I first heard the word "hipster" at the start of the year describing a group of girls I know. I'd never heard this word before, but as soon as I did I knew exactly what it was talking about.
Standing outside an art-party next to a neat row of locked-up fixed-gear bikes, I come across a couple girls who exemplify hipster homogeneity. I ask one of the girls if her being at an art party and wearing fake eyeglasses, leggings and a flannel shirt makes her a hipster.
"I’m not comfortable with that term," she replies.
Her friend adds, with just a flicker of menace in her eyes, "Yeah, I don’t know, you shouldn’t use that word, it’s just…"
"Offensive?"
"No… it’s just, well… if you don’t know why then you just shouldn’t even use it."
"Ok, so what are you girls doing tonight after this party?"
Those girls do this. Dress like 'em, talk like 'em, and walk like 'em. But they'll vehemently deny being them. These same girls, while being very socialized (all they do is party), don't seem like they actually have a purpose in their life. The article I linked articulates it.
That's the only small pocket of them I know. Even then, they make me wtf with some of the stuff they do and what they say in class. I'll start paying attention and post shit here, but they'll do really inconvenient things just because its ironic. I don't want to classify all hipsters by this one group, but this one group just kind of siphons off everything.
If any of you know what I'm talking about from the inside, please explain it to me. I will listen. The only hipsters I know don't have any actual explanations for me.
But if you give me any of that crap about it being ironic or just saying how I don't get it, to me it means you don't think about your life choices or why you are who you are and something else is doing it for you. That makes you a dumb shit.
I'm looking for a sensible and opposing point of view to this article ...like this! + Show Spoiler +
On September 30 2010 10:17 Daigomi wrote: I'm honestly confused here. A large part of youth society believes it's cool to be counterculture. Why exactly is this strange or new? Rock and roll, hippies, punks, hasn't this been true for each generation since at least the fifties, and hasn't each older generation decried it? Counterculture has been popular culture for ages now, hasn't it?
An artificial appropriation of different styles from different eras, the hipster represents the end of Western civilization – a culture lost in the superficiality of its past and unable to create any new meaning. Not only is it unsustainable, it is suicidal. While previous youth movements have challenged the dysfunction and decadence of their elders, today we have the "hipster" – a youth subculture that mirrors the doomed shallowness of mainstream society.
The first few sentences are stupid. Trying to measure when meaning is or is not created is ridiculous. Perhaps the article is implying that most of the hipsters are simply trend followers that make no contribution to culture, but the same can be said of every other counterculture movement. There were very few original hippies, and very few hippies did anything meaningful. That hippiedom as a whole was culturally meaningful, on the other hand, cannot be contested.
Secondly, the idea that previous youth movements challenged the dysfunction and decadence of the elders is just plain wrong. The Beats might not have been materialistic, but they were lazy and very decadent in their own way. The same can be said for the hippies, and once again all counterculture groups in the last fifty years.
Perhaps it's easier to look back at previous counterculture movements and find meaning in them than to see the long term cultural effects of the movement as they are happening. It's also easy to fixate on isolated ideals within each movement and then to argue that it will bring down Western culture. However, it seems to me that rather than ever truly entering mainstream culture, a more moderate, positive version of these ideals enter society. The hippies were free love and drug culture, but what entered mainstream culture was a slightly lower tendency to follow cultural norms blindly.
Punks wear their tattered threads and studded leather jackets with honor, priding themselves on their innovative and cheap methods of self-expression and rebellion. B-boys and b-girls announce themselves to anyone within earshot with baggy gear and boomboxes. But it is rare, if not impossible, to find an individual who will proclaim themself a proud hipster. It’s an odd dance of self-identity – adamantly denying your existence while wearing clearly defined symbols that proclaims it.
The article first shows how the word hipster is almost always used in a derogative way before being surprised that youth do not like being associated with the term. Furthermore, is it surprising that a group of people who prize individuality (regardless of their success in achieving it) do not like to be categorized as a group? How is this surprising or bad?
The dance floor at a hipster party looks like it should be surrounded by quotation marks. While punk, disco and hip hop all had immersive, intimate and energetic dance styles that liberated the dancer from his/her mental states – be it the head-spinning b-boy or violent thrashings of a live punk show – the hipster has more of a joke dance. A faux shrug shuffle that mocks the very idea of dancing or, at its best, illustrates a non-committal fear of expression typified in a weird twitch/ironic twist. The dancers are too self-aware to let themselves feel any form of liberation; they shuffle along, shrugging themselves into oblivion.
Once again, this is such a misguided paragraph. Yes, a few of the countercultures had energetic dances, but things like grunge and shoegaze in the 90s had very similar dances to the current hipster dance. Furthermore, the writer is implying that people who took part in other counterculture movements were not self-conscious (because of their dances), which is just as wrong. From what I know of countercultures, they have all been as self-conscious as the hipsters. Going back to the Beats (since I know the most about them), even within the fairly tight knit center of the movement there was a lot of vying for status and almost all the members were painfully insecure. Youth movements tend to revolve around "cool," and cool movements tend to be characterised by self-consciousness, regardless of how it is expressed. In the hipster movement, cool is just expressed by disinterest.
What they may or may not know is that "cool-hunters" will also be skulking the same sites, taking note of how they dress and what they consume. These marketers and party-promoters get paid to co-opt youth culture and then re-sell it back at a profit. In the end, hipsters are sold what they think they invent and are spoon-fed their pre-packaged cultural livelihood.
Hipsterdom is the first "counterculture" to be born under the advertising industry’s microscope, leaving it open to constant manipulation but also forcing its participants to continually shift their interests and affiliations. Less a subculture, the hipster is a consumer group – using their capital to purchase empty authenticity and rebellion. But the moment a trend, band, sound, style or feeling gains too much exposure, it is suddenly looked upon with disdain. Hipsters cannot afford to maintain any cultural loyalties or affiliations for fear they will lose relevance. ... An amalgamation of its own history, the youth of the West are left with consuming cool rather that creating it.
Once again, I don't know where the writer got his information from. Just before the hippies, the Beats got so popular that you could hire a "beatnik" for your party who would then sit around, be drunk, and probably recite some terrible poetry. Punk is the same, look at the Sex Pistols: They were basically a manufactured band designed to sell punk counterculture and clothing. Similar to the hipster movement, Vivian Westwood played a massive role in creating the punk movement and ended up profiting from it tremendously. Perhaps the hipster movement is bigger than any previous counterculture movements, but just like all those movements it influences and is influenced by society.
I really don't think the article makes a single good point. It is best said by Gavin McInnes in the article: "They’re just so mad at these young kids for going out and getting wasted and having fun and being fashionable." Just like most youth movements, being a hipster is about hedonism. It's about having fun regardless of the harm you cause. It's also about finding yourself and expressing yourself in some way. One ironic T might look just like any other ironic T, but it's a form of self-expression, and whether it's unique or not to an outsider is beside the point.
All of this is not to say that I particularly like hipsters. By and large, I find them to be pretentious idiots. However, as with the other things discussed, I doubt being a pretentious student is specific to this counterculture.
Before you go on hating hipsters after reading this article, read these posts.
On September 29 2010 13:06 jon arbuckle wrote: Williamsburgh, man. Although I've heard that the economic crisis sent a lot of trust fund arts students back to their houses for obvious reasons. And not all "hipsters" are rich; I know people who are arguably hipsters and they eat 99 cents worth of pasta a day (no sauce) + bagels retrieved from dumpsters because they're too busy going to concerts, buying records, or working with their band.
Which is another thing: the most hipster-y people I know are astounding at networking and under-the-table business. How else do you make money from music these days?
This whole "hipsters, GRR" attitude blows my mind because by the definition of people who deride them hipsters will not admit to being hipsters and will still deride other people for being hipsters. It's like you're trying to position "hipsterdom" as some sort of counterculture when there does not exist actual parameters by which to understand the composition or effects of the counterculture. It's the most massive exercise in Othering I've ever seen, and it primarily comes from people who've never met hipsters, or people who otherwise bear some unholy grudge against the arts.
On September 29 2010 14:34 vek wrote: Who honestly cares what other people do with their money/spare time?
If people are enjoying themselves (doesn't matter what "group" you decide put them in) and not harming anyone doing it then let them do whatever it is they do.
The US has many issues worth worrying about... this is not one of them.
I don't care nor do I understand why anyone else cares about hipsters or any social group for that matter. If people want to spend money on ridiculous clothes and dress in a strange way, go for it. They're not hurting me in any way and honestly, hipsters are the least of my worries anyways.
On September 29 2010 09:07 Half wrote: The U.S. has always had a huge socialite trash culture dating back a hundred years. Nothing really new imo.
Though I kinda like retro style stuff -_-.
Correction: the human race always had numerous trash cultural fads dating back thousands of years. And the older generation will call the new fads trash while comfortably participating in their trash fads that their grandparents called trash/the end of western civilization.
If western civilization ended every time people started dressing and acting weird, we'd all have harems of burqa covered women by now.
Correction: the human race always had numerous trash cultural fads dating back thousands of years. And the older generation will call the new fads trash while comfortably participating in their trash fads that their grandparents called trash/the end of western civilization.
If western civilization ended every time people started dressing and acting weird, we'd all have harems of burqa covered women by now.
I was less so referring to just dressing funny and being kinda "nonconformist" (wut), and moreso about having no real purpose in life beyond partying/socializing. I guess that does date back farther then 100 years, but I doubt there were too many socialites when people were dieing by the bucketloads from the plague.
Even then its really only gotten cultural emphasis along with consumerism.
Though I'm not really that vindictive about it, don't mean it if I came off that way.
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
I definitely agree, especially in Ottawa and it's downtown sector. I cannot believe how many there are.
The only thing I've gotten out of people that are into this fad is that most of the time they are impressionable and dumb. Even more so than your standard teenager.
And most of the males into this kinda thing are those kind of douche bag guys that treat girls like shit.
On September 29 2010 09:07 Half wrote: The U.S. has always had a huge socialite trash culture dating back a hundred years. Nothing really new imo.
Though I kinda like retro style stuff -_-.
Correction: the human race always had numerous trash cultural fads dating back thousands of years. And the older generation will call the new fads trash while comfortably participating in their trash fads that their grandparents called trash/the end of western civilization.
I was just thinking about that. Like what if I'm being the grandpa lol. The advertising industry bit got me. I hate advertisements and most tv. I will literally leave the room, shut off the tv or do something drastic not to be exposed to them and I always have.
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
wasn't that a proposed bill awhile back that for like 2 year of your life the government can call upon you to do anything or some shit lol
How to tell there's a damn good chance you are a hipster: you feel it necessary to write an entire article about the "hipster phenomenon". Seriously, the majority of people who I see saying they hate hipsters are obnoxious people themselves, either matching the hipster stereotype exactly or are the type of people who can't go a day without making snickering remarks about generalized stereotypes.
IE people who get off on snark. My god, there are trends and people wear skinny jeans! So fucking what.
On September 29 2010 09:19 choboPEon wrote: How to tell there's a damn good chance you are a hipster: you feel it necessary to write an entire article about the "hipster phenomenon".
hmunkey wrote: honestly, hipsters are the least of my worries anyways.
x2
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
Hope that is not serious given the small portion of people who could actually benefit in character development from either of those menial jobs and for everyone else it is..menial.
Who the hell cares about the newest trend in clothing/style? Why do people make such a big deal out of these fads that come and go. Also, Screw postmodernism.
On September 29 2010 09:22 Slaughter wrote: Who the hell cares about the newest trend in clothing/style? Why do people make such a big deal out of these fads that come and go. Also, Screw postmodernism.
Gotta have some perceived group to hate on, dude. Just gotta.
Do not underestimate hipsters or the damage they inflict on a culture collectively.
Example: Hipsters buy iphones because they are trendy when most of them (not 100%) actually would have been better off buying some other device to satisfy their needs (some other smart phone that doesn't have absurd software restrictions, maybe a small laptop.)
Hipsters now try to justify their purchase by pressuring others into buying other apple products with the promise of being trendy. As the fad catches on it validates the hipster.
The company (in this example apple) determines they can establish a marketing strategy to pander to these people and make considerable profits off of them while gaining marketshare simply by deploying products with stupid features that obfuscate as much of what actually happens in the device as possible.
As the market share increases, you start noticing more and more people sending you PDF files in your office that are mostly just single image files wrapped in a PDF, or a short list or memo that should have been in a text file. This is happening because as more people use products designed for the hipsters, they become less and less aware of the technology they are using, and how to use it properly.
After rejecting said PDF mails for months, one day some one sends you a .webarchive, you then completely flip out, grab your ak-47 put on a ski mask and go to the nearest school spraying bullets into the wall then taking your own life in a rather tragic turn of events.
Hipsters will never go away, and like bacteria in your digestive system, they do play an important role. But efforts must be made to suppress them whenever they start multiplying out of control or start spreading to areas that they have no business being around.
On September 29 2010 09:19 choboPEon wrote: How to tell there's a damn good chance you are a hipster: you feel it necessary to write an entire article about the "hipster phenomenon". Seriously, the majority of people who I see saying they hate hipsters are obnoxious people themselves, either matching the hipster stereotype exactly or are the type of people who can't go a day without making snickering remarks about generalized stereotypes.
IE people who get off on snark. My god, there are trends and people wear skinny jeans! So fucking what.
lol you mad?
it's amusing to poke fun at how counter-culture is becoming mass culture
Seriously, I hate them as much as you do but of all the things hipsters are something you think is disturbing about US culture? Hipsters exist in practically all developed nations so it's hardly an isolated US thing. What IS disturbing is the fact that the majority of Americans are fat and don't believe in evolution but that's for another thread.
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
Maybe just a better education system and more stringent social standards.
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
Haha...
Yeah but it's not really funny when I actually do have to do that 2 years of mandatory military service.
I wish I had the luxury of being a slacker who pretends to be rebeilious and be against the mainstream in a totally conforming way. Sadly, I got a dynastic Communist country to worry about. Curse you! Kim Jung-il and Kim jung-un
I am telling you these suburban middle-income white kids don't know how good they have it.
Hipsters in the US tend to be middle class teens and young adults. Despite having no full time jobs (are students), they are financially well off (parents pay for their lifestyle) and have plenty of disposable income. They also have very few responsibilities (no families to care for) and way too much free time. Sound familiar? Because this is about the same demographic as TL.
