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2013 NBA Finals - Page 18

Forum Index > Sports
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Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
June 08 2013 04:18 GMT
#341
On June 08 2013 12:53 Itsmedudeman wrote:
Jordan was a twig compared to your avg NBA player today. FT line dunk? That's like a requirement to get into the slam dunk contest nowadays. He wouldn't last 2 seconds in the modern NBA. He came back for the Wizards and he was a mediocre player when the game evolved


He was still a good player and most importantly, he was an old man.

I'm not sure the NBA had evolved that much in 2002-03, aside from having Shaq destroy people like never before. I think that was mostly just age.

And in that ESPN article he said his playing weight was 218. Paul George is listed at 6'8" 221. So not really a twig. I mean, I'm a believer that NBA players are better than ever, but I think Jordan would still be dominant today and had a body/athleticism for the modern NBA.
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
scaban84
Profile Joined August 2010
United States1080 Posts
June 08 2013 05:01 GMT
#342
On June 08 2013 12:53 Jibba wrote:
The idea that MJ didn't complain about fouls is ridiculous. He headbutted a ref once and got suspended.

Flopping has been prevalent with some players since at least the 80's. They try to sell it as an injury more often these days, but it's also part of the culture and what they can get away with.

I didn't say Jordan never complained about fouls. He raged more often than not. I was merely poking fun at Lebron's "12 year old girl encounters Justin Beiber" reaction.
"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design." — Friedrich von Hayek
scaban84
Profile Joined August 2010
United States1080 Posts
June 08 2013 05:25 GMT
#343
On June 08 2013 13:18 Jibba wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 12:53 Itsmedudeman wrote:
Jordan was a twig compared to your avg NBA player today. FT line dunk? That's like a requirement to get into the slam dunk contest nowadays. He wouldn't last 2 seconds in the modern NBA. He came back for the Wizards and he was a mediocre player when the game evolved


He was still a good player and most importantly, he was an old man.

I'm not sure the NBA had evolved that much in 2002-03, aside from having Shaq destroy people like never before. I think that was mostly just age.

And in that ESPN article he said his playing weight was 218. Paul George is listed at 6'8" 221. So not really a twig. I mean, I'm a believer that NBA players are better than ever, but I think Jordan would still be dominant today and had a body/athleticism for the modern NBA.


I think itsmedudeman is just trolling a little bit. Professional NBA trainers have said that Jordan had more fast-twitch muscle power than anyone. Which is more important than "size" in basketball. There are guys that can squat twice as much as me but they can't jump nearly as high as I can. Also, athleticism declines rapidly after 28. Most people watch MJ highlights from his later championship years. But watch footage from his younger years to see how truly explosive he was.
"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design." — Friedrich von Hayek
Tivu
Profile Joined February 2012
United States244 Posts
June 08 2013 05:33 GMT
#344
Go Spurs!
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
June 08 2013 05:45 GMT
#345
On June 08 2013 14:25 scaban84 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 13:18 Jibba wrote:
On June 08 2013 12:53 Itsmedudeman wrote:
Jordan was a twig compared to your avg NBA player today. FT line dunk? That's like a requirement to get into the slam dunk contest nowadays. He wouldn't last 2 seconds in the modern NBA. He came back for the Wizards and he was a mediocre player when the game evolved


He was still a good player and most importantly, he was an old man.

I'm not sure the NBA had evolved that much in 2002-03, aside from having Shaq destroy people like never before. I think that was mostly just age.

And in that ESPN article he said his playing weight was 218. Paul George is listed at 6'8" 221. So not really a twig. I mean, I'm a believer that NBA players are better than ever, but I think Jordan would still be dominant today and had a body/athleticism for the modern NBA.


I think itsmedudeman is just trolling a little bit. Professional NBA trainers have said that Jordan had more fast-twitch muscle power than anyone. Which is more important than "size" in basketball. There are guys that can squat twice as much as me but they can't jump nearly as high as I can. Also, athleticism declines rapidly after 28. Most people watch MJ highlights from his later championship years. But watch footage from his younger years to see how truly explosive he was.

Yep, plus he combined it with ridiculous flexibility.
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
saltygrapes
Profile Joined April 2010
181 Posts
June 08 2013 06:18 GMT
#346
On June 08 2013 14:25 scaban84 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 13:18 Jibba wrote:
On June 08 2013 12:53 Itsmedudeman wrote:
Jordan was a twig compared to your avg NBA player today. FT line dunk? That's like a requirement to get into the slam dunk contest nowadays. He wouldn't last 2 seconds in the modern NBA. He came back for the Wizards and he was a mediocre player when the game evolved


He was still a good player and most importantly, he was an old man.

