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General Discussion - Page 5201

Forum Index > Dota 2 General
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IRC chatter should remain in IRC - http://webchat.quakenet.org/?channels=tl.dota2

Posts that relate to topics with their own thread, such as in News, Tournaments or Strategy should go in those threads.
Ru ba
Profile Joined February 2014
Serbia1812 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-23 00:14:17
April 23 2014 00:12 GMT
#104001
On April 23 2014 07:30 Sbrubbles wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 23 2014 07:03 TheYango wrote:
The thing is with Sven is that he's not really threatening by himself given his comparatively low mobility. He has a powerful 10s BKB timing, but unless your team really has the appropriate means to let him stand and do damage (e.g. DS, Magnus kind of heroes) or picks specifically to supplement his ability to engage and move around in fights (e.g. Wisp), it's not all that easy for him to stay on targets once those BKB charges go down.

He's quite good at a secondary frontline core with a primary back-line damage dealer, but given that there's not really a place to lane him other than safe lane, it means you need a pretty specific draft with a mid- or off-lane damage-dealing lategame core, and even then you have to look at the situation for whether it suit's Sven's raw up-front damage over someone like Doom who has more flexibility and usefulness against specific heroes.

So he's a good pick in the right circumstances, but a little bit uncomfortable to pick for, and comparatively easy to pick against.


Sounds like something EG could run with Fear, like they did Ursa with Weaver (I think) mid.

well old EG was actually the team that ran stuff like sven,enigma,ds,etc for the longest time even tho nobody else did.
they fucking sucked tho
u gotta farm
Hagen0
Profile Joined June 2013
Germany765 Posts
April 23 2014 00:36 GMT
#104002
I don't feel arc warden is overpowered. Strong yes but no more than that. Maybe I am underestimating stuff like double necro fast pushing with mines for cover.

Oracle on the other hand is bonkers.
Jinxed
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States6450 Posts
April 23 2014 00:45 GMT
#104003
I think Oracle is being a bit overhyped. Yes Fate's Edict is on a 3 second cooldown, but in order to make the most of it you need the other 2 spells first.

False Promise is strong and I wouldn't be shocked to see a CD/Duration nerf to it, but as far as I can see he's hardly on the pubstomp level of Earth Spirit and is going to be another hero that takes some time to learn.
LiquidDota Staff"LeLoup is a great name pls undo." -Liquid`Nazgul
rebdomine
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
6040 Posts
April 23 2014 00:54 GMT
#104004
On April 23 2014 08:55 ControlMonkey wrote:
Funny that Wraith King has 1 active skill, but then you need to tread swap, armlet toggle, use wand charges to get mana for ult, blink, use blade mail...


Well I suppose he's a good starting point if you wanted to get used to using item actives, as you only really have one skill to worry about.
"Just because you are correct doesn't mean you are right!"
SKC
Profile Joined October 2010
Brazil18828 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-23 01:00:31
April 23 2014 00:57 GMT
#104005
On April 23 2014 09:45 LeLoup wrote:
I think Oracle is being a bit overhyped. Yes Fate's Edict is on a 3 second cooldown, but in order to make the most of it you need the other 2 spells first.

False Promise is strong and I wouldn't be shocked to see a CD/Duration nerf to it, but as far as I can see he's hardly on the pubstomp level of Earth Spirit and is going to be another hero that takes some time to learn.

Flames/Purge/Flames is still a 1060 nuke, 800 at lvl 7. Finger does 600 at lvl 1, for comparison. Its pretty strong, and there is also his ult, and heals for the lane. He is not a win the game by yourself hero like Zet, but I expect him to be like old wisp, stacks playing the hero well being almost unbeatable.

