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On March 07 2013 14:21 Wysp wrote:
because once you have the yasha you can push a lane and farm the jungle at the same time, and vice versa. Also kill towers faster, also kill heroes and creeps faster. Without it illusions just fizzle out.
stop with your yasha propaganda, next time i shamelessly random pl i will get yasha before heart kkkkkk.
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On March 07 2013 14:23 Shaella wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 14:21 aintz wrote:On March 07 2013 14:19 Shaella wrote:On March 07 2013 14:18 aintz wrote:
i acknowledged the fact yasha speeds up farm multiple times already. my point is: why farm when you can fight and win. when i get my sub 10min defusal and start fighting, ppl start dying and game is over. but then again with any carry i random i would just farm for 15min and start killing everyone. excessive farming in pubs is just unnecessary
Well clearly because i'm not bad. big huge talks coming from the hero picker. time to pull a tube: 1v1 grudge match. Yeah. No. I have no desire to associate with you, let alone waste my time in a 1v1 match.
so dodge it is.
here is my noob profile
http://dotabuff.com/players/6988608
btw ian that furion build is unstoppable, its hard to lose games with furion.
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On March 07 2013 14:07 Wysp wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 14:00 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:On March 07 2013 13:51 Wysp wrote:
lol @ crediting one person with building yasha on PL. You learn it from his games, not he invented. Also the type of stacks he queues with he could go just about anything he wants, and often does, and win. Yes I face his stupid stacks and solo queuers never try hard enough to challenge them.
But with that said, yasha is easily the best farming item for cost on PL. Once you have yasha diffusal your illusions are totally self perpetuating. If you go drums first and the game seems to simmer down (you went drums because you needed HP to deal with pressure...) its better to yasha before diffusal, as you will farm up much faster to your diff and next item with it first. Otherwise I would probably go diffusal after drums to be even better at fighting. Yasha first situations are pretty much won games, as its basically saying you expect to free farm for another 8 minutes on that hero.
If you are total ass like aintz though you will just go diff -> heart without even bothering with a yasha, and farm like a slug counting on a free type game to hand you kills. The diff first is totally alright, but seriously finish heart before a yasha. What is that garbage. Something like diff --> vit booster --> yasha is so much better.
edit: why diff before yasha is much safer. You get to punish people who come to gank you. If your team responds well suddenly no one can run and you guys clean up. Yasha doesn't offer HP like drums, or the punishment diff can bring to gankers. It also offers about 75% the farming speed of yasha, excluding the MS. Dignitas providing Aui space to farm in tournament games is pretty standard so going Yasha sounds like a no brainer here to me. lol @ you thinking I watch player streams and base my opinions off pub stomps. I assume most people in here are talking about their queue games, as thats what we play, and he in no way 'invented' yasha first in any context. Its like people who say Merlini invented jungling, or vigoss invented tower diving.
The reasoning behind why he goes Yasha first is relevant for any game. The key is to understand why somebody does something and to use it in a proper situation. I provided a logical reasoning for why Aui200 goes yasha first and why you would adapt it into your play. I never made the claim that going Yasha first on PL will increase your winrate in pubs or that everyone should go yasha first because Aui does it.
Maybe my wording of Aui started it is off and you want me to credit some other random name, but he was the first person I saw doing it and then a bunch of others started doing it as well so I credited him. If you'd like to throw some other name in the hat or you just want me to credit nobody I could care less.
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On March 07 2013 14:26 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 14:07 Wysp wrote:On March 07 2013 14:00 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:On March 07 2013 13:51 Wysp wrote:
lol @ crediting one person with building yasha on PL. You learn it from his games, not he invented. Also the type of stacks he queues with he could go just about anything he wants, and often does, and win. Yes I face his stupid stacks and solo queuers never try hard enough to challenge them.
