Hana Daetoo Securities MSL 2010 Semi-Final B Thursday, May 20 9:30am GMT (GMT+00:00)
Relevant Statistics: Record: 330-153 (68.32%) Record vZ: 117-38 (75.48%) Current ELO: 2314 Peak ELO: 2365 Current ELO vZ: 2237 Peak ELO vZ: 2341 Last 10 Games: W W W W W W W W W W Last 10 vZ Games: L W W W L W W W W W
Relevant Statistics: Record: 143-106 (57.43%) Record vZ: 55-38 (59.14%) Current ELO: 2187 Peak ELO: 2287 Current ELO vZ: 2143 Peak ELO vZ: 2196 Last 10 Games: L W L W L L W W W W Last 10 vZ Games: W L W W L L W W W W
The Tyrant has been the dominating presence on the Starcraft scene for a damn-long time. And it seems as if he doesn't want his presence to fade for an even longer time to come. He is renowned for his unbreakable mindset. While strong players before him come and go, Jaedong is just that much different. He won't allow himself to be forgotten. What makes him so much different than anyone before him is that unbreakable mindset. When other players lose, they slump, begin to struggle, and eventually fade away. When Jaedong loses, he comes back stronger than ever the very next day. You cannot phase Jaedong. If you expect to beat him, don't expect to break his focus with unexpected play, unorthodox builds, and other useless tools of battle. Jaedong is too strong for simple things like that. If you want to win versus him... you have to beat him straight up. And that leads to his frightening statistics...
Jaedong is a Bo5 monster. According to the Liquipedia (Stats) he is 19-3 in Bo5 matches. Not only is that a ridiculous amount of Bo5 matches, but ridiculous win statistics. It shows how long he has been in the scene, and how dominant he has been since then. The interesting thing to note though is that he has lost one time to each race. Once to Rock, fOrGG, and... Calm. But as I said before, Jaedong doesn't get phased. When he sees a statistic that doesn't go in his favor, he goes to break that statistic into pieces. And expect that ferocity tonight against Calm.
Jaedong is also renowned for his ZvZ (also known as JvZ). To try and explain this match-up in words... it could be called a Rock, Paper, Scissors match of build orders. Basically put: build #1 is strong against #2 which is strong against #3 which is strong against #1. And to put it simply, Jaedong was beating Rock with Scissors. He was so far ahead of the curve that no one could even begin to touch him. While things aren't exactly "JvZ" anymore, they are pretty damn close. Especially with his recent vZ results.
Don't expect Jaedong to be phased because he has lost to Calm before. Expect Jaedong to be stronger than ever. Calm has his hands full tonight.
Calm (For Calm fans: I want to make this section as long as Jaedong's... but lets face it, there simply isn't as much to mention in terms of readily available information for me to type about, and sheer amount of games played, and etc.... please don't hate me >_<!)
Back in the time of JvZ, there were very few Zergs who could even fathom to win against Jaedong. And Calm is one of those Zergs. He is known for his genius plays and builds, earning him the nickname Brain Zerg. And in most of his games, you can see that shine of sheer brilliance come through into his play. Whether it comes through a slight twist in build order, or a small tweak in army composition, if you expect to beat him, expect to outsmart him. Or you will end up left in the dust.
Calm's best statistical match-up is vZ. And he has had recent practice in vZ Bo5's, seeing how he recently beat great in one 3-2. Calm has had the practice and has the ability to beat Jaedong, as he has shown before. He is the only Zerg in the world who can say that he has beaten Jaedong in the most skill-intensive game setup that exists. And Calm plans to keep it that way.
Calm will come at Jaedong with utmost preparation, as expected of a Brain Zerg. If Jaedong hopes to turn the statistics from 0-1 to 1-1, he will have to out-play this Zerg, because there simply is no out-thinking him.
It's hard to judge what will happen in any mirror match. Seeing how maps don't tend to benefit a specific player. But it is even more-so with ZvZ. Anything can happen. So don't judge me for my super-biased predictions!
this is going to be close I think. I'm happy with either result though; if calm wins then that's fucking awesome calm is in the MSL finals again. If JD wins then that's fucking awesome JD vs flash rematch.
Jaedong is going to lose to Calm when he doesn't have to prepare for a golden mouse like he did 2 seasons ago? Come on. Jaedong has this. He is too clutch.
Jaedong Hwaiting! You haev to win your half of the finals so we can get the most epic rematch ever. If Calm ends up winning this, then these finals just might become one of the most one sided events ever.
I'm in a fanboy crisis.. but Flash vs JD rematch finals minus power outage = paramount. Gogo Jaedong! But since JD's ZvZ has been looking like "business as usual" and Calm being a little shaky on his ZvZ, I'd say the Tyrants got the edge over Cerebral Zerg this time around, Jaedong is out for revenge afterall. JD 3-1.
Jaedong v.s. Flash is heck a lot more dramatic than Calm v.s. Flash.
I am rooting for Jaedong ALL the way.
See here, I don't like the idea of one individual standing on top of everyone without a worthy rival.
So I want Effort and Jaedong to dethrone Flash. Personally I prefer Effort taking the OSL than Jaedong taking the MSL just because I like Effort more and Jaedong has won too many leagues already.
On May 20 2010 13:57 dukethegold wrote: Jaedong v.s. Flash is heck a lot more dramatic than Calm v.s. Flash.
I am rooting for Jaedong ALL the way.
See here, I don't like the idea of one individual standing on top of everyone without a worthy rival.
So I want Effort and Jaedong to dethrone Flash. Personally I prefer Effort taking the OSL than Jaedong taking the MSL just because I like Effort more and Jaedong has won too many leagues already.
If he wins this MSL he ties with NaDa for starleague titles.
Wow if u look at their ZvZ stats, they both have the same number of losses but jaedong has more than twice the wins O_O. Lol just thought that was interesting.
