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I've been a quite and shy guy for most of my life and it wasn't until recently that I decided that being a loner/socially-awkward person wasn't a good thing. As a result, I've embarked on a quest to make myself a more sociable, funny person that one will feel comfortable around. I am new to this though, and have made plenty of mistakes that have helped me learn about talking and being social, but I still have a few questions that I'd like someone to answer and I would be glad to except further advice.
1. What are some good icebreakers to start a conversation with someone I don't know particularly well and with friends that I know well (besides the weather by the way, I hate using the weather card to start a conversation)?
2. What are some "deeper" topics to talk about with friends rather then more shallow items like something about sports or movies? I always seem to be have conversations that really have no real depth or do not give me that much insight about the person I'm talking too. Sure, I may now know their favorite movie, but so what? That puts me on the level of acquaintance maybe, I want to go deeper!
3. What do I say when I need to leave my friends or whoever else I am talking to in a conversation? How do I "say goodbye"?
4. When in a "deeper" and in a more "shallow" conversation, when should I interrupt the other person's talking to add input or crack a joke or something along those lines? Also, how do I draw attention to myself in a conversation with multiple people without looking obnoxious, loud, etc.
5. Is there a ratio that should be established in a conversation of when I should be listening to the other person and when I should be talking?
6. What do I talk about on a date?
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I'm hardly one that should be giving advice being almost a hermit, but don't even try to classify conversations as deep or shallow. Deep conversations will arise of their own in the right time and circumstance... conversations can often drift back and forth from deep to shallow. Main thing is take genuine interest in the other person, and try to look at things from a humorous angle rather than a depressing one, otherwise awkward silence is likely to ensue.
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the more you are thinking about your above questions when talking the more awkward the talking will be
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On April 25 2012 12:10 NationInArms wrote:
I've been a quite and shy guy for most of my life and it wasn't until recently that I decided that being a loner/socially-awkward person wasn't a good thing. As a result, I've embarked on a quest to make myself a more sociable, funny person that one will feel comfortable around. I am new to this though, and have made plenty of mistakes that have helped me learn about talking and being social, but I still have a few questions that I'd like someone to answer and I would be glad to except further advice.
1. What are some good icebreakers to start a conversation with someone I don't know particularly well and with friends that I know well (besides the weather by the way, I hate using the weather card to start a conversation)?
2. What are some "deeper" topics to talk about with friends rather then more shallow items like something about sports or movies? I always seem to be have conversations that really have no real depth or do not give me that much insight about the person I'm talking too. Sure, I may now know their favorite movie, but so what? That puts me on the level of acquaintance maybe, I want to go deeper!
3. What do I say when I need to leave my friends or whoever else I am talking to in a conversation? How do I "say goodbye"?
4. When in a "deeper" and in a more "shallow" conversation, when should I interrupt the other person's talking to add input or crack a joke or something along those lines? Also, how do I draw attention to myself in a conversation with multiple people without looking obnoxious, loud, etc.
5. Is there a ratio that should be established in a conversation of when I should be listening to the other person and when I should be talking?
6. What do I talk about on a date?
EDIT: Just discovered the PUA thread, looks interesting.
I've never approached my social interactions in such a...systematic way. Learning how to interact for me was basically listening to people until I could sort of do what they did, seeing what worked and what didn't.
1. If we're talking about someone who's name you know but you don't know too much about them as a person, I assume you know what they generally do, some things they like, so you can start talking to them about those things. If you're talking to a friend you know well, you shouldn't need an ice-breaker or an introduction, you should already be able to interact easily.
2. If you want to know deeper topics to talk about with your friends, they're probably not really your friends. I already know what deeper topics I could talk about with my friends, but it may not always be appropriate. It sounds like what you really have are acquaintances or "friends" who are your classmates. I have no idea what you mean by "deep" topics, but to me it means thoroughly personal topics, sensitive things they wouldn't talk about to just anyone and that people generally expect to stay within a certain social circle or area. You can't just "go deeper" because you feel like it, you'll have to talk about more general things with a person, open up appropriately yourself (don't go overloading them with your personal information and expect them to reciprocate), and develop a real friendship if that's what you want. Spoiler: it's not going to happen with everyone you meet.
3. If you're rushed try to bring some kind of conclusion or resolution to whatever you were talking about and excuse yourself graciously. "I have to go do X, thanks for the talk/chat." With closer friends you can be slightly more informal, but acknowledge the conversation you were having, don't leave them hanging.
