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TL Endures Mafia II - Page 2

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marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 17:35 GMT
#1364
15 pages to go and I’m going to workout. So will continue to read the rest in between sets. Just finished d1 lynch and it was all a bit sad.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 17:42 GMT
#1366
I really thought DP had a good shot of being mafia for quite a while when reading, he seemed more ‘together’ than last game and I’d generally characterise that as him being more likely mafia than town.

But if he is maf he did an exceptionally good job at ‘caring’ about the lynch. Makes it a lot a lot less likely
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 17:43 GMT
#1367
Think I’m missing something with the Slam townreads as I can’t differentiate his play so much from last game so far.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 17:45 GMT
#1369
On June 13 2023 02:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 13 2023 02:43 marvellosity wrote:
Think I’m missing something with the Slam townreads as I can’t differentiate his play so much from last game so far.

Short answer from my part would be he seems more "happy" than last game.

Doesn’t feel like much?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 18:29 GMT
#1376
On June 13 2023 03:23 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Whoever said MZ is town because he cared about the lynch, is not making a very good read. MZ's targets were LS and Vayoletta. We know Ls is like 99% blue, so unless MZ is mafia with Vayoletta, this is very safe thing to do to "look like caring" when noone is on the line from mafia team -- and multiple people had even said they are not up for policy lynch.

Show nested quote +
On June 11 2023 10:41 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
On June 11 2023 10:41 Hapahauli wrote:
I really dislike that this game is just a shadow of the previous game. Feels like i'm just missing half my brain.

Well we've got 15 minutes, DMB, DP, Vayoletta, or LS.

Show nested quote +
On June 11 2023 10:48 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
On June 11 2023 10:42 TankTopTiger wrote:
Not gonna lie, having good town activity does actually make policy more appealing. But no I value the early information over it. If we policy, we're only getting the info mafia want us to have.

I am open to lynches on DMB, CC, and LS. Possibly Slam or Vivax too but unless someone makes a banger case in the next 10 minutes I'd have no conviction for it.

I would rather policy. Worst thing that happens is Vayoletta flips town. If we don't policy, Vayoletta gets modkilled and we potentially mislynch a townie and lose 2 instead of worst case scenario 1.

In between here LS claims.
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2023 10:49 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
LS... sigh. OK doubling down on a policy now

Now what is this?? His other lynch target drops a blue claim so he STARTS DOUBTING the only viable lynch in his mind ?????? Or is there something i am misreading in this post lol?

You have stolen my thoughts on MZ around the lynch
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 19:09 GMT
#1385
I’ve finished reading. Game isn’t very clear to me but I will post my thoughts after dinner.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 19:10 GMT
#1386
Can’t believe after so long not having played with Hapa I basically didn’t get to play with him. I blame him.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 20:24 GMT
#1389
So:
LS - town, uncounterclaimed tracker, longer filter in less than half the time of last game. Emotionally congruent?

DP/Vivax - townreads to a lesser extent. I don’t really know what Vivax is on and my brain hurts, so likely town. DP has been the town leader (sort of in rayn’s absence a little), I didn’t understand why he was getting votes d1. Good play around the lynch. Read on Copcake feels genuine.

The rest is where it gets tricky.

Slam and Chez both seem to be playing similarly to last game. What that means for their alignment this game is anyone’s guess.

TTT’s play also has a lot of similarities to last game and at some point I thought he was pretty town for it. There’s something around how he’s treating Copcake this game vs me last game that I find suspicious though. Apparently last game he was happy to tunnel me to shit and tell me how poorly I was playing if town, seemingly purely based on his interpretation of other people’s interpretation of my play (?!). This game where he apparently has legit in game reasons to scumread CC, the tunnel is way more… gentle. Feels a marked difference. Something about the Hapa kill too (yes wifom)

rayn said plenty of smart things as usual and he’s had some pretty strong townreads from a couple of people (sort of blurring into one after a big read). But I’m not ready for that read yet, he is less town leadery than I would expect, a little more passive. I’m not ready to do much about it today, because he’s missing Koshi to bounce off and he’s been missing me to bounce off too. So it might all be nothing. But it might be something

Copcake I read as somewhat town for holding up to the pressure early game. I did agree with whoever said that there is a lack of alignment-finding-out-ness about her play, but then I think about some of my past games when I’ve been under a lot of pressure and I sometimes fall into the trap of just defending, defending, defending.

