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Mailing
Profile Joined March 2011
United States3087 Posts
June 15 2011 02:47 GMT
#681
On June 15 2011 11:46 EnderCraft wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:44 Mailing wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:41 EnderCraft wrote:
Would you want to give a grand to somebody who took a shat all over you? I certainly wouldn't. They don't deserve my time or money.

Why host a tourney if you only pick your favorite players?


That is completely irrelevant to the quote above. TB is financing this tournament by himself, I hope you understand that. It's completely up to him who he deems as an invite candidate.


For someone who spouts "ESPORTS" a lot, no it's not
Are you hurting ESPORTS? Find out today - http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=232866
Phaded
Profile Joined August 2010
Australia579 Posts
June 15 2011 02:47 GMT
#682
On June 15 2011 11:44 Mailing wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:41 EnderCraft wrote:
Would you want to give a grand to somebody who took a shat all over you? I certainly wouldn't. They don't deserve my time or money.

Why host a tourney if you only pick your favorite players?


That's the definition of an invitational, to pick the players you want to play. Just like a showmatch. It would be a different story if it was an open tournament, but as an invitational, its up to the organiser and only the organiser to determine who to invite, not some vocal posters on a board.
I am down but I am far from over
Heaton31
Profile Joined October 2010
United States323 Posts
June 15 2011 02:48 GMT
#683
On June 15 2011 11:45 walklightwhat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:41 TotalBiscuit wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:38 DrN0 wrote:
I hate to sound like a four year old, but Idra did start it... he made it personal before it was, and although I usually agree with taking the higher road, there is no need to let somebody you know who openly slanders you have an attempt at earning your money. Frankly this hurts him more than you. I could talk about why for years, but I am sure everyone can summarize the reasons.


Pretty much this. If I was actively working against the guy to sabotage tournament invites, then angryinternetguy would have a point but as it stands, it's my invitational and I can invite whoever I please to take my money or in this case, not. If you want people to give you money it's usually a good idea not to go around insulting them. Yes there are actually consequences to doing things on the internet.


So, basically, if someone is asked for their opinion on a tournament you were involved in (in this case the IPL) and says, bluntly perhaps but still honestly, that you're a bad caster they are no longer eligible to participate in tournaments you run yourself?

That's fine either way, but it's pretty ridiculous to claim IdrA made it personal by giving his opinion, especially when you not only take every opportunity you get to take cheap shots at either him or his fans on reddit or in your casts and also were the one who turned it into a twitter bitch fight, criticizing both his fans and casting.

This is whole thing is a pile of childish bullshit from the pair of you.


So basically how NASL hand picked their players?

If I run a tournament and put up the money myself and only want to invite people starting with the letter A I can do that because... it's my tournament.
nvs.
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada3609 Posts
June 15 2011 02:48 GMT
#684
not some vocal posters on a board.


Well if the goal is to gain the viewership of those vocal posters then their opinion DOES become important. ^^
TotalBiscuit
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United Kingdom5437 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-15 02:51:59
June 15 2011 02:50 GMT
#685
On June 15 2011 11:47 Mailing wrote:
For someone who spouts "ESPORTS" a lot, no it's not


Sorry, but not inviting IdrA to a tournament does not HURT ESPORTS. There's a lot of players I didn't invite to this tournament and there are a lot of players who I won't invite to the next one, mostly because that's how math works. You don't need IdrA to have a successful 8-man tournament.

Well if the goal is to gain the viewership of those vocal posters then their opinion DOES become important. ^^


It isn't.
CommentatorHost of SHOUTcraft Clan Wars- http://www.mlg.tv/shoutcraft
walklightwhat
Profile Joined November 2010
Australia752 Posts
June 15 2011 02:50 GMT
#686
On June 15 2011 11:48 Heaton31 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:45 walklightwhat wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:41 TotalBiscuit wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:38 DrN0 wrote:
I hate to sound like a four year old, but Idra did start it... he made it personal before it was, and although I usually agree with taking the higher road, there is no need to let somebody you know who openly slanders you have an attempt at earning your money. Frankly this hurts him more than you. I could talk about why for years, but I am sure everyone can summarize the reasons.


