EPTOn March 27 2020 10:01 LightningStrike wrote:
I wasn't exactly sheeping you I had the same reaction as you and you voting him I thought we could push him? I still thought he was scum until his first post on his return on DMA.
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2020 09:57 GlowingBear wrote:
I agree with your points of how to analyze people as being Mafia. However, I don't believe Mafia, especially Kelsier, would play like this. I also believe his posts could come from a townie perspective.
I don't believe he was discrediting, I believe he was fleshing out opinions on what he thinks about peoples assumption. I do this all the time as town.
I don't believe that him disagreeing with your case but still willing to lynch Sentinel is alignment indicative. He can think your cause is bad while still wanting to lynch a lurker. Again, I do this all the time as town.
I think we should consider the reality of the thread. Town is very disorganized at this point. So Mafia don't really need to do anything. At this point, I would expect Mafia to just stay on the background just to see town destroying themselves. That means they won't make any commitments, they will not push anything, they will at most sheep people. In that sense, I find LS's sheep on me much more suspicious. When I dropped the push, he kept thinking you're scum. But he was sheeping me, so... ?
Trfel is the other one who isn't having strong stances at all. Why not?
Holyflare, especially in a game with two Mafia, I believe they will play a very safe game. That's not what Kelsier was doing.
On March 26 2020 14:01 Holyflare wrote:
I've evolved as a player. I see far beyond what normal players see and I can extrapolate things from a meta-analysis of this game.
Mafia have three main objectives:
The game relies on mafia making mistakes and outing themselves through having perfect knowledge and being unable to think and type with the naivety that a townie has. This leads to the following main problems:
1.They know that fundamentally all cases against townies are bad.
2.They know that all cases against mafia are good (or poorly explained but correct) but they need to discredit them or downplay them.
3.They have to jump on cases on townies that they know are fundamentally bad.
Kelsier is textbook mafia in this situation, regardless of Sentinel's townieness or mafia-ness. Kelsier's last posts are the hallmark of every mafia player with perfect information. It hits point 2 and 3 to a tee.
There is a fundamental disconnect between the information presented to Kelsier in the thread and his logical assumptions and progressions. In Kelsier's opinion, the case on Sentinel is bad but the case is majoritively based on the assumption that while being present in the thread and having the ability to post for the first 6 hours he has contributed nothing and his entries were unfunny.
Kelsier's current mindset if town: I have seen a case based on Sentinel doing nothing and I think it is terrible.
Then he follows up with a goodnight post (bolded for brevity) that he outlines "Sentinel hasn't done shit so I would lynch him anyway".
Kelsier's current mindset if town: ??????
Kelsier's mindset as mafia: The case on Sentinel is the only one in the thread so far, I need to find a reason to hop on it and he's doing nothing so he's easy to get rid of and put a vote on.
These points are irrespective of the rest of his filter. Remember the mafia tenets I mentioned earlier? Mafia has perfect information, they know that all cases on townies are bad and have to "reason" out their reads. His filter is full of discrediting people's opinions for almost no reasons.
Mafia has perfect information and it's a beginner mafia mistake to town read people freely for bad reasons and also out yourself by arguing against OK-ish points (remember mafia tenet number 1?). Again, Kelsier's filter is littered with these.
Discredits a read for no reason. Makes no conclusions.
Jumps on giving a free town read to Vivax even though this is not his meta.
Discredits read on GB. This is all discrediting reads.
Says absolutely nothing about Rels again. Says he'd give him credit but also contradicts the credit right at the end of the point. The post amounts to nothing.
To surmise, Kelsier is following all tenets of playing as mafia. He is playing destructively, rather than constructively with his perfect information (he discredits town reads people are giving frequently). He discredits the Sentinel push while meekly saying he'd join it right after. Kelsier has perfect information and is mafia.
On March 26 2020 12:57 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
For saying the wagon on me is bleh? I think it's too early in the game for that to be a scum read
On March 26 2020 12:49 Holyflare wrote:
If you are town, Sentinel, you should be voting for Kelsier because he would be confirmed mafia.
If you are town, Sentinel, you should be voting for Kelsier because he would be confirmed mafia.
