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Thanks for the rares

Blogs > motbob
Post a Reply
motbob
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States12546 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-11 21:26:29
August 11 2014 21:26 GMT
#1
Sports betting is a pretty established enterprise. There are people who bet on sports for a living, though it's really hard to do at a profit, since they usually only work with information that everyone can see. Bettors have to make tough choices: Let's say the Cavs looked really mediocre in their first 15 games. They're the current Vegas favorites to win the NBA Championship, but if they were to have a slow start, the odds would shift towards another team, like the Spurs. As a bettor, you have to decide whether the oddsmakers are overreacting (leading you to put your money on the Cavs) or whether the Cavs' slow start is reflective of what their level of play in the playoffs will be. It's not easy, since hundreds of other people with money will be trying to make the same decision, and you effectively have to make a better decision than them. It's rare to see an "easy bet" where everyone gets caught up in the hype / media narrative and where you as a bettor can exploit that.

But ESPORTS betting is easy. Just look at the front page of Dota2lounge. Right after Merlini joined Zephyr, the odds for Pokerface vs Zephyr were 29%/71%. That's far too skewed in Zephyr's favor given those two teams' recent performance, and it's unclear whether Zephyr was even the favorite. People got caught up in the Merlini hype and bet accordingly.

This blog is about Dota2lounge's TI4 prediction event and how I made my decision on who to bet on. My goal for this blog is to help bring Dota 2 betting to a level of sophistication closer to that of sports betting. The only way this will happen is if more people exploit bad odds.


http://dota2lounge.com/predict

The above link goes to a page where you were once able to bet on which team you thought would get top 3 at TI4. Take a look at the odds for EG: what those odds are saying is that if EG had placed 1st, someone who bet on EG would both keep the items he/she bet and receive 3.06x the value of those items from other people. As it happened, EG placed 3rd, so EG fanboys got their rares back along with 1.02x the value of their bet.

Some fairly high value items could be bet in this way. You could bet arcanas or Rotten Staches (~$60 value). Accounts were limited to two items bet maximum, but dedicated bettors could (and did) make multiple accounts.

Let's take a look at the odds for the teams as they existed shortly before TI4 began (they changed slightly as betting closed):

[image loading]


First of all, look at the difference in odds between Newbee and DK. You might remember that, in the time period leading up to TI4, DK and Newbee played an unusual number of tournament games against each other, going almost even in their series. Yet the odds for DK and Newbee are very different. This is an example of "favorite team bias," which is another way of saying that the odds on popular teams are almost always too high, and the odds for teams that aren't in the eye of Western bettors can sometimes be way, way too low (the Zephyr vs Pokerface match is another example of this). If people thought DK was the favorite to win, why was Newbee, a team clearly right up there with DK in skill, so far down in the rankings? This alone meant that a bet on Newbee was probably a +EV bet.

The next thing to look at are the odds for Alliance and Na`Vi vs the other Western teams. Bettors apparently thought that Na`Vi had better odds of winning than Newbee and had more than 5x more of a chance to place than C9 did. Why the huge difference between C9 and Na`Vi? The answer might lie in bias towards CIS teams, which would also explain why Empire had such (comparatively) good odds. It might also lie in the fact that C9 never won any of the major tournaments they attended this year, and that leads to another type of bias: wins stick in the minds of people who watch tournaments. The highs of Alliance's and Na`Vi's 2014 were higher than C9's, but their lows were certainly lower (see: D2L for Alliance). People remember the highs, especially if they're fans of a certain team and want to have faith. In fact, that last statement might be a better explanation than anything else I've written: people wanted to have faith. At any rate, thanks for the rares!

I wanted to find the best team to bet on, and it wasn't easy. The odds for NAR and the SEA teams were ridiculously high, but were they high enough to warrant a bet? Did a Chinese team down on its luck (LGD) really only have a 1-in-69 shot at winning?

So that led me to simulate the whole tournament in Excel. I gave teams an ELO and gave the ELOs the opportunity to fluctuate based on chance, to reflect the fact that it's hard to know the true skill of a team based on results. For example, Fnatic was assigned an ELO of 1300 with a chance to fluctuate up to 125 points, while Newbee was assigned a 1480 ELO with a chance to fluctuate up to 75 points. Fnatic was sort of an unknown quantity due to the whole Era situation, while Newbee had posted very consistent results.

I ran the tournament 10,000 times and kept track of how often they placed first, second, or third. Then I used the odds on Dota2lounge to calculate expected returns on each team, and came up with this:

[image loading]


Accordingly, I bet my most expensive items on Newbee. Too bad I only bet Kunkka whale swords and not arcanas...

Obviously, when you use this sort of method, assigning the ELOs is everything. I think there was room for improvement in that regard. VG's performance in TI4 definitely showed that they were better than even the highest ELO my model allowed them to be. I think I need to switch to a model that allows for teams to get much better than their current performance has shown, if the stars align. Also, I fell into the trap of overvaluing C9's recent (bad) performances and gave them a low ELO that they didn't deserve. I think I relied too much on Gosugamers's ELO ranking. That ranking underrated Chinese teams before TI4, so when C9 lost to a bunch of Chinese teams in a row, their ranking tanked.

