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United States47024 Posts
On September 15 2013 07:50 Verrou wrote:
Is drow a decent mid vs od? Cause on paper she doesn't seem that bad. Rush phase boots, don't care if int gets stolen, just stay there and farm...
(Thinking of a luna/drow mix for a pocket strat draft and have noone vs who to test drow in mid)
If you have a good block and the OD is not good, then yes.
The problem is that at low levels, you will get absolutely bodied if OD gets the creep wave in a good position because his base stats are way higher. If he has a better block than you, you can't really punish him or move the creep wave easily, and he will just have total free reign over lasthits and denies.
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Ok, ty for the answer.
I guess a level 1 rosh with luna/drow/3 other ranged might be necessary against an od mid then if ever I try to pull this off... mass range ftw
EDIT: then again she has poor stat gain. I guess I can accept a drow getting wrecked in early game in terms of cs but good od's will deny the hell out of their creeps and she would end up underleveled and underfarmed. Which is very, very bad for a level and farm dependent carry (even if i'd have her on 2 in that team).
Oh, well, whatever =)
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Why build phase boots on some carries? Today I saw [A] build phase on phantom assassin and I was surprised. Isn't AS usually better than MS? I almost always go treads, and if I need MS I go drums/yasha etc.
Where am I mistaken?
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PA's phantom strike provides the AS that she needs and sometimes melee carries need phase for maneuverability. Phantom Strike has low cd too!
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On September 15 2013 08:50 Derrida wrote:
Why build phase boots on some carries? Today I saw [A] build phase on phantom assassin and I was surprised. Isn't AS usually better than MS? I almost always go treads, and if I need MS I go drums/yasha etc.
Where am I mistaken?
If you chase, build phase. Esp if your hero has an attack speed boost.
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On September 15 2013 09:49 Laserist wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2013 08:50 Derrida wrote:
Why build phase boots on some carries? Today I saw [A] build phase on phantom assassin and I was surprised. Isn't AS usually better than MS? I almost always go treads, and if I need MS I go drums/yasha etc.
Where am I mistaken? If you chase, build phase. Esp if your hero has an attack speed boost.
also if you need early last hitting power / lane dominance.
for a hero like gyro, phase gives you more damage out of flak so thats something to consider too
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On September 15 2013 08:50 Derrida wrote:
Why build phase boots on some carries? Today I saw [A] build phase on phantom assassin and I was surprised. Isn't AS usually better than MS? I almost always go treads, and if I need MS I go drums/yasha etc.
Where am I mistaken?
It's actually not just the MS. Phase on PA is probably just as much if not more for the damage rather than the MS. PA's blink strike provides her with mobility and attack speed. All she needs is raw damage to make those ridiculous crits hurt. Thus, phase, with +24 damage.
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On September 15 2013 08:50 Derrida wrote:
Why build phase boots on some carries? Today I saw [A] build phase on phantom assassin and I was surprised. Isn't AS usually better than MS? I almost always go treads, and if I need MS I go drums/yasha etc.
Where am I mistaken?
It depends on the carry and the game. PA usually prefers damage to crit higher. Phase boots also give you more mobility, which is crucial in a lot of games. It's sometimes not practical to wait till Drums + yasha to have good movement speed, especially if you wanna go for other items.
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On September 15 2013 12:15 Xxazn4lyfe51xX wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2013 08:50 Derrida wrote:
Why build phase boots on some carries? Today I saw [A] build phase on phantom assassin and I was surprised. Isn't AS usually better than MS? I almost always go treads, and if I need MS I go drums/yasha etc.
Where am I mistaken? It's actually not just the MS. Phase on PA is probably just as much if not more for the damage rather than the MS. PA's blink strike provides her with mobility and attack speed. All she needs is raw damage to make those ridiculous crits hurt. Thus, phase, with +24 damage.
It's a nice side effect, but I think it's not the main reason. PA would for example looooove the HP treads could give her.
It's the mobility. PA is quite fast, but not the fastest. Against an enemy that is running away you will get more hits the faster you move(since you have to walk between hits).
