|
I will start with Shinhan 2008 ProLeague, because that's the oldest season of ProLeague that I could find information on the overall scores for all of the teams, and I don't want to spend six hours counting the overall scores of every team for five years worth of ProLeague schedule.
The first thing I will look into is the players with a good performance in the regular season and the play-offs, and will look into how much their team won without the gamer in question playing for the team.
1. Flash in Shinhan 2008 ProLeague
Flash's total number of victories: 17
KT Rolster's total number of victories without Flash (one-versus-one games only): 20
Flash's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 45.95%
This was the season that gave birth to the nickname, "Child Labour Terran". Flash had absolutely zero support from his team as his ProLeague heroics failed to launch his lackluster team to the play-off rounds.
2. Jaedong in Shinhan 2008/2009 ProLeague
Jaedong's total number of victories: 63
Hwaseung Oz's total number of victories without Jaedong: 79
Jaedong's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 44.37%
In perhaps one of the most heart-breaking tale of one superlative player failing miserably in his attempt to overthrow an empire. Jaedong dragged his lifeless team to second place in the 2009 Winners League, and to second place in ProLeague.
3. Jaedong in Shinhan 2009/2010 ProLeague
Jaedong's total number of victories: 52
Hwaseung Oz's total number of victories without Jaedong: 73
Jaedong's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 41.6%
Jaedong had a dip in form the following year, but his team also did even worse without him than the year before.
4. Flash in Shinhan 2008/2009 ProLeague
Flash's total number of victories: 54
KT Rolster's total number of victories without Flash: 76
Flash's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 41.54%
Flash slaved away for his useless team, but accomplished nothing due to his less than stellar teammates.
5. Leta in Shinhan 2009/2010 ProLeague
Leta's total number of victories: 43
HITE Sparkyz's total number of victories without Light: 64
Light's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 40.19%
HITE Sparkyz was plagued by key members of the match-fixing scandal, and people were leaking replays left and right in order to fix matches. Leta somehow still managed to maintain his form despite having his key strategies leaked by backstabbing teammates who sold out for financial reasons.
6. Pure in Shinhan 2008 ProLeague
Pure's total number of victories: 14
WeMade Fox's total number of victories without Pure (one-versus-one games only): 22
Pure's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 38.89%
Pure had the performance of his lifetime in this season of the ProLeague, but it was ultimately all a fruitless endeavour, especially since nobody cares about what Pure did in the past.
7. Flash in Shinhan 2009/2010 ProLeague
Flash's total number of victories: 61
KT Rolster's total number of victories without Flash: 96
Flash's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 38.85%
A story of a one man team with a happy ending for once. Flash put his mediocre team on his back, and carried them all the way to glory in both the 2010 Winners League, and the entire ProLeague season versus the SK Telecom T1 empire. A somewhat stark contrast to the year before when SK Telecom T1 was able to break Jaedong.
8. Bisu in Shinhan 2008/2009 ProLeague
Bisu's total number of victories: 55
SK Telecom T1's total number of victories without Bisu: 101
Bisu's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 35.26%
This was the period, in my opinion, when Bisu was at the peak of his powers. Bisu was doing fantastic in the ProLeague, and was able to accompany that with respectable individual leagues placings. Bisu played a huge part in SK Telecom T1 revival as a top level team before FanTaSy had yet to establish himself as a carrying force for the team.
9. Light in Shinhan 2009/2010 ProLeague
Light's total number of victories: 49
MBC Game HERO's total number of victories without Light: 97
Light's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 33.56%
Light was at the peak of his powers, making MBC Game HERO relevant once again, and although Sea was decent, Light was the true driving force behind his team's resurgence.
10. Leta in Shinhan 2008/2009 ProLeague
Leta's total number of victories: 49
OGN Sparkyz's Rolster's total number of victories without Leta: 99
Leta's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 33.11%
The "Miracle Boy" worked his magic in an unprecedented thirteen ACE-match victories in this season, a number that has never been seen before, or since. Leta was literally the only reason why OGN Sparkyz managed to reach the play-off rounds this season.
11. Jaedong in Shinhan 2010/2011 ProLeague
Jaedong's total number of victories: 51
Hwaseung Oz's total number of victories without Jaedong: 105
Jaedong's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 32.69%
Jaedong slaved away for yet another season, but his team was not a high-calibre team by any means. Hwaseng Oz would disband after this season, and Jaedong would never again find his original form after being moved to Team 8, a hastily created joke of a team with zero infrastructure.
|
|
|
I'll add some players who played when both one-versus-one and two-versus-two games were played more of a role in the ProLeague, one step at a time.
