On October 07 2020 02:59 3 Lions wrote: Thanks for the thread, Pandemona, but I think you have the wrong banner
Very exciting group. I think Stats being sick recently likely hurt his ability to practice well. We'll see though
Haha i was indeed, i needed to wait for Wax to upload the new one to pinch
This group is insane lol, arguably the best two protoss in Korea right now? vs ByuN who looks to regain his top form and Maru who is always a menance in TvP.
On October 07 2020 02:59 3 Lions wrote: Thanks for the thread, Pandemona, but I think you have the wrong banner
Very exciting group. I think Stats being sick recently likely hurt his ability to practice well. We'll see though
Haha i was indeed, i needed to wait for Wax to upload the new one to pinch
This group is insane lol, arguably the best two protoss in Korea right now? vs ByuN who looks to regain his top form and Maru who is always a menance in TvP.
While true that, Parting v Maru rarely delivers top TvP Maru for w/e reason. Let's hope it will be better, but somehow I'm afraid that Parting still has the upper edge.
I think Stats being ill and in the hospital for the past week is gonna have an effect on his performance. He may not have prepared as hard. Parting is a PvT monster and with Maru not in top form, Parting has a chance in the opening match.
On October 07 2020 12:04 yht9657 wrote: Damn if you think about it this group is no less stacked than group D.
IMO it's arguably even more stacked, it depends how high you judge Dark and Trap. Dark hasn't been performing great since his injury and I personally don't think as much of Trap as a lot of others do. With Group D I can feasibly say that Inno and Rogue are slight favorites.
Here, it's just Maru and 3 equals and if the weaker Maru shows up, then it's perfectly even.
On October 07 2020 18:46 Javah wrote: Shit losing the raven decided this game.
For a player known for his superb micro. But then again, that can be said about everyone in this group, so I won't use this against ByuN.
Yes you could feel that Stats was of course hunting for it, it was the key unit that made ByuN's timing push scary... Once taken out of the equation there wasn't a real backup plan for him and the prism in the main was the nail in the coffin.
One of the most one-sided PvTs I've seen in a long time. Byun really does not seem a ro8 caliber yet. Even if he would somehow beat Maru in a TvT if he plays like this I dont think he has a shot against Parting.
Well now I'm worried for the Terrans. That build from Stats looks really tough for the meta openings Terrans have been using. Hope Maru has something prepped for that.
On October 07 2020 18:58 Elentos wrote: Everything in this series reinforces my believe that ByuN isn't ready for this yet and his Ro24 result was a fluke
It's more the fact that the top of the Korean scene is so supreme to the rest. Like the top 10 players are so out of their world. But he can still be in the top 20(ByuN that is) and as such getting to the RO16 isn't as muich of a fluke. Similar to Patience who's certainly not the top player, but he's counted as a serious contender for RO16.
That said, Stats build was basically tailored to hard counter what ByuN was doing (which is what every damn terran is doing in match-up these days), wasn't it? Even the phoenix count was at 4 to exactly 2 shot raven instead of more common 5 unless i missed something.
On October 07 2020 19:02 Vindicare605 wrote: Well now I'm worried for the Terrans. That build from Stats looks really tough for the meta openings Terrans have been using. Hope Maru has something prepped for that.
2 prox rax? 3 proxy rax? Also not sure if Maru is relying on this build this heavily, OTOH he's naturally weak to Parting and TvT, so, uh.... damn.
I'm wondering. If you opened Cyclones and did a Timing with a couple of Cyclones and Marines, could you hit the natural and the Phoenixes be unable to defend it? It'd be a hefty investment but with Stats going directly into Collosus off of it, he won't have a lot of defense against an early two base timing.
The early Phoenix are there mostly to counter Widow Mine drops I'm assuming. The picking off of the Raven is just the final thing they are useful for.
On October 07 2020 19:02 Vindicare605 wrote: Well now I'm worried for the Terrans. That build from Stats looks really tough for the meta openings Terrans have been using. Hope Maru has something prepped for that.
2 prox rax? 3 proxy rax? Also not sure if Maru is relying on this build this heavily, OTOH he's naturally weak to Parting and TvT, so, uh.... damn.
Proxy rax is a build order loss to shield batteries
On October 07 2020 19:09 Vindicare605 wrote: I'm wondering. If you opened Cyclones and did a Timing with a couple of Cyclones and Marines, could you hit the natural and the Phoenixes be unable to defend it? It'd be a hefty investment but with Stats going directly into Collosus off of it, he won't have a lot of defense against an early two base timing.
The early Phoenix are there mostly to counter Widow Mine drops I'm assuming. The picking off of the Raven is just the final thing they are useful for.
Given the BBQ pandemic of this year, i suspect phoenixes are against hellions more so than mines.
EDIT: That immortal moment was kind of hilarious remembering Maru's 2015 TvP shenanigans.
On October 07 2020 19:09 Vindicare605 wrote: I'm wondering. If you opened Cyclones and did a Timing with a couple of Cyclones and Marines, could you hit the natural and the Phoenixes be unable to defend it? It'd be a hefty investment but with Stats going directly into Collosus off of it, he won't have a lot of defense against an early two base timing.
The early Phoenix are there mostly to counter Widow Mine drops I'm assuming. The picking off of the Raven is just the final thing they are useful for.
Early Phoenix are useful for almost everything, getting intel, light harass, force turrets so less units in the push, can catch mine drops and deter drops in general since you will lose you medivacs no matter how, lift tanks and last but not least kill the raven. To me it seems that it more or less forces the Terran to give up the early-mid kill timing (when his army supply is naturally higher than the P) and to go mid-late game.
