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On January 21 2015 20:34 OtherWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2015 20:22 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 18:45 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 17:44 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 16:02 NotSorry wrote:
Flash finally wins and Zest goes 0-2...what is the world coming too Flash finally got matched up with someone of similar skill in BBoongBBoong, and Zest losing isn't surprising; patchtosses come and go like the wind. Oh hey, look who's back. Where were you last week when your dear patchtoss Zest single-handedly carried KT to victory against Samsung? And the week before that, when he did the same against SKT? You mean when he won ZvP over Shine and over an incredibly slumping Solar? Yeah I saw it, was I supposed to be impressed?. FYI Zest is also #1 in the players' ranking with 5 victories, above players like INnoVation and Dark. 5 victories and 4 losses..."above" players like INnoVation who has 4 victories and 0 losses...Zest simply gets chances to play more because KT loses to teams like Prime. I guess by your logic INnoVation is a shit player because he only beat Center, MyuNgSiK, a slumping TY and sOs, right? A win is a win, especially in PL where you have players who train only for that, and you should show some respect to the players. And there's a reason Zest isn't rotated out like Stats and TY... Just like being 5-4 still puts him above player like Life or Maru in win %. So, Maru is a patchterran and Life a patchzerg?
If you look at my post history where I actually explain why he's a patchtoss, it has nothing to do with "win percentages" and has everything to do with when he "got good" right after the two biggest protoss-buffing patches. You should go read the thread; even people who were arguing against me eventually ceded their point and allowed that my analysis was correct.
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I dont know why i even responded. I love when people claim that Zest is a patch toss, soO is overrated or MC is bad because i should immiadtly know that they dont know what they are talking about and can ignore them. Now that would be a usefull use of the filter function. TL pls
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On January 21 2015 20:38 SackOfWetMice wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2015 20:34 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 20:22 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 18:45 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 17:44 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 16:02 NotSorry wrote:
Flash finally wins and Zest goes 0-2...what is the world coming too Flash finally got matched up with someone of similar skill in BBoongBBoong, and Zest losing isn't surprising; patchtosses come and go like the wind. Oh hey, look who's back. Where were you last week when your dear patchtoss Zest single-handedly carried KT to victory against Samsung? And the week before that, when he did the same against SKT? You mean when he won ZvP over Shine and over an incredibly slumping Solar? Yeah I saw it, was I supposed to be impressed?. FYI Zest is also #1 in the players' ranking with 5 victories, above players like INnoVation and Dark. 5 victories and 4 losses..."above" players like INnoVation who has 4 victories and 0 losses...Zest simply gets chances to play more because KT loses to teams like Prime. I guess by your logic INnoVation is a shit player because he only beat Center, MyuNgSiK, a slumping TY and sOs, right? A win is a win, especially in PL where you have players who train only for that, and you should show some respect to the players. And there's a reason Zest isn't rotated out like Stats and TY... Just like being 5-4 still puts him above player like Life or Maru in win %. So, Maru is a patchterran and Life a patchzerg? If you look at my post history where I actually explain why he's a patchtoss, it has nothing to do with "win percentages" and has everything to do with when he "got good" right after the two biggest protoss-buffing patches. You should go read the thread; even people who were arguing against me eventually ceded their point and allowed that my analysis was correct.
No. I was in this thread and people stopped arguing against you because you argue with the sole goal of arguing, and that makes arguing with you pointless and tiring. Which is why I'll stop there as well. Seriously, you're displaying swag_bro-level of analysis, except swag_bro is actually funny (and not insulting towards players).
