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On March 05 2024 04:11 Koshi wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:08 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:07 Koshi wrote:On March 05 2024 02:35 marvellosity wrote:On March 05 2024 02:34 marvellosity wrote:On March 05 2024 02:34 Vivax wrote:On March 05 2024 02:34 marvellosity wrote:
I’m currently not looking outside my mason partners for mayor. Sandro is scummy though He’s townie. He has pursued me in the chat in a very townie way. Also this is dumb. Good info for when you flip town. But now all this is dumb. Whisperer mafia only need to fight 1 townie. While if he posts in the thread he needs to fight 16. Mason stuff is useless. Keep it to yourselves. Eh, let them decide. It is far from shitting up the thread. If that bothers you, you should be shouting me down honestly. It bothers me that marv kinda forced the sandroba read on us because "mason stuff". Really bad going forward to approach it like that.
Ah OK fair point.
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He can't force us to read any particular way but I get what you mean. And it's better than valid.
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On March 05 2024 04:13 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:10 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:08 iamperfection wrote:On March 05 2024 04:07 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:06 iamperfection wrote:On March 05 2024 04:05 Koshi wrote:On March 05 2024 02:33 marvellosity wrote:On March 05 2024 02:32 iamperfection wrote:
I'm inclined to think vivax has to be town. No scum claims like that. I strongly oppose any effort to make him mayor. He already has shown he willing to throw as town we aren't giving him power. I’m inclined to agree I disagree for what it is worth. The guy who gets lynched as blue regulary now claims it to be mayor. Press x for doubt He didn't have any real pressure on him though Does this not strengthen Koshi's point? No how so. Isn't Koshi saying he suspects a fake claim from Vivax? This would be because Vivax is usually very adverse to real claiming, Which implies this is a gambit for mayor. If Vivax wasn't under pressure, that is further evidence it was a gambit for mayor. Where is my comprehension/logic problem? You and Cop are the only ones so far questioning it well knowing I'm a N1 if I don't get the role. It's a waste of energy on your part.
In the post you quoted, I am referring to Koshi doing just that
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On March 05 2024 04:15 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:12 CopCake wrote:On March 05 2024 04:08 Vivax wrote:On March 05 2024 04:06 CopCake wrote:On March 05 2024 04:04 Vivax wrote:
So maybe I just have to accept the fact that if rayn and iamp are actually town like I had in mind earlier, they prefer to annoy the hell out of you instead of actually finding scum and cause a massive unhelpful distraction that makes me reconsider their alignments.
Either way, not helpful.
I still want to kill Trfel. That's where my head is at.
Going to hedge on sandro.
VE/MZ worth looking into more deeply imo.
But Trfel first. I'm not going to repeat the mistake of trying to kill multples. Nah, if you are against Tfrel you have to cross over me. No one touches him. Ok, tell me who I should look into then and I'll tell you if I agree. mz ve, maybe a no posting person like palmar or hapa lol cmon Are you asking me to filter people with no posts. VE/MZ I could see myself agreeing with because mafia is also interested in becoming mayor and they'd be of sufficient calibre.
Fwiw I still town read you m8.
I can still ask people how the logic of others plays out.
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On March 05 2024 04:19 Trfel wrote:Do you think he is mafia?
I'm beginning to wonder.
I can't remember anything but town reads from him and pedantic accusations.
However, that was why I was SR DP and I don't anymore.
And that might be a piss poor rubric, as I have few games with oats.
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On March 05 2024 04:27 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:12 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:11 Koshi wrote:On March 05 2024 04:08 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:07 Koshi wrote:On March 05 2024 02:35 marvellosity wrote:On March 05 2024 02:34 marvellosity wrote:On March 05 2024 02:34 Vivax wrote:On March 05 2024 02:34 marvellosity wrote:
I’m currently not looking outside my mason partners for mayor. Sandro is scummy though He’s townie. He has pursued me in the chat in a very townie way. Also this is dumb. Good info for when you flip town. But now all this is dumb. Whisperer mafia only need to fight 1 townie. While if he posts in the thread he needs to fight 16. Mason stuff is useless. Keep it to yourselves. Eh, let them decide. It is far from shitting up the thread. If that bothers you, you should be shouting me down honestly. It bothers me that marv kinda forced the sandroba read on us because "mason stuff". Really bad going forward to approach it like that. Ah OK fair point. How is this a fair point, koshi isn’t making sense with that post
You must have a different worldview from us.
