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On August 31 2013 23:24 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2013 23:19 Unleashing wrote:On August 31 2013 23:15 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 22:54 dartoo wrote:On August 31 2013 22:00 Unleashing wrote:Lmfao at naniwa. "I want to laugh at ppl who win no skill moba tournaments thinkin they are kings" He even compared winning TI3 to winning lotto, calling it random/no-skill. Loda replying with "Nice to hear how you feel. To think you wanted to stay in the same house as 5 lottery winners...  " http://www.tv6.se/blog/naniwa/skill-sc2-och-moba-spelHe talked a lot about how easy the game was, yet i don't think he could even make it to a C-tier team with his personality LOL. Although I can totally see him saying something like this...Are we getting the context right? Maybe he said it as a joke or something.. No. He said that he played a lot of dota 1, but its a lot simpler game than to Starcraft. And it wont ever get any respect in his eyes. He also says that he laughs at people winning the International and then thinking themselves the king, not knowing how easy their game is. And tbh, he does have a point. Dota IS an easier game than starcraft by far. There is skill involves of course, but it doesn't require 400 apm and a chesslike way of thinking. It requires Micro and Teamwork instead of Macro, Micro and deep strategy. And this is coming from someone who loves dota 2 and have completely abandoned sc2 because of it It doesn't require less skill and isn't an easier game. It requires a completely different skill-set and having good synergy is hard as fuck and requires a fuck-ton of work and dedication. It doesn't matter if your mechanics are flawless if you can't function as a team. Dude. I love dota 2 more than most and I play it 50 hours a week. But it IS easier than starcraft 2. It just is. There is a lot of knowledge required to play dota 2, a lot of micro being required to practice, and a ton of teamwork. But it all comes down to controlling one hero, sometimes with minions. But I think you're misunderstanding "easier" for "easy". I could never be the best in dota, just like I could never be the best in sc2. They both require putting in infinitely amount of hours and hard work. But that doesn't mean sc2 pro's wont look at dota and go: "With a bit of practice, I can do that." While dota pro's look at sc2 progames and go "whoa. That is amazing. I could never do that". And this is also the reason why a lot of sc2 pro's have switched to ARTS, although being LoL and not Dota  While absolutely not a single moba/arts pro have ever switched to sc2 (If there is one, I'd like to know)
I seriously doubt any SC2 pro can just switch to Dota and be sucessful with a bit of practice. I certainly don't know anyone that did it. And we do have players that switched from Dota to SC2, such as Babyknight and IceIceIce for a period of time, and they were fairly sucessful.
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SC2 is a lot easier to learn than Dota2, game sense and understanding strategies takes far longer to really develop compared to build orders and mechanical ability. Ofc top levels of SC2 need more than pure mechanics but they can take you pretty far all the same. It's also fun to say things like 'hurrr 1 hero' but what you have to do with that single hero is far more complex than what you do with a single marine.
Which game is harder at the high levels of competition, I can't say.
