mafia are going to NK him anyway.

So unless you can give a good reason not to vote Node in this instance then losing the game because someone decided to play bad is fine. I'll make that vote every single time and live with the consequences since I know my judgment and analysis leads me to Scum an overwhelming number of times.

LSB

United States5171 Posts

December 30 2010 04:35 GMT

#23

Exactly, there was no counterclaim so Node had to be DT. And we specifically called out the DT to claim. Lynching node would be lynching a confirmed townie.

Secondly the only thing 'bad' about Node's play was that he admitted to lying.
Lying is not a bad play. If node did nothing about the lie, the town would be increadibly close to turning around for victory. Lying can be powerful when used right.

Ace

United States16096 Posts

December 30 2010 04:49 GMT

#24

And like I said, if there is no counter claim and we are sure there has to be 1 DT in the game I'd take his claim seriously.

That was a bad play, there is no argument around it. You just said he was an ACTUAL DT that lied and said his isn't one.

Then Node said that he was actually lying, and the two people he checked were dead so he actually had no useful information.

How is this not bad? You're at LYLO. You just said there has to a Detective. Node claims DT, says DC and Eiii are Scum. He then retracts and lie to say the 2 ppl he checked are dead.

Stop looking at the result of the game because ultimately that's not the point here. You're at LYLO with a guy who just lied about information that's pretty critical to LYLO. The lie wasn't even useful at all. Why would he retract his claim? What did that do to further the town vote on a path to lynching as opposed to just staying with his truthful claim?

Explain to me how that lie helped the town win.

LSB

United States5171 Posts

December 30 2010 05:07 GMT

#25

(firstly it was double lynch, if we missed both we lose)

Very simple, it presented critical information about DCXLVI. He claimed Hatter and wouldn't tell where the secons bomb was. I didn't believe it, and so I pushed to lynch him.

If node had not done that, DC probably wouldn't have slipped on the radar as the town was more concerned with the people who weren't posting.

Node's post was an excellent way to pressure DC, who probably wouldn't have roleclaimed to a simple analysis.

Foolishness

United States3044 Posts

December 30 2010 20:07 GMT

#26

On December 30 2010 01:48 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
I have been thinking lately that we should try to get the staff to let us have a wiki on liquipedia instead of making a billion threads for resources. Does anyone else think that would be a good idea?

That would be Ver's job!