For saying the wagon on me is bleh? I think it's too early in the game for that to be a scum read
On March 26 2020 13:36 Rels wrote:
and please explain why KSC should be conf scum in Sent POV
and please explain why KSC should be conf scum in Sent POV
I've evolved as a player. I see far beyond what normal players see and I can extrapolate things from a meta-analysis of this game.
Mafia have three main objectives:
- Blend
- Sew discontent
- Survive
The game relies on mafia making mistakes and outing themselves through having perfect knowledge and being unable to think and type with the naivety that a townie has. This leads to the following main problems:
1.They know that fundamentally all cases against townies are bad.
2.They know that all cases against mafia are good (or poorly explained but correct) but they need to discredit them or downplay them.
3.They have to jump on cases on townies that they know are fundamentally bad.
Kelsier is textbook mafia in this situation, regardless of Sentinel's townieness or mafia-ness. Kelsier's last posts are the hallmark of every mafia player with perfect information. It hits point 2 and 3 to a tee.
On March 26 2020 08:15 KelsierSC wrote:
I think the push on sentinel blows a fat cock but I want to see who else jumps on it and pretends its a good case.
On March 26 2020 08:13 LightningStrike wrote:
We can agree to disagree on the last part only. Is there anything else you want to talk about?
On March 26 2020 08:10 KelsierSC wrote:
The only thing i'd give Rels credit for is he seemed to make an effort to understand all the nonsense chez posted and the resulting discussion. I just ignored all of that tbh. Rest of his play has been weak.
On March 26 2020 07:52 LightningStrike wrote:
Good point but GB is usually more jokey as town than scum especially doesn't do these type of pushes this early as scum like in Battle of the Drams. Rels I can see your argument but I been liking his responses so far just want to see him push the game more.
On March 26 2020 07:48 KelsierSC wrote:
Feels like it is way to early to make reads like that, GB posted some random stuff and GIFS in the first page, it's not exactly a hard mimic. There is no way the Rels push was anything real at all, you should know that tbh so his reponse is pretty null aswell.
Bad reads.
On March 26 2020 07:37 LightningStrike wrote:
GB is town because of his attitude which I don't think he can fake as mafia. Rels is town because he responded well to GB's push I thought at least.
On March 26 2020 07:09 KelsierSC wrote:
[quote]
Guess you could fill me in on why GB is town and why Rels is town?
[quote]
Guess you could fill me in on why GB is town and why Rels is town?
GB is town because of his attitude which I don't think he can fake as mafia. Rels is town because he responded well to GB's push I thought at least.
Feels like it is way to early to make reads like that, GB posted some random stuff and GIFS in the first page, it's not exactly a hard mimic. There is no way the Rels push was anything real at all, you should know that tbh so his reponse is pretty null aswell.
Bad reads.
Good point but GB is usually more jokey as town than scum especially doesn't do these type of pushes this early as scum like in Battle of the Drams. Rels I can see your argument but I been liking his responses so far just want to see him push the game more.
The only thing i'd give Rels credit for is he seemed to make an effort to understand all the nonsense chez posted and the resulting discussion. I just ignored all of that tbh. Rest of his play has been weak.
We can agree to disagree on the last part only. Is there anything else you want to talk about?
I think the push on sentinel blows a fat cock but I want to see who else jumps on it and pretends its a good case.
On March 26 2020 08:26 KelsierSC wrote:
Apparently I have to go to work tomorrow ( I don't as i'm not a key worker but my boss is a fuckhead )
going to sleep now but I will probably be posting from my office with the door closed. I think LS and vivax are pretty town. vivax because he has posted.
LS because the interaction felt ok and if I recall he is a fan of outrageous reads.
no one else has been impressive, would lynch chez because he gives me a headache.
the push on sentinel is bleh however he hasn't done shit so I would lynch him anyway , but I don't like listening to HF about anything. I operate in a no bully zone.
Apparently I have to go to work tomorrow ( I don't as i'm not a key worker but my boss is a fuckhead )
going to sleep now but I will probably be posting from my office with the door closed. I think LS and vivax are pretty town. vivax because he has posted.