He can also heal you for 88 HP per second stacking two flames in a single fate´s edict. Alchemist ult at lvl 16 heals for 100.
FinestHour
Profile Joined August 2010
United States18466 Posts
April 23 2014 01:03 GMT
#104006
does he still solo roshan or did that finally get fixed
thug life.                                                       MVP/ex-
LuckoftheIrish
Profile Joined November 2011
United States4791 Posts
April 23 2014 01:35 GMT
#104007
On April 23 2014 07:30 Sbrubbles wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 23 2014 07:03 TheYango wrote:
The thing is with Sven is that he's not really threatening by himself given his comparatively low mobility. He has a powerful 10s BKB timing, but unless your team really has the appropriate means to let him stand and do damage (e.g. DS, Magnus kind of heroes) or picks specifically to supplement his ability to engage and move around in fights (e.g. Wisp), it's not all that easy for him to stay on targets once those BKB charges go down.

He's quite good at a secondary frontline core with a primary back-line damage dealer, but given that there's not really a place to lane him other than safe lane, it means you need a pretty specific draft with a mid- or off-lane damage-dealing lategame core, and even then you have to look at the situation for whether it suit's Sven's raw up-front damage over someone like Doom who has more flexibility and usefulness against specific heroes.

So he's a good pick in the right circumstances, but a little bit uncomfortable to pick for, and comparatively easy to pick against.


Sounds like something EG could run with Fear, like they did Ursa with Weaver (I think) mid.

My thought was EG, too, with zai playing the Sven basically the same way they run WK. It won't happen, though, just because Fear likes the hero too much to let someone else play it.
On Twitter @GosuGamers_LotI | Grubby has a huge head!
LuckoftheIrish
Profile Joined November 2011
United States4791 Posts
April 23 2014 01:39 GMT
#104008
On April 23 2014 02:37 Sn0_Man wrote:
Well, 0 cast point heroes are inherently more fun.

Also ES and Phoenix both have precise enough skill shots that they can't really afford real cast points (above say .2). LoL style


I don't play enough ES to say anything about his kit, but Phoenix could easily have small cast times added to all its skills except the actual usage of the Spirits.
On Twitter @GosuGamers_LotI | Grubby has a huge head!
Targe
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United Kingdom14103 Posts
April 23 2014 01:41 GMT
#104009
mid dazzle, wtf am i doing?
11/5/14 CATACLYSM | The South West's worst Falco main
SnowfaLL
Profile Joined December 2008
Canada730 Posts
April 23 2014 02:10 GMT
#104010
On April 23 2014 10:35 LuckoftheIrish wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 23 2014 07:30 Sbrubbles wrote:
On April 23 2014 07:03 TheYango wrote:
The thing is with Sven is that he's not really threatening by himself given his comparatively low mobility. He has a powerful 10s BKB timing, but unless your team really has the appropriate means to let him stand and do damage (e.g. DS, Magnus kind of heroes) or picks specifically to supplement his ability to engage and move around in fights (e.g. Wisp), it's not all that easy for him to stay on targets once those BKB charges go down.

He's quite good at a secondary frontline core with a primary back-line damage dealer, but given that there's not really a place to lane him other than safe lane, it means you need a pretty specific draft with a mid- or off-lane damage-dealing lategame core, and even then you have to look at the situation for whether it suit's Sven's raw up-front damage over someone like Doom who has more flexibility and usefulness against specific heroes.

So he's a good pick in the right circumstances, but a little bit uncomfortable to pick for, and comparatively easy to pick against.


Sounds like something EG could run with Fear, like they did Ursa with Weaver (I think) mid.

My thought was EG, too, with zai playing the Sven basically the same way they run WK. It won't happen, though, just because Fear likes the hero too much to let someone else play it.


I've been playing a lot of Sven and WK support in MM because you can create space for your carry / control and win the earlygame, but also turn into the lategame carry if you notice your team sucks. It's a great medium and I still think its the only way to consistently win as support-only in MM. Other similar heroes such as Mirana, Necrophos and Alch are my mainstays lately too for carry potential from the 4/5 position.
Favorites: Moon, Grubby, Naniwa, TAiLS, viOLeT, DongRaeGu
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-23 02:21:03
April 23 2014 02:19 GMT
#104011
On April 23 2014 09:36 Hagen0 wrote:
I don't feel arc warden is overpowered. Strong yes but no more than that. Maybe I am underestimating stuff like double necro fast pushing with mines for cover.