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On August 31 2013 23:29 hadang wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2013 23:27 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 23:26 hadang wrote:On August 31 2013 23:24 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 23:19 Unleashing wrote:On August 31 2013 23:15 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 22:54 dartoo wrote:On August 31 2013 22:00 Unleashing wrote:Lmfao at naniwa. "I want to laugh at ppl who win no skill moba tournaments thinkin they are kings" He even compared winning TI3 to winning lotto, calling it random/no-skill. Loda replying with "Nice to hear how you feel. To think you wanted to stay in the same house as 5 lottery winners... " http://www.tv6.se/blog/naniwa/skill-sc2-och-moba-spelHe talked a lot about how easy the game was, yet i don't think he could even make it to a C-tier team with his personality LOL. Although I can totally see him saying something like this...Are we getting the context right? Maybe he said it as a joke or something.. No. He said that he played a lot of dota 1, but its a lot simpler game than to Starcraft. And it wont ever get any respect in his eyes. He also says that he laughs at people winning the International and then thinking themselves the king, not knowing how easy their game is. And tbh, he does have a point. Dota IS an easier game than starcraft by far. There is skill involves of course, but it doesn't require 400 apm and a chesslike way of thinking. It requires Micro and Teamwork instead of Macro, Micro and deep strategy. And this is coming from someone who loves dota 2 and have completely abandoned sc2 because of it It doesn't require less skill and isn't an easier game. It requires a completely different skill-set and having good synergy is hard as fuck and requires a fuck-ton of work and dedication. It doesn't matter if your mechanics are flawless if you can't function as a team. But it all comes down to controlling one hero, sometimes with minions. And that is where you are wrong. Oh I'm sorry, is your name Flash and you're controlling all 5 heroes in the same game? ??? The point is , even if you could control your hero perfectly, you are still far away from winning. Mechanically controlling the hero is a pretty minor part of dota
You misunderstand again. Even over such a simple sentence. ALL you do in dota is control your hero. Yes, you require vast knowledge of all the items, spells, heroes and combination of those to know HOW to move, but it still comes down to moving your hero. Don't misunderstand this for "micro" being everything required to play dota. That is, like you said, a pretty minor part of it.
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On August 31 2013 23:37 Excludos wrote:
ALL you do in dota is control your hero.
Lmfao.
Just lmfao.
Seriously buddy? All you do in dota is control your hero?
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Russian Federation4050 Posts
Yay for more pointless Dota - SC comparisons!
We just need to get Treant and PL in the mix for it to be the greatest discussion of all time.
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Interesting discussion for sure.
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On August 31 2013 23:27 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2013 23:26 hadang wrote:On August 31 2013 23:24 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 23:19 Unleashing wrote:On August 31 2013 23:15 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 22:54 dartoo wrote:On August 31 2013 22:00 Unleashing wrote:Lmfao at naniwa. "I want to laugh at ppl who win no skill moba tournaments thinkin they are kings" He even compared winning TI3 to winning lotto, calling it random/no-skill. Loda replying with "Nice to hear how you feel. To think you wanted to stay in the same house as 5 lottery winners... " http://www.tv6.se/blog/naniwa/skill-sc2-och-moba-spelHe talked a lot about how easy the game was, yet i don't think he could even make it to a C-tier team with his personality LOL. Although I can totally see him saying something like this...Are we getting the context right? Maybe he said it as a joke or something.. No. He said that he played a lot of dota 1, but its a lot simpler game than to Starcraft. And it wont ever get any respect in his eyes. He also says that he laughs at people winning the International and then thinking themselves the king, not knowing how easy their game is. And tbh, he does have a point. Dota IS an easier game than starcraft by far. There is skill involves of course, but it doesn't require 400 apm and a chesslike way of thinking. It requires Micro and Teamwork instead of Macro, Micro and deep strategy. And this is coming from someone who loves dota 2 and have completely abandoned sc2 because of it It doesn't require less skill and isn't an easier game. It requires a completely different skill-set and having good synergy is hard as fuck and requires a fuck-ton of work and dedication. It doesn't matter if your mechanics are flawless if you can't function as a team. But it all comes down to controlling one hero, sometimes with minions. And that is where you are wrong. Oh I'm sorry, is your name Flash and you're controlling all 5 heroes in the same game?
Let's assume that "perfect" control is not achievable (by humans). Also to simplify things let's just say that control = positioning.
Yes, it's easier to position one unit than it's to position 10 zealots/marines/...
On the other hand - if one of those zealots/marines is slightly out of position it doesnt matter as much as when your one hero is slightly out of position.
It's easier to achieve, but it gets punished harder. Thus it's more important / requires more player resources (APM to correct the position, thinking if it's not better to move half an inch in another direction, ...).
To say one is easier, because of that is ... strange. They're just different things, requiring different approaches.
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http://www.tv6.se/blog/naniwa/skill-sc2-och-moba-spel
Sorry if I get something wrong. I'm actually Norwegian and not Swedish which this article is. While the languages are very similar, some words might be different. Also my English is terrible. Sry 
Translation:
I started playing Warcraft 3 many years ago while I was attending school. Even since the 7 year (in school) I remember it, and even before that. But it became more serious the older I got, and the more I understood the more I got pulled towards gaming because I have always liked challenges.