3-0 Jaedong imo since he's favored on the first two maps, plus he's been on fire lately and he's destined to play Flash in the finals. Can't wait~~
On May 20 2010 14:30 Bac wrote: God himself has provided us with the opportunity for the rematch of the century alla Flash v Jaedong. If Calm wins hes going to hell.
God has actually provided us with two rematches. JD vs Calm from MSL and Flash vs JD from MSL (when JD betas calm).
FFFFF I have my LAST FINAL in 7 hours. I can't stay up for this. Fucking A man. FUCKING A. No way I am going to be able to see the VODs unspoiled either, I am going to be checking my phone as soon as I am done the test to see jaedongs win.
Jaedong just have to win this or Flash will have a walk in the park to win both MSL and OSL.
Not that Calm and Effort are not good players. But the way Flash plays now, the only player with the skill and the mindset to take on Flash head to head is Jaedong. The others will be 0-1 before they even start game 1 just because Flash is so damn scary.
On May 20 2010 14:50 Xinliben wrote: FFFFF I have my LAST FINAL in 7 hours. I can't stay up for this. Fucking A man. FUCKING A. No way I am going to be able to see the VODs unspoiled either, I am going to be checking my phone as soon as I am done the test to see jaedongs win.
You know what, fuck this. I'm just staying awake. I'll do better anyway, No way I could concentrate if I slept while this game was going on. Yay starcraft.
On May 20 2010 14:50 Xinliben wrote: FFFFF I have my LAST FINAL in 7 hours. I can't stay up for this. Fucking A man. FUCKING A. No way I am going to be able to see the VODs unspoiled either, I am going to be checking my phone as soon as I am done the test to see jaedongs win.
You know what, fuck this. I'm just staying awake. I'll do better anyway, No way I could concentrate if I slept while this game was going on. Yay starcraft.
loooool. I feel the same way.
P.S. You're gonna probably slit your wrists if Jaedong ends up losing.
On May 20 2010 14:50 Xinliben wrote: FFFFF I have my LAST FINAL in 7 hours. I can't stay up for this. Fucking A man. FUCKING A. No way I am going to be able to see the VODs unspoiled either, I am going to be checking my phone as soon as I am done the test to see jaedongs win.
You know what, fuck this. I'm just staying awake. I'll do better anyway, No way I could concentrate if I slept while this game was going on. Yay starcraft.
Rofl. I have morning classes, a multi test at the end of said morning classes, late AP European history tomorrow afternoon, and states semifinals for tennis 3.5 hours away at the coast. Oh, and a portfolio paper + presentation due on Friday.
On May 20 2010 16:36 lolaloc wrote: Calm should just jump to the We-Want-Flash-JD-rematch bandwagon and give Jaedong free wins.
I don't think Jaedong needs Calm to give him free wins to dominate this series. If Calm can take even a single game I will raise my eyebrows in amazement for a period of several seconds.
Jaedong ZvZ BO5 with no OSL to worry about -> no chance for Calm.
On May 20 2010 14:50 Xinliben wrote: FFFFF I have my LAST FINAL in 7 hours. I can't stay up for this. Fucking A man. FUCKING A. No way I am going to be able to see the VODs unspoiled either, I am going to be checking my phone as soon as I am done the test to see jaedongs win.
Well you cant beat me ! I have guard duty on saturday and will be missing the Flash Effort finals. FML Im a sad panda
On May 20 2010 14:50 Xinliben wrote: FFFFF I have my LAST FINAL in 7 hours. I can't stay up for this. Fucking A man. FUCKING A. No way I am going to be able to see the VODs unspoiled either, I am going to be checking my phone as soon as I am done the test to see jaedongs win.
Well you cant beat me ! I have guard duty on saturday and will be missing the Flash Effort finals. FML Im a sad panda
On May 20 2010 16:53 Art.FeeL wrote: I really hope Jaedong to own this shit 3-0 so that he remains undefeated in May
Think he'll take the finals undefeated as well?
ah, i was talking about this semifinals. I hope for JD 3-0 Calm. As for the finals it could be any score. From 3-0 to 0-3. There really isn't any way to predict how JD vs Flash will turn out
I'm hoping Jaedong advances and defeat Flash in 5 hours long 3-2 bo5 marathon of the history. Just saying =) But ya, anything can happen in zVz... Pretty damn exciting!!
On May 20 2010 18:47 prosatan wrote: one question How can you split mutas like that? i saw effort do it first
Probably by doing a move command then deselecting 1 muta from group, then repeat until you're down to 1 muta. Only JD can do it that insanely fast though.
On May 20 2010 18:47 prosatan wrote: one question How can you split mutas like that? i saw effort do it first
Probably be doing a move command then deselecting 1 muta from group, then move again until you're down to 1 muta. Only JD can do it that insanely fast though.
Effort was actually the first one who has done that regularly since he usually has less mutas than the other player.
On May 20 2010 18:47 prosatan wrote: one question How can you split mutas like that? i saw effort do it first
Probably be doing a move command then deselecting 1 muta from group, then move again until you're down to 1 muta. Only JD can do it that insanely fast though.
Effort was actually the first one who has done that regularly since he usually has less mutas than the other player.
rofl Effort was not the first player to muta split
Jaedong is such a noob, he has to cheese to win /jab at all the anti-Flash fans who were pissy over Flash 8rax'ing and BBS'ing.
But damn, that was some impressive cheese, double sunkens with a 5 pool. When you're gonna cheese, don't half-ass it. Or single-ass it. Go all the waaaaaay.
why is everyone making such a big deal about jd's facial expression? he's like that all the time. I don't know if anyone remembers how "angry" jd was when he played vs ForGG, how did that helped him? he just got rolled. facial expressions mean shit.
On May 20 2010 19:01 whathappened wrote: Jaedong is such a noob, he has to cheese to win /jab at all the anti-Flash fans who were pissy over Flash 8rax'ing and BBS'ing.
