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Active: 1431 users

SC2 World Ranking, Part 7: TvP

Blogs > Entirety
Post a Reply
Entirety
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
1423 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-14 18:04:17
August 13 2012 17:59 GMT
#1
Part 6: http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=360007

+ Show Spoiler [Introduction] +
Lately, I've heard lots of discussion about a StarCraft 2 World Ranking based on tournament results. Essentially, the concept is that you assign points for tournament rankings. Unfortunately, no matter how it is done, the ranking will always be subjective. One person may say that the GSL is worth as much as every other tournament combined, whereas another person may say that the GSL is worth about as much as a MLG.

How do I get around this "subjective" problem? Here's my answer: I'll let you choose the values!

That's right, I'm starting a project to create a World Ranking. The cool thing is that you get to choose how many points each victory is worth and more.


Now updated with "Ratios"! Please check the "How to Use" section for more info.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/43612415/World Ranking.xlsm

+ Show Spoiler [How to Use] +
The first sheet is known as "Values" and it is the only spreadsheet you should edit. Only edit the highlighted areas!

I have now changed the spreadsheet to work on ratios. First, start with the point ratios. Simply enter the points that you think a 1st place is worth compared to a 2nd place, a 3rd place, a 4th place, etc.

For example, if I enter 1,000 points for 1st place and 500 points for 2nd place, that means 1st place is worth double the amount of points as 2nd place. If another person thinks that 1st place is worth 3 times as much as 2nd place, he/she can put 1st place as 300 points and 2nd place at 100 points.

The section underneath that (highlighted with a darker shade), the one containing 3rd/4th, 5th/6th, etc. are optional. You can choose the values yourself if you want. If you do not, they work using averages (3rd/4th averages the points you gave for 3rd place and 4th place).

Next, enter the tournament ratios. For example, if I enter 10 points for GSL and 4 points for MLG, that means GSL will give out 2.5x as many points as MLG. Use these ratios to gauge relative importance of the tournaments. If you think MLG is worth half as much as GSL, make MLG 5 points and GSL 10 points, and so on.

The points are calculated by multiplying the tournament ratios with the point ratios. If I put 100 points for 1st place and 10 points for GSL, it will multiply the two values and give you 1,000 points for GSL 1st place. Here's another example:

Say I choose these values: 1st place = 1,000 points, 2nd place = 500 points. GSL = 10 points, MLG = 4 points.

GSL 1st = 1,000*10 = 10,000 points
GSL 2nd = 500*10 = 5,000 points
MLG 1st = 1,000*4 = 4,000 points
MLG 2nd = 500*4 = 2,000 points

The "Sort" button will automatically sort the lists in order of points.

The sheet known as "Rankings" has the ultimate ranking which you are looking for.


+ Show Spoiler [Regression] +
One thing that is very popular in point rankings such as this is the concept of regression. Basically, your points degrade over time, meaning that a GSL today is worth more than a GSL one year ago. I completely agree with this idea, so I've included this.

The sheet "Values" has a "Regression Factor" which you can edit. Right now, the spreadsheet only supports simple regression - exponential decay. Here's how the regression model works:

New Point Value = Original Point Value * (Regression Factor)^(# of Days since the Tournament)

The value I prefer is "0.99769217652702". If you use this value, the number of points will be halved after 300 days (so 10,000 points becomes 5,000 points), the number of points will be 25% after 600 days (so 10,000 points becomes 2,500 points), and so on.

You may choose your own value! If you do not wish to use regression (you think a GSL from one year ago is worth exactly the same as a GSL today), then simply use the value "1".


However, this is not completed yet! In fact, I need your help!

+ Show Spoiler [Checklist] +
Iron Squid
TSL
Red Bull LAN
Assembly
WCG
WCS
HomeStory
OSL
ESWC
BlizzCon
GSL Code A
Other major tournaments/one-off tournaments (such as IPL Hot Import Nights, GSL All-Stars Invitational, MLG Global Invitational, etc.)
Tournament rankings without prize pool (such as MLG 9th place)


+ Show Spoiler [My Progress] +
Part 1: I started this project on Google Spreadsheets and added the three GSL Open Seasons. NesTea topped the rankings with his GSL Open Season win.

Part 2: I added all of the GSL Code S seasons including the World Championship, Super Tournament, and Blizzard Cup. I also moved the project to Microsoft Excel, which is much much faster than Google Spreadsheets. With the addition of more GSL seasons, the GSL king (also known as Mvp) topped the rankings.

Part 3: I added IPL. I changed the spreadsheet into a macro-enabled spreadsheet and protected each sheet except "Values". The addition of IPL allowed Squirtle to break the top ten!

Part 4: I added MLG. MLG gave a lot of points to DongRaeGu and MarineKing, and they rose many places. MC, MMA, and Leenock also rose some places, while NesTea didn't gain any points.

Part 5: I added DreamHack. A high placement in DreamHack allowed Genius to overtake aLive and break into the top 10.

