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Interpretation of 15th cent song

Blogs > exeexe
Post a Reply
exeexe
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Denmark937 Posts
February 07 2011 16:42 GMT
#1
Lyric from the song Greensleeves:

My gayest gelding I thee gaue

LOL @ the funny spelling
LOL @ the use of the word GAY!!!

gayest = gayest
gelding = castrated horse
thee = you
gaue = gave

but really, is gayest really gayest? o.0
source:
http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/ballads/handful.html#green

I was also told here
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greensleeves
that green of that time was related to sex, so gayest and sex seems to be concepts related to each other huh?


At the time, the word "green" had sexual connotations


Man, WTF, back then the people had something between their ears compared to nowadays. How did we end up in this big pile of shit, where green is seen as something bad and needs to be harashed until thee conforms?

In the modernised version of the song they censured out the part containing gayest lol?

Should u not know what music i am talking about:


And never forget, its always easier to throw a bomb downstairs than up. - George Orwell
NonY
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
8751 Posts
February 07 2011 17:00 GMT
#2
Why didn't you ever say what you think the author intended the line to mean?

In addition to its original and continuing senses of “merry, lively” and “bright or showy,” gay has had various senses dealing with sexual conduct since the 17th century. A gay woman was a prostitute, a gay man a womanizer, a gay house a brothel.

I think a gay gelding is a metaphor for the speaker in the song. The speaker is sexually desirous of Lady Green Sleeves but her refusal makes him unable to act on his desire. The horse, being described as the gayest, has strong sexual desires but his castration makes him unable to act on his desire.
"Fucking up is part of it. If you can't fail, you have to always win. And I don't think you can always win." Elliott Smith ---------- Yet no sudden rage darkened his face, and his eyes were calm as they studied her. Then he smiled. 'Witness.'
anatem
Profile Joined September 2010
Romania1369 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-07 17:01:58
February 07 2011 17:01 GMT
#3
gay = merry, happy

wtf are you doing here

edit: oh, tyler went for the scholarly approach, there you go
'Tis with our Judgements as our Watches, none / Go just alike, yet each believes his own.
Kamille
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Monaco1035 Posts
February 07 2011 17:02 GMT
#4
Green probably referenced the idea of fertility, spring, rebirth etc, making it sexual in nature.
Priphea
Patriot.dlk
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Sweden5462 Posts
February 07 2011 17:04 GMT
#5
When you find the most obscure forum thread you might just find Tyler in there making a quality post lol
exeexe
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Denmark937 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-07 17:27:36
February 07 2011 17:21 GMT
#6
On February 08 2011 02:02 Kamille wrote:
Green probably referenced the idea of fertility, spring, rebirth etc, making it sexual in nature.


yes yes but its gay o.o

On February 08 2011 02:00 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
Why didn't you ever say what you think the author intended the line to mean?


I did, but im bad:
He gives his castrated most gayest horse to her. This means he has more horses that are gay, but she coouldnt have them. Its must be the gayest.

I see the castrated part as something that is fixed. Look you get a horse not on a bronzeplate but on a silverplate. I did all the work for you.

On February 08 2011 02:01 anatem wrote:
gay = merry, happy


Man this makes no sense cause normally gay, when not used for sexual orientation, is loaded with negative vibes.

For example if i said to my parents i wish you a gay christmas, they would hit me and tell me to wash my mouth with soap.

But if i said "man that political speech was just pure gay", no one would think i would be positive about it o.o
And never forget, its always easier to throw a bomb downstairs than up. - George Orwell
Musoeun
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States4324 Posts
February 07 2011 17:28 GMT
#7
On February 08 2011 02:21 exeexe wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 08 2011 02:01 anatem wrote:
gay = merry, happy


Man this makes no sense cause normally gay, when not used for sexual orientation, is loaded with negative vibes.

For example if i said to my parents i wish you a gay christmas, they would hit me and tell me to wash my mouth with soap.

But if i said "man that politically speech was just pure gay", no one would think i would be positive about it o.o


You've got it a little back to front here. "Gay" originally meant happy, with sexual overtones (I'm trying to think of an equivalent modern word and failing) as discussed above by Tyler and others.

It only gained its pejorative sense indirectly: as it came to mean only/mainly "homosexual", society (still largely heterosexual) started using it as an insult because being a homo has been something that's been getting you insulted for years and years (see: Julius Caesar, yes that one, getting called "Queen of Bithynia" for an alleged affair on a campaign).