Reach in KTF EVER Cup ProLeague
Reach's total number of victories: 16 (both one-versus-one, and two-versus-two victories added)
KTF MagicNs' total number of victories without Reach: 8
Reach's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 66.67%
July in SKY 2005 ProLeague R2
July's total number of victories: 20 (both one-versus-one, and two-versus-two victories added)
POS' total number of victories without July: 21
July's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 48.78%
NaDa in SKY 2005 ProLeague R2
NaDa's total number of victories: 19 (both one-versus-one, and two-versus-two victories added)
Pantech and Curitel Curriors's total number of victories without NaDa: 22
NaDa's contributions to the total number of his team's victories: 46.34%
|
Part about JD is a lie. He was supported all season by PirateZerg, MustacheZerg and OzSucksBallsWithoutMeZerg.
|
As an OZ fan, the reverse all kill in the WL finals and the personal tragedy of JDs performance in the PL final 2008/9 still hurts :[ Hmm, I think I need to watch the 2007 finals again.
|
This is obviously purely hypothetical but i always wondered if JD would have been better/worse/same if he was on another team back then. Not even talking about his team8 days, that one seems clear enough.
But even his OZ days, sure he was the star and thus probably got better treatment, but other teams could have maybe had more ressources or better practice in general. Though iirc SKT and KT had a gentlemen's agreement to not get him? I think i heard something like that.
|
On September 07 2017 21:54 Keniji wrote:
As an OZ fan, the reverse all kill in the WL finals and the personal tragedy of JDs performance in the PL final 2008/9 still hurts :[ Hmm, I think I need to watch the 2007 finals again.
You just reopened a wound that never healed. Ugh.
|
Edit: thanks, good job 
|
|
|
I forgot all about "child labor terran"... ah the memories.
|
Jaedong should have pulled a Durant and just joined KT.
|
On September 07 2017 23:22 The_Red_Viper wrote:
This is obviously purely hypothetical but i always wondered if JD would have been better/worse/same if he was on another team back then. Not even talking about his team8 days, that one seems clear enough.
But even his OZ days, sure he was the star and thus probably got better treatment, but other teams could have maybe had more ressources or better practice in general. Though iirc SKT and KT had a gentlemen's agreement to not get him? I think i heard something like that.
. . . I really question why people make these type of comments. I know you started posting stuff around SC2 bud, but come on. Just because they are on a separate team man doesn't mean they don't practice with other players from other teams. In fact, if you were watching PL back then you would notice players thanking other players from other teams all the time.
Koreans are so modest that more often than not when asked about rivalries they would laugh and say I didn't even know I had a rivalry. It wasn't until players like Jaedong and Flash were battling it out head to head that they would take notice of a rivalry.
So no.. team has little to do with it. There are countless of examples of teams with players who made it and they would say they didn't just scrimmage with their teammates all the time just like they would say in SC2.
|
I never said that players couldn't play against people from other teams. But just from watching the JD documentary and the nalra series, etc it seems like they still mostly practiced with teammates.
It's also not only about practicing directly, there are different coaches, just talking with your teammates, etc.
So i rather question why you would quote me here, i don't think my hypothetical is that absurd at all.
|
On September 07 2017 23:22 The_Red_Viper wrote:
This is obviously purely hypothetical but i always wondered if JD would have been better/worse/same if he was on another team back then. Not even talking about his team8 days, that one seems clear enough.
But even his OZ days, sure he was the star and thus probably got better treatment, but other teams could have maybe had more ressources or better practice in general. Though iirc SKT and KT had a gentlemen's agreement to not get him? I think i heard something like that.
We're in the land of make-believe here. There's nothing of value of what I'm about to say, but for fun, let's look into the all the teams that ever existed:
CJ Entus
An upgrade in terms of infrastructure and quality of practice partners. It would have been interesting to see the dynamic between Jaedong, EffOrt, and hydra.
Estro
Hell no.
KT Rolster
Flash was the alpha of the team. Jaedong's experience as a player for KT Rolster would hinge on his dynamic with Flash, and I'm not certain how that would play out.