The reason why phase boots beat yasha/drums is because you Phase boots alone can give you a burst of 16% and unitwalking. Yasha only gives 10%, drums give 5%/15%.
And that for a fraction of either price and without an inventory slot(you will always have boots, so it doesn't count)
Or in short, she gets Phase Boots for the same reason Lone Druids bear and Naix do. Because no reliable stun until you get an abyssal, and you can't hit something faster than you.
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On September 15 2013 01:37 hooahah wrote:
is Medusa mid a thing? in my head it's bad but so far in pubs it's worked whenever I've seen it (vs Puck, Drow)
Medusas ok in lane (altho her base damage kinda sucks), but she doesn't really have any qualities you'd want in a mid laner. She can't gank or translate early levels and farm into pressure around the map. It's a hero way more suited for safelane imo
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I feel if you had some high-impact aggressive supports and a teamfight safelaner, you could feasibly run a strong dual core lineup with a medusa mid. One example of this would be an earthshaker - luna - medusa combo, in which you guarantee 2 dps heroes farm while still maintaining a solid midgame. Also, medusa is somewhat undervalued as an early midgame hero, because her ult is fantastic in teamfights. Basically, as long as your team has the power to beat off the other team in the midgame, you can guarantee a stronger lategame by virtue of 2 hard carries with secured early game farm. Sure, she doesn't gank, but she can make up for it in teamfights (barring the other team's nightstalker having already ended the game by that point).
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On September 15 2013 12:38 TheSubtleArt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2013 08:50 Derrida wrote:
Why build phase boots on some carries? Today I saw [A] build phase on phantom assassin and I was surprised. Isn't AS usually better than MS? I almost always go treads, and if I need MS I go drums/yasha etc.
Where am I mistaken? It depends on the carry and the game. PA usually prefers damage to crit higher. Phase boots also give you more mobility, which is crucial in a lot of games. It's sometimes not practical to wait till Drums + yasha to have good movement speed, especially if you wanna go for other items.
This is actually something I've always disagreed with - not the mobility part but the damage part. PA's damage is already so insane early game with the crits and her attack speed is so good with the blink strike that damage just isn't really a huge priority on her in my opinion - when I play her I usually build more like XBOCT did the few times I've seen him play her and go for survivability and mobility >>>>>> damage (phase -> bkb or phase -> drums -> bkb or whatever, also manta can be really good). Also I haven't watched many Loda PA games lately but from what I remember from G1 he was building her much the same - she is really an early game carry at heart, and the damage is the least important part of building her in my opinion.
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On September 15 2013 04:50 evilfatsh1t wrote:
usually you start by getting morph at lvl 1. morph some str into agi at fountain so you start with full mana and go stats heavy with tangos for items. only in rare cases do you get waveform at lvl 1 (trilane situations mainly, or escaping a very early gank before you have allocated skills). morph solves morphlings low base damage at the start, although you have to be careful with your aggression and stuff because you will be sitting at ~400hp. for mana, rob/aquila and perserverance is enough with treads switching early game. however if you dont like finishing perserverance first, then some people opt to get bottle. if youre farming really well and youre good at managing your mana, rob/aquila + treads can last you until you get your linkens. if you went mid, then bottle is standard. a good timing for linkens + eblade is 28mins. 30mins is acceptable too, but anything past 30 and youre losing the timing when your eblade is most effective. theres a morphling guide somewhere i think where items have been discussed already i think, although it may be in this thread.
