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Hi TL I just recently moved to Maui, Hawaii. Overall its been pretty nice, but there is a HUGE racism problem here, native Hawaiians hate white people (they call them "haole") its so bad that in my neighborhood I cant even go out at night, I would get mugged, stabbed etc.
Even the government here is racist, the judges are Hawaiian, the police are Hawaiian, being a white person here, is like being a black male in the 60s, alot of Hawaiians who get sent to court for rape charges and the like against white women, get off almost Scott free, and never try to take a native to court, you wont win. Its that bad. Seriously
When you drive down the road, it isn't uncommon to get the middle finger from a Hawaiian on the street, if you go to a restaurant, and there is a Hawaiian guy behind you, there going to make his food first, and probably spit in yours.
I have to a go to a little all-white christian school, because pretty much all public schools, are all Hawaiian, in fact, recently a PUBLIC Hawaiian only school opened in Pukalani, even if i wanted to go, I couldn't, because im white.
/end rant
 
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I'm not sure of what to make of this.
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you should just be like, yo im white, dont hate
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As hard to believe as this is, if what you say is true them you have my sympathy. Hopefully we will get more information from other people who live in Hawaii.
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Wow I am surprised to hear this if it is indeed true. Hang in there, be tough, and try to be the bigger, better person.
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The area im in is drug infested so that could be a contributing cause .__.
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Seems like its going against human rights...
Not that I know much.
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you need to befriend some hawaiian people (somehow). hopefully they are people with power.
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How is it a public school if you can't go to it because you are white?
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On September 08 2011 17:00 travis wrote:
How is it a public school if you can't go to it because you are white?
i think he means he cant go cause of to much bullying towards him cause him being white.
i think,
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they dont allow white kids, and the school isn't privatized or w.e its a public school tho, its probably the one of the biggest middle school on the island. EDIT When I was looking for a school to go to, the first one that caught my eye was a HUGE brand new one in the pukalani area (i think?) well I called them and they said I couldn't go because it was a all Hawaiian school, sort of how they have Indian only schools on the mainland, on reservations or whatever? Im not to well educated on the subject.
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being a white person here, is like being a black male in the 60s
I can find no reference to any public schools in Hawaii disallowing any race or gender to attend. Care to share some references?
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I think he probably reads too much right-wing propaganda and watches too much TV. As a result he's scared of Hawaiians and pretends it's their fault.
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Personally, I would imagine that Hawaii is too tourist-dependent to afford to be so blatantly racist like that. Although perhaps it's the dependency that causes the racism.
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I've heard similar stories from Caucasian friends who live or have lived in Hawaii. They've mostly been happy living there, but some neighborhoods are not nearly as friendly as others, particularly in the Honolulu metropolitan area.
On the other hand, I have one Caucasian friend who said that the Hawaiian locals in his neighborhood, who were at first distant and wary, welcomed him once they realized he had children living in the neighborhood. He wasn't sure if it was something about putting down roots there or just maybe seeming more stable or nonthreatening because he had a family, but he had a very good experience.
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I do have a few white friends from Hawaii, but they haven't mentioned any like racism towards them. So I don't know -- it might just be a general hatred towards non-islanders. Hawaii is a huge tourist destination, so I assume it's pretty annoying for them to deal with tourists/outsiders all the time.
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On September 08 2011 17:10 Jinsho wrote:
I think he probably reads too much right-wing propaganda and watches too much TV. As a result he's scared of Hawaiians and pretends it's their fault.
Really?
I think you are jumping to massive conclusions here. I'm not saying that you're definately wrong, but please try not to make these huge leaps, it's not constructive. Try to actually respond to the content of the post, if you think he is lying or exaggerating, try asking about that first.
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On September 08 2011 17:10 Jinsho wrote:
I think he probably reads too much right-wing propaganda and watches too much TV. As a result he's scared of Hawaiians and pretends it's their fault.
Tourists only go to Touristy parts of the island, Lahaina, haleakala, kihei etc. They dont go to places like slums in kahului, ghetto shacks in the upcountry, etc. where a white person would never step foot.