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On January 21 2015 21:10 OtherWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2015 20:38 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 20:34 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 20:22 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 18:45 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 17:44 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 16:02 NotSorry wrote:
Flash finally wins and Zest goes 0-2...what is the world coming too Flash finally got matched up with someone of similar skill in BBoongBBoong, and Zest losing isn't surprising; patchtosses come and go like the wind. Oh hey, look who's back. Where were you last week when your dear patchtoss Zest single-handedly carried KT to victory against Samsung? And the week before that, when he did the same against SKT? You mean when he won ZvP over Shine and over an incredibly slumping Solar? Yeah I saw it, was I supposed to be impressed?. FYI Zest is also #1 in the players' ranking with 5 victories, above players like INnoVation and Dark. 5 victories and 4 losses..."above" players like INnoVation who has 4 victories and 0 losses...Zest simply gets chances to play more because KT loses to teams like Prime. I guess by your logic INnoVation is a shit player because he only beat Center, MyuNgSiK, a slumping TY and sOs, right? A win is a win, especially in PL where you have players who train only for that, and you should show some respect to the players. And there's a reason Zest isn't rotated out like Stats and TY... Just like being 5-4 still puts him above player like Life or Maru in win %. So, Maru is a patchterran and Life a patchzerg? If you look at my post history where I actually explain why he's a patchtoss, it has nothing to do with "win percentages" and has everything to do with when he "got good" right after the two biggest protoss-buffing patches. You should go read the thread; even people who were arguing against me eventually ceded their point and allowed that my analysis was correct. No. I was in this thread and people stopped arguing against you because you argue with the sole goal of arguing, and that makes arguing with you pointless and tiring. Which is why I'll stop there as well. Seriously, you're displaying swag_bro-level of analysis, except swag_bro is actually funny (and not insulting towards players).
And Swag_bro is actually useful because he tells us who the best player in the world is
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haha i knew he would come back as soon as zest doesn't carry KT, so pathetic...
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On January 21 2015 21:10 OtherWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2015 20:38 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 20:34 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 20:22 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 18:45 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 17:44 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 16:02 NotSorry wrote:
Flash finally wins and Zest goes 0-2...what is the world coming too Flash finally got matched up with someone of similar skill in BBoongBBoong, and Zest losing isn't surprising; patchtosses come and go like the wind. Oh hey, look who's back. Where were you last week when your dear patchtoss Zest single-handedly carried KT to victory against Samsung? And the week before that, when he did the same against SKT? You mean when he won ZvP over Shine and over an incredibly slumping Solar? Yeah I saw it, was I supposed to be impressed?. FYI Zest is also #1 in the players' ranking with 5 victories, above players like INnoVation and Dark. 5 victories and 4 losses..."above" players like INnoVation who has 4 victories and 0 losses...Zest simply gets chances to play more because KT loses to teams like Prime. I guess by your logic INnoVation is a shit player because he only beat Center, MyuNgSiK, a slumping TY and sOs, right? A win is a win, especially in PL where you have players who train only for that, and you should show some respect to the players. And there's a reason Zest isn't rotated out like Stats and TY... Just like being 5-4 still puts him above player like Life or Maru in win %. So, Maru is a patchterran and Life a patchzerg? If you look at my post history where I actually explain why he's a patchtoss, it has nothing to do with "win percentages" and has everything to do with when he "got good" right after the two biggest protoss-buffing patches. You should go read the thread; even people who were arguing against me eventually ceded their point and allowed that my analysis was correct. No. I was in this thread and people stopped arguing against you because you argue with the sole goal of arguing, and that makes arguing with you pointless and tiring.
Perhaps you missed TheDwf's post stating that my analysis was correct? I'll link it for you below.
Secondly, if you look back through my post history, nearly every prediction I've made about 2015 has been correct. When everyone was predicting KT to be the #1 in Proleague power-rankings, I posted that they would be a solid, mid-level team. Look where they are now - right where I predicted.
I also predicted that at least two of KT's main 4 would see a drop-off in results. Also became true.
I know very well that Zest having a great first half of 2014 was, in a way, a byproduct of racial imbalance since he has top PvP, great PvZ and mediocre PvT. Of course it's going to propel him to the top in the Zparcraft environment. If you want the exact numbers from all the Premier he played prior to Hot6ix, here you go:
- 55 PvP with a 42-13 record (76.36%).
