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On February 12 2008 13:32 Vharox wrote:
But then again why would he want to stir things up when he almost got off the hook b/c of dragoon's former stupidity?
Indeed, I think we can agree that the saving of the file in .jpeg was not intentional.
What does this mean however? Does it indicate that the original image WAS indeed photoshopped? Does this change our feelings towards Dr.Dragoon?
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On February 12 2008 13:40 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:Show nested quote +On February 12 2008 13:27 Alethios wrote:
Wow... what a huge slip up from shallow.
Though i can suggest an alternative:
Shallow, after being berated for not saving in jpeg last time, subconsciously doesn't make the decision to manually save the file in .png
I'm undecided.
This thread delivers. I seriously don't know how the file being saved in .png proves it was edited. When I went to save the file, I thought for a second before habitually selecting .png, and I just left it as .jpeg.
If you saved it in .png, but don't usually (like the .jpeg photo), it would show that you had gone out of your way to increase the quality of the PM photo, thus it was almost certainly photoshopped.
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On February 12 2008 13:46 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:Show nested quote +On February 12 2008 13:44 Alethios wrote:On February 12 2008 13:40 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:On February 12 2008 13:27 Alethios wrote:
Wow... what a huge slip up from shallow.
Though i can suggest an alternative:
Shallow, after being berated for not saving in jpeg last time, subconsciously doesn't make the decision to manually save the file in .png
I'm undecided.
This thread delivers. I seriously don't know how the file being saved in .png proves it was edited. When I went to save the file, I thought for a second before habitually selecting .png, and I just left it as .jpeg. If you saved it in .png, but don't usually (like the .jpeg photo), it would show that you had gone out of your way to increase the quality of the PM photo, thus it was almost certainly photoshopped. We've already deduced I don't have photoshop on my computer, and I even showed you a SS of my applications TWO MINUTES after I was accused of photoshop. I also honestly didn't know that .png was higher quality (I swear on the soul of Mae Jae Yoon and Shi Ni Seung, if you know me that's pretty damn solid). My friends just assure me that it's better for whatever reason, so I, out of habit, tend to save in that format.
Firstly, Photoshop is hardly the only program you could have used, so really the SS proves nothing. CompuPic for instance would do the job for you. That being said, i'm leaning towards believing you on this one. In a similar position, I would likely have reverted back to .jpeg format.
Casts a spell of doubt over everything however.
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Tracil.
Why use your special lynching power on Dr.Dragoon if he is dying by the end of the day anyway due to the vote? (Kill somebody else, like your political rivals rofl)
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On February 12 2008 14:10 Tracil wrote:
Alethios: I believe the first day is entirely dedicated to voting for the mayor, who THEN selects one person to lynch. The point is really moot; if I lynch a candidate that few people dispute, that puts us in a position to see if he is in fact town or scum when he dies and we find out his alignment, which can then be used as a springboard for future discussion.
Why would I want to kill my political rivals off *after I'm elected*? o-o;
Could somebody confirm this? Are there no mob lynchings on the first day?
Why would you want to kill them? They ran against you. Surely you must see that your authority as mayor must not be questioned. I was joking by the way.
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On February 12 2008 15:33 infinity21 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 12 2008 15:17 Live2Win wrote:On February 12 2008 14:47 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:Another stepped up to Chuiu with a knife in his hand and said "I'll take care of this, he's been a thorn in my side since the day I got here". Chuiu looked up once again to see his executioner, "You're never going to be trusted iaaagh" the knife pierced his throat quickly, in seconds he was dead. The mafioso who killed Chuiu's name started with i. This leaves us with: -ieatkids5 -imDerek -ilovezil -infinity21 The prononciation of "iaaagh" implies that the "i" is clearly pronounced, leaving us with ilovezil, ieatkids5, and imDerek. Chuiu joined teamliquid in 2003, and has been "a thorn in my side since the day I got here". This implies that it has been a long time that Chuiu has been irritating the person in question. The issue arises here that the closest join date was that of ieatkids5, in September 2004. I'm still working out this clue, but I think it places ieatkids5 as a good suspect at this time, with ilovezil and imDerek close behind. [EDIT=Breakthrough] Depending on how Aepplet is pronounced, it could be taken as "i-pplet". Aepplet joined the site in 2003, mere months after Chuiu! [EDIT] wow, great catch right there.... Definately helpful. See, I told you people that I wasn't a mafia. We're a finite simple group of order two~ p.s. be wary of those who lead discussions
Sorry to say it my friend, but this doesn't say anything either way about your mafia status. Firstly we can't assume that the assumption of the pronunciation is correct. Secondly, assuming you aren't the dredge from the clue, doesn't mean you aren't one of the other 13 members.
To be frank, we know one of either shallow or dragoon is lying. This means that one of them is almost certainly from the Cult of Despair. Kill off the most suspicious one first. reassess. then kill off the other if need be.
A presumably better than 50/50 chance of killing a mafioso this evening (before he has the chance to kill one of us off), is highly beneficial to us, and should be taken advantage of.
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On February 12 2008 16:50 Dr.Dragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On February 12 2008 16:21 Tracil wrote:
Firstly, I don't think we'll lose two townies. I still think one of you is lying.
Go ahead, if shallow is mafia, you win. Otherwise, I just laugh. Show nested quote +
Secondly, *if I never try to kill anyone based on the fact that they *might* have a power role of some kind, then I will never be able to support any lynch*.