ok thanks for replying, i seem to have a problem trying to last hit with him well compared to other heroes and its really annoying. for pa is it advisable to go midas? i tend to go midas + phase but i think considering how weak pa is in early-mid game getting midas would make her even more vulnerable
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going midas on any hero requires you to have kind of a gauge on how the game is going, dont blindly build it every game
can you afford to spend 1900 gold on an item that does nothing for you in terms of fighting and hope that it pays off in the 17-18 minutes that it takes for you to get your money back
will your team suddenly crumble apart and lose every single tower for some reason because you spent all the money on midas instead of actual fighting items to go 5v5
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On September 15 2013 14:58 Invictus wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2013 04:50 evilfatsh1t wrote:
usually you start by getting morph at lvl 1. morph some str into agi at fountain so you start with full mana and go stats heavy with tangos for items. only in rare cases do you get waveform at lvl 1 (trilane situations mainly, or escaping a very early gank before you have allocated skills). morph solves morphlings low base damage at the start, although you have to be careful with your aggression and stuff because you will be sitting at ~400hp. for mana, rob/aquila and perserverance is enough with treads switching early game. however if you dont like finishing perserverance first, then some people opt to get bottle. if youre farming really well and youre good at managing your mana, rob/aquila + treads can last you until you get your linkens. if you went mid, then bottle is standard. a good timing for linkens + eblade is 28mins. 30mins is acceptable too, but anything past 30 and youre losing the timing when your eblade is most effective. theres a morphling guide somewhere i think where items have been discussed already i think, although it may be in this thread. ok thanks for replying, i seem to have a problem trying to last hit with him well compared to other heroes and its really annoying. for pa is it advisable to go midas? i tend to go midas + phase but i think considering how weak pa is in early-mid game getting midas would make her even more vulnerable
A simplified way of thinking about Midas is that it's a great item if you're aiming to peak at around 10k gold in total items with the Midas included. If you aim for less than that (e.g. Radiance bear) the Midas will delay it, if you aim for a lot more than that a "real" farming item (e.g. BF/Linkens) is most likely a smarter choice if you can get away with it.
Sticking with the Bear example compared to straight up rushing the items a Midas would e.g. delay your Radiance timing but speed up your Radiance + AC timing by a couple of minutes for either assuming nothing super weird happens.
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You should keep in mind that Midas is often bought because of the level-advantage it gives, the gold is obviously nice aswell but if this item is gotten in pro-games the levels are the selling point in most cases.
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On September 15 2013 14:58 Invictus wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2013 04:50 evilfatsh1t wrote:
usually you start by getting morph at lvl 1. morph some str into agi at fountain so you start with full mana and go stats heavy with tangos for items. only in rare cases do you get waveform at lvl 1 (trilane situations mainly, or escaping a very early gank before you have allocated skills). morph solves morphlings low base damage at the start, although you have to be careful with your aggression and stuff because you will be sitting at ~400hp. for mana, rob/aquila and perserverance is enough with treads switching early game. however if you dont like finishing perserverance first, then some people opt to get bottle. if youre farming really well and youre good at managing your mana, rob/aquila + treads can last you until you get your linkens. if you went mid, then bottle is standard. a good timing for linkens + eblade is 28mins. 30mins is acceptable too, but anything past 30 and youre losing the timing when your eblade is most effective. theres a morphling guide somewhere i think where items have been discussed already i think, although it may be in this thread. ok thanks for replying, i seem to have a problem trying to last hit with him well compared to other heroes and its really annoying. for pa is it advisable to go midas? i tend to go midas + phase but i think considering how weak pa is in early-mid game getting midas would make her even more vulnerable
You delay your bkb a lot and PA does not need more to wreck faces. She's not that weak early-mid, you can stay out of range and wait for the right moment to blink in crit&kill. Any heroe without stun or good burst damage should not stay in PA's range without teammates once she is 6.
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On September 15 2013 12:44 TheSubtleArt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2013 01:37 hooahah wrote:
is Medusa mid a thing? in my head it's bad but so far in pubs it's worked whenever I've seen it (vs Puck, Drow) Medusas ok in lane (altho her base damage kinda sucks), but she doesn't really have any qualities you'd want in a mid laner. She can't gank or translate early levels and farm into pressure around the map. It's a hero way more suited for safelane imo That's an interesting way of looking at it. What heroes do you think are the best in terms of translating early farm into pressure?
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the mids everyone always picks. qop, puck, ta etc. heroes capable of solo killing opponents or changing teamfights with big spells
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Well, I'm just wondering what are the best mids in high level play in the current metagame? Besides the ones you mentioned. I don't watch many games so I'm somewhat in the dark.
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EPT
