• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 18:51
CEST 00:51
KST 07:51
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting10[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11Team TLMC #5: Winners Announced!3[ASL20] Ro8 Preview Pt2: Holding On9Maestros of the Game: Live Finals Preview (RO4)5
Community News
Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou21Weekly Cups (Oct 13-19): Clem Goes for Four3BSL Team A vs Koreans - Sat-Sun 16:00 CET7Weekly Cups (Oct 6-12): Four star herO85.0.15 Patch Balance Hotfix (2025-10-8)81
StarCraft 2
General
RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close" Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou The New Patch Killed Mech! Weekly Cups (Oct 13-19): Clem Goes for Four 5.0.15 Patch Balance Hotfix (2025-10-8)
Tourneys
Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest Tenacious Turtle Tussle RSL Season 3 Qualifier Links and Dates $1,200 WardiTV October (Oct 21st-31st) SC2's Safe House 2 - October 18 & 19
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 496 Endless Infection Mutation # 495 Rest In Peace Mutation # 494 Unstable Environment Mutation # 493 Quick Killers
Brood War
General
OGN to release AI-upscaled StarLeague from Feb 24 Is there anyway to get a private coach? BW General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ SnOw's Awful Building Placements vs barracks
Tourneys
Small VOD Thread 2.0 ASL final tickets help [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Semifinal B
Strategy
Roaring Currents ASL final Relatively freeroll strategies BW - ajfirecracker Strategy & Training TvP Upgrades
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Dawn of War IV ZeroSpace Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine YouTube Thread The Chess Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion Anime Discussion Thread Series you have seen recently... Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023 Formula 1 Discussion NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
The Benefits Of Limited Comm…
TrAiDoS
Sabrina was soooo lame on S…
Peanutsc
Our Last Hope in th…
KrillinFromwales
Certified Crazy
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1227 users

Breaking out into the scene #9

Blogs > MonkSEA
Post a Reply
MonkSEA
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Australia1227 Posts
December 01 2011 09:09 GMT
#1
Blogggg time!!!

I haven't done it for a while, so here's a new blog!

I took a short 3 day break from SC2 to play Skyrim(Who didn't? )

After Skyrim, I was a little off and on SC2, mainly watching Streams, but in this last week I've started participating in tournaments and playing a lot. Anyone else who is masters that want's to practice, join 'Masters practice group' I've met so many great player who have agreed to practice with me, so I'm going to go back to my schedule.

I didn't really watch all that much Dreamhack since it started really early in the morning for me, and I just ended up playing SC2, except I watched the finals. Pretty amazing with the casters lounge and the games weren't too bad.

So I booted up SC2 Gears and looked at my matchups.. This is what it returned me with..

[image loading]
From the left: Matchups, Games Played, APM, EAPM, APM Redundancy, Record, Win-rate, Time spent in matchup, Average game length, Presence, Average games a day, First Game, Last Game

Yes.. That's over 100 hours spent in ZvZ while less then 60 hours spent in the other two match-ups, and I was wondering why I could play toe-to-toe with players on the level of vileHawk. So I decided that I won't be focusing on ZvZ(which I still feel is my weakest matchup) but a 63% win-rate says otherwise. Looking at that makes me feel like my ZvT and ZvP aren't too bad either, but it's counting replays I had since I was in platinum.. So I think that's why it's that high. I don't know, I'd love to see an automated 'last 50 matches' type of win percentages or something along those lines, I can do it myself, but that requires time off of SC2!

Now for my APM! :D Shamless bragging incoming!

[image loading]

This made me a little confused.. Why did my APM over seemingly random periods of time just spike down? I did a little research.. and lo and behold! It was because those were the weeks I was offracing as Protoss :x I don't know what the dashes represent, I was thinking maybe long periods of time where I wasn't playing and came back or something along the lines like that.. I have no clue.

So my ZvP's have been a little weird lately, Mass lings into infestors or hydras. I never go mutas because the second all these Protoss find these abusive timings to punish the fast tech of Zerg, a lot of Zergs will fail with their ZvP. I'm finding ling infestor, ling hydra and the good old roach hydra pretty good. I'm starting to mix up my games with bane drops as well. I'm starting to win a lot more in ZvP so I think this might be my style of gameplay.

In other news, 2 stargate's are so fucking annoying. Sometimes I will take no damage from them, even if they are surprise(if they kill overlords on the way etcetc) since I always get an early evo chamber to start upgrades, but sometimes.. I just completely fail with my defense. They find the ONE spot that I don't have a spore crawler and just harass from there. It's really frustrating as well, and makes me tilt a little. This warp prism play most Protoss are doing now isn't too hard to stop, spore and 2 spines in each mineral line to buffer time or out right kill the harassment.

In ZvT I'm losing a lot to just the standard marine tank shit. I find it so hard to break contains on certain maps(specifically Shattered Temple and Antiga Shityards(Just joking on the name play, I'm like 16-2 against T on MLG anitga, but 1-6 on normal antiga..))