4.Ehh, this is highly dependent on who you're with and how good you are at using humor. If you're not confident breaking the flow of the conversation, just keep listening and chime in when appropriate, but you can test the limits sometimes. If you are confident, you'll generally know what works and wouldn't even need to ask this question. But it really does depend what situation you're in and what conversation(s) are going on.
5. Again, highly dependent on who you're talking about. You need to be aware of social and body language cues to know if you're interrupting too much or being too passive.
6. I don't date much, but when I do, I try to talk about the girl's interests, some of my interests, cool things I think I can get her attention/impress her with, and just try to keep the conversation going. It helps if you're good at telling jokes and telling stories.
Really though, I don't think what you need to do is build a list of stuff to do in a conversation or written rules to follow. You know how the first stage of a baby's learning is imitating the way adults talk and do things? Yeah, that's kind of how conversations are, you learn by doing, and sometimes by imitating. Just imagine yourself as somebody more confident who you've seen interact with people, see what things you think they do work and what things don't. Try not to overdo it though. If you suck at introducing yourself to people, get into a new activity outside of what you regularly do, and get to know everyone in it, you'll get better at making small-talk.
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How you start a conversation sort of depends on the individual you're trying to talk to and the environment you two are in. You can talk about the weather, location, decor, themselves, ask a question, etc. Most important things to remember about conversations with strangers are don't bring up controversial topics, don't be negative, and don't be selfish.
Topics with your friends can be about anything, you shouldn't have to think about this. If they're your friends than there's no problem in discussing interests and personal matters.
If you need to leave than just say so appropriately. If it's with friends then you can just be casual about it - "I gotta go, I'll ttyl." If it's with some stranger then you can say something like "I have to head out but it was nice talking to you, hope to see you around."
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When I'm starting a conversation with someone, I like to come completely out of left field. For example, if I'm going to start talking to a girl, I might ask her something like, "Hey, what's the most ferocious animal you can think of?" She'll probably say something like, "I don't know, a shark maybe? Why?" Then, I'd respond, "Because I swear, if you take any animal, no matter how frightening, and make it into a plushie, that thing is adorable!" From here, let the conversation comence.
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Fuck the PUA thread. I promise you, you will become even more socially awkward spewing out canned openers/routines, especially if the canned routine is something you can't even relate to, which is what conversating is all about---relating to others.
First, before you even learn to conversate, you must learn the art of eye contact and holding it. It shows that you are interested in the conversation, and won't come off as shy. It is crucial body language. Don't be a creeper and just stare into her soul. Break eye contact once in awhile. If you find it hard to look at the person's eyes, kind of look at the bridge of their nose until you become comfortable.
A good ice breaker can be anything. Say what's on your mind. To do this, you must be sensitive to all your surroundings. Smell, sight, sound, touch, fuck what's the fifth sense? edit: taste durr You get the idea. Today, I was at a store and a gang of skateboarders rolled by that thundered throughout the store. There was a cute girl there and I just blurted, "Holy shit, sounds like we're close to the train tracks." to which she giggled and we talked a little. It's nothing special and nothing pre-planned, but it initiates conversation.
Second, start with small talk. You already know what that is. Sports, weather, cars, video games, tv shows, girls, etc. It's simple. You just spew out facts about stuff. Then after all that superficial bullshit, you start creating rapport. How? By invoking your emotions on certain stuff. It's all about the "I". How do you feel about certain things? Voice your opinion on it. What do you think of "x" thing? (These are also good questions to ask the other person to create rapport too).
People create connections by relating to others through emotions. Everyone has felt the same emotions as you at some point and time. Your friend talked about how good he felt after winning first place in his wrestling division? Cool. Sense of accomplishment. Tell him how you felt the same way after placing first in your Starcraft 2 division. Kind of corny, but that's the concept.
Third, get a sales/retail job. No other job will cause you to develop social skills faster. Just prepare to give the job interview of your life.
On dates, you're most likely to fuck it up. Sorry, but you're just starting out and haven't received much practice. But a good base would be, listen more than you talk. Girls love talking about themselves especially when you're interested. It shows that you like what they like, and their accomplishments. And if she wonders why you're so quiet or claims that you're shy. Agree and be honest. Say you don't really do this and that you are shy around cute girls. The worst thing any guy starting out is to act like some bigshot who did a minute kegstand and slept with mad bitches when in reality you're a shy introvert. I did it when I started out and it sucked when I realized how much of a fake douchebag I was, which is why I dislike anything PUA related.
