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Zerg rule finally toppled - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Prev 1 2 3 4 5 10 11 12 Next All
ScrubS
Profile Joined September 2010
Netherlands436 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-18 12:32:31
April 18 2013 12:31 GMT
#21
On April 18 2013 21:23 dani` wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2013 21:20 ScrubS wrote:
The math seems pretty solid behind it. For those people wondering why the top 10 is rather strange, the website is based on a dataset of thousands of replays. Unfortuantely pro's dont release their replays (except streamers such as ForGG) and are therefore not rated correctly

Not so much replays, just official matches I would think.


Even then the same problem pops up. If replays from only official matches would be taken, players from EU wouldn't be ever (or almost never) matched vs koreans, meaning that their relative ELO actually cannot be determined. This will ofcourse lead into flaws in the rankings.

The best would be if only matches/replays from the same tournament (or same class tournaments) would be considered, or at least from the same region. For example, the zotac cup and go4sc2cup are pretty similar level, and replays of those tournaments could be merged into a big dataset. GSL and GSTL goes the same, but not GSL and the zotac cup.
Godwrath
Profile Joined August 2012
Spain10126 Posts
April 18 2013 12:32 GMT
#22
On April 18 2013 21:23 ZenithM wrote:
I like how I have no idea of the current skill level of some of the names of that list.
Like, Lucifron, Sen and forGG what? :D

Edit: And no Kespa players


Kespa players will start raising as they play more GSL (MLGs too or is that completely over?). About Sen, forGG and lucifron, like kespa players, you should take into account that they play mostly in foreign competitions so while they are good foreigner players their aligulac rating is only accurate if you compare them with people who play in those competitions aswell.
Forsy
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada36 Posts
April 18 2013 12:33 GMT
#23
As usual, the overpowered, easy race a-move protoss is magically not well represented at the top.

User was warned for this post
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
April 18 2013 12:42 GMT
#24
Free at last, hallelujah free at last! No longer are we under the boot of Broodlord infestor!
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
SpaceYeti
Profile Joined June 2010
United States723 Posts
April 18 2013 13:01 GMT
#25
IS this still factoring in performance from WoL? or was it reset with HotS? Would be interesting to see a side by side comparison.
Behavior is a function of its consequences.
Darroth
Profile Joined October 2012
United Kingdom38 Posts
April 18 2013 13:16 GMT
#26
I thought RoRo was second just a few days ago.
Godwrath
Profile Joined August 2012
Spain10126 Posts
April 18 2013 13:18 GMT
#27
On April 18 2013 22:16 Darroth wrote:
I thought RoRo was second just a few days ago.


You are thinking of TLPD rating ?
Zealously
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
East Gorteau22261 Posts
April 18 2013 13:20 GMT
#28
On April 18 2013 22:16 Darroth wrote:
I thought RoRo was second just a few days ago.


If you're thinking about TLPD, Roro is still second - Aligulac uses a separate rating system
AdministratorBreak the chains
TheBB
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Switzerland5133 Posts
April 18 2013 13:21 GMT
#29
On April 18 2013 22:01 SpaceYeti wrote:
IS this still factoring in performance from WoL? or was it reset with HotS? Would be interesting to see a side by side comparison.

There was no reset.
http://aligulac.com || Barcraft Switzerland! || Zerg best race. || Stats-poster extraordinaire.
HaruRH
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Singapore2780 Posts
April 18 2013 13:21 GMT
#30
Funfact: GGanDoL have 666 rating. Conspiracy theory anyone?
It is fucking D4 and you are still alive as a CONFIRMED FUCKING TOWN. This is how fucking terrible scum thinks you are - Koshi
TAMinator
Profile Joined February 2011
Australia2706 Posts
April 18 2013 13:21 GMT
#31
List is pretty invalid if there's no KESPA players.
Shellshock
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States97276 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-18 13:25:22
April 18 2013 13:25 GMT
#32
I guess what's happening with kespa is when they all started playing they had no rating. then they only played each other so their rating didnt really go up. they only way their rating increases quickly is by beating players with established ratings, so the one that qualified for GSL are moving up. but then if they lost a game in proleague they lose to players with low rating because those players havent established a rating yet. it's kind of just a cycle that has to work itself out eventually. that's my take on it at least. could be completely wrong
Moderatorhttp://i.imgur.com/U4xwqmD.png
TL+ Member
Scarecrow
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Korea (South)9172 Posts
April 18 2013 13:26 GMT
#33
Having only one player from SPL (currently has over half of code S) in your top 10 list makes your rating system garbage.
Yhamm is the god of predictions
playa
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States1284 Posts
April 18 2013 13:27 GMT
#34
List is depressing. The 1 toss in the top 10 for foreigners is someone I have to ask myself if I've heard of him before, and a player whose only mu above 50% is p vs p. The stats better change a lot in HotS, or they may as well start holding Toss only tournaments.
MasterOfPuppets
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Romania6942 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-18 13:30:56
April 18 2013 13:29 GMT
#35
On April 18 2013 22:21 TAMinator wrote:
List is pretty invalid if there's no KESPA players.


Because subjectivity > math?

U wot m8.

On April 18 2013 22:27 playa wrote:
List is depressing. The 1 toss in the top 10 for foreigners is someone I have to ask myself if I've heard of him before, and a player whose only mu above 50% is p vs p. The stats better change a lot in HotS, or they may as well start holding Toss only tournaments.


