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On January 10 2013 20:44 TheBB wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2013 20:16 Toxi78 wrote:
to be taken with a "grain of salt", considering MVP (surely the most dominant T we've seen in wol, don't think you can argue with that) appears ONCE in the terran hall of fame (http://aligulac.com/records/?race=T) Mvp is good at winning tournaments. I don't think he was as far ahead of his peers as the paychecks indicated. Also this ranking tends to value very high performance over short periods of time over "quite" high performance over long periods of time. That's why I made the Hall of Fame (where Mvp is third).
MVP not being at any foreign tournaments for quite a long time probably also had quite an effect on his ratings. While winning vs top tier competition gives bigger rating jumps, winning is still winning, and Bomber for example racked up a lot of his rating by dominating foreign competitions(and all-killing GSTL matches).
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United Kingdom14103 Posts
On January 10 2013 20:16 TheBB wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2013 20:13 Targe wrote:
Just to clarify, these rankings represent who's dominant in a short period of time correct? Shorter than the ELO ranking of TL at least? I think the word you're looking for is volatile, and the answer is that yeah, these ratings react quite quickly to apparent changes in skill.
Awesome, that's definitely the word I was looking for, thanks for the reply. That means this is helpful for me because I cannot follow what's going on 24/7 and am often quite clueless as to the true skill of a player at a current time + Show Spoiler +I know players who were good for a time e.g. Taeja was incredible for a bit and I didn't realise he wasn't still incredible until a month after he had started losing games, this happened to me with DRG as well -.-
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Would be nice if you added the: "Show only X country" or "Show without X Country"
Could be used to see only American players, or see the list without Koreans (Which I guess most would like to have :-P)
Also: Always a pleasure to work with you and help you, I really love the project 
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This shows how broken the game is with Zerg players dominating the lists of best Korean and best Foreigners. It's undeniable now.
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Online performances really helped in a time where not much is going on tournament-wise. And Welmu really did extremely well in the last couple of weeks, glad he gets some recognition in the list.
Yay for VortiX and it's a bit weird that Baby is still hanging around, I never understood how he got up there in the first place.
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How is KT so low despite dominating Proleague?
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Surprised to see a protoss so high on that list
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On January 11 2013 08:03 StarVe wrote:
Online performances really helped in a time where not much is going on tournament-wise. And Welmu really did extremely well in the last couple of weeks, glad he gets some recognition in the list.
Yay for VortiX and it's a bit weird that Baby is still hanging around, I never understood how he got up there in the first place.
Looks like he got a lot of points from the MvP matches:
http://aligulac.com/players/63/period/69/
Since then he's been slowly going down:
http://aligulac.com/players/63/historical/
There were so many MvP games, that should help get the relative ratings of Koreans vs Foreigners more accurate. After Baby and other Kespa players took rating points from overrated foreigners, he is now distributing them to other Koreans.
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On January 11 2013 08:06 RainmanMP wrote:
How is KT so low despite dominating Proleague?
Remember that the team rank is not based on results in team leagues, but rather on simulations, which are based on the ratings of the individual players on the team. The question should then be: why are players on KT ranked so low, in spite of dominating in Proleague?
The obvious answer is probably that the Kespa players play fewer games than the ESF players do, so their ratings don't update as quickly. (This also explains why Baby is still ranked so high. He did great in MvP, and then he keeps playing just enough games to stay active, but not enough to really drop down quickly.)
Another explanation could be that the KT players are doing well in Proleague but poorly in other leagues. (Certainly possible, considering the recent Up and Downs for example. I'm not familiar enough with each of them to say.)
Feel free to investigate. You can see the matches that caused each rating adjustment by going to a player page, clicking "rating history" and then clicking the little arrow to the right of the entry you are interested in.
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On January 11 2013 08:29 TheBB wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 08:06 RainmanMP wrote:
How is KT so low despite dominating Proleague? Remember that the team rank is not based on results in team leagues, but rather on simulations, which are based on the ratings of the individual players on the team. The question should then be: why are players on KT ranked so low, in spite of dominating in Proleague? The obvious answer is probably that the Kespa players play fewer games than the ESF players do, so their ratings don't update as quickly. (This also explains why Baby is still ranked so high. He did great in MvP, and then he keeps playing just enough games to stay active, but not enough to really drop down quickly.) Another explanation could be that the KT players are doing well in Proleague but poorly in other leagues. (Certainly possible, considering the recent Up and Downs for example. I'm not familiar enough with each of them to say.) Feel free to investigate. You can see the matches that caused each rating adjustment by going to a player page, clicking "rating history" and then clicking the little arrow to the right of the entry you are interested in.
