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The only thing i do win is when i'm not doing what every Z seems to do (3hatchspire5hydras).
I mean, whenever i scout with my ovi or drone i always see fast forge / nexus. So ok i can do this 3hspire5hydras shit.
But what i don't like about this build is how the hell am i supposed to counter the first zealots ?
So i had to find it myself, so far stop making drone at my 1st base after like 12ish drones in my main and change to zerglings seems to be working.
Now there's the corsair. Ok fine, with this build i mostly lose only 1 ovi before i'm chasing the corsair with scourges. But then when the fuck do you make hydras ? Cauz he already have 20 speedlot +1 and i can't do shit.
Another thing that really pisses me off is DT. GOD. Can't stand them. Pisses me off to no end.
What i lack is macro and lack of attention @ the minimap.
Even by playing this game for 10 years and a lot of iccup i just can't improve or change my style which really is killing me...
C+/C player in case you need to know... 
Need confidence...
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Kentor
United States5784 Posts
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no seriously yeah thats the first thing i thought when i started reading the content
use literally correctly please
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Now when we're all bashing his english i want to point out literally is not only misused it's also misspelled! i do this because i can't really help you since I'm c- ^^ but i didn't find any p winning convincingly against me yet, just the fucking t's and z's.
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The title is an exact capture of my feelings of zvp.
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Sorry english isn't my native language. Can't edit my title now.
Seriously i'm really lost, played the entire day and lost like 10 straight zvp, just because i can't get all the timing right
I mean i can do a 90 supply in 9 minutes using this strat, but in iccup i just can't stick to my plan and get steamrolled everytime.
I just have NO confidence at all... Be it macro, lack minimap attention, lack of dodging drop, everything... GAH.
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Try switching up your builds a bit. Do some ling run-bys and hydra rushes especially in best-of 3's or 5's type series. It's a big help as P when the Z does nothing to pressure you early on with speedlings or early hydras. I mean if you wanted to get some wins with confidence just go 2 hat range hydra rush, especially on destination. Also you can try 9pool speed or overpool speed into 2 hatch muta. The timing works so their scouting sair runs into your newly hatched scourge and they immediately plant cannons but your mutas get there in time to shut it down and it's a fast game.
I want to try and create an analogy to help. Generally, in PvT, the protoss player needs to do some form of harass (generally via reaver harassment) to slow and disrupt the terran's play or else the P player often times ends up at a disadvantage. I would say this is similar to what Z needs to do in ZvP. By pressuring the P, even if all you do is make them anxious by being diligent about killing their initial probe scout and not letting anymore scout you, it helps a lot.
Also, try going hydra den only and then adding a spire as soon as his sair is done scouting you. The P player probably won't be inclined to make many sairs if he sees you're going all hydra and he likely won't add cannons/any more cannons to his mineral lines. This delayed muta thing is really annoying and you can always use the mutas for sniping templars before you go in with your hydras.
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I personally get hydras when i have my third up and running with enough drones at each mining base. Also, if you scout speedlots get lurkers. I personally always get lurker tech when going 5 hatch hydra.
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don't do the hydra shit. use a couple lurkers, a couple sunkens, a couple spores. get to hive. then you're invincible and can autowin.
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On August 04 2009 16:01 RaiZ wrote:The only thing i do win is when i'm not doing what every Z seems to do (3hatchspire5hydras). I mean, whenever i scout with my ovi or drone i always see fast forge / nexus. So ok i can do this 3hspire5hydras shit. But what i don't like about this build is how the hell am i supposed to counter the first zealots ? So i had to find it myself, so far stop making drone at my 1st base after like 12ish drones in my main and change to zerglings seems to be working. Now there's the corsair. Ok fine, with this build i mostly lose only 1 ovi before i'm chasing the corsair with scourges. But then when the fuck do you make hydras ? Cauz he already have 20 speedlot +1 and i can't do shit. Another thing that really pisses me off is DT. GOD. Can't stand them. Pisses me off to no end. What i lack is macro and lack of attention @ the minimap. Even by playing this game for 10 years and a lot of iccup i just can't improve or change my style which really is killing me... C+/C player in case you need to know... Need confidence... If your not good with the regular builds why are you doing them? Why don't you attempt to play hungry zerg?
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Im B zerg and have had the same trouble you seem to be having.
3 hatch spire into 5 hatch hyds is very hard to do vs any toss that knows the perfect build. Or just make speedlots and being able to macro somewhat decently.
Unless you have really good multitasking (being able to do muta micro while building the right stuff depending on what the toss have) If you can do this as a zerg the build is VERY strong. Otherwise it is VERY weak.
I recommend 5 hatch hyd or ling/lurks into delayed muts if you have trouble doing the above things. With 5 hatch hyds you get the macro going before you have to muta micro later. So much easier.
Then when your multitasking is better you can try out the 3 hatch spire build again.
Just my oppinion.
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On August 04 2009 16:49 Jonoman92 wrote:
Try switching up your builds a bit. Do some ling run-bys and hydra rushes especially in best-of 3's or 5's type series. It's a big help as P when the Z does nothing to pressure you early on with speedlings or early hydras. I mean if you wanted to get some wins with confidence just go 2 hat range hydra rush, especially on destination. Also you can try 9pool speed or overpool speed into 2 hatch muta. The timing works so their scouting sair runs into your newly hatched scourge and they immediately plant cannons but your mutas get there in time to shut it down and it's a fast game.
I want to try and create an analogy to help. Generally, in PvT, the protoss player needs to do some form of harass (generally via reaver harassment) to slow and disrupt the terran's play or else the P player often times ends up at a disadvantage. I would say this is similar to what Z needs to do in ZvP. By pressuring the P, even if all you do is make them anxious by being diligent about killing their initial probe scout and not letting anymore scout you, it helps a lot.
Also, try going hydra den only and then adding a spire as soon as his sair is done scouting you. The P player probably won't be inclined to make many sairs if he sees you're going all hydra and he likely won't add cannons/any more cannons to his mineral lines. This delayed muta thing is really annoying and you can always use the mutas for sniping templars before you go in with your hydras.
What if you don't like doing too many all in builds because you don't like that type of play or you don't want to be seen as someone going for easy wins? I too suffer from losing when i go fully straight up, but don't know if i have to go really early pressure to have to win. I can runby, i don't mind that.
Would 3 hat muta be a nice aggressive opening, forces p to change opening a little, forces econ to slow down with cannons/sairs, and my micros good.
I just vs my friend 5 times, won once with runby and macro, 3 times with 3 hat muta -> 5 hat hydra, lost once with 3 hat scourge -> 5 hat hydra, late mutas as usual.
Also your on my LKL team, practice with me!
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EPT
