• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:17
CEST 18:17
KST 01:17
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play1Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview8
Community News
[TLMC] Summer 2026 Ladder Map Rotation05.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start)83ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo39Weekly Cups (June 8-14): Clem and Solar double, PTR tested0RSL: S6 Finals played at BlizzCon 202611
StarCraft 2
General
Is the larve respawn broken? The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser 5.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start) Old Replays From 1.4.6 The future of the SC game model
Tourneys
Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28) Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event INu's Battles#17 <BO.9> Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 532 Nuclear Family Mutation # 531 Experimental Artillery Mutation # 530 One For All
Brood War
General
ASL 22 Proposed Map Pool Best thing happen to StarCraft since Remastered? ProGamer Paychecks Story Data needed BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Grand Finals The Casual Games of the Week Thread [BSL22] GosuLeague Casts - Tue & Thu 22:00 CEST
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies Why doesn't anyone use restoration?
Other Games
General Games
ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The HerO Fan Club! The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Listen To The Coaches!
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 29437 users

Breaking out into the scene #9

Blogs > MonkSEA
Post a Reply
MonkSEA
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Australia1227 Posts
December 01 2011 09:09 GMT
#1
Blogggg time!!!

I haven't done it for a while, so here's a new blog!

I took a short 3 day break from SC2 to play Skyrim(Who didn't? )

After Skyrim, I was a little off and on SC2, mainly watching Streams, but in this last week I've started participating in tournaments and playing a lot. Anyone else who is masters that want's to practice, join 'Masters practice group' I've met so many great player who have agreed to practice with me, so I'm going to go back to my schedule.

I didn't really watch all that much Dreamhack since it started really early in the morning for me, and I just ended up playing SC2, except I watched the finals. Pretty amazing with the casters lounge and the games weren't too bad.

So I booted up SC2 Gears and looked at my matchups.. This is what it returned me with..

[image loading]
From the left: Matchups, Games Played, APM, EAPM, APM Redundancy, Record, Win-rate, Time spent in matchup, Average game length, Presence, Average games a day, First Game, Last Game

Yes.. That's over 100 hours spent in ZvZ while less then 60 hours spent in the other two match-ups, and I was wondering why I could play toe-to-toe with players on the level of vileHawk. So I decided that I won't be focusing on ZvZ(which I still feel is my weakest matchup) but a 63% win-rate says otherwise. Looking at that makes me feel like my ZvT and ZvP aren't too bad either, but it's counting replays I had since I was in platinum.. So I think that's why it's that high. I don't know, I'd love to see an automated 'last 50 matches' type of win percentages or something along those lines, I can do it myself, but that requires time off of SC2!

Now for my APM! :D Shamless bragging incoming!

[image loading]

This made me a little confused.. Why did my APM over seemingly random periods of time just spike down? I did a little research.. and lo and behold! It was because those were the weeks I was offracing as Protoss :x I don't know what the dashes represent, I was thinking maybe long periods of time where I wasn't playing and came back or something along the lines like that.. I have no clue.

So my ZvP's have been a little weird lately, Mass lings into infestors or hydras. I never go mutas because the second all these Protoss find these abusive timings to punish the fast tech of Zerg, a lot of Zergs will fail with their ZvP. I'm finding ling infestor, ling hydra and the good old roach hydra pretty good. I'm starting to mix up my games with bane drops as well. I'm starting to win a lot more in ZvP so I think this might be my style of gameplay.

In other news, 2 stargate's are so fucking annoying. Sometimes I will take no damage from them, even if they are surprise(if they kill overlords on the way etcetc) since I always get an early evo chamber to start upgrades, but sometimes.. I just completely fail with my defense. They find the ONE spot that I don't have a spore crawler and just harass from there. It's really frustrating as well, and makes me tilt a little. This warp prism play most Protoss are doing now isn't too hard to stop, spore and 2 spines in each mineral line to buffer time or out right kill the harassment.

In ZvT I'm losing a lot to just the standard marine tank shit. I find it so hard to break contains on certain maps(specifically Shattered Temple and Antiga Shityards(Just joking on the name play, I'm like 16-2 against T on MLG anitga, but 1-6 on normal antiga..))

In ZvZ I'm just doing Roach infestor or Roach Hydra into infestor, I really enjoy playing with Roach Hydra though, the aggression you can put on in an instant is amazingly fun, but you can also play it pretty defensively(not as good defensive though)

So overall so far this week it's been pretty swell, I've been frustrated with myself for messing up a lot of play, and I end up grinding a few AI games to get me back into the groove while also practising against the thing that made me frustrated. If it's at night I just logout and go to bed, like what I'm about to be doing!

