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I noticed recently that every single unit in the game that has an attack bonus against armored is considered armored itself.
The same goes for light units being the only ones who may have +dmg to light (only exeption being the Thors air attack).
![[image loading]](http://i42.tinypic.com/azb9so.jpg)
I think that this leads to a very limited usability of these attack boni, if you encounter armored units (e.g. Marauders) you would want to use units that have +dmg against armored units (e.g. Stalkers).
Problem is, the Marauders also have an attack bonus to kill your Stalkers, thus negating the usefulness of your Stalkers attack bonus, so your enemy can just happily keep pumping his Marauders.
My suggestion would be, that blizzard should mix up the attack boni (have light units with +dmg to armored and vice versa etc) to encourage a higher army diversity and force people to be more aware of what the enemy is doing.
This would probably lead to SC2 being more dependant on skill (more scouting and reaction to your enemy necessary) and less dependant on who can mass more and faster.
Please discuss!
Poll: Do you agree with this? (Mixed Attack Boni)Yes (197) 79% No (53) 21% 250 total votes Your vote: Do you agree with this? (Mixed Attack Boni) (Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
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is boni really the plural of bonus that is weird
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not exactly sure about that...wouldnt this change lead to an even more "hard counter" system?
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wow that picture looks really high quality if it's from actual game play
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It took me a whole half minute to figure out what the hell this post was talking about. The proper term is "bonuses"
But once I got it, I really liked it  . Totally agree, though not specifically applied to stalkers.
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At this point, it is completely unnecessary change. The game is balanced pretty well and fucking with that balance just because you think some other solution might be better isn't really good idea. Forcing even more hard counters without proper options to scout would end up with even worse coin flips that now.
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Um, 101FTP not sure where you learned that "boni" is the plural of bonus but I do think we should mix it up! "Bonuses" is a common and an accurate plural form of bonus. Not quite sure about boni--never heard of it before but 101FTP do let me know why you think boni is the plural of bonus.
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the latin plural of bonus is boni, so both terms bonuses and boni are correct, but i like boni more :>
On May 09 2010 04:42 Zaphid wrote:
At this point, it is completely unnecessary change. The game is balanced pretty well and fucking with that balance just because you think some other solution might be better isn't really good idea. Forcing even more hard counters without proper options to scout would end up with even worse coin flips that now.
the game is in beta stage, which is meant to test things out.
i really dont see a point in attack boni/bonuses if there are just a few units always countering each other
edit: and yes thats a gameplay screenshot on ultra settings
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This setup really isn't that different from the original sc setup, except that it was "full" dmg then and "bonus" damage now.
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On May 09 2010 04:50 101TFP wrote:the latin plural of bonus is boni, so both terms bonuses and boni are correct, but i like boni more :> Show nested quote +On May 09 2010 04:42 Zaphid wrote:
At this point, it is completely unnecessary change. The game is balanced pretty well and fucking with that balance just because you think some other solution might be better isn't really good idea. Forcing even more hard counters without proper options to scout would end up with even worse coin flips that now. the game is in beta stage, which is meant to test things out. i really dont see a point in attack boni/bonuses if there are just a few units always countering each other edit: and yes thats a gameplay screenshot on ultra settings
Not sure where you learned Boni is the plural form of Bonus in Latin, but I have looked up that Bona is the plural form in Latin.
Nonetheless I am getting sidetracked here. My condolences for bringing you off topic.
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I don't understand... Are you saying that some units should have bonuses against both Ligth and Armored??
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Let's all agree to define the pluralization of Bonus as 'Boners'.
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Yea I laughed when I read "boni" for some reason it made me think of Bono of U2 fame playing sc2.
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the latin language differentiates between male, female and neutral plurals, boni (m), bonae (f) and bona (n).
but this is not what this thread is about, please keep it on topic
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On May 09 2010 04:54 lolaloc wrote:
I don't understand... Are you saying that some units should have bonuses against both Ligth and Armored??
no, just that there should be (some) armored units with +light and vice versa, to help countering
edit: sorry for double posting, messed up the quoting
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lucky you... i posted the same thing 2 months ago and got flamed to the ground with the usual "it's a different game" / "it's fine" / "i want dustin's baby" etc
gl
although outdated, blizzard still seems to think of the attributes as a successor to the old unit sizes and "big" units are supposed to deal more damage against other "big" units.
alas, i fear it's too late to mix that up now... imagine archons getting "massive" attribute, hellions being mechanical only, a little like banelings - yes, units don't have to come with either armored nor light attribute. in fact, it's the best "armor type" there is... something i'd recommend for ultralisks.
not gonna happen at this stage 8[
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god no, games will be decided in 1 battle, because you can't switch techs fast enough unless you play zerg, this is exactly the thing no one wants in a solid rts, ultimative hard counters
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Never realized this. Great observation, sooo true.
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i think the boni are too big to allow your suggestion, it would make games too much about countering your opponents units all the time.
Maybe if the bonus damages get lowered it would be viable.
Age of empires 2 had the system of extreme stone paper scissor, for example hellebards that demolish knights, but those counterunits had many other disadvantages (slow, no damage against all other units, low hp, minrange....) so the game remained playable.
+ Show Spoiler +boni comes from latin, but latin does not only have different endings for male female neutrum, but also for all casi, giving you 30 possible kombinations for the ending of bonus; boni is used often because it sounds right i guess.
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The OP is correct in his pluralization of bonus -> boni.
I agree that unit damage hard-counters are a little overboard atm, but I don't think that diversification is the solution - devolution back to simpler damage types (softening the counters) is the solution.
Diversification doesn't necessarily lead to more skill demand and less macro, although I think it's a step in the right direction. Improving unit responsiveness, fixing the lag, unit clumping and crowd pathfinding - these things will lead to stronger micro games, but units need to stand a fighting chance.
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EPT