But damn, that was some impressive cheese, double sunkens with a 5 pool. When you're gonna cheese, don't half-ass it. Or single-ass it. Go all the waaaaaay.
5pool is cheese in ZvZ as much as 12hat is econ cheese. A 9pool kills a 5pool right away on this map, the lings will be at the ramp before the 5 pool lings reach there. Calm went for the greediest build possible which is standard in this map due to rush distances and JD read him like an open book.
On May 20 2010 19:03 fallingdream wrote: why is everyone making such a big deal about jd's facial expression? he's like that all the time. I don't know if anyone remembers how "angry" jd was when he played vs ForGG, how did that helped him? he just got rolled. facial expressions mean shit.
No, when JD gets angry, he will destroy you even if he has to bend time and space.
I think Calm will overpool while JD 12-hatches. Great semis so far! Looking forward to seeing Jaedong play Flash again. Hopefully the MSL-people will buy a couple UPSs this time.
On May 20 2010 19:10 vietboi wrote: I expect both to go safe 9 pool or overpool. JD may go 12 hatch, but calm is so scared now that hes fosho gonna go safe.
That's not always a guarantee.
"Shit man, I better go fast pool next game in case he rushes again... Wait... what if that's his plan and then he 12hatches? I'll just 12hatch too. But... what if that's his plan and therefore he actually does pool first? :S"
On May 20 2010 19:10 vietboi wrote: I expect both to go safe 9 pool or overpool. JD may go 12 hatch, but calm is so scared now that hes fosho gonna go safe.
That's not always a guarantee.
"Shit man, I better go fast pool next game in case he rushes again... Wait... what if that's his plan and then he 12hatches? I'll just 12hatch too. But... what if that's his plan and therefore he actually does pool first? :S"
repeats
In Mafia, we call this WIFOM and it can rape your mind. Like Calm's is. Oh wait.
Hmm Jaedong playing safe with 12hatch in back expo. Calm out at normal expo. Triathlon is such a weird match.
C'mon Jaedong, take this match for a 3-0 and a 13-game win streak! And then we can write about how opponents along the way have been raped 3-0 along the way to destiny.
Doesn't work on my computer for some reason, the only thing I could read was I.E., so I'm assuming it only plays on Internet Explorer. Cheers for the help though.
On May 20 2010 19:18 flamewheel91 wrote: Holy shit Jaedong. So. Good.
o rly.
he lost.
Doesn't change what I said.
Either way, Jaedong just didn't multi well enough. He had the opportunity when engaging with mutalisks against Calm, since he had a few zerglings in Calm's nat already.
Mismicro and a few seconds later, Calm has the advantage.
Yeah, JD not with the best multitasking there, left those zerglings right outside Calms base for ages while microing his mutas (and Calm still microed better than him too).
On May 20 2010 19:22 flamewheel91 wrote: Ah shit, now we can't have all four of the MSL/OSL semifinals matches be 3-0. Also Jaedong would've tied his 13 game win streak with a 3-0. Ah, shiet.
Sexy zergling micro right there. Calm gets two lings in! They try sniping a drone. And fail :S
Jaedong moving with 4 lings across map! Calm with sunk and spire going? He has his ramp walled. JAEDONG SLIPS THROUGH THE CRACK! CALM IN JAEDONG'S BASE NOW!
Jaedong is awesome. That was some amazing play, with the hatch snipe, and the final attack. Splitting the lings to take out the hatch, while his mutas took on Calm's. Good games.
JD was playing so safe in the final moments of that game. He overestimated the amount of muta Calm had but it would've been the better thing to do in many other situations.
People who say JD is a mindless robot simply dont understand zvz . ZvZ is the most strategically demanding mu out of all the zerg match ups, and JVZ is the greatest mu in BW.
On May 20 2010 19:40 samachking wrote: People who say JD is a mindless robot simply dont understand zvz . ZvZ is the most strategically demanding mu out of all the zerg match ups, and JVZ is the greatest mu in BW.
Oh my god! So intense! I thought Jaedong had lost for sure when he couldn't destroy the sunkens, but then he came back to show who's the best ZvZ player in the world. JvZ!
commentators: congrats!! jd: thx~ commentators: its hard to get to the finals back 2 back ~ your thoughts? jd: there was a period where i was slumping in the midst of the msl but i'm happy i was able to get over it and get to the finals... i said my goal was to get to the finals so i'm half satisfied ~ i'll be fully satisfied by winning next week commentators: as you prepared for calm what did you think you should be careful of most jd: i tried to play zvz differently then i have thus far; calm prepares good builds and plays mind games so i didnt want to lose to that so i prepared differently~ commentators: what was the most significant game~ jd: the last game was the most significant~ commentators: is there something you want to show through hte finals this season? jd: personally i'm very happy with the finals match~ i'm happy i'll be playing the current best player so i think theres a big meaning in the finals; through the finals i'll show that the true winner and champion is me~ this will be my opportunity please look forward to it
On May 20 2010 19:41 SkelA wrote: JD was never really behind in the last game...
yeah; it's still impressive how badly he won the BO war: 2 mirrors and 2 hard counters in his favor
Actually Calm had a better bo in triathalon because he was able to scare JD with ling pressure forcing JD to build more lings while Calm was able to pump drones because of that. Remember JD can only pump lings from 1hat, so all he did with that main hat is pump pure ling, and Calm abused that to the victory.
commentators: words for your fans? jd: just like now there are so many fans cheering... even while i'm playing i gained a lot of strength so thank you~ during the finals next week (laughs) i hope you will cheer for me~ commentators: yes thank you~ prepare a lot and show great games! jd: thx~ ^^
On May 20 2010 19:40 flamewheel91 wrote: tbrown, games 2, 3, 4 all recommended? Actually hell it's a semis. Recommend them all.
Also remember that "bigger and grander" thing? It will come to fruition because of the result tonight. Keke.
Game 1 was strong multitasking, decent.