I'm not sure the NBA had evolved that much in 2002-03, aside from having Shaq destroy people like never before. I think that was mostly just age.

And in that ESPN article he said his playing weight was 218. Paul George is listed at 6'8" 221. So not really a twig. I mean, I'm a believer that NBA players are better than ever, but I think Jordan would still be dominant today and had a body/athleticism for the modern NBA.


I think itsmedudeman is just trolling a little bit. Professional NBA trainers have said that Jordan had more fast-twitch muscle power than anyone. Which is more important than "size" in basketball. There are guys that can squat twice as much as me but they can't jump nearly as high as I can. Also, athleticism declines rapidly after 28. Most people watch MJ highlights from his later championship years. But watch footage from his younger years to see how truly explosive he was.


Medicine, training and nutrition has evolved tenfold since Jordan was 28. lol
sxpointz!
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
June 08 2013 07:46 GMT
#347
On June 08 2013 15:18 saltygrapes wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 14:25 scaban84 wrote:
On June 08 2013 13:18 Jibba wrote:
On June 08 2013 12:53 Itsmedudeman wrote:
Jordan was a twig compared to your avg NBA player today. FT line dunk? That's like a requirement to get into the slam dunk contest nowadays. He wouldn't last 2 seconds in the modern NBA. He came back for the Wizards and he was a mediocre player when the game evolved


He was still a good player and most importantly, he was an old man.

I'm not sure the NBA had evolved that much in 2002-03, aside from having Shaq destroy people like never before. I think that was mostly just age.

And in that ESPN article he said his playing weight was 218. Paul George is listed at 6'8" 221. So not really a twig. I mean, I'm a believer that NBA players are better than ever, but I think Jordan would still be dominant today and had a body/athleticism for the modern NBA.


I think itsmedudeman is just trolling a little bit. Professional NBA trainers have said that Jordan had more fast-twitch muscle power than anyone. Which is more important than "size" in basketball. There are guys that can squat twice as much as me but they can't jump nearly as high as I can. Also, athleticism declines rapidly after 28. Most people watch MJ highlights from his later championship years. But watch footage from his younger years to see how truly explosive he was.


Medicine, training and nutrition has evolved tenfold since Jordan was 28. lol


So, we are going to give Lebron and Wade credit because other people figured out what kinds of vitamins they should take?

This is why inter-generational comparisons are ridiculous. Lebron was born in (i think) Jordan's first year in the league. We should assume Jordan has the bonus strength, agility, etc from not only his own nutrition and weight programs, but for his mother's prenatal vitamins and more.

This is why I am a fan of the "brain transplant" test. If we put Lebron's brain in Jordan's body, and ViceVersa, who does better? The epitome of this test is Dwight Howard, I doubt there is a single player in the NBA who's realized production is as short of his actual potential as Howard.
Freeeeeeedom
DystopiaX
Profile Joined October 2010
United States16236 Posts
June 08 2013 08:01 GMT
#348
Shaq.

As good as he was he'd be GOAT (literally, not so far) if he had Jordan's competitiveness.
TheKefka
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Croatia11752 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-08 08:32:00
June 08 2013 08:17 GMT
#349
I don't agree with the Shaq not being competitive.
In my mind someone who had everything going for him to become one of the GOATs and did not because he was too lazy/not competitive enough and just didn't have the mental edge of someone like Jordan was Vince Carter.
Vince Carter had inhuman athletic ability(better than jordan fyi),excellent jump shot,never had a really major injury at his peek,but he just didn't have that extra edge or the drive.I mean having that kind of skill,physical predispositions and even having jason kidd as point guard,it's almost a miracle not to win something at least at that point.
Cackle™
DystopiaX
Profile Joined October 2010
United States16236 Posts
June 08 2013 08:41 GMT
#350
Shaq kinda never gave a fuck. Yeah he was great but with that body he'd have to try extremely hard not to.

We wanna talk about wasted talent let's look at Len Bias. Give him the mind of a Jordan who'd never try Coke cause he was too busy trying to beat the shit out of everyone at everything and you'd have a great player.
RowdierBob
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
Australia13330 Posts
June 08 2013 12:02 GMT
#351
On June 08 2013 13:06 red_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 12:53 Jibba wrote:
The idea that MJ didn't complain about fouls is ridiculous. He headbutted a ref once and got suspended.