In ZvZ I'm just doing Roach infestor or Roach Hydra into infestor, I really enjoy playing with Roach Hydra though, the aggression you can put on in an instant is amazingly fun, but you can also play it pretty defensively(not as good defensive though)

So overall so far this week it's been pretty swell, I've been frustrated with myself for messing up a lot of play, and I end up grinding a few AI games to get me back into the groove while also practising against the thing that made me frustrated. If it's at night I just logout and go to bed, like what I'm about to be doing!

Also, I don't really get why people bring up BW mechanics while talking about SC2 balance. Like honestly.. The games are two completely different things, just because the units follow the same type of concept as its predecessors, it doesn't mean it's the exact same and should be balanced like BW, and half the people(see also: Idiots) that talking about BW don't actually know what they're talking about too :\

Anyways, enough of my bragging and ranting, thanks for reading as always, and expect more of these in the future.

*
http://www.youtube.com/user/sirmonkeh Zerg Live Casts and Commentary!
Liquid`Nazgul
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
22427 Posts
December 01 2011 14:18 GMT
#2
Also, I don't really get why people bring up BW mechanics while talking about SC2 balance. Like honestly.. The games are two completely different things, just because the units follow the same type of concept as its predecessors, it doesn't mean it's the exact same and should be balanced like BW, and half the people(see also: Idiots) that talking about BW don't actually know what they're talking about too :\

Curious what you are trying to say here.
Administrator
.Sic.
Profile Joined February 2011
Korea (South)497 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-01 15:28:44
December 01 2011 15:21 GMT
#3
60% apm redundancy is a lot.... it means you're like super spamming useless things. If you want to measure changes in your multitasking skills, you should look at the EAPM, which is your APM - (APM*APM redundancy) and focus on improving that (although there's no gurantee that EAPM is a 100% accurate way of measuring your multitasking).
Clan MvP Member | http://sc2ranks.com/kr/3273340/SicMvP
NB
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Netherlands12045 Posts
December 01 2011 16:10 GMT
#4
hmm first and fore most, congratz

now about the paragraph nazgul just quote, i think you just get it a bit wrong. 'mechanics' is not the right word i think. Balance could also be a wrong word but im not sure how did you want to use it.

It is true that the 2 games are different but sc2 is build based on BW. I mean its not called CNC 5 but SC2 for a reason. There is a signature play styles/ feeling about each race back in BW while sc2 is just a cluster fucked that dustin browder failed in design. For example, Terran supposed to be the slow race with a slow paced heavy turtle mech style while Protoss is the race which have really expensive but 'good' tier 1 units. Zerg in BW requires a GOD sense in decision making with the larva management mechanic. Mean while in sc2, they just give each race a dragoon(Stalker marauder roaches), an air2air (phoenix corruptors vikings) and stop thinking. Bad game DESIGN which then lead to the rock-paper-sciccor system with the 'A hard counter B' balance approached make sc2 become no more than a slow paced complicated poker games between 2 players.

It is true that Blizzard did a great job in balancing the game. Look at how many patches had came out since beta? A close 50% win rate across all match up show that they care. But the fact that they are incompetent in designing a game to live up with BW is undeniable and should be mentioned as a lot of people were blind because of how sc2 helped eSports grow in general. I mean they could just design sc2 and call it 'space war: wing of liberty' instead of using the name 'Starcraft'.

Finally, dont go to fast on calling people idiot... Every single 'idiot' out there is a potential customer for blizzard and who would not care about their customer? You might be 'oh this guy is dumb fuck wasting my time let me close this thread' but the next day when you wake up, guess what? Roaches to 2 supply! Phoenix get 'auto attack'! Carrier is removed! Just be patient with the slow
Im daed. Follow me @TL_NB
MonkSEA
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Australia1227 Posts
December 01 2011 19:40 GMT
#5
On December 01 2011 23:18 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
Show nested quote +
Also, I don't really get why people bring up BW mechanics while talking about SC2 balance. Like honestly.. The games are two completely different things, just because the units follow the same type of concept as its predecessors, it doesn't mean it's the exact same and should be balanced like BW, and half the people(see also: Idiots) that talking about BW don't actually know what they're talking about too :\

Curious what you are trying to say here.


I know they're the same franchise, but comparing them is like comparing war1 to war3. That's kinda what I'm trying to say. And in terms of people talking out of their ass, it's people who just look at the game and go, wow


On December 02 2011 00:21 .Sic. wrote:
60% apm redundancy is a lot.... it means you're like super spamming useless things. If you want to measure changes in your multitasking skills, you should look at the EAPM, which is your APM - (APM*APM redundancy) and focus on improving that (although there's no gurantee that EAPM is a 100% accurate way of measuring your multitasking).