Game 2 was amazing.
Game 4 was amazing.
Game 3 was recommended so that Calm fans wouldn't hunt me down and burn me at the stake.
Edit: ALSO YES PERFECT PREDICTIONS!!!!
I don't know though... I feel like I didn't earn it, my other predictions I actually sit there and think about the maps for an hour, look at the teams make ups and who they've played etc. Here I just said, okay JD's favored first 2, Calm 3rd, JD 4th. K 3-1 thats good.
On May 20 2010 19:43 Smix wrote: commentators: congrats!! jd: thx~ commentators: its hard to get to the finals back 2 back ~ your thoughts? jd: there was a period i was slumping in the midst of hte msl but i'm happy i was able to get over it and get to the finals... i said my goal was to get to the finals so i'm half satisfied ~ i'll be fully satisfied by winning commentators: as you prepared for calm what did you think you should be careful o fmost jd: i tried to play zvz differently than i have thus far; calm prepares good builds and plays games so i didnt want to lose to taht so i prepared differently~ commentators: what was the game~ jd: the last game was the most significant~ commentators: is there something you want to show through hte finals this season? jd: personally i'm very happy with the finals match~ i'm happy i'll be playing the current best player so i think theres a big meaning in the finals; through the finals i'll show that the true winner and champion is me~ this will be my opportunity please look forward to it
Calm going 9 pool speedling bust JD totaly counter him with 10 hatch 10 pool . ( the worst thing you can do against this is 9 pool speedling) He lost the ling exchange preety bad. He barely defended waisting 2 drones on sunks and with really fast tech to muta but no economy to support making mutas. JD is on 2 hatch the whole time with more drones and just behind in tech but Calm cant use his tech because he have 6 drones total. And losing the 2nd hatch was huge.
How can anyone who have the slightest idea how zvz goes can say Calm had any sort of advantage in this game
For the finals, I demand a real stadium (aka not a blue box) with a lot of real people and a few backup-systems for basically everything that requires energy.
On May 20 2010 19:46 Malinor wrote: For the finals, I demand a real stadium (aka not a blue box) with a lot of real people and a few backup-systems for basically everything that requires energy.
On May 20 2010 19:46 Malinor wrote: For the finals, I demand a real stadium (aka not a blue box) with a lot of real people and a few backup-systems for basically everything that requires energy.
On May 20 2010 19:46 SkelA wrote: Ok lets see this.
Calm going 9 pool speedling bust JD totaly counter him with 10 hatch 10 pool . ( the worst thing you can do against this is 9 pool speedling) He lost the ling exchange preety bad. He barely defended waisting 2 drones on sunks and with really fast tech to muta but no economy to support making mutas. JD is on 2 hatch the whole time with more drones and just behind in tech but Calm cant use his tech because he have 6 drones total. And losing the 2nd hatch was huge.
How can anyone who have the slightest idea how zvz goes can say Calm had any sort of advantage in this game
i agree jaedong did look ahead longer than people seemed to think. however, he had to make spores just like calm had to make sunkens, calm didn't really lose that much mining time or that many drones, etc. if jaedong hadn't held off the expo so long it might have been very different
On May 20 2010 19:46 Malinor wrote: For the finals, I demand a real stadium (aka not a blue box) with a lot of real people and a few backup-systems for basically everything that requires energy.
On May 20 2010 19:46 SkelA wrote: Ok lets see this.
Calm going 9 pool speedling bust JD totaly counter him with 10 hatch 10 pool . ( the worst thing you can do against this is 9 pool speedling) He lost the ling exchange preety bad. He barely defended waisting 2 drones on sunks and with really fast tech to muta but no economy to support making mutas. JD is on 2 hatch the whole time with more drones and just behind in tech but Calm cant use his tech because he have 6 drones total. And losing the 2nd hatch was huge.
How can anyone who have the slightest idea how zvz goes can say Calm had any sort of advantage in this game
He never did. The only chance Calm had after those bos is to mass up mutas while taking his nat and then securing map control vs JD's late mutas allowing him to take a faster 3rd or deny JD's nat. However, Calm never got his nat up and his mutas couldnt defend vs the lings efficiently at all . After all those drones died and the fact that he got 2 sunks while JD got a spore, the game was over.
Calm played brilliantly though, if he didnt get that 2nd sunk and take off drones off gas while getting a muta for defence he wouldve been dead, heck any other zerg wouldve been dead. His play to get a quick nat was brilliant.
commentators: is there something you want to show through hte finals this season? jd: personally i'm very happy with the finals match~ i'm happy i'll be playing the current best player so i think theres a big meaning in the finals; through the finals i'll show that the true winner and champion is me~ this will be my opportunity please look forward to it
The good thing for Flash is that he only has to prepare for Zerg for both finals. So we'll have a very well prepared and warmed up Flash vs a ready to kill Jaedong. And this time, MBC will have learned it's lesson. This could be the last great finals SC will ever have.
It's more like he said He wanted to show He was the strongest of the era through these finals. I think Jaedong too can be referred to as Him. The only other imo. Jaedong is the best ever.
On May 20 2010 19:46 SkelA wrote: Ok lets see this.
Calm going 9 pool speedling bust JD totaly counter him with 10 hatch 10 pool . ( the worst thing you can do against this is 9 pool speedling) He lost the ling exchange preety bad. He barely defended waisting 2 drones on sunks and with really fast tech to muta but no economy to support making mutas. JD is on 2 hatch the whole time with more drones and just behind in tech but Calm cant use his tech because he have 6 drones total. And losing the 2nd hatch was huge.
How can anyone who have the slightest idea how zvz goes can say Calm had any sort of advantage in this game
I agree with you, it wasn't a comeback.
But I think it was a very good game anyway. Calm realized in time what he was up against and showed a perfect reaction imo, his drone saves were quite good, 2 sunkens necessary etc. He just couldn't win because he was starving for lava so much. JD also played nearly perfectly, first of all to chose a BO that you basically never see, and played it out like a champ.
