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On October 17 2012 06:06 Holy_AT wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 02:52 Endymion wrote:
OH BOY, another internet witch hunt. the internet is so hypocritical, people do this shit every day on chat roulette, blog tv, tinychat, etc etc etc. someone did what a lot of people on the internet do??!?? call teh copz! if the canadian police cared about amanda todd's case they would have found this guy on day 1, annonomous is being hypocritical and vindictive acting like they give two shits. at least /b/ knows the truth, she commited suicide because of low self esteem and social pressure, not because this guy screen capped her boobs and sent it to everyone.. the only problem about spreading it is that it's childporn, not that it's destructive to amanda todd.. people do this shit every day on facebook, have you guys even seen mean girls? real highschools are much more effective at bullying than that film, and it was meant to be a satire on the state of young girls' development in highschool.. so say whatever you want about this guy, but tbh he's the same as like 75% of the people who spend any time on the internet (including 12 year old girls on facebook)
it's just a different form of slander, and the end result was a suicide. except it wasn't even slander because it was a picture of her boobs/vag that she provided (in video form!)... you guys have no idea how good these girls are at destroying eachother, it's an art. this guy was a philistine, he had no idea how to bully someone. and you want to arrest him? give me a break, double standards much.
for the record i liked amanda todd, and i think her suicide was beautiful. but this witch hunt is retarded. Sorry, but I really have to say that this style of writing is not what I expect from the normally high quality posts of TL staff or writers. Although the girl might not have acted in the most intelligent way blaming soley her and saying it is hippocritical to uphold this case because this is happening often is not the right thing todo. Just because some bad things are happening often does not mean that one cant do anything about them or spread awareness. I also really dont get what you mean by calling her suicide beautifull ? It is a tragedy not something beautifull. And if you as a writer had a report button I would have hit it, I searched for it but unfortunatly there wasn't one. I am really disappointed by this post, it casts a shadow on the high standards of team liquid writers, staff and the community. I myself got warned and banned for things where I deserved it, I hope someone else will intervene.
Feel free to post in Website Feedback about it, thats where i'll be reprimanded for improper posting.This isn't directed at you in particular, but rather to anyone who takes issue with my posts.
In terms of why I think that her suicide was "beautiful," I think it's an extremely raw expression of free will. She made the completely contested decision to kill herself (contested in the sense of her friends/family, not her peers), and went through with it. It's amazing to me that free speech still exists anywhere with all of the pressure that people put on others. That's why I think it's beautiful. It speaks to her strong will and her convictions to herself. She was a great person, and now she's unfortunately gone. It's a waste, but it was still a beautiful act of expression.
edit ~ correction of website feedback and I added the URL
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On October 17 2012 06:25 Endymion wrote:
In terms of why I think that her suicide was "beautiful," I think it's an extremely raw expression of free will. She made the completely contested decision to kill herself (contested in the sense of her friends/family, not her peers), and went through with it. It's amazing to me that free speech still exists anywhere with all of the pressure that people put on others. That's why I think it's beautiful. It speaks to her strong will and her convictions to herself. She was a great person, and now she's unfortunately gone. It's a waste, but it was still a beautiful act of expression.
This is the most twisted understanding of suicide, beauty, and "free speech" I have ever seen. For your sake (and the world's), I hope you are making some subtle joke that is flying by my head.
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On October 17 2012 06:25 Endymion wrote:
In terms of why I think that her suicide was "beautiful," I think it's an extremely raw expression of free will. She made the completely contested decision to kill herself (contested in the sense of her friends/family, not her peers), and went through with it. It's amazing to me that free speech still exists anywhere with all of the pressure that people put on others. That's why I think it's beautiful. It speaks to her strong will and her convictions to herself. She was a great person, and now she's unfortunately gone. It's a waste, but it was still a beautiful act of expression.
this is so deeply ironic and misbegotten that I do not even know where to start:
- an exercise in free will only goes so far as what the actor and the greater society gains from it, if anything. this girl could have continued to persevere against the actions of her classmates and it would have been a true celebration of free will and the ability to escape your miserable circumstance in the sort of way that killing yourself can never approach. ultimately, the act of suicide is a surrender, and honestly not something that deserves the sort of morbid laudation I see in your post.
- her will and convictions were twisted and wrenched by the constant bullying...kind of distorts the message when if she'd felt she had another out that wasn't death, she'd almost certainly have taken it. is the desperate act of someone who feels emotionally trapped and forced to act when they can't take any more really considered free speech?