The hipsters decide to spend all that spare time and extra resources keeping up with the latest in youth culture. In the end, they are not that different from many of us on TL who are also young adults or teens with way too much free time and comfort. The difference is that we invest it in video games while the hipsters invest that time in whatever happens to be trendy that week. Like them, we waste time on something that ultimately has no actual return value (unless you go pro, playing Starcraft all day is just as unfruitful as going 'hipster.')
But the part I think that pisses people off the most is the attitude of hipsters: the way they talk, classify people, try to be as exclusive as possible, etc.
In reality, the hipsters are really no different than we TLers for the most part. And to look down on the hipsters for their elitist attitudes and fruitless lifestyles is to be hypocritical and do exactly what we despise the most in the "hipsters."
The only hipsters I have a problem with are the kids in their freshman year of college who decide that they want to be self-righteous, arrogant, asshats that feel that they are entitled to judge the rest of the world and tell them how they should live because they happened to hear something they think was incredibly insightful in Philosophy 101 or something...
I couldn't care less about someone deciding to dress like an idiot because that's his/her own business, but I have a problem with a pothead that parties all day and night on mommy and daddy's money giving me crap because I don't drive a hybrid, buy organic, or because I don't mind shopping at WalMart if it will save me some money.
On September 29 2010 09:19 choboPEon wrote: How to tell there's a damn good chance you are a hipster: you feel it necessary to write an entire article about the "hipster phenomenon". Seriously, the majority of people who I see saying they hate hipsters are obnoxious people themselves, either matching the hipster stereotype exactly or are the type of people who can't go a day without making snickering remarks about generalized stereotypes.
IE people who get off on snark. My god, there are trends and people wear skinny jeans! So fucking what.
lol you mad?
it's amusing to poke fun at how counter-culture is becoming mass culture
It was amusing a few years ago, maybe for the first 3 million wink-and-jokes, but now it's a word which has virtually no meaning or purpose except to facilitate making snide remarks. It's dumb. There's a reason respected newspapers and other media outlets are actively trying to remove the use of the word hipster from their work. It's because it doesn't mean shit except that some snide remark is about to follow.
I admit I'm coming across as 'mad' but I live in Brooklyn, apparently the hipster capital of the universe, and I've been hearing these annoying jokes from every direction for years and years. Trust me, you don't know what it's like. If you had to hear the same people make the same tired jokes about the punching bag hipsters and think 'god damn I am clever', you'd go a little loopy too.
Just read this thread. The word has no specific meaning. Almost every post has a different definition and it's all vague and it all comes down to one thing: Young person I'd like to insult? Hipster.
On September 29 2010 09:27 EndlessRain wrote: Seriously, I hate them as much as you do but of all the things hipsters are something you think is disturbing about US culture? Hipsters exist in practically all developed nations so it's hardly an isolated US thing. What IS disturbing is the fact that the majority of Americans are fat and don't believe in evolution but that's for another thread.
well to this end, the title I wanted was "Hipsters"
but I needed a longer one so I typed in " -- A disturbing look at US culture" or whatever I said
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Hipsters in the US tend to be middle class teens and young adults. Despite having no full time jobs (are students), they are financially well off (parents pay for their lifestyle) and have plenty of disposable income. They also have very few responsibilities (no families to care for) and way too much free time. Sound familiar? Because this is about the same demographic as TL.
How are you so sure this is the makeup of TL? A website with a large number of long term posters and young adults on their own.
On September 29 2010 09:19 choboPEon wrote: How to tell there's a damn good chance you are a hipster: you feel it necessary to write an entire article about the "hipster phenomenon". Seriously, the majority of people who I see saying they hate hipsters are obnoxious people themselves, either matching the hipster stereotype exactly or are the type of people who can't go a day without making snickering remarks about generalized stereotypes.
IE people who get off on snark. My god, there are trends and people wear skinny jeans! So fucking what.
lol you mad?
it's amusing to poke fun at how counter-culture is becoming mass culture
It was amusing a few years ago, maybe for the first 3 million wink-and-jokes, but now it's a word which has virtually no meaning or purpose except to facilitate making snide remarks. It's dumb. There's a reason respected newspapers and other media outlets are actively trying to remove the use of the word hipster from their work. It's because it doesn't mean shit except that some snide remark is about to follow.
I admit I'm coming across as 'mad' but I live in Brooklyn, apparently the hipster capital of the universe, and I've been hearing these annoying jokes from every direction for years and years. Trust me, you don't know what it's like. If you had to hear the same people make the same tired jokes about the punching bag hipsters and think 'god damn I am clever', you'd go a little loopy too.
Just read this thread. The word has no specific meaning. Almost every post has a different definition and it's all vague and it all comes down to one thing: Young person I'd like to insult? Hipster.
I live in Brooklyn also but my encounters with the Hipster culture is very limited. I'm not even sure what classifies a person as being a Hipster aside from their choice of fashion.
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Like them, we waste time on something that ultimately has no actual return value (unless you go pro, playing Starcraft all day is just as unfruitful as going 'hipster.') The only real difference is perspective.
I completely disagree with the premise that regular playing of Starcraft or strategy games in general offers "no actual return value". There are numerous quantifiable benefits to be had without winning money, such as improving dexterity, mental focus, multitasking, critical thought, crisis management, and many many others. These attributes are applicable to many important aspects of daily life.
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
This. Hipsters, scene kids, goths, and stupid athletes are the scum of the earth. In fact anybody who isn't a nerd or a chill dude or a pothead or something, I immediately consider to be less than human.
On September 29 2010 09:19 choboPEon wrote: How to tell there's a damn good chance you are a hipster: you feel it necessary to write an entire article about the "hipster phenomenon". Seriously, the majority of people who I see saying they hate hipsters are obnoxious people themselves, either matching the hipster stereotype exactly or are the type of people who can't go a day without making snickering remarks about generalized stereotypes.
IE people who get off on snark. My god, there are trends and people wear skinny jeans! So fucking what.
lol you mad?
it's amusing to poke fun at how counter-culture is becoming mass culture
I live in Brooklyn, apparently the hipster capital of the universe
Umm... San Francisco? (Or anywhere in California for the matter...) Seriously, like the only part of BK that's anything like that last time I checked was like WB....
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
This. Hipsters, scene kids, goths, and stupid athletes are the scum of the earth. In fact anybody who isn't a nerd or a chill dude or a pothead or something, I immediately consider to be less than human.
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Hipsters in the US tend to be middle class teens and young adults. Despite having no full time jobs (are students), they are financially well off (parents pay for their lifestyle) and have plenty of disposable income. They also have very few responsibilities (no families to care for) and way too much free time. Sound familiar? Because this is about the same demographic as TL.
How are you so sure this is the makeup of TL? A website with a large number of long term posters and young adults on their own.
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
Hipsters in the US tend to be middle class teens and young adults. Despite having no full time jobs (are students), they are financially well off (parents pay for their lifestyle) and have plenty of disposable income. They also have very few responsibilities (no families to care for) and way too much free time. Sound familiar? Because this is about the same demographic as TL.
The hipsters decide to spend all that spare time and extra resources keeping up with the latest in youth culture. In the end, they are not that different from many of us on TL who are also young adults or teens with way too much free time and comfort. The difference is that we invest it in video games while the hipsters invest that time in whatever happens to be trendy that week. Like them, we waste time on something that ultimately has no actual return value (unless you go pro, playing Starcraft all day is just as unfruitful as going 'hipster.')
But the part I think that pisses people off the most is the attitude of hipsters: the way they talk, classify people, try to be as exclusive as possible, etc.
In reality, the hipsters are really no different than we TLers for the most part. And to look down on the hipsters for their elitist attitudes and fruitless lifestyles is to be hypocritical and do exactly what we despise the most in the "hipsters."
Well, there are trash culture fads and then there are actual counterculture movements such as the USSR-occupied East Germany underground punk culture and the more recent English South Asian club culture. Each was a declaration of identity and was dissent against the established norms of government and society, be it the oppressive USSR policies or social discrimination against South Asians in England.
The crucial things hipsters lack are a clear reason to do what they do and the willingness to take pride in it. Obviously, this is due to the fact that the "hipster" movement is neither a productive nor meaningful endeavor to do anything nor does it have a clear message.
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Hipsters in the US tend to be middle class teens and young adults. Despite having no full time jobs (are students), they are financially well off (parents pay for their lifestyle) and have plenty of disposable income. They also have very few responsibilities (no families to care for) and way too much free time. Sound familiar? Because this is about the same demographic as TL.
How are you so sure this is the makeup of TL? A website with a large number of long term posters and young adults on their own.
On September 29 2010 09:19 choboPEon wrote: How to tell there's a damn good chance you are a hipster: you feel it necessary to write an entire article about the "hipster phenomenon". Seriously, the majority of people who I see saying they hate hipsters are obnoxious people themselves, either matching the hipster stereotype exactly or are the type of people who can't go a day without making snickering remarks about generalized stereotypes.
IE people who get off on snark. My god, there are trends and people wear skinny jeans! So fucking what.
lol you mad?
it's amusing to poke fun at how counter-culture is becoming mass culture
It was amusing a few years ago, maybe for the first 3 million wink-and-jokes, but now it's a word which has virtually no meaning or purpose except to facilitate making snide remarks. It's dumb. There's a reason respected newspapers and other media outlets are actively trying to remove the use of the word hipster from their work. It's because it doesn't mean shit except that some snide remark is about to follow.
I admit I'm coming across as 'mad' but I live in Brooklyn, apparently the hipster capital of the universe, and I've been hearing these annoying jokes from every direction for years and years. Trust me, you don't know what it's like. If you had to hear the same people make the same tired jokes about the punching bag hipsters and think 'god damn I am clever', you'd go a little loopy too.
Just read this thread. The word has no specific meaning. Almost every post has a different definition and it's all vague and it all comes down to one thing: Young person I'd like to insult? Hipster.
I live in Brooklyn also but my encounters with the Hipster culture is very limited. I'm not even sure what classifies a person as being a Hipster aside from their choice of fashion.
If you want to make fun of a person, they're a hipster. "Look at that hipster. What a fucking idiot."
There you go.
Also, I remember you from like 7 years ago in a thread where I talked about getting robbed around Flatbush and The Junction. How's it going :O
This all reminds me of a few South Park episodes, which pretty much summarized it perfectly. I forget which seasons they were, but one was with the music festival and the other was about people driving hybrids.
ITT: A bunch of geeks get angry and call people who dress well bad names and rage.
Seriously, we have way bigger issues in this country than a bunch of college students walking around in American Apparel Zip Down Hoodies. Whats the problem? Its not like they are hurting anyone, they simply are being trendy and are into new fashions.
I can see it on the hipster website them saying "Those nerds over on video gaming forums love smoking weed and making blogs asking other nerds for girl help". Everyone has different styles, concerns, opinions, and hobbies. Deal with it starcraft players.
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Hipsters in the US tend to be middle class teens and young adults. Despite having no full time jobs (are students), they are financially well off (parents pay for their lifestyle) and have plenty of disposable income. They also have very few responsibilities (no families to care for) and way too much free time. Sound familiar? Because this is about the same demographic as TL.
How are you so sure this is the makeup of TL? A website with a large number of long term posters and young adults on their own.
This is a poll of TL conducted for this year. As you can see, the vast majority of TLers fall within the teen/young adult age group.
That poll definitely does not represent any meaningful data on TL posters. For one it's a random forum thread which means everyone who COULD vote has not voted because everyone hasn't even seen the thread. With barely over 1,000 votes claiming to be male when we all know this website has many more than that how can you even take that poll at face value?
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Hipsters in the US tend to be middle class teens and young adults. Despite having no full time jobs (are students), they are financially well off (parents pay for their lifestyle) and have plenty of disposable income. They also have very few responsibilities (no families to care for) and way too much free time. Sound familiar? Because this is about the same demographic as TL.
How are you so sure this is the makeup of TL? A website with a large number of long term posters and young adults on their own.
This is a poll of TL conducted for this year. As you can see, the vast majority of TLers fall within the teen/young adult age group.
That poll definitely does not represent any meaningful data on TL posters. For one it's a random forum thread which means everyone who COULD vote has not voted because everyone hasn't even seen the thread. With barely over 1,000 votes claiming to be male when we all know this website has many more than that how can you even take that poll at face value?
Pretty decent sample size, yeah? Not like you need 50% of the forum to get a fairly accurate idea on this sort of thing. But I don't know shit about stats so whatever
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Hipsters in the US tend to be middle class teens and young adults. Despite having no full time jobs (are students), they are financially well off (parents pay for their lifestyle) and have plenty of disposable income. They also have very few responsibilities (no families to care for) and way too much free time. Sound familiar? Because this is about the same demographic as TL.
The hipsters decide to spend all that spare time and extra resources keeping up with the latest in youth culture. In the end, they are not that different from many of us on TL who are also young adults or teens with way too much free time and comfort. The difference is that we invest it in video games while the hipsters invest that time in whatever happens to be trendy that week. Like them, we waste time on something that ultimately has no actual return value (unless you go pro, playing Starcraft all day is just as unfruitful as going 'hipster.')
But the part I think that pisses people off the most is the attitude of hipsters: the way they talk, classify people, try to be as exclusive as possible, etc.
In reality, the hipsters are really no different than we TLers for the most part. And to look down on the hipsters for their elitist attitudes and fruitless lifestyles is to be hypocritical and do exactly what we despise the most in the "hipsters."
The only real difference is perspective.
Yeah I took the same train of thought to a different conclusion. They don't have real jobs, and most people's parents aren't going to pay for their sorry asses forever. Don't worry about it, these hipsters you speak of will eventually need money and then they will have to get jobs and conform.
On September 29 2010 09:42 Surrealz wrote: ITT: A bunch of geeks get angry and call people who dress well bad names and rage.
Seriously, we have way bigger issues in this country than a bunch of college students walking around in American Apparel Zip Down Hoodies. Whats the problem? Its not like they are hurting anyone, they simply are being trendy and are into new fashions.
I can see it on the hipster website them saying "Those nerds over on video gaming forums love smoking weed and making blogs asking other nerds for girl help". Everyone has different styles, concerns, opinions, and hobbies. Deal with it starcraft players.