Pretty much this. If I was actively working against the guy to sabotage tournament invites, then angryinternetguy would have a point but as it stands, it's my invitational and I can invite whoever I please to take my money or in this case, not. If you want people to give you money it's usually a good idea not to go around insulting them. Yes there are actually consequences to doing things on the internet.


So, basically, if someone is asked for their opinion on a tournament you were involved in (in this case the IPL) and says, bluntly perhaps but still honestly, that you're a bad caster they are no longer eligible to participate in tournaments you run yourself?

That's fine either way, but it's pretty ridiculous to claim IdrA made it personal by giving his opinion, especially when you not only take every opportunity you get to take cheap shots at either him or his fans on reddit or in your casts and also were the one who turned it into a twitter bitch fight, criticizing both his fans and casting.

This is whole thing is a pile of childish bullshit from the pair of you.


So basically how NASL hand picked their players?

If I run a tournament and put up the money myself and only want to invite people starting with the letter A I can do that because... it's my tournament.


Which is why I said it is fine.

It's also fine if TB doesn't want to address my points. If I'm delusional, so be it.
TotalBiscuit
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United Kingdom5437 Posts
June 15 2011 02:51 GMT
#687
On June 15 2011 11:50 walklightwhat wrote:
Which is why I said it is fine.

It's also fine if TB doesn't want to address my points. If I'm delusional, so be it.


Address your points? You're asking me to prove a negative?

Burden of proof is on the accuser. You accused me of taking every chance I get to take potshots at IdrA and his fans, including in my casts. Prove it.
CommentatorHost of SHOUTcraft Clan Wars- http://www.mlg.tv/shoutcraft
Probulous
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Australia3894 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-15 02:55:58
June 15 2011 02:52 GMT
#688
On June 15 2011 11:44 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:44 Mailing wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:41 EnderCraft wrote:
Would you want to give a grand to somebody who took a shat all over you? I certainly wouldn't. They don't deserve my time or money.

Why host a tourney if you only pick your favorite players?



Excluding one person on the entire planet is not the same as only picking my favourite players.


I wonder whether he would accept the invite if you made one? My guess is no, especially not now.

To quote the great TL Ten Commandments "My house my rules". I don't see the problem here. Who cares if you actually did only invite your favourite players?

Seriously what exactly is the problem here?

Loved the NASL Top Ten. I know I'm late but that was awesome.

Edit:
On June 15 2011 11:50 TotalBiscuit wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +

On June 15 2011 11:47 Mailing wrote:
For someone who spouts "ESPORTS" a lot, no it's not


Sorry, but not inviting IdrA to a tournament does not HURT ESPORTS. + Show Spoiler +
There's a lot of players I didn't invite to this tournament and there are a lot of players who I won't invite to the next one, mostly because that's how math works. You don't need IdrA to have a successful 8-man tournament.

Well if the goal is to gain the viewership of those vocal posters then their opinion DOES become important. ^^


It isn't.


Thanks for this quote, it is going straight to Makilatov's blog
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=232866
"Dude has some really interesting midgame switches that I wouldn't have expected. "I violated your house" into "HIHO THE DAIRY OH!" really threw me. You don't usually expect children's poetry harass as a follow up " - AmericanUmlaut
DrN0
Profile Joined September 2010
United Kingdom184 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-15 02:54:07
June 15 2011 02:52 GMT
#689
On June 15 2011 11:44 Mailing wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:41 EnderCraft wrote:
Would you want to give a grand to somebody who took a shat all over you? I certainly wouldn't. They don't deserve my time or money.

Why host a tourney if you only pick your favorite players?



