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On October 17 2010 01:33 ReighT wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2010 15:46 Phanekim wrote: "This won't stop any hacks from being developed. Nice try tho Blizzard.
I can't remember who Wiggly is, Dark_Mage I believe retired from making hacks some time ago and I have not sold or released anything.
This all seems nothing more than a joke to me. "
this is a recent response by zynastor. i wont post website. but he remains defiant. LOL I think he's mad  Good move from Blizzard
the source is http://www.gamethreat.net/forums/general-chat/43990-gg-geeks.html
yea, I just google'd..
wow apparently its a hacking forum. there's even a guy who asks for "maphacking strategies"
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I applaud that Blizzard is doing something about hackers, I'm not too sure a law suit is the right answer. I mean is it really going to stop hacks from coming out and hackers from hacking?
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On October 17 2010 01:49 Burban wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2010 01:33 ReighT wrote:On October 16 2010 15:46 Phanekim wrote: "This won't stop any hacks from being developed. Nice try tho Blizzard.
I can't remember who Wiggly is, Dark_Mage I believe retired from making hacks some time ago and I have not sold or released anything.
This all seems nothing more than a joke to me. "
this is a recent response by zynastor. i wont post website. but he remains defiant. LOL I think he's mad  Good move from Blizzard the source is http://www.gamethreat.net/forums/general-chat/43990-gg-geeks.htmlyea, I just google'd.. wow apparently its a hacking forum. there's even a guy who asks for "maphacking tutorial"
Yeah that wasn't hard to find..
I don't think Zynastor realizes that blizzard isn't doing this to stop hacking, just to stop people from making money off it. We all know they don't give two shits about hackers
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On October 16 2010 14:04 ooni wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2010 13:50 Damnesiac wrote: REALLY REALLY hate the direction intellectual property and copyright law is headed in the US. Just because you used their product to get money doesn't make that your money *KeSPA nods* If so the creators of programming languages would be the richest people on the planet Errr what? Just because you used their product to get money doesn't make that your money *KeSPA nods*Software works like this, you are paying for the right to use the software. Because you are just using a software that another company owns, you have restrictions. For example Microsoft Office costs a lot more than video games or some other software partially because the extend of the right when using the licence. (i.e. you can sell stuff with what you made on MS Office like writing or excel sheet of something; in addition commercial versions are much more expansive). You do not own any software you buy, you just gain a license to use it. With the KeSPA's case it's a lot more complex as Blizzard allowed KeSPA to use SC for a very long time. So Blizzard may have implied agreement with KeSPA, free advertising for Blizzard <=> advertising dollars produced by x Company. This is why Blizzard is being hesitant (to take KeSPA to court). There is no direction or sides 'the law' likes to take, it is just balance of reasonableness and personal rights. If that is the wrong direction to take, everything about law in any country should be considered being wrong.
i have a problem with intellectual property rights when it comes to software. i believe, if i buy it, i am buying the right to OWN the piece of software that i have. that is the issue... blah i dont care for this stance. too possessive
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On October 17 2010 02:02 Garaman wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2010 14:04 ooni wrote:On October 16 2010 13:50 Damnesiac wrote: REALLY REALLY hate the direction intellectual property and copyright law is headed in the US. Just because you used their product to get money doesn't make that your money *KeSPA nods* If so the creators of programming languages would be the richest people on the planet Errr what? Just because you used their product to get money doesn't make that your money *KeSPA nods*Software works like this, you are paying for the right to use the software. Because you are just using a software that another company owns, you have restrictions. For example Microsoft Office costs a lot more than video games or some other software partially because the extend of the right when using the licence. (i.e. you can sell stuff with what you made on MS Office like writing or excel sheet of something; in addition commercial versions are much more expansive). You do not own any software you buy, you just gain a license to use it. With the KeSPA's case it's a lot more complex as Blizzard allowed KeSPA to use SC for a very long time. So Blizzard may have implied agreement with KeSPA, free advertising for Blizzard <=> advertising dollars produced by x Company. This is why Blizzard is being hesitant (to take KeSPA to court). There is no direction or sides 'the law' likes to take, it is just balance of reasonableness and personal rights. If that is the wrong direction to take, everything about law in any country should be considered being wrong. i have a problem with intellectual property rights when it comes to software. i believe, if i buy it, i am buying the right to OWN the piece of software that i have. that is the issue... blah i dont care for this stance. too possessive
It was always, whenever you buy a software, you own the /right/ to use the software in ways limited by its terms. Isn't this always true? I thought it was obvious, since many people know of adobe Photoshop and how their licensing works. Or almost any software you buy for that matter.