The problem is that they don't do anything meaningful nor useful. Associating them with any kind of true counterculture like the ones I listed in my previous post in this thread misrepresents the culture the word "hipster" refers to. Personally, I hang out, work out, and study a lot more than I play Starcraft.
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Hipsters in the US tend to be middle class teens and young adults. Despite having no full time jobs (are students), they are financially well off (parents pay for their lifestyle) and have plenty of disposable income. They also have very few responsibilities (no families to care for) and way too much free time. Sound familiar? Because this is about the same demographic as TL.
How are you so sure this is the makeup of TL? A website with a large number of long term posters and young adults on their own.
On September 29 2010 09:33 choboPEon wrote:
On September 29 2010 09:24 caelym wrote:
On September 29 2010 09:19 choboPEon wrote: How to tell there's a damn good chance you are a hipster: you feel it necessary to write an entire article about the "hipster phenomenon". Seriously, the majority of people who I see saying they hate hipsters are obnoxious people themselves, either matching the hipster stereotype exactly or are the type of people who can't go a day without making snickering remarks about generalized stereotypes.
IE people who get off on snark. My god, there are trends and people wear skinny jeans! So fucking what.
lol you mad?
it's amusing to poke fun at how counter-culture is becoming mass culture
It was amusing a few years ago, maybe for the first 3 million wink-and-jokes, but now it's a word which has virtually no meaning or purpose except to facilitate making snide remarks. It's dumb. There's a reason respected newspapers and other media outlets are actively trying to remove the use of the word hipster from their work. It's because it doesn't mean shit except that some snide remark is about to follow.
I admit I'm coming across as 'mad' but I live in Brooklyn, apparently the hipster capital of the universe, and I've been hearing these annoying jokes from every direction for years and years. Trust me, you don't know what it's like. If you had to hear the same people make the same tired jokes about the punching bag hipsters and think 'god damn I am clever', you'd go a little loopy too.
Just read this thread. The word has no specific meaning. Almost every post has a different definition and it's all vague and it all comes down to one thing: Young person I'd like to insult? Hipster.
I live in Brooklyn also but my encounters with the Hipster culture is very limited. I'm not even sure what classifies a person as being a Hipster aside from their choice of fashion.
If you want to make fun of a person, they're a hipster. "Look at that hipster. What a fucking idiot."
There you go.
Also, I remember you from like 7 years ago in a thread where I talked about getting robbed around Flatbush and The Junction. How's it going :O
haha oh wow that is faintly familiar. It's going good I guess, how's life in BK treating you now?
On September 29 2010 09:42 Surrealz wrote: ITT: A bunch of geeks get angry and call people who dress well bad names and rage.
Seriously, we have way bigger issues in this country than a bunch of college students walking around in American Apparel Zip Down Hoodies. Whats the problem? Its not like they are hurting anyone, they simply are being trendy and are into new fashions.
I can see it on the hipster website them saying "Those nerds over on video gaming forums love smoking weed and making blogs asking other nerds for girl help". Everyone has different styles, concerns, opinions, and hobbies. Deal with it starcraft players.
The problem is that they don't do anything meaningful nor useful. Associating them with any kind of true counterculture like the ones I listed in my previous post in this thread misrepresents the culture the word "hipster" refers to. Personally, I hang out, work out, and study a lot more than I play Starcraft.
You hang out, work out, and study. You might be at risk of being a hipster dude.
What exactly is useful? Cause the only thing remotely useful you listed in your activities list there is studying, which is pretty useless to the rest of us as it is more of a self improvement for yourself
Let people do what they want. These hipsters are all cooler than us. We are typing on an internet forum about them.
On September 29 2010 09:42 Surrealz wrote: ITT: A bunch of geeks get angry and call people who dress well bad names and rage.
Seriously, we have way bigger issues in this country than a bunch of college students walking around in American Apparel Zip Down Hoodies. Whats the problem? Its not like they are hurting anyone, they simply are being trendy and are into new fashions.
I can see it on the hipster website them saying "Those nerds over on video gaming forums love smoking weed and making blogs asking other nerds for girl help". Everyone has different styles, concerns, opinions, and hobbies. Deal with it starcraft players.
The problem is that they don't do anything meaningful nor useful. Associating them with any kind of true counterculture like the ones I listed in my previous post in this thread misrepresents the culture the word "hipster" refers to. Personally, I hang out, work out, and study a lot more than I play Starcraft.
You hang out, work out, and study. You might be at risk of being a hipster dude.
What exactly is useful? Cause the only thing remotely useful you listed in your activities list there is studying, which is pretty useless to the rest of us as it is more of a self improvement for yourself
Let people do what they want. These hipsters are all cooler than us. We are typing on an internet forum about them.
Don't get in the way of an orgy of insults, dude. GET OUT OF THE WAY.
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Hipsters in the US tend to be middle class teens and young adults. Despite having no full time jobs (are students), they are financially well off (parents pay for their lifestyle) and have plenty of disposable income. They also have very few responsibilities (no families to care for) and way too much free time. Sound familiar? Because this is about the same demographic as TL.
How are you so sure this is the makeup of TL? A website with a large number of long term posters and young adults on their own.
This is a poll of TL conducted for this year. As you can see, the vast majority of TLers fall within the teen/young adult age group.
That poll definitely does not represent any meaningful data on TL posters. For one it's a random forum thread which means everyone who COULD vote has not voted because everyone hasn't even seen the thread. With barely over 1,000 votes claiming to be male when we all know this website has many more than that how can you even take that poll at face value?
You don't have to drop a penny fifty times with a control variable, calculate air resistance based on the penny's aerodynamic properties, perform it in an isolated testing environment, and do a z test analysis to find out that when you let go of a penny, it's going to drop.
Same thing here. The poll isn't some perfectly conducted scientific experiment, but it doesn't have to be in order to show a very rough point.
On September 29 2010 09:42 Surrealz wrote: ITT: A bunch of geeks get angry and call people who dress well bad names and rage.
Seriously, we have way bigger issues in this country than a bunch of college students walking around in American Apparel Zip Down Hoodies. Whats the problem? Its not like they are hurting anyone, they simply are being trendy and are into new fashions.
I can see it on the hipster website them saying "Those nerds over on video gaming forums love smoking weed and making blogs asking other nerds for girl help". Everyone has different styles, concerns, opinions, and hobbies. Deal with it starcraft players.
The problem is that they don't do anything meaningful nor useful. Associating them with any kind of true counterculture like the ones I listed in my previous post in this thread misrepresents the culture the word "hipster" refers to. Personally, I hang out, work out, and study a lot more than I play Starcraft.
You hang out, work out, and study. You might be at risk of being a hipster dude.
What exactly is useful? Cause the only thing remotely useful you listed in your activities list there is studying, which is pretty useless to the rest of us as it is more of a self improvement for yourself
Let people do what they want. These hipsters are all cooler than us. We are typing on an internet forum about them.
I don't try to identify with a "movement" or "counterculture" through the products that I buy. And I don't live my life like I have all the time and money in the world either. And when I say "useful" I mean personally useful.
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Like them, we waste time on something that ultimately has no actual return value (unless you go pro, playing Starcraft all day is just as unfruitful as going 'hipster.') The only real difference is perspective.
I completely disagree with the premise that regular playing of Starcraft or strategy games in general offers "no actual return value". There are numerous quantifiable benefits to be had without winning money, such as improving dexterity, mental focus, multitasking, critical thought, crisis management, and many many others. These attributes are applicable to many important aspects of daily life.
Uh... no. Playing starcraft makes one better at playing starcraft. I'm sure that some of the skills also carry over into RL, but the rewards are not in any way proportional to the effort/time sacrificed. It's a "waste of time" and playing all day just means that you're part of a decadent, pleasure seeking, ambitionless generation. I hate talk about generations. At least "hipsters" aren't naive or dishonest about what they are.
"We have no Great War. No Great Depression. Our Great War is a spiritual war, our Great Depression is our lives. We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars.
But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off bored. "
On September 29 2010 09:53 BroOd wrote: "We have no Great War. No Great Depression. Our Great War is a spiritual war, our Great Depression is our lives. We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars.
But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off bored. "
On September 29 2010 09:53 BroOd wrote: "We have no Great War. No Great Depression. Our Great War is a spiritual war, our Great Depression is our lives. We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars.
But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off bored. "
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Hipsters in the US tend to be middle class teens and young adults. Despite having no full time jobs (are students), they are financially well off (parents pay for their lifestyle) and have plenty of disposable income. They also have very few responsibilities (no families to care for) and way too much free time. Sound familiar? Because this is about the same demographic as TL.
The hipsters decide to spend all that spare time and extra resources keeping up with the latest in youth culture. In the end, they are not that different from many of us on TL who are also young adults or teens with way too much free time and comfort. The difference is that we invest it in video games while the hipsters invest that time in whatever happens to be trendy that week. Like them, we waste time on something that ultimately has no actual return value (unless you go pro, playing Starcraft all day is just as unfruitful as going 'hipster.')
But the part I think that pisses people off the most is the attitude of hipsters: the way they talk, classify people, try to be as exclusive as possible, etc.
In reality, the hipsters are really no different than we TLers for the most part. And to look down on the hipsters for their elitist attitudes and fruitless lifestyles is to be hypocritical and do exactly what we despise the most in the "hipsters."
The only real difference is perspective.
This sounds a lot like damn dirty hipster talk to me, lets get him!!
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Like them, we waste time on something that ultimately has no actual return value (unless you go pro, playing Starcraft all day is just as unfruitful as going 'hipster.') The only real difference is perspective.
I completely disagree with the premise that regular playing of Starcraft or strategy games in general offers "no actual return value". There are numerous quantifiable benefits to be had without winning money, such as improving dexterity, mental focus, multitasking, critical thought, crisis management, and many many others. These attributes are applicable to many important aspects of daily life.
Uh... no. Playing starcraft makes one better at playing starcraft. I'm sure that some of the skills also carry over into RL, but the rewards are not in any way proportional to the effort/time sacrificed. It's a "waste of time" and playing all day just means that you're part of a decadent, pleasure seeking, ambitionless generation. I hate talk about generations. At least "hipsters" aren't naive or dishonest about what they are.
Multitasking, mental focus, crisis management and dexterity all play a major roll in making you less likely to die in a preventable car accident.
Long term immersion with technology can open up many lucrative career paths, I my self am a software developer.
Frankly, the core virtues of good Starcraft play are endlessly applicable to real life.
On September 29 2010 09:42 Surrealz wrote: ITT: A bunch of geeks get angry and call people who dress well bad names and rage.
Seriously, we have way bigger issues in this country than a bunch of college students walking around in American Apparel Zip Down Hoodies. Whats the problem? Its not like they are hurting anyone, they simply are being trendy and are into new fashions.
I can see it on the hipster website them saying "Those nerds over on video gaming forums love smoking weed and making blogs asking other nerds for girl help". Everyone has different styles, concerns, opinions, and hobbies. Deal with it starcraft players.
The problem is that they don't do anything meaningful nor useful. Associating them with any kind of true counterculture like the ones I listed in my previous post in this thread misrepresents the culture the word "hipster" refers to. Personally, I hang out, work out, and study a lot more than I play Starcraft.
You hang out, work out, and study. You might be at risk of being a hipster dude.
What exactly is useful? Cause the only thing remotely useful you listed in your activities list there is studying, which is pretty useless to the rest of us as it is more of a self improvement for yourself
Let people do what they want. These hipsters are all cooler than us. We are typing on an internet forum about them.
I don't try to identify with a "movement" or "counterculture" through the products that I buy. And I don't live my life like I have all the time and money in the world either. And when I say "useful" I mean personally useful.
And its not personally useful to dress well? It sounds like you think that everyone should live the way YOU want us to, and everyone should value all products the same way you do. Personally, I spend alot of money on clothes so I look better and can attract the opposite sex. Whether this is useful or not is MY opinion.
People. Are. Different. Not everyone plays SC2, do you see me making rage posts about the "uninformed masses" who don't play SC2? No. If they don't like the game, they don't have to play it.
On September 29 2010 09:42 Surrealz wrote: ITT: A bunch of geeks get angry and call people who dress well bad names and rage.
Seriously, we have way bigger issues in this country than a bunch of college students walking around in American Apparel Zip Down Hoodies. Whats the problem? Its not like they are hurting anyone, they simply are being trendy and are into new fashions.
I can see it on the hipster website them saying "Those nerds over on video gaming forums love smoking weed and making blogs asking other nerds for girl help". Everyone has different styles, concerns, opinions, and hobbies. Deal with it starcraft players.
The problem is that they don't do anything meaningful nor useful. Associating them with any kind of true counterculture like the ones I listed in my previous post in this thread misrepresents the culture the word "hipster" refers to. Personally, I hang out, work out, and study a lot more than I play Starcraft.
You hang out, work out, and study. You might be at risk of being a hipster dude.
What exactly is useful? Cause the only thing remotely useful you listed in your activities list there is studying, which is pretty useless to the rest of us as it is more of a self improvement for yourself
Let people do what they want. These hipsters are all cooler than us. We are typing on an internet forum about them.
I don't try to identify with a "movement" or "counterculture" through the products that I buy. And I don't live my life like I have all the time and money in the world either. And when I say "useful" I mean personally useful.
And its not personally useful to dress well? It sounds like you think that everyone should live the way YOU want us to, and everyone should value all products the same way you do. Personally, I spend alot of money on clothes so I look better and can attract the opposite sex. Whether this is useful or not is MY opinion.
People. Are. Different. Not everyone plays SC2, do you see me making rage posts about the "uninformed masses" who don't play SC2? No. If they don't like the game, they don't have to play it.
Stop putting words in my mouth. You can dress well if you want to. My point is that the "hipster" thing shouldn't be associated with countercultures. I was using myself as an example of someone who does not try to identify with a culture through products that are marketed as being associated with that culture. Nothing more, nothing less.
On September 29 2010 10:13 Diuqil wrote: Why do you guys care?
I don't, lol. I'm just trying to point out that this "hipster" thing wasn't a real counterculture to begin with. It's just a group of consumers that marketers like to target their products at.