I can deal with a few locals flipping me off, and pointing me in the wrong direction when i ask for help, i dont really give a shit, but what erks me, is the corruption and the government, how if I get stabbed or something serious, the offender will most likely get off almost scotch free, maybe a year in jail tops, nothing much. Its that kind of stuff that bothers me, the stuff you don't hear about. You have to live here to understand.
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Crazy to think that its possibly that bad there. Or is this a ploy to get us to not want to vacation there anymore?
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On September 08 2011 17:28 Irave wrote:
Crazy to think that its possibly that bad there. Or is this a ploy to get us to not want to vacation there anymore?
There's a lot of ghettos in Hawaii. Honolulu has a pretty high crime rate. I believe it's the second or third highest in the US?
Hawaii also has like some of the worst public school systems in the US.
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What the fuck... As a scandinavian my image of Hawaii is a happy paradise with beaches and shit.
jeezus...
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They're probably pissed about businessmen contaminating their crops with gene-manipulated ones. I think I saw a documentary about it.
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For starters I have to say that racism is the height of ignorance and stupidity, imo.
But knowing nothing of living in Hawaii myself I have to wonder if part of the reason they hate white people is because it wasn't that long ago that Hawaii was totally fucked over by white people. There are still huge racism problems in the south between blacks and whites, a lot of that goes back to the Civil War. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of their racism derives from their past in Hawaii as well.
That said, it doesn't justify their racism.
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nice rant but is there a way for you go get out of hawaii asap?
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Wow I thought Hawaii's a vacation paradise. Hard to imagine this kind of racism surrounding it. Or maybe the places tourists go to aren't affected as much compared to the city and town areas?
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Okay hold on- I haven't heard of ANY of the racism and granted I'm on the opposite side of the country, you'd still hear about it. What the hell.
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Hawaiians are nice to people in touristy areas, because they can easily make money off them, but once you move in to one of there small towns they get really passive agressive, I cant really put a word on it.
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But can you put any proof in the segregation claim?
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from my brief time in hawaii i can vouch for the OP, exploring beyond touristy areas to the ghettos can get you in trouble. from what i could feel there was also a pretty strong hawaiian secessionist movement there too. just stay off the ice!
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Racism exists everywhere, you'll find it if you look.
I was in Hawaii recently for a while, got to know a native hawaiin dude-- was a cool guy, was proud to be able to speak hawaiian when so many people forgot it, taught me some hawaiian pidgin. (yeah, I'm a white guy).
If you say something like "native Hawaiians hate white people " and then follow it up with statements about how 'they' are so corrupt, etc, that says a lot more about your view of the place than the place itself. That kind of mindset basically creates racism both towards you, and from you.
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^ benjammin means methamphetamines for the non US readers.
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It can't be worse than being black in the 60's. You can always go out and tan, and rub stuff on your skin til you're bright orange. Now you look Hawaiian!
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obviously not all native hawaiins hate white people, but in my experience most of the hawaiians i try to talk to, wont even make eye contact with me. And the local government here is corrupt, to put it bluntly, but most people who live here dont care.
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And I thought white people are racists. :o
I hope you find a solution soon enough though.
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On September 08 2011 18:02 Makaveli1 wrote:
obviously not all native hawaiins hate white people, but in my experience most of the hawaiians i try to talk to, wont even make eye contact with me. And the local government here is corrupt, to put it bluntly, but most people who live here dont care.
Well, you can justify racism in your own perspectives by talking about corruption and making blanket general statements about what kind of people native hawaiians are, or you can look for areas in your own experience that don't exhibit racism and build from there.
I can guarantee that if you continue to assume that all or most native hawaiians are unfriendly/corrupt/hate white people to begin with, that mentality will come across in your own interactions with other people, and you'll come across as judgemental/racist, and thus encourage that type of mentality when you interact with people. I think a better alternative for me would be to give people the benefit of the doubt at times, and be disappointed some of the time, but have overall more positive experiences with the people you deal with day to day.
Ask yourself this-- would you rather be friends with someone who assumed before he met you that you were a judgemental asshole, or someone that thought you would be cool to hang out with and probably a decent guy? Now look at the way you are assuming, and imagine how others see you. I don't think you're that kind of person, so you should give people the benefit of the doubt so they don't mistake you for that kind of person.