LOL at the immortal saved by the super-battery edit : of course I forgot phoenix can also lift hellions if need be.
Parting has been quite out of shape lately, but his PvT is still solid and especially PvMaru. I hope Maru takes this but even if he does, give him a very little chance against current Stats.
Surprising no one has been mentioning this but Stats is the best PvT player since CodeS season 2 quite surely ! Actually since September, he hasnt lost a PvT and only lost matches to Trap (thrice), and Zergs (Rogue, Reynor, Solar, Ragnax2)
Maru took out a decent amount of probes with the mine drops, but it's not that many considering how many mines he used. Probably killed like maybe under 20 probes for 12 mines and a medivac?
Either way, Maru looking very strong. He even placed a bunker with bio on his 3rd's mineral line just to protect workers from zealot runbys, something very few Terrans really bother with.
On October 07 2020 19:28 sudete wrote: I don't see enough circlejerking over this game in which maru had a big advantage from the start
His advantage wasn't that big. He got a slight eco lead but he had a tiny army for a while, with raxes being super late etc., so he couldn't really pressure the 3rd ever. Basically he had to win in lategame no matter what, he could not end the game in the midgame, not many terrans accept to do that.
On October 07 2020 19:29 yoshi245 wrote: Maru took out a decent amount of probes with the mine drops, but it's not that many considering how many mines he used. Probably killed like maybe under 20 probes for 12 mines and a medivac?
Either way, Maru looking very strong. He even placed a bunker with bio on his 3rd's mineral line just to protect workers from zealot runbys, something very few Terrans really bother with.
I think the more important thing with mine drops is that they keep the Protoss at home. We saw what happened with Stats when he had map control.
On October 07 2020 19:29 yoshi245 wrote: Maru took out a decent amount of probes with the mine drops, but it's not that many considering how many mines he used. Probably killed like maybe under 20 probes for 12 mines and a medivac?
Either way, Maru looking very strong. He even placed a bunker with bio on his 3rd's mineral line just to protect workers from zealot runbys, something very few Terrans really bother with.
I think the more important thing with mine drops is that they keep the Protoss at home. We saw what happened with Stats when he had map control.
Yeah, I think that's the point Tastosis isn't really highlighting. It's not so much the workers lost, as much as keeping Protoss from damaging the Terran economy in response at the same time as he's forced to move observers and army units to deal with the mine drops.
On October 07 2020 19:46 Vindicare605 wrote: Can I just say, this is some of the most aesthetically pleasing turtling I've ever seen? When did Maru start to play like this?
In 2018? Make no mistake, i suspect he has earlier games like that before as well, but 2018 is when it actually became memorable.
On October 07 2020 19:46 Vindicare605 wrote: Can I just say, this is some of the most aesthetically pleasing turtling I've ever seen? When did Maru start to play like this?
On October 07 2020 19:46 Vindicare605 wrote: Can I just say, this is some of the most aesthetically pleasing turtling I've ever seen? When did Maru start to play like this?
In 2018?
I never saw anything like this from him in 2018, not against Protoss anyway. I've seen this vs Zerg but never vs Protoss and I saw pretty much all of his 2018 games.
it's the exact same strategy he did against Trap in King of battles, uThermal analyzed it on his youtube if you guys are interested. Except this game we don't know if he ends up winning. If he does, I'd be depressed as PartinG
On October 07 2020 19:41 Poopi wrote: Maru fp vod is just so gorgeous. He is doing the same strategy as against Trap
It is so beautiful to watch him play. Unfortunately his fp is 20s ahead of Tastosis' cast.
Also vikings against carriers, curious to see how it will play out in the long run.
Last thing, is anybody able to guess Maru's graphic settings? (I assume it's his settings that we see on this stream).
this is probably low settings with high textures.
Ok thanks! So graphics low and Textures high that's it? I play with hybrid settings and his setting looks even clearer. But maybe it's just because it's Maru :D
I'm blown away by Maru's play in this scenario, even if he may not win it. Sure he didn't have a choice really but the way he embraces very late TvP is mindblowing.
It's weird that even now that protoss has more attrition weapons htey still don't use them, like the equivalent of nukes and blords are tempest and distruptors. chip away at the terran continuosly, they'll pay as you are doing against those nukes!
That said i believe Maru looks better after this game. He would probably lose either way because Tempests lol, but this way he loses with a smile on his face.
On October 07 2020 20:13 5ecured wrote: So its safe to say Parting didnt win. Maru defeated himself.
On October 07 2020 20:13 lolfail9001 wrote: That said i believe Maru looks better after this game. He would probably lose either way because Tempests lol, but this way he loses with a smile on his face.
Yes, Maru walked away with the moral victory while PartinG is exhausted.
On October 07 2020 20:14 Dave4 wrote: Maru definitely should have gone BCs and spammed yamato over time when its off cooldown. Then he would have definitely won. Poor strategising i think.
Yeah, after introduction of Tempests, BCs (and i dare say, only post-LotV BCs) are the only valid approach to endgame TvP.
On October 07 2020 20:29 Vindicare605 wrote: Parting's player cam. He's done.
That bodes well for ByuN. Maru kinda pulled the soul off of PartinG with this bo3 and that 2nd game loss. ByuN could even qualify should Maru lose to Stats, so it's either Stats - Maru or Stats - ByuN depending on if Maru beats Stats or not.
On October 07 2020 20:30 Vindicare605 wrote: Now THAT ladies and gentlemen was a fucking Starcraft series.