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Like them, we waste time on something that ultimately has no actual return value (unless you go pro, playing Starcraft all day is just as unfruitful as going 'hipster.') The only real difference is perspective.
I completely disagree with the premise that regular playing of Starcraft or strategy games in general offers "no actual return value". There are numerous quantifiable benefits to be had without winning money, such as improving dexterity, mental focus, multitasking, critical thought, crisis management, and many many others. These attributes are applicable to many important aspects of daily life.
Uh... no. Playing starcraft makes one better at playing starcraft. I'm sure that some of the skills also carry over into RL, but the rewards are not in any way proportional to the effort/time sacrificed. It's a "waste of time" and playing all day just means that you're part of a decadent, pleasure seeking, ambitionless generation. I hate talk about generations. At least "hipsters" aren't naive or dishonest about what they are.
Multitasking, mental focus, crisis management and dexterity all play a major roll in making you less likely to die in a preventable car accident.
Long term immersion with technology can open up many lucrative career paths, I my self am a software developer.
Frankly, the core virtues of good Starcraft play are endlessly applicable to real life.
In no way did any of what you just said amount to a counter argument. I agree with everything you said.
Hipsters like to party and haven't necessarily dealt with the essence of their existence. The same can be said about the pretty boys (and girls) in the clubs with their barbed wire tattoos and Jersey Shore casting meetings.
This doesn't concern me one bit. What does concern me is the lack of a decent counter culture worth devoting time to. It seems that at the core, every group that say they are unique (like the hipsters, couch surfers, culture jammers, "independent" movies/music) are only doing it to get higher status or work on their network and use the culture as a tool. It's shallow and narcissistic and degrading for anyone that participates. Graffiti, underground hip-hop, the OC-remix community and Teamliquid are some of the rare instances where there is a genuine interest for the subject that's being dealt with. I wish we had more people investing themselves and showing how amazing the world can be instead of letting TV/Media set the agenda.
Fight Club, a movie from 1999, dealt with this in great detail and suggested that we need to focus on the people around us instead of our wardrobes/careers/looks. The main character goes to support groups and fakes having terminal cancer in order to feel connected to someone. This however doesn't give him any lasting satisfaction so he starts fight clubs, local demolition crews and various other destructive activities. It spirals down to the final scene, full of symbolism and ideas on what life should really be about. Check it out if you have the time.
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Like them, we waste time on something that ultimately has no actual return value (unless you go pro, playing Starcraft all day is just as unfruitful as going 'hipster.') The only real difference is perspective.
I completely disagree with the premise that regular playing of Starcraft or strategy games in general offers "no actual return value". There are numerous quantifiable benefits to be had without winning money, such as improving dexterity, mental focus, multitasking, critical thought, crisis management, and many many others. These attributes are applicable to many important aspects of daily life.
Uh... no. Playing starcraft makes one better at playing starcraft. I'm sure that some of the skills also carry over into RL, but the rewards are not in any way proportional to the effort/time sacrificed. It's a "waste of time" and playing all day just means that you're part of a decadent, pleasure seeking, ambitionless generation. I hate talk about generations. At least "hipsters" aren't naive or dishonest about what they are.
Multitasking, mental focus, crisis management and dexterity all play a major roll in making you less likely to die in a preventable car accident.
Long term immersion with technology can open up many lucrative career paths, I my self am a software developer.
Frankly, the core virtues of good Starcraft play are endlessly applicable to real life.
In no way did any of what you just said amount to a counter argument. I agree with everything you said.
I did not provide a counter argument, because you did not provide any initial argument. All I did was give some examples. Regardless, I'm glad I was able to change your mind on this issue!
On September 29 2010 09:42 Surrealz wrote: ITT: A bunch of geeks get angry and call people who dress well bad names and rage.
Seriously, we have way bigger issues in this country than a bunch of college students walking around in American Apparel Zip Down Hoodies. Whats the problem? Its not like they are hurting anyone, they simply are being trendy and are into new fashions.
I can see it on the hipster website them saying "Those nerds over on video gaming forums love smoking weed and making blogs asking other nerds for girl help". Everyone has different styles, concerns, opinions, and hobbies. Deal with it starcraft players.
The problem is that they don't do anything meaningful nor useful. Associating them with any kind of true counterculture like the ones I listed in my previous post in this thread misrepresents the culture the word "hipster" refers to. Personally, I hang out, work out, and study a lot more than I play Starcraft.
You hang out, work out, and study. You might be at risk of being a hipster dude.
What exactly is useful? Cause the only thing remotely useful you listed in your activities list there is studying, which is pretty useless to the rest of us as it is more of a self improvement for yourself
Let people do what they want. These hipsters are all cooler than us. We are typing on an internet forum about them.
I don't try to identify with a "movement" or "counterculture" through the products that I buy. And I don't live my life like I have all the time and money in the world either. And when I say "useful" I mean personally useful.
And its not personally useful to dress well? It sounds like you think that everyone should live the way YOU want us to, and everyone should value all products the same way you do. Personally, I spend alot of money on clothes so I look better and can attract the opposite sex. Whether this is useful or not is MY opinion.
People. Are. Different. Not everyone plays SC2, do you see me making rage posts about the "uninformed masses" who don't play SC2? No. If they don't like the game, they don't have to play it.
You keep talking about "dressing well", but whether or not following that aesthetic is being stylish or "well-dressed" is completely subjective. Personally I feel like they look stupid, but of course people have a right to dress any way they want. The problem a lot of people have with "hipsters" is really not their fashion sense, but rather their attitude and worldview. You can say their opinions shouldn't affect you, but on one level or another, they do, whether that effect is as small as having someone annoy you or whether it becomes a larger issue where the opinions of that culture begin to have an effect on government policy through their activism.
Obviously if they didn't affect me at all, I'd have little reason to care. Unfortunately for me, I've got many people like this in my life that do annoy the crap out of me and I don't really have the luxury of avoiding them or cutting them out of my life. It's extremely rare that it ever actually becomes an issue that results in any major conflict, but I'll certainly admit that it's one of my gripes in life. I work hard and do my best to live decently on my budget and income. I don't need some snob that's spent the past 10 years in undergrad never having worked a single day in his life constantly calling me a murderer for eating meat or accusing me of contributing in the exploitation of migrant workers for not spending more time or money to buy food from local farmers at the farmers' market...
Don't even get me started on the crap I hear every single time they come over for not having a Dyson vacuum cleaner (You would think someone so supposedly against consumerism wouldn't fall into this crap.)... I live life the best I can according to my means. Take that hippie shit to someone who actually has the luxury of caring because I don't. If they want to party all day and worry about nonsense like that and they can actually afford to do so, more power to them. I don't want to be bothered by it, though. That's all I ask. Unfortunately for many people I know, that seems to be asking too much for them since they're so right and therefore, have a moral responsibility to make sure I'm living according to their standards.
And SC2 is actually a much better game than I thought it would be so kudos to Blizzard on that. Now they just need to actually balance the game...
On September 29 2010 09:31 The_Pacifist wrote: Like them, we waste time on something that ultimately has no actual return value (unless you go pro, playing Starcraft all day is just as unfruitful as going 'hipster.') The only real difference is perspective.
I completely disagree with the premise that regular playing of Starcraft or strategy games in general offers "no actual return value". There are numerous quantifiable benefits to be had without winning money, such as improving dexterity, mental focus, multitasking, critical thought, crisis management, and many many others. These attributes are applicable to many important aspects of daily life.
Uh... no. Playing starcraft makes one better at playing starcraft. I'm sure that some of the skills also carry over into RL, but the rewards are not in any way proportional to the effort/time sacrificed. It's a "waste of time" and playing all day just means that you're part of a decadent, pleasure seeking, ambitionless generation. I hate talk about generations. At least "hipsters" aren't naive or dishonest about what they are.
Multitasking, mental focus, crisis management and dexterity all play a major roll in making you less likely to die in a preventable car accident.
Long term immersion with technology can open up many lucrative career paths, I my self am a software developer.
Frankly, the core virtues of good Starcraft play are endlessly applicable to real life.
In no way did any of what you just said amount to a counter argument. I agree with everything you said.
I did not provide a counter argument, because you did not provide any initial argument. All I did was give some examples. Regardless, I'm glad I was able to change your mind on this issue!
No. The fact that the "core virtues of good starcraft play" are "endlessly applicable to real life" doesn't conflict with my assertion that playing starcraft is a mostly useless passtime. Only the naive reader would conclude that "endlessly" necessairily refers to how much the skills carry over. I interpreted the word as meaning that there are a lot of different scenarios where the "virtues" are of some (extremely limited) use. You're fucking with me, right? I did make an argument and you replied by saying things that are sensible until you read them as a coherent response to what I said. Stop being such a hipster douchebag!
i rather have hipsters than wiggas. I honestly feel safer walking around streets than i used to as i wasn't able to differentiate wannabes from muggers. Now even most black people i see at college are walking around looking classy and i sure as hell know he aint hiding a knife/gun in those tight pants.
Hey, since a hipster will generally deny that they are a hipster, if one "sarcastically" said that s/he IS a hipster, would that be considered post-irony?
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
I definitely agree, especially in Ottawa and it's downtown sector. I cannot believe how many there are.
i hate sterotyping people lol. they see something and assume its a bad thing. who cares? i never even heard of the word "hipster". are they the cool trendy rebellious people? xP
Every single time I go to a book store I spend at least 30 minutes flipping through this book. It always puts me in a good mood lol. I highly suggest flipping through it. The captions are just too funny haha.
I don't see why hipsters bother you so much. They have their own purpose and goal in life and way of having fun. Just because it doesn't agree with yours, doesn't mean they're bad.
I don't personally like the look or culture of the stereotypical hipster, but if they enjoy looking/being like that more then I'd rather them be happy and do what they want, then be less happy and do something I approve of more.
Yeah, Adbusters is a hipster rag. Like Vice. And Hipster Runoff.
Seems kind of disingenuous for TLers to chuckle at "hipsters" or grit their teeth and joke about conscription and concentration camps when there's a gigantic Dubstep thread in the blog forum. Not to mention a popular run of blogs from renowned forum personality, University student (IIRC), and possible moderator (who I hope will not mind my mentioning him) JWD - blogs that recommend Fleet Foxes and provide tips on how to put up posters in your dorm room.
On September 29 2010 09:19 choboPEon wrote: How to tell there's a damn good chance you are a hipster: you feel it necessary to write an entire article about the "hipster phenomenon". Seriously, the majority of people who I see saying they hate hipsters are obnoxious people themselves, either matching the hipster stereotype exactly or are the type of people who can't go a day without making snickering remarks about generalized stereotypes.
IE people who get off on snark. My god, there are trends and people wear skinny jeans! So fucking what.
lol you mad?
it's amusing to poke fun at how counter-culture is becoming mass culture
It was amusing a few years ago, maybe for the first 3 million wink-and-jokes, but now it's a word which has virtually no meaning or purpose except to facilitate making snide remarks. It's dumb. There's a reason respected newspapers and other media outlets are actively trying to remove the use of the word hipster from their work. It's because it doesn't mean shit except that some snide remark is about to follow.
I admit I'm coming across as 'mad' but I live in Brooklyn, apparently the hipster capital of the universe, and I've been hearing these annoying jokes from every direction for years and years. Trust me, you don't know what it's like. If you had to hear the same people make the same tired jokes about the punching bag hipsters and think 'god damn I am clever', you'd go a little loopy too.
Just read this thread. The word has no specific meaning. Almost every post has a different definition and it's all vague and it all comes down to one thing: Young person I'd like to insult? Hipster.
I live in Brooklyn also but my encounters with the Hipster culture is very limited. I'm not even sure what classifies a person as being a Hipster aside from their choice of fashion.
Williamsburgh, man. Although I've heard that the economic crisis sent a lot of trust fund arts students back to their houses for obvious reasons. And not all "hipsters" are rich; I know people who are arguably hipsters and they eat 99 cents worth of pasta a day (no sauce) + bagels retrieved from dumpsters because they're too busy going to concerts, buying records, or working with their band.
Which is another thing: the most hipster-y people I know are astounding at networking and under-the-table business. How else do you make money from music these days?
This whole "hipsters, GRR" attitude blows my mind because by the definition of people who deride them hipsters will not admit to being hipsters and will still deride other people for being hipsters. It's like you're trying to position "hipsterdom" as some sort of counterculture when there does not exist actual parameters by which to understand the composition or effects of the counterculture. It's the most massive exercise in Othering I've ever seen, and it primarily comes from people who've never met hipsters, or people who otherwise bear some unholy grudge against the arts.
Man, those colourful, coked out twenty-somethings who attended Vice/Ed Banger parties in '07. Hipsters.
Man, those tweens who steal their parents' liquor and go see Steve Aoki. Hipsters.
Man, this waifish, bespectacled guy with Animal Collective and the Smiths on his iPod in a garage band. Hipsters.
Man, this bearded, long-haired, dirty guy in a Boris t-shirt with Wolves in the Throne Room and Burzum vinyl in his bag. Fucking metal-jockin' hipsters.
Man, this suburban white girl with glasses and a messenger bag, with Portugal. The Man and Andrew Bird on her Last.fm and a Polaroid camera. Hipster.
Man, this rotund, neck-bearded guy talking about Merzbow on his tumblr. Hipster.
&c. I mean, it applies to anything to which you want to apply it, so long as you want to denigrate it, or somehow imply that the consumption of it is superficial, ironic, just for show - not as deep as the reasons for whichIam downloading or engaging with this art.
I'm not saying TL.net is full of hipsters - this is the last place I expected anyone to bicker about it - but chances are you're just perturbed by superficial bohemians, rich people, consumerist trendhopping, and conformist non-conformists. In which case, you're buying into nearly all those concepts by seriously harbouring even a shred of resentment towards the shoddily defined "hipster" concept. (And unless you're Ted Kaczynski or Amish, you're probably consumerist, too.)
And don't get off on that whole "nostalgia! end of culture!" thing. Fredrick Jameson and Jean Baudrillard have been singing that song about the West since the '70s.
On September 29 2010 10:48 cartoon wrote: stop hipster bashing.
On September 29 2010 11:45 eSen1a wrote: hipster is such a massive generalisation lol
So many cry babies, its a new fad, like being emo etc, who cares what they do. What this thread is doing is shaping people to think this new thing is so much worse than it's predecessors.