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On September 08 2011 17:58 caradoc wrote:
Racism exists everywhere, you'll find it if you look.
I was in Hawaii recently for a while, got to know a native hawaiin dude-- was a cool guy, was proud to be able to speak hawaiian when so many people forgot it, taught me some hawaiian pidgin. (yeah, I'm a white guy).
If you say something like "native Hawaiians hate white people " and then follow it up with statements about how 'they' are so corrupt, etc, that says a lot more about your view of the place than the place itself. That kind of mindset basically creates racism both towards you, and from you.
you can't really use an anecdote as a counterargument to a generalization, things don't need to be 100% consistent to be a tendency
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My friends who were stationed in Hawaii have told me the exact same things so I am going to have to think what the TC is saying is true. I've been warned to not get stationed there because of the severe limitations on where you can be without getting jumped for being white. I didn't really believe them, but if I am hearing it from two different sources, I'd have to think it is at least a little bit true.
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So why are you still living there?
Sounds like you shouldn't be there if you ask me.
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Funny how he mentioned that he moved to there so he has actually experience what's living there like, and there comes a bunch of people, who never been to Hawaii or just at the populated tourist areas or a friend or their friend's friend said that it's not really bad, and trying to tell him that he must be wrong. I know for a lot of you (and you are fortunate) hard to imagine that racism against white people is as strong as racism against non-whites at some places, or even stronger. (duh South Africa)
I don't really know what to say, maybe you should move to a more tourist friendly area in Hawaii.
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I was in Hawaii a few months ago, and I never experienced any racism. We were on Kauai though, not Maui.
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how old are you
i have been in hawaii all my life
there is racism towards whites for sure especially if they give an air of arrogance or appear really non-local
but i think you drastically over exaggerate your experience unless you are bringing it on yourself in a very large amount
i know this because i know even more people that (incoming classic race trump card) have best friends who are white
you must live in a really ghetto area where the racism tends to be stronger
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Maybe they are mad because the western people came from the other side of the wold, destroyed their army, occupied their land, crushed the resistance and then annexed it.
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there is only one answer for you. start tanning.
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On September 08 2011 17:32 overt wrote:
it wasn't that long ago that Hawaii was totally fucked over by white people
What? Were they better of tribal with no hope of development and endemic war?
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A good friend of mine is 100% of hawaiian decent but was born on the mainland. he went to hawaii (honolulu) summer of 09 for vacation and he went to visit his family outside the tourist areas and they were even rude to him, calling him a haole and flipping him off and stuff. he couldn't go anywhere by himself he had to have his cousins with him to keep things from happening to him. i guess him and his family are traders for leaving hawaii?? (not from him that's my theory) it's not just white people it's all "outsiders".
idk anything about the government and the court system so i can't comment on that, but it seems very weird to me that people don't know about the racism/violence. i learned this in high school in U.S. history class. maybe if ur not from the US i can understand, but sometimes americans suprise me. i'd assume us history is pretty standard throughout the states, and the history of hawaii seems significant enough to be put into the curriculum. do people just not pay attention? or does no one care because it doesn't involve them? i don't agree with the violence but i don't blame hawaiians for being angry at us. we did go in there and kinda take over. (i'd like to be more specific but it's been a few years since US history.)
as someone said earlier in the thread, racism is everywhere. as an african american gentlemen i can tell you that even today as a 21 year old living in the united states, i see it all the time. i even find myself being i wouldn't say racist but judgmental at times. if a group of 5 big black guys wearing baggy clothes comes walking toward you what would you do?? not gonna lie i'd be fkin scared, and i'm big and black myself. did those black guys do anything to me? are they planning to do something to me? i have no idea only thing i know is i wanna get the hell away from them as soon as possible. racism is everywhere (in america at least) don't be ignorant and say it's done with and you've never heard anything about it.
sry idk if the last paragraph was necessary but this is a sensitive subject for me.
