• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 07:21
CEST 13:21
KST 20:21
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting3[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent6Team TLMC #5: Winners Announced!3[ASL20] Ro8 Preview Pt2: Holding On9Maestros of the Game: Live Finals Preview (RO4)5
Community News
Weekly Cups (Oct 6-12): Four star herO65.0.15 Patch Balance Hotfix (2025-10-8)68Weekly Cups (Sept 29-Oct 5): MaxPax triples up3PartinG joins SteamerZone, returns to SC2 competition325.0.15 Balance Patch Notes (Live version)119
StarCraft 2
General
The New Patch Killed Mech! 5.0.15 Patch Balance Hotfix (2025-10-8) TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting Weekly Cups (Oct 6-12): Four star herO PartinG joins SteamerZone, returns to SC2 competition
Tourneys
Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Tenacious Turtle Tussle WardiTV Mondays SC2's Safe House 2 - October 18 & 19 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 495 Rest In Peace Mutation # 494 Unstable Environment Mutation # 493 Quick Killers Mutation # 492 Get Out More
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Brood War web app to calculate unit interactions BSL Season 21 Whose hotkey signature is this? Any rep analyzer that shows resources situation?
Tourneys
[ASL20] Semifinal B [ASL20] Semifinal A [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Ro8 Day 4
Strategy
Current Meta BW - ajfirecracker Strategy & Training Siegecraft - a new perspective TvZ Theorycraft - Improving on State of the Art
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread Dawn of War IV Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640} TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Men's Fashion Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Sex and weight loss US Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club! The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 NBA General Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Inbreeding: Why Do We Do It…
Peanutsc
From Tilt to Ragequit:The Ps…
TrAiDoS
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1274 users

Ladder Fear Mentality

Blogs > FuRRyChoBo
Post a Reply
FuRRyChoBo
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States218 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-03 04:18:07
December 31 2011 06:41 GMT
#1
My background with SC2: Bought at release, played a little bit into low Diamond, starting grinding Zerg ladder to get to Master in the last few days of Season 1. Was top 750 NA Masters in Season 2, didn't play much Seasons 3-4, switched race to Protoss to start season 5 and am 6-1 to start the new season at Master League. During season 2 I created a Youtube "database" of interesting games I had played in order to show FPVODs of relatively high-level ZvX gameplay to compliment my stream as an educational tool for the lower-level players I met on Battle.net.

Like I said in the above paragraph, I've met a lot of people on Battle.net who are looking to improve. The problem is that many are afraid to ladder, out of the fear of losing and having a "bad" record. I've always found this to be kind of silly, but the more time I spend getting to know different people, the more I see it coming up. I'm writing this with the hope that it will change the mentality that a lot of people have in regards to laddering.

The reason I find the "Ladder Fear Mentality" to be silly is that when everything is said and done, this is just a game. Don't get me wrong; I take this game and the scene very seriously, and many others do too, but in the grand scheme of things, losing on ladder doesn't mean anything. If anything, it should motivate you to play better and "fix" your rank/winrate, but we'll get to that later. There are several reasons I feel that ladder is very beneficial on the whole:

1) Ladder is a very efficient way to practice if you don't have a specific practice partner who can challenge you. Once you are comfortable with a matchup, the randomness of builds you see on ladder is very beneficial to becoming a more well-rounded player. While it's good to have a practice partner or two for each matchup who you can practice specific things against, it's important to keep in mind that each player has his own unique style and if you only practice against a few people, you won't be ready when it comes to adapting to different styles.

2) Your winrate doesn't mean anything. As cool as it is to have a 2:1 win:loss ratio in Master League, the important thing is that the matchmaking system is constantly finding people who are around your skill level for you to play. You're SUPPOSED to have a 50:50 win:loss ratio in most cases, and being roughly even in that regard is more than respectable. I'm sure a lot of people see Idra's record and say, "Well I lose more than he does and it looks bad, so I should practice in customs!" The problem with that is by joining a custom game randomly, you leave yourself open to getting smashed by someone much better than you (or crushing someone who you are much better than). This leads me to my next point...

