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Russo-Ukrainian War Thread - Page 834

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NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.

Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.
0x64
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
Finland4647 Posts
August 08 2025 12:02 GMT
#16661
On August 07 2025 20:45 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2025 18:57 0x64 wrote:
Even Trump knows you don't fight an economic war in all direction at once, so it might look chaotic and cause panic. At least someone does something against India's scalping.
He started a trade war with the entire world.

Literally one of the first things he did upon getting into office was do the very thing you say he isn't dumb enough to do.


Fair point, but he is also known for randomly retracting. Causing chaos to misdirect from other issues etc. he is probably just a high functional idiot.
Dump of assembler code from 0xffffffec to 0x64: End of assembler dump.
Excludos
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Norway8279 Posts
August 08 2025 19:26 GMT
#16662
https://kyivindependent.com/us-russia-discuss-deal-to-cement-moscows-hold-on-occupied-ukrainian-territories-bloomberg-reports/

Great new peace deal! US and Russia have now agreed that Russia should get everything they want, and Ukraine gets nothing. The art of the deal strikes again!

Gotta love US and Russia making a peace deal for the war in Ukraine, without actually involving Ukraine.
duckTemplar
Profile Joined February 2011
United States216 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-08-09 23:55:00
August 09 2025 23:54 GMT
#16663
At the end of Ww 2, i think churchill divided up middle east w/ a napkin.
The first word Kerrigan said to Raynor was "...You Pig!", to Raynor's response "What? ... oh you're a psychic"
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44373 Posts
August 10 2025 02:05 GMT
#16664
On August 10 2025 08:54 duckTemplar wrote:
At the end of Ww 2, i think churchill divided up middle east w/ a napkin.

At the end of WW2 Churchill wasn’t even Prime Minister, pretty sure he was on a lecture tour.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
RvB
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Netherlands6322 Posts
August 10 2025 06:05 GMT
#16665
On August 09 2025 04:26 Excludos wrote:
https://kyivindependent.com/us-russia-discuss-deal-to-cement-moscows-hold-on-occupied-ukrainian-territories-bloomberg-reports/

Great new peace deal! US and Russia have now agreed that Russia should get everything they want, and Ukraine gets nothing. The art of the deal strikes again!

Gotta love US and Russia making a peace deal for the war in Ukraine, without actually involving Ukraine.

That's not everything Russia wants. Their initial demands were also for a demilitarized Ukraine, a different government, and including giving up unoccupied parts of Zapirizhia, and Kherson. They still ask for unoccupied Donetsk though so it makes little sense for Ukraine to accept. It's giving away land for nothing in return.
maybenexttime
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
Poland5876 Posts
August 10 2025 07:06 GMT
#16666
On August 10 2025 15:05 RvB wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2025 04:26 Excludos wrote:
https://kyivindependent.com/us-russia-discuss-deal-to-cement-moscows-hold-on-occupied-ukrainian-territories-bloomberg-reports/

Great new peace deal! US and Russia have now agreed that Russia should get everything they want, and Ukraine gets nothing. The art of the deal strikes again!

Gotta love US and Russia making a peace deal for the war in Ukraine, without actually involving Ukraine.

That's not everything Russia wants. Their initial demands were also for a demilitarized Ukraine, a different government, and including giving up unoccupied parts of Zapirizhia, and Kherson. They still ask for unoccupied Donetsk though so it makes little sense for Ukraine to accept. It's giving away land for nothing in return.

Their demands haven't changed. Several outlets are reporting that Witkoff misunderstood Putin:

https://unn.ua/en/news/trumps-special-envoy-witkoff-misunderstood-putin-bild
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17850 Posts
August 10 2025 16:19 GMT
#16667
On August 10 2025 15:05 RvB wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2025 04:26 Excludos wrote:
https://kyivindependent.com/us-russia-discuss-deal-to-cement-moscows-hold-on-occupied-ukrainian-territories-bloomberg-reports/

Great new peace deal! US and Russia have now agreed that Russia should get everything they want, and Ukraine gets nothing. The art of the deal strikes again!

Gotta love US and Russia making a peace deal for the war in Ukraine, without actually involving Ukraine.

That's not everything Russia wants. Their initial demands were also for a demilitarized Ukraine, a different government, and including giving up unoccupied parts of Zapirizhia, and Kherson. They still ask for unoccupied Donetsk though so it makes little sense for Ukraine to accept. It's giving away land for nothing in return.


Not just any land. Russia basically wants them to surrender their most developed strongholds and fortifications (something they'd probably need another 1 million men and years of grind to capture).

Georgie explains it pretty well I think:

Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44373 Posts
August 10 2025 17:06 GMT
#16668
On August 11 2025 01:19 Manit0u wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 10 2025 15:05 RvB wrote:
On August 09 2025 04:26 Excludos wrote:
https://kyivindependent.com/us-russia-discuss-deal-to-cement-moscows-hold-on-occupied-ukrainian-territories-bloomberg-reports/

Great new peace deal! US and Russia have now agreed that Russia should get everything they want, and Ukraine gets nothing. The art of the deal strikes again!