That should be why host a tourney if you dont invite your enemies? enemies being a strong word but the only apt one in that sentence, and the answer is to teach them a lesson, to tell them that you are not powerless. Or more honestly not giving the oppurtunity to win money to somebody who has openly insulted you,

Why reward someone when their true character has already been revealed by their actions? Especially when there are equally qualified competitors.
TotalBiscuit
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United Kingdom5437 Posts
June 15 2011 02:53 GMT
#690
On June 15 2011 11:52 Probulous wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:44 TotalBiscuit wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:44 Mailing wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:41 EnderCraft wrote:
Would you want to give a grand to somebody who took a shat all over you? I certainly wouldn't. They don't deserve my time or money.

Why host a tourney if you only pick your favorite players?



Excluding one person on the entire planet is not the same as only picking my favourite players.


I wonder whether he would accept the invite if you made one? My guess is no, especially not now.

To quote the great TL Ten Commandments "My house my rules". I don't see the problem here. Who cares if you actually did only invite your favourite players?

Seriously what exactly is the problem here?

Loved the NASL Top Ten. I know I'm late but that was awesome.


End of the day, if I invited only my favourite players, it would be one fucking awesome tournament, just as it probably would be if anyone else invited only their favourite players.
CommentatorHost of SHOUTcraft Clan Wars- http://www.mlg.tv/shoutcraft
Heavenly
Profile Joined January 2011
2172 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-15 02:56:09
June 15 2011 02:54 GMT
#691
Choosing not to invite IdrA is totally within Totalbiscuit's right, are people actually arguing this? As for it hurting esports, IdrA hurts esports. He acts like a child, has no regard for etiquette (doesn't GG to Boxer twice in a row?), and constantly whines about imbalance and you see these whines echoed by zergs in every starcraft related discussion board imaginable. I'm glad that he invited someone like Nerchio who was able to 3-0 Thorzain, opposed to IdrA who got 2-0'd by Thorzain after Thorzain had to play through the open bracket. Sorry that Totalbiscuit chose not to invite a person who insults him, trashes other players constantly, ragequits games, complains about 2/3 races in the game, and makes a fool out of himself. He isn't even one of the top zergs, he is highly overrated and has accomplished nothing besides winning IPL since the beta. Getting into the round of 8 in GSL, where people like Rain and Inca get to the finals, means nothing.

"thx for all my fans i'm many lost but cheer for me .. i lost but so happy my power is fans i will good play this is promise my fans" - oGsMC
MrDudeMan
Profile Joined April 2011
Canada973 Posts
June 15 2011 02:54 GMT
#692
On June 15 2011 11:33 TotalBiscuit wrote:
It's probably personal because I sponsor the tournament and I don't really like giving my money to people who slag me off on the internet.

If you're suggesting that I should, then you're holding me to an impossibly high standard that I very much doubt you'd adhere to yourself in the same situation.

Put a couple of grand on the line for someone who's done nothing but shit on you. I dare you. If you do, then you are a way better man than I will ever be.

You know what being the better man would be? Casting his Dreamhack games the same way I cast anyone elses, without bias. I am not the fuckin eSports Jesus, that's as much as you're getting from me.


But isn't denying great players an entry into a tournament because of your personal opinion bad for esports?
Duravi
Profile Joined September 2010
United States1205 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-15 02:56:56
June 15 2011 02:55 GMT
#693
Cut your nose to spite your face? If your fine with sacrificing viewers and the potential to gain new fans by excluding Idra from it then fine. Personally I like your casting but I also like Idra (except when he doesn't GG boxer). I really don't give a flying fuck what you think of him or what he thinks of you and I'm sure there are a lot of other people like me out there, I watch tournaments for entertaining games + casters, the former half you will lose some of by excluding him.
TotalBiscuit
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United Kingdom5437 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-15 02:56:50
June 15 2011 02:55 GMT
#694
On June 15 2011 11:54 MrDudeMan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:33 TotalBiscuit wrote:
It's probably personal because I sponsor the tournament and I don't really like giving my money to people who slag me off on the internet.

If you're suggesting that I should, then you're holding me to an impossibly high standard that I very much doubt you'd adhere to yourself in the same situation.

Put a couple of grand on the line for someone who's done nothing but shit on you. I dare you. If you do, then you are a way better man than I will ever be.

