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General Discussion - Page 3595

Forum Index > Dota 2 General
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IRC chatter should remain in IRC - http://webchat.quakenet.org/?channels=tl.dota2

Posts that relate to topics with their own thread, such as in News, Tournaments or Strategy should go in those threads.
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-15 06:23:06
August 15 2013 06:22 GMT
#71881
Is anyone else camping the valve store to wait for microplushie restocks?
I swear i check like 8 times a day
Kaniol
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Poland5551 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-15 06:46:46
August 15 2013 06:44 GMT
#71882
I'll tell you guys an anecdote: so European person goes to sleep, wakes up and sees GD full of math discussion. Yes, that's how serious it got!

Also speaking of infinity i remember that on studies i've been taught that there are 2 concepts of infinity and both have their flaws so none is ruled out yet, so this may explain the difference in your opinions :x
sandyph
Profile Joined September 2010
Indonesia1640 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-15 06:55:22
August 15 2013 06:45 GMT
#71883
On August 15 2013 00:51 PrinceXizor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 15 2013 00:48 Comeh wrote:
On August 15 2013 00:45 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 15 2013 00:41 Comeh wrote:
On August 15 2013 00:29 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 15 2013 00:26 Comeh wrote:
On August 15 2013 00:16 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 14 2013 23:37 Comeh wrote:
On August 14 2013 23:35 Firebolt145 wrote:
He was FotM a while ago when teams were still bashing their heads against his ult. Then they realised that Warlock was all about his ult and offered nothing else to the team and he quickly grew out of favour.

Not to mention he is a bit awkward to farm around as a core, and well, diffusal blade.

stating diffusal blade as a reason not to go warlock is inane. Losing half of your golems for 10 minutes isn't really an issue. and its something they had to spend thousands on.

It's not like diffusal blade is a sole purpose item - Na'Vi often used to draft juggernaut or PL against a warlock pick and get a diffusal blade earlier. I mean, you are talking about a hero where 90% of the hero is his ultimate that has a long cool down being INSTANTLY killed by one charge of an item that can continue to be used throughout the fight.

It's not that insane.

Its also not very strong or efficient to be using diffusal on a single golem. saving the charges for that puts you in shit situations, makes you adverse to upgrading the diffusal immediately, weakening your fighting overall by a quite a bit, and ceases to be useful after 10 minutes, or aghanims/refresher on warlock.

and warlock isn't 90% golem, that's just ignorance about how effective fatal bonds truly is as well as the stun initiate and about his overall damage from his autos.

On August 15 2013 00:27 Kipsate wrote:
Warlock has quite a few problems but one of the biggest ones right now is simple

he doesn't handle splitpush.

yeah and diffusal blade is probably one of the single most minor issues with warlock. thats like saying HOTD makes chen useless so teams shouldn't play chen. :/

If you are using diffusal blade on warlock, you are literally removing 75% of his effectiveness in fights, and likely are going to win that fight. Winning the fight puts you further ahead in the game, and gives you more map control, and generally makes warlock less effective as a whole (less likely to find the room to farm an aghs / refresher anyways). Essentially, if you don't do a lot with your first 2-3 golems, chances are you aren't going to win the game.

I'm not saying I would build a diffusal on any carry if I saw a warlock, but I'd be more inclined to draft a hero where diffusal is situational if I saw a warlock pick.

I'd put warlock golem as about 40% of his total effectiveness. the stun doesn't get stopped by diffusal, and fatal bonds and his autos are still active, his shadow word is still active. Diffusal just isn't a big deal to deal with as warlock. period. Its a non-issue and putting a bandaid on a stab wound.

the enemy carry shouldn't even HAVE a diffusal for the first two offerings, and the third one only if its rushed, and the warlock decides to go use it ON the carry. (the rock being dropped on the carry in that situation will still end up causing that carries death though).

I'm not sure you understand how powerful / reliant warlock is on his ultimate for the first 15-20 minutes of the game.

It's literally the entire hero (unless the gyro / spectre on your team get 4 items).

