Okay so, I just had an argument with my father because I think he is in the wrong. What do you think TL?
He was driving to my aunt's house after stopping by at a friend and having a few beers after work (yes, he is pretty awful about drinking and driving and I never stop giving him hell about it) and my aunt lives along a main road. So, he slowed down and started indicating, moving toward the middle of the road, (as is correct procedure when turning across traffic) when another car came along from behind at some speed and smashed off his wing mirror. He continued speeding off, so my father put his foot down and chased after him. My father chased him along the road for about a kilometre before he managed to overtake this car and force him to pull over by running him off the road. The driver was apparently absolutely pissed out of his bracket with a hysterical wife in the passenger seat. My father started confronting the guy, who could apparently not give a sober answer. So my father reached in and grabbed the car keys from the ignition. Naturally the other guy put up a bit of resistance and the two of them had a bit of a boxing match. Eventually my father got into his own car and drove off with the keys. He was intending to go to the police station, but stopped at my uncle's house first. My uncle advised him not to go to the police on account of getting mixed in with drunken driving offences, and so they both got back in the car and drove back to the scene of the crime. They apparently drove past them to check out the scene and then returned back home. STILL WITH THE KEYS.
My father stayed and had dinner, had a few more drinks and just drove home now. He said the car was still there on the side of the road. I asked what he planned to do now, as he still has the keys in his pocket. 'Nothing'. Is that not really fucking illegal? My dad claims he did nothing wrong in taking away the guy's keys, he was infact doing the roads a service by removing a hazardous driver. I argued that his taking of the keys was almost in-line with theft as he was disabling this man's property and effectively leaving it liable for a break-in overnight. But no, my father doesn't see that. I asked what if they had taken down my father's numberplate? 'Nono he was too pissed!' 'And his wife?' 'Nah'. So well, I am pretty unconvinced and when the police inevitably turn up on our doorstep I would rather not tell him 'I told you so'. So please TL, who do you think has done more wrong here?
Also, in other news, I just got my first car! :D
Oh EDIT: This is also a one year of TL anniversary post (belated) and a happy 1800 post blog. With shoutouts to all my cool friends, particularly the ones in #liquipedia, #tl-abl and #tl.dota2 and the ones who are too cool for irc ^_^ And Targe.
Double edit: TLDR:
On May 22 2014 05:31 Heyoka wrote: Your dad thinks there is nothing wrong with running a guy off the road, punching him repeatedly before taking his keys and keeping them without even going to the police?
Your dad thinks there is nothing wrong with running a guy off the road, punching him repeatedly before taking his keys and keeping them without even going to the police?
On May 22 2014 05:26 GeckoXp wrote: Grats to your car. I guess.
The guy with the papers is the legal owner AFAIK, I think taking keys is theft.
His argument with that was that it isnt theft because the car is still there. -____- Also i have spent the last week driving around with the log books for my car inside the car. GG to me if anyone stole my new car! In reply to your other post - I suggested he do that, but he doesn't want to go to the police now because he KNOWS he will get in shit. I recommended he find out who the owner of the car is, find their number and arrange to drop off the keys. He won't do it though. I am so mad at him right now.
On May 22 2014 05:31 Heyoka wrote: Your dad thinks there is nothing wrong with running a guy off the road, punching him repeatedly before taking his keys and keeping them without even going to the police?
On May 22 2014 06:04 KadaverBB wrote: Sounds like your father shouldn't drive anymore if the thinks car chases are acceptable -.-
Ahahaha KBB I am imagining you as a traffic officer banling with a ban hammer going around revoking licences XD But yeah, I hope he thinks over what he has done tonight and tomorrow he does the right thing. Just not sure why I am the only person he has spoken to who thinks he has done the wrong thing.
I can imagine the guy who your dad forced off the road and took the keys would be reporting it to the police... Cause your dad took his keys (and other stuff...)
What the heck is this story? I'm guessing this is in the States? In the Netherlands even you would be punishable, as you are effectively, knowingly, not doing anything about the situation (= in this case going to the police)
On May 22 2014 06:22 sOda~ wrote: your dad sounds like an idiot
you could put it a little more nicely ~ 'it sounds like your father makes bad decisions occasionally' or something
He followed someone, ran them off the road, assaulted them and then stole their belongings. You'll be lucky if he isn't locked up tbh. His description was pretty accurate, sorry to say. Also while intoxicated, although they probably wouldn't be able to pull that up.
