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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 9552

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
sc-darkness
Profile Joined August 2017
856 Posts
December 18 2017 00:02 GMT
#191021


I like that suggestion.
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
December 18 2017 00:04 GMT
#191022
On December 18 2017 07:57 Introvert wrote:
Democrats say the same thing when a Democrat is president, this is the most banal political line and not worth even a tweet. Everyone knows it's garbage, but they say it anyways.

it feels to me like democrats do it less; and offten when they bring it up they do so specifically to point out how republicans only say it when there's a republican leader.
it does fit with the general archetypes found in each group that such an attitude would be more prevalent amongst reps than dems.
but I don't know of any stronger data to establish it.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
Danglars
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States12133 Posts
December 18 2017 02:05 GMT
#191023
On December 18 2017 09:02 sc-darkness wrote:
https://twitter.com/krassenstein/status/942278183856066560

I like that suggestion.

That's a pretty asinine comment. Trump is haughty disdain and bombast paired with high levels of stupidity.

Leave the very definition of stupidity to somebody that lost to somebody like him rofl.
Great armies come from happy zealots, and happy zealots come from California!
TL+ Member
doomdonker
Profile Joined October 2017
90 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-12-18 02:20:37
December 18 2017 02:20 GMT
#191024
I know you have a hard-on for trying to turn everything around onto Clinton but that wouldn't be the definition of stupidity. That would be the very definition of hubris.
Danglars
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States12133 Posts
December 18 2017 02:23 GMT
#191025
On December 18 2017 11:20 doomdonker wrote:
I know you have a hard-on for trying to turn everything around onto Clinton but that wouldn't be the definition of stupidity. That would be the very definition of hubris.

That last line was a joke, and I’d agree with hubris.
Great armies come from happy zealots, and happy zealots come from California!
TL+ Member
Gahlo
Profile Joined February 2010
United States35165 Posts
December 18 2017 02:48 GMT
#191026
Besides, Danglers' definition would extend to any and every politician that entered into the R primary.
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
December 18 2017 02:59 GMT
#191027
On December 18 2017 11:48 Gahlo wrote:
Besides, Danglers' definition would extend to any and every politician that entered into the R primary.

I dunno, I feel pretty jeb!in stupid sometimes
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-12-18 03:00:52
December 18 2017 03:00 GMT
#191028
On December 18 2017 11:59 Nevuk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 18 2017 11:48 Gahlo wrote:
Besides, Danglers' definition would extend to any and every politician that entered into the R primary.

I dunno, I feel pretty jeb!in stupid sometimes

jeb and exclamation point simply do not go together.


PS to gahlo -> it's danglArs
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States45229 Posts
December 18 2017 03:33 GMT
#191029
On December 18 2017 09:02 sc-darkness wrote:
https://twitter.com/krassenstein/status/942278183856066560

I like that suggestion.


20 years? I've already heard some pretty good puns connecting his name to stupidity or other negative connotations. One of my favorites is "The UK thought they could top American stupidity with their Brexit... But they didn't realize that we had a Trump card."
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23591 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-12-18 04:15:42
December 18 2017 04:12 GMT
#191030
This doesn't surprise me, not even a little.



Forgot this part:

WASHINGTON — Alabama’s newly elected senator Doug Jones said Sunday he’s not sure how he would vote on the Republican tax reform bill Congress is expected to consider this week.


Source
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24753 Posts
December 18 2017 04:21 GMT
#191031
What is your analysis, aside from the fact that you aren't surprised? It seems to me like he's trying to lay low and isn't even sharing how he feels or what he will actually do once given the chance. In particular, his comment that he's not sure how he would vote is probably an exaggeration of his ambivalence.
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
m4ini
Profile Joined February 2014
4215 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-12-18 04:28:06
December 18 2017 04:27 GMT
#191032
Leave the very definition of stupidity to somebody that lost to somebody like him rofl.


If you have two persons for election, and the most un-electable thing ever gets elected, it's not the opponent that's the very definition of stupidity if you know what i mean. I know, i know, you're just singing the song of your people, shillary, bad bad i know. Can't not let that go, it's not even a year ago that she was last of any importance to anything, not yet time to NOT bring her up everytime trump gets rightfully blasted. I fully understand, some straws need to stay.
On track to MA1950A.
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23591 Posts
December 18 2017 04:29 GMT
#191033
On December 18 2017 13:21 micronesia wrote:
What is your analysis, aside from the fact that you aren't surprised? It seems to me like he's trying to lay low and isn't even sharing how he feels or what he will actually do once given the chance. In particular, his comment that he's not sure how he would vote is probably an exaggeration of his ambivalence.


That he wants to win his next election more than he wants to help Democrats (or his constituents) and given the ultimatum he'll side with Republicans if that's what it takes.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
December 18 2017 04:31 GMT
#191034
On December 18 2017 13:29 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 18 2017 13:21 micronesia wrote:
What is your analysis, aside from the fact that you aren't surprised? It seems to me like he's trying to lay low and isn't even sharing how he feels or what he will actually do once given the chance. In particular, his comment that he's not sure how he would vote is probably an exaggeration of his ambivalence.


That he wants to win his next election more than he wants to help Democrats (or his constituents) and given the ultimatum he'll side with Republicans if that's what it takes.