Alpha-males don't always co-operate with the introduction of another alpha. When Didi came to Real Madrid after winning the World Cup, thes were the first words Di Stefano had to say to him.
“They say you’ve come to replace me. Well, you’re too old and not good enough.”
Di Stefano proceeded to freeze Didi out of the team, making it as difficult as possible for Didi to play his game.
MBC Game HERO
Hell no.
OGN Sparkyz
Hell no.
Samsung Khan
The team didn't have a rigorous training culture. So no.
SK Telecom T1
SK Telecom T1 reminds me of Manchester United under the rule of Alex Ferguson. They are a well-oiled machine, and brings forth great results, but I always got the impression that no player was bigger than the team itself (maybe except for BoxeR).
SK Telecom T1 definitely would have done better with Jaedong. I'm not so certain if Jaedong would have done better with SK Telecom T1.
STX SouL
A decent team, but the funding from the team dwindled as the company itself struggled. Being part of a sinking ship is not always good for a player's psychological well being. Even though Hwaseung was another company that bailed out as they struggled to keep up financially, they at least did what they could to keep Jaedong happy with the limited resources they had, I'm not sure if STX SouL would have been enough of an upgrade to abandon all that.
WeMade Fox
Hell no.
Woongjin Stars
The head coach of the team was said to be a huge admirer of Jaedong, and may have done his best to help Jaedong reach his full potential. Jaedong actually could have gone to Woongjin Stars, but ZerO probably would not have stayed at the team had that trade taken place. If ZerO, a player that could have been the ace player on a lot of teams, found a way to co-exist with Jaedong, I believe it is a possibility that Jaedong might have had even more depth to his game.
What I think is of interest, is that if Woongjin Stars were in posession of Jaedong, ZerO, and Soulkey, Flash would have had severe trouble finding the necessary high calibre practice partners to help him prepare for Jaedong. I already posted the story of how the Woongjin Stars zergs played a vital role in Flash being able to overcome Jaedong.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/brood-war/517700-the-story-of-late-mech-translated-from-ygosu
So in my opinion, the only trade that would have been beneficial for Jaedong's career might have been a trade to Woongjin Stars. It definitely would have been an ideal situation for Jaedong in particular had ZerO stayed on the team even after Jaedong's arrival, but that would have never happened.
|
So next blog "Players that teamkilled/were teamkilled in maior tournaments" maybe? 
I remmember some beeing notorious team killers (Fantasy was probably one of the biggest offender, lol)
|
10810 Posts
On September 07 2017 20:06 hitthat wrote:
Part about JD is a lie. He was supported all season by PirateZerg, MustacheZerg and OzSucksBallsWithoutMeZerg.
Bahaha!
Actually the blog confused me at first. I thought it was counting team victories, but it makes more sense as individual victories... So the second number is all wins of everyone else on the team combined.
|
On September 08 2017 08:51 The_Red_Viper wrote:
I never said that players couldn't play against people from other teams. But just from watching the JD documentary and the nalra series, etc it seems like they still mostly practiced with teammates.
It's also not only about practicing directly, there are different coaches, just talking with your teammates, etc.
So i rather question why you would quote me here, i don't think my hypothetical is that absurd at all.
sure, practice partners existed. That doesn't mean they were playing against each other all the time. It's not just here say they flat out say it and they play against each other a lot.
|
Seeker
Where dat snitch at?37118 Posts
On September 07 2017 20:06 hitthat wrote:
Part about JD is a lie. He was supported all season by PirateZerg, MustacheZerg and OzSucksBallsWithoutMeZerg.
I don't think BW TL people understand this reference.
|
On September 09 2017 11:56 Seeker wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2017 20:06 hitthat wrote:
Part about JD is a lie. He was supported all season by PirateZerg, MustacheZerg and OzSucksBallsWithoutMeZerg. I don't think BW TL people understand this reference.
Why not? Everybody knows OZ's new players
![[image loading]](http://i39.tinypic.com/dey6id.jpg)
|
United States10569 Posts
On September 09 2017 11:56 Seeker wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2017 20:06 hitthat wrote:
Part about JD is a lie. He was supported all season by PirateZerg, MustacheZerg and OzSucksBallsWithoutMeZerg. I don't think BW TL people understand this reference.
wait what why wouldnt they? unless you mean that all the old BW TLers had already left the site by now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