- I very much protest this strange artistic framing that you've undertaken. framing the cycle of bullying and othering in some sort of process that can culminate in a "beautiful act of expression" when the end result is the loss of life is frankly fucking naive and sheltered and creepy. the message of anti-bullying and anti-discrimination groups for a long time now has been "it gets better", and it does get better, so for the love of god can we not romanticize the subject to the point where anyone else in this girl's position might be persuaded that they're making some sort of statement by hurting themselves, even slightly?
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On October 17 2012 06:25 Endymion wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 06:06 Holy_AT wrote:On October 17 2012 02:52 Endymion wrote:
OH BOY, another internet witch hunt. the internet is so hypocritical, people do this shit every day on chat roulette, blog tv, tinychat, etc etc etc. someone did what a lot of people on the internet do??!?? call teh copz! if the canadian police cared about amanda todd's case they would have found this guy on day 1, annonomous is being hypocritical and vindictive acting like they give two shits. at least /b/ knows the truth, she commited suicide because of low self esteem and social pressure, not because this guy screen capped her boobs and sent it to everyone.. the only problem about spreading it is that it's childporn, not that it's destructive to amanda todd.. people do this shit every day on facebook, have you guys even seen mean girls? real highschools are much more effective at bullying than that film, and it was meant to be a satire on the state of young girls' development in highschool.. so say whatever you want about this guy, but tbh he's the same as like 75% of the people who spend any time on the internet (including 12 year old girls on facebook)
it's just a different form of slander, and the end result was a suicide. except it wasn't even slander because it was a picture of her boobs/vag that she provided (in video form!)... you guys have no idea how good these girls are at destroying eachother, it's an art. this guy was a philistine, he had no idea how to bully someone. and you want to arrest him? give me a break, double standards much.
for the record i liked amanda todd, and i think her suicide was beautiful. but this witch hunt is retarded. Sorry, but I really have to say that this style of writing is not what I expect from the normally high quality posts of TL staff or writers. Although the girl might not have acted in the most intelligent way blaming soley her and saying it is hippocritical to uphold this case because this is happening often is not the right thing todo. Just because some bad things are happening often does not mean that one cant do anything about them or spread awareness. I also really dont get what you mean by calling her suicide beautifull ? It is a tragedy not something beautifull. And if you as a writer had a report button I would have hit it, I searched for it but unfortunatly there wasn't one. I am really disappointed by this post, it casts a shadow on the high standards of team liquid writers, staff and the community. I myself got warned and banned for things where I deserved it, I hope someone else will intervene. Feel free to post in Website Feedback about it, thats where i'll be reprimanded for improper posting.This isn't directed at you in particular, but rather to anyone who takes issue with my posts. In terms of why I think that her suicide was "beautiful," I think it's an extremely raw expression of free will. She made the completely contested decision to kill herself (contested in the sense of her friends/family, not her peers), and went through with it. It's amazing to me that free speech still exists anywhere with all of the pressure that people put on others. That's why I think it's beautiful. It speaks to her strong will and her convictions to herself. She was a great person, and now she's unfortunately gone. It's a waste, but it was still a beautiful act of expression. edit ~ correction of website feedback and I added the URL
You are a funny odd little duck... calling people delusional and glorifying suicide. She got cornerd and saw no way out, she didn't have the courage to commit suicide, she couldn't find a resolution for her problems and as a last resort she opted the only viable way in her mind out. Glorifying suicide is what i call delusional. She would have shown courage if she asked for help.
[edit]
appearently she did receive help but to no success, that was courages of her. Everything else I said still stands.
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On October 17 2012 06:25 Endymion wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 06:06 Holy_AT wrote:On October 17 2012 02:52 Endymion wrote:
OH BOY, another internet witch hunt. the internet is so hypocritical, people do this shit every day on chat roulette, blog tv, tinychat, etc etc etc. someone did what a lot of people on the internet do??!?? call teh copz! if the canadian police cared about amanda todd's case they would have found this guy on day 1, annonomous is being hypocritical and vindictive acting like they give two shits. at least /b/ knows the truth, she commited suicide because of low self esteem and social pressure, not because this guy screen capped her boobs and sent it to everyone.. the only problem about spreading it is that it's childporn, not that it's destructive to amanda todd.. people do this shit every day on facebook, have you guys even seen mean girls? real highschools are much more effective at bullying than that film, and it was meant to be a satire on the state of young girls' development in highschool.. so say whatever you want about this guy, but tbh he's the same as like 75% of the people who spend any time on the internet (including 12 year old girls on facebook)
it's just a different form of slander, and the end result was a suicide. except it wasn't even slander because it was a picture of her boobs/vag that she provided (in video form!)... you guys have no idea how good these girls are at destroying eachother, it's an art. this guy was a philistine, he had no idea how to bully someone. and you want to arrest him? give me a break, double standards much.