But with that said, yasha is easily the best farming item for cost on PL. Once you have yasha diffusal your illusions are totally self perpetuating. If you go drums first and the game seems to simmer down (you went drums because you needed HP to deal with pressure...) its better to yasha before diffusal, as you will farm up much faster to your diff and next item with it first. Otherwise I would probably go diffusal after drums to be even better at fighting. Yasha first situations are pretty much won games, as its basically saying you expect to free farm for another 8 minutes on that hero.
If you are total ass like aintz though you will just go diff -> heart without even bothering with a yasha, and farm like a slug counting on a free type game to hand you kills. The diff first is totally alright, but seriously finish heart before a yasha. What is that garbage. Something like diff --> vit booster --> yasha is so much better.
edit: why diff before yasha is much safer. You get to punish people who come to gank you. If your team responds well suddenly no one can run and you guys clean up. Yasha doesn't offer HP like drums, or the punishment diff can bring to gankers. It also offers about 75% the farming speed of yasha, excluding the MS. Dignitas providing Aui space to farm in tournament games is pretty standard so going Yasha sounds like a no brainer here to me. lol @ you thinking I watch player streams and base my opinions off pub stomps. I assume most people in here are talking about their queue games, as thats what we play, and he in no way 'invented' yasha first in any context. Its like people who say Merlini invented jungling, or vigoss invented tower diving. The reasoning behind why he goes Yasha first is relevant for any game. The key is to understand why somebody does something and to use it in a proper situation. I provided a logical reasoning for why Aui200 goes yasha first and why you would adapt it into your play. I never made the claim that going Yasha first on PL will increase your winrate in pubs or that everyone should go yasha first because Aui does it. Maybe my wording of Aui started it is off and you want me to credit some other random name, but he was the first person I saw doing it and then a bunch of others started doing it as well so I credited him. If you'd like to throw some other name in the hat or you just want me to credit nobody I could care less.
i can tell you that this wysp guy has told me to get yasha on pl before aui started streaming.
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See, this is the problem, he latches onto the idea that we're doing it cause Aui, rather than the theorycraft
Why argue with a person this daft? Its like yelling at a wall
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The person who invented this has absolutely no bearing on anything I have said in this entire topic. You're getting hung up on tiny details that have no meaning.
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On March 07 2013 14:31 Shaella wrote:
See, this is the problem, he latches onto the idea that we're doing it cause Aui, rather than the theorycraft
Why argue with a person this daft? Its like yelling at a wall
the wall is much better than you at dota it seems.
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On March 07 2013 14:34 aintz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 14:31 Shaella wrote:
See, this is the problem, he latches onto the idea that we're doing it cause Aui, rather than the theorycraft
Why argue with a person this daft? Its like yelling at a wall
the wall is much better than you at dota it seems.
i hear dota is a 1v1 game.
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On March 07 2013 14:35 Shaella wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 14:34 aintz wrote:On March 07 2013 14:31 Shaella wrote:
See, this is the problem, he latches onto the idea that we're doing it cause Aui, rather than the theorycraft
Why argue with a person this daft? Its like yelling at a wall
the wall is much better than you at dota it seems. i hear dota is a 1v1 game.
clearly the better player will lose in a 1v1 shom game. o wait
its ok you can go get 4 other professional competitive hero pickers and 5v5 me and my game throwers.
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On March 07 2013 14:37 aintz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 14:35 Shaella wrote:On March 07 2013 14:34 aintz wrote:On March 07 2013 14:31 Shaella wrote:
See, this is the problem, he latches onto the idea that we're doing it cause Aui, rather than the theorycraft
Why argue with a person this daft? Its like yelling at a wall
the wall is much better than you at dota it seems. i hear dota is a 1v1 game. clearly the better player will lose in a 1v1 shom game. o wait its ok you can go get 4 other professional competitive hero pickers and 5v5 me and my game throwers.
See. I just don't care about satisfying your bruised ego.
