EPTPoll: Should the bonus pool be removed?
no (593)
50%
I don't care (291)
25%
yes (269)
23%
maybe (25)
2%
1178 total votes
I don't care (291)
yes (269)
maybe (25)
1178 total votes
Your vote: Should the bonus pool be removed?
Poll: Bonus pool should be removed
| Forum Index > Closed |
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koveras
163 Posts
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oDieN[Siege]
United States2905 Posts
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Geiko
France1952 Posts
=> points always stay the same unless you get better => people aren't motivated to play => blizzard is unhappy so no, bonus has its problem but it's necessary so bronze players know they're are going to win more points thant they lose when they decide to play. | ||
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Soma.bokforlag
Sweden448 Posts
i like the fact that its a positive reinforcer too, compared to point decay or so | ||
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mewbert
United States291 Posts
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iamho
United States3347 Posts
On June 29 2011 23:04 mewby wrote: who the fuck cares about ladder points, the point of the game is to be better than the next person. Then they should show us our MMR so we actually know how good we are, instead of having to guess. | ||
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InvictusTT
United States47 Posts
Though, I voted for "I dont care." I don't see a reason to have it. | ||
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weltraumMonster
Germany62 Posts
Without the bonus pool i would always stay in low ladder spots... with it i can play lees and still stay in the top 8 of my division... to have a high ladder rank is my main motivation to kkep playing. Even though it does'nt mean to much below masters league. | ||
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oDieN[Siege]
United States2905 Posts
On June 29 2011 23:05 iamho wrote: Then they should show us our MMR so we actually know how good we are, instead of having to guess. ...and what exactly would be listed if Blizzard were to show us our "MMR?" The whole point on why it's called "Hidden MMR" is that it's Hidden. | ||
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cocosoft
Sweden1068 Posts
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GreEny K
Germany7312 Posts
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Carush
United States356 Posts
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Drake
Germany6146 Posts
not help you to wait, you wont get MORE bonus than when you play | ||
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Morphs
Netherlands645 Posts
The current system can be improved though. Now the bonus pool greatly distorts the real ranking of someone. Say I have 1000 ladder points with no bonus pool. Someone else has 950 ladder points but has 150 bonus pool remaining. That makes a huge difference and really, it SUCKS to have to click on everyones profile on the ladder to get a sense of his/her skill points. There should be a way to quickly see the "skill points" of a player. Like a button on the ladder screen that when clicked, substracts all bonus pool of the season from his/her current ladder points or adds the bonus pool to that player. That way you can see who is actually playing better/worse then you. I'd have the first option (substracting) since it's more accurate, but negative values make people stop playing so Blizzard will never do that. And I think everything is too much work for them so this thread is kinda useless. Still... they should allow more statistics for diamond/master/grandmaster players. For a simple fix, I wouldn't mind if the bonus pool accrued at half the current rate. | ||
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cyrex
United States24 Posts
There is no benefit at all to letting your pool build up and if you wait too long and let it cap out, you will fall behind where you could be. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Battle.net_Leagues#Bonus_PoolSource I'm going to expand on this and attempt to try to explain why the bonus pool is a good thing for people who don't play daily. The basic idea of the ladder is to systematically rank players in such a way that they are usually matched up against people with equal skill/ability. As you know, the ladder uses a points system where winning earn you points and loses will cause you to lose point. Winning more than loses will typically cause your points to trend upward. Being that very few, if any, players on the ladder are playing at their absolute best, the basic trend for the majority is to get better as they play causing the total ladder points in play to trend upwards. On the top end of the ladder (> Platinum), the skill of players increases at a slower rate than ladder points do. On the lower end of the ladder (<= Gold) skill increases faster than ladder points do. Because of this, the bonus pool has a different effect at different levels. If a Diamond player hasn't played for a week, it is unlikely that his ability has worsened significantly, however his rating has stayed the same while players at his skill level that did play during the week has increased. Bonus points all how to catch up to where he should be faster rather than without the bonus pool. In general, the ladder works better as players fit into their rightful spot, so the bonus pool promotes this. According to liquipedia, we gain 84 bonus pool points a week. This means someone with a 55% win rate playing 16 games a week (8.8 won 7.2 lost) in an even match at Gold level (win/lose 10 points per game) will win earn an average of 100 points per week (88-72+84). After the bonus pool, it will take an additional 100 games (55-45) for the next 100 ladder points. All this does, is encourage casual players to play up to 5 hours per week, while not really harming anyone that plays more. Sorry if this doesn't make sense. I started going down a track to explain this all using calculus and it just got to where I wasn't sure anyone but math majors would understand, so its been drastically simplified. | ||
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SoundProof
Sweden99 Posts
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Bibbit
Canada5377 Posts
On June 29 2011 23:04 mewby wrote: who the fuck cares about ladder points, the point of the game is to be better than the next person. Shockingly, we've recently learned that the answer is a hell of a lot of people. | ||
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Gnax
Sweden490 Posts
Having 0 bonus pool and playing ladder doesn't give you any disadvantage over someone who plays with 1000 bonus pool. If you have 0 bonus pool it means you have more points than the guy with 1000 bonus pool will ever get from bonus pool alone. | ||
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shinyA
United States473 Posts
If I play 1000 games in the first month of a ladder reset with a decent win percentage say I have 1500 points. After that month someone else starts laddering, has an inflated bonus pool, will have the same amount of points as me after just 100 games. That doesn't reward or motivate players to play more it actually does the opposite. It's funny, the person above me says "you're officially stupid if you want bonus pool removed because it motivates the casual player to play" but that makes no sense. The casual player is actually persuaded to play less. They know playing over their bonus pool will risk losing more points so they will play only to keep the advantage of bonus pool. If there is no bonus pool they would be motivated to play more to keep up with other players. A system that rewards mass gaming is what motivates people to mass game. Logically a system that rewards minimal play cannot motivate more play. If I know that I have a better chance of keeping my points high by not playing, why would I play more? First of all the argument in favor of bonus pool, which is for the casual gamer, would imply that the casual gamer cares a lot about points. If that's the case, like I have said then there is no reason for them to ever play past their bonus pool. But I would argue that if you're a casual player then you play for fun and should not care about points. But when you have a factor such as bonus pool it puts more emphasis on points which would, in my opinion, discourage mass gaming. Take a ladder system like ICC for example, mass gamers are rewarded and those who don't play a lot won't get a high rank. How is that not how it should be? Why should someone who plays at the very end of a season be the same rank as someone who's play 10 times as many games? Not to mention Bonus Pool makes no real skill bars, points are only important for whatever is the current time. 1000 points in the first few weeks is a cool thing but a couple weeks after that it's nothing. In a system like ICC points are a reflection of skill, if you're A+ you're one of the best players, but that's a set rank where other players of the same rank are equally skilled. When I play a game and I see +20 points I want that to mean something, as should everyone else, casual and competitive alike. | ||
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vectorix108
United States4633 Posts
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