for the record i liked amanda todd, and i think her suicide was beautiful. but this witch hunt is retarded. Sorry, but I really have to say that this style of writing is not what I expect from the normally high quality posts of TL staff or writers. Although the girl might not have acted in the most intelligent way blaming soley her and saying it is hippocritical to uphold this case because this is happening often is not the right thing todo. Just because some bad things are happening often does not mean that one cant do anything about them or spread awareness. I also really dont get what you mean by calling her suicide beautifull ? It is a tragedy not something beautifull. And if you as a writer had a report button I would have hit it, I searched for it but unfortunatly there wasn't one. I am really disappointed by this post, it casts a shadow on the high standards of team liquid writers, staff and the community. I myself got warned and banned for things where I deserved it, I hope someone else will intervene. Feel free to post in community feedback about it, thats where i'll be reprimanded for improper posting.This isn't directed at you in particular, but rather to anyone who takes issue with my posts. In terms of why I think that her suicide was "beautiful," I think it's an extremely raw expression of free will. She made the completely contested decision to kill herself (contested in the sense of her friends/family, not her peers), and went through with it. It's amazing to me that free speech still exists anywhere with all of the pressure that people put on others. That's why I think it's beautiful. It speaks to her strong will and her convictions to herself. She was a great person, and now she's unfortunately gone. It's a waste, but it was still a beautiful act of expression.
This is no expression of free will, this is an expression of desperation. By the gods, she needed help and was desperate and afraid, labeling this as a beautfull act of free will is just wrong.
Do you know how she probably must have felt? Can you imagine the pain in the hours before she took her life ?
The quarrels in her mind between desperation, hope and sense ? The spiral of emotion taking her down until she reached this dreadfull decission, where she was too afraid and too ashamed to ask for help ?
And you come here talking about the beautifull free choice ?
Your post is a mockery about her death and all the people facing a crises in life. You may argue that there was no crisis because it was just mockery, but it was real to her and it mattered to her and it as in any case with any human is just a personal matter. If you are down, your mind plays tricks on you resinforcing your desperation and fears and you can not see reality as it is and it is really really hard to ask for help in such a situation.
I am sorry but you really havent given enough thought or maybe heart in that matter into your post. I hope you take some time and think about what you have really posted before considering an answer.
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On October 17 2012 07:06 Khainer wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 06:25 Endymion wrote:On October 17 2012 06:06 Holy_AT wrote:On October 17 2012 02:52 Endymion wrote:
OH BOY, another internet witch hunt. the internet is so hypocritical, people do this shit every day on chat roulette, blog tv, tinychat, etc etc etc. someone did what a lot of people on the internet do??!?? call teh copz! if the canadian police cared about amanda todd's case they would have found this guy on day 1, annonomous is being hypocritical and vindictive acting like they give two shits. at least /b/ knows the truth, she commited suicide because of low self esteem and social pressure, not because this guy screen capped her boobs and sent it to everyone.. the only problem about spreading it is that it's childporn, not that it's destructive to amanda todd.. people do this shit every day on facebook, have you guys even seen mean girls? real highschools are much more effective at bullying than that film, and it was meant to be a satire on the state of young girls' development in highschool.. so say whatever you want about this guy, but tbh he's the same as like 75% of the people who spend any time on the internet (including 12 year old girls on facebook)
it's just a different form of slander, and the end result was a suicide. except it wasn't even slander because it was a picture of her boobs/vag that she provided (in video form!)... you guys have no idea how good these girls are at destroying eachother, it's an art. this guy was a philistine, he had no idea how to bully someone. and you want to arrest him? give me a break, double standards much.
for the record i liked amanda todd, and i think her suicide was beautiful. but this witch hunt is retarded. Sorry, but I really have to say that this style of writing is not what I expect from the normally high quality posts of TL staff or writers. Although the girl might not have acted in the most intelligent way blaming soley her and saying it is hippocritical to uphold this case because this is happening often is not the right thing todo. Just because some bad things are happening often does not mean that one cant do anything about them or spread awareness. I also really dont get what you mean by calling her suicide beautifull ? It is a tragedy not something beautifull. And if you as a writer had a report button I would have hit it, I searched for it but unfortunatly there wasn't one. I am really disappointed by this post, it casts a shadow on the high standards of team liquid writers, staff and the community. I myself got warned and banned for things where I deserved it, I hope someone else will intervene. Feel free to post in Website Feedback about it, thats where i'll be reprimanded for improper posting.This isn't directed at you in particular, but rather to anyone who takes issue with my posts. In terms of why I think that her suicide was "beautiful," I think it's an extremely raw expression of free will. She made the completely contested decision to kill herself (contested in the sense of her friends/family, not her peers), and went through with it. It's amazing to me that free speech still exists anywhere with all of the pressure that people put on others. That's why I think it's beautiful. It speaks to her strong will and her convictions to herself. She was a great person, and now she's unfortunately gone. It's a waste, but it was still a beautiful act of expression. edit ~ correction of website feedback and I added the URL You are a funny odd little duck... calling people delusional and glorifying suicide. She got cornerd and saw no way out, she didn't have the courage to commit suicide, she couldn't find a resolution for her problems and as a last resort she opted the only viable way in her mind out. Glorifying suicide is what i call delusional. She would have shown courage if she asked for help.