I think it should be pointed out that theft of car keys is still theft. You took an item from someone and are not giving it back. The value of car keys is a little bit more difficult to quantify than the value of most items due to the circumstances, but it's definitely pretty serious. I'm not going to go through all of your step dad's actions and give explanations for why they were wrong and what the proper thing to do would be... I'm just going to suggest you don't get in the car with him whenever his blood alcohol level is higher than the equivalent of ~1 drink. If he's of a reasonably normal size, you can assume he metabolizes one drink per hour, and count his drinks/hours.
This sounds like some Rink justice, getting pissed off and then punching the shit out of a dude and taking his honor (and car keys). I can get behind that.
On May 22 2014 06:21 ffadicted wrote: your dad is so so so fucked tbh. Expect charges to be pressed
The guy was drunk and took off his Dads mirror, then ran off. That's called a hit and run. Also, a locksmith can easily make him a new key for his car. Obviously the father acted reckless, but they both did and the cops would have to take that into account.
On May 22 2014 06:21 ffadicted wrote: your dad is so so so fucked tbh. Expect charges to be pressed
The guy was drunk and took off his Dads mirror, then ran off. That's called a hit and run. Also, a locksmith can easily make him a new key for his car. Obviously the father acted reckless, but they both did and the cops would have to take that into account.
The other guy would get charged if that was brought up sure but it wouldnt lower the fathers charges lol.
On May 22 2014 06:30 Ketch wrote: What the heck is this story? I'm guessing this is in the States? In the Netherlands even you would be punishable, as you are effectively, knowingly, not doing anything about the situation (= in this case going to the police)
The guy damaged your step-father's car and didn't attempt to compensate for it = asshole. Your step-father was drinking and driving, and stole the guy's keys after getting in a fistfight with him = also an asshole.
How are we to even trust your step-father's side of the story though? If he was so intoxicated that he couldn't go to the police, then why should we just accept that the other guy was actually an asshole, and that he damaged your father's car and not vice-verse? How do we know the other guy was intoxicated too? If your step-father hadn't been drinking and driving, he could have called the police after getting his car damaged, but instead you say he runs someone off the road and steals their keys.
I have no respect for drunk-drivers. Your step-father's an idiot and an asshole for putting others at risk through his reckless behavior.
I don't disagree at all. Anyway, update: My dad is sending our gardener to the police station this morning with the keys with the instruction to say he 'found them on the side of the road' -_- I asked my mom what she thought and she said 'I think your dad saved that man's life and possibly the lives of his wife, pedestrians, cyclists and other motorists. '
On May 22 2014 14:38 dravernor wrote: our gardener
wow are you a zimbabwean quadrillionaire
Only in Zim dollars dudebro.
wait are you the one constantly sending me emails about wanting to move to europe and giving me big money for it? I already sent you all of my credit card information you may stop asking now
On May 22 2014 14:38 dravernor wrote: our gardener
wow are you a zimbabwean quadrillionaire
Only in Zim dollars dudebro.
wait are you the one constantly sending me emails about wanting to move to europe and giving me big money for it? I already sent you all of my credit card information you may stop asking now
No that's salle's "crowd funding approach" to finance Liquipedia coins.
Small update: the car is apparently still on the side of the road, and the police asked no questions when ny gardener handed in the keys at the station. Wtf.
Also Targe pls you're not even old enough to father my children let alone be my father Also Hawk my dad would legit do that, don't invite him please.
On May 22 2014 14:38 dravernor wrote: our gardener
wow are you a zimbabwean quadrillionaire
Only in Zim dollars dudebro.
wait are you the one constantly sending me emails about wanting to move to europe and giving me big money for it? I already sent you all of my credit card information you may stop asking now
That is my Nigerian cousin. We're competing to see who can earn more money.
haha I like the derail into nigerian quadrillionaires XD.
If you stick to this from a purely legalistic perspective, then of course what your dad did was wrong in many ways. But, had he not entered a high speed chase as a good citizen would avoid, that drunk driver with his maybe hysterical wife could have gotten into a car accident and killed several people. I would like to think that the law can prevent these things and that being a vigilante is unnecessary, but I am skeptical that (at least in this case) calling the police station just after the incident would really have accomplished anything. Its a matter of weighing things...is it okay to maybe go to jail for a week or so to keep a drunk driver off the road and potentially save lives? I think a lot of people would say yes it is
I think its kind of like defending your shop from a mugger, the cops typically arrive way too late after the money was stolen or someone was hurt. That's why I think in some cases people (who have training) should have a responsibility to act in the moment.
Anyway I agree with you that he should have figured out who that guy was and figured out how to return his keys like you said. Otherwise just discreetly mail the police an envelope with his approximate location and the keys or something.
EPT
