Jesus said that faith was not for those who are well, but only those who are sick. So I guess if you do feel like you're a good person and don't need God that's fine for you, but there are people in this world who do need God's forgiveness and have their lives changed as a result.
Sorry was reading a bit outta this and figured I post a flaw.
So what Jesus is saying is that if you are not sick you are unable to become a Christian? People who are well pretty much are like homeless people?
How about instead of talking through the bible and talking through the words of otheres talking through your own mind. It's not like you are some kind of worthless vessel.
Reading Friedrich Nietzsche in this matter might help a lot .
A few things i want you all to think about :
1) A ''good'' religion is by definition a religion who accepts almost any other religion
2) A ''good''/''free'' religion without ''hell/sin'' is doomed to ''die'' ( * )
3) Ever thought about it : The way the church is working nowadays and how many people are just praying , not reflecting and thinking about religion/jesus/god is exactly what Jesus DID NOT WANT THE PEOPLE TO DO. Do you realize that partly the church is exactly behaving in a way which jesus didnt want to..
* the religion wont die, but i expect that in a certain time, we will see a development : the number of religious people will drastically decrease. Only a few , very few will still be ''christians'' in the end and there will be the ''old'' religion invented by jesus, without money involved and only lived by a little little number of truly faithful people.
PhiL
p.s : God is almighty ?
Tell god to create a stone so heavy , that he can not lift him.
( i know this isnt proving anything and does not have to do much with this matter and thread at all so dont feel supposed to comment it..i know its something entirely different .. para.. anyone.. )
I think the core idea from the bible is to simply be a good person but unfortunately too many people think the bible is literal. The book is a fictional account that outlines (generally) how good people should live... humility... love for ones family... doing the right thing.. generosity... yada yada yada...
Now we use Christianity to hate gays, bomb counties, and point the finger at our neighbor to show them how fucked up their life is while ignoring all that's wrong in our own lives.
On September 25 2007 03:58 Tyrant wrote: I think the core idea from the bible is to simply be a good person but unfortunately too many people think the bible is literal. The book is a fictional account that outlines (generally) how good people should live... humility... love for ones family... doing the right thing.. generosity... yada yada yada...
Now we use Christianity to hate gays, bomb counties, and point the finger at our neighbor to show them how fucked up their life is while ignoring all that's wrong in our own lives.
praise jesus!
Wrong. the core idea from the bible is not simply to be a good person, but its to accept jesus as your savior and have faith in him.
On September 25 2007 06:04 TesisMech wrote: it does actually, and there is more videos on his account
No, it doesn't. His assertion that the cause of our universe is intelligent has no support. To paraphrase him: "We exist therefore some intelligence must've created us." That is a circular argument.
As for the Earth being 6,000 years old... yeah, I suppose the Bible does say that in a roundabout way with its Genealogies, but it clearly states the Earth is flat. Is the Earth flat?
On September 25 2007 06:21 Mindcrime wrote: As for the Earth being 6,000 years old... yeah, I suppose the Bible does say that in a roundabout way with its Genealogies, but it clearly states the Earth is flat. Is the Earth flat?
It does? Could you quote where because it wasn't so clear to me.
On September 25 2007 06:04 TesisMech wrote: it does actually, and there is more videos on his account
but it clearly states the Earth is flat. Is the Earth flat?
Thats a pretty strong emphasis you have there, all bolded and everything. The only thing it really speaks of is the corners of the earth, or ends of the earth. Lets not forget that there are oceans and the north and south pole, and the word "earth" is lowercase, which most likely means that its the stuff you walk on, inhabitable areas. If I was living a few thousand years ago, the ocean would be essentally where the earth ended, because there would be no means to go past that point.
Just like right now, when we say "we" we are probably referring to humans, because we don't know if other intelligent life exists in the universe.
On September 25 2007 06:21 Mindcrime wrote: As for the Earth being 6,000 years old... yeah, I suppose the Bible does say that in a roundabout way with its Genealogies, but it clearly states the Earth is flat. Is the Earth flat?