Next you'll have people telling you that MJ never had a bad game in the playoffs/finals... oh wait.

Jordan is the GOAT, but people have some serious revisionist history in their heads about him.


Dude is 6/6 and prob would be 8/8 if he didn't take a two year hiatus. People have forgotten how good MJ was. He would carve shit up today if he were playing.
"Terrans are pretty much space-Australians" - H
TheKefka
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Croatia11752 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-08 12:07:57
June 08 2013 12:07 GMT
#352
The biggest thing to me,if you think about it,is that hand checking was allowed back than.
I mean if you ever played basketball you can understand what a monumental difference it is between the defense being played now and,for instance,the piston defense that Jordan had to play against.
Cackle™
DystopiaX
Profile Joined October 2010
United States16236 Posts
June 08 2013 12:21 GMT
#353
yeah if Jordan didn't have to deal with handchecking he'd absolutely dominate the league even harder than he already did.

Same goes for any guard from over ten years ago.
Ferrose
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States11378 Posts
June 08 2013 12:48 GMT
#354
On June 08 2013 21:07 TheKefka wrote:
The biggest thing to me,if you think about it,is that hand checking was allowed back than.
I mean if you ever played basketball you can understand what a monumental difference it is between the defense being played now and,for instance,the piston defense that Jordan had to play against.


I can't blame him for being upset when he had to deal with this shit.
@113candlemagic Office lady by day, lonely woman at night. | Official lolicon of thread 94273
XaI)CyRiC
Profile Joined October 2002
United States4471 Posts
June 08 2013 21:58 GMT
#355
Let's not get into another silly Jordan argument because it's been argued to death already. There will be arguments about how much help he had (no rings before Phil, Pippen, Grant/Rodman, etc.), the rules changes (handcheck/"Jordan Rules" vs. more sophisticated defenses/allowed to semi-zone), and the level of competition he faced. Let's leave it for another time because we're in the midst of a great finals series at the end of a great postseason with two great teams.
Moderator
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
June 08 2013 22:04 GMT
#356
Ok, new conversation topic.

MJ had Michael Jordan: Chaos in the Windy City
Charles had Barkley Shut Up and Jam!
Shaq had Shaq-Fu

What would Tim Duncan's video game be?
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
Jerubaal
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States7684 Posts
June 08 2013 22:20 GMT
#357
Coach T Teaches you the FUNdamentals.
I'm not stupid, a marauder just shot my brain.
DystopiaX
Profile Joined October 2010
United States16236 Posts
June 08 2013 23:51 GMT
#358
On June 09 2013 07:20 Jerubaal wrote:
Coach T Teaches you the FUNdamentals.

Yeah, and it'd be an educational game where you have to like spell shit to make Timmy make bank shots.

Shut up and Jam best videogame based on a single bball player ever.
x2fst
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
1272 Posts
June 09 2013 00:03 GMT
#359
On June 08 2013 21:07 TheKefka wrote:
The biggest thing to me,if you think about it,is that hand checking was allowed back than.
I mean if you ever played basketball you can understand what a monumental difference it is between the defense being played now and,for instance,the piston defense that Jordan had to play against.
yeah but how ridiculous would lebron be if he were allowed to hand check people though? i really doubt allowing MORE contact would hurt guys like lebron (who jordan will get compared to)

really the major rule change between jordan's prime and now is the illegal defence rules, during jordan's time you had to either be doubling or guarding your own guy. no shading, no half doubles, fake doubles. you only have to watch game 1 to see how successfully the spurs implemented all those tactics against lebron. offensive efficiency went down noticeably when those rules were scrapped.

on balance it's fairly unlikely that it was harder to be an offensive player in the 90s than it is now, players play markedly better offence now and offensive efficiency isn't any better. defences are just much more sophisticated than they used to be
muda, is a crime for me to wear a shirt, cos I is so good lookin
Jerubaal
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States7684 Posts
June 09 2013 00:24 GMT
#360
On June 09 2013 08:51 DystopiaX wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 09 2013 07:20 Jerubaal wrote:
Coach T Teaches you the FUNdamentals.

Yeah, and it'd be an educational game where you have to like spell shit to make Timmy make bank shots.

Shut up and Jam best videogame based on a single bball player ever.


You have to find the angle to make that bankshot.
I'm not stupid, a marauder just shot my brain.
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