EDIT:
+ Show Spoiler +On September 08 2011 18:53 Terranist wrote:
there is only one answer for you. start tanning.
i hope i'm being trolled cause otherwise ur a fkin idiot
+ Show Spoiler +On September 08 2011 19:00 Romantic wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2011 17:32 overt wrote:
it wasn't that long ago that Hawaii was totally fucked over by white people What? Were they better of tribal with no hope of development and endemic war?
i can't believe i just read someone write this...
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I've heard similar stories like this about korea as well. It's sad that we're in this day and age, yet we can't be accepting of others. That's humans for ya.
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On September 08 2011 19:02 JDizz6688 wrote:
What? Were they better of tribal with no hope of development and endemic war?
i can't believe i just read someone write this...
That is an excellent explanation as to how white people came along and made things so much worse for them that they have regrettable but historically understandable racism towards white people.
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Its what happenin when a population is entirely secular apart from tourists. Now I could say all the Hawaiians i've met have been nice (actually i lie.. one was a total socio-path I'll be telling people stories about for the rest of my life,) but from what I understand they are very proud of their heritage, just like the koreans /Japanese etc. So they don't seem to immediately warm to outsiders no.
I've had some blatant racism thrown at me being a whitey when I was in Japan, but i also met a lot of really awesome people. So I wouldn't go so far to judge a whole country on a few assholes.
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That really stinks. All I can say is try to keep a positive attitude and set a good example for your race. I would read about Martin Luther King Jr, Thurgood Marshall, Nelson Mandela, Jackie Robinson and other people who have had to deal with racism. Howard Stern also grew up in an area where it was tough being white, and he turned out ok. I don't know how helpful his autobiography would be. Of course these are the exceptions, it is perfectly understandable that you would be bitter. Just try to stay true to yourself.
+ Show Spoiler +On September 08 2011 19:00 Romantic wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2011 17:32 overt wrote:
it wasn't that long ago that Hawaii was totally fucked over by white people What? Were they better of tribal with no hope of development and endemic war? This is so wrong its almost funny. What makes you think that the Native Hawaiians had no hope of development? I think anyone can see that if avoiding war is your goal, joining the US is probably not productive, probably better if they were colonized by Switzerland or something.
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Personally, I think all racism is a joke and all racist terms are even funnier. The reason I think that is because usually the only people who attempt to use the terms at a disrespectful level are more than likely not doing very good their selves and using them on someone who the think is "Lower" than them makes them feel better. Its the same with trolls on the internet, and its the same with the big ugly kid in your elementary/middle school classes. If someone calls me a "nigger", I dont get mad at all, I just ignore them because thats the easiest (and best) way to deal with people like that. They're just your basic bullies. Not sure if this has anything to do with the op but, in your case just go where you want to. If you cant get there, go to where your wanted. Dont try to force yourself into any awkward positions because the place that you live at is (obviously) naturally going to be filled with Hawaiians anyway.
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Never knew this existed in Hawaii, interesting
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On September 08 2011 17:58 caradoc wrote:
Racism exists everywhere, you'll find it if you look.
I was in Hawaii recently for a while, got to know a native hawaiin dude-- was a cool guy, was proud to be able to speak hawaiian when so many people forgot it, taught me some hawaiian pidgin. (yeah, I'm a white guy).
If you say something like "native Hawaiians hate white people " and then follow it up with statements about how 'they' are so corrupt, etc, that says a lot more about your view of the place than the place itself. That kind of mindset basically creates racism both towards you, and from you.
yeah it's like people think racism only excists in the Western world or something...
I know someone who lived on this island ( can't remember the name it's half Dutch and half French )
and she went trough a lot of racism there from the black people it can be quite bad everywhere.
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Hawai'i was invaded, their royal family and high level government officials imprisoned, and is still occupied to this day. Yeah, I'd think they'd be just a bit racist towards white people.
I don't know why people are surprised that the Chinese are racist towards the Japanese, the Tibetans and Mongolians towards the Chinese, the Afghanistanis towards Americans and Russians, etc.
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Makaveli1, foreigners introduced a lot of things to Hawaii, like disease, racial degradation, and the concept of "private land ownership." Through these introduction of foreign mentalities and concepts, and various events like the abolishment of the Kapu system, the Great Mahele, and the "ban" of speaking Hawaiian, Hawaiians lost a lot of their culture while foreigners obtained a lot of Hawaiian land. Also, with the introduction of plantation farms, the plantation owners were not conscious of how delicate the resources of the islands were, and so not only were the Hawaiian people suffering, but the land itself suffers, too.