Time flies and my parents had only one condition: That I finished High School, and then I could do whatever I wanted with my life. This was about the time that Starcraft 2 came along, and I could feel I wanted to give being professional a chance. I thought since I played wc3 on a pretty decent level I should have a bit of potential, but I quickly realized that the world is a much bigger place than I ever imagined. There was a lot good players than I had realized. I started in Germany where grew a lot as a player, while later having a really bad experience when kicked from EPS. But I have never been a person who quits because of a defeat. No matter how bad it gets I never give up. Thats one of my biggest abilities in life. I won MLG Dallas quickly after, and I thought I was at the top, I was there. I was the best in the world. But little did I know it was only the beginning.
Next MLG 4 or 6 koreans showed up, and I got crushed. All other foreigners got crushed too. It was a "wake-up" call I didn't think would happen like it did.
I had for the first time realized that it was much bigger than anything in Warcraft or any other game. I understood this then, and realized that the only thing I could do was give up or travel to Korea and play with the best. I chose the latter, like most knows since I don't like giving up, but this was the first taste of a proper competition. It feels weird knowing that being the best foreigner was only the first step on the road to becoming a really good player.
(this is the part people are talking about next)
I'm not sure what more I should say about this right now, but I wanted to share my view on gaming. I played a lot of Dota 1 under my wc3 time and I know what a simple game it is compared to Starcraft, same with LoL. These games will never get any bigger respect in my eyes since they never understand the real competition in gaming. Or well. LoL players seems to understand how to get crushed by Koreans, even in a game with such low skillcap.
When I look at tournaments like LCS, The International etc. I compare it to winning in lotto. It seems like there is a ton of nice guys in dota that doesn't deserve any hate. I don't mean to attack anyone personally. But when I hear about people winning ten thousands of dollars in an American moba-tournament and they think themselves kings, I just want to laugh at how easy their game is compared.
Everyone is of course welcome to play any kind of game you want be it Sims, WC3, SC2, CS etc. But to try to compare to play in Wimbledon in Tennis with playing with a JoJo is like I view comparing Sc2 and Moba. Its not the real competition in my eyes.
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nani is entitled to his opinion. No use attacking him for it.
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What the...
I got a Heirloom of the Temple Priestess and a Strange Shoulders of the Commets Tail just randomly got tagged with Diretide 2012 and TI2 repectivly. I'm pretty sure that they didn't have the tags when I got them, and I certainly didn't play Dota2 during Diretide 2012. Not that I mind, everything is just so weid ...
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On August 31 2013 23:33 SKC wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2013 23:24 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 23:19 Unleashing wrote:On August 31 2013 23:15 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 22:54 dartoo wrote:On August 31 2013 22:00 Unleashing wrote:Lmfao at naniwa. "I want to laugh at ppl who win no skill moba tournaments thinkin they are kings" He even compared winning TI3 to winning lotto, calling it random/no-skill. Loda replying with "Nice to hear how you feel. To think you wanted to stay in the same house as 5 lottery winners... " http://www.tv6.se/blog/naniwa/skill-sc2-och-moba-spelHe talked a lot about how easy the game was, yet i don't think he could even make it to a C-tier team with his personality LOL. Although I can totally see him saying something like this...Are we getting the context right? Maybe he said it as a joke or something.. No. He said that he played a lot of dota 1, but its a lot simpler game than to Starcraft. And it wont ever get any respect in his eyes. He also says that he laughs at people winning the International and then thinking themselves the king, not knowing how easy their game is. And tbh, he does have a point. Dota IS an easier game than starcraft by far. There is skill involves of course, but it doesn't require 400 apm and a chesslike way of thinking. It requires Micro and Teamwork instead of Macro, Micro and deep strategy. And this is coming from someone who loves dota 2 and have completely abandoned sc2 because of it It doesn't require less skill and isn't an easier game. It requires a completely different skill-set and having good synergy is hard as fuck and requires a fuck-ton of work and dedication. It doesn't matter if your mechanics are flawless if you can't function as a team. Dude. I love dota 2 more than most and I play it 50 hours a week. But it IS easier than starcraft 2. It just is. There is a lot of knowledge required to play dota 2, a lot of micro being required to practice, and a ton of teamwork. But it all comes down to controlling one hero, sometimes with minions. But I think you're misunderstanding "easier" for "easy". I could never be the best in dota, just like I could never be the best in sc2. They both require putting in infinitely amount of hours and hard work. But that doesn't mean sc2 pro's wont look at dota and go: "With a bit of practice, I can do that." While dota pro's look at sc2 progames and go "whoa. That is amazing. I could never do that". And this is also the reason why a lot of sc2 pro's have switched to ARTS, although being LoL and not Dota While absolutely not a single moba/arts pro have ever switched to sc2 (If there is one, I'd like to know) I seriously doubt any SC2 pro can just switch to Dota and be sucessful with a bit of practice. I certainly don't know anyone that did it. And we do have players that switched from Dota to SC2, such as Babyknight and IceIceIce for a period of time, and they were fairly sucessful.