You know what being the better man would be? Casting his Dreamhack games the same way I cast anyone elses, without bias. I am not the fuckin eSports Jesus, that's as much as you're getting from me.


But isn't denying great players an entry into a tournament because of your personal opinion bad for esports?


Well no because there is more than 1 good Starcraft 2 player.

Cut your nose to spite your face? If your fine with sacrificing viewers and the potential to gain new fans by excluding Idra from it then fine. Personally I like your casting but I also like Idra (except when he doesn't GG boxer). I really don't give a flying fuck what you think of him or what he thinks of you and I'm sure there are a lot of other people like me out there, I watch tournaments for entertaining games + casters, the former half you will lose somihe of by excluding him.


The first tournament did just fine without IdrA in it so it's not really an issue.
CommentatorHost of SHOUTcraft Clan Wars- http://www.mlg.tv/shoutcraft
EnderCraft
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1746 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-15 03:00:10
June 15 2011 02:56 GMT
#695
On June 15 2011 11:47 Mailing wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:46 EnderCraft wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:44 Mailing wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:41 EnderCraft wrote:
Would you want to give a grand to somebody who took a shat all over you? I certainly wouldn't. They don't deserve my time or money.

Why host a tourney if you only pick your favorite players?


That is completely irrelevant to the quote above. TB is financing this tournament by himself, I hope you understand that. It's completely up to him who he deems as an invite candidate.


For someone who spouts "ESPORTS" a lot, no it's not

Typically, in an invitational you want to include big names to attract viewership. That is what he is going to do. However, since it is being financed from his own pocket, if one of those said players doesn't respect TB, why should TB give one thousand dollars of his own money to somebody who doesn't respect him, and who always spouts ignorant/ego fueled comments at him all the time? The tourney can get viewership without IdrA. Why does he need to be in the tournament? TB's first invitational had 20k consistent viewers without IdrA. That's better than NASL on most days... As far as i'm concerned he's still doing great things for ESPORTs, and among the general gaming community in general.

I honestly don't know an individual who puts forth more effort into the general gaming community than TB. You have to respect the guy for the work he does neither way, he does A LOT of good things for the industry... Really saddens me when a guy like TB works his butt off everyday only to get shat on by ignorant people like IdrA and other various people with the maturity level of a 12 year old.
SC:BW has a higher skill ceiling than SC2? SC 64 is where it's at brah.
Mashmed
Profile Joined September 2010
Sweden198 Posts
June 15 2011 02:57 GMT
#696
On June 15 2011 11:54 MrDudeMan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:33 TotalBiscuit wrote:
It's probably personal because I sponsor the tournament and I don't really like giving my money to people who slag me off on the internet.

If you're suggesting that I should, then you're holding me to an impossibly high standard that I very much doubt you'd adhere to yourself in the same situation.

Put a couple of grand on the line for someone who's done nothing but shit on you. I dare you. If you do, then you are a way better man than I will ever be.

You know what being the better man would be? Casting his Dreamhack games the same way I cast anyone elses, without bias. I am not the fuckin eSports Jesus, that's as much as you're getting from me.


But isn't denying great players an entry into a tournament because of your personal opinion bad for esports?


If it was an open tournament and someone was excluded I would have a problem with it. But if it is an invite tournament then the creator can invite whom ever he want...
Gosh Digglydarnit
MrDudeMan
Profile Joined April 2011
Canada973 Posts
June 15 2011 02:58 GMT
#697
On June 15 2011 11:57 Mashmed wrote:


If it was an open tournament and someone was excluded I would have a problem with it. But if it is an invite tournament then the creator can invite whom ever he want...


Yeah, I sort of wasn't aware it was just an 8 man invitational.
walklightwhat
Profile Joined November 2010
Australia752 Posts
June 15 2011 02:59 GMT
#698
On June 15 2011 11:48 Heaton31 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:45 walklightwhat wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:41 TotalBiscuit wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:38 DrN0 wrote:
I hate to sound like a four year old, but Idra did start it... he made it personal before it was, and although I usually agree with taking the higher road, there is no need to let somebody you know who openly slanders you have an attempt at earning your money. Frankly this hurts him more than you. I could talk about why for years, but I am sure everyone can summarize the reasons.