What I mean is that you should lynch people who are suspected by clues. In day 1, did any part of the passage point to me? There was one that could be pointed to shallow, but it was a stretch. Show nested quote +
Thirdly, we *cannot* just wait for more clues. The mafia gets a whole bunch of kills each night. We get hardly any; they *will* kill townies every night and each and every townie they kill might have a power role of some kind. Conversly, lynching has a chance of hitting mafia, one that can be refined with clues and verbal tells. Killing mafia is the only way we can win the game.
You can work out the math if you want. The chances of you picking a mafia member at random are pretty crappy anyways. Even if you do get one, there's no guarantee of a link either. Show nested quote +
Fourthly, by accusing people and threatening them with death, I can force them to actually speak, rather than continue to go 'hahaha lulz' and make jokes. They'll have to weigh in seriously on various issues and there'll be no way around that; if they refuse to participate, then they're not trying to win for town.
You'll lynch them anyways. Show nested quote +
Point the fifth; if we just sit around and adopt a strategy of 'wait and see', that will allow the mafia to dictate the pace of the game via their own kills. Later in the game, as well, we won't be able to go back and look at discussion that took place near the beginning to see if it has new relevance (e.g. did person x defend person y back then, even though it has now been shown that person y was mafia? were their reasons sound at that time?)
The game is already in the mafia's pace. If I wanted someone to just go around smiting people, I would have voted for FakeSteve. The chances of you finding connected mafia aren't that great either, unless the mafia members play poorly. I'm tired
You aren't convincing anybody. Go to sleep, come up with something better when you aren't as tired perhaps.
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On February 12 2008 20:04 MasterOfChaos wrote:Show nested quote +On February 12 2008 18:57 Live2Win wrote:On February 12 2008 18:39 MasterOfChaos wrote:
You can easily see if a png is saved by paint. Normal pngs are much smaller, whereas paint .pngs are about the size of the bitmap.
But faking screenshots using photoshop is stupid, when you can edit the html, which produces perfect screenshots.
When posting screenshots of teamliquid I'd use png, no loss and as TL has large areas of the same color reasonably small.
btw what is dragoons defence? That he did not send the PM or that he was testing shallow? out of curiosity, how does that work? I just clicked a random pm in my mailbox, hit "view source" and editted the text of the pm. I then saved the .txt to my desktop as .html, and then viewed it in a browser... it shows up parts of TL but most of it has image errors with [x] boxes. Do I need to save the .html in a specific directory for it to look like TLnet? In Opera it's trivial. Just hit view source, edit it, and press Apply Changes.(there is a button on the view source tab) For FF there are extensions for everything, and several webdeveloper extensions allow live changes to the source or DOM-Tree. IE is a bit more difficult, you probably have to fix the imagepaths in the source and photoshop the url(easy to do perfectly using another ie-instance with the correct url). => Never trust Screenshots. On the right the View Souce tab is visible  but I could have closed it before taking the Screenshot.
I see you have xkcd open in a tab. Good man.
Just to let you know, not editing posts is currently in vogue.
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I would advise everybody to keep a list of people that you think are acting suspiciously. Write the name and a small explanation. That way, you can come back to it later, and look over the posts if need be.
I'd also like to get concrete statements regarding the PMs and screenshots from both Shallowbay and Dr.Dragoon.
What happened and in what order?
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FakeSteve, you sure do worry me. I wonder if my earlier assertion that you were the right man for the job was valid. Dr.Dragoon seems to be against you though, so i'm going to go with my prior instinct and stick with you.
Hmmmmm.... he is so very enigmatic at the moment.
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On February 13 2008 11:47 Tracil wrote:
Mayor is indeed a desirable position for the mafia to take and hold. It is no less desirable for a towny to hold it. Saying "One of the mayoral candidates is probably mafia, don't vote for that guy because of that!" is a pretty weird position, because the logic applies just as much to you as to myself.
Frankly, I think you're abusing your position as a 'known' figure within TL.net to encourage people to vote for you without proposing a plan of action or outlining the logic on which you'll use the mayoral powers; in short, you're relying on a cult of personality to get you elected.
Do you have any plans on who you will lynch if you are elected, and how will you use the ability to declare double-lynches?
I have asked for the candidates to make their intentions known. Currently you are the only person to do so.
Also, probably buried now, but could Shallowbay and Dr.Dragoon please step forward and outline in detail your take on the events leading up to and directly after the PM event?
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On reflection, and to provide a counterpoint to Dr.Dragoon.
FakeSteve, despite my assertion earlier, can no longer considered to be a utterly "safe" candidate.
Whats more, Tracil has been the only person to outline his policy (and personally I find it rational and well thought out). This is especially important as candidates who have outlined their policy can be examined to see if they are following it. We can decide whether the mayor is trustworthy or not, depending on whether he follows his policy. This way, if the mayor is a mafia, we will be more likely to notice.
Thus, in these closing hours of the election, I am changing by vote from FakeSteve to Tracil, and I would encourage others to do the same.
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Furthermore, I see Dr.Dragoon's distrust of Tracil as a positive thing.
If a probable mafioso is telling us that another player is "100% mafia", chances are the other player isn't.
Vote Tracil!
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On February 13 2008 12:05 Chuiu wrote:
I will have your night post momentarily.
Don't we get to kill somebody first?
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Sorry to break my vow of non-postage. But I was discussing my death with a friend of mine on msn, and he sent me this link showing that Alethios just got owned. Thought i'd share it with you and wish you all a fun game.
Won't post again, promise.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://img148.imageshack.us/my.php?image=live2winmafiakm1.png)