Dont really like air vs air too much but everything is suddenly better when no Zerg is involved Aside from TvZ, ZvP and TvT Starcraft is still super cool to watch.
On October 07 2020 20:30 Vindicare605 wrote: Now THAT ladies and gentlemen was a fucking Starcraft series.
Dont really like air vs air too much but everything is suddenly better when no Zerg is involved Aside from TvZ, ZvP and TvT Starcraft is still super cool to watch.
It wasn't even just game 2, although game 2 was an instant classic. Watching Maru just absolutely crush Parting (who was playing really well honestly) was also excellent spectator sports watching.
On October 07 2020 20:40 Luolis wrote: Hots highlights make me warm and fuzzy inside.
Sounds like you need to rewatch mana vs firecake
It was a bad game and obviously things weren't perfect but overall hots was way better than lotv, and i'd return to it immediately given the chance.
Mana vs Firecake was the worst example of an ongoing problem in HoTS which was the Swarm Host. It wasn't the only game that was ruined by that unit, there were many of them.
Also during HoTS was the Blink All In meta vs Terran which was horrid and one of the worst balance periods the game has ever seen for one match up and that was all thanks to the Mothership Core.
HoTS had some great moments, but it had a LOT that was bad about it.
Early 2015-2016 LoTV was awful, but it's been much better on average since then.
EDIT: can't forget 2019 Zerg dominance, the worst that one race has dominated a year of play EVER since previous years of race dominance was either in the Foreign Scene OR Korean never one race dominated both that hard.
On October 07 2020 20:40 Luolis wrote: Hots highlights make me warm and fuzzy inside.
Sounds like you need to rewatch mana vs firecake
It was a bad game and obviously things weren't perfect but overall hots was way better than lotv, and i'd return to it immediately given the chance.
Just returning to the disappointment that Blizzard took away the WoL and HotS ladders so that we literally aren't given the chance, despite paying to buy those ladders when we bought the games...
On October 07 2020 20:40 Luolis wrote: Hots highlights make me warm and fuzzy inside.
Sounds like you need to rewatch mana vs firecake
It was a bad game and obviously things weren't perfect but overall hots was way better than lotv, and i'd return to it immediately given the chance.
Mana vs Firecake was the worst example of an ongoing problem in HoTS which was the Swarm Host. It wasn't the only game that was ruined by that unit, there were many of them.
Also during HoTS was the Blink All In meta vs Terran which was horrid and one of the worst balance periods the game has ever seen for one match up and that was all thanks to the Mothership Core.
HoTS had some great moments, but it had a LOT that was bad about it.
Early 2015-2016 LoTV was awful, but it's been much better on average since then.
EDIT: can't forget 2019 Zerg dominance, the worst that one race has dominated a year of play EVER since previous years of race dominance was either in the Foreign Scene OR Korean never one race dominated both that hard.
Yeah no shit, HotS had bad games forced by badly designed units and problems (sometimes big) with balance. I still maintain that overall it was a better game than LotV.
On October 07 2020 20:40 Luolis wrote: Hots highlights make me warm and fuzzy inside.
Sounds like you need to rewatch mana vs firecake
It was a bad game and obviously things weren't perfect but overall hots was way better than lotv, and i'd return to it immediately given the chance.
Mana vs Firecake was the worst example of an ongoing problem in HoTS which was the Swarm Host. It wasn't the only game that was ruined by that unit, there were many of them.
Also during HoTS was the Blink All In meta vs Terran which was horrid and one of the worst balance periods the game has ever seen for one match up and that was all thanks to the Mothership Core.
HoTS had some great moments, but it had a LOT that was bad about it.
Early 2015-2016 LoTV was awful, but it's been much better on average since then.
EDIT: can't forget 2019 Zerg dominance, the worst that one race has dominated a year of play EVER since previous years of race dominance was either in the Foreign Scene OR Korean never one race dominated both that hard.
Yeah no shit, HotS had bad games forced by badly designed units and problems (sometimes big) with balance. I still maintain that overall it was a better game than LotV.
I actually agree most of the lotv added units tend to be dumb (maybe except the lurker) meanwhile in hots only the sh was a really bad offender. And as a toss at least PvZ was more fun imo outside of sh.
On October 07 2020 20:40 Luolis wrote: Hots highlights make me warm and fuzzy inside.
Sounds like you need to rewatch mana vs firecake
It was a bad game and obviously things weren't perfect but overall hots was way better than lotv, and i'd return to it immediately given the chance.
Mana vs Firecake was the worst example of an ongoing problem in HoTS which was the Swarm Host. It wasn't the only game that was ruined by that unit, there were many of them.
Also during HoTS was the Blink All In meta vs Terran which was horrid and one of the worst balance periods the game has ever seen for one match up and that was all thanks to the Mothership Core.
HoTS had some great moments, but it had a LOT that was bad about it.
Early 2015-2016 LoTV was awful, but it's been much better on average since then.
EDIT: can't forget 2019 Zerg dominance, the worst that one race has dominated a year of play EVER since previous years of race dominance was either in the Foreign Scene OR Korean never one race dominated both that hard.
Yeah no shit, HotS had bad games forced by badly designed units and problems (sometimes big) with balance. I still maintain that overall it was a better game than LotV.
I actually agree most of the lotv added units tend to be dumb (maybe except the lurker) meanwhile in hots only the sh was a really bad offender. And as a toss at least PvZ was more fun imo outside of sh.
Uh excuse me? The MSC was just as bad if not worse. There's a reason it's no longer in the game and everyone cheered when it was removed.