Pretty much this. If I was actively working against the guy to sabotage tournament invites, then angryinternetguy would have a point but as it stands, it's my invitational and I can invite whoever I please to take my money or in this case, not. If you want people to give you money it's usually a good idea not to go around insulting them. Yes there are actually consequences to doing things on the internet.


So, basically, if someone is asked for their opinion on a tournament you were involved in (in this case the IPL) and says, bluntly perhaps but still honestly, that you're a bad caster they are no longer eligible to participate in tournaments you run yourself?

That's fine either way, but it's pretty ridiculous to claim IdrA made it personal by giving his opinion, especially when you not only take every opportunity you get to take cheap shots at either him or his fans on reddit or in your casts and also were the one who turned it into a twitter bitch fight, criticizing both his fans and casting.

This is whole thing is a pile of childish bullshit from the pair of you.


So basically how NASL hand picked their players?

If I run a tournament and put up the money myself and only want to invite people starting with the letter A I can do that because... it's my tournament.


Yep, basically. But I did say it's fine, and it is. I was just basically asking for clarification / criticizing the guy before him for the whole "he started it" crap. It's needless, childish drama about one dude and his opinion. Heaven forbid.
TotalBiscuit
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United Kingdom5437 Posts
June 15 2011 03:02 GMT
#699
On June 15 2011 11:59 walklightwhat wrote:
Yep, basically. But I did say it's fine, and it is. I was just basically asking for clarification / criticizing the guy before him for the whole "he started it" crap. It's needless, childish drama about one dude and his opinion. Heaven forbid.


Look I get it, the whole thing is childish which is why I ended it. My fault in the matter was not ending it immediately and actually exchanging a reply with IdrA. Trust me, there's nothing I'd love more than to get into a good old fashioned flamewar but it helps nobody.
CommentatorHost of SHOUTcraft Clan Wars- http://www.mlg.tv/shoutcraft
Heavenly
Profile Joined January 2011
2172 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-15 03:03:32
June 15 2011 03:02 GMT
#700
On June 15 2011 11:59 walklightwhat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2011 11:48 Heaton31 wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:45 walklightwhat wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:41 TotalBiscuit wrote:
On June 15 2011 11:38 DrN0 wrote:
I hate to sound like a four year old, but Idra did start it... he made it personal before it was, and although I usually agree with taking the higher road, there is no need to let somebody you know who openly slanders you have an attempt at earning your money. Frankly this hurts him more than you. I could talk about why for years, but I am sure everyone can summarize the reasons.


Pretty much this. If I was actively working against the guy to sabotage tournament invites, then angryinternetguy would have a point but as it stands, it's my invitational and I can invite whoever I please to take my money or in this case, not. If you want people to give you money it's usually a good idea not to go around insulting them. Yes there are actually consequences to doing things on the internet.


So, basically, if someone is asked for their opinion on a tournament you were involved in (in this case the IPL) and says, bluntly perhaps but still honestly, that you're a bad caster they are no longer eligible to participate in tournaments you run yourself?

That's fine either way, but it's pretty ridiculous to claim IdrA made it personal by giving his opinion, especially when you not only take every opportunity you get to take cheap shots at either him or his fans on reddit or in your casts and also were the one who turned it into a twitter bitch fight, criticizing both his fans and casting.

This is whole thing is a pile of childish bullshit from the pair of you.


So basically how NASL hand picked their players?

If I run a tournament and put up the money myself and only want to invite people starting with the letter A I can do that because... it's my tournament.


Yep, basically. But I did say it's fine, and it is. I was just basically asking for clarification / criticizing the guy before him for the whole "he started it" crap. It's needless, childish drama about one dude and his opinion. Heaven forbid.


eh, delete.
"thx for all my fans i'm many lost but cheer for me .. i lost but so happy my power is fans i will good play this is promise my fans" - oGsMC
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