On May 20 2010 19:46 SkelA wrote: Ok lets see this.
Calm going 9 pool speedling bust JD totaly counter him with 10 hatch 10 pool . ( the worst thing you can do against this is 9 pool speedling) He lost the ling exchange preety bad. He barely defended waisting 2 drones on sunks and with really fast tech to muta but no economy to support making mutas. JD is on 2 hatch the whole time with more drones and just behind in tech but Calm cant use his tech because he have 6 drones total. And losing the 2nd hatch was huge.
How can anyone who have the slightest idea how zvz goes can say Calm had any sort of advantage in this game
I think Calm was winning, he just needed to wait a bit longer until he had 3 or at least 2 mutas before taking his nat. He just got ahead of himself, only mining enough gas for one muta then trying to take the nat immediately. JD's lings were able to take it to half health right then.
Also I don't recall Calm ever having 6 drones total. And 10 hatch really isn't that good against 9 pool if you build the hatch in your main.
This final is going to be epic. It does not matter who will win, the forum will go crazy either way.
If Flash wins, the flash fanboys will start screaming that this is what would have happend if the powerouttage would not have given JD the win.
And if JD wins, his fanboys will say that this proves that JD > Flash and that the powerouttage did not matter last MSL finals.
The rest of us will just sit down and enjoy the ride. LAst MSL final was long time ago, what happend then is history. This is now, and whoever is in best form when the final is played will win.
On May 20 2010 19:54 tbrown47 wrote: updated results with... how do you say...
hotter? text?
The next logical step is to use animated GIFs of explosions (of increasing magnitude) for the recommended games. With a nuke for Flash vs Jaedong-level games.
On May 20 2010 20:09 Harem wrote: [07:08] <@Smix_> triathlon first set [07:09] <@Smix_> second set oddeye2 [07:09] <@Smix_> 3rd matchpoint [07:09] <@Smix_> 4th fighting spirit [07:09] <@Smix_> 5th triathlon
Map order for finals.
Urgh, why does it have to be Triathlon. Flash will do some valkyrie shit twice and lose -_-
(okay, they will find another way to fuck up the finals, but im pretty sure that theres no power outage to expect. what about giving flash some 486 cpu with like... no ram?)
I just wanna JD to win this final so that the Flash fanboys would just shutup or even better complain how Flash keyboard was off like 1 cm from his mouse loolol
On May 20 2010 20:12 Heimatloser wrote: prepare for a rematch of last msls finals!
THIS TIME, POWER OUTAGE WON'T HELP YOU JAEDONG!
(okay, they will find another way to fuck up the finals, but im pretty sure that theres no power outage to expect. what about giving flash some 486 cpu with like... no ram?)
Dont worry this time Flash wont have any excuse for his loose.
On May 20 2010 19:54 tbrown47 wrote: updated results with... how do you say...
hotter? text?
The next logical step is to use animated GIFs of explosions (of increasing magnitude) for the recommended games. With a nuke for Flash vs Jaedong-level games.
On May 20 2010 19:54 tbrown47 wrote: updated results with... how do you say...
hotter? text?
The next logical step is to use animated GIFs of explosions (of increasing magnitude) for the recommended games. With a nuke for Flash vs Jaedong-level games.
fuck not triathalon twice edit: I guess odd eye is more retardedly T>Z than it, but it would have been nice to have had fighting spirit as the bookends map
I seriously think that after 3rd game JD looked a bit shaken up. Fortunately midway through the 4th game he recollected himself. I mean that ling allin was really bad executed. It would've succeded if he split lings attacking both from south (like he did) and up where spire and sunken where.
I guess those who said that he lost to Calm in a Bo5 because he just did not practice were right. This is what happens when a well-prepared Dong meets an equally well-prepared Calm.
I really don't like the fact that Triathlon is going to be played twice in the finals, seems like a T-favored map. I hope the dong knows what he's doing thumbing down Odd-eye. ;;
Damn nice predictions in the OP. Just read the map stats and thought "wtf you can't judge shit based on that" and then it happened exactly how OP said it would.
On May 21 2010 01:42 Documentary wrote: I love it... in the rock, paper, scissors match that is ZvZ -- JD uses stapler...
So true. Set 4 was the definition of JvZ. I was so sure a 2-2 score was coming, but he picked himself up like the don that he is. Just for funs sake, here's set 1 of Kwanro vs. Calm from the Avalon MSL finals. Kwanro goes 5-pool. + Show Spoiler +
Flash facing the 2 best Zergs both in Starleague finals... with a chance to pretty much solidify his Legend status. TvZ is the classic Starcraft matchup! This is what its all about :D
Niiiice! The look on Jaedongs face is awesome. And it's even awesome-er that he doesn't even flinch when he loses game 3. He didn't take down Calm to go and win the MSL, he took down Calm so he can redeem himself against Flash.
I was really impressed by JD's maneuvers. too good to be true... now JD vs Flash round 2! Lucky Flash only needs to practice one matchup for both finals
At this point, I almost would hope that Flash doesn't give a shit about OSL and does all his preparation over the next 1.5 weeks for Jaedong. Can't wait >_>
wow that was a pretty good series. Can't say I'm disappointed at all, Calm played really good and so did JD, and now we get another Flash vs JD finals :D
just too bad JD had to cheese in 2 of the games :\
also I really hope we see the hype thread for finals go up SUPER fast
just too bad JD had to cheese in 2 of the games :\
he only cheesed in one game, imo. I don't think jaedong's 10 hatch was cheese as much as it was trying to psych out Calm (and, likely, Flash).
10h 9p 9g is pretty fucking cheesy
And if Calm had done it it would have been a "genius" build. Uhhhh huh
Bingo. Calm got wrecked, get over it.
nah JD did the same thing in the bacchus OSL finals so it's clearly just an established build. It's no BBS or 4pool but it's pretty cheesy. I'm not saying that it wasnt a smart build either, clearly it was a really good idea to do it lol.