The phrasing of delusional that I used was that the user was delusional if he thought that anonymous vindictively killing this guy would do anything in the long run, which I think is true because I don't think it'll change anything just like the Kony movement didn't change anything.
I guess we just have a different perception on the human spirit, it takes a lot of willpower to commit suicide, especially in a situation like hers. Just because it's beautiful doesn't necessarily mean it's a good thing, horrible things can at times be beautiful. I just think it says a lot about her (knowing a lot of people who have cowered from suicide) that she was able to overcome the torment of living and to just end it. I know it's morbid, but that's the context of calling it beautiful.
On October 17 2012 07:08 Holy_AT wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 06:25 Endymion wrote:On October 17 2012 06:06 Holy_AT wrote:On October 17 2012 02:52 Endymion wrote:
OH BOY, another internet witch hunt. the internet is so hypocritical, people do this shit every day on chat roulette, blog tv, tinychat, etc etc etc. someone did what a lot of people on the internet do??!?? call teh copz! if the canadian police cared about amanda todd's case they would have found this guy on day 1, annonomous is being hypocritical and vindictive acting like they give two shits. at least /b/ knows the truth, she commited suicide because of low self esteem and social pressure, not because this guy screen capped her boobs and sent it to everyone.. the only problem about spreading it is that it's childporn, not that it's destructive to amanda todd.. people do this shit every day on facebook, have you guys even seen mean girls? real highschools are much more effective at bullying than that film, and it was meant to be a satire on the state of young girls' development in highschool.. so say whatever you want about this guy, but tbh he's the same as like 75% of the people who spend any time on the internet (including 12 year old girls on facebook)
it's just a different form of slander, and the end result was a suicide. except it wasn't even slander because it was a picture of her boobs/vag that she provided (in video form!)... you guys have no idea how good these girls are at destroying eachother, it's an art. this guy was a philistine, he had no idea how to bully someone. and you want to arrest him? give me a break, double standards much.
for the record i liked amanda todd, and i think her suicide was beautiful. but this witch hunt is retarded. Sorry, but I really have to say that this style of writing is not what I expect from the normally high quality posts of TL staff or writers. Although the girl might not have acted in the most intelligent way blaming soley her and saying it is hippocritical to uphold this case because this is happening often is not the right thing todo. Just because some bad things are happening often does not mean that one cant do anything about them or spread awareness. I also really dont get what you mean by calling her suicide beautifull ? It is a tragedy not something beautifull. And if you as a writer had a report button I would have hit it, I searched for it but unfortunatly there wasn't one. I am really disappointed by this post, it casts a shadow on the high standards of team liquid writers, staff and the community. I myself got warned and banned for things where I deserved it, I hope someone else will intervene. Feel free to post in community feedback about it, thats where i'll be reprimanded for improper posting.This isn't directed at you in particular, but rather to anyone who takes issue with my posts. In terms of why I think that her suicide was "beautiful," I think it's an extremely raw expression of free will. She made the completely contested decision to kill herself (contested in the sense of her friends/family, not her peers), and went through with it. It's amazing to me that free speech still exists anywhere with all of the pressure that people put on others. That's why I think it's beautiful. It speaks to her strong will and her convictions to herself. She was a great person, and now she's unfortunately gone. It's a waste, but it was still a beautiful act of expression. This is no expression of free will, this is an expression of desperation. By the gods, she needed help and was desperate and afraid, labeling this as a beautfull act of free will is just wrong. Do you know how she probably must have felt? Can you imagine the pain in the hours before she took her life ? The quarrels in her mind between desperation, hope and sense ? The spiral of emotion taking her down until she reached this dreadfull decission, where she was too afraid and too ashamed to ask for help ? And you come here talking about the beautifull free choice ? Your post is a mockery about her death and all the people facing a crises in life. You may argue that there was no crisis because it was just mockery, but it was real to her and it mattered to her and it as in any case with any human is just a personal matter. If you are down, your mind plays tricks on you resinforcing your desperation and fears and you can not see reality as it is and it is really really hard to ask for help in such a situation. I am sorry but you really havent given enough thought or maybe heart in that matter into your post. I hope you take some time and think about what you have really posted before considering an answer.