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On October 17 2010 01:03 Solai wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2010 00:15 sulliwan wrote:On October 17 2010 00:00 Solai wrote:
How is that a "evil" angle? In any case, how do you think they should handle guys, who are leeching and profiteering of the game while simultaniously destroying it? I am glad that Blizz is coming down hard on them.
In any case: What what would such a "less evil solution" be? How would you stop hacking? It has implications for everyone who needs to reverse-engineer software for whatever reason. There are a lot of reasons why you would want to do that and setting a precedent where the software creator can sue you for it using a legal loophole is just wrong. How exactly are they profiteering from Blizzard's work? The hacks most likely don't have a single line in them for which Blizzard could claim any sort of ownership. It's like claiming that selling a document management system built on MS Office is "profiteering" from Microsoft's work. "Ruining the game" is of course horrible, however, it is not illegal and I see no reason why it should be. Blizzard has plenty of control to deal with it on a software level, instead of a legal level. A less evil solution would be to simply write the game in a way that it is much harder to hack. See for example how HoN prevents maphacking. Also maintaining Warden to detect hacks that are found spreading in the wild. The profiteering comes simply into the play that if there was no SC2, they couldnt sell their hacks. So yes, they are profiteering of the game. And they are not selling their hacks just to see if they can hack SC2, they are doing it for profit and at Blizzards (and ours by destroying the game) expanses. So please stop pretending that those people are some sort of "Fight the power guys". But yeah, I wish too that Warden would be more effective and that lawsuits would not be needed. As of now, it seems Blizard isn't that far yet and they have to stop the hacks at its roots. All in all it reminds me very much on their lawsuit against the WoWglider guy, which they actually have won.
Its easy to wonder if they could ever attack people who give lessons in SC2 for money. Maybe in order to legally give lessons you have to apply for some sort of verification or authentication from Blizzard themselves or pay some sort of skim off the top. Im not really sure about th EULA but I dont think its a huge stretch for them to come after coaches if they are suing over this type of shit.
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On October 17 2010 02:29 Sadist wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2010 01:03 Solai wrote:On October 17 2010 00:15 sulliwan wrote:On October 17 2010 00:00 Solai wrote:
How is that a "evil" angle? In any case, how do you think they should handle guys, who are leeching and profiteering of the game while simultaniously destroying it? I am glad that Blizz is coming down hard on them.
In any case: What what would such a "less evil solution" be? How would you stop hacking? It has implications for everyone who needs to reverse-engineer software for whatever reason. There are a lot of reasons why you would want to do that and setting a precedent where the software creator can sue you for it using a legal loophole is just wrong. How exactly are they profiteering from Blizzard's work? The hacks most likely don't have a single line in them for which Blizzard could claim any sort of ownership. It's like claiming that selling a document management system built on MS Office is "profiteering" from Microsoft's work. "Ruining the game" is of course horrible, however, it is not illegal and I see no reason why it should be. Blizzard has plenty of control to deal with it on a software level, instead of a legal level. A less evil solution would be to simply write the game in a way that it is much harder to hack. See for example how HoN prevents maphacking. Also maintaining Warden to detect hacks that are found spreading in the wild. The profiteering comes simply into the play that if there was no SC2, they couldnt sell their hacks. So yes, they are profiteering of the game. And they are not selling their hacks just to see if they can hack SC2, they are doing it for profit and at Blizzards (and ours by destroying the game) expanses. So please stop pretending that those people are some sort of "Fight the power guys". But yeah, I wish too that Warden would be more effective and that lawsuits would not be needed. As of now, it seems Blizard isn't that far yet and they have to stop the hacks at its roots. All in all it reminds me very much on their lawsuit against the WoWglider guy, which they actually have won. Its easy to wonder if they could ever attack people who give lessons in SC2 for money. Maybe in order to legally give lessons you have to apply for some sort of verification or authentication from Blizzard themselves or pay some sort of skim off the top. Im not really sure about th EULA but I dont think its a huge stretch for them to come after coaches if they are suing over this type of shit.