Testie went from BW to HoN.
I have no doubt that top players of either game could be very good at the other game, but being at the top level at either requires a good amount of dedication and patience which not all players may not have , we can see a lot of BW to SC2 players lose their passion for the game, 13abyKnight lost interest in pro Dota2, but iceiceice didn't.
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On August 31 2013 23:50 WindWolf wrote:
What the...
I got a Heirloom of the Temple Priestess and a Strange Shoulders of the Commets Tail just randomly got tagged with Diretide 2012 and TI2 repectivly. I'm pretty sure that they didn't have the tags when I got them, and I certainly didn't play Dota2 during Diretide 2012. Not that I mind, everything is just so weid ...
Bug, will probably be fixed soon.
I have a S&Y tagged with TI2 twice, should only have 1 tag.
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On August 31 2013 23:24 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2013 23:19 Unleashing wrote:On August 31 2013 23:15 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 22:54 dartoo wrote:On August 31 2013 22:00 Unleashing wrote:Lmfao at naniwa. "I want to laugh at ppl who win no skill moba tournaments thinkin they are kings" He even compared winning TI3 to winning lotto, calling it random/no-skill. Loda replying with "Nice to hear how you feel. To think you wanted to stay in the same house as 5 lottery winners... " http://www.tv6.se/blog/naniwa/skill-sc2-och-moba-spelHe talked a lot about how easy the game was, yet i don't think he could even make it to a C-tier team with his personality LOL. Although I can totally see him saying something like this...Are we getting the context right? Maybe he said it as a joke or something.. No. He said that he played a lot of dota 1, but its a lot simpler game than to Starcraft. And it wont ever get any respect in his eyes. He also says that he laughs at people winning the International and then thinking themselves the king, not knowing how easy their game is. And tbh, he does have a point. Dota IS an easier game than starcraft by far. There is skill involves of course, but it doesn't require 400 apm and a chesslike way of thinking. It requires Micro and Teamwork instead of Macro, Micro and deep strategy. And this is coming from someone who loves dota 2 and have completely abandoned sc2 because of it It doesn't require less skill and isn't an easier game. It requires a completely different skill-set and having good synergy is hard as fuck and requires a fuck-ton of work and dedication. It doesn't matter if your mechanics are flawless if you can't function as a team. Dude. I love dota 2 more than most and I play it 50 hours a week. But it IS easier than starcraft 2. It just is. There is a lot of knowledge required to play dota 2, a lot of micro being required to practice, and a ton of teamwork. But it all comes down to controlling one hero, sometimes with minions. But I think you're misunderstanding "easier" for "easy". I could never be the best in dota, just like I could never be the best in sc2. They both require putting in infinitely amount of hours and hard work. But that doesn't mean sc2 pro's wont look at dota and go: "With a bit of practice, I can do that." While dota pro's look at sc2 progames and go "whoa. That is amazing. I could never do that". And this is also the reason why a lot of sc2 pro's have switched to ARTS, although being LoL and not Dota While absolutely not a single moba/arts pro have ever switched to sc2 (If there is one, I'd like to know)
You can not be serious.