Then in 1887, King Kalākaua was forced to sign the Bayonet Constitution at gunpoint, which removed the executive powers of the king and restricted the voting rights of many Hawaiians through various restrictions like literacy and property requirements. Queen Liliʻuokalani succeeded Kalākaua to the throne after he passed away, and she was going to create a new constitution, but in1893 there was the whole event where Queen Liliʻuokalani was overthrown, and a group consisting mainly of white plantation owners took charge of the government in Hawaii for a long time, and Hawaii eventually became a territory, and then a state of United States.
This is only a little bit of history of Hawaii, but white people have had a tremendous impact on Hawaii. Not everything foreigners introduced were necessarily negative, but over a very long period of time the Hawaiian culture, land, and people suffered. The attitudes some people possess towards foreigners here in Hawaii may be negative at times, but I hope you can understand the reasoning. The negative attitude towards white people is not shared by everyone, but there are still some people who feel compelled to outwardly express their discontent. It is not nice for anyone to show disrespect, but do not let their behaviour discourage you. Do your best to be respectful and to be courteous. Chances are you may encounter the same people more than once, and they will probably remember you.
Having lived here all my life, I do question your doubt in the justice system. I live in a different area of Hawaii, but I cannot confirm the racial preference in the court. On this island at least, the Hawaiian ethnic population of inmates is slightly more significant compared to the other ethnicities. No court system is perfect, but I wonder what your sources are for these allegations. There are Innocence Programs going around the country looking to free innocent individuals who have been accused of crimes they did not commit. In Maui there was a recent case this year where a man who had spent about 20 years of prison has been released because the Hawaii's Innocence Program gathered evidence to support his innocence. But I still question the validity of the statement that Hawaiians are immune to the justice system.
Two more things: The term "haole" is the Hawaiian word for "foreign." In the culture here it is frequently used in reference towards white people, but it is not a racial slur. Also, there is this concept and attitude of "Aloha." Believe it or not, but it exists, and people possess it. I hope you may experience it.
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Sucks for you man, better go try to make peace.
Otherwise =[
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One of my coworkers (white male) lived in Hawaii for 10+ years, and he told me similar stories, but not as severe as your case.
He told me that Asian Americans are really popular in Hawaii, is that true?
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On September 08 2011 18:47 Suisen wrote:
Maybe they are mad because the western people came from the other side of the wold, destroyed their army, occupied their land, crushed the resistance and then annexed it.
Wait Hawaii had an army?
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I don't know anything about racism in Hawaii but I can say from first-hand experience that much of the "native" population lives in really desperate poverty. The neighborhoods I've seen remind me of some of the worst areas of Los Angeles. You just can't see them from the resorts. It's the kind of environment that would breed a lot of resentment.
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On September 08 2011 19:05 KonohaFlash wrote:
I've heard similar stories like this about korea as well. It's sad that we're in this day and age, yet we can't be accepting of others. That's humans for ya.
Korea is nothing like this. Korean people are lovely to visitors.
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On September 08 2011 19:00 Romantic wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2011 17:32 overt wrote:
it wasn't that long ago that Hawaii was totally fucked over by white people What? Were they better of tribal with no hope of development and endemic war?
Typical Western viewpoint. Bringing civilization to the natives so they have to be grateful? Bullshit.
Like the poster a couple of posts above said, white settlers on Hawaii disenfranchised the majority of the poor native Hawaiian population, implementing policies that favored the rich whites greatly. The Bayonet Constitution and the illegal overthrow of the Queen also didn't help matters.
I don't condone racism though, so those Hawaiians actively bullying white people are deplorable.
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On September 09 2011 02:42 sick_transit wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2011 19:05 KonohaFlash wrote:
I've heard similar stories like this about korea as well. It's sad that we're in this day and age, yet we can't be accepting of others. That's humans for ya. Korea is nothing like this. Korean people are lovely to visitors.