I'm not sure you understand how bad diffusal is to get as a first item immediately after boots. I also don't think you understand how warlock is played effectively.

Its literally not even the majority of the hero.


tranquil-->diffusal PL is not bad if you get free farm

On August 15 2013 14:37 Daozzt wrote:
Vanguard's not horrible on Viper but you should only get it if you're dominating your lane and its before 10 minutes.


Mek is still a much better option than vanguard
Put quote here for readability
Myrddraal
Profile Joined December 2010
Australia937 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-15 06:56:13
August 15 2013 06:56 GMT
#71884
On August 15 2013 15:22 trinxified wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 15 2013 15:20 Itsmedudeman wrote:
Not really as it gets a lot easier to kill the bear later on so the trade off is fair.


Well I mean a Level 4 bear early on is so hard to kill, at least have a trade-off to almost kill the LD afterwards

EDIT: btw is idra interesting to watch? Has he been playing dota for a while now?


Hmm, interesting to watch, but nah he definitely has not been playing long. The mmr they are at is pretty low, the KotL on the other team started bitching about Furion taking his items and vowed to start feeding... I found it entertaining anyway haha.
[stranded]: http://www.indiedb.com/games/stranded
Whole
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States6046 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-15 06:57:30
August 15 2013 06:57 GMT
#71885
IdrA confirmed that DotA 2 community is better than LoL community.

+ Show Spoiler +
He said he doesn't play enough of DotA to make a fair judgement yet
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
August 15 2013 07:35 GMT
#71886
On August 15 2013 15:45 sandyph wrote:
tranquil-->diffusal PL is not bad if you get free farm

Tranquil->Diffusal also doesn't play with the expectation of going to fights. It's mostly planning on farming/split-pushing/picking people off. You wouldn't get 1st item diffusal and then go 5-man.

On August 15 2013 14:37 Daozzt wrote:
Vanguard's not horrible on Viper but you should only get it if you're dominating your lane and its before 10 minutes.


Mek is still a much better option than vanguard[/QUOTE]
Vanguard is situationally good on Viper if you're super behind and need both Mek and Vanguard.
Moderator
BaBaUTZ
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany146 Posts
August 15 2013 07:39 GMT
#71887
On August 15 2013 16:35 TheYango wrote:
Vanguard is situationally good on Viper if you're super behind and need both Mek and Vanguard.


Isnt a naked booster better in this case?
sandyph
Profile Joined September 2010
Indonesia1640 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-15 07:44:12
August 15 2013 07:41 GMT
#71888
On August 15 2013 16:35 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 15 2013 15:45 sandyph wrote:
tranquil-->diffusal PL is not bad if you get free farm

Tranquil->Diffusal also doesn't play with the expectation of going to fights. It's mostly planning on farming/split-pushing/picking people off. You wouldn't get 1st item diffusal and then go 5-man.


yes Diffu is more about accelerating farm/split pushing since it will make the illusion clear camps/creeps faster.
would need at least another item (yasha?) along with casual vit booster if you want to constantly engage in team fight.


Show nested quote +

On August 15 2013 14:37 Daozzt wrote:
Vanguard's not horrible on Viper but you should only get it if you're dominating your lane and its before 10 minutes.


Mek is still a much better option than vanguard

Vanguard is situationally good on Viper if you're super behind and need both Mek and Vanguard.


But isnt Mek+Vit Booster only + Drum better if you want to catch up ? Drum will help with viper mana issue while Vit Booster can be used for Heart later on.
Put quote here for readability
trinxified
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada7774 Posts
August 15 2013 07:47 GMT
#71889
vanguard is already bad enough, and on range it's even worse...
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
August 15 2013 07:50 GMT
#71890
On August 15 2013 16:41 sandyph wrote:
But isnt Mek+Vit Booster only + Drum better if you want to catch up ? Drum will help with viper mana issue while Vit Booster can be used for Heart later on.