It does? Could you quote where because it wasn't so clear to me.
Yeah I would like that too if your gonna put such stupid accusations of the Bible
On September 25 2007 06:21 Mindcrime wrote: As for the Earth being 6,000 years old... yeah, I suppose the Bible does say that in a roundabout way with its Genealogies, but it clearly states the Earth is flat. Is the Earth flat?
It does? Could you quote where because it wasn't so clear to me.
"And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH." -Isaiah 11:12
"And after these things I saw four angels standing on FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree." - Revelation 7:1
"That it might take hold of the ENDS OF THE EARTH, that the wicked might be shaken out of it?" - Job 38:13
O" LORD, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come unto thee from the ENDS OF THE EARTH, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit." - Jeremiah 16:19
Should we add more references? Theres dozens... Some might say that their referring to the cardinal directions of north, south, east, west. But can you deny it?
Never the less, we're not here to attack the clearity of the bible, that could go on forever. Because even I believe that the bible doesn't truly teach people that the earth is flat, but an argument used by skeptics to try to discredit the bible. However, my post just merely stated references that could be interpreted as that teaching.
On September 25 2007 06:21 Mindcrime wrote: As for the Earth being 6,000 years old... yeah, I suppose the Bible does say that in a roundabout way with its Genealogies, but it clearly states the Earth is flat. Is the Earth flat?
It does? Could you quote where because it wasn't so clear to me.
"And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH." -Isaiah 11:12
"And after these things I saw four angels standing on FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree." - Revelation 7:1
"That it might take hold of the ENDS OF THE EARTH, that the wicked might be shaken out of it?" - Job 38:13
O" LORD, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come unto thee from the ENDS OF THE EARTH, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit." - Jeremiah 16:19
Should we add more references? Theres dozens... Some might say that their referring to the cardinal directions of north, south, east, west. But can you deny it?
Never the less, we're not here to attack the clearity of the bible, that could go on forever. Because even I believe that the bible doesn't truly teach people that the earth is flat, but an argument used by skeptics to try to discredit the bible. However, my post just merely stated references that could be interpreted as that teaching.
"Some Bible critics have claimed that Revelation 7:1 assumes a flat earth since the verse refers to angels standing at the "four corners" of the earth. Actually, the reference is to the cardinal directions: north, south, east, and west"
"Perhaps no phrase in Scripture has been so controversial as the phrase, "the four corners of the earth." The word translated "corners," as in the phrase above, is the Hebrew word, KANAPH. Kanaph is translated in a variety of ways. However, it generally means extremity.
It is translated "borders" in Numbers 15:38. In Ezekiel 7:2 it is translated "four corners" and again in Isaiah 11:12 "four corners." Job 37:3 and 38:13 as "ends."
You see, with religion, I can ask you if "those were for a fact what was intended behind what the words meant." You couldn't possibly answer that because you, nor I, truly know the meaning behind the words.
Religion is a never ending cycle and you can't delve too deeply in it before you lose your logical reasoning. Nothing is wrong with religion, it's just widely more manipulative than anything else in the world.
The problem is that when we say some terms are taken literal in the bible,including also paraboles etc. for some reason scientists ignore this and still conclude what they want ignoring the literal elements of the book.
Just like in this discussion, atheist use this and they conclude with no real proof or evidence that the "Bible says that the Earth is flat!" and you call the bible manipulation?
On September 25 2007 09:29 TesisMech wrote: The problem is that when we say some terms are taken literal in the bible,including also paraboles etc. for some reason scientists ignore this and still conclude what they want ignoring the literal elements of the book.
Just like in this discussion, atheist use this and they conclude with no real proof or evidence that the "Bible says that the Earth is flat!" and you call the bible manipulation?
No no no no, you have it wrong my friend. Unlike you, scientists actually LIKE thoroughly examining evidence and creating logical theories around it, instead of blindly accepting ideas.
EPT