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On March 05 2024 04:29 Trfel wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:24 Rels wrote:Look at this way of phrasing things, having to come with justification just for his vote
But yes, I am gonna vote my weak scumread because if a wagon starts then I could use the way other players engage with it to start having more reads.
Am I the only one seeing this or what? Honestly it feels a bit weak to me. But he's posted so little it's just hard to say. @Alakaslam, that wasn't really how I would characterise Oatsmaster's play, but I suppose it's up to interpretation.
So how do you?
He just asks "why do you say that" and however honest the reply, just says "that makes no sense" unless it's someone he respects.
Partly, I can get that, but have you NEVER seen aggro scum pursue mislynch opportunities?
What about Oatsmaster's play has been different from that?
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On March 05 2024 04:32 Alakaslam wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:29 Trfel wrote:On March 05 2024 04:24 Rels wrote:Look at this way of phrasing things, having to come with justification just for his vote
But yes, I am gonna vote my weak scumread because if a wagon starts then I could use the way other players engage with it to start having more reads.
Am I the only one seeing this or what? Honestly it feels a bit weak to me. But he's posted so little it's just hard to say. @Alakaslam, that wasn't really how I would characterise Oatsmaster's play, but I suppose it's up to interpretation. So how do you? He just asks "why do you say that" and however honest the reply, just says "that makes no sense" unless it's someone he respects. Partly, I can get that, but have you NEVER seen aggro scum pursue mislynch opportunities? What about Oatsmaster's play has been different from that?
And anything that doesn't make sense- regardless of the player who is inconsistent- means rolled scum.
That's a rubric that doesn't take into account human error.
I could understand if he presented the correct logic.
But he doesn't. He just suspects them and moves on, possibly with an implied ad hom. So... I suspect that play.
What is different that you see from him? I am trying to understand outside my own ego @Trfel
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On March 05 2024 04:34 Trfel wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:32 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:29 Trfel wrote:On March 05 2024 04:24 Rels wrote:Look at this way of phrasing things, having to come with justification just for his vote
But yes, I am gonna vote my weak scumread because if a wagon starts then I could use the way other players engage with it to start having more reads.
Am I the only one seeing this or what? Honestly it feels a bit weak to me. But he's posted so little it's just hard to say. @Alakaslam, that wasn't really how I would characterise Oatsmaster's play, but I suppose it's up to interpretation. So how do you? He just asks "why do you say that" and however honest the reply, just says "that makes no sense" unless it's someone he respects. Partly, I can get that, but have you NEVER seen aggro scum pursue mislynch opportunities? What about Oatsmaster's play has been different from that? To me he's actually seemed to care and is involved. He truly seems interested in his approach, even if that approach is a bit different from mine, it makes me think he is trying to figure out the game.
Caring about what exactly?
Because if he cares to find actual scum, this pursuit of perfection doesn't seem to be a surefire way to me.
He was not far from lynching our cop, for example, for being a bit logically inconsistent- in Oatsmaster's mind.
I think Oats may suffer from some difficulty with theory of mind if he is town here, which I could relate to. In which case I would go right back from a growing SR to a TR.
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On March 05 2024 04:42 iamperfection wrote:
Alright we are getting off track. Humoring vivaxs delusions that he made a good play is a waste of time. You either think he is scum or town for that he did we aren't voting him mayor.
Let's talk about how useless ve has been. He also is running for mayor but his post seems insincere to me. I'm voting him
In light of his absence, I am inclined to start agreeing with you but I have seen him do that as town and there is decent logic for it.
Indeed you have yourself mentioned that people absolutely CAN lurk as scum...
But I know what you mean and could get behind it.
