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On June 27 2013 00:19 -Celestial- wrote:
Dunno then. My game quality DRASTICALLY improved when I changed to only playing RD and more recently I added in SD and AR in. My main account finally ground up to High level games and my newer account leapfrogged straight up to playing in Very High.
All Pick games always seemed to result in even worse lineups than AR games as a general rule. All carries, every game.
Heh, whenever my team goes all-carry I just pick Lifestealer or Nature's Prophet for jungle and out-carry them all.
From my experience, the lineups are usually good at pages 1-5 though.
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On June 27 2013 00:24 Pseudoku wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2013 00:19 -Celestial- wrote:
Dunno then. My game quality DRASTICALLY improved when I changed to only playing RD and more recently I added in SD and AR in. My main account finally ground up to High level games and my newer account leapfrogged straight up to playing in Very High.
All Pick games always seemed to result in even worse lineups than AR games as a general rule. All carries, every game. Heh, whenever my team goes all-carry I just pick Lifestealer or Nature's Prophet for jungle and out-carry them all. From my experience, the lineups are usually good at pages 1-5 though.
Thats not really helpful to that guy in the thread trying to MMR boost from normal though is it? :-\
Prefer Naix myself for winning the game in "single player" mode. Just flat out cannot play Furion, its weird. Can't get my head around it it seems.
On June 27 2013 00:21 DrPandaPhD wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2013 00:10 Pseudoku wrote:On June 26 2013 23:01 -Celestial- wrote:On June 26 2013 22:17 Zelniq wrote:
sick and tired of the level of allies im getting in solo queues. i've had enough.
add me on steam (same name), i prefer US east and until I get to higher level games, all pick All Pick is horrendous for getting your MMR up in my experience. Might be the source of your problems. I played only All Pick all the way up to page 1 before (solo queuing). ye me too, but "2man stacking." (duo queuing) I dislike playing Dota alone. Could be doing something productive, like play with kittens or ride my bike down a pool.
Its a lot easier when you're playing with someone competent though. So if you can get that consistently of course you're going to shoot up in MMR easy as that.
The only people I ever queued with are a few people I know from elsewhere. One is a bit of a rager but ok at playing. One is kinda inexperienced and doesn't play anymore anyway. The third is both a newbie and a MASSIVE rager who just yells at the team all game before ragequitting.
I don't queue with any of them anymore. Hell I don't even SPEAK to the last guy anymore after he decided that he was going to start throwing insults at me, mock my knowledge of DOTA2 over a simple discussion of an item build and then getting his mates to gang up on me.
So yeah, frankly solo queueing is actually a better gameplay experience for me. Solo queue only was a godsend so I don't have to run into stacks. Weird I know.
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I also find that if I get 5 players together (ex. from the teamliquid channel), the lineups are reasonable.
It also helps when I suggest what heroes to take :D
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How good is offlane supposed to do in a semi serious game?
I remember more games than I'm comfortable with where I'm kinda forced to go offlane. Dark Seer and Clinkz being one of my regular choices for that. What truly irritates me, though, is that even if I get a trilane or 2 heroes and a jungler as opponents I sometimes just do flat out better than my teammates.
Ganks come to me, I go to gank, sometimes I die, rarely I get a solokill, all standard fare. But those irritating games I can have upgraded boots and have 2-3k gold on the way for my next item at 25 minutes and our next most wealthy person has upgraded boots, no money and some junk(branches, bracer, bottle, stout shield, tp, etc.).
I always thought that typically the offlaner would trail behind in farm progression compared to his team.
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I can't no longer play Doto when I'm awake alone.
During sleepy time, I can solo-Q.
It's really sad, I need a hug or smth. T___T
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I just hope the guilds come online soon, a lot of my friends have been offline recently and playing solo is rather coinflippy depending on the mode though politeness and reasonable picks seem to make people more relaxed and focused.
Seems like matchmaking has had some tweaks too or having a short break from the game changes it's approach as the level of my games fluctuated suprisingly much after a week.