On October 07 2020 20:40 Luolis wrote: Hots highlights make me warm and fuzzy inside.
Sounds like you need to rewatch mana vs firecake
It was a bad game and obviously things weren't perfect but overall hots was way better than lotv, and i'd return to it immediately given the chance.
Mana vs Firecake was the worst example of an ongoing problem in HoTS which was the Swarm Host. It wasn't the only game that was ruined by that unit, there were many of them.
Also during HoTS was the Blink All In meta vs Terran which was horrid and one of the worst balance periods the game has ever seen for one match up and that was all thanks to the Mothership Core.
HoTS had some great moments, but it had a LOT that was bad about it.
Early 2015-2016 LoTV was awful, but it's been much better on average since then.
EDIT: can't forget 2019 Zerg dominance, the worst that one race has dominated a year of play EVER since previous years of race dominance was either in the Foreign Scene OR Korean never one race dominated both that hard.
Yeah no shit, HotS had bad games forced by badly designed units and problems (sometimes big) with balance. I still maintain that overall it was a better game than LotV.
I actually agree most of the lotv added units tend to be dumb (maybe except the lurker) meanwhile in hots only the sh was a really bad offender. And as a toss at least PvZ was more fun imo outside of sh.
Uh excuse me? The MSC was just as bad if not worse. There's a reason it's no longer in the game and everyone cheered when it was removed.
I know this is a controversial opinion but even though it wasn't very good design, i feel like nexus cannon made for better protoss matchups than shield battery.
On October 07 2020 20:40 Luolis wrote: Hots highlights make me warm and fuzzy inside.
Sounds like you need to rewatch mana vs firecake
It was a bad game and obviously things weren't perfect but overall hots was way better than lotv, and i'd return to it immediately given the chance.
Mana vs Firecake was the worst example of an ongoing problem in HoTS which was the Swarm Host. It wasn't the only game that was ruined by that unit, there were many of them.
Also during HoTS was the Blink All In meta vs Terran which was horrid and one of the worst balance periods the game has ever seen for one match up and that was all thanks to the Mothership Core.
HoTS had some great moments, but it had a LOT that was bad about it.
Early 2015-2016 LoTV was awful, but it's been much better on average since then.
EDIT: can't forget 2019 Zerg dominance, the worst that one race has dominated a year of play EVER since previous years of race dominance was either in the Foreign Scene OR Korean never one race dominated both that hard.
Yeah no shit, HotS had bad games forced by badly designed units and problems (sometimes big) with balance. I still maintain that overall it was a better game than LotV.
I actually agree most of the lotv added units tend to be dumb (maybe except the lurker) meanwhile in hots only the sh was a really bad offender. And as a toss at least PvZ was more fun imo outside of sh.
Uh excuse me? The MSC was just as bad if not worse. There's a reason it's no longer in the game and everyone cheered when it was removed.
I know this is a controversial opinion but even though it wasn't very good design, i feel like nexus cannon made for better protoss matchups than shield battery.
Yes, msc wasn't the best design but lotv pylon cannon was a worse offender than nexus cannon in hots later on it wasn't that toxic imo, also with it's recall recall had some risk with it.
It's something to see just how much better Maru looks vs Stats than Byun did. Really shows the difference in their respective skill levels. No offense to Byun he DID just come back.
Non-stop widow mine drops even against phoenix (check) No viking play vs Colossus (check) Immortal Maruders (check) Proxies (check) Insane multiprong (check) Brutal ending by pushing with his bio into the middle of the Collosi/disruptor (check)
That being said, Stats is playing insanely well too, anyone can take this
I can't fathom a reality where Maru doesn't advance in second after the way he's played both these series. Only weird way would be Byun beating Parting and doing some weird TvT shit to advance instead.
On October 07 2020 21:30 Poopi wrote: This matchup is so hard, omfg. Hopefully Maru beats the winner of ByuN PartinG.
Dude you're really always putting it on the mu when the terran loses :D
Can you blame him? Watching the way Stats plays he really does make the match up look really fucking difficult. Credit Stats dude, the fact Maru played that well against him and still lost is just disheartening if you're a mortal Terran player.
On October 07 2020 21:31 MarianoSC2 wrote: Incredible PvTs from Stats and amazing TvPs from Maru. I hope Maru advances in the rematch against Parting...
I hope ByuN will prove you wrong. I know it's difficult to imagine after his first series but I hope.
On October 07 2020 21:30 Poopi wrote: This matchup is so hard, omfg. Hopefully Maru beats the winner of ByuN PartinG.
Dude you're really always putting it on the mu when the terran loses :D
Can you blame him? Watching the way Stats plays he really does make the match up look really fucking difficult.
Putting aside the fact that the only reason it got this difficult was because Stats did a fairly smart play to shutdown a timing attack by Maru.
And then Maru committed to it anyways.
So basically in the time it took for Maru to execute that timing, Stats was able to tech to Phoenix, Collosus, Charge and have Templar Archives with Templar ready to stop a Tank/Marine/Medivac push with a single Raven.
Honestly it's shocking to me that Protoss can tech that fast I've never seen an army composition like that that fast before.
On October 07 2020 21:30 Poopi wrote: This matchup is so hard, omfg. Hopefully Maru beats the winner of ByuN PartinG.
Dude you're really always putting it on the mu when the terran loses :D
Can you blame him? Watching the way Stats plays he really does make the match up look really fucking difficult.
Putting aside the fact that the only reason it got this difficult was because Stats did a fairly smart play to shutdown a timing attack by Maru.
And then Maru committed to it anyways.