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On March 05 2024 04:43 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:42 iamperfection wrote:
Alright we are getting off track. Humoring vivaxs delusions that he made a good play is a waste of time. You either think he is scum or town for that he did we aren't voting him mayor.
Let's talk about how useless ve has been. He also is running for mayor but his post seems insincere to me. I'm voting him What post?
Just filter him, it's short enough.
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On March 05 2024 04:47 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:27 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:27 Oatsmaster wrote:On March 05 2024 04:12 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:11 Koshi wrote:On March 05 2024 04:08 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:07 Koshi wrote:On March 05 2024 02:35 marvellosity wrote:On March 05 2024 02:34 marvellosity wrote:On March 05 2024 02:34 Vivax wrote:
[quote]
Sandro is scummy though He’s townie. He has pursued me in the chat in a very townie way. Also this is dumb. Good info for when you flip town. But now all this is dumb. Whisperer mafia only need to fight 1 townie. While if he posts in the thread he needs to fight 16. Mason stuff is useless. Keep it to yourselves. Eh, let them decide. It is far from shitting up the thread. If that bothers you, you should be shouting me down honestly. It bothers me that marv kinda forced the sandroba read on us because "mason stuff". Really bad going forward to approach it like that. Ah OK fair point. How is this a fair point, koshi isn’t making sense with that post You must have a different worldview from us. Can you explain the point he’s making in your own words
Marv insisted without much elaboration on WHY that we should townread Sandroba based on faith in Marv's word and integrity alone, on day 1.
Koshi is not a fan of that noise.
Are you?
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On March 05 2024 04:51 Alakaslam wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:47 Oatsmaster wrote:On March 05 2024 04:27 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:27 Oatsmaster wrote:On March 05 2024 04:12 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:11 Koshi wrote:On March 05 2024 04:08 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:07 Koshi wrote:On March 05 2024 02:35 marvellosity wrote:On March 05 2024 02:34 marvellosity wrote:
[quote]
He’s townie. He has pursued me in the chat in a very townie way. Also this is dumb. Good info for when you flip town. But now all this is dumb. Whisperer mafia only need to fight 1 townie. While if he posts in the thread he needs to fight 16. Mason stuff is useless. Keep it to yourselves. Eh, let them decide. It is far from shitting up the thread. If that bothers you, you should be shouting me down honestly. It bothers me that marv kinda forced the sandroba read on us because "mason stuff". Really bad going forward to approach it like that. Ah OK fair point. How is this a fair point, koshi isn’t making sense with that post You must have a different worldview from us. Can you explain the point he’s making in your own words Marv insisted without much elaboration on WHY that we should townread Sandroba based on faith in Marv's word and integrity alone, on day 1. Koshi is not a fan of that noise. Are you?
By the way, if you are, we agree.
I will explain how that could be if it confuses you.
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On March 05 2024 04:48 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:28 Vivax wrote:
Of course the player with the strongest role should be mayor.
Is that even debatable Yes actually considering how the fuck are you supposed to use your “strongest” role now
On March 05 2024 04:47 Trfel wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:38 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:34 Trfel wrote:On March 05 2024 04:32 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:29 Trfel wrote:On March 05 2024 04:24 Rels wrote:Look at this way of phrasing things, having to come with justification just for his vote
But yes, I am gonna vote my weak scumread because if a wagon starts then I could use the way other players engage with it to start having more reads.
Am I the only one seeing this or what? Honestly it feels a bit weak to me. But he's posted so little it's just hard to say. @Alakaslam, that wasn't really how I would characterise Oatsmaster's play, but I suppose it's up to interpretation. So how do you? He just asks "why do you say that" and however honest the reply, just says "that makes no sense" unless it's someone he respects. Partly, I can get that, but have you NEVER seen aggro scum pursue mislynch opportunities? What about Oatsmaster's play has been different from that? To me he's actually seemed to care and is involved. He truly seems interested in his approach, even if that approach is a bit different from mine, it makes me think he is trying to figure out the game. Caring about what exactly? Because if he cares to find actual scum, this pursuit of perfection doesn't seem to be a surefire way to me. He was not far from lynching our cop, for example, for being a bit logically inconsistent- in Oatsmaster's mind. I think Oats may suffer from some difficulty with theory of mind if he is town here, which I could relate to. In which case I would go right back from a growing SR to a TR. I'm not confident enough in my read to be interested in defending Oatsmaster here, it's just the impression I got from his posts, which could be wrong. I will say though that whether or not his play is helpful doesn't matter as much as whether or not he truly thinks it is helpful.