I can see where you're coming from, but also it's your own problem if you don't follow the scene well enough to know Welmu. He's been around for a while and has always been a consistent, solid Protoss.
"my shaft scares me too" - strenx 2014
Zarahtra
Profile Joined May 2010
Iceland4053 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-18 13:33:59
April 18 2013 13:30 GMT
#36
This seems like it's lacking a lot of data to be reliable. Also guessing WCS EU is screwing over NA players a lot, which afaik haven't really had any real tourneys in HotS? Atleast the foreigner list is far from what I'd consider the top 10, and like I said noticeably many EU players.

Edit:
On April 18 2013 22:29 MasterOfPuppets wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2013 22:21 TAMinator wrote:
List is pretty invalid if there's no KESPA players.


Because subjectivity > math?

U wot m8.

Show nested quote +
On April 18 2013 22:27 playa wrote:
List is depressing. The 1 toss in the top 10 for foreigners is someone I have to ask myself if I've heard of him before, and a player whose only mu above 50% is p vs p. The stats better change a lot in HotS, or they may as well start holding Toss only tournaments.


I can see where you're coming from, but also it's your own problem if you don't follow the scene well enough to know Welmu. He's been around for a while and has always been a consistent, solid Protoss.

I'm sure the person you are quoting isn't doubting the math behind the list, but rather that the dataset has any resemblance with the real skill level of players, when WoL stats and tourneys have only be held to specific portions of the world.
MasterOfPuppets
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Romania6942 Posts
April 18 2013 13:31 GMT
#37
On April 18 2013 22:30 Zarahtra wrote:
This seems like it's lacking a lot of data to be reliable. Also guessing WCS EU is screwing over NA players a lot, which afaik haven't really had any real tourneys in HotS? Atleast the foreigner list is far from what I'd consider the top 10, and like I said noticeably many EU players.


If I'm not mistaken, there's significantly more games in the Aligulac database than in TLPD.
"my shaft scares me too" - strenx 2014
Whatson
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
United States5356 Posts
April 18 2013 13:35 GMT
#38
On April 18 2013 22:29 MasterOfPuppets wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2013 22:21 TAMinator wrote:
List is pretty invalid if there's no KESPA players.


Because subjectivity > math?

U wot m8.

Show nested quote +
On April 18 2013 22:27 playa wrote:
List is depressing. The 1 toss in the top 10 for foreigners is someone I have to ask myself if I've heard of him before, and a player whose only mu above 50% is p vs p. The stats better change a lot in HotS, or they may as well start holding Toss only tournaments.


I can see where you're coming from, but also it's your own problem if you don't follow the scene well enough to know Welmu. He's been around for a while and has always been a consistent, solid Protoss.

Lol has welmu even won anything major, or is he just another one of those guys who gets knocked out in the Ro8 of a euro/NA tournament and gets called "good"
¯\_(シ)_/¯
MasterOfPuppets
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Romania6942 Posts
April 18 2013 13:39 GMT
#39
On April 18 2013 22:35 Whatson wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2013 22:29 MasterOfPuppets wrote:
On April 18 2013 22:21 TAMinator wrote:
List is pretty invalid if there's no KESPA players.


Because subjectivity > math?

U wot m8.

On April 18 2013 22:27 playa wrote:
List is depressing. The 1 toss in the top 10 for foreigners is someone I have to ask myself if I've heard of him before, and a player whose only mu above 50% is p vs p. The stats better change a lot in HotS, or they may as well start holding Toss only tournaments.


I can see where you're coming from, but also it's your own problem if you don't follow the scene well enough to know Welmu. He's been around for a while and has always been a consistent, solid Protoss.

Lol has welmu even won anything major, or is he just another one of those guys who gets knocked out in the Ro8 of a euro/NA tournament and gets called "good"


I could say the same thing about a bunch of foreigners (who are actually far overrated compared to their actual results). And it depends what you mean by major. He won Assembly this year and placed 2nd in Copenhagen Games last year, both of which are very reputable scandinavian lans. But obviously you're going to decry that that's not good enough.

But I've watched him play and seen some pretty sick stuff.
"my shaft scares me too" - strenx 2014
Whatson
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
United States5356 Posts
April 18 2013 13:44 GMT
#40
On April 18 2013 22:39 MasterOfPuppets wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2013 22:35 Whatson wrote:
On April 18 2013 22:29 MasterOfPuppets wrote:
On April 18 2013 22:21 TAMinator wrote:
List is pretty invalid if there's no KESPA players.


Because subjectivity > math?

U wot m8.

On April 18 2013 22:27 playa wrote:
List is depressing. The 1 toss in the top 10 for foreigners is someone I have to ask myself if I've heard of him before, and a player whose only mu above 50% is p vs p. The stats better change a lot in HotS, or they may as well start holding Toss only tournaments.


I can see where you're coming from, but also it's your own problem if you don't follow the scene well enough to know Welmu. He's been around for a while and has always been a consistent, solid Protoss.

Lol has welmu even won anything major, or is he just another one of those guys who gets knocked out in the Ro8 of a euro/NA tournament and gets called "good"


I could say the same thing about a bunch of foreigners (who are actually far overrated compared to their actual results). And it depends what you mean by major. He won Assembly this year and placed 2nd in Copenhagen Games last year, both of which are very reputable scandinavian lans. But obviously you're going to decry that that's not good enough.

But I've watched him play and seen some pretty sick stuff.

Oh, so he only wins against euros and NA players. Yeah shows how lacking the "foreigner top 10" is.
¯\_(シ)_/¯
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