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On June 27 2013 00:43 Mataza wrote:
How good is offlane supposed to do in a semi serious game?
I remember more games than I'm comfortable with where I'm kinda forced to go offlane. Dark Seer and Clinkz being one of my regular choices for that. What truly irritates me, though, is that even if I get a trilane or 2 heroes and a jungler as opponents I sometimes just do flat out better than my teammates.
Ganks come to me, I go to gank, sometimes I die, rarely I get a solokill, all standard fare. But those irritating games I can have upgraded boots and have 2-3k gold on the way for my next item at 25 minutes and our next most wealthy person has upgraded boots, no money and some junk(branches, bracer, bottle, stout shield, tp, etc.).
I always thought that typically the offlaner would trail behind in farm progression compared to his team.
I believe in theory your farm is likely to be poor to average depending on the offlaner (Druid and DS should be able to get ok farm for example because of Bear and Ion Shell respectively) but your levels should be decent unless they're REALLY good at zoning you out of XP range.
That being said...yeah I've been in that position before myself. I actually got three or four kills on their carry/support combo as Windrunner once but it wasn't enough because our main carry just didn't farm properly at all.
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Czech Republic18921 Posts
On June 27 2013 00:43 Mataza wrote:
How good is offlane supposed to do in a semi serious game?
I remember more games than I'm comfortable with where I'm kinda forced to go offlane. Dark Seer and Clinkz being one of my regular choices for that. What truly irritates me, though, is that even if I get a trilane or 2 heroes and a jungler as opponents I sometimes just do flat out better than my teammates.
Ganks come to me, I go to gank, sometimes I die, rarely I get a solokill, all standard fare. But those irritating games I can have upgraded boots and have 2-3k gold on the way for my next item at 25 minutes and our next most wealthy person has upgraded boots, no money and some junk(branches, bracer, bottle, stout shield, tp, etc.).
I always thought that typically the offlaner would trail behind in farm progression compared to his team.
"offlane" as a term is WAY too broad. You can't pin it down. It matters on what hero the offlaner is, what heroes are against him, etc. There's no way to get a universal answer.
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On June 26 2013 22:17 Zelniq wrote:
sick and tired of the level of allies im getting in solo queues. i've had enough.
add me on steam (same name), i prefer US east and until I get to higher level games, all pick
added you 'Player'
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Czech Republic18921 Posts
So what do you think about the role switch in Na'Vi? Xboct was playing support and Kuroky carry, recently. I hope it's just an experiment... xboct is definitely a better carry than he is support, but Kuroky can play both of them well. I definitely hope there's no bad blood inside of Na'Vi, that would definitely suck.
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navi dont give a fuck and arent trying
joke drafts and joke plays joke item builds
#jetlag #tryingstuffout #outofcomfortzone #weonlycareaboutLAN #navibootcamp
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United Kingdom24425 Posts
They did this before they were changing rosters as well. The putting XBOCT on support.
Either way Kuroky isn't as strong of a carry as he is a support. (the past is irrelevant in this regard)
And XBOCT certainly isn't as strong of a support as he is a carry.
The problems with Na'Vi are with drafts, with in-game strategy, with vision and map control. It's not with XBOCT getting himself killed when the team is already behind.
Changing positions rarely have huge effects on teams performance, we typically see a bigger change from swapping drafter.
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Netherlands45349 Posts
Na'vi is experimenting and they kinda should, the bootcamp is for practice. I don't mind that they try and practice new stuff honestly.
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Czech Republic18921 Posts
Xboct plays from behind differently than other players. When Na'Vi are behind he starts playing risky and tries to get away with things he wouldn't be able to if he played safe. It's definitely a legitimate way way to try get back into the game. Other teams and carries might just go for the safe farm and safe kills and just lose more slowly. The thing is, nobody flames the carries that just play passive and lose the game by getting outfarmed over 20 minutes, but everybody flames xboct for "throwing" the game. It pisses me off so much when people say that.
It might be truth that Na'Vi's losses are caused by tactical and drafting decisions. Dendi tweeted after Dreamhack that he's satisfied with their teamfighting and overall skill of all the players, but that they lost because of team decision making and drafting.