I grew up in North America, I know what the system of bullying is (built upon the idea that education is useless without adversity). I think you don't respect her death as much as I do, I really look up to her. I'm certainly not mocking her at all, not in the slightest. What would you have preferred, that she accept the shit everyone gave to her and carry on? She tried that and it failed. Multiple times even. I don't agree with her doing it, but I respect her decision to do it more than the people who say she was weak or stupid for doing it. That's the beauty of it, not the mockery..
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On October 17 2012 07:11 Endymion wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 07:06 Khainer wrote:
...*snip*...
You are a funny odd little duck... calling people delusional and glorifying suicide. She got cornerd and saw no way out, she didn't have the courage to commit suicide, she couldn't find a resolution for her problems and as a last resort she opted the only viable way in her mind out. Glorifying suicide is what i call delusional. She would have shown courage if she asked for help. The phrasing of delusional that I used was that the user was delusional if he thought that anonymous vindictively killing this guy would do anything in the long run, which I think is true because I don't think it'll change anything just like the Kony movement didn't change anything. I guess we just have a different perception on the human spirit, it takes a lot of willpower to commit suicide, especially in a situation like hers. Just because it's beautiful doesn't necessarily mean it's a good thing, horrible things can at times be beautiful. I just think it says a lot about her (knowing a lot of people who have cowered from suicide) that she was able to overcome the torment of living and to just end it. I know it's morbid, but that's the context of calling it beautiful. ...*snip*...
I agree we have different perceptions, I also can't believe you honestly think someone has a lot of willpower to commit suicide. I believe you have mistake willpower with desperation. She went throught a whole ordeal of problems, all the help she received got immediatly shutdown every day she walked through the hallways of her school and anywhere else her bullies decided to harass her. This doesn't increase her willpower but drags her further down into desperation. Saying otherwise is delusional and probably helps you sleep better at night.
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On October 17 2012 06:25 Endymion wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 06:06 Holy_AT wrote:On October 17 2012 02:52 Endymion wrote:
OH BOY, another internet witch hunt. the internet is so hypocritical, people do this shit every day on chat roulette, blog tv, tinychat, etc etc etc. someone did what a lot of people on the internet do??!?? call teh copz! if the canadian police cared about amanda todd's case they would have found this guy on day 1, annonomous is being hypocritical and vindictive acting like they give two shits. at least /b/ knows the truth, she commited suicide because of low self esteem and social pressure, not because this guy screen capped her boobs and sent it to everyone.. the only problem about spreading it is that it's childporn, not that it's destructive to amanda todd.. people do this shit every day on facebook, have you guys even seen mean girls? real highschools are much more effective at bullying than that film, and it was meant to be a satire on the state of young girls' development in highschool.. so say whatever you want about this guy, but tbh he's the same as like 75% of the people who spend any time on the internet (including 12 year old girls on facebook)
it's just a different form of slander, and the end result was a suicide. except it wasn't even slander because it was a picture of her boobs/vag that she provided (in video form!)... you guys have no idea how good these girls are at destroying eachother, it's an art. this guy was a philistine, he had no idea how to bully someone. and you want to arrest him? give me a break, double standards much.
for the record i liked amanda todd, and i think her suicide was beautiful. but this witch hunt is retarded. Sorry, but I really have to say that this style of writing is not what I expect from the normally high quality posts of TL staff or writers. Although the girl might not have acted in the most intelligent way blaming soley her and saying it is hippocritical to uphold this case because this is happening often is not the right thing todo. Just because some bad things are happening often does not mean that one cant do anything about them or spread awareness. I also really dont get what you mean by calling her suicide beautifull ? It is a tragedy not something beautifull. And if you as a writer had a report button I would have hit it, I searched for it but unfortunatly there wasn't one. I am really disappointed by this post, it casts a shadow on the high standards of team liquid writers, staff and the community. I myself got warned and banned for things where I deserved it, I hope someone else will intervene. Feel free to post in Website Feedback about it, thats where i'll be reprimanded for improper posting.This isn't directed at you in particular, but rather to anyone who takes issue with my posts. In terms of why I think that her suicide was "beautiful," I think it's an extremely raw expression of free will. She made the completely contested decision to kill herself (contested in the sense of her friends/family, not her peers), and went through with it. It's amazing to me that free speech still exists anywhere with all of the pressure that people put on others. That's why I think it's beautiful. It speaks to her strong will and her convictions to herself. She was a great person, and now she's unfortunately gone. It's a waste, but it was still a beautiful act of expression. edit ~ correction of website feedback and I added the URL I kinda see now why you were defending that blackmailing guy, bacause you've clearly share some personality traits. The most disturbing one is a complete lack of empathy.