And of course, now it's starting to become a general-purpose insult with no regard to any original meaning, which is just an example of how language changes.
Don't Shoot the Penguins. | Dance, 성은, dance! | Killer FanKlub | Action sucks. | Storm Terran hwaiting.
QuanticHawk
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States32097 Posts
February 07 2011 17:33 GMT
#8
On February 08 2011 02:21 exeexe wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 08 2011 02:02 Kamille wrote:
Green probably referenced the idea of fertility, spring, rebirth etc, making it sexual in nature.


yes yes but its gay o.o

Show nested quote +
On February 08 2011 02:00 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
Why didn't you ever say what you think the author intended the line to mean?


I did, but im bad:
He gives his castrated most gayest horse to her. This means he has more horses that are gay, but she coouldnt have them. Its must be the gayest.

I see the castrated part as something that is fixed. Look you get a horse not on a bronzeplate but on a silverplate. I did all the work for you.

Show nested quote +
On February 08 2011 02:01 anatem wrote:
gay = merry, happy


Man this makes no sense cause normally gay, when not used for sexual orientation, is loaded with negative vibes.

For example if i said to my parents i wish you a gay christmas, they would hit me and tell me to wash my mouth with soap.

But if i said "man that political speech was just pure gay", no one would think i would be positive about it o.o



words can have multiple meanings that are not necessarily negative... gay as cheerful is a little old world, but anyone native english speaker with a halfway decent education would get what you meant
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exeexe
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Denmark937 Posts
February 07 2011 17:45 GMT
#9
Ok then - Guess i learned something here :D
And never forget, its always easier to throw a bomb downstairs than up. - George Orwell
Navane
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Netherlands2749 Posts
February 07 2011 17:45 GMT
#10
Uh there are no lyrics in the youtube?
exeexe
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Denmark937 Posts
February 07 2011 17:47 GMT
#11
On February 08 2011 02:45 Navane wrote:
Uh there are no lyrics in the youtube?


lol no i think it sounds better with no lyrics. However it comes in many variations on youtube, and you got the lyrics in OP, so i think its ok.
And never forget, its always easier to throw a bomb downstairs than up. - George Orwell
Kamille
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Monaco1035 Posts
February 07 2011 17:50 GMT
#12


Clearly, Maria is not gay, as she loves Tony.

Otherwise, I believe this is a troll. The immaturity of finding humor in the word gay is quite exaggerated.
Priphea
exeexe
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Denmark937 Posts
February 07 2011 18:00 GMT
#13
Man i can go on iccup play one on one, loose, and call my opponent gay, and not have fear of penalties..
And never forget, its always easier to throw a bomb downstairs than up. - George Orwell
Herpadurr
Profile Joined January 2011
Monaco151 Posts
February 07 2011 18:04 GMT
#14
Damned, the topic made me believe this was a thread about some guy named 15th Cent who parodies songs by 50 Cent by rapping about 15th century topics.
My hopes and dreams have been crushed.
You're stupid. Stop it.
emythrel
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United Kingdom2599 Posts
February 07 2011 18:10 GMT
#15
On February 08 2011 02:28 Musoeun wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 08 2011 02:21 exeexe wrote:
On February 08 2011 02:01 anatem wrote:
gay = merry, happy


Man this makes no sense cause normally gay, when not used for sexual orientation, is loaded with negative vibes.

For example if i said to my parents i wish you a gay christmas, they would hit me and tell me to wash my mouth with soap.

But if i said "man that politically speech was just pure gay", no one would think i would be positive about it o.o


You've got it a little back to front here. "Gay" originally meant happy, with sexual overtones (I'm trying to think of an equivalent modern word and failing) as discussed above by Tyler and others.

It only gained its pejorative sense indirectly: as it came to mean only/mainly "homosexual", society (still largely heterosexual) started using it as an insult because being a homo has been something that's been getting you insulted for years and years (see: Julius Caesar, yes that one, getting called "Queen of Bithynia" for an alleged affair on a campaign).

And of course, now it's starting to become a general-purpose insult with no regard to any original meaning, which is just an example of how language changes.


I think the word closest to it now would be "camp". Camp means happy, boysterous behaviour. It is often used to describe men who behave in a more feminine way but doesn't automatically have the sexual connotations attached.

When there is nothing left to lose but your dignity, it is already gone.
aike
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States1629 Posts
February 07 2011 19:01 GMT
#16
On February 08 2011 02:00 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
Why didn't you ever say what you think the author intended the line to mean?

Show nested quote +
In addition to its original and continuing senses of “merry, lively” and “bright or showy,” gay has had various senses dealing with sexual conduct since the 17th century. A gay woman was a prostitute, a gay man a womanizer, a gay house a brothel.

I think a gay gelding is a metaphor for the speaker in the song. The speaker is sexually desirous of Lady Green Sleeves but her refusal makes him unable to act on his desire. The horse, being described as the gayest, has strong sexual desires but his castration makes him unable to act on his desire.


Tyler is such a hero! Haha.
Wahaha
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