Why are rating update speed and number of games related?
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On January 11 2013 08:29 TheBB wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 08:06 RainmanMP wrote:
How is KT so low despite dominating Proleague? Remember that the team rank is not based on results in team leagues, but rather on simulations, which are based on the ratings of the individual players on the team. The question should then be: why are players on KT ranked so low, in spite of dominating in Proleague? The obvious answer is probably that the Kespa players play fewer games than the ESF players do, so their ratings don't update as quickly. (This also explains why Baby is still ranked so high. He did great in MvP, and then he keeps playing just enough games to stay active, but not enough to really drop down quickly.) Another explanation could be that the KT players are doing well in Proleague but poorly in other leagues. (Certainly possible, considering the recent Up and Downs for example. I'm not familiar enough with each of them to say.) Feel free to investigate. You can see the matches that caused each rating adjustment by going to a player page, clicking "rating history" and then clicking the little arrow to the right of the entry you are interested in.
Well that makes sense with Jaedong being top 10 despite Flash putting in the better proleague performance because of the up and downs.
I don't know of anyone on KT other than Flash who has done anything in individual leagues since the MvP tournament, remind me if there are 
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the term "patchzerg" is real? i thought it was just a whining term
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On January 11 2013 08:36 jinorazi wrote:
the term "patchzerg" is real? i thought it was just a whining term
It's a term for people that don't know when Brood War pros switched to SC2 and assorted international players weren't known before WCS because their countries don't get very much spotlight. It's not a whining term, just a term used by those that have no idea what they're talking about.
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On January 11 2013 08:34 Hier wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 08:29 TheBB wrote:On January 11 2013 08:06 RainmanMP wrote:
How is KT so low despite dominating Proleague? Remember that the team rank is not based on results in team leagues, but rather on simulations, which are based on the ratings of the individual players on the team. The question should then be: why are players on KT ranked so low, in spite of dominating in Proleague? The obvious answer is probably that the Kespa players play fewer games than the ESF players do, so their ratings don't update as quickly. (This also explains why Baby is still ranked so high. He did great in MvP, and then he keeps playing just enough games to stay active, but not enough to really drop down quickly.) Another explanation could be that the KT players are doing well in Proleague but poorly in other leagues. (Certainly possible, considering the recent Up and Downs for example. I'm not familiar enough with each of them to say.) Feel free to investigate. You can see the matches that caused each rating adjustment by going to a player page, clicking "rating history" and then clicking the little arrow to the right of the entry you are interested in. Why are rating update speed and number of games related?
Please, read the FAQ. I wrote it for exactly these kinds of questions. Relevant section:
Then, the new rating is adjusted somewhat in the direction of the maximal likelihood rating found above. How much it's adjusted depends on how certain the original rating was, and how certain the maximal likelihood rating is (how consistent the results were). The adjustment will be biased towards whichever of these two is most certain.
Basically, the more games a player plays over a shorter time period, the more accurately we can pinpoint his or her current skill. More weight will then be given to the recent results, and less weight to the rating from the previous list. If a player plays fewer games, they gauge the current skill of a player very inaccurately, and so the system will "prefer" the relative certainty of the already established rating.
The uncertainty of a player's rating will grow over time if he or she doesn't play enough games. At the moment Baby's rating has an estimated standard deviation of about 93 points. After his MvP run, it was about 72. If it grows much larger, his rating will adjust quicker.
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this should be all the ammo that the zerg-too-strong lot need
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Makes me proud to be a startales fan , even when they had the even crappier logos -_-.
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On January 11 2013 08:41 Elite_ wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 08:36 jinorazi wrote:
the term "patchzerg" is real? i thought it was just a whining term It's a term for people that don't know when Brood War pros switched to SC2 and assorted international players weren't known before WCS because their countries don't get very much spotlight. It's not a whining term, just a term used by those that have no idea what they're talking about.
It's a term for Zergs who have been playing for longer than since 1.5 came out and only started to get good around then. Their game plan only revolves around getting to BL Infestor as fast as possible and hoping you don't die before then. Patchzergs are players who are able to win, or get really close losses despite glaring holes in their game play and being outplayed all game long because of how cost efficient you can be with infestors right now.
It also applies to players who had good mechanics but no results who just dominate now that Zerg have their optimal composition, most Korean zergs would fall into this category while foreigners are the more of the former.
Vers article sums it up well, and you're silly if you think he has no idea what he's talking about
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So, on a different topic to balance whine...
Damn, startale still being top of both team formats even without parting.
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yeah keep posting rating lists >_>
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EPT