Vayo, bleh. Could obviously easily be mafia, probs in the same way some/all of you think I might be mafia in this spot.

MZ… I don’t disagree with the general analysis that MZ’s play feels similar to last game. But, ya know, townplay thay gets you lynched d1 (sorry about that) isn’t terribly hard to mimic either. I agree very much with what rayn said about MZ at the lynch. As an aside, I read a bunch of his past games last game, and he does just seem to be more aggressive now than he used to be.

Tldr; tomorrow I need to filter the bottom 3, and I need to interact more with the two above that.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 20:37 GMT
#1392
Just think this is all in your wheelhouse as maf, rayn.

Assuming you are town here, obvs this is my fault for not being here to talk to you, which is where I normally derive my strong reads on you from.

All I can say is I read about 40 pages in one go and DP stood out to me as a bigger driver than you (although you got your lynch!)
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 20:39 GMT
#1393
On June 13 2023 05:36 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I can legit tell you two things why i am not mafia.
DP is alive and Hapa is dead.

Pish
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 20:40 GMT
#1395
On June 13 2023 05:40 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 13 2023 05:36 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I can legit tell you two things why i am not mafia.
DP is alive and Hapa is dead.


Maybe we should lynch him then lol.

I‘m currently genuinely unwilling of looking at Slam/Chez as a team.

It would be tremendously tricky if they were.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 20:54 GMT
#1399
On June 13 2023 05:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Does nobody really see all the problems in this post?
Show nested quote +
On June 12 2023 22:27 TankTopTiger wrote:
Okay this is just going to go on forever with you getting more and more pedantic, and we're still a way off lynch anyway.

The case is:
+ CC made a blind read on Rayn early and based her worldview off it
+ CC is not paranoid when she should be
+ CC is tunneling with confidence she didn't express last game until much later
+ CC hasn't pushed anybody but the people that question her (OMGUS)

I'm gonna leave it here for now unless you have anything but nitpicks and telling me to read entire other games when I'm struggling to keep up with this one.

I'm gonna write this whole thing open in like 7 hrs when i get home but i believe this is purely and utterly 100% mafia post.

100% is super high, so my curiosity is piqued
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 20:59 GMT
#1404
On June 13 2023 05:55 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 13 2023 05:54 marvellosity wrote:
On June 13 2023 05:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Does nobody really see all the problems in this post?
On June 12 2023 22:27 TankTopTiger wrote:
Okay this is just going to go on forever with you getting more and more pedantic, and we're still a way off lynch anyway.

The case is:
+ CC made a blind read on Rayn early and based her worldview off it
+ CC is not paranoid when she should be
+ CC is tunneling with confidence she didn't express last game until much later
+ CC hasn't pushed anybody but the people that question her (OMGUS)

I'm gonna leave it here for now unless you have anything but nitpicks and telling me to read entire other games when I'm struggling to keep up with this one.

I'm gonna write this whole thing open in like 7 hrs when i get home but i believe this is purely and utterly 100% mafia post.

100% is super high, so my curiosity is piqued

You'll have to wait until tomorrow morning though, since i need to work too, and it's gonna take time to put everything together.

It’s my bedtime imminently anyway, long day at work also and trying to read 800 posts in a go. Really does not give the same feel as playing along in real time… D:
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 20:59 GMT
#1405
On June 13 2023 05:56 CopCake wrote:
Btw Vayoletta have you caught up?


Pls
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 21:07 GMT
#1410
DP, I understand what you’re saying about Copcake and the aggression, but defence -> offence is all part of the same emotional sweep.

I don’t want to lynch rayn either. There’s just a high threshold for me to townread a player like rayn (ie one that thinks similarly to me). So it’s either a pretty hard townread or I’m a wary marv.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 12 2023 21:09 GMT
#1412
I would be offended but tbh it’s at least somewhat valid, which I’m a bit ashamed about
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 13 2023 06:38 GMT
#1511
On June 13 2023 11:38 raynpelikoneet wrote:
My biggest fear is that both of you and marv are mafia. It's not impossible given how marv treats you <-> me. I don't understand how you are "more townie" than i am, since we have had basically same reads aside from Cake. You having been more "thread boss" shouldn't mean shit.

