EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 958
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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets. Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source. If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
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FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Netherlands30548 Posts
 + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/0O0G5Xf.jpg) | ||
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Wulfey_LA
932 Posts
Trump Wanted to Order Justice Dept. to Prosecute Comey and Clinton https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/20/us/politics/president-trump-justice-department.html | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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farvacola
United States18866 Posts
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
Manaforts lawyers are fishing for a pardon, because this is malpractice otherwise. | ||
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ReditusSum
79 Posts
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
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Wulfey_LA
932 Posts
EDIT: does confidentiality matter here? Just find out where Manafort was lying. Nail him down on it. Then find matching lies in Trump's responses. | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands22452 Posts
On November 29 2018 06:43 Wulfey_LA wrote: Lets pack up a step and realize that we don't know if Trump copies Manafort's lies into his answers.I am reminded of when Tyrion Lannister told three different plans to three different people to determine who was leaking to his sister. Manafort lied during his cooperation. Manafort passed his lies to Trump via attorneys. Trump then copyPasta'd these lies into his responses to interrogatories. It was already too late for a pardon, but now it is even more preposterous. Mueller need only put Mueller back into jail based on his most recent lies, and then use those lies as a spear to go straight for Trump because Trump was dumb enough to copy and paste. All we have is that Manafort's lawyers passed information to Trump's lawyers while Manafort was cooperating with Mueller, supposedly in violation of their cooperation agreement. Edit:As for your edit. You would have to be able to prove Trump knew they were lies and not just what Manafort or others told him. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
But this is so outside the norm that I’m having a hard time speculating how the Judge, FBI and Courts will respond. Straight up, this this is crazy. I think we are going to see the same thing from the Court too. They will be so shocked by the actions of Manafort’s attorneys that they will have to take time to formulate how they will respond. Or they will throw the book at him and his attorneys. | ||
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Wulfey_LA
932 Posts
On November 29 2018 06:46 Gorsameth wrote: Lets pack up a step and realize that we don't know if Trump copies Manafort's lies into his answers. All we have is that Manafort's lawyers passed information to Trump's lawyers while Manafort was cooperating with Mueller, supposedly in violation of their cooperation agreement. Edit:As for your edit. You would have to be able to prove Trump knew they were lies and not just what Manafort or others told him. I am guessing that they copy and pasted their answers. Perhaps they were brainy enough to reword the exact lies that Manafort told. But you know they synced up their stories to make sure that if Manafort said "XXX is true", then Trump will have answered "XXX is true" in his interrogatories. What would be the point of collaborating and leaking information if not to make sure that their stories were the same? Can you imagine a circumstance where Manafort gave fact claim YYY to Mueller, tells Trump "I told Mueller YYY", and then Trump responds in an interrogatory: "It was actually ABC"? If team Trump knew that Mueller said YYY, then they will put down YYY in Trump's answer. It perhaps might not have been a literal copy and paste, but ... knowing his team ... | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
On November 29 2018 07:21 Plansix wrote: It is all to stupid to believe. I mean, isn't that most of this in a nutshell? If I recall correctly, Manafort's got some a pretty good legal team. White shoe defense/ litigation lawyers tend to be a pretty sharp bunch (I've met some dumb ass corporate practice lawyers, yet to meet a dumb litigator) kind of surprised if they'd be willing to do such absurd things. | ||
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Doodsmack
United States7224 Posts
On November 29 2018 07:21 Plansix wrote: It is hard to say, but I would think it is dangerously close to obstruction of justice. They entered an agreement with prosecutor and the FBI with the full intent of leaking that information to the people being investigated. And one of those people happens to be the President, who has the power the pardon. But there would need to be smoking gun evidence that the attorneys were doing for that reason. It is all to stupid to believe. But this is so outside the norm that I’m having a hard time speculating how the Judge, FBI and Courts will respond. Straight up, this this is crazy. I think we are going to see the same thing from the Court too. They will be so shocked by the actions of Manafort’s attorneys that they will have to take time to formulate how they will respond. Or they will throw the book at him and his attorneys. It seems as though trump is just in all out war with Mueller because trumps ultimate defense here is political. His strategy is a public relations one to ensure he doesnt get impeached. | ||
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ReditusSum
79 Posts
On November 29 2018 06:38 Plansix wrote: The agreement they entered with the prosecutor did not include them leaking information about the investigation to the people being investigated. That is very very bad. The fact that Trump's team took that information is slightly less dumb, but not smart at all. As far as I am aware, it has never been confirmed that Trump is under investigation. The assumption is that he is really under investigation, but I'm pretty sure that is still just the unofficial reality but not the official reality. The theory I am hearing from conservatives is that Mueller wanted Manafort to lie about the Trump tower meeting, basically fabricate testimony so they could pursue a case against Don Jr. but instead Manafort's lawyers shared this information with Trump's team (that Mueller was pressuring him to fabricate testimony). This seems plausible given the fact that a federal judge has already accused Mueller of doing just that and almost every target of his investigation has said the same thing: that he is pressuring them to fabricate testimony. Also this was (is?) typical for the Justice Dept as we saw with the Ted Stevens case and the Enron case. As far as the "lies" go, this is that Manafort allegedly met with Assange? But we've learned that the FBI was surveilling him as far back as 2013... so how would they not know whether he met Assange or not? How could they suddenly "learn" that he met with Assange when they apparently started watching him 3 years before he met with Assange? So was the "met with wikileaks" thing a perjury trap, or just a straight-up lie by the Mueller team leaked to the media to try to scare Manafort into playing ball? It seems obvious what is going on: A Russian working with the same firm that Clinton hired tried to set Donald Jr. up with a honey-pot meeting, but Don Jr and team didn't take the bait; so now they need Manafort to fabricate testimony and claim there was some kind of pay-to-play (concerning the Magninsky act). It goes back to the theory (one I tend to find the most credible) that Mueller is really just a clean-up operation trying to distract everyone from the massive (and highly unethical and potentially illegal) spying operation the Obama admin and Justice Dept. (and probably British intelligence) set up against a rival political campaign. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18356 Posts
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Velr
Switzerland10917 Posts
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Neneu
Norway492 Posts
On a more serious note, that is some of the more far fetched stuff I've read in a while, but ofc if you provide any reasonable sources for all your claims I will have to try to take your post more seriously. | ||
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