And I think that's a good thing if you're a Na'Vi fan. I mean, you can't really improve your skill overnight, but you can make big improvements in strategy and drafting in a very short amount of time. And Puppey has showed many times before, that he knows how to "break the game" and how to adapt, so I think chances are he and his team will figure it out again.
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I honestly don't get the 'throws' flame on xboct, the dude has always been like that since forever, yes he made so many retarded positionings at times and he was indeed the weakest link back in the 'good old navi' team.
BUT, he is not the biggest issue in the new navi. I said that because the dude actually deliver almost every time when he was given the laning phase that he needed, unlike many of the pro carry players out there who could still fail hard if you gave them complete free farming (i dont really want to mention names here but for example someone couldn't finish a 5v4 game in 60mins *ahem*) so i have no doubt that xboct IS still one of your top na/eu carry players.
The biggest difference between old and new navi is that the old navi's #3-5 treated dendi/xboct as their bosses where they play the game around them, the trio of LoH+puppy+AA were amazing that I dont think people would disagree on that. Their teamwork and chemistry and brotherhood during TI1/TI2 made me such a huge fan of the old navi.
While for the new navi, there was one time i saw dendi needed to carry sentry+ward as a Puck and then today I predicted that Navi will lose when Puppey picked Ench, because a #4 Ench cannot be played like a #5 (to cover kuroky's ass).
+ Show Spoiler +On June 26 2013 21:56 BurningSera wrote:Well if the game didnt become a joke then my post before the game started would look so good -_- basically 20mins in due to kuroky's selfless and thoughtful playstyle, despite navi owned early game pretty nicely, both puppey and kuroky have very bad economy (ench ganking nonstop and playing like a #5 while cm whoring gold to buy item but get killed). You cant play 3v5 against actual 'good team'. Well, orange nearly throw that because mushi was having fun hunting in navi's jungle >_> prolonging the game to the point that cm/ench all got their items -_- Show nested quote +On June 26 2013 21:05 BurningSera wrote:
Calling Navi lost this.
Gonna type my brief reason here:
Whenever puppey plays a #4 hero, he is actually playing #5 hero at the same time. Kuroky is abusing that so he can get his items, which is FINE on some super support hero like Rubick/Lina etc. However, a farmed CM would be....pointless, when they are playing against actual good team.
as soon as mushi didnt go extreme actor mode >_>
I am not saying that anyone in the new navi is bad or anything like that, they are all very talented for sure, but they simply didn't have the fluidity in their teamwork (especially that economy management) like the 'good old navi'. You need to adjust many things from personalities to playstyle to make a team works, especially when you are playing against some of the best teams out there.
Just look at [A], sickening duo EGM+Akke. They weren't even that good back in January but look at them now how they play according to their core heroes in team (very solidly) and how they have always been thoughtful and selfless for the team.
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I think Xboct's agressive playstyle fit the old Na'vi more. Sure they're still very fight-oriented but it's not the same, the old team had a lot more teamwork and synergy.
We'll just have to see what happens at TI3.
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When do you pull the easy camp on radiant side to make a successful stack? I have a really hard time to make it work and fail 80% of the time. I understand that it depends on the creeps but please I would really appreciate if anyone could list when to stack which creep on radiant easy camp.
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Bearded Elder29905 Posts
Got my account back with all items stolen.
<3 Volvo
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On June 27 2013 02:45 VAGZ wrote:
When do you pull the easy camp on radiant side to make a successful stack? I have a really hard time to make it work and fail 80% of the time. I understand that it depends on the creeps but please I would really appreciate if anyone could list when to stack which creep on radiant easy camp.
Its probably where you are pulling them. The kobolds I pull at :53 to the right or north. The gnolls/trolls I pull :52 to the right. Harpies at :53 to the right since they don't stack up on eachother.
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Nobody plays anything except All pick on SEA..It's weird..I can find all pick matches in 3-4 minutes , anything else and it goes beyond 8-9 minutes it seems
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EPT