I know that it's a lot of apm redundancy, but I've always played the game doing some spammy spammy. My EAPM is like always 124-134. I also play that multi tasking trainer where you have to save the probe from the ling, rescue a high templar, make sure your queen stays under 70 energy, Minerals needs to stay below xxx(depends on difficulty) and protect your base from a Terran, while also killing the Terran after you save the templar xx(again, based on the difficulty) times. So I like to think my multi tasking is slow improving.


On December 02 2011 01:10 NB wrote:
hmm first and fore most, congratz

now about the paragraph nazgul just quote, i think you just get it a bit wrong. 'mechanics' is not the right word i think. Balance could also be a wrong word but im not sure how did you want to use it.

It is true that the 2 games are different but sc2 is build based on BW. I mean its not called CNC 5 but SC2 for a reason. There is a signature play styles/ feeling about each race back in BW while sc2 is just a cluster fucked that dustin browder failed in design. For example, Terran supposed to be the slow race with a slow paced heavy turtle mech style while Protoss is the race which have really expensive but 'good' tier 1 units. Zerg in BW requires a GOD sense in decision making with the larva management mechanic. Mean while in sc2, they just give each race a dragoon(Stalker marauder roaches), an air2air (phoenix corruptors vikings) and stop thinking. Bad game DESIGN which then lead to the rock-paper-sciccor system with the 'A hard counter B' balance approached make sc2 become no more than a slow paced complicated poker games between 2 players.

It is true that Blizzard did a great job in balancing the game. Look at how many patches had came out since beta? A close 50% win rate across all match up show that they care. But the fact that they are incompetent in designing a game to live up with BW is undeniable and should be mentioned as a lot of people were blind because of how sc2 helped eSports grow in general. I mean they could just design sc2 and call it 'space war: wing of liberty' instead of using the name 'Starcraft'.

Finally, dont go to fast on calling people idiot... Every single 'idiot' out there is a potential customer for blizzard and who would not care about their customer? You might be 'oh this guy is dumb fuck wasting my time let me close this thread' but the next day when you wake up, guess what? Roaches to 2 supply! Phoenix get 'auto attack'! Carrier is removed! Just be patient with the slow


The BW and SC2 mechanics are different, they're not the same. By mechanics, I mean the SC2 engine. How the game runs, Units clump up more, units have better pathing and units are easier to control. The signature play styles are completely different in some cases in SC2 then in BW, and that's why the games are completely different.

I'm not going to start arguing balance because I couldn't care less - but the games are different because the engine SC2 uses is completely different. Also I never said that Blizzard balanced the game, All I said that was BW and SC2 are completely different games in terms of mechanics so using units in BW as an example to balance is stupid.

How about.. You give SC2 10 years to achieve perfection LIKE BW WAS GIVEN. It's fucking down right retarded to compare a year old game with a 10 year old game and say that isn't balanced as much.

And I call people idiots because they're talking out of their ass. I never said that Blizzard didn't care or anything like that, I just simply said that half the people saying that SC2 units should act like BW units don't actually know what they're talking about. I never said anything in regards to balance, nor did I say anything about Blizzard responding to them. Also I don't see where this beautifully masked balance whine came from as well.
http://www.youtube.com/user/sirmonkeh Zerg Live Casts and Commentary!
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
The PiG Daily
22:00
Best Games of SC
ByuN vs Solar
Reynor vs herO
MaxPax vs Solar
Clem vs MaxPax
PiGStarcraft382
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft382
UpATreeSC 186
ProTech98
Codebar 3
StarCraft: Brood War
NaDa 9
Dota 2
syndereN504
canceldota126
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K593
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox0
Heroes of the Storm
Trikslyr50
Other Games
FrodaN3408
Grubby2686
shahzam634
mouzStarbuck264
ToD241
KnowMe166
C9.Mang0129
ViBE117
PPMD31
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL184
Other Games
BasetradeTV40
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 91
• davetesta38
• RyuSc2 37
• IndyKCrew
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• Kozan
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• RayReign 28
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Doublelift3591
Other Games
• imaqtpie1440
• Scarra318
• Shiphtur174
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
3h 9m
RSL Revival
11h 9m
WardiTV Invitational
12h 9m
OSC
16h 9m
SKillous vs goblin
Spirit vs GgMaChine
ByuN vs MaxPax
Afreeca Starleague
1d 9h
Snow vs Soma
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 11h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 13h
CrankTV Team League
1d 14h
BASILISK vs Streamerzone
Team Liquid vs Shopify Rebellion
Team Vitality vs Team Falcon
RSL Revival
1d 18h
Wardi Open
2 days
[ Show More ]
CrankTV Team League
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
CrankTV Team League
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
CrankTV Team League
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
The PondCast
5 days
CrankTV Team League
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
WardiTV Invitational
6 days
CrankTV Team League
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4 - TS2
WardiTV TLMC #15
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
EC S1
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025

Upcoming

SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
RSL Offline Finals
RSL Revival: Season 3
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
CranK Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.