So basically in the time it took for Maru to execute that timing, Stats was able to tech to Phoenix, Collosus, Charge and have Templar Archives with Templar ready to stop a Tank/Marine/Medivac push with a single Raven.
Honestly it's shocking to me that Protoss can tech that fast I've never seen an army composition like that that fast before.
That's why the normal tank-raven push is done off of 2 base rather than reaper bunker rush into triple CC (and was it 2EB, i missed it?).
On October 07 2020 21:30 Poopi wrote: This matchup is so hard, omfg. Hopefully Maru beats the winner of ByuN PartinG.
Dude you're really always putting it on the mu when the terran loses :D
Can you blame him? Watching the way Stats plays he really does make the match up look really fucking difficult.
Putting aside the fact that the only reason it got this difficult was because Stats did a fairly smart play to shutdown a timing attack by Maru.
And then Maru committed to it anyways.
So basically in the time it took for Maru to execute that timing, Stats was able to tech to Phoenix, Collosus, Charge and have Templar Archives with Templar ready to stop a Tank/Marine/Medivac push with a single Raven.
Honestly it's shocking to me that Protoss can tech that fast I've never seen an army composition like that that fast before.
Maru played a quick 3rd so the timing is ofc delayed and stats did so by delaying upgrades, also stats chrono for a long time did fully go into eco or upgrades like charge and collo range etc. so not too weird.
On October 07 2020 21:56 Harris1st wrote: This thread: Protoss OP, Terran can't win Other thread: Protoss UP, Toss hasn't won a title in over 5 gazillion years
I think we may be at the pinnacle of balance :D
Yeah well you're just ignoring that the root of all evil is Zerg tho
On October 07 2020 21:56 Harris1st wrote: This thread: Protoss OP, Terran can't win Other thread: Protoss UP, Toss hasn't won a title in over 5 gazillion years
I think we may be at the pinnacle of balance :D
It's almost as though Protoss has 3 match ups and they are all balanced differently.
On October 07 2020 21:56 Harris1st wrote: This thread: Protoss OP, Terran can't win Other thread: Protoss UP, Toss hasn't won a title in over 5 gazillion years
I think we may be at the pinnacle of balance :D
Well, you didn't notice the other thread was mostly whining about PvZ. This is PvT. See the difference? Terran, who won 9 premiere tournament titles from the ROgue patchzerg Blizzcon or Protoss who won 7 premiere tournament tiles or zerg with their shitty 31 titles which include 7 WC titles.
On October 07 2020 22:01 darklycid wrote: I think maru broke parting, he looks so off.
He didn't look that great against Maru to begin with.
Not as bad as here tho.
I mean the very fact he won a game. Granted Maru nuked his own army, but he still won a game. Byun killed him in straight sets and Parting made a lot of mistakes that allowed that to happen.
On October 07 2020 22:01 darklycid wrote: I think maru broke parting, he looks so off.
He didn't look that great against Maru to begin with.
Not as bad as here tho.
I mean the very fact he won a game. Granted Maru nuked his own army, but he still won a game. Byun killed him in straight sets and Parting made a lot of mistakes that allowed that to happen.
Just didn't look as sharp.
Well, maru would've lost that game regardless of the nuke.
It is sad that we have to lose either Maru or ByuN but the games should be good and if ByuN makes it through it would be as close as a perfect day of SC2 as it can be for me.
On October 07 2020 22:08 Javah wrote: It is sad that we have to lose either Maru or ByuN but the games should be good and if ByuN makes it through it would be as close as a perfect day of SC2 as it can be for me.
Byun making it through would probably be the worst outcome, as he should get stomped by everyone in the ro8.
On October 07 2020 22:08 Javah wrote: It is sad that we have to lose either Maru or ByuN but the games should be good and if ByuN makes it through it would be as close as a perfect day of SC2 as it can be for me.
Byun making it through would probably be the worst outcome, as he should get stomped by everyone in the ro8.
Although Maru is surely better, you should have a little more faith in ByuN! For sure Ro8 would be a big hurdle (and for Maru too) but I can definitely see him win over Armani or Zest so...
On October 07 2020 22:08 Javah wrote: It is sad that we have to lose either Maru or ByuN but the games should be good and if ByuN makes it through it would be as close as a perfect day of SC2 as it can be for me.
Byun making it through would probably be the worst outcome, as he should get stomped by everyone in the ro8.
Although Maru is surely better, you should have a little more faith in ByuN! For sure Ro8 would be a big hurdle (and for Maru too) but I can definitely see him win over Armani or Zest so...
The winner of this game will face the winner of Group D.
On October 07 2020 22:08 Javah wrote: It is sad that we have to lose either Maru or ByuN but the games should be good and if ByuN makes it through it would be as close as a perfect day of SC2 as it can be for me.
Byun making it through would probably be the worst outcome, as he should get stomped by everyone in the ro8.
Although Maru is surely better, you should have a little more faith in ByuN! For sure Ro8 would be a big hurdle (and for Maru too) but I can definitely see him win over Armani or Zest so...
The winner of this game will face the winner of Group D.
Well, on the incredibly tiny chance Innovation tops it, it's another TvT.
On October 07 2020 22:08 Javah wrote: It is sad that we have to lose either Maru or ByuN but the games should be good and if ByuN makes it through it would be as close as a perfect day of SC2 as it can be for me.
Byun making it through would probably be the worst outcome, as he should get stomped by everyone in the ro8.
Although Maru is surely better, you should have a little more faith in ByuN! For sure Ro8 would be a big hurdle (and for Maru too) but I can definitely see him win over Armani or Zest so...