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On October 17 2012 07:11 Endymion wrote:
built upon the idea that education is useless without adversity
what? what does this even mean? where does such an outlandish concept come from, please help me understand. I don't think harvard trust fund babies agree with this, let alone the sizable portion of schoolchildren that get through without any notable problems.
What would you have preferred, that she accept the shit everyone gave to her and carry on
yes? I really hate to break this to you, and I don't want to marginalize her story or her struggle by saying this, but the selfishness and othering tendencies inherent to children, adolescents and people in general win out when generally good people kill themselves over things like this. there is no artistic statement to be found here, just another casualty. regardless of whether you think that anti-bullying initiatives are going to be the one-shot answer to bullying (probably not), the romanticization involved in this artistry of suicide nonsense is simply revolting because it serves no purpose than to break down walls between teenagers living and teenagers dying.
horrible things can at times be beautiful
I'm calling your bluff, let's go with some comparisons. amaze me.
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On October 17 2012 07:27 TheExile19 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 07:11 Endymion wrote:
built upon the idea that education is useless without adversity what? what does this even mean? where does such an outlandish concept come from, please help me understand. I don't think harvard trust fund babies agree with this, let alone the sizable portion of schoolchildren that get through without any notable problems. Show nested quote +What would you have preferred, that she accept the shit everyone gave to her and carry on yes? I really hate to break this to you, and I don't want to marginalize her story or her struggle by saying this, but the selfishness and othering tendencies inherent to children, adolescents and people in general win out when generally good people kill themselves over things like this. there is no artistic statement to be found here, just another casualty. regardless of whether you think that anti-bullying initiatives are going to be the one-shot answer to bullying (probably not), the romanticization involved in this artistry of suicide nonsense is simply revolting because it serves no purpose than to break down walls between teenagers living and teenagers dying. I'm calling your bluff, let's go with some comparisons. amaze me.
education is useless without adversity ~ without context, you can never experience something.. if everyone loved you would be hard pressed to find more value in love than someone who only has one person loving them. the sweet is never as sweet without the sour.
That's the reason that beautiful things can be horrible.. Look at the holocaust, you may at first say "wow that's revolting, so many people died.." and you still will once you delve into it, but now that we don't have the holocaust we're able to enjoy life that much more.. Of course things become marginalized over time, that's why people keep repeating history. That's why if you ask someone who was in Auschwitz about their experience they won't tell you to fuck off, they'll tell you their story so that you can learn something from it.
That's partially why the suicide was beautiful, but I still say she was strong willed
On October 17 2012 07:25 Cheerio wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 06:25 Endymion wrote:On October 17 2012 06:06 Holy_AT wrote:On October 17 2012 02:52 Endymion wrote:
OH BOY, another internet witch hunt. the internet is so hypocritical, people do this shit every day on chat roulette, blog tv, tinychat, etc etc etc. someone did what a lot of people on the internet do??!?? call teh copz! if the canadian police cared about amanda todd's case they would have found this guy on day 1, annonomous is being hypocritical and vindictive acting like they give two shits. at least /b/ knows the truth, she commited suicide because of low self esteem and social pressure, not because this guy screen capped her boobs and sent it to everyone.. the only problem about spreading it is that it's childporn, not that it's destructive to amanda todd.. people do this shit every day on facebook, have you guys even seen mean girls? real highschools are much more effective at bullying than that film, and it was meant to be a satire on the state of young girls' development in highschool.. so say whatever you want about this guy, but tbh he's the same as like 75% of the people who spend any time on the internet (including 12 year old girls on facebook)
it's just a different form of slander, and the end result was a suicide. except it wasn't even slander because it was a picture of her boobs/vag that she provided (in video form!)... you guys have no idea how good these girls are at destroying eachother, it's an art. this guy was a philistine, he had no idea how to bully someone. and you want to arrest him? give me a break, double standards much.