Also, I don't really get why people bring up BW mechanics while talking about SC2 balance. Like honestly.. The games are two completely different things, just because the units follow the same type of concept as its predecessors, it doesn't mean it's the exact same and should be balanced like BW, and half the people(see also: Idiots) that talking about BW don't actually know what they're talking about too :\

Anyways, enough of my bragging and ranting, thanks for reading as always, and expect more of these in the future.

*
http://www.youtube.com/user/sirmonkeh Zerg Live Casts and Commentary!
Liquid`Nazgul
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
22427 Posts
December 01 2011 14:18 GMT
#2
Also, I don't really get why people bring up BW mechanics while talking about SC2 balance. Like honestly.. The games are two completely different things, just because the units follow the same type of concept as its predecessors, it doesn't mean it's the exact same and should be balanced like BW, and half the people(see also: Idiots) that talking about BW don't actually know what they're talking about too :\

Curious what you are trying to say here.
Administrator
.Sic.
Profile Joined February 2011
Korea (South)497 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-01 15:28:44
December 01 2011 15:21 GMT
#3
60% apm redundancy is a lot.... it means you're like super spamming useless things. If you want to measure changes in your multitasking skills, you should look at the EAPM, which is your APM - (APM*APM redundancy) and focus on improving that (although there's no gurantee that EAPM is a 100% accurate way of measuring your multitasking).
Clan MvP Member | http://sc2ranks.com/kr/3273340/SicMvP
NB
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Netherlands12045 Posts
December 01 2011 16:10 GMT
#4
hmm first and fore most, congratz

now about the paragraph nazgul just quote, i think you just get it a bit wrong. 'mechanics' is not the right word i think. Balance could also be a wrong word but im not sure how did you want to use it.

It is true that the 2 games are different but sc2 is build based on BW. I mean its not called CNC 5 but SC2 for a reason. There is a signature play styles/ feeling about each race back in BW while sc2 is just a cluster fucked that dustin browder failed in design. For example, Terran supposed to be the slow race with a slow paced heavy turtle mech style while Protoss is the race which have really expensive but 'good' tier 1 units. Zerg in BW requires a GOD sense in decision making with the larva management mechanic. Mean while in sc2, they just give each race a dragoon(Stalker marauder roaches), an air2air (phoenix corruptors vikings) and stop thinking. Bad game DESIGN which then lead to the rock-paper-sciccor system with the 'A hard counter B' balance approached make sc2 become no more than a slow paced complicated poker games between 2 players.

It is true that Blizzard did a great job in balancing the game. Look at how many patches had came out since beta? A close 50% win rate across all match up show that they care. But the fact that they are incompetent in designing a game to live up with BW is undeniable and should be mentioned as a lot of people were blind because of how sc2 helped eSports grow in general. I mean they could just design sc2 and call it 'space war: wing of liberty' instead of using the name 'Starcraft'.

Finally, dont go to fast on calling people idiot... Every single 'idiot' out there is a potential customer for blizzard and who would not care about their customer? You might be 'oh this guy is dumb fuck wasting my time let me close this thread' but the next day when you wake up, guess what? Roaches to 2 supply! Phoenix get 'auto attack'! Carrier is removed! Just be patient with the slow
Im daed. Follow me @TL_NB
MonkSEA
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Australia1227 Posts
December 01 2011 19:40 GMT
#5
On December 01 2011 23:18 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
Show nested quote +
Also, I don't really get why people bring up BW mechanics while talking about SC2 balance. Like honestly.. The games are two completely different things, just because the units follow the same type of concept as its predecessors, it doesn't mean it's the exact same and should be balanced like BW, and half the people(see also: Idiots) that talking about BW don't actually know what they're talking about too :\

Curious what you are trying to say here.


I know they're the same franchise, but comparing them is like comparing war1 to war3. That's kinda what I'm trying to say. And in terms of people talking out of their ass, it's people who just look at the game and go, wow


On December 02 2011 00:21 .Sic. wrote:
60% apm redundancy is a lot.... it means you're like super spamming useless things. If you want to measure changes in your multitasking skills, you should look at the EAPM, which is your APM - (APM*APM redundancy) and focus on improving that (although there's no gurantee that EAPM is a 100% accurate way of measuring your multitasking).


I know that it's a lot of apm redundancy, but I've always played the game doing some spammy spammy. My EAPM is like always 124-134. I also play that multi tasking trainer where you have to save the probe from the ling, rescue a high templar, make sure your queen stays under 70 energy, Minerals needs to stay below xxx(depends on difficulty) and protect your base from a Terran, while also killing the Terran after you save the templar xx(again, based on the difficulty) times. So I like to think my multi tasking is slow improving.