- 35 PvT with a 19-16 record (54.29%). Virtually half of the PvTs were played post-patch at IEM Toronto. Before that, he had 7-3. Post-patch, he scored 12-13.
- 44 PvZ with a 28-16 record (63.64%).
So yes, your analysis is accurate. Zest was the master of Zparcraft. But now, are you forced to call him "patchtoss" everywhere for all that, instead of simply stating that he will have a rough 2015 year if he doesn't improve in PvT...
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On January 21 2015 21:32 SackOfWetMice wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2015 21:10 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 20:38 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 20:34 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 20:22 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 18:45 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 17:44 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 16:02 NotSorry wrote:
Flash finally wins and Zest goes 0-2...what is the world coming too Flash finally got matched up with someone of similar skill in BBoongBBoong, and Zest losing isn't surprising; patchtosses come and go like the wind. Oh hey, look who's back. Where were you last week when your dear patchtoss Zest single-handedly carried KT to victory against Samsung? And the week before that, when he did the same against SKT? You mean when he won ZvP over Shine and over an incredibly slumping Solar? Yeah I saw it, was I supposed to be impressed?. FYI Zest is also #1 in the players' ranking with 5 victories, above players like INnoVation and Dark. 5 victories and 4 losses..."above" players like INnoVation who has 4 victories and 0 losses...Zest simply gets chances to play more because KT loses to teams like Prime. I guess by your logic INnoVation is a shit player because he only beat Center, MyuNgSiK, a slumping TY and sOs, right? A win is a win, especially in PL where you have players who train only for that, and you should show some respect to the players. And there's a reason Zest isn't rotated out like Stats and TY... Just like being 5-4 still puts him above player like Life or Maru in win %. So, Maru is a patchterran and Life a patchzerg? If you look at my post history where I actually explain why he's a patchtoss, it has nothing to do with "win percentages" and has everything to do with when he "got good" right after the two biggest protoss-buffing patches. You should go read the thread; even people who were arguing against me eventually ceded their point and allowed that my analysis was correct. No. I was in this thread and people stopped arguing against you because you argue with the sole goal of arguing, and that makes arguing with you pointless and tiring. Perhaps you missed TheDwf's post stating that my analysis was correct? I'll link it for you below. Secondly, if you look back through my post history, nearly every prediction I've made about 2015 has been correct. When everyone was predicting KT to be the #1 in Proleague power-rankings, I posted that they would be a solid, mid-level team. Look where they are now - right where I predicted. I also predicted that at least two of KT's main 4 would see a drop-off in results. Also became true. Show nested quote +I know very well that Zest having a great first half of 2014 was, in a way, a byproduct of racial imbalance since he has top PvP, great PvZ and mediocre PvT. Of course it's going to propel him to the top in the Zparcraft environment. If you want the exact numbers from all the Premier he played prior to Hot6ix, here you go:
- 55 PvP with a 42-13 record (76.36%).
- 35 PvT with a 19-16 record (54.29%). Virtually half of the PvTs were played post-patch at IEM Toronto. Before that, he had 7-3. Post-patch, he scored 12-13.
- 44 PvZ with a 28-16 record (63.64%).
So yes, your analysis is accurate. Zest was the master of Zparcraft. But now, are you forced to call him "patchtoss" everywhere for all that, instead of simply stating that he will have a rough 2015 year if he doesn't improve in PvT...
do you actually know that SPL lasts for 8 months? I might be a bit early to say you were right. Last year Cj went 2-5 in the first round before almost making it to the grand final ( herO lost the last ace match against Rain) , and sOs lost at least his 4 firsts games and yet had the most win at the end...