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On March 07 2013 14:39 Shaella wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 14:37 aintz wrote:On March 07 2013 14:35 Shaella wrote:On March 07 2013 14:34 aintz wrote:On March 07 2013 14:31 Shaella wrote:
See, this is the problem, he latches onto the idea that we're doing it cause Aui, rather than the theorycraft
Why argue with a person this daft? Its like yelling at a wall
the wall is much better than you at dota it seems. i hear dota is a 1v1 game. clearly the better player will lose in a 1v1 shom game. o wait its ok you can go get 4 other professional competitive hero pickers and 5v5 me and my game throwers. See. I just don't care about satisfying your bruised ego.
my ego has a ghost scepter, cannot be bruised. by all mean keep talking trash and dodging.
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On March 07 2013 14:41 aintz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 14:39 Shaella wrote:On March 07 2013 14:37 aintz wrote:On March 07 2013 14:35 Shaella wrote:On March 07 2013 14:34 aintz wrote:On March 07 2013 14:31 Shaella wrote:
See, this is the problem, he latches onto the idea that we're doing it cause Aui, rather than the theorycraft
Why argue with a person this daft? Its like yelling at a wall
the wall is much better than you at dota it seems. i hear dota is a 1v1 game. clearly the better player will lose in a 1v1 shom game. o wait its ok you can go get 4 other professional competitive hero pickers and 5v5 me and my game throwers. See. I just don't care about satisfying your bruised ego. my ego has a ghost scepter, cannot be bruised. by all mean keep talking trash and dodging.
will do.
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Maxing dopplewalk is fine, competitive games are different than matchmaking (or even inhouse leagues). Also, aui is not a really valid source of builds, since everything he does is weird and often contrary to how other pros do it. Sometimes it works out for him, but his weird builds have also lost him games at times.
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So.. if you guys are finished with your little douche vs obnoxious competition anyone wanna touch on my post that seemed to get eaten up by the Pit Lord history lesson?
+ Show Spoiler +On March 07 2013 10:28 Myrddraal wrote:
Hey guys, I've only recently started playing Gyro, and so far I have gone 10-0 with him. Is he just awesome or is it more likely that the players at my level just don't know what to do against him/underestimate him?
I have played him mid every time, usually ganking sometime shortly after hitting level 6. I usually use his missile to chase my opponent out of lane followed by flak cannon to clear out the creeps as quick as possible so they can't physically see me leave the lane, but of course if they had wards on the river it wouldn't make a difference. Anyway, my first gank is nearly always successful, killing one or both of the opponents in lane and from their it just seems natural progression to take the game. I don't know maybe his style just suits me, I have always liked heroes that can gank efficiently and Gyro's skills seem to do so really well, and he can then capitalise on the advantage gained by farming and pushing towers effectively with Flak cannon while also having a formidable teamfight from pretty early on. He just seems... awesome.
TL DR; is Gyro awesome or are my opponents just bad?
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I swear I've read the word yasha so much by now it has lost all meaning.
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On March 07 2013 14:48 Myrddraal wrote:So.. if you guys are finished with your little douche vs obnoxious competition anyone wanna touch on my post that seemed to get eaten up by the Pit Lord history lesson? + Show Spoiler +On March 07 2013 10:28 Myrddraal wrote:
Hey guys, I've only recently started playing Gyro, and so far I have gone 10-0 with him. Is he just awesome or is it more likely that the players at my level just don't know what to do against him/underestimate him?
I have played him mid every time, usually ganking sometime shortly after hitting level 6. I usually use his missile to chase my opponent out of lane followed by flak cannon to clear out the creeps as quick as possible so they can't physically see me leave the lane, but of course if they had wards on the river it wouldn't make a difference. Anyway, my first gank is nearly always successful, killing one or both of the opponents in lane and from their it just seems natural progression to take the game. I don't know maybe his style just suits me, I have always liked heroes that can gank efficiently and Gyro's skills seem to do so really well, and he can then capitalise on the advantage gained by farming and pushing towers effectively with Flak cannon while also having a formidable teamfight from pretty early on. He just seems... awesome. TL DR; is Gyro awesome or are my opponents just bad?
