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Standard LR thread rules apply. No caster bashing, no insulting the interviewers, no player bashing, no balance whining. Bans will be doled out to violators so don't shit up this thread with immature garbage. |
On October 09 2011 19:03 ypslala wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2011 18:28 Alpina wrote:On October 09 2011 18:22 ypslala wrote:
man what are voidrays good for in PvZ outside of gold diamond master or whatever.
they don't counter mass ling roach, or hydras. even mutas eat them. what are they good for at all? they cost kiwikaki game 1 and 3.
so bad, these 2 guys taking out each other and only one can go on. Thing is Stephano went into pretty much pure hydra which is very uncommon nowadays.. Voids are very good in certain situations.. how can you say they don't counter roach lol? Of course 1 void ray not going to counter 30 roaches but that would be just stupid comparison. the trick is, they dont counter mass ling roach. at least many pros have found that out. mondragon made it popular against cruncher at TSL3 i guess. even if you pump out 5 or 6 v-rays, meanwhile a zerg has 50 speedlings and a ton of roaches ruining your bases. the rest of your army usually is small then, because v-rays are expensive.
That's why you keep few sentries on your ramp to defend vs. roach ling counter attack. Void ray is a multi purpose unit which usually pays for itself.
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somewhere i can find ret vs alive?
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Im watching the kiwikaki stephano game atm. I cant belive the casters go like "OMG HIS CORRUPTORS" when hes at 200/200 and obviously freeing up supply :D
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so sad for mc, getting a pvp, its just still so random. Pretty much ruined tournament for me
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On October 09 2011 18:37 Fushin wrote:
Well void ray are still the best unit to counter mass broodlords which is the usual late game for Stephano.
With the infestor/roach/broodlord army, stalkers are just worthless crap (admittingly they're always crap in late game thanks to awful upgrades stack), and void ray is the best choice, even if it still sucks because Z can macro up tons of corruptor pretty fast.
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right, though i think, blink stalker are still the most cost effective counterunits for broodlord.
and once zerg has broodlord infestor roach and corruptor, zerg has his deathball and its almost unbeatable.
my point was more, for example as a transition from a fast expansion.
if you go void rays only - after a forge fast expand - it can work, but, most of the zerg can handle them easily. some spores, queens, and its all good.
1-2 voidrays supported with a bunch of phoenix makes sense.
On October 09 2011 18:37 Fushin wrote:
If anything, the series with Stephano showed us how powerful zerg end game is versus protoss, Kiwikaki did win game 2, but that was only at the price of an amazing game and some passivity from Stephano. But overall, the unit composition from Stephano was just better.
i agree. Ret once said in his stream, he thinks broodlord infestor corruptor is the strongest deathball in the game. i think kiwi won because he played mothership almost perfectly with all these recalls.
"usually" stephano would have won that. but there was the double vortex at the end winning the game for kiwi. so it was very close.
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The best part of the day was when White-Ra said that Terran is OP. Maybe someone at blizzard was watching...
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On October 09 2011 19:28 Cain0 wrote:
The best part of the day was when White-Ra said that Terran is OP. Maybe someone at blizzard was watching...
White-ra losing there has nothing to do with Terran being OP lol...
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On October 09 2011 19:18 ypslala wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2011 18:37 Fushin wrote:
If anything, the series with Stephano showed us how powerful zerg end game is versus protoss, Kiwikaki did win game 2, but that was only at the price of an amazing game and some passivity from Stephano. But overall, the unit composition from Stephano was just better. i agree. Ret once said in his stream, he thinks broodlord infestor corruptor is the strongest deathball in the game. i think kiwi won because he played mothership almost perfectly with all these recalls. "usually" stephano would have won that. but there was the double vortex at the end winning the game for kiwi. so it was very close.
Honestly, if it wasn't still possible to archon-toilet broodlords (they're kinda slow, so the spread doesn't happen), that battle (and the game) would have gone the other way. But I agree that Stephano's alternating cost-inefficient aggression (the hydra debacle) and extreme passivity (sure, we can split the map) were a bigger issue. Obviously Stephano's really fucking good, but I can't help but think better decision-making could have won that game for him long before the 50 minute mark.
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White-Ra was interviewed earlier in the tournament and he said Toss needs to play greedy or go for a very aggressive all-in to have a chance against Terran. That's why he played greedy (both going for 3rd on time of attack = greedy for protoss).
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On October 09 2011 19:31 sereniity wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2011 19:28 Cain0 wrote:
The best part of the day was when White-Ra said that Terran is OP. Maybe someone at blizzard was watching... White-ra losing there has nothing to do with Terran being OP lol...
White-Ra is a wise man. He speaks the truth.
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Could someone pm me a link to the day 3 vods so that i don't have to read through this and get spoilered, have looked on the justin.tv but maybe they are just not up yet?
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Where is Thorzain vs Spanishiwa ? i really cant find it ><
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On October 09 2011 19:58 chrisnacht wrote:
Where is Thorzain vs Spanishiwa ? i really cant find it ><
Don't think it was casted.
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On October 09 2011 19:31 sereniity wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2011 19:28 Cain0 wrote:
The best part of the day was when White-Ra said that Terran is OP. Maybe someone at blizzard was watching... White-ra losing there has nothing to do with Terran being OP lol...
He said Terran to good.
Which is true but not a reason for his loss.
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Anyone know where exactly is kiwi vs Stephano G2?
Which vod and which minute?
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United Kingdom12065 Posts
On October 09 2011 19:47 xCenasfu wrote:
White-Ra was interviewed earlier in the tournament and he said Toss needs to play greedy or go for a very aggressive all-in to have a chance against Terran. That's why he played greedy (both going for 3rd on time of attack = greedy for protoss).
He may have said that, but there's greedy and then there's doing what he did. He knew that Puma had a large standing army and he was doing some warp prism hurass, so Puma just took the "just go fucking kill him" approach and it worked. Now, if white-ra knew that Puma didn't have an army that would have been fine, but he knew damn well he had loads of units. As I've said, you can be greedy, but that was just far, far, far too greedy.
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Wow didn't think aLive would lose.
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EPT