The winner of this game will face the winner of Group D.
Which technically can be Innovation which would be a very bad news for Maru
On October 07 2020 22:02 Morbidius wrote: Parting is the most overrated player in SC2 right now, and this is supposed to be his good matchup.
Nope he has stated multiple times, even at the group selections he prefers pvz over pvt atm
Right now maybe, but PartinG is arguably the best PvT player of all time.
Even though right now Stats looks completely unbeatable in the matchup. I can't think of anyone who has chance fighting disruptors while holding the constant zealot and DT harass as well as Maru did.
On October 07 2020 22:08 Javah wrote: It is sad that we have to lose either Maru or ByuN but the games should be good and if ByuN makes it through it would be as close as a perfect day of SC2 as it can be for me.
Byun making it through would probably be the worst outcome, as he should get stomped by everyone in the ro8.
Although Maru is surely better, you should have a little more faith in ByuN! For sure Ro8 would be a big hurdle (and for Maru too) but I can definitely see him win over Armani or Zest so...
The winner of this game will face the winner of Group D.
Which technically can be Innovation which would be a very bad news for Maru
I am very impressed by how much better Byun looks in TvT than TvP. But... Maru ist still just on another level overall. This was closer than I expected, but at no point in the game was Maru in the danger of losing. Incredible plays
Why does Artosis think Maru proxied for three of his GSLs? It was only the third season where he proxied every game (which was the meta for terran). The other three were a pretty balanced mix of everything
On October 07 2020 22:34 Fango wrote: Why does Artosis think Maru proxied for three of his GSLs? It was only the third season where he proxied every game (which was the meta for terran). The other three were a pretty balanced mix of everything
On October 07 2020 22:34 Fango wrote: Why does Artosis think Maru proxied for three of his GSLs? It was only the third season where he proxied every game (which was the meta for terran). The other three were a pretty balanced mix of everything
First season even had raven deathballs.
For literally two games against Dark, out of the roughly 30 he played that season. And even then he never had a huge deathball of them.
ByuN is again refusing to go vikings. First game I thought it was because he lost his 2 ravens early and assumed he could not keep up in the air battle but now it seems a stylistic choice. Unfortunately it doesn't really work anymore in contemporary TvT.
On October 07 2020 22:47 Javah wrote: ByuN is again refusing to go vikings. First game I thought it was because he lost his 2 ravens early and assumed he could not keep up in the air battle but now it seems a stylistic choice. Unfortunately it doesn't really work anymore in contemporary TvT.
Eh you can play without vikings. It's not a great style against Maru in particular though.
Maru is way too good to let ByuN win in this type of scenario. This style asks for your opponent to "give" you the win and Maru is not stupid enough to do this.
I wonder why there is no medical help there at all. In traditional sports if you have a light injury during the game you would get some temporary treatment, like spray his hand with some shit or something to reduce pain at least a little.
It sucks for ByuN but its only fair he gets a warning, it cant be allowed to pause for any reason besides technical. Its the same with mental exhaustion, you want to pause, no no you should gg if you cant keep playing. Maru taxing ByuNs micro is also a skill and its up to ByuN to handle it.
I really appreciate GSL giving ByuN a break to recover but at the same time giving him a warning and keeping to the rules, its a good middle ground.
On October 07 2020 23:01 ytherik wrote: I wonder why there is no medical help there at all. In traditional sports if you have a light injury during the game you would get some temporary treatment, like spray his hand with some shit or something to reduce pain at least a little.
Probably because injuries in traditional sports are a regular occurrence while in eSports it is not.
On October 07 2020 23:01 ytherik wrote: I wonder why there is no medical help there at all. In traditional sports if you have a light injury during the game you would get some temporary treatment, like spray his hand with some shit or something to reduce pain at least a little.
Now that our sport has lasted this long, this is 100% what we need.
Before it was all twenty year olds, now that we have a wider range, we need to plan for the future. Good idea to integrate that.
On October 07 2020 23:01 ytherik wrote: I wonder why there is no medical help there at all. In traditional sports if you have a light injury during the game you would get some temporary treatment, like spray his hand with some shit or something to reduce pain at least a little.
They can use the same spray, it's just cold and maybe some painkillers. But we're talking about wrists, where you don't want to kill the pain as much. This should be checked by a doctor and i believe the doctor would say - stop playing, no painkillers.
Perfect week in liquibets so far. Just need Innovation/Rogue and Reynor/Innovation to advance for it to be a perfect 7 days. Really just need Innovation to play well this week. Don't let me down Inno!
What the hell Maru, the disrespect. "I expected to go out of the group in first place" "I didn't practise for the winners match so I just adapted to his gameplan"..... Love you Maru but come on man, show Stats some respect or you will suffer
On October 07 2020 23:01 ytherik wrote: I wonder why there is no medical help there at all. In traditional sports if you have a light injury during the game you would get some temporary treatment, like spray his hand with some shit or something to reduce pain at least a little.
They can use the same spray, it's just cold and maybe some painkillers. But we're talking about wrists, where you don't want to kill the pain as much. This should be checked by a doctor and i believe the doctor would say - stop playing, no painkillers.
Anti-inflammatories can actually be somewhat beneficial, but yeah, most doctors would tell you to moderate the activities straining the wrists.
On October 07 2020 23:01 ytherik wrote: I wonder why there is no medical help there at all. In traditional sports if you have a light injury during the game you would get some temporary treatment, like spray his hand with some shit or something to reduce pain at least a little.