Koreans are pretty racist. Just talking to one of my old friends after leaving the country for 8 years made this very obvious to me. The people that receive the brunt of the racism in Korea are Indians, Middle Easterners, and Blacks. I've noticed that for all the publicity that the Korean-Japanese national tensions get on the media, in a normal person to person interaction, people are pretty friendly to Japanese tourists.
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I can't say I noticed any tension between Koreans and Japanese people while I was in Japan. Japanese tourists love Korea, people often go to Korean restaurants, listen to Kpop.. etc the hatred between them is old fashioned and overblown in the media.. just like how Japanese people "hate" Americans (hint.. absolute bollocks!.. they love Americans, or at least the youth do) Every Korean I've ever met and spoke to personally I've liked and got on with.
One Korean girl nearly had me crying with laughter using a starcraft put-down on another Korean girl.
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Not really surprised. Been to Hawaii a few times and you wouldn't notice it on the big island but if you get away from the touristy places it comes out. I'm asian-american so I guess no one ever bothered me but you'd see shit like "white people go home, leave your women" graffiti. Tbh though, the OP probably isn't making his situation better for himself. At the same time it really seemed like there was an anti-outsider/white people feeling out in the country.
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I remember when I went to maui you couldn't go out at big beaches at night because thats where the bums/poor people smoke crack, and other hardcore drugs 0.o
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On September 09 2011 02:42 sick_transit wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2011 19:05 KonohaFlash wrote:
I've heard similar stories like this about korea as well. It's sad that we're in this day and age, yet we can't be accepting of others. That's humans for ya. Korea is nothing like this. Korean people are lovely to visitors.
tell that to bi-racial koreans...
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On September 09 2011 09:44 Gingerninja wrote:
I can't say I noticed any tension between Koreans and Japanese people while I was in Japan. Japanese tourists love Korea, people often go to Korean restaurants, listen to Kpop.. etc the hatred between them is old fashioned and overblown in the media.. just like how Japanese people "hate" Americans (hint.. absolute bollocks!.. they love Americans, or at least the youth do) Every Korean I've ever met and spoke to personally I've liked and got on with.
One Korean girl nearly had me crying with laughter using a starcraft put-down on another Korean girl.
I think it depends on the people. From what I've heard and experienced (through friends, not directly), the anti-Korean thing by the Japanese is more likely to be found amongst the older generation and not as likely with the younger generation, whom, as you describe, listen to kpop and are fascinated by Korean shit.
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On September 08 2011 17:32 FourFace wrote:
They're probably pissed about businessmen contaminating their crops with gene-manipulated ones. I think I saw a documentary about it.
perhaps because any plants OR animals that become genetically modified by eating genetically modified PATENTED plants become fall under the PATENt themselves, and as such become the property of the people who used bio-labs and engineers to manipulate the DNA of plants, as a money grab.
Imagine that in 10 or 20 years there will be bio-wars going on, with people creating new strains and trying to release other strains to wipe out competitor crops.
Destroying nature for the pocketbook, nothing new, and what happened in hawaii is just the start of the above described, and just a footnote in how far its progressed since the 60's.
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On September 09 2011 01:27 pred470r wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2011 18:47 Suisen wrote:
Maybe they are mad because the western people came from the other side of the wold, destroyed their army, occupied their land, crushed the resistance and then annexed it. Wait Hawaii had an army?
Maybe they are mad because Western people came from somewhere else in the world, occupied their land, overthrew the monarchy, crushed the resistances, and then annexed it.
^fxt
I'd be a little bit upset.
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
On September 09 2011 00:16 Cambium wrote:
One of my coworkers (white male) lived in Hawaii for 10+ years, and he told me similar stories, but not as severe as your case.
He told me that Asian Americans are really popular in Hawaii, is that true?
I never lived in Maui as a resident, but would wager that I have been there more times than 99.99% of the TL.net visitors. Even though I've only been there as a vacationer and primarily on the west side of the island, I can believe what the OP is saying, and what Cambium's friend said as well. Kahului is not that nice of a place and I can believe that shady stuff happens there. 
I presume you moved there due to family. Do you think there is any way you can go to a school in Oahu? (where you'd work parttime to cover 1/2 your expenses or something...)
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EPT