He doesn't need mines for cover. Double Necro + Rapier Arc Warden takes towers faster than anything with zero risk because he outright never needs to show his own face--only his clone and a clone with Rapier breaks towers stupid fast for something that gives no reward when killed.

Even if we're playing in a setting where he kind of cares about getting caught he can still get Manta over Rapier and push with 4 x Necro 4x Illusions + Clone (you get Rapier in pubs because who the fuck cares about losing a pub and Rapier is just more fun because who the fuck wouldn't buy a Rapier on a hero who can use it without risk of dropping it). It's rat Dota on a level you've never seen before with any current hero, and it's on a support who didn't even need to take a core farming position because his farm explodes with double Midas anyway.
Moderator
icystorage
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Jollibee19350 Posts
April 23 2014 02:28 GMT
#104012
yango hold me. im scared
LiquidDota StaffAre you ready for a Miracle-? We are! The International 2017 Champions!
Stancel
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
Singapore15360 Posts
April 23 2014 02:28 GMT
#104013
I had to double check to see if it was really Yango.

Sounds like a hero that'll make me stay away from AP.
ffxiv enjoyer
Jinxed
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States6450 Posts
April 23 2014 02:30 GMT
#104014
On April 23 2014 10:41 Targe wrote:
mid dazzle, wtf am i doing?


Being a baller clearly. Mid dazzle is just too good.
LiquidDota Staff"LeLoup is a great name pls undo." -Liquid`Nazgul
Skullflower
Profile Joined July 2010
United States3779 Posts
April 23 2014 02:33 GMT
#104015
On April 23 2014 10:41 Targe wrote:
mid dazzle, wtf am i doing?


mid dazzle is awesome
The ruminations are mine, let the world be yours.
FinestHour
Profile Joined August 2010
United States18466 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-23 02:38:01
April 23 2014 02:37 GMT
#104016
http://dotabuff.com/matches/196954636

mid dazzle is awesome
thug life.                                                       MVP/ex-
rebdomine
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
6040 Posts
April 23 2014 02:40 GMT
#104017
On April 23 2014 11:37 FinestHour wrote:
http://dotabuff.com/matches/196954636

mid dazzle is awesome


nice fat puck avatar
"Just because you are correct doesn't mean you are right!"
FinestHour
Profile Joined August 2010
United States18466 Posts
April 23 2014 02:44 GMT
#104018
based
thug life.                                                       MVP/ex-
Weasel-
Profile Joined June 2009
Canada1556 Posts
April 23 2014 03:02 GMT
#104019
On April 23 2014 07:30 Sbrubbles wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 23 2014 07:03 TheYango wrote:
The thing is with Sven is that he's not really threatening by himself given his comparatively low mobility. He has a powerful 10s BKB timing, but unless your team really has the appropriate means to let him stand and do damage (e.g. DS, Magnus kind of heroes) or picks specifically to supplement his ability to engage and move around in fights (e.g. Wisp), it's not all that easy for him to stay on targets once those BKB charges go down.

He's quite good at a secondary frontline core with a primary back-line damage dealer, but given that there's not really a place to lane him other than safe lane, it means you need a pretty specific draft with a mid- or off-lane damage-dealing lategame core, and even then you have to look at the situation for whether it suit's Sven's raw up-front damage over someone like Doom who has more flexibility and usefulness against specific heroes.

So he's a good pick in the right circumstances, but a little bit uncomfortable to pick for, and comparatively easy to pick against.


Sounds like something EG could run with Fear, like they did Ursa with Weaver (I think) mid.


EG ran RTZ mid Sven at least once, although he was more of an initiator who rushed blink and maxed stun then warcry before cleave (can't remember if he even got cleave).
Targe
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United Kingdom14103 Posts
April 23 2014 03:13 GMT
#104020
i failed at playing a non support dazzle friends

i have failed you all

apparently he needs at least 1 hp item and rushing orchid is bad
11/5/14 CATACLYSM | The South West's worst Falco main
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