This thread is shaping the readers to turn into the old people that yell "darn kids"
a) this has already been posted b) you haven't seen this (it cannot be unseen) c) you actually like Art School douchebaggery
She's young and a sophomore. This was too much for her; you can tell she's not experienced because she's so unsure of herself. Fiddling with the can-opener; not particularly steeled on the exit.
I don't like performance art; I just feel sorry for this girl. This could haunt her for a while.
Although I mean if you want to see some scat and laugh at performance art then go ahead.
Who gives a fuck about hipsters, or any of these other bourgeois "subcultures" either for that matter?
The way I see it, anyone who has the money, and chooses to waste it on clothes and other shit that makes them look strange is probably an asshole anyway.
Correction: the human race always had numerous trash cultural fads dating back thousands of years. And the older generation will call the new fads trash while comfortably participating in their trash fads that their grandparents called trash/the end of western civilization.
If western civilization ended every time people started dressing and acting weird, we'd all have harems of burqa covered women by now.
I was less so referring to just dressing funny and being kinda "nonconformist" (wut), and moreso about having no real purpose in life beyond partying/socializing. I guess that does date back farther then 100 years, but I doubt there were too many socialites when people were dieing by the bucketloads from the plague.
Even then its really only gotten cultural emphasis along with consumerism.
Though I'm not really that vindictive about it, don't mean it if I came off that way.
Having no purpose beyond partying and socializing is not a new thing either.
On September 29 2010 13:06 jon arbuckle wrote: Williamsburgh, man. Although I've heard that the economic crisis sent a lot of trust fund arts students back to their houses for obvious reasons. And not all "hipsters" are rich; I know people who are arguably hipsters and they eat 99 cents worth of pasta a day (no sauce) + bagels retrieved from dumpsters because they're too busy going to concerts, buying records, or working with their band.
Which is another thing: the most hipster-y people I know are astounding at networking and under-the-table business. How else do you make money from music these days?
This whole "hipsters, GRR" attitude blows my mind because by the definition of people who deride them hipsters will not admit to being hipsters and will still deride other people for being hipsters. It's like you're trying to position "hipsterdom" as some sort of counterculture when there does not exist actual parameters by which to understand the composition or effects of the counterculture. It's the most massive exercise in Othering I've ever seen, and it primarily comes from people who've never met hipsters, or people who otherwise bear some unholy grudge against the arts.
A massive exercise of Othering i think might be the best way to describe it.
I was going to go on about how I'm from art school and try to speak my piece about all this 'cause i like to procrastinate, but i think you've just hit the nail on the head.
i know i do because i live in los angeles and hollywood is about 10 minutes away. if you learn to deal with their bright neon plad shirt and their matching fix geared bikes, theyre really not that bad, if you dont talk to them.
I don't keep up with transient cultural phenomenons but wasn't it just a few years ago that goths/emos were being disparaged? I guess that trend has faded and now it's the hipsters' turn to be ridiculed by a previous generation.
I don't know who gets to decide what constitute culture but I do know that gaming culture has very little room to be disparaging any other culture.
"Damn kids these days" is something that will never go out of fashion in any generation.
On September 29 2010 09:03 KurtistheTurtle wrote: I first heard the word "hipster" at the start of the year describing a group of girls I know. I'd never heard this word before, but as soon as I did I knew exactly what it was talking about.
Standing outside an art-party next to a neat row of locked-up fixed-gear bikes, I come across a couple girls who exemplify hipster homogeneity. I ask one of the girls if her being at an art party and wearing fake eyeglasses, leggings and a flannel shirt makes her a hipster.
"I’m not comfortable with that term," she replies.
Her friend adds, with just a flicker of menace in her eyes, "Yeah, I don’t know, you shouldn’t use that word, it’s just…"
"Offensive?"
"No… it’s just, well… if you don’t know why then you just shouldn’t even use it."
"Ok, so what are you girls doing tonight after this party?"
Those girls do this. Dress like 'em, talk like 'em, and walk like 'em. But they'll vehemently deny being them. These same girls, while being very socialized (all they do is party), don't seem like they actually have a purpose in their life. The article I linked articulates it.
That's the only small pocket of them I know. Even then, they make me wtf with some of the stuff they do and what they say in class. I'll start paying attention and post shit here, but they'll do really inconvenient things just because its ironic. I don't want to classify all hipsters by this one group, but this one group just kind of siphons off everything.
If any of you know what I'm talking about from the inside, please explain it to me. I will listen. The only hipsters I know don't have any actual explanations for me.
But if you give me any of that crap about it being ironic or just saying how I don't get it, to me it means you don't think about your life choices or why you are who you are and something else is doing it for you. That makes you a dumb shit.
I'm looking for a sensible and opposing point of view to this article
Not sure if anyone has said this already, but why do you care about what other people do? You clearly have low self-esteem if you are concerned about what other people wear/do. By your post it seems you aren't mad at them for "siphoning everything" ,you are more jealous of their popularity and wish you were one of them. Stop worrying about other people and focus on your own life. Also i'm guessing one of your ex-girlfriends or friends is a hipster and has done something for you to rage about it, in which case grow up and get over it.
Hey guys, while we are hating Hipsters (a very vague genre of style), lets add some hate of emo people as well in here! Hell, lets just jump to nerds too! + Show Spoiler +
Yeah, overgeneralizing, presumptuous threads are worse than the presumptuous people they are about.
Who honestly cares what other people do with their money/spare time?
If people are enjoying themselves (doesn't matter what "group" you decide put them in) and not harming anyone doing it then let them do whatever it is they do.
The US has many issues worth worrying about... this is not one of them.
On September 29 2010 13:06 jon arbuckle wrote: Williamsburgh, man. Although I've heard that the economic crisis sent a lot of trust fund arts students back to their houses for obvious reasons. And not all "hipsters" are rich; I know people who are arguably hipsters and they eat 99 cents worth of pasta a day (no sauce) + bagels retrieved from dumpsters because they're too busy going to concerts, buying records, or working with their band.
Which is another thing: the most hipster-y people I know are astounding at networking and under-the-table business. How else do you make money from music these days?
This whole "hipsters, GRR" attitude blows my mind because by the definition of people who deride them hipsters will not admit to being hipsters and will still deride other people for being hipsters. It's like you're trying to position "hipsterdom" as some sort of counterculture when there does not exist actual parameters by which to understand the composition or effects of the counterculture. It's the most massive exercise in Othering I've ever seen, and it primarily comes from people who've never met hipsters, or people who otherwise bear some unholy grudge against the arts.
On September 29 2010 14:34 vek wrote: Who honestly cares what other people do with their money/spare time?
If people are enjoying themselves (doesn't matter what "group" you decide put them in) and not harming anyone doing it then let them do whatever it is they do.
The US has many issues worth worrying about... this is not one of them.
There are different strains of hipster. Many are filthy and do not wear deodorant. Others are into vintage fashion and immaculate grooming. Remember the furry x emo hybrid clique who call themselves werewolves? They are like a larvael stage on the way to becoming full grown hipsters.
I'm sure many hipsters also consider people who dedicate an enormous amount of time trying to be better than everyone else at a video game to be gigantic tools as well.
If you aren't accepting "ironic" as an excuse then there aren't going to be any excuses for that kind of behavior to be had. That's what being a hipster is. The people who disagree are even more ignorant for not realizing it's a joke. It's stupidity.
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
wasn't that a proposed bill awhile back that for like 2 year of your life the government can call upon you to do anything or some shit lol
Singapore has this, for example, and people revert pretty hard the moment they're out of it - or just stay under the radar while they're in.
a) this has already been posted b) you haven't seen this (it cannot be unseen) c) you actually like Art School douchebaggery
I know this isn't adding anything to the discussion.. but what the fuck did I just watch? Girl struggles for minutes to open a can.. Puts contents of said can on her shirt while saying weird backwards-ish shit.. Proceeds to rip her pants and piss in the can (WTF ART?).. aaaaaaaand cleans it up with her shirt to exit.
Maybe I just don't have an appreciative eye for "art"... LOL
The_Pacifist won the thread for me too. i cant help but agree though. I grew up in a surban area, where the kids have nothing better to do then follow the trends. I bet theres alot of TLers out there who wear nice expencive clothing. I know I spend more then i really need too on a pair of jeans, or my nikes. I know im not alone in that regard. I've got friends who fit right in with these people. Guys who were girls suuuper tight jeans and glasses. Some actually need the glasses though. Their in screamo bands and they write blogs. Thing is most of the ones ive met are all pretty decent people.
When i think about how people always complain about how their all douche bags and make snide remarks, hell i do that sometimes too. People watching can be kinda fun. I kinda lsot track of were i was going with this, but all im saying is, they arn't all assholes like you may think. Some make great music, write great things, and probably play starcraft 2.
a) this has already been posted b) you haven't seen this (it cannot be unseen) c) you actually like Art School douchebaggery
I know this isn't adding anything to the discussion.. but what the fuck did I just watch? Girl struggles for minutes to open a can.. Puts contents of said can on her shirt while saying weird backwards-ish shit.. Proceeds to rip her pants and piss in the can (WTF ART?).. aaaaaaaand cleans it up with her shirt to exit.
Maybe I just don't have an appreciative eye for "art"... LOL
Each person in that room is the stupidest person I have ever seen.
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
Agree 100000000%. Hipsters are the bane of human race.
I wrote about hipsters for my college paper last week. Funny this thread came up.
I don't know if the writing was awful on purpose or not, but it was awful. I'm surprised your college paper published that with mistakes in the first sentence. Do they even bother proof reading?
On September 29 2010 09:27 EndlessRain wrote: Seriously, I hate them as much as you do but of all the things hipsters are something you think is disturbing about US culture? Hipsters exist in practically all developed nations so it's hardly an isolated US thing. What IS disturbing is the fact that the majority of Americans are fat and don't believe in evolution but that's for another thread.
Haha majority? I believe 1 in 10 more people are fat then in other countries. Thats not a majority. I cant find one person that does not believe in evolution and i live in the midwest.
On September 29 2010 09:27 EndlessRain wrote: Seriously, I hate them as much as you do but of all the things hipsters are something you think is disturbing about US culture? Hipsters exist in practically all developed nations so it's hardly an isolated US thing. What IS disturbing is the fact that the majority of Americans are fat and don't believe in evolution but that's for another thread.
Haha majority? I believe 1 in 10 more people are fat then in other countries. Thats not a majority. I cant find one person that does not believe in evolution and i live in the midwest.
It's a fact that a majority of Americans say they don't believe in evolution. Sadly...
Edit: Well, majority if you add in the people that say they dont know, which I'd think have to lean more towards not believing it. So it's a fact in my own biased opinion!
On September 29 2010 10:35 Emon_ wrote: Hipsters like to party and haven't necessarily dealt with the essence of their existence. The same can be said about the pretty boys (and girls) in the clubs with their barbed wire tattoos and Jersey Shore casting meetings.
This doesn't concern me one bit. What does concern me is the lack of a decent counter culture worth devoting time to. It seems that at the core, every group that say they are unique (like the hipsters, couch surfers, culture jammers, "independent" movies/music) are only doing it to get higher status or work on their network and use the culture as a tool. It's shallow and narcissistic and degrading for anyone that participates. Graffiti, underground hip-hop, the OC-remix community and Teamliquid are some of the rare instances where there is a genuine interest for the subject that's being dealt with. I wish we had more people investing themselves and showing how amazing the world can be instead of letting TV/Media set the agenda.
Fight Club, a movie from 1999, dealt with this in great detail and suggested that we need to focus on the people around us instead of our wardrobes/careers/looks. The main character goes to support groups and fakes having terminal cancer in order to feel connected to someone. This however doesn't give him any lasting satisfaction so he starts fight clubs, local demolition crews and various other destructive activities. It spirals down to the final scene, full of symbolism and ideas on what life should really be about. Check it out if you have the time.
The reason these people are so lame is that they're trying to establish their identities as individuals by becoming part of a collective. Is there such thing as a "decent counter culture"? Yeah there are trends, but only because someone had an idea and then everybody else jumped on the bandwagon. If you're looking for a counter culture to subscribe to, you're already behind the curve. Think for yourself, man.
Why do you guys care what people like to do as a hobby. If you ask hipsters what they think about gamers and esport, they'll say gamers are awkward teens who are all too shy to look at girls and they play games 24/7 with no self control. Ironically, you guys are stereotyping hipsters in the same way as they will stereotype you.
On September 29 2010 16:11 T.O.P. wrote: Why do you guys care what people like to do as a hobby. If you ask hipsters what they think about gamers and esport, they'll say gamers are awkward teens who are all too shy to look at girls and they play games 24/7 with no self control. Ironically, you guys are stereotyping hipsters in the same way as they will stereotype you.
On September 29 2010 16:26 darmousseh wrote: The only way to get rid of hipsters is to stop thinking or writing about them. Don't give them any publicity and suddenly they will become unpopular.
On September 29 2010 16:11 T.O.P. wrote: Why do you guys care what people like to do as a hobby. If you ask hipsters what they think about gamers and esport, they'll say gamers are awkward teens who are all too shy to look at girls and they play games 24/7 with no self control. Ironically, you guys are stereotyping hipsters in the same way as they will stereotype you.
I'm a hipster. I like esports. They're hardly mutually exclusive. Hell, we have a dubstep thread here.
I do agree that these people griping come off as bitter nerds.
Yes, people who do nothing other than partying are bad. Yes, people who kill the enviroment without thinking about it are bad. Yes, people who do mild drugs and enjoy them are bad. Yes, people who eat lots of fast food are bad.
The contents of this list can go on and on until eternity.
Stop giving a damn about other people and what they are doing. The truth is that you probably dislike what 80% of the people do. To them you're a low life sitting at the desk for long hours playing games and watching forums, to you they are low life partiers not caring about anything else but partying.
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
All the really really amazing reasons to require that and hipsters are your reason?
The aspect of hipsters that seems to draw the most hate to them is their apparent tendency to confuse meaningless shit with profound observations of life and society. In my opinion, no one should be allowed to declare something as being "deep" or "profound" without having read a lot of literature.