LS because the interaction felt ok and if I recall he is a fan of outrageous reads.
no one else has been impressive, would lynch chez because he gives me a headache.
the push on sentinel is bleh however he hasn't done shit so I would lynch him anyway , but I don't like listening to HF about anything. I operate in a no bully zone.
There is a fundamental disconnect between the information presented to Kelsier in the thread and his logical assumptions and progressions. In Kelsier's opinion, the case on Sentinel is bad but the case is majoritively based on the assumption that while being present in the thread and having the ability to post for the first 6 hours he has contributed nothing and his entries were unfunny.
Kelsier's current mindset if town: I have seen a case based on Sentinel doing nothing and I think it is terrible.
Then he follows up with a goodnight post (bolded for brevity) that he outlines "Sentinel hasn't done shit so I would lynch him anyway".
Kelsier's current mindset if town: ??????
Kelsier's mindset as mafia: The case on Sentinel is the only one in the thread so far, I need to find a reason to hop on it and he's doing nothing so he's easy to get rid of and put a vote on.
These points are irrespective of the rest of his filter. Remember the mafia tenets I mentioned earlier? Mafia has perfect information, they know that all cases on townies are bad and have to "reason" out their reads. His filter is full of discrediting people's opinions for almost no reasons.
Mafia has perfect information and it's a beginner mafia mistake to town read people freely for bad reasons and also out yourself by arguing against OK-ish points (remember mafia tenet number 1?). Again, Kelsier's filter is littered with these.
On March 26 2020 04:25 KelsierSC wrote:
you agree it's scummy to check the day post when a game starts?
lul x2
On March 26 2020 04:15 LightningStrike wrote:
Made me laugh but I do agree with your logic at least.
On March 26 2020 04:04 Vivax wrote:
This is slightly scummy because after the game started he decided to read the setup before posting.
On March 26 2020 03:59 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
fixed
On March 26 2020 03:03 Fecalfeast wrote:
The exact roles in this game are as follows:
Antivaxxer
Coughing Boomer
American Doctor
8x Healthy Boomer
Setup Information
The exact roles in this game are as follows:
Antivaxxer
Coughing Boomer
American Doctor
8x Healthy Boomer
fixed
This is slightly scummy because after the game started he decided to read the setup before posting.
Made me laugh but I do agree with your logic at least.
you agree it's scummy to check the day post when a game starts?
lul x2
Discredits a read for no reason. Makes no conclusions.
On March 26 2020 06:59 KelsierSC wrote:
last thing I remember is he is AFK as fuck as mafia, so not a bad read.
On March 26 2020 06:25 Trfel wrote:
Hi all, thanks for being willing to help me out of my boredom and nothingness and play some mafia!
I'm pretty happy with Vivax as town, no?
Hi all, thanks for being willing to help me out of my boredom and nothingness and play some mafia!
I'm pretty happy with Vivax as town, no?
last thing I remember is he is AFK as fuck as mafia, so not a bad read.
Jumps on giving a free town read to Vivax even though this is not his meta.
On March 26 2020 07:48 KelsierSC wrote:
Feels like it is way to early to make reads like that, GB posted some random stuff and GIFS in the first page, it's not exactly a hard mimic. There is no way the Rels push was anything real at all, you should know that tbh so his reponse is pretty null aswell.
Bad reads.
On March 26 2020 07:37 LightningStrike wrote:
GB is town because of his attitude which I don't think he can fake as mafia. Rels is town because he responded well to GB's push I thought at least.
On March 26 2020 07:09 KelsierSC wrote:
Guess you could fill me in on why GB is town and why Rels is town?
On March 26 2020 06:27 LightningStrike wrote:
I agree with the read is there anything else you want to talk about?
On March 26 2020 06:25 Trfel wrote:
Hi all, thanks for being willing to help me out of my boredom and nothingness and play some mafia!
I'm pretty happy with Vivax as town, no?
Hi all, thanks for being willing to help me out of my boredom and nothingness and play some mafia!
I'm pretty happy with Vivax as town, no?
I agree with the read is there anything else you want to talk about?
Guess you could fill me in on why GB is town and why Rels is town?
GB is town because of his attitude which I don't think he can fake as mafia. Rels is town because he responded well to GB's push I thought at least.