DOTA2 is by no means easier than SC2, i'd agree if you said that it is easier than SC:BW, but not SC2, one of the reasons why "moba"/"arts" games are getting so much attention nowadays is because SC2 failed SC:BW fans who expected a difficult game.
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On August 31 2013 23:51 rabidch wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2013 23:33 SKC wrote:On August 31 2013 23:24 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 23:19 Unleashing wrote:On August 31 2013 23:15 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 22:54 dartoo wrote:On August 31 2013 22:00 Unleashing wrote:Lmfao at naniwa. "I want to laugh at ppl who win no skill moba tournaments thinkin they are kings" He even compared winning TI3 to winning lotto, calling it random/no-skill. Loda replying with "Nice to hear how you feel. To think you wanted to stay in the same house as 5 lottery winners... " http://www.tv6.se/blog/naniwa/skill-sc2-och-moba-spelHe talked a lot about how easy the game was, yet i don't think he could even make it to a C-tier team with his personality LOL. Although I can totally see him saying something like this...Are we getting the context right? Maybe he said it as a joke or something.. No. He said that he played a lot of dota 1, but its a lot simpler game than to Starcraft. And it wont ever get any respect in his eyes. He also says that he laughs at people winning the International and then thinking themselves the king, not knowing how easy their game is. And tbh, he does have a point. Dota IS an easier game than starcraft by far. There is skill involves of course, but it doesn't require 400 apm and a chesslike way of thinking. It requires Micro and Teamwork instead of Macro, Micro and deep strategy. And this is coming from someone who loves dota 2 and have completely abandoned sc2 because of it It doesn't require less skill and isn't an easier game. It requires a completely different skill-set and having good synergy is hard as fuck and requires a fuck-ton of work and dedication. It doesn't matter if your mechanics are flawless if you can't function as a team. Dude. I love dota 2 more than most and I play it 50 hours a week. But it IS easier than starcraft 2. It just is. There is a lot of knowledge required to play dota 2, a lot of micro being required to practice, and a ton of teamwork. But it all comes down to controlling one hero, sometimes with minions. But I think you're misunderstanding "easier" for "easy". I could never be the best in dota, just like I could never be the best in sc2. They both require putting in infinitely amount of hours and hard work. But that doesn't mean sc2 pro's wont look at dota and go: "With a bit of practice, I can do that." While dota pro's look at sc2 progames and go "whoa. That is amazing. I could never do that". And this is also the reason why a lot of sc2 pro's have switched to ARTS, although being LoL and not Dota While absolutely not a single moba/arts pro have ever switched to sc2 (If there is one, I'd like to know) I seriously doubt any SC2 pro can just switch to Dota and be sucessful with a bit of practice. I certainly don't know anyone that did it. And we do have players that switched from Dota to SC2, such as Babyknight and IceIceIce for a period of time, and they were fairly sucessful. Testie went from BW to HoN. I have no doubt that top players of either game could be very good at the other game, but being at the top level at either requires a good amount of dedication and patience which not all players may not have .
Well if you're naturally good at competitive games it generally means you have good reflexes and hand-eye coordination. Obviously those skills carry over to other video games if you devote 10 hours a day playing something else.
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On August 31 2013 23:52 Unleashing wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2013 23:50 WindWolf wrote:
What the...
I got a Heirloom of the Temple Priestess and a Strange Shoulders of the Commets Tail just randomly got tagged with Diretide 2012 and TI2 repectivly. I'm pretty sure that they didn't have the tags when I got them, and I certainly didn't play Dota2 during Diretide 2012. Not that I mind, everything is just so weid ... Bug, will probably be fixed soon. I have a S&Y tagged with TI2 twice, should only have 1 tag.
Hopefully it is.