These in conjunction are enough for me. Gonna work with Oats where able then. Because I effort can see a world where this is genuine from him too.
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On March 05 2024 05:02 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:42 Rels wrote:
BTW I also think Vivax' claim was kind of stupid, but now that it's done, he 100% should be the mayor I agree with this.
On March 05 2024 04:48 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:28 Vivax wrote:
Of course the player with the strongest role should be mayor.
Is that even debatable Yes actually considering how the fuck are you supposed to use your “strongest” role now
@DarthPunk
How do you answer Oats here then?
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On March 05 2024 05:07 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:50 raynpelikoneet wrote:On March 05 2024 04:31 Vivax wrote:On March 05 2024 04:29 raynpelikoneet wrote:On March 05 2024 04:23 Vivax wrote:On March 05 2024 04:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:On March 05 2024 04:19 die_meatbaby wrote:On March 05 2024 04:10 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:08 iamperfection wrote:On March 05 2024 04:07 Alakaslam wrote:
[quote]
Does this not strengthen Koshi's point? No how so. Isn't Koshi saying he suspects a fake claim from Vivax? This would be because Vivax is usually very adverse to real claiming, Which implies this is a gambit for mayor. If Vivax wasn't under pressure, that is further evidence it was a gambit for mayor. Where is my comprehension/logic problem? He is not fake claiming thats not what he would do. As I already know fake claiming always be exposed at some point and as he loves to play here on TL he would not risk a fake claim as scum and risking an early lynch. Just feels so wrong and it would be not comparable with any game I habe read of him. Maybe he is Town and claims so we get a town mayor but even that doesn´t seem like his meta Why would Vivax think we don't get town mayor as he thinks i am town? Correction: I currently think you are town. But I know I'm town. Yes but how does DMB come to conclusion that while you thinking i am town, you need to claim to have a town mayor? Because for me that seems like an insane thought process. No it's clear rationality. How do you protect the role that can't protect itself but other players? You make it mayor. They have to kill three randomly selected BGS before they can NK me. If we get the roleblocker I become a jailkeeper with medic protection. It's honestly mind boggling I have to explain. I understand your point. I really do. It just hinges on us getting the roleblocker where there is no guarantee on. Otherwise none of this matters because most likely there is nothing else to roleblock than you.... I don't usually live long as town. There is perhaps some logic to that. I am not sure if you know this but i am 11/4 in LYLO (let it be F-3, F-5, or F-7) situations. From those games, one is where i had the correct read and i just couldnt for my life convince Oats to vote for VA over me even when the mafia dude was voting for Oats (lol). One i got right but i still consider it a loss, because i think Art/rsoul slot cheated to get me townread them and DP was mafia (RSM2). So basically i am really fucking good when i live long enough. I just: 1) dont get to live long enough 2) dont have enough "decent people" around long enough Both of these can be avoided this game, (2) naturally and (1) by making me a mayor. I have never been lynched in LYLO as town, have you? Does it tell you anything about how you/me look to other people and who is more trusthworthy (if we assume we have good reads -- as i legit know you DO have good reads most of the time, later on in the game)? The only other player i would genuinely say is on par or even perhaps better than i am late game as town is marv. I have a 90% winrate in endgames bro.
As town? Do you get to endgame as town often enough to be statistically significant?
I don't disagree though. You're worth keeping around.