At this point, marketing based development and product distribution ensures no counter culture can ever thrive. It will soon be exploited, for profit, regardless, and therefore, become part of the system, not what opposes it.
they're people who don't want conform with the society, just for the sake of not conforming, which is pretty naive actually. it's not like you've never met people like these before in your everyday lives.
why bother about them anyway. just let them be naive if they so wish.
"However, there is pretty solid agreement that the word "hip" is a variant of "hep" meaning "wise to" or "informed." During the 1930s, some of the big-bands of swing, like Benny Goodman's and Count Basie's, were called "hep," meaning the musicians and arrangers were "in the know." A later phrase of similar meaning would be "in tune with." Jazz devotees were called "hep-cats" although the term was not popular among the musicians themselves."
So do these people listen to Jazz? Because I think to technically be a hipster that's what you gotta do.
But frankly I don't think "hipster" and "hip" aren't even really hip terms anymore, which means hip doesn't even mean hip. Which means that the only way to be hip is to not be hip and criticize hipsterdom. :O
In England we call them indie fans and we had them for years. Where i used to live in Brighton i used to work in an army surplus shop and it was always flooded with them guys cos they loved the old admiral style jackets with the gold tassels on the shoulders.
Edit: maybe its a bit reckless saying in England, at least around Brighton and south east. And i don't ever remember meeting one of those guys who wasn't really nice and mannered.
On September 29 2010 09:19 choboPEon wrote: How to tell there's a damn good chance you are a hipster: you feel it necessary to write an entire article about the "hipster phenomenon". Seriously, the majority of people who I see saying they hate hipsters are obnoxious people themselves, either matching the hipster stereotype exactly or are the type of people who can't go a day without making snickering remarks about generalized stereotypes.
IE people who get off on snark. My god, there are trends and people wear skinny jeans! So fucking what.
This ? What's the problem anyway? Most of them are also pretty young and will grow, like everyone else.
On a side-note: With the way the thread has evolved so far...it vaguely relates to the "How many Team Liquider's it takes to screw in a lightbulb"-phenomenon.
As for hipsters...you are judging a group of people by a name that has different definations in different cultures and extreme differences in how they go about hipster-ing.
If you focused more on the "lost generation", or basically us kids born and living in the nameless years (nameless by historian standards mind you), then you might have had something.
You are calling the norm of most teens nowadays a term, hipsters, instead of understanding the fact that most teens leech off the parents, live with parents till their thirties or more, partying alot, and focusing on the social aspect of their lives rather then their own personal advancement.
Call buying yourself expensive brands and whatnot "selfish" all you want, but its more about the image for others rather then one's self. Being a someone not for yourself, but for others, basically.
Also I disagree with the people who are trying to relate us gamers with the hipsters as a means to defend against the nature of this thread. You are suffering a sterotype biased yourselves because you do not see the evolution that the Gaming Culture.
Gamers use to be sorta like the hipsters (lost generation). The shy, living in grandma's basement, pimple, thick glasses kinda guys. Obviously a different end, but both sides pretty similiar in their role.
Nowadays, 80% of the US population are gamers whether they want to call themselves one or not, and the old sterotype many are attempting to bring up in this thread is not the norm anymore. Gaming Culture has moved into people who go about their normal lives, doing normal things, and fitting whatever social sterotypes they see fit. The only difference is now, we all game (casually or regularly) as one of our many activities (almost replacing the role television use to).
So I was browsing TL and clicking on this post. I read the OP, but I'm not getting it: There are people who you name. Then those people say, I don't name myself like that. And then theres a lot of text about what they supposedly do in their free time? Wtf?
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
I guess a mod didnt realize i was making fun of the whole hipsterhate. I was just too lazy to actually find the correct quote from A Single Man, was even oscar material, thought you'd recognize it
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
Self-righteous people are the reason I think we shouldn't.
theyre no worse than super party bros, at least theyre biking and saving the environment a little bit instead of having huge trucks and jeeps causing mayhem
a) this has already been posted b) you haven't seen this (it cannot be unseen) c) you actually like Art School douchebaggery
I know this isn't adding anything to the discussion.. but what the fuck did I just watch? Girl struggles for minutes to open a can.. Puts contents of said can on her shirt while saying weird backwards-ish shit.. Proceeds to rip her pants and piss in the can (WTF ART?).. aaaaaaaand cleans it up with her shirt to exit.
Maybe I just don't have an appreciative eye for "art"... LOL
I get a feeling more than half the people in that room were like, WTF...and really they didn't want the girl to feel bad and just went along with it...if not...then...wow...
On September 29 2010 09:24 No_Roo wrote: Do not underestimate hipsters or the damage they inflict on a culture collectively.
Example: Hipsters buy iphones because they are trendy when most of them (not 100%) actually would have been better off buying some other device to satisfy their needs (some other smart phone that doesn't have absurd software restrictions, maybe a small laptop.)
Hipsters now try to justify their purchase by pressuring others into buying other apple products with the promise of being trendy. As the fad catches on it validates the hipster.
The company (in this example apple) determines they can establish a marketing strategy to pander to these people and make considerable profits off of them while gaining marketshare simply by deploying products with stupid features that obfuscate as much of what actually happens in the device as possible.
As the market share increases, you start noticing more and more people sending you PDF files in your office that are mostly just single image files wrapped in a PDF, or a short list or memo that should have been in a text file. This is happening because as more people use products designed for the hipsters, they become less and less aware of the technology they are using, and how to use it properly.
After rejecting said PDF mails for months, one day some one sends you a .webarchive, you then completely flip out, grab your ak-47 put on a ski mask and go to the nearest school spraying bullets into the wall then taking your own life in a rather tragic turn of events.
Hipsters will never go away, and like bacteria in your digestive system, they do play an important role. But efforts must be made to suppress them whenever they start multiplying out of control or start spreading to areas that they have no business being around.
I didn't realize Chuck Palahniuk frequented these forums.
Seriously. This sounds like something straight out of his books.
Am I the only person here who people regularly identify as hipster? I don't think of myself as one, but everyone else does, so maybe i can explain a few things to you.
I have a collection of baller sunglasses, I wear tighter fitting clothes, im super skinny, I am up to date with culture, and my favorite bands are bands that none of you have ever heard of (or if you have, props to you! Long live Ed Sharpe & Magnetic Zeroes, Deadmau5, and Radiohead!). I hang out with kids who wear ironic t-shirts and flannel. I wear colorful clothes mixed with preppy clothes, but I buy all of them at goodwill. I buy 7$ organic crackers at whole foods. I don't shop at target after that whole emmer thing (MN politics, you don't have to care to get my point). I drink PBR (actually i'm moving to hams, you can get a 30 pack here for like 18 bucks and its not bad beer).
I guess, yeah, maybe you could call me hipster. I don't understand why so many people have such a problem with this. I'm not hurting anyone by being ironic; in fact, i think the OP is probably the biggest hipster in the world. This is EXACTLY the sort of thread a hipster would not make, which means that its almost inevitable that one would make it. Is the whole ironic thing making more sense?
and to all the people who think hipsters are rich as fuck: LOL. you CLEARLY do not know any of my friends. we're all poor as balls. I couldn't even afford books for school this year.
On September 30 2010 02:07 tnkted wrote: Am I the only person here who people regularly identify as hipster? I don't think of myself as one, but everyone else does, so maybe i can explain a few things to you.
I have a collection of baller sunglasses, I wear tighter fitting clothes, im super skinny, I am up to date with culture, and my favorite bands are bands that none of you have ever heard of (or if you have, props to you! Long live Ed Sharpe & Magnetic Zeroes, Deadmau5, and Radiohead!). I hang out with kids who wear ironic t-shirts and flannel. I wear colorful clothes mixed with preppy clothes, but I buy all of them at goodwill. I buy 7$ organic crackers at whole foods. I don't shop at target after that whole emmer thing (MN politics, you don't have to care to get my point). I drink PBR (actually i'm moving to hams, you can get a 30 pack here for like 18 bucks and its not bad beer).
I guess, yeah, maybe you could call me hipster. I don't understand why so many people have such a problem with this. I'm not hurting anyone by being ironic; in fact, i think the OP is probably the biggest hipster in the world. This is EXACTLY the sort of thread a hipster would not make, which means that its almost inevitable that one would make it. Is the whole ironic thing making more sense?
and to all the people who think hipsters are rich as fuck: LOL. you CLEARLY do not know any of my friends. we're all poor as balls. I couldn't even afford books for school this year.
Maybe you're poor as balls because you spend $7 on crackers? But props to you for having the courage to come out and admit to being a hipster in this one-sided thread...
On September 30 2010 02:07 tnkted wrote: and my favorite bands are bands that none of you have ever heard of (or if you have, props to you! Long live Ed Sharpe & Magnetic Zeroes, Deadmau5, and Radiohead!).
Seriously? I mean, I havent heard of the first band, but Radiohead is rather famous, and you dont really have to look far into trance / hardstyle without Deadmau5 popping up either. Anyhow, good for you that you know what you "are" and even better that you dont care I guess
On September 30 2010 02:07 tnkted wrote: and my favorite bands are bands that none of you have ever heard of (or if you have, props to you! Long live Ed Sharpe & Magnetic Zeroes, Deadmau5, and Radiohead!)
it's cool because all these groups/artists are incredibly mainstream
On September 30 2010 02:07 tnkted wrote: and my favorite bands are bands that none of you have ever heard of (or if you have, props to you! Long live Ed Sharpe & Magnetic Zeroes, Deadmau5, and Radiohead!).
Yeah man, no one has ever heard of Radiohead, Deadmau5, or Edward Sharpe & the Magnetic Zeroes...... LOL. how did you get such unique and odd taste in music (seriously, RADIOHEAD? WHAT IS THAT?), you're so ironic!!
I think "tnkted" may have justified this entire thread.
Unless he's trolling... in which case, Bravo!
If that's good art, wtf is bad art?!
Oh, that's definitely not good Art. That's not even good art.
I know this isn't adding anything to the discussion.. but what the fuck did I just watch? Girl struggles for minutes to open a can.. Puts contents of said can on her shirt while saying weird backwards-ish shit.. Proceeds to rip her pants and piss in the can (WTF ART?).. aaaaaaaand cleans it up with her shirt to exit.
Young art-school girl trying to make a nihilistic statement about society and its values; the absurdity of placing value on anything, and the utter meaninglessness of "things."
Maybe I just don't have an appreciative eye for "art"... LOL
It's not that you don't have an eye for art; it's that you probably do, which is why it looks absurd.
On September 30 2010 02:20 buffkarpov wrote: Anybody who uses the term hipster is a hipster or an old person. If you hate hipsters you are a hipster.
I don't hate hipsters to be hip. I hate them because they are causing the decay of art with their so called "performance art" and I think this a good enough reason to hate them. I don't want to generalize or stereotype, but they are stupid. I've dealt with people who think they are deep with absolutely NO knowledge of what they are talking about. How can you hope to understand and have a level of depth when you have no knowledge of the past. I'm arguing this in reference to art. Most of them just make shit up and have no basis to form their knowledge on. The idea of art school is bullshit unless you start from the very beginning instead of starting at Jackson Pollock and his bullshit. If the majority of hipsters are constantly "going to parties, blogging" or bathing in their own "coolness" as everyone suggests that leaves no time to actually LEARN about art they pretend to understand. In essence, I stand diametrically opposed to hipsters and that is why I hate them.
i'm not really up to date on whats mainstream and whats not, and i don't really care, those are my favorite bands. if you're curious, here is some other music i like: Aphex twin (the earlier stuff, saw1 & 2), the roots, felix cartel, gtronic, pheonix, nin, deerhoof, caribou, local natives, etc. Are those mainstream? I wouldn't know, i never listen to the radio. all i know is that if i mention ANY of those bands to any of my uncool friends (lol) they are all like 'man, have you heard of taylor swift? she's pretty good.
You can spend your time bitching or you can ask me some questions. as i understood it, the point of this thread is for the OP to learn a bit about hipsterdom. if i'm wrong, and this is about trolling hipsters, i can bum off.
also, im making the
I think "tnkted" may have justified this entire thread.
All the hipster hate is so ridiculous. Should we all be wearing douche-bag pre-faded Hollister or Abercrombie clothes? Should we all be listening to the ATROCIOUS music played on modern radio?
There is nothing wrong with fashion, there is nothing wrong with art, and there is nothing wrong with embracing a lifestyle steeped in both of these two things. People are offended by hipsters because there is something feminine about their dress and their bearing. It's a vaguely homophobic reaction.
We can all be different. It's ok dudes -- hipsters aren't trying to fuck you in the ass. Team Liquid is usually pretty open minded but a lot of these comments have been fairly pathetic.
My main gripe with hipsters is they drink crappy beer. I mean PBR, really? Its not keystone or genny light, but its damn close. I mean if you wanna get drunk and can only afford cheep beer thats one thing, but if you can spend $7 on organic crackers you can get some better beer.(or buy 99c crackers and then add taht to your beer budget)
The other thing that bothers me about some hipsters is the air of smug superiority that they project, but that is not a quality unique to hipsters, it is just a common one. On casual inspection tnkted does not seem to be a member of this group. Great you know about some bands I haven't heard of, that does not make you better then me(Hint: this runs both ways, I know about books and music you don't know either).
The last thing that aggravates me is again, not unique to hipsters, but found very commonly in that group. Misusing the word ironic. As I said, lots of people do it but because hipsters do it more frequently then most.
Hipster is the most meaningless word I can think of. If you listen to indie music you're a "hipster", if you like any sort of foreign film you're a "hipster", if you dress fashionably you're a "hipster".
It's ridiculous. People throw around this word at anything and everything and it's used so often it's almost completely lost its meaning. To me anyway. Maybe some people just genuinely like indie music, art, and fashion. That doesn't make them "hipster trash" or whatever.
On September 30 2010 04:13 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Hipster is the most meaningless word I can think of. If you listen to indie music you're a "hipster", if you like any sort of foreign film you're a "hipster", if you dress fashionably you're a "hipster".
It's ridiculous. People throw around this word at anything and everything and it's used so often it's almost completely lost its meaning. To me anyway. Maybe some people just genuinely like indie music, art, and fashion. That doesn't make them "hipster trash" or whatever.
Dressing fashionably does not make you a hipster.
Paying 200$ for pants to look like you paid 10$ for pants makes you a hipster.