On April 25 2012 12:57 thrawn2112 wrote:
the more you are thinking about your above questions when talking the more awkward the talking will be
great advice, don't be inside your head and thinking about the perfect thing to say. You want to be listening to what the other person is saying and work with that.
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PUA is all about creating artificial character to pick up girls. You're better off actually creating character.
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On April 25 2012 14:54 matiK23 wrote:Fuck the PUA thread. I promise you, you will become even more socially awkward spewing out canned openers/routines, especially if the canned routine is something you can't even relate to, which is what conversating is all about---relating to others. First, before you even learn to conversate, you must learn the art of eye contact and holding it. It shows that you are interested in the conversation, and won't come off as shy. It is crucial body language. Don't be a creeper and just stare into her soul. Break eye contact once in awhile. If you find it hard to look at the person's eyes, kind of look at the bridge of their nose until you become comfortable. A good ice breaker can be anything. Say what's on your mind. To do this, you must be sensitive to all your surroundings. Smell, sight, sound, touch, fuck what's the fifth sense? edit: taste durr You get the idea. Today, I was at a store and a gang of skateboarders rolled by that thundered throughout the store. There was a cute girl there and I just blurted, "Holy shit, sounds like we're close to the train tracks." to which she giggled and we talked a little. It's nothing special and nothing pre-planned, but it initiates conversation. Second, start with small talk. You already know what that is. Sports, weather, cars, video games, tv shows, girls, etc. It's simple. You just spew out facts about stuff. Then after all that superficial bullshit, you start creating rapport. How? By invoking your emotions on certain stuff. It's all about the "I". How do you feel about certain things? Voice your opinion on it. What do you think of "x" thing? (These are also good questions to ask the other person to create rapport too). People create connections by relating to others through emotions. Everyone has felt the same emotions as you at some point and time. Your friend talked about how good he felt after winning first place in his wrestling division? Cool. Sense of accomplishment. Tell him how you felt the same way after placing first in your Starcraft 2 division. Kind of corny, but that's the concept. Third, get a sales/retail job. No other job will cause you to develop social skills faster. Just prepare to give the job interview of your life. On dates, you're most likely to fuck it up. Sorry, but you're just starting out and haven't received much practice. But a good base would be, listen more than you talk. Girls love talking about themselves especially when you're interested. It shows that you like what they like, and their accomplishments. And if she wonders why you're so quiet or claims that you're shy. Agree and be honest. Say you don't really do this and that you are shy around cute girls. The worst thing any guy starting out is to act like some bigshot who did a minute kegstand and slept with mad bitches when in reality you're a shy introvert. I did it when I started out and it sucked when I realized how much of a fake douchebag I was, which is why I dislike anything PUA related. Show nested quote +On April 25 2012 12:57 thrawn2112 wrote:
the more you are thinking about your above questions when talking the more awkward the talking will be great advice, don't be inside your head and thinking about the perfect thing to say. You want to be listening to what the other person is saying and work with that.
Thank you for this post. _|¯|O
Just one more quick question, how do I reconcile confidence with admitting that I'm shy?
On April 25 2012 12:20 Mothra wrote:
I'm hardly one that should be giving advice being almost a hermit, but don't even try to classify conversations as deep or shallow. Deep conversations will arise of their own in the right time and circumstance... conversations can often drift back and forth from deep to shallow. Main thing is take genuine interest in the other person, and try to look at things from a humorous angle rather than a depressing one, otherwise awkward silence is likely to ensue.
Alright, makes sense.
On April 25 2012 12:57 thrawn2112 wrote:
the more you are thinking about your above questions when talking the more awkward the talking will be
I think you're right, you win. 
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The last thing you need is a rehearsed script anticipating which direction the conversation will go.
I'm a pretty social guy, so heres my 2 cents.
You need to do 2 main things. 1) be brave and 2) accept rejection (ie people will think your not funny, or will recognize the conversation is boring, or any other situation you may fear)
Here's the thing, everyones different and like talking about different things. Conversations are a lot easier when you have similar interests, but that doesn't mean you can't have a decent conversation if you are 2 very different people.