On May 21 2010 05 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 21 2010 05 end_of_the_skype_highlighting:03 Ideas wrote:
On May 21 2010 04:56 Issorlol wrote:
On May 21 2010 04:44 Ideas wrote:
just too bad JD had to cheese in 2 of the games :\
he only cheesed in one game, imo. I don't think jaedong's 10 hatch was cheese as much as it was trying to psych out Calm (and, likely, Flash).
10h 9p 9g is pretty fucking cheesy
Zvz, the only match-up that has no cheese.
I don;t know, 5 pool sunken rush is pretty cheesy. The 10 hatch on the other hand is more like BSB imo or a 2 rax rush.
yea it's not 100% cheese but if you dont do a lot of damage with it or it's scouted early you're fucked, but it's super easy to pull off and beats a shitload of ZvZ openings (I think 12hatch is the only standard opening that is pretty safe vs it, and even then it's pretty hard).
shit last time JD did this in the OSL 75% of my ZvZs on ICCUP for a month were vs this build lol. I guess I should just stick to SC2B for a while...
On May 21 2010 05 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 21 2010 05 end_of_the_skype_highlighting:03 Ideas wrote:
On May 21 2010 04:56 Issorlol wrote:
On May 21 2010 04:44 Ideas wrote:
just too bad JD had to cheese in 2 of the games :\
he only cheesed in one game, imo. I don't think jaedong's 10 hatch was cheese as much as it was trying to psych out Calm (and, likely, Flash).
10h 9p 9g is pretty fucking cheesy
Zvz, the only match-up that has no cheese.
I don;t know, 5 pool sunken rush is pretty cheesy. The 10 hatch on the other hand is more like BSB imo or a 2 rax rush.
yea it's not 100% cheese but if you dont do a lot of damage with it or it's scouted early you're fucked, but it's super easy to pull off and beats a shitload of ZvZ openings (I think 12hatch is the only standard opening that is pretty safe vs it, and even then it's pretty hard).
shit last time JD did this in the OSL 75% of my ZvZs on ICCUP for a month were vs this build lol. I guess I should just stick to SC2B for a while...
you could just 12 hatch every map and if you lose to lings, just shrug it off....
9 hat 9 pool 9 gas 9 over hat, over and pool finish at same time, build zerglings until 18/18 speed @ 100 gas, take drones off attack with 1,5 groups lings, speed finishes when your last lings are halfway to his base.
First Impression: I actually practiced this build for CSL+ Playoffs vs University of Texas -> really all-in build, but works wonders even @ high level. I've beaten quite number of B-/B Zergs with this build.
Result: I've beaten B-/B Zergs approximately 50% of the time. Great build, but cheesy as fuck. Will die to 12hatch inbase or competent Zerg that goes 11/12pool variation. Replay: Note: This particular replay is vs a B/B+ Zerg (j2.Jolin) in a CSL+ Playoff match between UCSD and University of Texas, Austin, last season's runner-up. I got insanely lucky with this game, but would've have worked wonders against any 9pool variation.
On May 21 2010 11:58 poebae wrote: For the OP, the "Recommended Games" isn't really spoiler-free when + Show Spoiler +
there are only four games
It is Recommended Games, not Recommended Games and Not Recommended Games. If a game isn't listed there, then it isn't recommended, it doesn't mean a game isn't played. At least, that is how I have always done it... and I don't really see a reason to change it. Seems logical to me.
On May 21 2010 12:57 dybydx wrote: alrite boyz, we got another FvJ final. for the love of god, MBC better not f*ck this one up or else i am gonna have to kill a kitten.
On May 21 2010 11:58 poebae wrote: For the OP, the "Recommended Games" isn't really spoiler-free when + Show Spoiler +
there are only four games
It is Recommended Games, not Recommended Games and Not Recommended Games. If a game isn't listed there, then it isn't recommended, it doesn't mean a game isn't played. At least, that is how I have always done it... and I don't really see a reason to change it. Seems logical to me.
Yes, but usually Spoiler-Free indicates that there'll be nothing that will give away the result of a series. When I saw that + Show Spoiler +
there were only four games listed, I instantly realised that only four games were played, so after Jaedong took Set 3 I knew he'd won the series/
I'm sorry if I sound ungrateful at the effort made not to spoil a game, but I don't think it's too much effort to + Show Spoiler +
On May 21 2010 11:58 poebae wrote: For the OP, the "Recommended Games" isn't really spoiler-free when + Show Spoiler +
there are only four games
It is Recommended Games, not Recommended Games and Not Recommended Games. If a game isn't listed there, then it isn't recommended, it doesn't mean a game isn't played. At least, that is how I have always done it... and I don't really see a reason to change it. Seems logical to me.
You are the best LR threadmaker among some great LR threadmakers, imho, but here is why the way you do "recommended games" is a small spoiler: it's true it doesn't mean that the non-recommended games aren't played, but it does mean that the recommended games are played, so, for instance, someone watching game 3 of this series will know that Calm wins it, since there is a game 4. Spoiler tags for each game, played or not, would eliminate that kind of spoiler.
On May 21 2010 15:17 JohnColtrane wrote: wow you were spoiled...you must be suffering so bad
Why be snarky? He's not whining for the sake of whining, just pointing out a small thing that could make a great LR thread even better, without much additional effort.
On May 21 2010 11:58 poebae wrote: For the OP, the "Recommended Games" isn't really spoiler-free when + Show Spoiler +
there are only four games
It is Recommended Games, not Recommended Games and Not Recommended Games. If a game isn't listed there, then it isn't recommended, it doesn't mean a game isn't played. At least, that is how I have always done it... and I don't really see a reason to change it. Seems logical to me.