They can use the same spray, it's just cold and maybe some painkillers. But we're talking about wrists, where you don't want to kill the pain as much. This should be checked by a doctor and i believe the doctor would say - stop playing, no painkillers.
To be honest "Stop playing, no painkillers" is valid recipe for any sports-related injury, not just video games. Everyone still takes the painkiller option though.
On October 07 2020 23:07 Vindicare605 wrote: Perfect week in liquibets so far. Just need Innovation/Rogue and Reynor/Innovation to advance for it to be a perfect 7 days. Really just need Innovation to play well this week. Don't let me down Inno!
On October 07 2020 23:07 Vindicare605 wrote: Perfect week in liquibets so far. Just need Innovation/Rogue and Reynor/Innovation to advance for it to be a perfect 7 days. Really just need Innovation to play well this week. Don't let me down Inno!
sorry to say, its gonna be trap dark
Since when have I ever taken your predictions seriously but seriously Group D is as stacked as this one was I hope it lives up to the expectations people have of it after how insane this group was.
On October 07 2020 23:01 ytherik wrote: I wonder why there is no medical help there at all. In traditional sports if you have a light injury during the game you would get some temporary treatment, like spray his hand with some shit or something to reduce pain at least a little.
They can use the same spray, it's just cold and maybe some painkillers. But we're talking about wrists, where you don't want to kill the pain as much. This should be checked by a doctor and i believe the doctor would say - stop playing, no painkillers.
To be honest "Stop playing, no painkillers" is valid recipe for any sports-related injury, not just video games. Everyone still takes the painkiller option though.
What I mean is that wrists are complicated and I would equal them to a knee injury in the football which is treated more carefully than just "here are painkillers,. cold, continue playing the game".
What I am referring to is the on field treatment, not the off-field Once the game ends players are profesionally treated and all the injuries are checked properly.
On October 07 2020 22:59 jojamon wrote: Oh man...how come it seems that all the players suffering from wrist issues are T players? Mvp, Maru, Byun?
To play bio terran you basically have to stutter step/kite/split units constantly, especially if you play a high micro style. If you watch third person vods of Maru some of the wrist actions he's doing are painful to look at, imagine doing those all day for 10 years.
Flash, Mvp, Taeja, ByuN, Maru have all sufferred from pretty bad wrist issues I think, I think TLO did back in the day as well. Maybe MMA as well I can't quite remember.
On October 08 2020 03:41 S19Q9A5 wrote: Anyone can explain, why Byun didn't use Ghosts against Ravens? They are always fly together.
Has any pro used Ghosts as a Raven counter?
It sounds like an unexplored option, but it requires some clunky tech, and controlling a TvT army is pretty technical already, so getting ghosts into position to land those EMPs is not easy! Ghosts are also expensive dead weight except that exact play.
On October 08 2020 03:41 S19Q9A5 wrote: Anyone can explain, why Byun didn't use Ghosts against Ravens? They are always fly together.
Has any pro used Ghosts as a Raven counter?
It sounds like an unexplored option, but it requires some clunky tech, and controlling a TvT army is pretty technical already, so getting ghosts into position to land those EMPs is not easy! Ghosts are also expensive dead weight except that exact play.
I've seen it once or twice, but it's very rare. Ravens are faster than ghosts and fly which makes getting the EMPs off before the ravens neutralize all the tanks really difficult.
FYI for anyone who is going to watch the videos on youtube - watch the full stream video rather than the individually uploaded matches. The individual matches have a botched audio
On October 08 2020 03:41 S19Q9A5 wrote: Anyone can explain, why Byun didn't use Ghosts against Ravens? They are always fly together.
Has any pro used Ghosts as a Raven counter?
It sounds like an unexplored option, but it requires some clunky tech, and controlling a TvT army is pretty technical already, so getting ghosts into position to land those EMPs is not easy! Ghosts are also expensive dead weight except that exact play.
Agreed - the tech tree is too awkward.
Though if imagine ghosts still had lockdown...would have so many uses in TvP too
Wow what a stacked group and all its participants really delivered high quality Starcraft, absolute treat.
Would highly recommend watching some of the games from the FPVoDs on afgsl3 and afgsl4 and syncing it with the cast. Easier from VoDs now as when live the streams are out of sync
Stats and Maru both brought potential championship level play today, and Parting and ByuN played well too, they certainly could have made Ro8 in other groups.
Speaking of the FPVoDs if anyone knows a decent method to rip them off Afreeca please hit me up via a PM. I want to pull together some dual FPVoDs from the last few GSL seasons and upload em for the community. At present I have nothing better than doing it in OBS but any buffering which is frequent for me and Afreeca makes syncing then a lot harder
On October 08 2020 08:02 WombaT wrote: Wow what a stacked group and all its participants really delivered high quality Starcraft, absolute treat.
Would highly recommend watching some of the games from the FPVoDs on afgsl3 and afgsl4 and syncing it with the cast. Easier from VoDs now as when live the streams are out of sync
Stats and Maru both brought potential championship level play today, and Parting and ByuN played well too, they certainly could have made Ro8 in other groups.
Speaking of the FPVoDs if anyone knows a decent method to rip them off Afreeca please hit me up via a PM. I want to pull together some dual FPVoDs from the last few GSL seasons and upload em for the community. At present I have nothing better than doing it in OBS but any buffering which is frequent for me and Afreeca makes syncing then a lot harder
They're no longer doing FPVoDs, players are afraid it gives away too much
On October 08 2020 03:41 S19Q9A5 wrote: Anyone can explain, why Byun didn't use Ghosts against Ravens? They are always fly together.