The closest thing that I can think of is that when I was looking to make some trade here, someone asked if my Heirloom had the Diretide 2012 tag
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On August 31 2013 23:33 SKC wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2013 23:24 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 23:19 Unleashing wrote:On August 31 2013 23:15 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 22:54 dartoo wrote:On August 31 2013 22:00 Unleashing wrote:Lmfao at naniwa. "I want to laugh at ppl who win no skill moba tournaments thinkin they are kings" He even compared winning TI3 to winning lotto, calling it random/no-skill. Loda replying with "Nice to hear how you feel. To think you wanted to stay in the same house as 5 lottery winners... " http://www.tv6.se/blog/naniwa/skill-sc2-och-moba-spelHe talked a lot about how easy the game was, yet i don't think he could even make it to a C-tier team with his personality LOL. Although I can totally see him saying something like this...Are we getting the context right? Maybe he said it as a joke or something.. No. He said that he played a lot of dota 1, but its a lot simpler game than to Starcraft. And it wont ever get any respect in his eyes. He also says that he laughs at people winning the International and then thinking themselves the king, not knowing how easy their game is. And tbh, he does have a point. Dota IS an easier game than starcraft by far. There is skill involves of course, but it doesn't require 400 apm and a chesslike way of thinking. It requires Micro and Teamwork instead of Macro, Micro and deep strategy. And this is coming from someone who loves dota 2 and have completely abandoned sc2 because of it It doesn't require less skill and isn't an easier game. It requires a completely different skill-set and having good synergy is hard as fuck and requires a fuck-ton of work and dedication. It doesn't matter if your mechanics are flawless if you can't function as a team. Dude. I love dota 2 more than most and I play it 50 hours a week. But it IS easier than starcraft 2. It just is. There is a lot of knowledge required to play dota 2, a lot of micro being required to practice, and a ton of teamwork. But it all comes down to controlling one hero, sometimes with minions. But I think you're misunderstanding "easier" for "easy". I could never be the best in dota, just like I could never be the best in sc2. They both require putting in infinitely amount of hours and hard work. But that doesn't mean sc2 pro's wont look at dota and go: "With a bit of practice, I can do that." While dota pro's look at sc2 progames and go "whoa. That is amazing. I could never do that". And this is also the reason why a lot of sc2 pro's have switched to ARTS, although being LoL and not Dota While absolutely not a single moba/arts pro have ever switched to sc2 (If there is one, I'd like to know) I seriously doubt any SC2 pro can just switch to Dota and be sucessful with a bit of practice. I certainly don't know anyone that did it. And we do have players that switched from Dota to SC2, such as Babyknight and IceIceIce for a period of time, and they were fairly sucessful.
Let him think what he wants; Select switched from sc2 to dota, and even though he had played a ton of dota1 he was still one of the worst in the scene for the half year or so he played. They're different breeds, and while excludos is allowed to think what he wants ... I think trying to compare the two is stupid and I think calling one harder than the other shows that you don't really understand either game
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I try to avoid these debates because they're always fruitless, but I figured why not (updated status)
I feel SC2 is harder than Dota purely on the basis that gathering and maintaining information on your opponent is a lot easier and some facets of the heroes and pace of the game can be determined within the initial selection and first few minutes.
The rest is pretty unique of each game and even including the above; it's difficult to really compare the two. They have their exclusive difficulties, I think some people tend to forget what those are.
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On August 31 2013 23:15 Excludos wrote:
And tbh, he does have a point. Dota IS an easier game than starcraft by far. There is skill involves of course, but it doesn't require 400 apm and a chesslike way of thinking.
Starcraft 2 doesn't require 400 apm either.
I honestly think that SC2 is automatically (and unfairly) credited with many of the properties Brood War had just because it's the sequel in the same series. It is not an exceptionally challenging game mechanically, and in that specific category it is very much comparable to not only Dota, but a good number of different games out there.