You are the best LR threadmaker among some great LR threadmakers, imho, but here is why the way you do "recommended games" is a small spoiler: it's true it doesn't mean that the non-recommended games aren't played, but it does mean that the recommended games are played, so, for instance, someone watching game 3 of this series will know that Calm wins it, since there is a game 4. Spoiler tags for each game, played or not, would eliminate that kind of spoiler.
On May 21 2010 15:17 JohnColtrane wrote: wow you were spoiled...you must be suffering so bad
Why be snarky? He's not whining for the sake of whining, just pointing out a small thing that could make a great LR thread even better, without much additional effort.
because im sick of people talking and worrying about being spoilered. alright, you know the victor, but you dont know how the game played out. what's the big problem? no need to wander around downbuzzing like a boy that's just had his last bit of bread pinched
you know what else would improve the lr thread? getting rid of all images and just having a spoilered text showing the results, so people like me dont have to worry about filling up my quota with useless pictures
How do people operate the recommended games anyway? Like do they open up each rec game spoiler tag to see if they should watch it? What if it's not recommended. Do they just go on to the next game?
On May 21 2010 11:58 poebae wrote: For the OP, the "Recommended Games" isn't really spoiler-free when + Show Spoiler +
there are only four games
It is Recommended Games, not Recommended Games and Not Recommended Games. If a game isn't listed there, then it isn't recommended, it doesn't mean a game isn't played. At least, that is how I have always done it... and I don't really see a reason to change it. Seems logical to me.
You are the best LR threadmaker among some great LR threadmakers, imho, but here is why the way you do "recommended games" is a small spoiler: it's true it doesn't mean that the non-recommended games aren't played, but it does mean that the recommended games are played, so, for instance, someone watching game 3 of this series will know that Calm wins it, since there is a game 4. Spoiler tags for each game, played or not, would eliminate that kind of spoiler.
On May 21 2010 15:17 JohnColtrane wrote: wow you were spoiled...you must be suffering so bad
Why be snarky? He's not whining for the sake of whining, just pointing out a small thing that could make a great LR thread even better, without much additional effort.
because im sick of people talking and worrying about being spoilered. alright, you know the victor, but you dont know how the game played out. what's the big problem? no need to wander around downbuzzing like a boy that's just had his last bit of bread pinched
you know what else would improve the lr thread? getting rid of all images and just having a spoilered text showing the results, so people like me dont have to worry about filling up my quota with useless pictures
People like you can set their browser not to show images from TL.net.
You might not care whether you know the result of a game before watching it, but some people do. Considering that the "recommended games" section does make an attempt to avoid spoilers, for the benefit of those people, I think it's fair to point out where it falls short.
On May 21 2010 16:03 Avidkeystamper wrote: How do people operate the recommended games anyway? Like do they open up each rec game spoiler tag to see if they should watch it? What if it's not recommended. Do they just go on to the next game?
open them in order: only open a tag if have watched/decided-not-to-watch the previous games.
On May 21 2010 11:58 poebae wrote: For the OP, the "Recommended Games" isn't really spoiler-free when + Show Spoiler +
there are only four games
It is Recommended Games, not Recommended Games and Not Recommended Games. If a game isn't listed there, then it isn't recommended, it doesn't mean a game isn't played. At least, that is how I have always done it... and I don't really see a reason to change it. Seems logical to me.
You are the best LR threadmaker among some great LR threadmakers, imho, but here is why the way you do "recommended games" is a small spoiler: it's true it doesn't mean that the non-recommended games aren't played, but it does mean that the recommended games are played, so, for instance, someone watching game 3 of this series will know that Calm wins it, since there is a game 4. Spoiler tags for each game, played or not, would eliminate that kind of spoiler.
On May 21 2010 15:17 JohnColtrane wrote: wow you were spoiled...you must be suffering so bad
Why be snarky? He's not whining for the sake of whining, just pointing out a small thing that could make a great LR thread even better, without much additional effort.
because im sick of people talking and worrying about being spoilered. alright, you know the victor, but you dont know how the game played out. what's the big problem? no need to wander around downbuzzing like a boy that's just had his last bit of bread pinched
you know what else would improve the lr thread? getting rid of all images and just having a spoilered text showing the results, so people like me dont have to worry about filling up my quota with useless pictures
People like you can set their browser not to show images from TL.net.
You might not care whether you know the result of a game before watching it, but some people do. Considering that the "recommended games" section does make an attempt to avoid spoilers, for the benefit of those people, I think it's fair to point out where it falls short.
On May 21 2010 16:03 Avidkeystamper wrote: How do people operate the recommended games anyway? Like do they open up each rec game spoiler tag to see if they should watch it? What if it's not recommended. Do they just go on to the next game?
open them in order: only open a tag if have watched/decided-not-to-watch the previous games.
On May 21 2010 15:17 JohnColtrane wrote: you know what else would improve the lr thread? getting rid of all images and just having a spoilered text showing the results, so people like me dont have to worry about filling up my quota with useless pictures
People like you can set their browser not to show images from TL.net.
It seems to be the commentators were really JD biased. When he had an advantage they were all excited and happy, when Calm was up, they were sad for JD/couldn't care less about Calm.
On May 21 2010 18:18 Emon_ wrote: It seems to be the commentators were really JD biased. When he had an advantage they were all excited and happy, when Calm was up, they were sad for JD/couldn't care less about Calm.
I'd think the fans would be the same. And I don't think the commentators have any requirement to be unbiased.
IMO the series was a lot closer than it looked. Calm almost had game 4 and then I wouldn't have been surprised if he pulled back to win game 5, he would have had all the momentum. Goes to show that even JvZ isn't what it used to be anymore.
On May 21 2010 18:33 writer22816 wrote: IMO the series was a lot closer than it looked. Calm almost had game 4 and then I wouldn't have been surprised if he pulled back to win game 5, he would have had all the momentum. Goes to show that even JvZ isn't what it used to be anymore.