The problem is slots. If you have Treads or Phase, Mek Vit Drums Wand TP, you can fight sure, but your items are a dead end unless you make Heart right after that, and selling any of those items is really shitty.
Moderator
sandyph
Profile Joined September 2010
Indonesia1640 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-15 08:00:01
August 15 2013 07:59 GMT
#71891
On August 15 2013 16:50 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 15 2013 16:41 sandyph wrote:
But isnt Mek+Vit Booster only + Drum better if you want to catch up ? Drum will help with viper mana issue while Vit Booster can be used for Heart later on.

The problem is slots. If you have Treads or Phase, Mek Vit Drums Wand TP, you can fight sure, but your items are a dead end unless you make Heart right after that, and selling any of those items is really shitty.


but wouldnt you have the same problem with Treads/Phase+Mek+Vanguard+Wand+TP ?
in both case I would sacrifice Wand for Yasha/Lothar

maybe its depends on whether you need the Move+Attack speed (Drums) or Health Regen+Block (Vanguard) but for me Attack Speed is better on Viper due to nethertoxin while corrosive skin buff mean that the Block from vanguard is really not needed
Put quote here for readability
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
August 15 2013 08:06 GMT
#71892
It depends. There are a lot of situations where Viper simply doesn't get to be back-line damage dealer and just has to be a frontline hero who eats spells and damage.
Moderator
Itsmedudeman
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States19229 Posts
August 15 2013 08:11 GMT
#71893
Lol watching the dota 2 market prices is so hilarious sometimes. Unusual fezzle feez was going at 270 the other day and then it dropped down to 138 overnight.
Abominous
Profile Joined March 2013
Croatia1625 Posts
August 15 2013 08:36 GMT
#71894
About the infinities...


Infinity is infinity. There are no greater infinities and smaller ones. You're probably confusing limits when a variable is growing to infinity and in that case, some mathematical functions grow to infinity faster than the others.
Daozzt
Profile Joined July 2010
United States1263 Posts
August 15 2013 08:44 GMT
#71895
On August 15 2013 12:59 MiX wrote:
I don't think you should bash people's item choice which is highly subjective when you don't think some infinities are larger than others, which was mathematically proven over a century ago.


Shouldn't have banned that guy. This was post of the year material.
Shaella
Profile Blog Joined January 2013
United States14828 Posts
August 15 2013 08:47 GMT
#71896
On August 15 2013 17:44 Daozzt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 15 2013 12:59 MiX wrote:
I don't think you should bash people's item choice which is highly subjective when you don't think some infinities are larger than others, which was mathematically proven over a century ago.


Shouldn't have banned that guy. This was post of the year material.

idk, the number of bad vanguard pickups i see..
don't tell me to provide a legend for those charts cause we already got shaella in this thread - eieio | Bulba is my waifu
Erasme
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Bahamas15899 Posts
August 15 2013 08:54 GMT
#71897
damnit i hate the new influx of timbersaw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7lxwFEB6FI “‘Drain the swamp’? Stupid saying, means nothing, but you guys loved it so I kept saying it.”
Mataza
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Germany5364 Posts
August 15 2013 08:57 GMT
#71898
Oh how you all talk about infinity like it's so easy.
Just always remember the guy who first got behind the concept and that there are different kinds of it, that very man spend the rest of his life in a lunatic asylum writing mathematical proof on the wall with his own feces.
Or so they say.

To come back to the way axe ulti was programmed in wc3:
When it does it's killing blow damage, it could oneshot the enemy throne with glyph and omniknight ulti active on it. If it could target buildings. And could activate killing blow damage against a 4k hp target.
If nobody hates you, you´re doing something wrong. However someone hating you doesn´t make you right
Esoterikk
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada1256 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-15 09:08:21
August 15 2013 09:05 GMT
#71899
What skill level would you need to be at before you can start to play more competitively, and please don't respond with "lol u not a pro" I mean just any level of competition that isn't pubs.
Daozzt
Profile Joined July 2010
United States1263 Posts
August 15 2013 09:05 GMT
#71900
I do think vanguard is better than mek on Viper though unless no one else on your team is a mek carrier/able to farm one. Viper has like 200 mana and goes oom after an ult and 3 orbs. I don't think its reliable on him at all.
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