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On January 22 2015 00:05 Lazzi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2015 21:32 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 21:10 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 20:38 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 20:34 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 20:22 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 18:45 OtherWorld wrote:On January 21 2015 17:44 SackOfWetMice wrote:On January 21 2015 16:02 NotSorry wrote:
Flash finally wins and Zest goes 0-2...what is the world coming too Flash finally got matched up with someone of similar skill in BBoongBBoong, and Zest losing isn't surprising; patchtosses come and go like the wind. Oh hey, look who's back. Where were you last week when your dear patchtoss Zest single-handedly carried KT to victory against Samsung? And the week before that, when he did the same against SKT? You mean when he won ZvP over Shine and over an incredibly slumping Solar? Yeah I saw it, was I supposed to be impressed?. FYI Zest is also #1 in the players' ranking with 5 victories, above players like INnoVation and Dark. 5 victories and 4 losses..."above" players like INnoVation who has 4 victories and 0 losses...Zest simply gets chances to play more because KT loses to teams like Prime. I guess by your logic INnoVation is a shit player because he only beat Center, MyuNgSiK, a slumping TY and sOs, right? A win is a win, especially in PL where you have players who train only for that, and you should show some respect to the players. And there's a reason Zest isn't rotated out like Stats and TY... Just like being 5-4 still puts him above player like Life or Maru in win %. So, Maru is a patchterran and Life a patchzerg? If you look at my post history where I actually explain why he's a patchtoss, it has nothing to do with "win percentages" and has everything to do with when he "got good" right after the two biggest protoss-buffing patches. You should go read the thread; even people who were arguing against me eventually ceded their point and allowed that my analysis was correct. No. I was in this thread and people stopped arguing against you because you argue with the sole goal of arguing, and that makes arguing with you pointless and tiring. Perhaps you missed TheDwf's post stating that my analysis was correct? I'll link it for you below. Secondly, if you look back through my post history, nearly every prediction I've made about 2015 has been correct. When everyone was predicting KT to be the #1 in Proleague power-rankings, I posted that they would be a solid, mid-level team. Look where they are now - right where I predicted. I also predicted that at least two of KT's main 4 would see a drop-off in results. Also became true. I know very well that Zest having a great first half of 2014 was, in a way, a byproduct of racial imbalance since he has top PvP, great PvZ and mediocre PvT. Of course it's going to propel him to the top in the Zparcraft environment. If you want the exact numbers from all the Premier he played prior to Hot6ix, here you go:
- 55 PvP with a 42-13 record (76.36%).
- 35 PvT with a 19-16 record (54.29%). Virtually half of the PvTs were played post-patch at IEM Toronto. Before that, he had 7-3. Post-patch, he scored 12-13.
- 44 PvZ with a 28-16 record (63.64%).
So yes, your analysis is accurate. Zest was the master of Zparcraft. But now, are you forced to call him "patchtoss" everywhere for all that, instead of simply stating that he will have a rough 2015 year if he doesn't improve in PvT... do you actually know that SPL lasts for 8 months? I might be a bit early to say you were right. Last year Cj went 2-5 in the first round before almost making it to the grand final ( herO lost the last ace match against Rain) , and sOs lost at least his 4 firsts games and yet had the most win at the end...
I do actually know that, thanks for the reminder. Yet I'm already correct in what I predicted; the rest of Proleague doesn't matter. My prediction wasn't that "KT will suck all of Proleague," it was that they were middle-tier and that certain players of theirs would show a pretty significant drop-off in results.
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Oh ok so one round of proleague already makes KT a middle tier team, even if they would win the next round and all of proleague, makes perfect sense...
"that certain players of theirs would show a pretty significant drop-off in results."
Over what timeframe?? Every player has some months where he doesn't have the best results, it's a "trivial" prediction if you actually mean that.
What matters is results over a long period of time to make any meaningful statements about the quality of a player.
It's really funny that right when KT (and Zest) loses this week you are back to spread your bs again, why didn't you post the last 2 weeks where the opposite was true?