(yes I hate myself for adding to this discussion, but fuck it)
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On August 31 2013 23:56 Testuser wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2013 23:33 SKC wrote:On August 31 2013 23:24 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 23:19 Unleashing wrote:On August 31 2013 23:15 Excludos wrote:On August 31 2013 22:54 dartoo wrote:On August 31 2013 22:00 Unleashing wrote:Lmfao at naniwa. "I want to laugh at ppl who win no skill moba tournaments thinkin they are kings" He even compared winning TI3 to winning lotto, calling it random/no-skill. Loda replying with "Nice to hear how you feel. To think you wanted to stay in the same house as 5 lottery winners... " http://www.tv6.se/blog/naniwa/skill-sc2-och-moba-spelHe talked a lot about how easy the game was, yet i don't think he could even make it to a C-tier team with his personality LOL. Although I can totally see him saying something like this...Are we getting the context right? Maybe he said it as a joke or something.. No. He said that he played a lot of dota 1, but its a lot simpler game than to Starcraft. And it wont ever get any respect in his eyes. He also says that he laughs at people winning the International and then thinking themselves the king, not knowing how easy their game is. And tbh, he does have a point. Dota IS an easier game than starcraft by far. There is skill involves of course, but it doesn't require 400 apm and a chesslike way of thinking. It requires Micro and Teamwork instead of Macro, Micro and deep strategy. And this is coming from someone who loves dota 2 and have completely abandoned sc2 because of it It doesn't require less skill and isn't an easier game. It requires a completely different skill-set and having good synergy is hard as fuck and requires a fuck-ton of work and dedication. It doesn't matter if your mechanics are flawless if you can't function as a team. Dude. I love dota 2 more than most and I play it 50 hours a week. But it IS easier than starcraft 2. It just is. There is a lot of knowledge required to play dota 2, a lot of micro being required to practice, and a ton of teamwork. But it all comes down to controlling one hero, sometimes with minions. But I think you're misunderstanding "easier" for "easy". I could never be the best in dota, just like I could never be the best in sc2. They both require putting in infinitely amount of hours and hard work. But that doesn't mean sc2 pro's wont look at dota and go: "With a bit of practice, I can do that." While dota pro's look at sc2 progames and go "whoa. That is amazing. I could never do that". And this is also the reason why a lot of sc2 pro's have switched to ARTS, although being LoL and not Dota While absolutely not a single moba/arts pro have ever switched to sc2 (If there is one, I'd like to know) I seriously doubt any SC2 pro can just switch to Dota and be sucessful with a bit of practice. I certainly don't know anyone that did it. And we do have players that switched from Dota to SC2, such as Babyknight and IceIceIce for a period of time, and they were fairly sucessful. Let him think what he wants; Select switched from sc2 to dota, and even though he had played a ton of dota1 he was still one of the worst in the scene for the half year or so he played. They're different breeds, and while excludos is allowed to think what he wants ... I think trying to compare the two is stupid and I think calling one harder than the other shows that you don't really understand either game
Ok. Sure. its not "he's entitled to his opinion", its "he understands nothing". Even though I was one of the best sc2 players in norway for a while (long time ago, I admit), and I'm currently playing more dota than I'm attending school and work combined. You're entitled to your opinion as well, but don't go around trashing other because it differs from them.
On August 31 2013 23:54 Kaniol wrote:
DOTA2 is by no means easier than SC2, i'd agree if you said that it is easier than SC:BW, but not SC2, one of the reasons why "moba"/"arts" games are getting so much attention nowadays is because SC2 failed SC:BW fans who expected a difficult game.
I wholeheartedly agree. SC2 is much easier game than BW ever was. But I still think Arts games would have been getting the same attention no matter what skillcap sc2 has, because its generally a very entertaining game to watch. I still think sc2 is harder to play than dota is. I also think Dota is harder to play than LoL (a lot more people will agree with me on this one), even though you can't really switch between them and be good instantly there either.
edit: I also agree that this is a stupid conversation and I'm being stupid for adding to it.
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What is the significance of a game being harder than another? Pro players do not play against the game, they play against other pro players. The difficulty of winning either starcraft or dota is how hard your opponent is, not how hard your game is.
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EPT