Gotta love US and Russia making a peace deal for the war in Ukraine, without actually involving Ukraine.

That's not everything Russia wants. Their initial demands were also for a demilitarized Ukraine, a different government, and including giving up unoccupied parts of Zapirizhia, and Kherson. They still ask for unoccupied Donetsk though so it makes little sense for Ukraine to accept. It's giving away land for nothing in return.


Not just any land. Russia basically wants them to surrender their most developed strongholds and fortifications (something they'd probably need another 1 million men and years of grind to capture).

Georgie explains it pretty well I think:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_xJ7HJxyGE

It seems like a terrible idea but consider the example of Munich. Czechoslovakia surrendered the highly defensible Sudetenland to a fascist dictator obsessed with rebuilding the former empire and nothing bad happened to them.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
maybenexttime
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
Poland5876 Posts
August 10 2025 18:20 GMT
#16669
Do you think Trump may try to arrest Zelensky and hand him to Russia?
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44373 Posts
August 10 2025 18:25 GMT
#16670
He’s notoriously gutless so no. They’re just going to present a surrender plan to Zelenskyy without any input from Ukraine, demand to know why he isn’t saying thank you, then reduce arms shipments to Ukraine.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17850 Posts
August 10 2025 19:03 GMT
#16671
On August 11 2025 03:20 maybenexttime wrote:
Do you think Trump may try to arrest Zelensky and hand him to Russia?


Why would he try and arrest a democratically elected president of a foreign country?
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
maybenexttime
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
Poland5876 Posts
August 10 2025 19:24 GMT
#16672
On August 11 2025 04:03 Manit0u wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 11 2025 03:20 maybenexttime wrote:
Do you think Trump may try to arrest Zelensky and hand him to Russia?


Why would he try and arrest a democratically elected president of a foreign country?

To strike some lucrative deals with Putin. He's the most corrupt politician in the Western world by far and he's fawning over Putin on top of that. He might also delude himself that Zelensky is an "obstacle to peace" because he won't let Ukraine surrender.
pmp10
Profile Joined April 2012
3400 Posts
August 10 2025 19:46 GMT
#16673
On August 11 2025 04:24 maybenexttime wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 11 2025 04:03 Manit0u wrote:
On August 11 2025 03:20 maybenexttime wrote:
Do you think Trump may try to arrest Zelensky and hand him to Russia?


Why would he try and arrest a democratically elected president of a foreign country?

To strike some lucrative deals with Putin. He's the most corrupt politician in the Western world by far and he's fawning over Putin on top of that. He might also delude himself that Zelensky is an "obstacle to peace" because he won't let Ukraine surrender.

That's not how any of this works.
You don't kidnap recognized diplomats, let alone heads of state during visits.

I know Trump hysteria is trending, but this is going into extremes.
maybenexttime
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
Poland5876 Posts
August 10 2025 20:06 GMT
#16674
On August 11 2025 04:46 pmp10 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 11 2025 04:24 maybenexttime wrote:
On August 11 2025 04:03 Manit0u wrote:
On August 11 2025 03:20 maybenexttime wrote:
Do you think Trump may try to arrest Zelensky and hand him to Russia?


Why would he try and arrest a democratically elected president of a foreign country?

To strike some lucrative deals with Putin. He's the most corrupt politician in the Western world by far and he's fawning over Putin on top of that. He might also delude himself that Zelensky is an "obstacle to peace" because he won't let Ukraine surrender.

That's not how any of this works.
You don't kidnap recognized diplomats, let alone heads of state during visits.

I know Trump hysteria is trending, but this is going into extremes.

You could say the same about his trying to steal an election, his handling of the economy, brazenly taking bribes, appointing incompetent fools to key positions, alienating longstanding allies, and many other things. There's a reason why Putin chose the Russian Direct Investment Fund's director as the negotiator. I'm not sure if Trump would go that far, but he's done a lot of unhinged stuff before.
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17850 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-08-10 20:11:48
August 10 2025 20:10 GMT
#16675
There's unhinged stuff you do on your own turf but trying to arrest the head of a foreign state on his home ground is pretty much tantamount with launching a war against said state.

Just like there's an arrest order for Putin so he can't really leave his own country and travel freely but no one is actually going to Russia to arrest him.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17850 Posts
Last Edited: 2025-08-10 20:16:07
August 10 2025 20:15 GMT
#16676
On August 11 2025 02:06 KwarK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 11 2025 01:19 Manit0u wrote:
On August 10 2025 15:05 RvB wrote:
On August 09 2025 04:26 Excludos wrote:
https://kyivindependent.com/us-russia-discuss-deal-to-cement-moscows-hold-on-occupied-ukrainian-territories-bloomberg-reports/

Great new peace deal! US and Russia have now agreed that Russia should get everything they want, and Ukraine gets nothing. The art of the deal strikes again!

Gotta love US and Russia making a peace deal for the war in Ukraine, without actually involving Ukraine.

That's not everything Russia wants. Their initial demands were also for a demilitarized Ukraine, a different government, and including giving up unoccupied parts of Zapirizhia, and Kherson. They still ask for unoccupied Donetsk though so it makes little sense for Ukraine to accept. It's giving away land for nothing in return.