Anyway, ESPORTS betting is easy as long as you're not an Alliance or Na`Vi fanboy. Or maybe it's easy if you always bet on Chinese teams. Or maybe it's not easy and requires close attention to the scene and thoughtful analysis. Pay attention to the biases that the rest of the betting community has, try to eliminate your own biases, choose your bets wisely, and soon you'll be swimming in rares. I think "choose your bets wisely" is the most important piece of advice here. Just bide your time, and eventually a bet will come along that will make you smile and think "Thanks for the rares" in advance.
ModeratorGood content always wins.
TanGeng
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Sanya12364 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-11 22:14:12
August 11 2014 22:13 GMT
#2
wow, motbob, conducting that arbitrage.
Moderator我们是个踏实的赞助商模式俱乐部
Heyoka
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Katowice25012 Posts
August 12 2014 15:03 GMT
#3
I love that LGD and NAR started with lower odds than the yet unnamed wildcard winner at the start
@RealHeyoka | ESL / DreamHack StarCraft Lead
motbob
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States12546 Posts
August 12 2014 16:55 GMT
#4
On August 13 2014 00:03 Heyoka wrote:
I love that LGD and NAR started with lower odds than the yet unnamed wildcard winner at the start

But then when TL won the wild card, the odds for them dropped below both teams!
ModeratorGood content always wins.
FiWiFaKi
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada9859 Posts
August 13 2014 02:55 GMT
#5
Really cool stuff, I might dip my feet into this. I also feel like people rely too much on certain hype and likability of the teams. Well written, great points, thank you.
In life, the journey is more satisfying than the destination. || .::Entrepreneurship::. Living a few years of your life like most people won't, so that you can spend the rest of your life like most people can't || Mechanical Engineering & Economics Major
danl9rm
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States3111 Posts
August 13 2014 02:57 GMT
#6
I'm pretty sure this is cheating.

Let's check:
Math = cheating.
You did math.

I'll let y'all figure out the rest.
"Science has so well established that the preborn baby in the womb is a living human being that most pro-choice activists have conceded the point. ..since the abortion proponents have lost the science argument, they are now advocating an existential one."
Velr
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Switzerland10938 Posts
August 13 2014 08:29 GMT
#7
It's simple:
Most People don't "bet" with their Brains, especially when its just about some Dota-Items or other stuff most People don't see a real value in.

Its just betting for fun. Its not about winning, its about making yourself more involved due to "losing" something when "your team" loses... Nothing is wrong with that .
TechSc2
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Netherlands554 Posts
August 13 2014 22:18 GMT
#8
On August 13 2014 11:57 danl9rm wrote:
I'm pretty sure this is cheating.

Let's check:
Math = cheating.
You did math.

I'll let y'all figure out the rest.


Why is doing math cheating? you really think professional bettors randomly bet? they use math to make calculated bets to make profit in the long run, much like DOTA 2 winrate, If you have a 55% winrate you are better then others, so you will win more games, in betting it is make ( more ) money.
Twitch.tv/TechGTV / Twitter.com/TechGTV
FiWiFaKi
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada9859 Posts
August 13 2014 23:26 GMT
#9
On August 14 2014 07:18 TechSc2 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2014 11:57 danl9rm wrote:
I'm pretty sure this is cheating.

Let's check:
Math = cheating.
You did math.

I'll let y'all figure out the rest.


Why is doing math cheating? you really think professional bettors randomly bet? they use math to make calculated bets to make profit in the long run, much like DOTA 2 winrate, If you have a 55% winrate you are better then others, so you will win more games, in betting it is make ( more ) money.


Wow...

Very obvious sarcasm, come on now.
In life, the journey is more satisfying than the destination. || .::Entrepreneurship::. Living a few years of your life like most people won't, so that you can spend the rest of your life like most people can't || Mechanical Engineering & Economics Major
wairai
Profile Joined May 2012
Malaysia1000 Posts
August 15 2014 06:16 GMT
#10
Esport betting is always ez without being blind fanboys.

That said, tears of fanboys are sweet.
Yungin' Leanin' with Pourple Drink
TMG26
Profile Joined July 2012
Portugal2017 Posts
August 15 2014 11:16 GMT
#11
I also bet Newbee.

Together with DK and IG in Chine they were the trio that won stuff. As you said, they were pretty much tied up with DK in their match-ups.

But it wasn't an immediate vote.I considered Titan and VG for my bet. Mainly because the 3rd place also warranted rares. Titan is kinda of an all or nothing thing, so it was really a wild bet, so i cross them out. And then in the weeks near TI i was switching between VG and Newbee. VG has really good performances in China, but the two last times they went to the west they struggled. but that 3rd place odd kept flowing my mind. I knew VG could make it to the main event, but could they reach 3rd? Eventually i placed my rares on Newbee. Would have got more value from VG bet bet, but even tough Newbee hasn't come to the west, Tongfu last year hasn't either, and they still fared well (tongfu is pretty much Newbee). And Newbee is the most stable of the Chinese lot, we all know how DK does some random drafts, and how IG can go into depressed mode. SO, my bet was on Newbee, all things considered, couldn't image them bellow 3rd place. And nice odds for them compared to the rivals.
Supporter of the situational Blink Dagger on Storm.
Hexo_
Profile Joined May 2014
Croatia59 Posts
August 20 2014 19:41 GMT
#12
You all act like a bunch of teenage white girls where the cosmetics are so important. Aesthetics are so trivial in this game, for a second there I thought it was about betting money.
top kek ... >implying
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