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Wingblade
United States1806 Posts
On March 12 2014 21:40 bo1b wrote: Yep, the potential for good games doesn't ruin the stigma of 3+ years of horrible ones. How do two or three year old games in entirely different circumstances have any bearing on the amazing PvP that we now have? It's time to let go of those ridiculous stigmas... | ||
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Vindicare605
United States16129 Posts
On March 12 2014 22:17 Wingblade wrote: How do two or three year old games in entirely different circumstances have any bearing on the amazing PvP that we now have? It's time to let go of those ridiculous stigmas... I have watched a lot of PvP this year. Tonight's were some of the only ones I have actually enjoyed watching. The stigma survives because good recommendable PvP games are still a rarity. Can you name any other than tonight's that you can remember that you would recommend from this year or last? I can't. I can't think of a single PvP series from last year that stuck in my mind while I can think of at least 10 TvT series that were amazing from just 2013. PvP might be better than it has been in the past but it has a LONG way to go before it's anywhere near as good as some of the other match ups. | ||
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intotheheart
Canada33091 Posts
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Daswollvieh
5553 Posts
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Paljas
Germany6926 Posts
On March 12 2014 22:24 Vindicare605 wrote: I have watched a lot of PvP this year. Tonight's were some of the only ones I have actually enjoyed watching. The stigma survives because good recommendable PvP games are still a rarity. Can you name any other than tonight's that you can remember that you would recommend from this year or last? I can't. I can't think of a single PvP series from last year that stuck in my mind while I can think of at least 10 TvT series that were amazing from just 2013. PvP might be better than it has been in the past but it has a LONG way to go before it's anywhere near as good as some of the other match ups. yes, i can. Rain vs HerO iem cologne | ||
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Vindicare605
United States16129 Posts
Cool we have one series from not even a month ago. Meanwhile I'd recommend literally every single TvP series from that tournament as amazing except for perhaps Innovation vs HerO and even then it was pretty good. That kind of sums up my whole point. PvP DOES have the potential to create good games, but they are so few and far between that the stigma remains. | ||
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bo1b
Australia12814 Posts
On March 12 2014 22:17 Wingblade wrote: How do two or three year old games in entirely different circumstances have any bearing on the amazing PvP that we now have? It's time to let go of those ridiculous stigmas... I don't know man, maybe I'm just being honest and pointing out that bias actually exists within me. I'm sure as hell that you weren't enjoying the many exceptional zvz's that used to happen amongst a sea of shit during infestor/broodlord, and will quite often post about how bad the matchup is, and if you don't then someone else surely will. The occasional fantastic game and series just doesn't make the majority think that the match up on average is good, especially after prolonged exposure to 4gate into turtle + lasers. I'm one of the few people that actually didn't enjoy rain vs parting g1, because the novelty of everything being a mirror just isn't that enjoyable to me. I'm glad you enjoyed it though. | ||
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Fuell
Netherlands3111 Posts
damn, this group overcame my expectations.. especially baffled by that first game of the final match, i'd say the best game this year so far.. | ||
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ffadicted
United States3545 Posts
On March 12 2014 22:24 Vindicare605 wrote: I have watched a lot of PvP this year. Tonight's were some of the only ones I have actually enjoyed watching. The stigma survives because good recommendable PvP games are still a rarity. Can you name any other than tonight's that you can remember that you would recommend from this year or last? I can't. I can't think of a single PvP series from last year that stuck in my mind while I can think of at least 10 TvT series that were amazing from just 2013. PvP might be better than it has been in the past but it has a LONG way to go before it's anywhere near as good as some of the other match ups. IMO it's the best mirror right now | ||
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Vindicare605
United States16129 Posts
There's outliers everywhere, you're clearly one of them. It's hard to dismiss such a wide majority that disagree. | ||
Darkhorse
United States23455 Posts
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Holdenintherye
Canada1441 Posts
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ffadicted
United States3545 Posts
On March 12 2014 23:12 Vindicare605 wrote: There's outliers everywhere, you're clearly one of them. It's hard to dismiss such a wide majority that disagree. Everyone has different opinions, I agree... With that said, I'd hardly call thinking PvP is best mirror is "clearly an outlier". I wouldn't be susprised if many many people agreed, and wouldn't be shocked if that was the majority. You're probably just tired of seeing protoss everywhere, regardless of matchup lol Part of me is too | ||
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Darkhorse
United States23455 Posts
On March 12 2014 23:50 ffadicted wrote: Everyone has different opinions, I agree... With that said, I'd hardly call thinking PvP is best mirror is "clearly an outlier". I wouldn't be susprised if many many people agreed, and wouldn't be shocked if that was the majority. You're probably just tired of seeing protoss everywhere, regardless of matchup lol Part of me is too I think most people can agree that in WoL it was TvT -------->PvP-->ZvZ In HotS it has changed a lot. TvT and PvP are pretty close overall. If you like Protoss you probably enjoy PvP more and if you like Terran you probably enjoy TvT more. ZvZ is still probably the worst in most people's eyes. | ||
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GWdeathscythe
Brazil1091 Posts
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Vindicare605
United States16129 Posts
On March 12 2014 23:50 ffadicted wrote: Everyone has different opinions, I agree... With that said, I'd hardly call thinking PvP is best mirror is "clearly an outlier". I wouldn't be susprised if many many people agreed, and wouldn't be shocked if that was the majority. You're probably just tired of seeing protoss everywhere, regardless of matchup lol Part of me is too I have never liked PvP it has nothing to do with how many Protoss are around. As far as the general majority, it doesn't need much researching to find what is favorable. Go to any live event, watch any stream, watch any Starcraft highlight reel on ANY youtube channel. PvP is followed with less enthusiasm and ZvZ is as well. TvT is the only mirror that consistently provides games that are praised as best of the year or best of all time. It would be hard for me to argue that it wasn't the best mirror even if I wasn't already in love with it. | ||
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Swisslink
2958 Posts
On March 12 2014 23:55 Darkhorse wrote: I think most people can agree that in WoL it was TvT -------->PvP-->ZvZ In HotS it has changed a lot. TvT and PvP are pretty close overall. If you like Protoss you probably enjoy PvP more and if you like Terran you probably enjoy TvT more. ZvZ is still probably the worst in most people's eyes. Well, wouldn't say that in general. The 4-Gate PvP in WoL was probably the most idiotic matchup of all time. It was simply not possible to get a good match, because they were just 4-gating the shit out of each other. Later on we had a rather idiotic ZvZ time - though with insanely good matches like Life vs Leenock. So... at least it was better than the 4-Gate time. TvT was clearly superior And with HotS... I don't know... All of them allow for quite good games - but none of them provides them very often :-P But I can definitely see ZvZ to be rather stupid as a non-Zerg player tbh. But especially Ling/Bane vs Ling/Bane has always been really impressive to me (though really annoying to play as a "normal human being".) :-P | ||
BisuDagger
Bisutopia19400 Posts
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Muffloe
Sweden6061 Posts
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stuchiu
Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
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