Has any pro used Ghosts as a Raven counter?
It sounds like an unexplored option, but it requires some clunky tech, and controlling a TvT army is pretty technical already, so getting ghosts into position to land those EMPs is not easy! Ghosts are also expensive dead weight except that exact play.
I've seen it once or twice, but it's very rare. Ravens are faster than ghosts and fly which makes getting the EMPs off before the ravens neutralize all the tanks really difficult.
and even if they manage to shutdown all ravens the fight wont be decided by ghosts anyway cuz they cant do shit vs stimmy bois and tanks ;OOo
On October 08 2020 08:02 WombaT wrote: Wow what a stacked group and all its participants really delivered high quality Starcraft, absolute treat.
Would highly recommend watching some of the games from the FPVoDs on afgsl3 and afgsl4 and syncing it with the cast. Easier from VoDs now as when live the streams are out of sync
Stats and Maru both brought potential championship level play today, and Parting and ByuN played well too, they certainly could have made Ro8 in other groups.
Speaking of the FPVoDs if anyone knows a decent method to rip them off Afreeca please hit me up via a PM. I want to pull together some dual FPVoDs from the last few GSL seasons and upload em for the community. At present I have nothing better than doing it in OBS but any buffering which is frequent for me and Afreeca makes syncing then a lot harder
It's odd that the wrist injury timeout is a warning, but I suppose the rule makes sense, since it's easy to lie. One look at Byun's hand, shaking and swollen at the point of contact with the table, definitely removes any doubt that he was faking. I hope he recovers.
Drama aside, that was one hell of a group, and I'm not surprised who made it through and the order in which they advanced. Almost all of the groups and games this season are absolutely savage af. I hope the finals continues the tradition.
I just rewatched the match between maru and byun. It was hard to watch.
(1) The intern who captured and uploaded the video to youtube put an additional audio on the video. You hear a korean guy eat something and talk to his cat. Afterwards there is a complete sitcom???
(2) I watched Byuns face cam a bit. At least since minute 5 of game 2 you can see him struggle with the wrist pain. It is heart wrenching. :-(
On October 08 2020 13:30 dUTtrOACh wrote: It's odd that the wrist injury timeout is a warning, but I suppose the rule makes sense, since it's easy to lie. One look at Byun's hand, shaking and swollen at the point of contact with the table, definitely removes any doubt that he was faking. I hope he recovers.
Drama aside, that was one hell of a group, and I'm not surprised who made it through and the order in which they advanced. Almost all of the groups and games this season are absolutely savage af. I hope the finals continues the tradition.
Does he face any consequences for the first warning? Of course it's hard, but it definitely makes sense to have it really clearly regulated and I would assume some people could potentially abuse any unclear rules. I hope a first warning is not a big issue though.
I don't think the warning by itself actually means much, but it may be a thing like a yellow card where a player can't afford to get another one during a group.
Just managed to catch the games - when I saw that the stream was 5 hours long I was shook! What an amazing group of games
Stats looking really great, Maru got some epic games in there (actually laughed out loud when he nuked his own army - thought he was baiting Parting in!)
Quite a sad moment with Byun's wrist and I saw some good comments here about those pain killer sprays footballers use, although you probably don't want to numb your wrist in the middle of a pro game... tough one
Parting seems a little bit tilted today... hoping for a rebound for ST, he's always an exciting one to watch (his games with Maru were generally really good as well)
On to Group D... what an insane group we have there
On October 08 2020 08:02 WombaT wrote: Wow what a stacked group and all its participants really delivered high quality Starcraft, absolute treat.
Would highly recommend watching some of the games from the FPVoDs on afgsl3 and afgsl4 and syncing it with the cast. Easier from VoDs now as when live the streams are out of sync
Stats and Maru both brought potential championship level play today, and Parting and ByuN played well too, they certainly could have made Ro8 in other groups.
Speaking of the FPVoDs if anyone knows a decent method to rip them off Afreeca please hit me up via a PM. I want to pull together some dual FPVoDs from the last few GSL seasons and upload em for the community. At present I have nothing better than doing it in OBS but any buffering which is frequent for me and Afreeca makes syncing then a lot harder
big boi definitely underperformed tho
Yes against Byun, not against Maru, he looked better vs Maru than I've seen him in regular TvP in a while.
I really think that Game 2 tilted him. That should have been a relatively straightforward win for him after what happened in the early and midgame and then it turned into THAT only for it to end because Maru made a stupidly awesome mistake, then Maru just wrecked him in Game 3.
Parting is an emotional player always has been. It's part of his charm. I think his series with Maru tilted him because he just did not look like the same player vs Byun who is obviously not the same level of TvP that Maru is.
wow one of the best groups of the year if not the best! what a nice surprise to see that last TvT, i didnt expect to ByuN get to the last match but im glad i was mistaken. Parting gave us a game of the year candidate so pretty much everyone had something to praise in their performance
On October 08 2020 17:37 Sophus wrote: I just rewatched the match between maru and byun. It was hard to watch.
(1) The intern who captured and uploaded the video to youtube put an additional audio on the video. You hear a korean guy eat something and talk to his cat. Afterwards there is a complete sitcom???
The full-stream VOD (of all matches) doesn't appear to have this, but yeah I noticed it too when watching individual matches via sc2links. This isn't the first time I've experienced this in VODs (the intern watching some Korean show or livestream or something while recording the matches) but last night's group was easily the worst and most noticeable instance of this, makes it really hard to watch.
For anyone like "wtf are you talking about", listen from 12:50-13:10 and imagine this popping up all over your SC2 vod: