EPTThe LiquidLegends Lounge - Page 1509
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Cixah
United States11285 Posts
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
It's just i think a lot of times people make it seem like healthcare is magic and costs nothing. When you do the math the average European or Canadian pays the same if not more for our Healthcare as Americans do. Just a pet peeve, I think Americans get more shit for private Healthcare than they should. I think a public health care system is better, but if you budget for it well, the average middle class person likely wouldn't notice a difference when drifting between the two. The real difference is at the endsame of the spectrum where in the public system rich people pay more than their way, and in the private system where people who don't have the income or knowhow to float themselves a Healthcare buffer get denied Healthcare. It is also real nice to feel Gross and be able to just go to the doctor willy-nilly. So, that is a huge plus. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On November 09 2016 07:05 iCanada wrote: I believe everyone has a right to live, and thus a right to Healthcare, so I'm not really complaining either. It's just i think a lot of times people make it seem like healthcare is magic and costs nothing. When you do the math the average European or Canadian pays the same if not more for our Healthcare as Americans do. Just a pet peeve, I think Americans get more shit for private Healthcare than they should. I think a public health care system is better, but if you budget for it well, the average middle class person likely wouldn't notice a difference when drifting between the two. The real difference is at the endsame of the spectrum where in the public system rich people pay more than their way, and in the private system where people who don't have the income or knowhow to float themselves a Healthcare buffer get denied Healthcare. It is also real nice to feel Gross and be able to just go to the doctor willy-nilly. So, that is a huge plus. I wouldn't really consider myself strong middle class necessarily, but compared to my peers, I'm relatively near that mark. I have few debts, live fairly well below my means, and don't worry too much about paying regular bills. However, if I were to be hit with some medical emergency (or really just any other unforeseen expenses like have come up recently), things get really hairy really fast. Of course healthcare isn't free, I don't think anyone truly believes that to be the case. However, if something like $50 came out of my weekly paycheck and I never had to worry about any medical emergency type shit or making sure I keep insurance through my employer, I would feel much more secure in that regard. It feels "free" because I already consider that to be money I don't have and won't get. But if a bombshell expense shows up right now, I'm SOL. | ||
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
... yeah nobody does that shit, which is why healthcare is a+ forces people to do the smart thing | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On November 09 2016 07:05 iCanada wrote: I think this is the most painful part. I usually don't go to the doctor unless I feel like I'm actually dying or if I've been feeling bad for way longer than I should. Like, sometimes if I feel super bad and I can't even get out of bed because of pain I'll still not even consider going to the doctor because of the cost. General physicals are covered by my plan but "hey doc I can't stand because of the pain" costs more money that I even want to think about. And usually ends with some non-answer about getting more rest and a bill equal to getting minor surgery.I believe everyone has a right to live, and thus a right to Healthcare, so I'm not really complaining either. It's just i think a lot of times people make it seem like healthcare is magic and costs nothing. When you do the math the average European or Canadian pays the same if not more for our Healthcare as Americans do. Just a pet peeve, I think Americans get more shit for private Healthcare than they should. I think a public health care system is better, but if you budget for it well, the average middle class person likely wouldn't notice a difference when drifting between the two. The real difference is at the endsame of the spectrum where in the public system rich people pay more than their way, and in the private system where people who don't have the income or knowhow to float themselves a Healthcare buffer get denied Healthcare. It is also real nice to feel Gross and be able to just go to the doctor willy-nilly. So, that is a huge plus. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
Even if shit hits the fan and you have to borrow a significant portion on top of your health care kiddy, you just keep putting that amount into your health care loan instead of the trust and you're at the same spot as the person with public healthcare. On average there is no difference. It's just the 1% either direction that notice the difference. I think the public model is better, I just think the disparity between them is largely over stated. I would say I'm in the same spot as you, relatively. A few debts here and there from school and vehicles, and a median wage. | ||
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
US healthcare is a joke that deserves to be laughed at. Even here in Malaysia the healthcare system is above and beyond better than the US system, and this is a country that can't get simple things like roads and sewage to work, where the prime minister siphons 2% of the countries GDP into his private bank account. | ||
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
On November 09 2016 07:16 Dandel Ion wrote: you can simulate healthcare by saving up a certain amount with each paycheck for emergencies ... yeah nobody does that shit, which is why healthcare is a+ forces people to do the smart thing But you can't because $50-100 a paycheck isn't going to cover something catastrophic even remotely... My family doesn't do cell phone insurance because we all contribute to a fund and that works because worst case probable scenario is two people breaking a $700 phone at the same time. I really doubt you come out even iCanada. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On November 09 2016 07:19 iCanada wrote: Realistically what would be the difference between that 50 bucks going to the government to pay for your health care or that 50 bucks being routed yourself into a separate inaccessible trust account? Even if shit hits the fan and you have to borrow a significant portion on top of your health care kiddy, you just keep putting that amount into your health care loan instead of the trust and you're at the same spot as the person with public healthcare. On average there is no difference. It's just the 1% either direction that notice the difference. I think the public model is better, I just think the disparity between them is largely over stated. I would say I'm in the same spot as you, relatively. A few debts here and there from school and vehicles, and a median wage. Well, let's say I save up $50 per paycheck. That'll be ~$1300/year. That would cover...the ambulance ride. Maybe. The difference is that when all of us do it and pool it all together, we can provide for those that end up needing it, whomever and whenever that may be. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On November 09 2016 07:30 mordek wrote: But you can't because $50-100 a paycheck isn't going to cover something catastrophic even remotely... My family doesn't do cell phone insurance because we all contribute to a fund and that works because worst case probable scenario is two people breaking a $700 phone at the same time. I really doubt you come out even iCanada. Yeah iCanada therein lies the difference. Notice how you never hear any stories of how your average person had some medical emergency and now owes $200,000 up here? I was in the hospital for a month 2 years ago and I think it cost me 8k, much of which was covered. Do you have any idea what surgeries and hospital stays cost in the US? It's truly no comparison. What makes it worse is the feeling that the system is 'kicking you when you're down.' need that lifesaving surgery? Sure! Now pay for it for the rest of your life. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
On November 09 2016 06:45 iCanada wrote: I wouldn't call it free. We pay quite handsomly for it, just it comes off our paycheck instead of a lumpsum when shit hits the fan. If I lived in the states I personally would have saved heaps of money on Healthcare. Not that I don't like our health care, I just think saying it's free is a misnomer. You're also overlooking that a lot of things cost a crapton more here than they do there. Also, money comes out of our taxes anyway for hospitals to make up for the money owed to hospitals by the uninsured. In theory, yeah, it should work out fine, but the devil is in the details. Ours is a much more scary beast than yours. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
The average person stays in a hospital 1 day every 3 years. The numbers aren't that far out. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On November 09 2016 07:52 iCanada wrote: Except the average Canadian pays just under $12000 cad annually and then around 200 bucks for a bimonthly copay though employment to fill gaps totalling $17000 CAD annually or $13000 USD. The average person stays in a hospital 1 day every 3 years. The numbers aren't that far out. Even if, on average, the numbers were close, why not go with the system that is less devastating to the individual? | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On November 09 2016 07:52 iCanada wrote: Except the average Canadian pays just under $12000 cad annually and then around 200 bucks for a bimonthly copay though employment to fill gaps totalling $17000 CAD annually or $13000 USD. The average person stays in a hospital 1 day every 3 years. The numbers aren't that far out. 12000 annually for what? Is that overall tax on average? Because I can guarantee you that not all tax money goes into health care spending. And again you're only counting hospital stays because I gave that example. There are plenty of services provided by doctors and hospitals in the states that don't require a stay that are also extremely expensive. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On November 09 2016 07:56 jcarlsoniv wrote: Even if, on average, the numbers were close, why not go with the system that is less devastating to the individual? I never said the public system wasn't better, just that the numbers aren't as bad as people say they are. I would pick the public system every day of the week and twice on Sundays. Statistically however, chances are the choice has very little bearing on my life. I'd argue the difference in medical costs are purely because those in public systems are more likely to prevent illness due to catching things early. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On November 09 2016 07:58 WaveofShadow wrote: 12000 annually for what? Is that overall tax on average? Because I can guarantee you that not all tax money goes into health care spending. And again you're only counting hospital stays because I gave that example. There are plenty of services provided by doctors and hospitals in the states that don't require a stay that are also extremely expensive. That's 12000 annually on just public health insurance. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On November 09 2016 08:01 iCanada wrote: That's 12000 annually on just public health insurance. How much do you think the average Canadian spends in taxes? | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30775 Posts
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