3) Having an idea of your skill level in regards to the ladder system allows you to find practice partners around your skill level much more easily. When I wasn't playing a lot and went into channels like Reddit or TeamLiquid, I'd get people saying, "You have no games played this season, you're not Master level." That may have been true, but it's more likely that I didn't lose all my skill and turn atrociously bad after not playing for a few months to the point where I couldn't compete with a mid-range Masters player. Telling someone that I was top 750 Masters in Season 2 didn't mean anything to them, because the game is always changing and who knows if I kept up with the metagame? It's a valid thing to say, but on the other hand, if I had played at least a handful of games on the ladder, it would've been easier to say, "High Masters LF 1v1" and find an opponent relatively quickly.

4) Ladder is a really good way to meet new people who will force you to improve. Some of the best players I know are guys I have met on the ladder, and once you prove your worth to them in a game, most are happy to play you continuously in order for you both to improve. While someone may dodge a custom game in a chat channel, nobody can dodge once a ladder game has started without losing points (which nobody wants to do). Not everyone is fortunate enough to have the "hookups" to immediately start practicing with high-level players (and not all high-level players will dedicate time to helping lower-level ones), but if you work your way up the ladder, you're almost guaranteed to be introduced to new people and have exciting games.

5) None of the games you're playing on ladder can hurt you as long as you keep everything in perspective. Simply put, you're one of the 99.9% of people who isn't playing the GSL or another major tournament. You're not playing for a lot of money; you're playing because you enjoy the game and want to improve. Realistically, losing games on the ladder can only hurt you mentally, but if you remember that losing is actually the best way to learn and improve, there are literally no downsides to laddering.

I'm going to leave it at those five points, but I could ramble about this forever. There's a lot to be said about learning a build or a timing against someone you know will play you over and over, but it's a bad habit to get into if you log off once you can't get a game with that person. As I've said, the randomness of the ladder is a beautiful way to develop yourself as a well-rounded player, and there's no better way to improve than to play a lot of games and put yourself in different situations.

Hopefully if you're one of the unfortunate souls who has "Ladder Fear," my ramblings have helped to change your mind a little bit.

For anyone who's interested, here is the aforementioned stream/Youtube.

www.twitch.tv/furrychobo
www.youtube.com/furrysc2

FuRRyChoBo.283

***
kAelle_sc
Profile Joined April 2011
287 Posts
December 31 2011 07:15 GMT
#2
you inspired me to ladder again... <3
It's all about the journey, not the outcome.
FuRRyChoBo
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States218 Posts
December 31 2011 09:29 GMT
#3
Glad to help! Keep at it ^^
ExodusHydrA
Profile Joined September 2011
58 Posts
December 31 2011 11:18 GMT
#4
Feels pretty true, I had ladder anxiety too when I started playing again in season 3, after having last played in season 1. I started practicing in custom games with people from bronze to gold (I was bronze) and next thing I knew, I was winning 90% of my games in bronze, and the next season, I had made gold league. If you jsut force yourself to ladder, eventually you will not care about losing a lot, and you will start to improve much much faster. Although if you're on a losing streak, it's not bad to quit playing for the day.
SF-Fork
Profile Blog Joined November 2002
Russian Federation1401 Posts
December 31 2011 14:54 GMT
#5
I had a probem before with -no bonus pool anxiety- which is kind of related. Back when we got 12 bonus points per day, I would only play the different leagues (1v1 2v2rt 2v2at 3v3 etc) up until I spent all my pool for fear of not winning more points than the ones I lost. The bonus pool nerf made me snap out of it and I feel much better!
TORTOISE
Profile Joined December 2010
United States515 Posts
December 31 2011 22:14 GMT
#6
On December 31 2011 23:54 SF-Fork wrote:
I had a probem before with -no bonus pool anxiety- which is kind of related. Back when we got 12 bonus points per day, I would only play the different leagues (1v1 2v2rt 2v2at 3v3 etc) up until I spent all my pool for fear of not winning more points than the ones I lost. The bonus pool nerf made me snap out of it and I feel much better!



Why focus on rank and points? I see no point in that.
◕ ‿‿ ◕ ๑•́ ₃ •̀๑ ( ͡ ° ͜ ʖ ͡°)
ExodusHydrA
Profile Joined September 2011
58 Posts
December 31 2011 22:48 GMT
#7
On January 01 2012 07:14 TORTOISE wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 31 2011 23:54 SF-Fork wrote:
I had a probem before with -no bonus pool anxiety- which is kind of related. Back when we got 12 bonus points per day, I would only play the different leagues (1v1 2v2rt 2v2at 3v3 etc) up until I spent all my pool for fear of not winning more points than the ones I lost. The bonus pool nerf made me snap out of it and I feel much better!