Usually your environment dictates your conversation. If you're at college, you usually talk about what classes your doing, what you hate, what you did on the weekend etc. if your at a gathering you'll talk bout who your there with, what your doing with yourself (ie going to university, or if you have a job blah blah).
People don't mind talking when it seems comfortable. For example, 2 sets of 2 different people can be talking about the exact same thing, but the uncomfortable and awkward group will find the conversation a alot harder to maintain/ weird than the other 2 people.
Solution: fake it till you make it. After enough pretending to be confident, even if your secretly feeling insecure, if they can't till then it's like you weren't insecure it all. Feed off that notion, and over time, talking casually will become much much easier. You just need to accept that at the beginning it might be awkward at times, and you'll make jokes that no one laughs to, but this is all part of learning to be ok with it.
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Okay, I actually have something to say to you! Wewt!
I actually recently went through something like this myself, so I hope I can help a little bit. I wasn't socially awkward because that's who I was, however, but it was a combination of... trauma and being thrown into a pond with a severely different group of fish from what I was used to. I actually shut down so hard I had to reteach myself facial expressions in every day conversation.
Okay, here's tip #1:
It's okay to actually be your own person. I know it sounds cliche, but it's true. Just be yourself! If you feel that in the current conversation you don't really want to talk, but listening is something you want to do, go for it! If your humor doesn't quite match theirs, that's fine, just roll with it! No matter what, something is better than nothing, so eliciting a reaction is good. Of course, it's better to have a positive reaction than a negative one, but that comes with time.
2) accept rejection
It hurts you realize your witty and on-the-spot joke sucked. It hurts when someone won't listen. It hurts when they don't really give a damn about your side of the situation. Unfortunately, it happens, and one must take the good with the bad.
Tip #3:
Listening is actually awesome to people. If you're really nervous about talking, go ahead and just listen to what other people have to say. This is useful in a few ways. One, you get to know more about them without having to make a choice about what to say to evoke the reaction you want. Two, people like to talk. Especially about themselves, so having someone listen to them makes them calmer and more appreciative of that person. Personally, I listen more than I speak, and it seems to work fairly well for me most of the time.
Tip #4:
Take it slowly! When the time comes, you'll find something that both you and that other person are interested in for both the "Deep" and "Shallow" conversations. Most often, it's worth muddling through that nearly painful filler for the real meat of a good talk.
I hope that helps... at all. It probably won't, but hell, who knows? I wish you the best of luck in your endeavor to become more sociable, and I pray it works out for you!
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So I'm bored, killing time before gsl and I saw your blog. I shall happily take it as my opportunity to be an agony aunt for you  .
1. Icebreakers: Use whatever you want. Open a conversation with "purple monkey dishwasher" if you like, It doesn't matter what it is, just talk and keep the conversation interesting and flowing.
2. Deep conversations: In general I find that deep conversations stem from strong feelings of rapport, so aim for that first. Also deep conversations (at least in my experience) always involve talking about emotions, so you may want to try and be a bit more expressive in that department. Don't rush into trying to have a deep conversation though, it just comes off as creepy and pathetic.
3. Saying Goodbye: Say whatever you want. Try to make some physical contact when you do like a handshake or a hug (depending on the context), it makes it more meaningful.
4. Breaking Rapport: Yeah don't do that. It's bad and it makes you come off as insensitive. If you did that to me I would slap you.
5. Listening/Talking Ratio: Nope. My advice is if they are talking with zeal, then just let them talk and every now and then ask them a question about the interest that they are so obsessed about and then go back to listening. Keep in mind that's only if you are trying to suck up to them (ftr i do this with my landlady), otherwise do as much or as litttle talking as you feel comfortable.
6. Date Conversations: Whatever the hell you want. It''s your date. Enjoy it. Make the most out of it.
As for other people's advice... well some of it is good. But I wouldn't get too caught up in overanlyzing things. Some of that pua stuff is good too and works but I would advise against it. It can backfire horrendously bad and it reeks of sociopathy and misogyny not to mention it's based off an external psychology model (ie it holds you accountable for the actions of others).
Anyway, hope that helps. GL HF
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Don't overthink and be more interested in the other person than yourself and you will be successful socially, at least from what I have found, though I don't usually do that because I have been awkward most of my life. Improvement comes slow, so be patient with yourself
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EPT