So uh... the existence of the hypothetical scenario that Jaedong loses game 4 instead of winning it and then loses the next game, implies that JvZ isn't what it used to be anymore.
On May 21 2010 18:33 writer22816 wrote: IMO the series was a lot closer than it looked. Calm almost had game 4 and then I wouldn't have been surprised if he pulled back to win game 5, he would have had all the momentum. Goes to show that even JvZ isn't what it used to be anymore.
What are you talking about? first of all how can u say that hypothetically he could've won game 5? and when the hell was he ahead in game 4? he used money on sunkens, had almost no drones. got out 1 muta and that 1 muta in maybe 3minutes. Jaedong had 3 more larva wich he used to drone up quick, and IMO he was ahead almost all game. Do NOT know what part of ur body you think with!!!
On May 21 2010 12:51 tbrown47 wrote: It is Recommended Games, not Recommended Games and Not Recommended Games. If a game isn't listed there, then it isn't recommended, it doesn't mean a game isn't played. At least, that is how I have always done it... and I don't really see a reason to change it. Seems logical to me.
You are the best LR threadmaker among some great LR threadmakers, imho, but here is why the way you do "recommended games" is a small spoiler: it's true it doesn't mean that the non-recommended games aren't played, but it does mean that the recommended games are played, so, for instance, someone watching game 3 of this series will know that Calm wins it, since there is a game 4. Spoiler tags for each game, played or not, would eliminate that kind of spoiler.
I see, it makes a little more sense if you do the whole open 1 game at a time thing. Whenever I watched games I missed I just opened all of them so I could get all of the games I was gonna watch loaded up at once and watch them back to back quickly. I suppose if you did do the whole open one at a time thing, then it could prevent that problem if you do it. I guess I'll add a dummy spoiler.
On May 21 2010 12:51 tbrown47 wrote: It is Recommended Games, not Recommended Games and Not Recommended Games. If a game isn't listed there, then it isn't recommended, it doesn't mean a game isn't played. At least, that is how I have always done it... and I don't really see a reason to change it. Seems logical to me.
You are the best LR threadmaker among some great LR threadmakers, imho, but here is why the way you do "recommended games" is a small spoiler: it's true it doesn't mean that the non-recommended games aren't played, but it does mean that the recommended games are played, so, for instance, someone watching game 3 of this series will know that Calm wins it, since there is a game 4. Spoiler tags for each game, played or not, would eliminate that kind of spoiler.
I see, it makes a little more sense if you do the whole open 1 game at a time thing. Whenever I watched games I missed I just opened all of them so I could get all of the games I was gonna watch loaded up at once and watch them back to back quickly. I suppose if you did do the whole open one at a time thing, then it could prevent that problem if you do it. I guess I'll add a dummy spoiler.
I've always just done that, with separate spoiler tags for every game, and if a game isn't played, then I'll just write "no game." That way people can choose how much information they want to reveal to themselves.
Really REALLY looking forward to the finals. Gonna be REALLY hard to beat Flash now, but lets hope that Flash needing to focus on both MSL and OSL will make him less prepared then Jaedong.
On May 21 2010 18:33 writer22816 wrote: IMO the series was a lot closer than it looked. Calm almost had game 4 and then I wouldn't have been surprised if he pulled back to win game 5, he would have had all the momentum. Goes to show that even JvZ isn't what it used to be anymore.
What are you talking about? first of all how can u say that hypothetically he could've won game 5? and when the hell was he ahead in game 4? he used money on sunkens, had almost no drones. got out 1 muta and that 1 muta in maybe 3minutes. Jaedong had 3 more larva wich he used to drone up quick, and IMO he was ahead almost all game. Do NOT know what part of ur body you think with!!!
It's funny cus Jaedong said himself he was behind in that game. And tbh I don't get your thinking either.
Calm had 8 drones after Jaedong lost all his lings, Jaedong had 12. So what if Jaedong had 2 hatchery, are you kidding me? 3 extra larvas? He didn't have money to use them up anyway... and this is the pure basics of ZvZ: Calm had seriously more gas than Jaedong, and 8 drones which is enough to constantly pump out mutas. He also was perfectly safe vs lings thanks to his 2 sunks. So... had Calm just stayed cool and made mutas he would always be ahead in mutas and this, my friend, is the key to winning ZvZ.
Only Jae 'THE TYRANT' Dong could have pulled this off though, wow!
On May 21 2010 18:33 writer22816 wrote: IMO the series was a lot closer than it looked. Calm almost had game 4 and then I wouldn't have been surprised if he pulled back to win game 5, he would have had all the momentum. Goes to show that even JvZ isn't what it used to be anymore.
What are you talking about? first of all how can u say that hypothetically he could've won game 5? and when the hell was he ahead in game 4? he used money on sunkens, had almost no drones. got out 1 muta and that 1 muta in maybe 3minutes. Jaedong had 3 more larva wich he used to drone up quick, and IMO he was ahead almost all game. Do NOT know what part of ur body you think with!!!
It's funny cus Jaedong said himself he was behind in that game.
They will be playing Triathlon twice? Feels less epic then say two games on FS or any other map without lurker eggs. Hope the games will be epic anyway =)
On May 21 2010 17:57 grax wrote: Jaedong is tied for best human in the universe with Carl Sagan. I love him more than I love guacamole, and I love guacamole A LOT.
EPT![[image loading]](http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/3632/hanablackmsl.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i1037.photobucket.com/albums/a451/koreangosu/LJD-1.gif?t=1274325144)
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![[image loading]](http://i1037.photobucket.com/albums/a451/koreangosu/CALM.gif?t=1274325875)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/76.jpg)
Jaedong < Match Point > ![[image loading]](http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/7068/matchpoint.jpg)
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Rock, 
fOrGG, and... ![[image loading]](http://i1037.photobucket.com/albums/a451/koreangosu/cooltext459191867.gif?t=1274338200)
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at flaming text
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