Not nice when the boot is on the other foot, is it?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 13 2023 06:40 GMT
#1512
On June 13 2023 12:48 Chezinu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 13 2023 12:37 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
Does this post agree with itself TTT?

On June 12 2023 12:42 TankTopTiger wrote:
A bit disorganised at this point, reading through all the posts since #30 atm, I'm up to #53 so I'm biased towards happenings within that frame.

I just spent a lot of time inside my head on you DP. Real spooky. I thought that a red DP would see the difference between DMB last game and this game, and know it meant blue. Then they could lead the mislynch, but have meta from previous game on leading mislynches. Bonus points for backing away from it at the last minute by reading them green (ad lib). But it was Rayn that pointed you in that direction, so that play doesn't work out unless redDP is very fortunate and just had this play fall into his lap (I don't think Rayn's suggestion was red at all). There were some other things. Your reactions have felt artificial twice to me - one was in response to CC, can't remember the other. You being onboard with policy feels irrational but I'm not actually sure on your position on that and WW may have softened you up.
But overall it's too much reach, so I'm back to treating you as green based on the overall pro-townliness of your play. Your read on me is exactly what I would expect and I can't argue against it. I'm not as engaged in poor information environments.

Rayn is green.

LS is weird because I think he decided at the start of the game that he was going to play differently and so my main reason for giving him the benefit of the doubt feels artificial. Someone said at some point that he feels very in the moment and I agree with that. He also seems to come across as artificial whenever he thinks he should be providing an anger response (congruent with autism claim). So I sort of just want to leave him and see where he takes it for now.

I still see CC as red. I don't really want to engage with her because she counter-tunnels and shits up the thread leaving everyone confused. I don't think there's anything she could say that would change my mind, but she also hasn't really done anything since that alleviates or intensifies my suspicion. The read is stale but it's still my firmest read.

Overall, I think town have been eating town a lot, but also in many directions. This sort of environment is something I wanted at the start of the game (not the TvT thing, but the diversity of opinions thing as opposed to last game which felt sychophantic to me from many). This pushes me in the direction of thinking that mafia are more passive, so toward Vayo, Marv, and Slam.


You said CC is stale but how is it your firmest read when you say you're thinking mafia are more passive?

Let's put all the policy lynch stuff from D1 aside, would you vote Vayoletta today after the last 36+ hours of thread progression?

On June 12 2023 16:07 TankTopTiger wrote:
On June 11 2023 03:33 Vivax wrote:
Probably town:

- Hapa (attitude mostly, like a talking rock that sprouts among the waves woosh)
- Marv (decent followup to bugs bunny intro, aligns with Hapa in some aspects)
- Rayn (I don't think he'd scumread Chez for his vote on me as mafia and would rather go along with it comes to mind as a reason)
- LS (Christmas tree salience recycled first post + I kind of agree with Slam on his initial analysis at this point.I think he'd have folded and fell over by now as scum)
- Vayo (weird gut reason, seems familiar idk how)
- Cop (tonally seems like annoyed town to me also #hashtag has me pocketed so congratz if scum)

Not sure, could murder:

Chezinu, Slam, DMB, MZ

Want to murder:

DP, TTT


How did you have reads on Marv or Vayo? These seem like really weak reasons to give someone town points.

Ok I don't disagree with you.

Your posts are structurally almost identical to the last game but something still feels a little off to me and I think it's because you're still stuck on CopCake who I've been mostly green on so far and I feel like you're dancing around calling vayoletta scum even though you were one of the leading reasons that lynch never got off the ground. I think if you spent more time on your other reads and less time on CC I'd be more inclined to townread you again but until then it feels like you're using the CC tunnel to deflect/avoid other reads.

I don't think I want to lynch you today. I want you to help me lynch Vayoletta


This is the way.

Lylo obsessed
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 13 2023 06:43 GMT
#1513
On June 13 2023 11:39 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Also his Vivax read sounds like "i wanna say vivax is town but don't listen to Vivax just pls ignore him".

You may have a more developed relationship with a town Vivax than I ever had. Possibly in the time after I stopped playing.

If someone is in my top 3 town then I would expect to give their opinions some weight though (he says eyeing the vote on me…)
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 13 2023 06:46 GMT
#1517
What did I say last game about Vivax? Something about tone and not lynching d1?

Genuinely asking, my memory is terrible.

Anyway let me read your case in peace before I get up for work
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
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