From what interviews I listened to him on PSA he basically said he doubts that the tax bill is coming to a vote at all. So he thinks he can basically say whatever and not have to take a stand right now.
m4ini
Profile Joined February 2014
4215 Posts
December 18 2017 04:33 GMT
#191035
The interesting question is, does that make him a smart or a weak politician?

Genuinely btw, i'm not sure what i think of that.
On track to MA1950A.
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23591 Posts
December 18 2017 04:33 GMT
#191036
On December 18 2017 13:31 Nevuk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 18 2017 13:29 GreenHorizons wrote:
On December 18 2017 13:21 micronesia wrote:
What is your analysis, aside from the fact that you aren't surprised? It seems to me like he's trying to lay low and isn't even sharing how he feels or what he will actually do once given the chance. In particular, his comment that he's not sure how he would vote is probably an exaggeration of his ambivalence.


That he wants to win his next election more than he wants to help Democrats (or his constituents) and given the ultimatum he'll side with Republicans if that's what it takes.

From what interviews I listened to him on PSA he basically said he doubts that the tax bill is coming to a vote at all. So he thinks he can basically say whatever and not have to take a stand right now.


Is that supposed to be indicative of something other than what I suggested?
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Aquanim
Profile Joined November 2012
Australia2849 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-12-18 04:39:21
December 18 2017 04:38 GMT
#191037
On December 18 2017 13:29 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 18 2017 13:21 micronesia wrote:
What is your analysis, aside from the fact that you aren't surprised? It seems to me like he's trying to lay low and isn't even sharing how he feels or what he will actually do once given the chance. In particular, his comment that he's not sure how he would vote is probably an exaggeration of his ambivalence.


That he wants to win his next election more than he wants to help Democrats (or his constituents) and given the ultimatum he'll side with Republicans if that's what it takes.

That's another interesting question: which way do you think his constituents want him to vote? Perhaps there's actual data on this question, I'm not sure.
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23591 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-12-18 04:45:55
December 18 2017 04:44 GMT
#191038
On December 18 2017 13:38 Aquanim wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 18 2017 13:29 GreenHorizons wrote:
On December 18 2017 13:21 micronesia wrote:
What is your analysis, aside from the fact that you aren't surprised? It seems to me like he's trying to lay low and isn't even sharing how he feels or what he will actually do once given the chance. In particular, his comment that he's not sure how he would vote is probably an exaggeration of his ambivalence.


That he wants to win his next election more than he wants to help Democrats (or his constituents) and given the ultimatum he'll side with Republicans if that's what it takes.

That's another interesting question: which way do you think his constituents want him to vote? Perhaps there's actual data on this question, I'm not sure.


Hard to say for sure, but the tax plan has ~30% support (nationally) and would be bad for his constituents, so the correct answer is "I would vote against it".

On December 18 2017 13:44 Nevuk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 18 2017 13:33 GreenHorizons wrote:
On December 18 2017 13:31 Nevuk wrote:
On December 18 2017 13:29 GreenHorizons wrote:
On December 18 2017 13:21 micronesia wrote:
What is your analysis, aside from the fact that you aren't surprised? It seems to me like he's trying to lay low and isn't even sharing how he feels or what he will actually do once given the chance. In particular, his comment that he's not sure how he would vote is probably an exaggeration of his ambivalence.


That he wants to win his next election more than he wants to help Democrats (or his constituents) and given the ultimatum he'll side with Republicans if that's what it takes.

From what interviews I listened to him on PSA he basically said he doubts that the tax bill is coming to a vote at all. So he thinks he can basically say whatever and not have to take a stand right now.


Is that supposed to be indicative of something other than what I suggested?

No, it was just context.


k
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
December 18 2017 04:44 GMT
#191039
On December 18 2017 13:33 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 18 2017 13:31 Nevuk wrote:
On December 18 2017 13:29 GreenHorizons wrote:
On December 18 2017 13:21 micronesia wrote:
What is your analysis, aside from the fact that you aren't surprised? It seems to me like he's trying to lay low and isn't even sharing how he feels or what he will actually do once given the chance. In particular, his comment that he's not sure how he would vote is probably an exaggeration of his ambivalence.


That he wants to win his next election more than he wants to help Democrats (or his constituents) and given the ultimatum he'll side with Republicans if that's what it takes.

From what interviews I listened to him on PSA he basically said he doubts that the tax bill is coming to a vote at all. So he thinks he can basically say whatever and not have to take a stand right now.


Is that supposed to be indicative of something other than what I suggested?

No, it was just context.
Aquanim
Profile Joined November 2012
Australia2849 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-12-18 04:58:23
December 18 2017 04:57 GMT
#191040
I don't think it's inherently wrong or a betrayal for Jones to make some concessions to his more conservative Alabama electorate in the hopes of getting re-elected. An Alabama senator voting with the Democrats sometimes is better than one that doesn't at all, and the notion that a generally conservative state can elect a Democrat and said Democrat won't immediately turn around and take a dump all over that conservative state's policy preferences doesn't seem like a bad notion to cultivate for any similar situations that occur in the future.

That being said, I'm not venturing an opinion on whether this tax bill is the time or place for such a thing. Just saying that I disagree with the absolute hardline approach which some here may or may not espouse.
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