Feels like it is way to early to make reads like that, GB posted some random stuff and GIFS in the first page, it's not exactly a hard mimic. There is no way the Rels push was anything real at all, you should know that tbh so his reponse is pretty null aswell.
Bad reads.
Discredits read on GB. This is all discrediting reads.
On March 26 2020 08:10 KelsierSC wrote:
The only thing i'd give Rels credit for is he seemed to make an effort to understand all the nonsense chez posted and the resulting discussion. I just ignored all of that tbh. Rest of his play has been weak.
On March 26 2020 07:52 LightningStrike wrote:
Good point but GB is usually more jokey as town than scum especially doesn't do these type of pushes this early as scum like in Battle of the Drams. Rels I can see your argument but I been liking his responses so far just want to see him push the game more.
On March 26 2020 07:48 KelsierSC wrote:
Feels like it is way to early to make reads like that, GB posted some random stuff and GIFS in the first page, it's not exactly a hard mimic. There is no way the Rels push was anything real at all, you should know that tbh so his reponse is pretty null aswell.
Bad reads.
On March 26 2020 07:37 LightningStrike wrote:
GB is town because of his attitude which I don't think he can fake as mafia. Rels is town because he responded well to GB's push I thought at least.
On March 26 2020 07:09 KelsierSC wrote:
Guess you could fill me in on why GB is town and why Rels is town?
On March 26 2020 06:27 LightningStrike wrote:
I agree with the read is there anything else you want to talk about?
On March 26 2020 06:25 Trfel wrote:
Hi all, thanks for being willing to help me out of my boredom and nothingness and play some mafia!
I'm pretty happy with Vivax as town, no?
Hi all, thanks for being willing to help me out of my boredom and nothingness and play some mafia!
I'm pretty happy with Vivax as town, no?
I agree with the read is there anything else you want to talk about?
Guess you could fill me in on why GB is town and why Rels is town?
GB is town because of his attitude which I don't think he can fake as mafia. Rels is town because he responded well to GB's push I thought at least.
Feels like it is way to early to make reads like that, GB posted some random stuff and GIFS in the first page, it's not exactly a hard mimic. There is no way the Rels push was anything real at all, you should know that tbh so his reponse is pretty null aswell.
Bad reads.
Good point but GB is usually more jokey as town than scum especially doesn't do these type of pushes this early as scum like in Battle of the Drams. Rels I can see your argument but I been liking his responses so far just want to see him push the game more.
The only thing i'd give Rels credit for is he seemed to make an effort to understand all the nonsense chez posted and the resulting discussion. I just ignored all of that tbh. Rest of his play has been weak.
Says absolutely nothing about Rels again. Says he'd give him credit but also contradicts the credit right at the end of the point. The post amounts to nothing.
To surmise, Kelsier is following all tenets of playing as mafia. He is playing destructively, rather than constructively with his perfect information (he discredits town reads people are giving frequently). He discredits the Sentinel push while meekly saying he'd join it right after. Kelsier has perfect information and is mafia.
I agree with your points of how to analyze people as being Mafia. However, I don't believe Mafia, especially Kelsier, would play like this. I also believe his posts could come from a townie perspective.
I don't believe he was discrediting, I believe he was fleshing out opinions on what he thinks about peoples assumption. I do this all the time as town.
I don't believe that him disagreeing with your case but still willing to lynch Sentinel is alignment indicative. He can think your cause is bad while still wanting to lynch a lurker. Again, I do this all the time as town.
I think we should consider the reality of the thread. Town is very disorganized at this point. So Mafia don't really need to do anything. At this point, I would expect Mafia to just stay on the background just to see town destroying themselves. That means they won't make any commitments, they will not push anything, they will at most sheep people. In that sense, I find LS's sheep on me much more suspicious. When I dropped the push, he kept thinking you're scum. But he was sheeping me, so... ?
Trfel is the other one who isn't having strong stances at all. Why not?
Holyflare, especially in a game with two Mafia, I believe they will play a very safe game. That's not what Kelsier was doing.
I wasn't exactly sheeping you I had the same reaction as you and you voting him I thought we could push him? I still thought he was scum until his first post on his return on DMA.
My mind tells me this is bs
My heart wants to believe
Vote Trfel with me