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On March 05 2024 05:15 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 04:51 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:47 Oatsmaster wrote:On March 05 2024 04:27 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:27 Oatsmaster wrote:On March 05 2024 04:12 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:11 Koshi wrote:On March 05 2024 04:08 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 04:07 Koshi wrote:On March 05 2024 02:35 marvellosity wrote:
[quote]
He has pursued me in the chat in a very townie way. Also this is dumb. Good info for when you flip town. But now all this is dumb. Whisperer mafia only need to fight 1 townie. While if he posts in the thread he needs to fight 16. Mason stuff is useless. Keep it to yourselves. Eh, let them decide. It is far from shitting up the thread. If that bothers you, you should be shouting me down honestly. It bothers me that marv kinda forced the sandroba read on us because "mason stuff". Really bad going forward to approach it like that. Ah OK fair point. How is this a fair point, koshi isn’t making sense with that post You must have a different worldview from us. Can you explain the point he’s making in your own words Marv insisted without much elaboration on WHY that we should townread Sandroba based on faith in Marv's word and integrity alone, on day 1. Koshi is not a fan of that noise. Are you? That’s not what marv said though, which is the entire point I’m making
Ok marv implied it. He said Sandroba is townie, directly after someone said he was scummy.
I can get that, and also think Marv has a point.
That is how we agree fwiw.
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On March 05 2024 05:16 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2024 05:10 Alakaslam wrote:On March 05 2024 05:07 DarthPunk wrote:On March 05 2024 04:50 raynpelikoneet wrote:On March 05 2024 04:31 Vivax wrote:On March 05 2024 04:29 raynpelikoneet wrote:On March 05 2024 04:23 Vivax wrote:On March 05 2024 04:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:On March 05 2024 04:19 die_meatbaby wrote:On March 05 2024 04:10 Alakaslam wrote:
[quote]
Isn't Koshi saying he suspects a fake claim from Vivax?
This would be because Vivax is usually very adverse to real claiming,
Which implies this is a gambit for mayor.
If Vivax wasn't under pressure, that is further evidence it was a gambit for mayor.
Where is my comprehension/logic problem? He is not fake claiming thats not what he would do. As I already know fake claiming always be exposed at some point and as he loves to play here on TL he would not risk a fake claim as scum and risking an early lynch. Just feels so wrong and it would be not comparable with any game I habe read of him. Maybe he is Town and claims so we get a town mayor but even that doesn´t seem like his meta Why would Vivax think we don't get town mayor as he thinks i am town? Correction: I currently think you are town. But I know I'm town. Yes but how does DMB come to conclusion that while you thinking i am town, you need to claim to have a town mayor? Because for me that seems like an insane thought process. No it's clear rationality. How do you protect the role that can't protect itself but other players? You make it mayor. They have to kill three randomly selected BGS before they can NK me. If we get the roleblocker I become a jailkeeper with medic protection. It's honestly mind boggling I have to explain. I understand your point. I really do. It just hinges on us getting the roleblocker where there is no guarantee on. Otherwise none of this matters because most likely there is nothing else to roleblock than you.... I don't usually live long as town. There is perhaps some logic to that. I am not sure if you know this but i am 11/4 in LYLO (let it be F-3, F-5, or F-7) situations. From those games, one is where i had the correct read and i just couldnt for my life convince Oats to vote for VA over me even when the mafia dude was voting for Oats (lol). One i got right but i still consider it a loss, because i think Art/rsoul slot cheated to get me townread them and DP was mafia (RSM2). So basically i am really fucking good when i live long enough. I just: 1) dont get to live long enough 2) dont have enough "decent people" around long enough Both of these can be avoided this game, (2) naturally and (1) by making me a mayor. I have never been lynched in LYLO as town, have you? Does it tell you anything about how you/me look to other people and who is more trusthworthy (if we assume we have good reads -- as i legit know you DO have good reads most of the time, later on in the game)? The only other player i would genuinely say is on par or even perhaps better than i am late game as town is marv. I have a 90% winrate in endgames bro. As town? Do you get to endgame as town often enough to be statistically significant? I don't disagree though. You're worth keeping around. Yes as town. And yes I tend to survive, cause for whatever reason mafia tend to think iI’m a good mislynch candidate. I have a lot better record as town than as mafia. Even though apparently everyone is afraid of my scum play.
Deservedly so. I believe you on this.
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95
EPT