Part 6: I added IEM. Also, I changed the "Values" system to work with ratios rather than point values for each "cluster" of tournaments. Ratios are more flexible in general.

Part 7: I added Top 16 for each DreamHack tournament (before, only the placements with prize money were included in the ranking). Also, I added the NASL, causing PuMa and Stephano to enter the rankings.


+ Show Spoiler [How You Can Help!] +
I need lists of tournament rankings. First, I need the name of the tournament, and the date it ended. Then, I need a list of players starting from 1st place until last place. Here's an example:

GSL Open Season 1
10/2/2010

FruitDealer
RainBOw
Ensnare
LiveForever
HongUn
InCa
Maka
TricKsteR
anypro
Check
Clide
Hyperdub
LegalMind
Nettie
San
TOP
IdrA
JookTo
justfake
Keeping
Maru
Polt
TaeJa
Tankboy
TheWinD
TLO
ZanDarke
Zenio
Aory
Artosis
Astraea
BrEEzE
Cella
Cezanne
Chipmunk
Dos
FoCuS
Genius
Gerrard
GuineaPig
Hansin
JiTaeHoon
jjonga
JSL
Junwi
LosirA
MC
miso
Myth
NesTea
New
RenieHouR
SengKun
Sopia
Spunky
SSoja
TorcH
Wind
Xian
Yong

My next goal is foreign tournaments. Do not worry about Code A yet!


Finally, here is my own ranking:

+ Show Spoiler +
1. 26,902 Mvp
2. 23,336 MC
3. 23,276 DongRaeGu
4. 19,089 MMA
5. 16,077 NesTea
6. 14,258 MarineKing
7. 9,871 Seed
8. 9,855 Polt
9. 9,072 PuMa
10. 8,907 Stephano

MC has overtaken DongRaeGu with his NASL Season 1 finish, while PuMa and Stephano have made their entrances. I know that some people may say PuMa isn't as good as other players such as Squirtle, while Stephano is a foreigner and doesn't belong in the top 10. Actually, I think these two have earned their places because they have placed high in many many tournaments.

Remember, this ranking ranks accomplishments, not skill level. Mvp is not the most skilled player in the world right now, but he has accomplished the most.


My favorite matchup is TvZ, followed by TvT, followed by ZvZ. After that, it used to be ZvP... but now, ZvP is my least favorite matchup, partly because it's so common nowadays and partly because it's just boring. 2-base all-ins, 3-base timing attacks, Infestor/Brood Lord, Mothership/Archon. Those define the matchup and it's become stale to watch.

Recently, I've been surprised by how much I'm enjoying a different matchup: TvP. I used to greatly dislike TvP because of how fragile the Protoss looked in the early game, how it was full of 1-1-1s, Protoss timings, Terran stim timings, and the focus on one lategame big battle. If EMPs landed, then then Terran steamrolled, if Storms landed, Protoss steamrolled. That's how it seemed to me, but I was very wrong.

Watching the NASL Season 1 Finals and NASL Season 2 Finals (MC vs. PuMa, HerO vs. PuMa) made me realize that TvP is a very skill-oriented matchup. When I watch a select group of players who really know how to play TvP/PvT (which include Polt, PuMa, HerO, MC, Squirtle, TaeJa, MarineKing, and PartinG as the notable ones), it's almost beautiful to see. When two of those players clash against each other, the games that result are highly interesting and epic. I never thought I would say this, but TvP is slowly becoming my favorite matchup.

Honestly, part of its allure is that TvP seems balanced. TvZ still seems Zerg-favored unless it's TaeJa (but TvZ is slowly fixing itself and the new changes Blizzard is considering will go a long way), while ZvP is just a nightmare in the lategame (Vortex isn't very fun to watch...). TvP, while many people consider the Protoss to be stronger in the lategame, still has many many opportunities for the Terran to win. Terrans win in the early game (proxy rax vs. Squirtle ), in the midgame (with drops and multi-prong aggression, see MarineKing), and in the lategame (yes, it's not a myth, Terrans do win the lategame too).

I love how matchups progress and show us something new. (ZvP being an exception because it seems to be mostly 'figured out'...)

Question for you: What tournament shall I add next?

Part 8: http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=360514

*****
IMMvp (정종현) | Fan Club: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=211431
Luepert
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States1933 Posts
August 13 2012 18:13 GMT
#2
I love these, I can't wait until it's completely up to date.
esports
nttea
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Sweden4353 Posts
August 13 2012 22:22 GMT
#3
I don't know! but good job i liked this
Bagration
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United States18282 Posts
August 14 2012 01:38 GMT
#4
Don't work yourself too hard. I (and I'm sure many others) appreciate all the work you are doing, but don't kill yourself over this please
Team Slayers, Axiom-Acer and Vile forever
Entirety
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
1423 Posts
August 14 2012 01:42 GMT
#5
Don't worry, there's a reason why I'm only adding one tournament per day.

If no one suggests a particular tournament I should add, I'll just go down the checklist.
IMMvp (정종현) | Fan Club: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=211431
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