Gyro is insane right now
+ Show Spoiler +Yasha is solid on him too
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Has anyone pointed out the Cyborgmatt tweet about South Korea servers going up, might give some info on the gom thing although i still think gom picking up Dota 2 is a super strange move.
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On March 07 2013 14:51 Shaella wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 14:48 Myrddraal wrote:So.. if you guys are finished with your little douche vs obnoxious competition anyone wanna touch on my post that seemed to get eaten up by the Pit Lord history lesson? + Show Spoiler +On March 07 2013 10:28 Myrddraal wrote:
Hey guys, I've only recently started playing Gyro, and so far I have gone 10-0 with him. Is he just awesome or is it more likely that the players at my level just don't know what to do against him/underestimate him?
I have played him mid every time, usually ganking sometime shortly after hitting level 6. I usually use his missile to chase my opponent out of lane followed by flak cannon to clear out the creeps as quick as possible so they can't physically see me leave the lane, but of course if they had wards on the river it wouldn't make a difference. Anyway, my first gank is nearly always successful, killing one or both of the opponents in lane and from their it just seems natural progression to take the game. I don't know maybe his style just suits me, I have always liked heroes that can gank efficiently and Gyro's skills seem to do so really well, and he can then capitalise on the advantage gained by farming and pushing towers effectively with Flak cannon while also having a formidable teamfight from pretty early on. He just seems... awesome. TL DR; is Gyro awesome or are my opponents just bad? Gyro is insane right now
Both awesome and your opponents being terrible
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I don't see how I latched on about this whole aui thing. One sentence explaining why I really dislike saying anyone invented any build/strategy, (another example 'zomg EE invent fake roshams!') and many paragraphs discussing yasha and how it fits into PL builds.
Infact, not sure why I am evening posting, as the last page of messages is total one line filler garbage. But I will respond more to blitzkrieg0's slightly long post above, which I've kinda already addressed. Actually this is impossible because what he is saying about my remarks seems to ignore what I posted, which was almost entirely about how yasha fits into PL play.
Yasha first is high risk low reward because you still need much more agility if you grab this at a low level to aquire your global farming presense. You are still gonna need a lot more stats before you can farm two places at once, and you have no way to punish or survive gankers. More about drums and these other agility items above. I actually dislike a whole lot bout aui_2000's builds on many heroes, but sometimes he does really get it right. here I feel he is just begging to be punish for almost no reward
@Aintz, I actually learned that build from ryze and link when they played tlih 2 years ago.
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On March 07 2013 14:52 Wysp wrote:
I don't see how I latched on about this whole aui thing. One sentence explaining why I really dislike saying anyone invented any build/strategy, (another example 'zomg EE invent fake roshams!') and many paragraphs discussing yasha and how it fits into PL builds.
Infact, not sure why I am evening posting, as the last page of messages is total one line filler garbage. But I will respond more to blitzkrieg0's slightly long post above, which I've kinda already addressed. Actually this is impossible because what he is saying about my remarks seems to ignore what I posted, which was almost entirely about how yasha fits into PL play.
Yasha first is high risk low reward because you still need much more agility if you grab this at a low level to aquire your global farming presense. You are still gonna need a lot more stats before you can farm two places at once, and you have no way to punish or survive gankers. More about drums and these other agility items above. I actually dislike a whole lot bout aui_2000's builds on many heroes, but sometimes he does really get it right. here I feel he is just begging to be punish for almost no reward
@Aintz, I actually learned that build from ryze and link when they played tlih 2 years ago.
i disagree about the risk factor of Yasha, i don't think its nearly as high risk as you think, and i think it gives more reward than you believe.
Now, Drums is definately safer, but it offers less reward, especially going into late game as sooner or later you have to sell it off for something stronger, that's inefficient. I'm not saying Drums is always wrong, infact if I'm having a tough early game and feeling like I have to fight sooner, yeah, I'll totally go drums. But i feel like if you've had a solid lane phase, yasha is a great pickup that gives a lot of reward going forward into the midgame for the farm acceleration
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EPT