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On January 22 2015 01:34 The_Red_Viper wrote:
Oh ok so one round of proleague already makes KT a middle tier team, even if they would win the next round and all of proleague, makes perfect sense...
Just look at '10-'11. ^_^
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Seeker
Where dat snitch at?37023 Posts
KT beat SKT. Prime and MVP beat KT. So by that logic, Prime and MVP > SKT? T-T
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On January 22 2015 04:56 Seeker wrote:
KT beat SKT. Prime and MVP beat KT. So by that logic, Prime and MVP > SKT? T-T
It's the Circle of KT > SKT > Prime/MVP > KT.
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On January 22 2015 04:56 Seeker wrote:
KT beat SKT. Prime and MVP beat KT. So by that logic, Prime and MVP > SKT? T-T
KT plays well when it matters. Beating the telecom rivals matters; losing to scrub teams is fine.
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On January 22 2015 05:23 KingofdaHipHop wrote:Show nested quote +On January 22 2015 04:56 Seeker wrote:
KT beat SKT. Prime and MVP beat KT. So by that logic, Prime and MVP > SKT? T-T It's the Circle of KT > SKT > Prime/MVP > KT.
Like Polt >MMA>MVP>Polt in the old days. Maybe KT would not win PL again if they didnt play SKT in the finals 
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On January 22 2015 07:21 BlackCompany wrote:Show nested quote +On January 22 2015 05:23 KingofdaHipHop wrote:On January 22 2015 04:56 Seeker wrote:
KT beat SKT. Prime and MVP beat KT. So by that logic, Prime and MVP > SKT? T-T It's the Circle of KT > SKT > Prime/MVP > KT. Like Polt >MMA>MVP>Polt in the old days. Maybe KT would not win PL again if they didnt play SKT in the finals
we just need prime to get there then. They need to win against teams that are not SKT or KT tho 
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On January 22 2015 06:50 Ctesias wrote:Show nested quote +On January 22 2015 04:56 Seeker wrote:
KT beat SKT. Prime and MVP beat KT. So by that logic, Prime and MVP > SKT? T-T KT plays well when it matters. Beating the telecom rivals matters; losing to scrub teams is fine.
But KTC K-Tel Prime is a telecom rival!
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France12795 Posts
On January 22 2015 04:56 Seeker wrote:
KT beat SKT. Prime and MVP beat KT. So by that logic, Prime and MVP > SKT? T-T
There is no transitivity in SC2 so not necessarily :D.
I'm glad Prime and MKP won recently, especially against good team/player!
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On January 22 2015 01:34 The_Red_Viper wrote:
Oh ok so one round of proleague already makes KT a middle tier team, even if they would win the next round and all of proleague, makes perfect sense...
It's really funny that right when KT (and Zest) loses this week you are back to spread your bs again, why didn't you post the last 2 weeks where the opposite was true?
You call this "spreading my bs," yet my predictions were far more accurate than yours were. I'm going to assume you posted KT Rolster as #1 in your pre-Proleague Round 1 power rank (correct me if I'm wrong, of course), whereas I posted that they would be a middle-tier team . Looks like what I'm spreading is sweet, buttery knowledge rather than "bs."
"that certain players of theirs would show a pretty significant drop-off in results."
Over what timeframe?? Every player has some months where he doesn't have the best results, it's a "trivial" prediction if you actually mean that.
What matters is results over a long period of time to make any meaningful statements about the quality of a player.
If you actually look at the thread where I posted my actual analysis of Zest's play, and explained why I don't think he's much more than an opportunistic Protoss (a nicer way of saying patchtoss), you will find your answers there. I don't have the time nor the will to repost it all.
Quite simply, what matters at this point is that we had different opinions, and my predictions have turned out to be correct. I'll quite gladly continue to watch the rest of 2015 to see if the year continues reinforcing my predictions and assertions, as it has so far.
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I think Zest is a handsome protoss, do you have a rebutal SackofWetMice?
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EPT