It's pretty simple. Hipsters = Music and Fashion pseudo-intellectuals. They were created by the US economic system where people made entirely too much money doing nothing special then gave it to their kids who now take it for granted.
On September 30 2010 03:45 IPA wrote: All the hipster hate is so ridiculous. Should we all be wearing douche-bag pre-faded Hollister or Abercrombie clothes? Should we all be listening to the ATROCIOUS music played on modern radio?
There is nothing wrong with fashion, there is nothing wrong with art, and there is nothing wrong with embracing a lifestyle steeped in both of these two things. People are offended by hipsters because there is something feminine about their dress and their bearing. It's a vaguely homophobic reaction.
We can all be different. It's ok dudes -- hipsters aren't trying to fuck you in the ass. Team Liquid is usually pretty open minded but a lot of these comments have been fairly pathetic.
The fallout of hipsterdom will actually surpass the casualties of the black death. Spending money with no motive or use is hipsterdom. Putting too much money into the economy and later becoming a mindless ATM hungry consumer. Its better for them to all die off the fad now, than become a worldwide catasprophe later on.
Lol I hate the obnoxious hipster culture of wearing non prescription glasses (Wtf why would do that), wearing, and having an artisticly elite behaviour, tho sometimes I myself can do that. I mean I like to go against the norm too, but you shouldn't be so stupid about it. Sometimes I'll believe something else for the sake of having a good arguement, not because I think it's cool.
"I have an iPhone, a Smart Car, big bug eye sunglasses, and I walk around all day laughing at people wearing clothes from walmart!" - Hipster A, B, C, D
Haters gunna Hate!
Honestly... seems like the OP is a little jealous because one of his friends is A, B, C, or D.
"TL are all hipsters, because we make the trends in the Starcraft Community!" HELL YEAH!
On September 29 2010 09:07 Half wrote: The U.S. has always had a huge socialite trash culture dating back a hundred years. Nothing really new imo.
Though I kinda like retro style stuff -_-.
Correction: the human race always had numerous trash cultural fads dating back thousands of years. And the older generation will call the new fads trash while comfortably participating in their trash fads that their grandparents called trash/the end of western civilization.
If western civilization ended every time people started dressing and acting weird, we'd all have harems of burqa covered women by now.
Funny you mention that....
Anyways, hipsters annoy me mostly because they seem to be associated with the acedemia/artsy bullshit and they kind of develop a superiority complex from it. Really is kind of pathetic considering their mostly a bunch of rich pricks who have life handed to them and don't really do much to contribute to society.
On September 30 2010 03:45 IPA wrote: All the hipster hate is so ridiculous. Should we all be wearing douche-bag pre-faded Hollister or Abercrombie clothes? Should we all be listening to the ATROCIOUS music played on modern radio?
There is nothing wrong with fashion, there is nothing wrong with art, and there is nothing wrong with embracing a lifestyle steeped in both of these two things. People are offended by hipsters because there is something feminine about their dress and their bearing. It's a vaguely homophobic reaction.
We can all be different. It's ok dudes -- hipsters aren't trying to fuck you in the ass. Team Liquid is usually pretty open minded but a lot of these comments have been fairly pathetic.
Everyone grows up at a different pace it seems. The reason that I personally group hipsters in the same group as 13 year old goths is that it is just people trying to fit into some sort of specific style/culture for the sake of, well, being a part of that style/culture. And that, to me, is weakness, no matter how you look at it.
And though I would agree that it is silly to try to push your negative views on someone, I don't think that's what people are doing here. Hipsters are just people taking too long to grow up. To criticize them for that is by no means inappropriate. We aren't busting into their house with a bag of good looking clothes, preaching that they need to abandon their raggedy plaid shirts, thick glasses they don't need, and ugly shoes.
Not to mention, there is a certain level of arrogance/snottiness that hipsters are known for. People that we can recognize as flawed and silly being arrogant is even more frustrating x_x Though I realize this is mainly satirical, I think it perfectly shows the type of arrogance hipsters are known for:
And I really think THAT is what annoys people the most about hipsters. The snotty attitude about listening to "underground" music and wearing raggedy clothing since "We aren't concerned with materialistic image", when in fact, they are going out of their way to be a specific image.
On September 29 2010 09:19 choboPEon wrote: How to tell there's a damn good chance you are a hipster: you feel it necessary to write an entire article about the "hipster phenomenon". Seriously, the majority of people who I see saying they hate hipsters are obnoxious people themselves, either matching the hipster stereotype exactly or are the type of people who can't go a day without making snickering remarks about generalized stereotypes.
IE people who get off on snark. My god, there are trends and people wear skinny jeans! So fucking what.
lol you mad?
it's amusing to poke fun at how counter-culture is becoming mass culture
It was amusing a few years ago, maybe for the first 3 million wink-and-jokes, but now it's a word which has virtually no meaning or purpose except to facilitate making snide remarks. It's dumb. There's a reason respected newspapers and other media outlets are actively trying to remove the use of the word hipster from their work. It's because it doesn't mean shit except that some snide remark is about to follow.
I admit I'm coming across as 'mad' but I live in Brooklyn, apparently the hipster capital of the universe, and I've been hearing these annoying jokes from every direction for years and years. Trust me, you don't know what it's like. If you had to hear the same people make the same tired jokes about the punching bag hipsters and think 'god damn I am clever', you'd go a little loopy too.
Just read this thread. The word has no specific meaning. Almost every post has a different definition and it's all vague and it all comes down to one thing: Young person I'd like to insult? Hipster.
Hey Chobo, which would you say is more hipster, Williamsburg or the LES? Coz I live in the LES and it's hard to imagine it getting any more hipster than this....
On September 29 2010 09:10 Kennigit wrote: Hipsters are the reason i think we need mandatory military service immediately after high school. That or labor camps.
This all sounds really overblown to me, isn't this basically the same thing as hippies? And as far as I know hippies never really did anything that bad. I mean a worldwide catastrophe? What are they gonna fuck up? Spending lots of their parents money... That's not going to ruin the world.
"These same girls, while being very socialized (all they do is party), don't seem like they actually have a purpose in their life." This quote kind of bothers me. Who are you to decide how someone should live their lives. I am some one spends a lot of time on video games, they are people who spend lots of time partying, but suddenly they have no purpose in life, because they do something different? I'm okay with people doing their own thing as long as it doesn't effect other people.
it seems to me that the people everyone here seems to be hatin on is people who act superior to other people and are all pretentious and shit. specifically im lookin at you, JamesJohansen:
Anyways, hipsters annoy me mostly because they seem to be associated with the acedemia/artsy bullshit and they kind of develop a superiority complex from it. Really is kind of pathetic considering their mostly a bunch of rich pricks who have life handed to them and don't really do much to contribute to society.
You do realize that the last sentance there makes you look like you have a superiority complex concerning hipsters? it makes your entire arguement illogical.
ITT: pretentious people bitchin on hipsters for being pretentious
and as to the comments on 7$ crackers: that was a joke. I did that once, i don't have the money to do it regularly. I do try to stick to a fairly vegetarian diet when i can, but that's really more for health reasons than because i want to save the animals or whatever. I do have friends that eat vegan specifically because they don't want to hurt animals, and i think thats very admirable. I would do it too if i had the willpower to stay away from bacon.
my point is that my friends, and people with similar interests to me (btw, NO hipster will admit to being a hipster because if you want to be a hipster, you are not a hipster by definition) are just like everyone else. there are nice people and arrogant people. Some 'hipsters' are pretentious fucks and some are actually fairly thoughtful dudes and gals that happen to care very deeply about their art or about peta or the gay rights movement or something. In fact, the people you call hipster are just like the people in this thread: some of them are legit dudes, some of them are confused, and some of them are arrogant and need to feel superior to people they think beneath them.
So I'm a little late to this thread, but I have a hipster question. Why do they like fixie bikes? I ride my bike to work every day, and there is a hipster bike messanger business near where I live. Every messanger has a fixie bike, and I cannot for the life of me figure out why. There are lots of hills, and hills on a fixed gear bike are brutal.
Edit: Also, they all smoke like chimneys when they're not on their bikes. If I made my living riding a bike all day, I would not fucking smoke.
On September 30 2010 05:17 Rho_ wrote: So I'm a little late to this thread, but I have a hipster question. Why do they like fixie bikes? I ride my bike to work every day, and there is a hipster bike messanger business near where I live. Every messanger has a fixie bike, and I cannot for the life of me figure out why. There are lots of hills, and hills on a fixed gear bike are brutal.
Edit: Also, they all smoke like chimneys when they're not on their bikes. If I made my living riding a bike all day, I would not fucking smoke.
fixie bikes? are you talking old bikes with single gears? or old bikes they fixed up? or NEW bikes with fixed gears?
But i think i know roughly what you're talking about. you're talking a cool looking retro bike, basically. thats what all my friends (and me, actually) ride. two reasons as far as i can tell:
1. they look cool, and 2. they are cheap
simple as that. i know a guy that got the COOLEST bike i have ever seen, and he spent literally 2 bucks for it at the junk yard, fixed it up, and has been riding ever since.
the cigarettes are probably because they're addicted. a lot of my friends started smoking years ago and have been trying to quit ever since - at least the ones that don't think of themselves as 'social smokers' who only smoke when they're at parties or wasted or something, but those don't sound like the kind of kid you're talking about.
On September 30 2010 05:17 Rho_ wrote: So I'm a little late to this thread, but I have a hipster question. Why do they like fixie bikes? I ride my bike to work every day, and there is a hipster bike messanger business near where I live. Every messanger has a fixie bike, and I cannot for the life of me figure out why. There are lots of hills, and hills on a fixed gear bike are brutal.
Edit: Also, they all smoke like chimneys when they're not on their bikes. If I made my living riding a bike all day, I would not fucking smoke.
fixie bikes? are you talking old bikes with single gears? or old bikes they fixed up? or NEW bikes with fixed gears?
But i think i know roughly what you're talking about. you're talking a cool looking retro bike, basically. thats what all my friends (and me, actually) ride. two reasons as far as i can tell:
1. they look cool, and 2. they are cheap
simple as that. i know a guy that got the COOLEST bike i have ever seen, and he spent literally 2 bucks for it at the junk yard, fixed it up, and has been riding ever since.
the cigarettes are probably because they're addicted. a lot of my friends started smoking years ago and have been trying to quit ever since - at least the ones that don't think of themselves as 'social smokers' who only smoke when they're at parties or wasted or something, but those don't sound like the kind of kid you're talking about.
fixie refers to fixed gear bicycles, as there is no freewheel and you cannot break. Benefits of fixies are that they are cheaper, and mechanically simpler(therefore lighter). Disadvantages are you cant coast, hills are brutal(cant shift gears going up, need to peddle REALLY fast going down up to 170 rpm) taking corners while peddling causes problems for new riders(peddles hit the ground).
In the end a fixie is a better sprinter because they are lighter therefore can accelerate faster, but cant come close to the top speed or endurance of a geared bike.
As for why hipsters use them, its mostly because other hipsters use them and they want to fit in(aka they look cool)
On September 30 2010 03:22 tnkted wrote: i'm not really up to date on whats mainstream and whats not, and i don't really care, those are my favorite bands. if you're curious, here is some other music i like: Aphex twin (the earlier stuff, saw1 & 2), the roots, felix cartel, gtronic, pheonix, nin, deerhoof, caribou, local natives, etc. Are those mainstream? I wouldn't know, i never listen to the radio. all i know is that if i mention ANY of those bands to any of my uncool friends (lol) they are all like 'man, have you heard of taylor swift? she's pretty good.
You can spend your time bitching or you can ask me some questions. as i understood it, the point of this thread is for the OP to learn a bit about hipsterdom. if i'm wrong, and this is about trolling hipsters, i can bum off.
I think "tnkted" may have justified this entire thread.
my new siggy.
Hey man, enjoy it.
I find this (and many TL threads) wildly entertaining and hope that my Interior Semiotics post is viewed with as much good-natured humour as it is with horror and derision.
Holy shit, so much of this happens back in Australia - it's indeed a culture obsessed by the inane. Thinking they are 'all that', although with a paranoid fear that they aren't as cool as the next person. As though don't have a solid opinion on anything and their life beliefs are versatile based on the next person who comes along who is seemingly 'cooler' in someone else's eyes.
It's a bit shit, it's a bunch of people who don't know how to make up their own minds...whatever, let them be as they be. If they do indeed live for the 'hip' clubs they visit, then so be it.
But definitely reminds me exactly of the culture surrounding a few clubs in Sydney. It's kinda tragic.
On September 30 2010 05:17 Rho_ wrote: So I'm a little late to this thread, but I have a hipster question. Why do they like fixie bikes? I ride my bike to work every day, and there is a hipster bike messanger business near where I live. Every messanger has a fixie bike, and I cannot for the life of me figure out why. There are lots of hills, and hills on a fixed gear bike are brutal.
Edit: Also, they all smoke like chimneys when they're not on their bikes. If I made my living riding a bike all day, I would not fucking smoke.
fixie bikes? are you talking old bikes with single gears? or old bikes they fixed up? or NEW bikes with fixed gears?
But i think i know roughly what you're talking about. you're talking a cool looking retro bike, basically. thats what all my friends (and me, actually) ride. two reasons as far as i can tell:
1. they look cool, and 2. they are cheap
simple as that. i know a guy that got the COOLEST bike i have ever seen, and he spent literally 2 bucks for it at the junk yard, fixed it up, and has been riding ever since.
the cigarettes are probably because they're addicted. a lot of my friends started smoking years ago and have been trying to quit ever since - at least the ones that don't think of themselves as 'social smokers' who only smoke when they're at parties or wasted or something, but those don't sound like the kind of kid you're talking about.
fixie refers to fixed gear bicycles, as there is no freewheel and you cannot break. Benefits of fixies are that they are cheaper, and mechanically simpler(therefore lighter). Disadvantages are you cant coast, hills are brutal(cant shift gears going up, need to peddle REALLY fast going down up to 170 rpm) taking corners while peddling causes problems for new riders(peddles hit the ground).
In the end a fixie is a better sprinter because they are lighter therefore can accelerate faster, but cant come close to the top speed or endurance of a geared bike.