for the record i liked amanda todd, and i think her suicide was beautiful. but this witch hunt is retarded. Sorry, but I really have to say that this style of writing is not what I expect from the normally high quality posts of TL staff or writers. Although the girl might not have acted in the most intelligent way blaming soley her and saying it is hippocritical to uphold this case because this is happening often is not the right thing todo. Just because some bad things are happening often does not mean that one cant do anything about them or spread awareness. I also really dont get what you mean by calling her suicide beautifull ? It is a tragedy not something beautifull. And if you as a writer had a report button I would have hit it, I searched for it but unfortunatly there wasn't one. I am really disappointed by this post, it casts a shadow on the high standards of team liquid writers, staff and the community. I myself got warned and banned for things where I deserved it, I hope someone else will intervene. Feel free to post in Website Feedback about it, thats where i'll be reprimanded for improper posting.This isn't directed at you in particular, but rather to anyone who takes issue with my posts. In terms of why I think that her suicide was "beautiful," I think it's an extremely raw expression of free will. She made the completely contested decision to kill herself (contested in the sense of her friends/family, not her peers), and went through with it. It's amazing to me that free speech still exists anywhere with all of the pressure that people put on others. That's why I think it's beautiful. It speaks to her strong will and her convictions to herself. She was a great person, and now she's unfortunately gone. It's a waste, but it was still a beautiful act of expression. edit ~ correction of website feedback and I added the URL I kinda see now why you were defending that blackmailing guy, bacause you've clearly share some personality traits. The most disturbing one is a complete lack of empathy.
I have way more empathy than the band-wagoners on facebook, because I strive to understand and appreciate her situation and decision. I would have been her best friend if I had known her.
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I request this thread to be closed.
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On October 17 2012 07:35 Endymion wrote:
That's the reason that beautiful things can be horrible.. Look at the holocaust, you may at first say "wow that's revolting, so many people died.." and you still will once you delve into it, but now that we don't have the holocaust we're able to enjoy life that much more.. Of course things become marginalized over time, that's why people keep repeating history. That's why if you ask someone who was in Auschwitz about their experience they won't tell you to fuck off, they'll tell you their story so that you can learn something from it.
I am so very concerned about the prioritization of "beautiful" over "horrible" when describing the holocaust.
also, I enjoy the 100% non-conditional statement of "if you ask a survivor, they'll tell you". it really says a lot about how connected you are to any of this stuff you're saying. the ridiculous irony here is when you say this:
without context, you can never experience something
yeah, tell me about it
edit: things do indeed become marginalized, like if someone was to frame a relevant discussion of bullying, cyclical violence and its tragic consequences in pretentious philomajor pseudosympathy.
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On October 17 2012 07:47 TheExile19 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 07:35 Endymion wrote:
That's the reason that beautiful things can be horrible.. Look at the holocaust, you may at first say "wow that's revolting, so many people died.." and you still will once you delve into it, but now that we don't have the holocaust we're able to enjoy life that much more.. Of course things become marginalized over time, that's why people keep repeating history. That's why if you ask someone who was in Auschwitz about their experience they won't tell you to fuck off, they'll tell you their story so that you can learn something from it. I am so very concerned about the prioritization of "beautiful" over "horrible" when describing the holocaust. also, I enjoy the 100% non-conditional statement of "if you ask a survivor, they'll tell you". it really says a lot about how connected you are to any of this stuff you're saying. the ridiculous irony here is when you say this: yeah, tell me about it
well if you decide to make an argument instead of just arguing that my credentials (which you don't know anything at all about) are insufficient to have an opinion feel free to PM me and we'll have a discussion of the line between horror and beauty. I'll be sure to send you to HG Giger, or any morbid author for that matter. Hell, any author that talks about something that isn't accepted in modern culture. Another example, Brave New World is a beautiful piece of literature and it's certainly horrifying and disgusting to most people.
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On October 17 2012 07:35 Endymion wrote:
That's the reason that beautiful things can be horrible.. Look at the holocaust, you may at first say "wow that's revolting, so many people died.." and you still will once you delve into it, but now that we don't have the holocaust we're able to enjoy life that much more.. Of course things become marginalized over time, that's why people keep repeating history. That's why if you ask someone who was in Auschwitz about their experience they won't tell you to fuck off, they'll tell you their story so that you can learn something from it.
Please tell me how can I enjoy my life more because of Holocaust, I really find it very hard to do. All those sufferings and the ability of human beings do that to each other only make me depressed and frustrated. This is like saying starving children in Africa make life better for everyone because we should value our comfortable lives more. This is sick.
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On October 17 2012 07:53 Cheerio wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 07:35 Endymion wrote:
That's the reason that beautiful things can be horrible.. Look at the holocaust, you may at first say "wow that's revolting, so many people died.." and you still will once you delve into it, but now that we don't have the holocaust we're able to enjoy life that much more.. Of course things become marginalized over time, that's why people keep repeating history. That's why if you ask someone who was in Auschwitz about their experience they won't tell you to fuck off, they'll tell you their story so that you can learn something from it.