Why focus on rank and points? I see no point in that.


Cause the difference between top masters and mid masters is pretty high?
TORTOISE
Profile Joined December 2010
United States515 Posts
January 01 2012 22:29 GMT
#8
On January 01 2012 07:48 ExodusHydrA wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 01 2012 07:14 TORTOISE wrote:
On December 31 2011 23:54 SF-Fork wrote:
I had a probem before with -no bonus pool anxiety- which is kind of related. Back when we got 12 bonus points per day, I would only play the different leagues (1v1 2v2rt 2v2at 3v3 etc) up until I spent all my pool for fear of not winning more points than the ones I lost. The bonus pool nerf made me snap out of it and I feel much better!



Why focus on rank and points? I see no point in that.


Cause the difference between top masters and mid masters is pretty high?



Ever heard of fun?
◕ ‿‿ ◕ ๑•́ ₃ •̀๑ ( ͡ ° ͜ ʖ ͡°)
Divinek
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
Canada4045 Posts
January 02 2012 00:45 GMT
#9
It's interesting that people get so worried with losing, because if you never lost games I'd imagine this game would get boring pretty fast
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
Oh goodness me, FOX tv where do you get your sight? Can't you keep track, the puck is black. That's why the ice is white.
Tendou
Profile Joined November 2010
United States54 Posts
January 02 2012 17:34 GMT
#10
this is an awesome post
It was a mistake to try to make you feel it again, I see that now.
Snaiil
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Sweden312 Posts
January 02 2012 17:50 GMT
#11
The last point is probably the best one. Great post
FuRRyChoBo
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States218 Posts
January 03 2012 04:15 GMT
#12
I think the problem is because of the competitive spirit associated with SC2 combined with the fear of not being successful at something immediately. The thing people forget is that a lot of people have been playing RTS for a VERY long time, and it takes a lot of work to get better. Don't dwell on having problems; just work on improving your game as a whole!
mike88zgm
Profile Joined January 2012
United States2 Posts
January 08 2012 00:03 GMT
#13
I am going to go ladder now! Thanks for this
~~Followed your stream too, hope to see you play!
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
LiuLi Cup
11:00
46
Creator vs Percival
ByuN vs SHIN
Rogue vs hero
Clem vs Classic
WardiTV271
Liquipedia
Afreeca Starleague
10:00
Ro4 Match 2
Soma vs Bisu
Afreeca ASL 16779
sctven
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 260
SortOf 127
Lowko87
ProTech82
Rex 76
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 8844
Sea 5438
Rain 4303
Flash 4270
Jaedong 2842
BeSt 1718
Horang2 942
Mini 822
EffOrt 511
Pusan 506
[ Show more ]
actioN 425
Larva 409
Stork 329
ZerO 289
firebathero 260
Hyun 247
Barracks 178
Light 164
PianO 91
hero 76
ToSsGirL 65
JYJ54
Aegong 39
Backho 36
Sharp 27
NotJumperer 26
Rush 25
Bale 21
yabsab 19
JulyZerg 18
Sea.KH 17
soO 14
Terrorterran 13
Sacsri 13
Hm[arnc] 11
HiyA 11
SilentControl 10
ajuk12(nOOB) 10
Icarus 10
scan(afreeca) 7
Noble 7
Dota 2
XaKoH 258
XcaliburYe245
League of Legends
JimRising 617
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1854
shoxiejesuss809
x6flipin387
edward12
oskar6
Other Games
summit1g6140
Pyrionflax306
crisheroes265
B2W.Neo213
DeMusliM203
Fuzer 75
Codebar3
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL4930
Other Games
gamesdonequick849
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 297
lovetv 8
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 1
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Doublelift2274
• Jankos1976
• Lourlo626
Upcoming Events
OSC
2h 39m
OSC
6h 39m
MaxPax vs Gerald
Solar vs Krystianer
PAPI vs Lemon
Ryung vs Moja
Nice vs NightPhoenix
Cham vs TBD
MaNa vs TriGGeR
PiGosaur Monday
12h 39m
OSC
1d 11h
The PondCast
1d 22h
OSC
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
Safe House 2
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
[ Show More ]
Safe House 2
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4 - TS2
WardiTV TLMC #15
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
EC S1
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025

Upcoming

SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
RSL Offline Finals
RSL Revival: Season 3
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.