I know that you need proper permission to make video tutorials for software that you're going to sell. That's how it was when I was trying to learn photoshop. If it is not something that is published I don't think you will get in trouble. Maybe if you do it massively in secret, not too sure
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People will still develop hacks, but they won't publicly release them anymore. Actually, they most likely won't release them to anyone if legal action is in the picture. What this means for us is great -- only a few skilled people will be able to make/use working hacks and they'll become incredibly uncommon.
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SuE???? GJ Blizzard!
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On October 16 2010 21:39 Burban wrote: I wouldnt mind even if they were sent to jail... As far as I'm concerned they should have their lifes totally ruined. In my opinion, that makes you a worse person than the hackers. =/
On October 17 2010 01:03 Solai wrote:The profiteering comes simply into the play that if there was no SC2, they couldnt sell their hacks. So yes, they are profiteering of the game Are you profiteering off a lumber yard if you make and sell furniture from the lumber you buy from them? Do they have a right to a cut of your profits? Should they sue?
Under your definition, basically everything is profiteering.
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On October 17 2010 02:02 Garaman wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2010 14:04 ooni wrote:On October 16 2010 13:50 Damnesiac wrote: REALLY REALLY hate the direction intellectual property and copyright law is headed in the US. Just because you used their product to get money doesn't make that your money *KeSPA nods* If so the creators of programming languages would be the richest people on the planet Errr what? Just because you used their product to get money doesn't make that your money *KeSPA nods*Software works like this, you are paying for the right to use the software. Because you are just using a software that another company owns, you have restrictions. For example Microsoft Office costs a lot more than video games or some other software partially because the extend of the right when using the licence. (i.e. you can sell stuff with what you made on MS Office like writing or excel sheet of something; in addition commercial versions are much more expansive). You do not own any software you buy, you just gain a license to use it. With the KeSPA's case it's a lot more complex as Blizzard allowed KeSPA to use SC for a very long time. So Blizzard may have implied agreement with KeSPA, free advertising for Blizzard <=> advertising dollars produced by x Company. This is why Blizzard is being hesitant (to take KeSPA to court). There is no direction or sides 'the law' likes to take, it is just balance of reasonableness and personal rights. If that is the wrong direction to take, everything about law in any country should be considered being wrong. i have a problem with intellectual property rights when it comes to software. i believe, if i buy it, i am buying the right to OWN the piece of software that i have. that is the issue... blah i dont care for this stance. too possessive If you believe that, then you're dead wrong. You can't buy somethign someone isn't willing to sell to you.
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This is awesome news. They get what they deserve.
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How will this affect production of future hacks that help the community, like hacks similar to bw's LAN latency or community bug fixes? I see a big risk for community creativity being hampered by this. If the tradeoff is no hacking (or at least minimal) it might be worth it. But this really aggressive stance by Blizzard makes me worried. I also hope the punishments they go for are proportionate, and not going trying to make them pay up millions of dollars or even threaten with jail time, like we've seen is so many American copyright cases.
Anyway, still really sweet to see Zynastor getting the heat turned up ^^ He had it coming!
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I love blizzard for taking responsibility in maintaining the integrity of the online experience hack free =D
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Blizzard doesn't have to successfully sue them. They just have to get them in court until they literally drain all of the hackers' money to lawyer and court fees.
Corporations can give you the ultimatum of quitting or being homeless. They do it in all walks of life. Why not video games
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I guess this is a Bobby Kotick type of move (more money coming from law suits?) But I love it kill em hackers Blizz <3
read the spoilers, so blizz is more interested with the makers instead of the players.. that's great as well!
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lol bet the hackers weren't expecting this ! this is pretty harsh but they will be made examples of
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What am I missing here? What is stopping Blizzard from hiring an insane team of expert hackers to keep their games hack proof? I'm no programmer, but it seems to me that a large company like Blizzard could afford to just pay some of these assholes to join the other side.
EDIT: +10 points for Blizzard for taking the legal approach anyways though.
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