Not just any land. Russia basically wants them to surrender their most developed strongholds and fortifications (something they'd probably need another 1 million men and years of grind to capture).

Georgie explains it pretty well I think:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_xJ7HJxyGE

It seems like a terrible idea but consider the example of Munich. Czechoslovakia surrendered the highly defensible Sudetenland to a fascist dictator obsessed with rebuilding the former empire and nothing bad happened to them.


There's a difference between ceding defensible territory before the actual war starts and doing that when you're already 3 years into a war and you spent most of it building fortifications there, making it your most valuable stronghold.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
Simberto
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Germany12026 Posts
August 10 2025 21:44 GMT
#16677
On August 11 2025 05:15 Manit0u wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 11 2025 02:06 KwarK wrote:
On August 11 2025 01:19 Manit0u wrote:
On August 10 2025 15:05 RvB wrote:
On August 09 2025 04:26 Excludos wrote:
https://kyivindependent.com/us-russia-discuss-deal-to-cement-moscows-hold-on-occupied-ukrainian-territories-bloomberg-reports/

Great new peace deal! US and Russia have now agreed that Russia should get everything they want, and Ukraine gets nothing. The art of the deal strikes again!

Gotta love US and Russia making a peace deal for the war in Ukraine, without actually involving Ukraine.

That's not everything Russia wants. Their initial demands were also for a demilitarized Ukraine, a different government, and including giving up unoccupied parts of Zapirizhia, and Kherson. They still ask for unoccupied Donetsk though so it makes little sense for Ukraine to accept. It's giving away land for nothing in return.


Not just any land. Russia basically wants them to surrender their most developed strongholds and fortifications (something they'd probably need another 1 million men and years of grind to capture).

Georgie explains it pretty well I think:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_xJ7HJxyGE

It seems like a terrible idea but consider the example of Munich. Czechoslovakia surrendered the highly defensible Sudetenland to a fascist dictator obsessed with rebuilding the former empire and nothing bad happened to them.


There's a difference between ceding defensible territory before the actual war starts and doing that when you're already 3 years into a war and you spent most of it building fortifications there, making it your most valuable stronghold.


I think you may have missed some sarcasm here. Bad things happened to Czechoslovakia basically immediately afterwards.
ETisME
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
12889 Posts
August 11 2025 22:41 GMT
#16678
Potentially a much larger land loss from Ukraine soon.
https://english.elpais.com/international/2025-08-11/russia-achieves-its-largest-advance-on-the-frontlines-in-ukraine-since-2024.html
其疾如风,其徐如林,侵掠如火,不动如山,难知如阴,动如雷震。
0x64
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
Finland4647 Posts
August 12 2025 09:47 GMT
#16679
On August 11 2025 06:44 Simberto wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 11 2025 05:15 Manit0u wrote:
On August 11 2025 02:06 KwarK wrote:
On August 11 2025 01:19 Manit0u wrote:
On August 10 2025 15:05 RvB wrote:
On August 09 2025 04:26 Excludos wrote:
https://kyivindependent.com/us-russia-discuss-deal-to-cement-moscows-hold-on-occupied-ukrainian-territories-bloomberg-reports/

Great new peace deal! US and Russia have now agreed that Russia should get everything they want, and Ukraine gets nothing. The art of the deal strikes again!

Gotta love US and Russia making a peace deal for the war in Ukraine, without actually involving Ukraine.

That's not everything Russia wants. Their initial demands were also for a demilitarized Ukraine, a different government, and including giving up unoccupied parts of Zapirizhia, and Kherson. They still ask for unoccupied Donetsk though so it makes little sense for Ukraine to accept. It's giving away land for nothing in return.


Not just any land. Russia basically wants them to surrender their most developed strongholds and fortifications (something they'd probably need another 1 million men and years of grind to capture).

Georgie explains it pretty well I think:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_xJ7HJxyGE

It seems like a terrible idea but consider the example of Munich. Czechoslovakia surrendered the highly defensible Sudetenland to a fascist dictator obsessed with rebuilding the former empire and nothing bad happened to them.


There's a difference between ceding defensible territory before the actual war starts and doing that when you're already 3 years into a war and you spent most of it building fortifications there, making it your most valuable stronghold.


I think you may have missed some sarcasm here. Bad things happened to Czechoslovakia basically immediately afterwards.


He was talking about Ukraine. I doubt he missed the sarcasm.
Dump of assembler code from 0xffffffec to 0x64: End of assembler dump.
Jankisa
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Croatia1778 Posts
August 12 2025 11:54 GMT
#16680
Looks like the insane amounts of bodies and equipment being thrown at Pokrovsk is finally paying off, as usual, a lot of doomer articles are coming out, by this point I learned to trust Ukrainian MOD that they knew this was inevitable and prepared accordingly.

To me, it seems like Putin is trying to give himself and Trump arguments that Ukrainian defeat is inevitable in order to gain upper hand in negotiations, or whatever the fuck they are trying to present as negotiations which it definitely isn't because the country that is being invaded is not at the table.
So, are you a pessimist? - On my better days. Are you a nihilist? - Not as much as I should be.
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