As for why hipsters use them, its mostly because other hipsters use them and they want to fit in(aka they look cool)
Hipsters are easy to make fun of because they do a lot of really strange things, and the Interior Semiotics video is a good example of that. But there is something to be said for trying to do something so outlandish. Interior Semiotics was laughable – but at least it was an attempt to create something. Because of their willingness to take risks, hipsters have probably been the most prominent contemporary subculture to substantially contribute too main-stream culture, and they do it in various media (art, music, design, film – nearly everyone entering these media would be classed as a "hipster"). The movement, if you want to call it that, is growing. As with anything that enters the mainstream, "Hipsterdom" is watered down for mass consumption. As it grows and is watered down, individuals who perhaps couldn't make the cut before or don't fully understand the original "hipster" ethos are allowed into the subculture and cripple the culture even more. Pretty soon, everyone just thinks hipsters are rich fucks who snort coke and ride their fixies all day.
On September 29 2010 09:24 No_Roo wrote: Do not underestimate hipsters or the damage they inflict on a culture collectively.
Example: Hipsters buy iphones because they are trendy when most of them (not 100%) actually would have been better off buying some other device to satisfy their needs (some other smart phone that doesn't have absurd software restrictions, maybe a small laptop.)
Hipsters now try to justify their purchase by pressuring others into buying other apple products with the promise of being trendy. As the fad catches on it validates the hipster.
The company (in this example apple) determines they can establish a marketing strategy to pander to these people and make considerable profits off of them while gaining marketshare simply by deploying products with stupid features that obfuscate as much of what actually happens in the device as possible.
As the market share increases, you start noticing more and more people sending you PDF files in your office that are mostly just single image files wrapped in a PDF, or a short list or memo that should have been in a text file. This is happening because as more people use products designed for the hipsters, they become less and less aware of the technology they are using, and how to use it properly.
After rejecting said PDF mails for months, one day some one sends you a .webarchive, you then completely flip out, grab your ak-47 put on a ski mask and go to the nearest school spraying bullets into the wall then taking your own life in a rather tragic turn of events.
Hipsters will never go away, and like bacteria in your digestive system, they do play an important role. But efforts must be made to suppress them whenever they start multiplying out of control or start spreading to areas that they have no business being around.
I didn't realize Chuck Palahniuk frequented these forums.
Seriously. This sounds like something straight out of his books.
Never heard of him, I should go look it up to determine if this was a complement or criticism!
There's a difference between "hipster" and "guy who likes to dress fashionably and listen to underground music". The difference is usually the attitude. The people I consider "hipsters" are the people who want nothing to do with anyone other than their fellow hipsters, and have this superiority complex + disdain for anyone who can't be as hipster as them. Those are the people I can't stand, but it's for their attitude that I can't stand them, not their stylistic choices/music tastes/taste in beer.
I'm honestly confused here. A large part of youth society believes it's cool to be counterculture. Why exactly is this strange or new? Rock and roll, hippies, punks, hasn't this been true for each generation since at least the fifties, and hasn't each older generation decried it? Counterculture has been popular culture for ages now, hasn't it?
That adbusters article is full of shit:
An artificial appropriation of different styles from different eras, the hipster represents the end of Western civilization – a culture lost in the superficiality of its past and unable to create any new meaning. Not only is it unsustainable, it is suicidal. While previous youth movements have challenged the dysfunction and decadence of their elders, today we have the "hipster" – a youth subculture that mirrors the doomed shallowness of mainstream society.
The first few sentences are stupid. Trying to measure when meaning is or is not created is ridiculous. Perhaps the article is implying that most of the hipsters are simply trend followers that make no contribution to culture, but the same can be said of every other counterculture movement. There were very few original hippies, and very few hippies did anything meaningful. That hippiedom as a whole was culturally meaningful, on the other hand, cannot be contested.
Secondly, the idea that previous youth movements challenged the dysfunction and decadence of the elders is just plain wrong. The Beats might not have been materialistic, but they were lazy and very decadent in their own way. The same can be said for the hippies, and once again all counterculture groups in the last fifty years.
Perhaps it's easier to look back at previous counterculture movements and find meaning in them than to see the long term cultural effects of the movement as they are happening. It's also easy to fixate on isolated ideals within each movement and then to argue that it will bring down Western culture. However, it seems to me that rather than ever truly entering mainstream culture, a more moderate, positive version of these ideals enter society. The hippies were free love and drug culture, but what entered mainstream culture was a slightly lower tendency to follow cultural norms blindly.
Punks wear their tattered threads and studded leather jackets with honor, priding themselves on their innovative and cheap methods of self-expression and rebellion. B-boys and b-girls announce themselves to anyone within earshot with baggy gear and boomboxes. But it is rare, if not impossible, to find an individual who will proclaim themself a proud hipster. It’s an odd dance of self-identity – adamantly denying your existence while wearing clearly defined symbols that proclaims it.
The article first shows how the word hipster is almost always used in a derogative way before being surprised that youth do not like being associated with the term. Furthermore, is it surprising that a group of people who prize individuality (regardless of their success in achieving it) do not like to be categorized as a group? How is this surprising or bad?
The dance floor at a hipster party looks like it should be surrounded by quotation marks. While punk, disco and hip hop all had immersive, intimate and energetic dance styles that liberated the dancer from his/her mental states – be it the head-spinning b-boy or violent thrashings of a live punk show – the hipster has more of a joke dance. A faux shrug shuffle that mocks the very idea of dancing or, at its best, illustrates a non-committal fear of expression typified in a weird twitch/ironic twist. The dancers are too self-aware to let themselves feel any form of liberation; they shuffle along, shrugging themselves into oblivion.
Once again, this is such a misguided paragraph. Yes, a few of the countercultures had energetic dances, but things like grunge and shoegaze in the 90s had very similar dances to the current hipster dance. Furthermore, the writer is implying that people who took part in other counterculture movements were not self-conscious (because of their dances), which is just as wrong. From what I know of countercultures, they have all been as self-conscious as the hipsters. Going back to the Beats (since I know the most about them), even within the fairly tight knit center of the movement there was a lot of vying for status and almost all the members were painfully insecure. Youth movements tend to revolve around "cool," and cool movements tend to be characterised by self-consciousness, regardless of how it is expressed. In the hipster movement, cool is just expressed by disinterest.
What they may or may not know is that "cool-hunters" will also be skulking the same sites, taking note of how they dress and what they consume. These marketers and party-promoters get paid to co-opt youth culture and then re-sell it back at a profit. In the end, hipsters are sold what they think they invent and are spoon-fed their pre-packaged cultural livelihood.
Hipsterdom is the first "counterculture" to be born under the advertising industry’s microscope, leaving it open to constant manipulation but also forcing its participants to continually shift their interests and affiliations. Less a subculture, the hipster is a consumer group – using their capital to purchase empty authenticity and rebellion. But the moment a trend, band, sound, style or feeling gains too much exposure, it is suddenly looked upon with disdain. Hipsters cannot afford to maintain any cultural loyalties or affiliations for fear they will lose relevance. ... An amalgamation of its own history, the youth of the West are left with consuming cool rather that creating it.
Once again, I don't know where the writer got his information from. Just before the hippies, the Beats got so popular that you could hire a "beatnik" for your party who would then sit around, be drunk, and probably recite some terrible poetry. Punk is the same, look at the Sex Pistols: They were basically a manufactured band designed to sell punk counterculture and clothing. Similar to the hipster movement, Vivian Westwood played a massive role in creating the punk movement and ended up profiting from it tremendously. Perhaps the hipster movement is bigger than any previous counterculture movements, but just like all those movements it influences and is influenced by society.
I really don't think the article makes a single good point. It is best said by Gavin McInnes in the article: "They’re just so mad at these young kids for going out and getting wasted and having fun and being fashionable." Just like most youth movements, being a hipster is about hedonism. It's about having fun regardless of the harm you cause. It's also about finding yourself and expressing yourself in some way. One ironic T might look just like any other ironic T, but it's a form of self-expression, and whether it's unique or not to an outsider is beside the point.
All of this is not to say that I particularly like hipsters. By and large, I find them to be pretentious idiots. However, as with the other things discussed, I doubt being a pretentious student is specific to this counterculture.
The big question is that what will happen when the hipster culture will be "SO 2010?"
I believe it will collapse on itself and cause a fashion black whole, devouring humanity as we know it.
Also, one thing that no one has addressed about hipsters are the smell. You know if a hipster is in a room if the room smells like 80 people defecated in said room and were living in it for a year. It is seriously one of the worst things you can experience.
My credentials about hipsters is that I go to Oberlin College, voted as the "most hipster" college in the US. I am also a conservatory student and not a normal college student, so that means i'm allowed not to be hipster =]
The whole Hipster trend makes me glad that I live in the South where most people can't afford all the hipster garbage, and the ones that could afford it get stuff that's actually nice.
That and ghetto black people don't do this crap cause they're total ballers.
On September 30 2010 10:36 koreasilver wrote: Women from anywhere and anything can be attractive. It has more to do with the woman herself than anything to do with culture or subculture.
The second line especially. Something about a girl with a free spirit and sexual confidence is oh so desirable.
JWD is a hipster, but we all love him and his hipster blog gets spotlighted every time. Why does everyone hate hipsters, most of us have a lot in common with them.
On September 30 2010 10:24 Rising_Phoenix wrote: The big question is that what will happen when the hipster culture will be "SO 2010?"
I believe it will collapse on itself and cause a fashion black whole, devouring humanity as we know it.
Also, one thing that no one has addressed about hipsters are the smell. You know if a hipster is in a room if the room smells like 80 people defecated in said room and were living in it for a year. It is seriously one of the worst things you can experience.
My credentials about hipsters is that I go to Oberlin College, voted as the "most hipster" college in the US. I am also a conservatory student and not a normal college student, so that means i'm allowed not to be hipster =]
A fashion black whole will devour humanity? you mean like what happened when someone invented crocks?
So here in Colorado we call these people "scene kids". I'm friends with a few, and from there have seen many more of these "scene kids". And from what I gather, the article is waaaay too harsh. They're just teenagers that are insecure, didn't like culture, and found a way to express themselves (that is, by being just like everyone else!) When I go to the parties (rarely and only when it's thrown by a friend of mine), it's really funny because I'm the one that sticks out like a sore thumb, and nobody will talk to me. Regardless, I have a quote that sums up the article very well. Scene kids (hipsters) are not causing harm, they'd be just as vacuous and incapable of expression if they didn't all dress the same :D. And here's the quote:
"And these children that you spit on, while they try to change their worlds... are immune to your consultations. They're quite aware of what they're going through."
Daigomi- great post. You make a convincing case that most youth movements have or had the same problems as hipsters.
For me, the key difference is the 'it's cool to be disinterested' part. If you take goths or punks or hippies, even if they were following occasionally questionable ideals, they were still doing it with a lot of passion - and I've always felt that was really cool. Being 'passionately disinterested' and ironic in the hipster vein is just kind of depressing/obnoxious.
On September 30 2010 10:24 Rising_Phoenix wrote: The big question is that what will happen when the hipster culture will be "SO 2010?"
I believe it will collapse on itself and cause a fashion black whole, devouring humanity as we know it.
Also, one thing that no one has addressed about hipsters are the smell. You know if a hipster is in a room if the room smells like 80 people defecated in said room and were living in it for a year. It is seriously one of the worst things you can experience.
My credentials about hipsters is that I go to Oberlin College, voted as the "most hipster" college in the US. I am also a conservatory student and not a normal college student, so that means i'm allowed not to be hipster =]
Fuck you, Oberlin connies aren't qualified to talk about hipsters.
What happens if the hipster fad gets really, really popular? Would they all start hating it and do the opposite (stop caring about superficial crap, work hard, and get jobs)?
I'm friends with a lot of people who dress like hipsters, but who still aren't arrogant pricks. They don't toss around the word "ironic" at every chance, and they don't spend 200$ for something they could pick up for 5$ at value village. It really is about the person and not the style - if you start judging a person based off of what they look like without actually ever talking to them, well, that's kind of sad. Just sayin'.
As for the attractiveness of the hipster style: don't bother making a fuss out of it. If the guy/girl is good looking normally, chances are they'll still be good looking underneath all that hipster gear. And in the end, if you're going to be vain and worry about someone's appearance, worry about what they look like beneath the clothing.
honestly i've heard the word a couple times, it doesn't seem any different than the other "cultures." who cares what their habits and trends are if you're not one and you don't want to be one?
in all cultures, one doesn't understand how to be themselves so they conform to the interests of those they hold in high regard. that's as far as anyone thinks it and after that they become a hive mind until they decide it's not interesting anymore. doesn't seem any different from wiggers, goths, etc. they're all equally pathetic in their lack of individuality. you're being way overreactive if you think some idiots who can't decide what they like to wear and do are going to destroy the world. they're pretty much the furthest of all the cultures from doing that.
those who purposely strive to non-conform end up doing so anyway. be yourself and let people be themselves and you won't care about judging people's silly perceptions so much, because everyone has them and to others, your judgements are probably just as silly.
I wrote about hipsters for my college paper last week. Funny this thread came up.
I don't know if the writing was awful on purpose or not, but it was awful. I'm surprised your college paper published that with mistakes in the first sentence. Do they even bother proof reading?
Jeesh, ya I made some spelling mistakes but the first sentence was done by my editor and I am quite pissed about that. Thanks for the constructive feedback. Oh wait, there wasn't any.
I wrote about hipsters for my college paper last week. Funny this thread came up.
I don't know if the writing was awful on purpose or not, but it was awful. I'm surprised your college paper published that with mistakes in the first sentence. Do they even bother proof reading?
Jeesh, ya I made some spelling mistakes but the first sentence was done by my editor and I am quite pissed about that. Thanks for the constructive feedback. Oh wait, there wasn't any.
youre surprised that a shit article that looks like it was written while you were stoned in the hour before class got dirted on?? like forget the fact that you didnt even spellcheck and proof (if you cant do this for a final paper, its aalways a good sign that its shit) the whole thing is just stupid. its terrible whether its for the school paper, eng 101, any academic stuff... what the hell was this even for??
EPT
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? I believe 1 in 10 more people are fat then in other countries. Thats not a majority. I cant find one person that does not believe in evolution and i live in the midwest. 
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