On December 02 2011 01:10 NB wrote:
hmm first and fore most, congratz

now about the paragraph nazgul just quote, i think you just get it a bit wrong. 'mechanics' is not the right word i think. Balance could also be a wrong word but im not sure how did you want to use it.

It is true that the 2 games are different but sc2 is build based on BW. I mean its not called CNC 5 but SC2 for a reason. There is a signature play styles/ feeling about each race back in BW while sc2 is just a cluster fucked that dustin browder failed in design. For example, Terran supposed to be the slow race with a slow paced heavy turtle mech style while Protoss is the race which have really expensive but 'good' tier 1 units. Zerg in BW requires a GOD sense in decision making with the larva management mechanic. Mean while in sc2, they just give each race a dragoon(Stalker marauder roaches), an air2air (phoenix corruptors vikings) and stop thinking. Bad game DESIGN which then lead to the rock-paper-sciccor system with the 'A hard counter B' balance approached make sc2 become no more than a slow paced complicated poker games between 2 players.

It is true that Blizzard did a great job in balancing the game. Look at how many patches had came out since beta? A close 50% win rate across all match up show that they care. But the fact that they are incompetent in designing a game to live up with BW is undeniable and should be mentioned as a lot of people were blind because of how sc2 helped eSports grow in general. I mean they could just design sc2 and call it 'space war: wing of liberty' instead of using the name 'Starcraft'.

Finally, dont go to fast on calling people idiot... Every single 'idiot' out there is a potential customer for blizzard and who would not care about their customer? You might be 'oh this guy is dumb fuck wasting my time let me close this thread' but the next day when you wake up, guess what? Roaches to 2 supply! Phoenix get 'auto attack'! Carrier is removed! Just be patient with the slow


The BW and SC2 mechanics are different, they're not the same. By mechanics, I mean the SC2 engine. How the game runs, Units clump up more, units have better pathing and units are easier to control. The signature play styles are completely different in some cases in SC2 then in BW, and that's why the games are completely different.

I'm not going to start arguing balance because I couldn't care less - but the games are different because the engine SC2 uses is completely different. Also I never said that Blizzard balanced the game, All I said that was BW and SC2 are completely different games in terms of mechanics so using units in BW as an example to balance is stupid.

How about.. You give SC2 10 years to achieve perfection LIKE BW WAS GIVEN. It's fucking down right retarded to compare a year old game with a 10 year old game and say that isn't balanced as much.

And I call people idiots because they're talking out of their ass. I never said that Blizzard didn't care or anything like that, I just simply said that half the people saying that SC2 units should act like BW units don't actually know what they're talking about. I never said anything in regards to balance, nor did I say anything about Blizzard responding to them. Also I don't see where this beautifully masked balance whine came from as well.
http://www.youtube.com/user/sirmonkeh Zerg Live Casts and Commentary!
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 13m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RushiSC 286
elazer 219
Ryung 135
BRAT_OK 54
Railgan 45
SHIN 21
mouzStarbuck 8
RotterdaM 0
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 4358
Sea 1668
Jaedong 887
Mini 598
EffOrt 514
Hyuk 419
BeSt 304
Soulkey 230
Zeus 209
Snow 156
[ Show more ]
Soma 152
Rush 125
Dewaltoss 121
ggaemo 102
hero 82
Hyun 69
Pusan 45
Aegong 34
scan(afreeca) 27
GoRush 25
ToSsGirL 24
sorry 20
IntoTheRainbow 18
yabsab 16
Bale 14
Hm[arnc] 12
Sacsri 12
ajuk12(nOOB) 8
Dota 2
Dendi1248
BananaSlamJamma302
420jenkins283
Counter-Strike
x6flipin343
edward54
Other Games
singsing3698
hiko1299
B2W.Neo1137
FrodaN1066
crisheroes311
Sick260
Beastyqt214
KnowMe131
ArmadaUGS88
Mew2King38
Trikslyr37
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream590
StarCraft 2
TaKeTV 364
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• mYiSmile129
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV515
League of Legends
• Nemesis3489
Other Games
• Shiphtur288
Upcoming Events
RotterdaM Event
13m
RotterdaM0
RSL Revival
17h 43m
RSL Revival
1d
Bombastic Starleague
1d 3h
PiGosaur Cup
1d 7h
Kung Fu Cup
1d 18h
Replay Cast
2 days
CrankTV Team League
2 days
Bombastic Starleague
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
[ Show More ]
HomeStory Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
HomeStory Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
HomeStory Cup
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
Douyu Cup 2026
Murky Cup 2026

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
CSL Season 21: Qualifier 2
SCTL 2026 Spring
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026

Upcoming

CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
ASL Season 22:Wild Card Qualifier
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
BCC 2026
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E1
Heroes Pulsing #3
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.