Please tell me how can I enjoy my life more because of Holocaust, I really find it very hard to do. All those sufferings and the ability of human beings do that to each other only make me depressed and frustrated. This is like saying starving children in Africa make life better for everyone because we should value our comfortable lives more. This is sick.
isn't that the whole idea of when people say "appreciate what you have because there are others who don't have it"
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On October 17 2012 07:51 Endymion wrote:
well if you decide to make an argument instead of just arguing that my credentials (which you don't know anything at all about) are insufficient to have an opinion feel free to PM me and we'll have a discussion of the line between horror and beauty. I'll be sure to send you to HG Giger, or any morbid author for that matter. Hell, any author that talks about something that isn't accepted in modern culture. Another example, Brave New World is a beautiful piece of literature and it's certainly horrifying and disgusting to most people.
I never said your credentials were in question or that such categorically forbids you to speak, you can come down from that cross if you like.
there is such a large jump between arguing that pieces of fiction and art have dark beauty and saying that the holocaust and young women killing themselves have upsides that it is literally impossible to take you seriously as a human being. I'm very sorry, I will have to pass on the further argument, which wasn't terribly strong on your end to begin with since you've been consistently justifying real-world consequences and ends with artistic, illusory means. they don't balance out.
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No it is not a show of will power of her to commit suicide, it is no expression of free will and it is no glorious beautifull act.
It is a tragedy and an outcry of desparation of this girl. What you are writting even bringing in the holocoust is pure mockery even mentioning it and bringing it up in that context is just ill advised.
Would you go to her parents and say that her daughter did something beautifull and commited an act of will power ?
Would you go to her friends ? Or rhe people who knew her and tell that what you are writing here ?
No, you would not because it is wrong and it is all a joke for you and you are not empathic enough to even grasp what happened to her and her familiy so please stop posting here or I will start to send PMs to other moderator requesting to overlook your postings. Stop with your, sry for the word but it really fits the most *bullshit* claims and get real.
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On October 17 2012 07:35 Endymion wrote:
I have way more empathy than the band-wagoners on facebook, because I strive to understand and appreciate her situation and decision. I would have been her best friend if I had known her.
Just curious ... what do you know about her, aside from admiring people who selfishly kill themselves?
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On October 17 2012 07:58 TheExile19 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 07:51 Endymion wrote:
well if you decide to make an argument instead of just arguing that my credentials (which you don't know anything at all about) are insufficient to have an opinion feel free to PM me and we'll have a discussion of the line between horror and beauty. I'll be sure to send you to HG Giger, or any morbid author for that matter. Hell, any author that talks about something that isn't accepted in modern culture. Another example, Brave New World is a beautiful piece of literature and it's certainly horrifying and disgusting to most people. I never said your credentials were in question or that such categorically forbids you to speak, you can come down from that cross if you like. there is such a large jump between arguing that pieces of fiction and art have dark beauty and saying that the holocaust and young women killing themselves have upsides that it is literally impossible to take you seriously as a human being. I'm very sorry, I will have to pass on the further argument, which wasn't terribly strong on your end to begin with since you've been consistently justifying real-world consequences and ends with artistic, illusory means. they don't balance out.
"without context, you can never experience something
yeah, tell me about it"
this is the comment that I took as you saying that I didn't have context, if that wasn't your implication then I apologize.
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I don't see why there has to be such a large jump, I think life is a beautiful yet horrifying experience. I'm sorry if you can't see the beauty in things, I was just expressing my appreciation of it. I'm sorry that our views don't align, I didn't mean to alienate you in any way.
As far as the inquiry to how much I know about her, I know enough as I have to. I'm obviously not going to go into relationships or information sources as it would be disrespectful to her, it's not like they would add any more validity to my comments anyways.
On October 17 2012 08:01 Holy_AT wrote:
No it is not a show of will power of her to commit suicide, it is no expression of free will and it is no glorious beautifull act.
It is a tragedy and an outcry of desparation of this girl. What you are writting even bringing in the holocoust is pure mockery even mentioning it and bringing it up in that context is just ill advised.
Would you go to her parents and say that her daughter did something beautifull and commited an act of will power ?
Would you go to her friends ? Or rhe people who knew her and tell that what you are writing here ?
No, you would not because it is wrong and it is all a joke for you and you are not empathic enough to even grasp what happened to her and her familiy so please stop posting here or I will start to send PMs to other moderator requesting to overlook your postings. Stop with your, sry for the word but it really fits the most *bullshit* claims and get real.
Oh, thanks for speaking for how I would phrase my comments to her parents and friends. I would say the exact same thing to them as I'm saying here, I respected their daughter. It's not up to you to accept or deny statements on their behalf..
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I am far from one of the people expounding "suicide is never the answer", but I'd be very reluctant to qualify suicide as an supreme expression of free will - the closest I would get would be a supreme expression of anti-institutionalism (or non-conformism), but I kind of feel like to invoke free will into the discussion would be like invoking free will in that "should prostitution be legalised?" thread, and that's not even taking into account the neuroscience behind chronic depression.
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EPT
